American Claims British Shooting Title; A Fresh Look At The .380; Gun Ban For Trans: 09.07.25 Hour 2
September 7, 2025 • 43 mins
In This Hour:
-- In a stunning come-from-behind finish American rifle shooter Brandon Green claimed the King's Prize at the historic Bisley shooting competition -- the first American to win in the 156-year history of a match marked by Queen Victoria firing the first shot in 1860!
-- It's time to take a fresh look at .380 pistols for defense.
-- Was there really a proposal to ban trans from owning guns? The gun rights community rallied to oppose that idea.
Gun Talk 09.07.25 Hour 2
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/gun-talk--6185159/support.
-- In a stunning come-from-behind finish American rifle shooter Brandon Green claimed the King's Prize at the historic Bisley shooting competition -- the first American to win in the 156-year history of a match marked by Queen Victoria firing the first shot in 1860!
-- It's time to take a fresh look at .380 pistols for defense.
-- Was there really a proposal to ban trans from owning guns? The gun rights community rallied to oppose that idea.
Gun Talk 09.07.25 Hour 2
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/gun-talk--6185159/support.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
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Speaker 2 (00:14):
Hey, welcome back to Gun Talk. Tom Gresham yere. I'm
going to call us eight sixty six talk Gun. We'll
get you in. We talk about well, anything that has
to do with gun, Second Amendment, hunting, competitive shooting, gun collecting,
all the rest of it. We don't talk enough honestly
about competition shooting. Joining me right now is a guy
who just did something that honestly has never been done before.
(00:34):
We've got Brandon Green. Brandon, you, of course were AMU
were on the Army Roxstership unit for a number of years.
But you just did something that in one hundred and
fifty six years no America has ever done, by winning
what it was.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
The Kings called the Kings Prize at the Imperial Meeting
in Busiley, England.
Speaker 4 (00:53):
So yeah, they've been running.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
This was one hundred and fifty sixth Imperial Meeting and
I was fortunate enough to kind of slip slip my
way in there at the end and take the King's Prize,
so as I'm the first American to ever do it,
as as far as we can tell, as far as
the record books.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Just to get people a little sense of history where
they had the first match in eighteen sixty the first
shot was fired by Queen Victoria. Yes, sir, that's unbelievable, man.
Speaker 4 (01:24):
Yes, sir, it is.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
I got to go into the museum and kind of
see the target that you shot, the rifle set up,
the rest that was used, and all that stuff, and
it was very very interesting.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
Right now, how many times? How many years have you
been shooting at Bisley?
Speaker 4 (01:38):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (01:38):
This was my first, my first time, my first go
at it really, yes, sir, yes, sir.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
You know it's not supposed to work that way, right.
Speaker 4 (01:45):
Yeah, they told me that they were.
Speaker 5 (01:48):
I bet they did.
Speaker 4 (01:49):
They definitely let me know. That's not how it usually.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
Goes, cheeky American. Here you go, all right, describe the
match and kind of the how it runs, and well
what you're shooting and the distances and all that.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
Okay, So the Imperial Meeting is put on by the
NRA of the UK and it is their basic national
championship and they shoot several different disciplines throughout basically about
a month of competition. We were there for what they
call tr or target rifle, which is what we in
America called palma. So it's a three oh eight or
a two twenty three rifle with iron sights, a single
(02:23):
shot rifle, and you shoot it at three hundred, five hundred,
six hundred, nine hundred and one thousand yards and it's
a decimal style target, so the center of the target
being a V ring, the next ring out being a
five ring, and a four ring, and then the target
outside of that is white, and there's a three ring,
a two ring, in a one.
Speaker 4 (02:42):
You shoot, you know, either a.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
Ten, a seven, a ten, or a fifteen shot string
at any of those given yard lines, and you shoot
what's called three to the mound there. So you have
three shooters per target, and each shooter fires one shot,
then it goes to the next and then they fire
the shot, and then the third shooter fire is a shot,
and then it goes back around to the first shooter
again until you've all fired your appropriate number of rounds.
Speaker 2 (03:08):
Is there is there a time component?
Speaker 3 (03:11):
There is, Yeah, So each shooter from the time the
previous shot is fired and the score is acknowledged. By
the score, you have forty five seconds to make your
determination on your wind and then execute the shot. So
it's pretty quick and that's the reason they do it
that way. So everybody has to basically make the wind call,
you know, give it their best guess, and then get
(03:33):
in the middle.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
You can't waiting around for the wind. Yeah no, you
can take what you get figured out and fire the shot.
Speaker 4 (03:39):
Yeah yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
And that's really the most fair way to do it
in my opinion. You know, in America we shoot what
we call string.
Speaker 4 (03:46):
Firing, So you have an allotted time for usually it's
twenty rounds per record.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
You can wait as long as you want to during
that allot of time and then you know, shoot really
fast or a few shots or however and play the.
Speaker 4 (03:58):
Game that way.
Speaker 3 (03:58):
But internetational shooting, you don't have that luxury. You're shooting
two or three to a mound.
Speaker 4 (04:03):
You have a.
Speaker 3 (04:04):
Certain number of seconds to get the shot done and
you basically make the win call and get with it.
And that's the reason that you know, all around the world,
the South Africans, the Australians, the gb team, all those
guys are really really good Win readers because they have
to read the wind and make a call, you know,
right now and get it done.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
You're not you're not saying the thing that I need
to say for you, okay, which is these are the
best rifle shooters on the planet who have gathered together here.
I mean, this is the place where the very best
rifle shooters get together and you just beat them all. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (04:39):
Yeah, I was very fortunate.
Speaker 6 (04:40):
So I was.
Speaker 3 (04:41):
I mean, you know, I was up there with I
know at least four other world or four world champions
that were there, and a couple of them didn't even
make it into the final. That just tells you how
tight the competition and these guys. You know, our World
Championships are shot on just like an Olympic cycles every
four years, so you only get a world champion to
come about out of the individual word championships every four years.
(05:01):
And I know at least four of them or maybe
five of them that were they're shooting with me from
the other countries.
Speaker 4 (05:06):
We haven't had a world champion out the US in
a long time.
Speaker 3 (05:09):
And I actually went into the final for the King's
Prize in thirtieth place, so you figure there's no way
you're going to come from thirtieth place all the way
up to first in thirty shots. It's all you have
is thirty shots for records. So it just it happened
to work out where I. You know, I stayed focused
and stayed in it.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
That's why coming back from three laps back with only
you know, shin laps to go, I mean I just done.
Speaker 3 (05:33):
Yeah, And I said, I was in thirtieth place and
I dropped a point early in stage two, and I
was like, if you drop a point, you know that
you're out of it. There's just no way. These guys
are too good. There's just no way you're going to
come back from that. So I was like, well, I'm
pretty much done. But at least I made it into it.
You know, to make it into the finals is a
big deal in itself. So you know, I went in
(05:54):
there and you know, my I was talking.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
To nothing to lose. Now, I just go ahead, just
acting Okay.
Speaker 4 (06:00):
That's it, go get it done.
Speaker 3 (06:02):
And that's I was a friend of mine named Ben
Ems from Australia. He was the twenty fifteen world champion
and I shot with him, you know, doing that twenty
fifteen World Championships. But anyway, he didn't make the final.
He was scorekeeping for one of his teammates and I
was down there talking to him before it all started
the nine hundred yard line and he was like, you know,
all you can do but is just keep yourself in
it and let it shake out the way it's going
(06:22):
to shake out. And and that's exactly what I focused on.
Speaker 4 (06:25):
I'm like, well, that's probably the best way to look
at it.
Speaker 3 (06:28):
Just keep yourself in the middle of the target each
and every shot the best you can, and then it'll
be what it is end.
Speaker 4 (06:33):
And it just happened to work out in my favor.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
You shot clean, and he came down to the last
shot and the guy who was, you know, right in
front of you, dropped a shot.
Speaker 4 (06:44):
Yep, he was. He had it beat.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
He had it won basically, and his very very last
shot he uh, he's had a little bit of elevation
and shot it a little bit, a little bit high
and uh and shot a four out the top and
dropped the point and that was all it took. I
had to be wull count and so my v bull
account was hiring his and it passed him up, you know,
so he ended up in ended up in second.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
All right, tell me about this chair thing, you know.
Speaker 3 (07:09):
I don't know how it started, honestly, I've never I
need to look into it because I've been chaired, but
you've been chaired before, yes, sir, I was lucky enough.
In twenty eighteen I got chaired in Canada for the
Governor General's Prize, it's their national championship and their version
of the Kings. And then in South Africa last year
in twenty twenty four, I won the South African National
(07:31):
Championship and I got chaired there. So what they do
is they at the end of the match, while you're shooting,
the match staff bring out a chair and it's a
wooden chair that has two long wooden poles bolted to
the legs, and you sit in the chair with your
rifle and your coat and they I mean basically from
the podium that they you know, are behind your firing point.
