September 8, 2024 • 43 mins
In This Hour:
-- 20 million new gun owners and the need for supporting 2nd amendment organizations. Chris Cox of NRA-ILA explains.
-- challenges to reloading when the size of the primer pocket changes.
-- collecting and firing old military guns.
Gun Talk 09.08.23 Hour 1
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/gun-talk--6185159/support.
-- 20 million new gun owners and the need for supporting 2nd amendment organizations. Chris Cox of NRA-ILA explains.
-- challenges to reloading when the size of the primer pocket changes.
-- collecting and firing old military guns.
Gun Talk 09.08.23 Hour 1
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/gun-talk--6185159/support.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
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Speaker 2 (00:16):
Well, you've better buckle up because we got a lot
of things to talk about today. Hey, I am Tom
Gresham and I am your host. This is Gun Talk.
We're going to be talking about web guns and shooting
and AMMO and scopes and all the rest of it.
But of course we'll also talk about the Second Amendment
and the fight to preserve it, expand it, to enlarge it,
(00:38):
and to fight back those efforts of those and there
are a lot of them out there who want to
take away your gun rights and consequently your guns.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
As a result of all of that, Today.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
We're going to be talking about gun rights and a
brand new gun rights group. Also, we're going to have
a hero on who stopped a mass shooting using his
AR fifteen rifle. Then we're going to talk to our
the pioneers in the development of in terms of getting
out to the public the AAR fifteen platform and what
an AR fifteen is actually good for. If you don't
(01:11):
know much about it. You may be amazed at this
because there's so much misinformation out there about that. So
you could be a part of this. All you have
to do is give us a call. Of course, we
love those range reports. Have you been shooting, You've been
taking somebody out to the range, did you buy a
new gun, did you trade for a gun. We're looking
for all those stories, and that's pretty easy. Just give
(01:32):
me a call. Eight six six Talk gun or Tom
Talk Gun. One of the pioneers who's been in the
lead in the battle to preserve the Second Amendment for
decades is Chris Cox, says, the head of the NRA's
Institute for Legislative Action, the NRAILA. He was in the
(01:52):
lead for many many years on this, and then of
course we had the thing over at the NRA which
you kind of imploded, blew up, and then Chris wasn't there.
But now Chris is back on board and he joined
us right now. Chris, how are you, my friend.
Speaker 4 (02:08):
I'm doing well. Tom. It's always great.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
To be with you, always a pleasure to have you here.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
Now I know that you haven't been like hiding because
you've been in DC and You've been doing things that
maybe people weren't aware of.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
If you want to bring us up to speed.
Speaker 5 (02:22):
Sure, I mean, Tom, you and I have been having direct,
tough but honest conversations for the past twenty plus years,
as you mentioned, and I think all of us, if
we have an honest reflection on the overall state of
affairs within the Second Amendment community, you've got to conclude
that they are important gaps that need to be filled.
So I looked at this, and I looked at the
(02:45):
one hundred million Americans who cherish the right of self
defense and cherish their ability to choose for themselves the
weapon that they want to have to protect themselves and
their family.
Speaker 4 (02:55):
God forbid they ever need it.
Speaker 5 (02:58):
And I look at it. There's there are gaps, Tom,
and we don't have time to sit back and hope
that everything just comes together on its own. I think
there are groups that are doing a phenomenal job in
certain areas you and I have talked about the Second
Amendment Foundation. They're leading the charge with an effective legal
(03:18):
strategy to not only expand upon bruing, but to fight
back against these ongoing legal, legislative and regulatory attacks. I
think the work that staff is doing is honestly more
important now than ever. I think the National Shooting Sports
Foundation is doing great works on behalf of the manufacturers
to give them a chance of actually manufacturing. I mean,
(03:41):
there are attacks on the industry, on the Protectional Lawful
Commerce and Arms.
Speaker 4 (03:45):
Act that we all work so hard for.
Speaker 5 (03:47):
And I think in the hunting arena there's phenomenal work
being done by