(07:52):
They put you in the chair, your teammates, eight of
your teammates hoisted you up to their shoulder height and
then they march you off the range. And usually there's
a bagpipe place, you know, at the awards ceremony. They
actually you start outside and they put you in the chair,
pick you up, march you into the awards ceremony, set
you down at the end of the ward, you know,
for your part of the award ceremony, which is usually
(08:12):
the very last thing.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
That is incredible. That's so awesome.
Speaker 4 (08:15):
Yeah, it is wild. It is. It's really really neat.
Speaker 3 (08:19):
But I you know, now that you mentioned it, I
really want to kind of look into it and see
what the history is behind it, because it's a super
cool tradition. I've never seen it done in the United States.
Speaker 4 (08:29):
It's awesome. I think we already do it here, all right.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
So I was talking to my buddy Dan Selinka. He
said that you guys shot together many many years ago
in Louisi. How you're from Bogalusa, And I sort of
know how old were you when you started shooting competition?
Speaker 3 (08:44):
So I started competitively shooting air rifle in a j
RTC program at my high school in Bogalusa. So we
shot ten meters air rifle and it's three position and
I was I guess I was thirteen or fourteen when
I started with that. And then I did, you know,
a really good run of it during high school and
and kind of made a name for myself in that world.
And I knew that the Army Marksmanship Unit had deepest
(09:07):
shooting programs in the world, you know, shooting teams in
the world.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
And you forgo, you forgot to mention you hold the
Distinguished Air air Gun Badge number one.
Speaker 3 (09:19):
Yes, sir, I was there at the right time when
they started the program, I guess, but I was.
Speaker 4 (09:23):
I was shooting real well.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
So I earned that number one, that number one first
junior badge, and and that helped me get into the
Army Marksmanship Unit.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
Next.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
Actually I tried to join the Army to shoot air
rifle in small boar, but they needed shooters on the
service rifle team. So they actually picked me up and
put me on the service rifle team, which I'd never
shot before.
Speaker 4 (09:41):
But so I went to basic training a I t
got to the team.
Speaker 3 (09:45):
They put a M sixteen match grade M sixteen in
my hands, showed me how to load magazines and how
to how to shoot the course of fire and and
hit the ground run. And I had really good coaches
and you know, really good mentors there at the AMU,
and they really set me down a path to of success.
Speaker 4 (10:00):
And of course they make you earn it. You know,
they're not easy on the new guy, I'm sure, which
they shouldn't be.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
And I know that you have helped a lot with
junior shooting clinics helping youngsters get involved. What is the
attraction or maybe what's the benefit When you're talking to
a young person about maybe getting into competitive shooting, particularly
rifle shooting, what do you tell them? Why should they
do that?
Speaker 3 (10:24):
There are several reasons, you know, the big one for
like a high school age kid is if they're not
going to go you know, if they don't want to
go on a full academic scholarship or they you know,
they're not a football player, basketball player, or whatever the
other sports are. There's a really good you know programs
for for scholarships through you know, a lot of high end,
you know, top tier schools to where you join the
(10:45):
rifle team and shoot on the rifle team, which was
one of one of my other options when I was
that age, and I just shows you to go to the
military oute. But so that's a great, you know, a
great way to get in college and get you know,
half a during college paid for. So that's you know,
one big selling point to the kids. Another is just
the interpersonal discipline that it teaches you, now that.
Speaker 4 (11:07):
I've seen it and lived it for so long.
Speaker 3 (11:09):
Really just the I didn't know it at the time,
but the shooting that I was doing back then, and
learning how to have discipline and and you know, kind
of force yourself to focus on things that you have
to focus on to be successful, sets you up for
the rest of your life.
Speaker 4 (11:22):
You know.
Speaker 3 (11:23):
It really teaches you a lot of lessons that are
carried you'll carry through the rest of your you know,
your adult life. And that's a really big selling point,
you know, for for adults to teach kids or why
to get into this thing. And if you're explaining to
a parent, you know, why they should let their kids
do this. It's it's it's just a really a lot
of really good reasons to get into it, not to mission.
(11:43):
It's also the safest sport there is, like bar none.
It is safer than playing tennis or you know, playing
there now, that's it there, it's extremely safe.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
You know, I have never I'm not say that doesn't happen,
but you just don't hear of young people who are
serious competitive shooters getting into trouble and you just don't
hear about it.
Speaker 3 (12:10):
No, it's because they're way too focused on trying to
succeed at other things. You know, this game is extremely competitive,
it's extremely interpersonal. Like you have to watch your diet,
you have to you know, exercise, you have to focus,
you have to study, you know the things that will
make you better, and you just honestly, you just don't
have time to goof off too much. And not saying
(12:33):
that it takes away from your outside of shooting personal life,
but it gives you.
Speaker 4 (12:37):
It gives you something to focus on and to drive towards.
Speaker 3 (12:40):
And I think that's absolutely huge for It was for
me for sure, you know, having something to focus on
and focus my energy on, and I'm sure that kept
me out of quite a lot of trouble.
Speaker 2 (12:50):
Yeah, and everybody needs purpose. I mean Brandon Green, I congratulations.
This is absolutely historic, the first American in one hundred
and fifty six years to win. This is the team's
prize at businly unbelievable.
Speaker 4 (13:02):
I appreciate it them real quick.
Speaker 3 (13:04):
Just to plug the kind of the United States National
Rifle Team, you can get on the social media look
up us n r T or you know on the
United States National Rifle Teams website which is USNRT dot
com and check out what we're doing and kind of
keep up with us, and lots of ways to support
us there. And of course we need all the support
we can get, you know, any anything will help us,
you know, in our mission to represent the United States
(13:25):
the absolute best of our ability. We also teach, you know,
a lot of clinics and do a lot of work
with juniors and try to bring people into the high
power long range community. You know, we're we're trying to
do all the fundraising we can to support the team
and traveling overseas, like when we go to Bisley for
the World Championship in a couple of years. Just help
cover the cost of flights for the team members or
(13:46):
hotels or whatever we can.
Speaker 4 (13:48):
We are a you.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
Know, nonprofit shared organization and you know, if there are
people out there that can that need you.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
Know, tax break on the donation, yeah, donation that's Pact deductible.
Speaker 4 (14:00):
Correct, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (14:00):
And so trying to just get the word out there
because not many people know about the us n RT
or what we do or you know, while we're doing
any of that stuff. So just trying to get look
us up on Instagram or Facebook or you know, the
website or anything like that.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
Thanks for what you do and congratulations.
Speaker 4 (14:17):
Yes, sir, thanks very much. I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
Gre absolutely all right. Gun talk will be right back
in just a second.
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Whether it's new guns, training tips, gunsmithing, competition, shooting, self defense,
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Speaker 2 (16:29):
Hi.
Speaker 10 (16:30):
I'm Kim Roady, a six time Olympian in shooting, and
you're listening to gun Top. For thirty years, Tom has
been championing our love for the shooting, sports, hunting, and
firearms safety. Thank you Tom for inspiring so many of
us and for keeping the conversation alive.
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Humh Speaking of champion level Shooters Kim Rody. Yeah, that
was a great interview with Brandon Green, obviously an incredibly
talented and serious shooter. Although if you didn't catch it,
maybe it went by quickly. I want to make sure
you understand they're shooting out to a thousand yards and
(17:11):
people going, yeah, big deal, everybody shoots a thousand yeards.
Did you get it that they're using iron sights. Yeah,
and they're having to read the wind and every shot
counts and they have to shoot now no matter what
the wind is. If you want to see more of
(17:32):
what they're doing, take a look at their website. We
gave it during the interview, but it is a us
NRT for National Rifle Team USNRT dot com and I'm
just looking at They got a picture there of Brandon
with the chair where they chaired him when he won
the King's Prize at Bisley. Had an amazing accomplishment one
(17:53):
hundred and fifty six years and no Americans ever won this.
And then you know it's one of those deals that
around long enough, you might win something. Well, are you
hang around long enough? And little inside stuff, little family,
gun talk family. Brandon shot on the Army Roxsmanship Unit
Team with Michelle Cleland's son Ben Cleveland, who's who is
(18:18):
a mu so And thank you Michelle for putting that together.
That was a great interview and I really enjoyed having
that conversation. Just what a nice fellow I mean. And
I wasn't kidding when I said, you know, with youngsters
who are serious competitive shooters, it really doesn't matter of trap, ski, sporting,
(18:41):
clay's rifle, pistol, anything. I just have not run into
any problem kids. They're respectful, they're serious, they're safe, they're
you know, responsible. I like hanging around with those young people. Now.
(19:02):
I don't like the fact that they could all beat me,
but you know that's again a fairly low bar for
them to get over to there, because a lot of
them at age you know, twelve can beat me. I
know Kem Roady certainly could. She was the US women's
national champion in skeet when she was thirteen. Yeah, not
(19:22):
not the youth category women beat all the adult women
when she was thirteen. Some people just have it there,
I mean there, it is all right. So I mentioned earlier,
and I want to throw this idea out to you.
People always ask me, you know what gun for self? Defense?
What gun should I get to carry? What gun? Blah blah?
You know, let me throw out a thought. For a
(19:45):
lot of people, guys don't want to admit this. Recoil
is a thing, and recoil doesn't bother me. Yeah, why
are you she and lower and left because you're anticipating
the recoil. You're jerking the trigger because of recoil. You
know what has less recoil? A three eighty It is
significantly less recoil than a nine milimeter. Well, but is
(20:08):
it any good for self defense? Yes, it is. We've
done testing and ballistic gelatine, and generally speaking, a nine
milimeter and a thirty eight special you'll get almost identical
penetration and ballistic gel A three eighty will usually come
in one or two inches less in penetration. Is that
(20:32):
enough to matter? I don't think so. Well, what do
you get when you go to a three eighty, Well, first,
you get less recoil, easier to shoot a lot of times,
you get smaller pistols, easier to conceal. You also get,
and this is kind of a big thing for a
lot of people, you get a slide that's a lot
(20:55):
easier to manipulate to rack the slide because the recoil
spring doesn't have to be as strong. The recoil spring
slows down the slide as it goes backwards. You know
the force of the round going off forces to slide backwards. Well,
if you have less power in the round, then you
don't need as strong a recoil spring. So a three
(21:19):
to eighty often is really easy for a lot of
people to rack the slide. And there are some really
nice one. I have recently been fooding around with the
Ruger LCPMAX, really nice pistol. I'm playing with a new
pockethole storage of scott and if it actually comes out
just a prototype, we'll let you know about it. I
(21:39):
can tell you about that pretty slick man. You've got
a real pistol with a decent trigger with good capacity
in your pocket that's really concealable. And then you've got
the of course Smith and West and Bodyguard two point
zero which is very nice. And of course you got
the Shield Easy which is a very easy to rack
(21:59):
the slide. That I guess what I'm saying is don't
discount the three eighty and you might want to give
it a look even if it's not to replace what
you carry in, but maybe as an additional option, depending
on when you're carrying, how you're carrying, the clothes you're wearing.
Give the three eighty a chance you might like it. Well, well, well,
(22:24):
I'm back with you on Tom Gresham's Gun Talk. If
you want to join us, it's pretty easy. Give me
a call it my name Tom Talk Gun, Tom Talk Gun.
That'll get you in. Now, this story had the internet
all of Twitter see what I did there this week,
And I was going to talk about it anyway. But
that's okay because Nicole just called in out of Massachusetts.
(22:45):
N Cole. I wanted to talk about this, but I'm
gonna let you introduce the subject. Go for it.
Speaker 11 (22:51):
Okay.
Speaker 8 (22:52):
So, as you said, my name is Nicole, I'm pro
by saying I'm a small libertarian and I'm also trained.
So I was calling to find out where you fell
and what you thought about this proposed fans on firearms
that the administration put forth.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
Okay, So this story is all over the place that
the government was considering doing a ban on gun ownership
for trans people who are transsexual. Okay. Well, first of all,
I haven't seen anything from the government on this. I've
seen a lot of people say in the government's going
(23:32):
to do this, but I haven't seen anything that actually
says that there was a proposal or that it's real. Okay,
so let's start with that it may be true, may
not be true, But that almost is irrelevant to the
discussion because here's what is interesting. If it is true,
it's possible that it's real, but it's also possible that
(23:54):
it's a ropodope, it's a setup. Because look the reaction.
Every gun rights group, NRA, a Second Foundation, Fire's Policy Coalition,
every one of them opposed the idea and said, look,
the Second Amendment is a real right, and everybody gets
(24:15):
to have the real right of the Second Amendment to
keep in beare arms. So you cannot ban the Second
Amendment right from a group of people this period. You
just can't. You haven't been adjudicated to be you know,
you know, haven't been found guilty of a felony or
all the things that are in law. You just can't
do that. So the gun rights people all came in
(24:37):
on the side of this is a terrible idea, and
at the same time, the left and the media all
came in on the side of this is a terrible idea.
We have to wait for it. We have to support
Second Amendment rights for everybody, which is the first time
(25:00):
they've ever study anything like that. So universally there was
opposition to this trial balloon. If it was in fact
really being floated. The reaction was amazing. What were you seeing?
Speaker 8 (25:16):
It was a mixed bag from from all the groups.
Like you said, they all felt, you know, they all
opposed it. A lot of the people like Dane Lash,
you know, they said the same things, and you know,
the left is about to defend your gun rights. But
(25:39):
from the public there was there's a mixed bag. There's
about fifty fifty of people that are like, yeah, taken
and take them away from all these people, and you know,
the other half are like, no, you know, we shall
not be infringed means for everybody unless you've been adjuricated
and mentally detective or committed to crime. So it's from
the public it's been kind of tough. But from from
(26:02):
you know, people who are informed, you know, they're following
on your right.
Speaker 2 (26:07):
Yeah, it was. It was one of those deals. But
when I first heard, I thought, Okay, that can't be true.
And then you kind of keep seeing the report, you going, okay,
well it might be true that someone said this and
leaked it, but the reaction has been amazing across the board.
Everybodys saying no, no, no, no, no. This is a real right,
(26:28):
the Second Amendment. Is it not a second class right.
You cannot take it away from people categorically because of
their color or because of you know, anything other characteristic
other than what it's spelled out in law. So just basically,
I think it put a stop to it. And yeah,
you're always look, it's the Internet. You're always going to
get people saying things all over the place. But in
(26:51):
terms of the movers and shakers and the policymakers and
those who affect the policy, this was universal that no, no, no, no, no,
you cannot do this. So well, I appreciate you bringing
this up. I wanted to get to that, but I'm
glad you called in. Thank you so much for the call.
All right, let's Richard online too, out of Eugene, Oregon. Hello, Richard,
you're on gun Talk. What's that?
Speaker 11 (27:13):
Well, you were inquiring about the three eighty pistols. I
carry a sick p two thirty. That's my carry gun,
and I think it's sufficient to do what the two
job does.
Speaker 2 (27:26):
How did you decide on that particular model.
Speaker 11 (27:30):
Well, I came across it, and the only thing I
don't like about the gun is it's got the European
release on the bottom of the AH.
Speaker 2 (27:44):
The mag release is on the bottom like they do. Yeah,
you're right, it's a European style. You're not going to
do a quick mag change in that generally.
Speaker 11 (27:52):
No, no. But they do have one P two thirty
two which does have a better release on it. It's
that you could do it quick. But I don't have
that pistol, so I deal with what I got it.
Speaker 2 (28:05):
It's a fairly small pistol, right.
Speaker 11 (28:08):
Yes, it's like it's like James Bond gun or the
water PPK.
Speaker 2 (28:14):
Well, you know what you can do. This is gonna
be I'm going to help you out here because you
can do You can do the New York reload, which
is just to have a second gun.
Speaker 12 (28:27):
I knew you were going to like that one.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
An excuse to buy another gun.
Speaker 11 (28:34):
Oh I got too many. Now, I don't get to
go hush.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
Your mouth, no, no, no, never let those words come
out of your mouth. No such things. Yeah, the three
eighties that actually, and you know what's happened is the
three eighty well, you know what, way back to nine
had a bad reputation because of the AMMO. Everywhere was
you in full metal jacket ball ammo. Same with the
three eighty. But once we got good AMMO for the nine,
(28:58):
it became more respectable. And now with the three eighty,
we're getting the same thing. We're getting good defensive AMMO,
expanding AMMO for the three eighty, and all of a
sudden it's become a viable option for self defense.
Speaker 11 (29:11):
All right. Yeah, And I've got some uh three eighty
eight plus P on mine.
Speaker 4 (29:17):
But it's.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
Good.
Speaker 11 (29:24):
I don't know, I can't see anything wrong with it.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
Well, you know, shooter, Yeah, well the only thing wrong
with the plus PMO it's got more power is you're
you're required to pull the tuggar harder. You know that? Right?
Oh yeah, right, okay, good, that's right. As long as
to pull the trigger harder, we're shooting faster, that's as good. Yeah, yeah,
the wretch, I appreciate it. I appreciate that. That's very cool.
(29:49):
But P three or two thirty rather there you go,
all right, we'll be right back with more gun talk.
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If you want to have a more fun shooting over
the next few months, take a lever action to the range.
If you don't have a lever action, this is a
good excuse to go out and buy new guns. So
there you go. I swear I don't think you can
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Just there, it is, all right, let's go line line one.
Denball is calling out a South Dakota or driving through
(32:39):
Wyoming or somewhere out there. Hey, Denball, you're on the air.
Speaker 12 (32:43):
Yeah. I've been thinking about what the Trump administration has
been doing with using the National Guard and the military
and urban areas. I'm an overdroad truck driver, so I'm
you know, I kind of see both sides of this.
You know, I spend a lot of time in kind
of less than desirable parts of LA and Oakland and
(33:04):
places like that, and I get it, you know, something
absolutely need needs to be done, and you know, I
feel terrible for the people living there and trying to
raise families there. But on the other hand, I also
remember Hurricane Katrina, where, you know, after Katrina, the governor,
you know, had the National Guard and the mayor of
New Orleans and they were using the weather event as
(33:27):
a way to confiscate firearms. You know. I also drove
through Missquaton, Nevada when you know, that whole Bundy thing
was going on, and it made me extremely uncomfortable watching that.
I'm just worried about a future president. You know, maybe
Heaven forbid a president Gavin Newsom, or Heaven forbid a
(33:49):
president AOC you know, like Biden put in the executive
order on the pistol braces, which had less than you know,
single digit compliance. What would happen if a future Democrat
president used this is a president for using the military
against the Second Amendment.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
It is an excellent question. And I know that some
folks who are conservative just automatically say, yeah, we got
to do something about that. And I'm not worried about
the military. But yes, in Katrina twenty years ago, they
sent the police door to door, kicking indoors and said
there will be no guns in this city other than
what the police have. They took them all and then
(34:30):
denied they did it, and then hit them all in
a warehouse and denied they had it until they were
sued by the Second Amendment Foundation. And then we found
the warehouse and they went, oh, look at that, a
warehouse full of guns. I wonder how that got there. Yeah, No,
to your point, it's an excellent point. If you look,
if you're not afraid of the government, you don't understand
the government. It's as simple as that. And yes they could,
(34:53):
and they are certainly elected politicians who would send them
the National Guard to go door to door or to
use the forty four seventy three to say you bought this,
it's now illegal and you have to turn it in
or we're going to pull you out of your house
and arrest you on the spot. It has happened before
in other countries. It has even happened here in this country.
(35:13):
We're in California where they said, well, yeah, we know,
we told you that was illegal, but now were it
was legal for you to have that, but now we've
made it illegal and we know who you are, and
they've sent letters to people, so you have to turn
these in. So I do not disagree with you that
this is a concern, and it's just something that I
(35:37):
don't know at this point what if anything needs to
be done other than just keeping an eye on it.
But I do appreciate to bring it up. I think
it is a very interesting topic and one that's worth discussing.
Thank you for the calle n Ball. Appreciate that Frank's
in a reno of that on too. Hey Frank talk
to me. Hello, Yes, sir.
Speaker 13 (35:59):
Yeah, Well, I have mentioned that many people over the
years that you know, when they complain about crazy mass
shootings and it turns out there's a suggestion the person
might be on some kind of riddlin or drugs or
something for ADHD or whatever their issues may be, and
they always ask, well, we should do something about that,
you know, similar to the trans ban issue that just
(36:21):
came up a while back, and the problem is there's
hippo laws that basically prevents you from learning anything about
the medical history, much less the mental history. And it's like, well,
until that changes, or we find some way to identify
these people. And the only way to do that now
is the guy gets thrown into fifty one fifty and
(36:42):
he gets adjudicated as a metal defective in some way,
and now the forty four to seventy three won't let
him buy a gun. But unless you've got any insight
on the hippo law problem, I don't remember anybody really
bringing this up. Every time it comes up, it never mentioned.
Speaker 2 (36:58):
No, it's a good point. And you know, and you're right,
if you haven't been adjudicated mentally incompetent, and this is
not you know, a middle incompetency issue according to the
documents and the regulations, then this is this is simply
a non starter. And the idea that we would say, okay,
those people over there, we should strip them of their
(37:22):
gun rights, you go, you understand that you are part
of those people, of some group of those people, whether
it's you know, those people who live in that state
or that city, or those people who are military veterans
because they've been trained to kill. I mean, there's everybody
is a part of some group that somebody doesn't like.
(37:43):
And if we are keen on saying we're going to
strip secrament of rights from some group of people, understand
that that can be turned right around and used against
you are any other group. And I appreciate the call.
In fact, let's take this down to the root of
the whole thing. Gun control laws in the US were
designed to take guns out of the hands of black citizens.
(38:09):
All gun control laws in the US are based on racism,
or are based you track them back down, you will
find that the whole idea was, how are we going
to keep black people from having guns? We will come
up with gun control laws. And so anybody who pushes
gun control laws is actually pushing Jim Crow laws, actually
(38:32):
pushing racist rooted laws. Talk about using gun laws against
those people. That's how gun controls started, was identifying those people.
Do we want to be part of that? I know
I don't, and I really don't think the Second AMENDMIC
(38:54):
community does either. We want Second MIC rights for everybody,
simple as that. Let me come back. I got to
take on school shootings. Something might be coming around the corner. Hey,
(39:14):
coming up in just a few minutes, a different take
on how to protect schools from shooters. You know, I
gotta leave this one using drones. Yeah, we'll talk about that.
Let's go to line one. Doug is with us out
of Waxahatchie, Texas. Hello Doug, what's on your mind?
Speaker 6 (39:34):
Hey? Tom Grisham. I'm one of those three eighties cicionados, okay,
and everything I have is three eighty, with the exception
of one that is not concealable, and that is a
British three oh three.
Speaker 2 (39:52):
So what three eighties do you have? And which one
do you like to carry?
Speaker 6 (39:57):
The one that I like the best is the R
I a Baby Rock three eighty nineteen eleven style. Oh cool,
scale down for three eighty, but is a very faithful
look of a nineteen eleven.
Speaker 2 (40:16):
Right. Uh, how do you carry it?
Speaker 12 (40:21):
I have?
Speaker 6 (40:23):
I have two holsters that I can use it effectively with.
It's an outside the waistband that's generic for kind of
like a The word escapes me right now, but I
can use it with several of my firearms. I do
(40:43):
have a Kaidex holster for it. I'm still fine tuning
how much effort I have to take out of it.
The first time I got it, it was almost impossible
to remove, so.
Speaker 11 (40:56):
I had it.
Speaker 2 (40:58):
Now, let me ask you one of the things that
people going to say, Okay, well, that's that's a small
pillstol god. I understand it's a little nineteen eleven. But
then you have reduced capacity in an era of the
bucket of bullets guns where you've got double stack ghosts forever?
What do you carry six or seven rounds in that?
Speaker 6 (41:16):
It's a seven round mag and I've got a lot
of them. Okay, Actually there's an aftermarket that is available
that will hold twelve rounds, and I'm looking at getting
a few of those.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
Oh okay, what other three as do you have?
Speaker 6 (41:38):
I have a high point with a laser on the
underside of it. A lot of people tend to bad
mouth the high point I've had. I've had surprisingly very
good results with them, and I would not like to
(41:59):
be on the receiving end.
Speaker 2 (42:01):
Well that's the you know what. You know what's great
about them? They go off when you pull the trigger.
Speaker 6 (42:05):
Bet they do? Yeah, And mine works real well with
the laser on underneath it. Ith and I've also got
car beans as well.
Speaker 2 (42:15):
Sweet. Okay, so I mean you're a real three eighty guy. Well,
I appreciate the call. I appreciate the update on that
and a little nineteen eleven and three eighty. I love
that idea A small light and with a decent trigger,
so as all nineteen elevens tend to have great idea. Yeah,
thanks for the call. I really think people ought to
(42:38):
take a fresh look at the three eighty. A lot
of the ideas that we have particare those of us
have been added a long time. We develop an idea
and we stick with it. We don't update our information.
And you're going, well, you know three AD they just
punched as holes. Well, yeah, if you use ball ammo,
but sort of the forty five. That's why the forty
five was popular because if you're it's just going to
(43:00):
shoot ball ammo and everything that, it makes a bigger hole. Okay,
because wherever it get's going to be what you get.
It doesn't expand. But if you have decent expanding AMMO
or something like the Honey Badge or Ammo from Blackhill's Ammo,
which is really cool, now you have effective self defense
AMMO in a small carriable pistol and something that where
(43:22):
you can rack the slide, and for more and more people,
that's becoming an issue as you get older, you get arthritis,
whatever it is, there, you go, all right when we
come back. We got some people that they say we
could put drones in schools and we can use those
to take care of these active shooters. So I'm going, really,
I need to know more about this. So that's where
we're going to take up when we come back. Step
(43:44):
for aside, be right back
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Speaker 2 (00:14):
Hey, welcome back to Gun Talk. Tom Gresham yere. I'm
going to call us eight sixty six talk Gun. We'll
get you in. We talk about well, anything that has
to do with gun, Second Amendment, hunting, competitive shooting, gun collecting,
all the rest of it. We don't talk enough honestly
about competition shooting. Joining me right now is a guy
who just did something that honestly has never been done before.
(00:34):
We've got Brandon Green. Brandon, you, of course were AMU
were on the Army Roxstership unit for a number of years.
But you just did something that in one hundred and
fifty six years no America has ever done, by winning
what it was.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
The Kings called the Kings Prize at the Imperial Meeting
in Busiley, England.
Speaker 4 (00:53):
So yeah, they've been running.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
This was one hundred and fifty sixth Imperial Meeting and
I was fortunate enough to kind of slip slip my
way in there at the end and take the King's Prize,
so as I'm the first American to ever do it,
as as far as we can tell, as far as
the record books.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Just to get people a little sense of history where
they had the first match in eighteen sixty the first
shot was fired by Queen Victoria. Yes, sir, that's unbelievable, man.
Speaker 4 (01:24):
Yes, sir, it is.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
I got to go into the museum and kind of
see the target that you shot, the rifle set up,
the rest that was used, and all that stuff, and
it was very very interesting.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
Right now, how many times? How many years have you
been shooting at Bisley?
Speaker 4 (01:38):
Oh?
Speaker 3 (01:38):
This was my first, my first time, my first go
at it really, yes, sir, yes, sir.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
You know it's not supposed to work that way, right.
Speaker 4 (01:45):
Yeah, they told me that they were.
Speaker 5 (01:48):
I bet they did.
Speaker 4 (01:49):
They definitely let me know. That's not how it usually.
Speaker 2 (01:52):
Goes, cheeky American. Here you go, all right, describe the
match and kind of the how it runs, and well
what you're shooting and the distances and all that.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
Okay, So the Imperial Meeting is put on by the
NRA of the UK and it is their basic national
championship and they shoot several different disciplines throughout basically about
a month of competition. We were there for what they
call tr or target rifle, which is what we in
America called palma. So it's a three oh eight or
a two twenty three rifle with iron sights, a single
(02:23):
shot rifle, and you shoot it at three hundred, five hundred,
six hundred, nine hundred and one thousand yards and it's
a decimal style target, so the center of the target
being a V ring, the next ring out being a
five ring, and a four ring, and then the target
outside of that is white, and there's a three ring,
a two ring, in a one.
Speaker 4 (02:42):
You shoot, you know, either a.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
Ten, a seven, a ten, or a fifteen shot string
at any of those given yard lines, and you shoot
what's called three to the mound there. So you have
three shooters per target, and each shooter fires one shot,
then it goes to the next and then they fire
the shot, and then the third shooter fire is a shot,
and then it goes back around to the first shooter
again until you've all fired your appropriate number of rounds.
Speaker 2 (03:08):
Is there is there a time component?
Speaker 3 (03:11):
There is, Yeah, So each shooter from the time the
previous shot is fired and the score is acknowledged. By
the score, you have forty five seconds to make your
determination on your wind and then execute the shot. So
it's pretty quick and that's the reason they do it
that way. So everybody has to basically make the wind call,
you know, give it their best guess, and then get
(03:33):
in the middle.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
You can't waiting around for the wind. Yeah no, you
can take what you get figured out and fire the shot.
Speaker 4 (03:39):
Yeah yeah.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
And that's really the most fair way to do it
in my opinion. You know, in America we shoot what
we call string.
Speaker 4 (03:46):
Firing, So you have an allotted time for usually it's
twenty rounds per record.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
You can wait as long as you want to during
that allot of time and then you know, shoot really
fast or a few shots or however and play the.
Speaker 4 (03:58):
Game that way.
Speaker 3 (03:58):
But internetational shooting, you don't have that luxury. You're shooting
two or three to a mound.
Speaker 4 (04:03):
You have a.
Speaker 3 (04:04):
Certain number of seconds to get the shot done and
you basically make the win call and get with it.
And that's the reason that you know, all around the world,
the South Africans, the Australians, the gb team, all those
guys are really really good Win readers because they have
to read the wind and make a call, you know,
right now and get it done.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
You're not you're not saying the thing that I need
to say for you, okay, which is these are the
best rifle shooters on the planet who have gathered together here.
I mean, this is the place where the very best
rifle shooters get together and you just beat them all. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (04:39):
Yeah, I was very fortunate.
Speaker 6 (04:40):
So I was.
Speaker 3 (04:41):
I mean, you know, I was up there with I
know at least four other world or four world champions
that were there, and a couple of them didn't even
make it into the final. That just tells you how
tight the competition and these guys. You know, our World
Championships are shot on just like an Olympic cycles every
four years, so you only get a world champion to
come about out of the individual word championships every four years.
(05:01):
And I know at least four of them or maybe
five of them that were they're shooting with me from
the other countries.
Speaker 4 (05:06):
We haven't had a world champion out the US in
a long time.
Speaker 3 (05:09):
And I actually went into the final for the King's
Prize in thirtieth place, so you figure there's no way
you're going to come from thirtieth place all the way
up to first in thirty shots. It's all you have
is thirty shots for records. So it just it happened
to work out where I. You know, I stayed focused
and stayed in it.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
That's why coming back from three laps back with only
you know, shin laps to go, I mean I just done.
Speaker 3 (05:33):
Yeah, And I said, I was in thirtieth place and
I dropped a point early in stage two, and I
was like, if you drop a point, you know that
you're out of it. There's just no way. These guys
are too good. There's just no way you're going to
come back from that. So I was like, well, I'm
pretty much done. But at least I made it into it.
You know, to make it into the finals is a
big deal in itself. So you know, I went in
(05:54):
there and you know, my I was talking.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
To nothing to lose. Now, I just go ahead, just
acting Okay.
Speaker 4 (06:00):
That's it, go get it done.
Speaker 3 (06:02):
And that's I was a friend of mine named Ben
Ems from Australia. He was the twenty fifteen world champion
and I shot with him, you know, doing that twenty
fifteen World Championships. But anyway, he didn't make the final.
He was scorekeeping for one of his teammates and I
was down there talking to him before it all started
the nine hundred yard line and he was like, you know,
all you can do but is just keep yourself in
it and let it shake out the way it's going
(06:22):
to shake out. And and that's exactly what I focused on.
Speaker 4 (06:25):
I'm like, well, that's probably the best way to look
at it.
Speaker 3 (06:28):
Just keep yourself in the middle of the target each
and every shot the best you can, and then it'll
be what it is end.
Speaker 4 (06:33):
And it just happened to work out in my favor.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
You shot clean, and he came down to the last
shot and the guy who was, you know, right in
front of you, dropped a shot.
Speaker 4 (06:44):
Yep, he was. He had it beat.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
He had it won basically, and his very very last
shot he uh, he's had a little bit of elevation
and shot it a little bit, a little bit high
and uh and shot a four out the top and
dropped the point and that was all it took. I
had to be wull count and so my v bull
account was hiring his and it passed him up, you know,
so he ended up in ended up in second.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
All right, tell me about this chair thing, you know.
Speaker 3 (07:09):
I don't know how it started, honestly, I've never I
need to look into it because I've been chaired, but
you've been chaired before, yes, sir, I was lucky enough.
In twenty eighteen I got chaired in Canada for the
Governor General's Prize, it's their national championship and their version
of the Kings. And then in South Africa last year
in twenty twenty four, I won the South African National
(07:31):
Championship and I got chaired there. So what they do
is they at the end of the match, while you're shooting,
the match staff bring out a chair and it's a
wooden chair that has two long wooden poles bolted to
the legs, and you sit in the chair with your
rifle and your coat and they I mean basically from
the podium that they you know, are behind your firing point.
(07:52):
They put you in the chair, your teammates, eight of
your teammates hoisted you up to their shoulder height and
then they march you off the range. And usually there's
a bagpipe place, you know, at the awards ceremony. They
actually you start outside and they put you in the chair,
pick you up, march you into the awards ceremony, set
you down at the end of the ward, you know,
for your part of the award ceremony, which is usually
(08:12):
the very last thing.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
That is incredible. That's so awesome.
Speaker 4 (08:15):
Yeah, it is wild. It is. It's really really neat.
Speaker 3 (08:19):
But I you know, now that you mentioned it, I
really want to kind of look into it and see
what the history is behind it, because it's a super
cool tradition. I've never seen it done in the United States.
Speaker 4 (08:29):
It's awesome. I think we already do it here, all right.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
So I was talking to my buddy Dan Selinka. He
said that you guys shot together many many years ago
in Louisi. How you're from Bogalusa, And I sort of
know how old were you when you started shooting competition?
Speaker 3 (08:44):
So I started competitively shooting air rifle in a j
RTC program at my high school in Bogalusa. So we
shot ten meters air rifle and it's three position and
I was I guess I was thirteen or fourteen when
I started with that. And then I did, you know,
a really good run of it during high school and
and kind of made a name for myself in that world.
And I knew that the Army Marksmanship Unit had deepest
(09:07):
shooting programs in the world, you know, shooting teams in
the world.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
And you forgo, you forgot to mention you hold the
Distinguished Air air Gun Badge number one.
Speaker 3 (09:19):
Yes, sir, I was there at the right time when
they started the program, I guess, but I was.
Speaker 4 (09:23):
I was shooting real well.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
So I earned that number one, that number one first
junior badge, and and that helped me get into the
Army Marksmanship Unit.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
Next.
Speaker 3 (09:31):
Actually I tried to join the Army to shoot air
rifle in small boar, but they needed shooters on the
service rifle team. So they actually picked me up and
put me on the service rifle team, which I'd never
shot before.
Speaker 4 (09:41):
But so I went to basic training a I t
got to the team.
Speaker 3 (09:45):
They put a M sixteen match grade M sixteen in
my hands, showed me how to load magazines and how
to how to shoot the course of fire and and
hit the ground run. And I had really good coaches
and you know, really good mentors there at the AMU,
and they really set me down a path to of success.
Speaker 4 (10:00):
And of course they make you earn it. You know,
they're not easy on the new guy, I'm sure, which
they shouldn't be.
Speaker 2 (10:08):
And I know that you have helped a lot with
junior shooting clinics helping youngsters get involved. What is the
attraction or maybe what's the benefit When you're talking to
a young person about maybe getting into competitive shooting, particularly
rifle shooting, what do you tell them? Why should they
do that?
Speaker 3 (10:24):
There are several reasons, you know, the big one for
like a high school age kid is if they're not
going to go you know, if they don't want to
go on a full academic scholarship or they you know,
they're not a football player, basketball player, or whatever the
other sports are. There's a really good you know programs
for for scholarships through you know, a lot of high end,
you know, top tier schools to where you join the
(10:45):
rifle team and shoot on the rifle team, which was
one of one of my other options when I was
that age, and I just shows you to go to the
military oute. But so that's a great, you know, a
great way to get in college and get you know,
half a during college paid for. So that's you know,
one big selling point to the kids. Another is just
the interpersonal discipline that it teaches you, now that.
Speaker 4 (11:07):
I've seen it and lived it for so long.
Speaker 3 (11:09):
Really just the I didn't know it at the time,
but the shooting that I was doing back then, and
learning how to have discipline and and you know, kind
of force yourself to focus on things that you have
to focus on to be successful, sets you up for
the rest of your life.
Speaker 4 (11:22):
You know.
Speaker 3 (11:23):
It really teaches you a lot of lessons that are
carried you'll carry through the rest of your you know,
your adult life. And that's a really big selling point,
you know, for for adults to teach kids or why
to get into this thing. And if you're explaining to
a parent, you know, why they should let their kids
do this. It's it's it's just a really a lot
of really good reasons to get into it, not to mission.
(11:43):
It's also the safest sport there is, like bar none.
It is safer than playing tennis or you know, playing
there now, that's it there, it's extremely safe.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
You know, I have never I'm not say that doesn't happen,
but you just don't hear of young people who are
serious competitive shooters getting into trouble and you just don't
hear about it.
Speaker 3 (12:10):
No, it's because they're way too focused on trying to
succeed at other things. You know, this game is extremely competitive,
it's extremely interpersonal. Like you have to watch your diet,
you have to you know, exercise, you have to focus,
you have to study, you know the things that will
make you better, and you just honestly, you just don't
have time to goof off too much. And not saying
(12:33):
that it takes away from your outside of shooting personal life,
but it gives you.
Speaker 4 (12:37):
It gives you something to focus on and to drive towards.
Speaker 3 (12:40):
And I think that's absolutely huge for It was for
me for sure, you know, having something to focus on
and focus my energy on, and I'm sure that kept
me out of quite a lot of trouble.
Speaker 2 (12:50):
Yeah, and everybody needs purpose. I mean Brandon Green, I congratulations.
This is absolutely historic, the first American in one hundred
and fifty six years to win. This is the team's
prize at businly unbelievable.
Speaker 4 (13:02):
I appreciate it them real quick.
Speaker 3 (13:04):
Just to plug the kind of the United States National
Rifle Team, you can get on the social media look
up us n r T or you know on the
United States National Rifle Teams website which is USNRT dot
com and check out what we're doing and kind of
keep up with us, and lots of ways to support
us there. And of course we need all the support
we can get, you know, any anything will help us,
you know, in our mission to represent the United States
(13:25):
the absolute best of our ability. We also teach, you know,
a lot of clinics and do a lot of work
with juniors and try to bring people into the high
power long range community. You know, we're we're trying to
do all the fundraising we can to support the team
and traveling overseas, like when we go to Bisley for
the World Championship in a couple of years. Just help
cover the cost of flights for the team members or
(13:46):
hotels or whatever we can.
Speaker 4 (13:48):
We are a you.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
Know, nonprofit shared organization and you know, if there are
people out there that can that need you.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
Know, tax break on the donation, yeah, donation that's Pact deductible.
Speaker 4 (14:00):
Correct, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (14:00):
And so trying to just get the word out there
because not many people know about the us n RT
or what we do or you know, while we're doing
any of that stuff. So just trying to get look
us up on Instagram or Facebook or you know, the
website or anything like that.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
Thanks for what you do and congratulations.
Speaker 4 (14:17):
Yes, sir, thanks very much. I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
Gre absolutely all right. Gun talk will be right back
in just a second.
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Speaker 7 (15:25):
There's more to this world of guns than you realize.
Speaker 8 (15:28):
Your entry to.
Speaker 7 (15:29):
Our world is a clickaway. At gun talk dot com
stay informed and entertained on the latest firearm related topics.
Whether it's new guns, training tips, gunsmithing, competition, shooting, self defense,
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Speaker 9 (15:54):
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Speaker 2 (16:29):
Hi.
Speaker 10 (16:30):
I'm Kim Roady, a six time Olympian in shooting, and
you're listening to gun Top. For thirty years, Tom has
been championing our love for the shooting, sports, hunting, and
firearms safety. Thank you Tom for inspiring so many of
us and for keeping the conversation alive.
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Humh Speaking of champion level Shooters Kim Rody. Yeah, that
was a great interview with Brandon Green, obviously an incredibly
talented and serious shooter. Although if you didn't catch it,
maybe it went by quickly. I want to make sure
you understand they're shooting out to a thousand yards and
(17:11):
people going, yeah, big deal, everybody shoots a thousand yeards.
Did you get it that they're using iron sights. Yeah,
and they're having to read the wind and every shot
counts and they have to shoot now no matter what
the wind is. If you want to see more of
(17:32):
what they're doing, take a look at their website. We
gave it during the interview, but it is a us
NRT for National Rifle Team USNRT dot com and I'm
just looking at They got a picture there of Brandon
with the chair where they chaired him when he won
the King's Prize at Bisley. Had an amazing accomplishment one
(17:53):
hundred and fifty six years and no Americans ever won this.
And then you know it's one of those deals that
around long enough, you might win something. Well, are you
hang around long enough? And little inside stuff, little family,
gun talk family. Brandon shot on the Army Roxsmanship Unit
Team with Michelle Cleland's son Ben Cleveland, who's who is
(18:18):
a mu so And thank you Michelle for putting that together.
That was a great interview and I really enjoyed having
that conversation. Just what a nice fellow I mean. And
I wasn't kidding when I said, you know, with youngsters
who are serious competitive shooters, it really doesn't matter of trap, ski, sporting,
(18:41):
clay's rifle, pistol, anything. I just have not run into
any problem kids. They're respectful, they're serious, they're safe, they're
you know, responsible. I like hanging around with those young people. Now.
(19:02):
I don't like the fact that they could all beat me,
but you know that's again a fairly low bar for
them to get over to there, because a lot of
them at age you know, twelve can beat me. I
know Kem Roady certainly could. She was the US women's
national champion in skeet when she was thirteen. Yeah, not
(19:22):
not the youth category women beat all the adult women
when she was thirteen. Some people just have it there,
I mean there, it is all right. So I mentioned earlier,
and I want to throw this idea out to you.
People always ask me, you know what gun for self? Defense?
What gun should I get to carry? What gun? Blah blah?
You know, let me throw out a thought. For a
(19:45):
lot of people, guys don't want to admit this. Recoil
is a thing, and recoil doesn't bother me. Yeah, why
are you she and lower and left because you're anticipating
the recoil. You're jerking the trigger because of recoil. You
know what has less recoil? A three eighty It is
significantly less recoil than a nine milimeter. Well, but is
(20:08):
it any good for self defense? Yes, it is. We've
done testing and ballistic gelatine, and generally speaking, a nine
milimeter and a thirty eight special you'll get almost identical
penetration and ballistic gel A three eighty will usually come
in one or two inches less in penetration. Is that
(20:32):
enough to matter? I don't think so. Well, what do
you get when you go to a three eighty, Well, first,
you get less recoil, easier to shoot a lot of times,
you get smaller pistols, easier to conceal. You also get,
and this is kind of a big thing for a
lot of people, you get a slide that's a lot
(20:55):
easier to manipulate to rack the slide because the recoil
spring doesn't have to be as strong. The recoil spring
slows down the slide as it goes backwards. You know
the force of the round going off forces to slide backwards. Well,
if you have less power in the round, then you
don't need as strong a recoil spring. So a three
(21:19):
to eighty often is really easy for a lot of
people to rack the slide. And there are some really
nice one. I have recently been fooding around with the
Ruger LCPMAX, really nice pistol. I'm playing with a new
pockethole storage of scott and if it actually comes out
just a prototype, we'll let you know about it. I
(21:39):
can tell you about that pretty slick man. You've got
a real pistol with a decent trigger with good capacity
in your pocket that's really concealable. And then you've got
the of course Smith and West and Bodyguard two point
zero which is very nice. And of course you got
the Shield Easy which is a very easy to rack
(21:59):
the slide. That I guess what I'm saying is don't
discount the three eighty and you might want to give
it a look even if it's not to replace what
you carry in, but maybe as an additional option, depending
on when you're carrying, how you're carrying, the clothes you're wearing.
Give the three eighty a chance you might like it. Well, well, well,
(22:24):
I'm back with you on Tom Gresham's Gun Talk. If
you want to join us, it's pretty easy. Give me
a call it my name Tom Talk Gun, Tom Talk Gun.
That'll get you in. Now, this story had the internet
all of Twitter see what I did there this week,
And I was going to talk about it anyway. But
that's okay because Nicole just called in out of Massachusetts.
(22:45):
N Cole. I wanted to talk about this, but I'm
gonna let you introduce the subject. Go for it.
Speaker 11 (22:51):
Okay.
Speaker 8 (22:52):
So, as you said, my name is Nicole, I'm pro
by saying I'm a small libertarian and I'm also trained.
So I was calling to find out where you fell
and what you thought about this proposed fans on firearms
that the administration put forth.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
Okay, So this story is all over the place that
the government was considering doing a ban on gun ownership
for trans people who are transsexual. Okay. Well, first of all,
I haven't seen anything from the government on this. I've
seen a lot of people say in the government's going
(23:32):
to do this, but I haven't seen anything that actually
says that there was a proposal or that it's real. Okay,
so let's start with that it may be true, may
not be true, But that almost is irrelevant to the
discussion because here's what is interesting. If it is true,
it's possible that it's real, but it's also possible that
(23:54):
it's a ropodope, it's a setup. Because look the reaction.
Every gun rights group, NRA, a Second Foundation, Fire's Policy Coalition,
every one of them opposed the idea and said, look,
the Second Amendment is a real right, and everybody gets
(24:15):
to have the real right of the Second Amendment to
keep in beare arms. So you cannot ban the Second
Amendment right from a group of people this period. You
just can't. You haven't been adjudicated to be you know,
you know, haven't been found guilty of a felony or
all the things that are in law. You just can't
do that. So the gun rights people all came in
(24:37):
on the side of this is a terrible idea, and
at the same time, the left and the media all
came in on the side of this is a terrible idea.
We have to wait for it. We have to support
Second Amendment rights for everybody, which is the first time
(25:00):
they've ever study anything like that. So universally there was
opposition to this trial balloon. If it was in fact
really being floated. The reaction was amazing. What were you seeing?
Speaker 8 (25:16):
It was a mixed bag from from all the groups.
Like you said, they all felt, you know, they all
opposed it. A lot of the people like Dane Lash,
you know, they said the same things, and you know,
the left is about to defend your gun rights. But
(25:39):
from the public there was there's a mixed bag. There's
about fifty fifty of people that are like, yeah, taken
and take them away from all these people, and you know,
the other half are like, no, you know, we shall
not be infringed means for everybody unless you've been adjuricated
and mentally detective or committed to crime. So it's from
the public it's been kind of tough. But from from
(26:02):
you know, people who are informed, you know, they're following
on your right.
Speaker 2 (26:07):
Yeah, it was. It was one of those deals. But
when I first heard, I thought, Okay, that can't be true.
And then you kind of keep seeing the report, you going, okay,
well it might be true that someone said this and
leaked it, but the reaction has been amazing across the board.
Everybodys saying no, no, no, no, no. This is a real right,
(26:28):
the Second Amendment. Is it not a second class right.
You cannot take it away from people categorically because of
their color or because of you know, anything other characteristic
other than what it's spelled out in law. So just basically,
I think it put a stop to it. And yeah,
you're always look, it's the Internet. You're always going to
get people saying things all over the place. But in
(26:51):
terms of the movers and shakers and the policymakers and
those who affect the policy, this was universal that no, no, no, no, no,
you cannot do this. So well, I appreciate you bringing
this up. I wanted to get to that, but I'm
glad you called in. Thank you so much for the call.
All right, let's Richard online too, out of Eugene, Oregon. Hello, Richard,
you're on gun Talk. What's that?
Speaker 11 (27:13):
Well, you were inquiring about the three eighty pistols. I
carry a sick p two thirty. That's my carry gun,
and I think it's sufficient to do what the two
job does.
Speaker 2 (27:26):
How did you decide on that particular model.
Speaker 11 (27:30):
Well, I came across it, and the only thing I
don't like about the gun is it's got the European
release on the bottom of the AH.
Speaker 2 (27:44):
The mag release is on the bottom like they do. Yeah,
you're right, it's a European style. You're not going to
do a quick mag change in that generally.
Speaker 11 (27:52):
No, no. But they do have one P two thirty
two which does have a better release on it. It's
that you could do it quick. But I don't have
that pistol, so I deal with what I got it.
Speaker 2 (28:05):
It's a fairly small pistol, right.
Speaker 11 (28:08):
Yes, it's like it's like James Bond gun or the
water PPK.
Speaker 2 (28:14):
Well, you know what you can do. This is gonna
be I'm going to help you out here because you
can do You can do the New York reload, which
is just to have a second gun.
Speaker 12 (28:27):
I knew you were going to like that one.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
An excuse to buy another gun.
Speaker 11 (28:34):
Oh I got too many. Now, I don't get to
go hush.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
Your mouth, no, no, no, never let those words come
out of your mouth. No such things. Yeah, the three
eighties that actually, and you know what's happened is the
three eighty well, you know what, way back to nine
had a bad reputation because of the AMMO. Everywhere was
you in full metal jacket ball ammo. Same with the
three eighty. But once we got good AMMO for the nine,
(28:58):
it became more respectable. And now with the three eighty,
we're getting the same thing. We're getting good defensive AMMO,
expanding AMMO for the three eighty, and all of a
sudden it's become a viable option for self defense.
Speaker 11 (29:11):
All right. Yeah, And I've got some uh three eighty
eight plus P on mine.
Speaker 4 (29:17):
But it's.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
Good.
Speaker 11 (29:24):
I don't know, I can't see anything wrong with it.
Speaker 2 (29:26):
Well, you know, shooter, Yeah, well the only thing wrong
with the plus PMO it's got more power is you're
you're required to pull the tuggar harder. You know that? Right?
Oh yeah, right, okay, good, that's right. As long as
to pull the trigger harder, we're shooting faster, that's as good. Yeah, yeah,
the wretch, I appreciate it. I appreciate that. That's very cool.
(29:49):
But P three or two thirty rather there you go,
all right, we'll be right back with more gun talk.
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If you want to have a more fun shooting over
the next few months, take a lever action to the range.
If you don't have a lever action, this is a
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Just there, it is, all right, let's go line line one.
Denball is calling out a South Dakota or driving through
(32:39):
Wyoming or somewhere out there. Hey, Denball, you're on the air.
Speaker 12 (32:43):
Yeah. I've been thinking about what the Trump administration has
been doing with using the National Guard and the military
and urban areas. I'm an overdroad truck driver, so I'm
you know, I kind of see both sides of this.
You know, I spend a lot of time in kind
of less than desirable parts of LA and Oakland and
(33:04):
places like that, and I get it, you know, something
absolutely need needs to be done, and you know, I
feel terrible for the people living there and trying to
raise families there. But on the other hand, I also
remember Hurricane Katrina, where, you know, after Katrina, the governor,
you know, had the National Guard and the mayor of
New Orleans and they were using the weather event as
(33:27):
a way to confiscate firearms. You know. I also drove
through Missquaton, Nevada when you know, that whole Bundy thing
was going on, and it made me extremely uncomfortable watching that.
I'm just worried about a future president. You know, maybe
Heaven forbid a president Gavin Newsom, or Heaven forbid a
(33:49):
president AOC you know, like Biden put in the executive
order on the pistol braces, which had less than you know,
single digit compliance. What would happen if a future Democrat
president used this is a president for using the military
against the Second Amendment.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
It is an excellent question. And I know that some
folks who are conservative just automatically say, yeah, we got
to do something about that. And I'm not worried about
the military. But yes, in Katrina twenty years ago, they
sent the police door to door, kicking indoors and said
there will be no guns in this city other than
what the police have. They took them all and then
(34:30):
denied they did it, and then hit them all in
a warehouse and denied they had it until they were
sued by the Second Amendment Foundation. And then we found
the warehouse and they went, oh, look at that, a
warehouse full of guns. I wonder how that got there. Yeah, No,
to your point, it's an excellent point. If you look,
if you're not afraid of the government, you don't understand
the government. It's as simple as that. And yes they could,
(34:53):
and they are certainly elected politicians who would send them
the National Guard to go door to door or to
use the forty four seventy three to say you bought this,
it's now illegal and you have to turn it in
or we're going to pull you out of your house
and arrest you on the spot. It has happened before
in other countries. It has even happened here in this country.
(35:13):
We're in California where they said, well, yeah, we know,
we told you that was illegal, but now were it
was legal for you to have that, but now we've
made it illegal and we know who you are, and
they've sent letters to people, so you have to turn
these in. So I do not disagree with you that
this is a concern, and it's just something that I
(35:37):
don't know at this point what if anything needs to
be done other than just keeping an eye on it.
But I do appreciate to bring it up. I think
it is a very interesting topic and one that's worth discussing.
Thank you for the calle n Ball. Appreciate that Frank's
in a reno of that on too. Hey Frank talk
to me. Hello, Yes, sir.
Speaker 13 (35:59):
Yeah, Well, I have mentioned that many people over the
years that you know, when they complain about crazy mass
shootings and it turns out there's a suggestion the person
might be on some kind of riddlin or drugs or
something for ADHD or whatever their issues may be, and
they always ask, well, we should do something about that,
you know, similar to the trans ban issue that just
(36:21):
came up a while back, and the problem is there's
hippo laws that basically prevents you from learning anything about
the medical history, much less the mental history. And it's like, well,
until that changes, or we find some way to identify
these people. And the only way to do that now
is the guy gets thrown into fifty one fifty and
(36:42):
he gets adjudicated as a metal defective in some way,
and now the forty four to seventy three won't let
him buy a gun. But unless you've got any insight
on the hippo law problem, I don't remember anybody really
bringing this up. Every time it comes up, it never mentioned.
Speaker 2 (36:58):
No, it's a good point. And you know, and you're right,
if you haven't been adjudicated mentally incompetent, and this is
not you know, a middle incompetency issue according to the
documents and the regulations, then this is this is simply
a non starter. And the idea that we would say, okay,
those people over there, we should strip them of their
(37:22):
gun rights, you go, you understand that you are part
of those people, of some group of those people, whether
it's you know, those people who live in that state
or that city, or those people who are military veterans
because they've been trained to kill. I mean, there's everybody
is a part of some group that somebody doesn't like.
(37:43):
And if we are keen on saying we're going to
strip secrament of rights from some group of people, understand
that that can be turned right around and used against
you are any other group. And I appreciate the call.
In fact, let's take this down to the root of
the whole thing. Gun control laws in the US were
designed to take guns out of the hands of black citizens.
(38:09):
All gun control laws in the US are based on racism,
or are based you track them back down, you will
find that the whole idea was, how are we going
to keep black people from having guns? We will come
up with gun control laws. And so anybody who pushes
gun control laws is actually pushing Jim Crow laws, actually
(38:32):
pushing racist rooted laws. Talk about using gun laws against
those people. That's how gun controls started, was identifying those people.
Do we want to be part of that? I know
I don't, and I really don't think the Second AMENDMIC
(38:54):
community does either. We want Second MIC rights for everybody,
simple as that. Let me come back. I got to
take on school shootings. Something might be coming around the corner. Hey,
(39:14):
coming up in just a few minutes, a different take
on how to protect schools from shooters. You know, I
gotta leave this one using drones. Yeah, we'll talk about that.
Let's go to line one. Doug is with us out
of Waxahatchie, Texas. Hello Doug, what's on your mind?
Speaker 6 (39:34):
Hey? Tom Grisham. I'm one of those three eighties cicionados, okay,
and everything I have is three eighty, with the exception
of one that is not concealable, and that is a
British three oh three.
Speaker 2 (39:52):
So what three eighties do you have? And which one
do you like to carry?
Speaker 6 (39:57):
The one that I like the best is the R
I a Baby Rock three eighty nineteen eleven style. Oh cool,
scale down for three eighty, but is a very faithful
look of a nineteen eleven.
Speaker 2 (40:16):
Right. Uh, how do you carry it?
Speaker 12 (40:21):
I have?
Speaker 6 (40:23):
I have two holsters that I can use it effectively with.
It's an outside the waistband that's generic for kind of
like a The word escapes me right now, but I
can use it with several of my firearms. I do
(40:43):
have a Kaidex holster for it. I'm still fine tuning
how much effort I have to take out of it.
The first time I got it, it was almost impossible
to remove, so.
Speaker 11 (40:56):
I had it.
Speaker 2 (40:58):
Now, let me ask you one of the things that
people going to say, Okay, well, that's that's a small
pillstol god. I understand it's a little nineteen eleven. But
then you have reduced capacity in an era of the
bucket of bullets guns where you've got double stack ghosts forever?
What do you carry six or seven rounds in that?
Speaker 6 (41:16):
It's a seven round mag and I've got a lot
of them. Okay, Actually there's an aftermarket that is available
that will hold twelve rounds, and I'm looking at getting
a few of those.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
Oh okay, what other three as do you have?
Speaker 6 (41:38):
I have a high point with a laser on the
underside of it. A lot of people tend to bad
mouth the high point I've had. I've had surprisingly very
good results with them, and I would not like to
(41:59):
be on the receiving end.
Speaker 2 (42:01):
Well that's the you know what. You know what's great
about them? They go off when you pull the trigger.
Speaker 6 (42:05):
Bet they do? Yeah, And mine works real well with
the laser on underneath it. Ith and I've also got
car beans as well.
Speaker 2 (42:15):
Sweet. Okay, so I mean you're a real three eighty guy. Well,
I appreciate the call. I appreciate the update on that
and a little nineteen eleven and three eighty. I love
that idea A small light and with a decent trigger,
so as all nineteen elevens tend to have great idea. Yeah,
thanks for the call. I really think people ought to
(42:38):
take a fresh look at the three eighty. A lot
of the ideas that we have particare those of us
have been added a long time. We develop an idea
and we stick with it. We don't update our information.
And you're going, well, you know three AD they just
punched as holes. Well, yeah, if you use ball ammo,
but sort of the forty five. That's why the forty
five was popular because if you're it's just going to
(43:00):
shoot ball ammo and everything that, it makes a bigger hole. Okay,
because wherever it get's going to be what you get.
It doesn't expand. But if you have decent expanding AMMO
or something like the Honey Badge or Ammo from Blackhill's Ammo,
which is really cool, now you have effective self defense
AMMO in a small carriable pistol and something that where
(43:22):
you can rack the slide, and for more and more people,
that's becoming an issue as you get older, you get arthritis,
whatever it is, there, you go, all right when we
come back. We got some people that they say we
could put drones in schools and we can use those
to take care of these active shooters. So I'm going, really,
I need to know more about this. So that's where
we're going to take up when we come back. Step
(43:44):
for aside, be right back
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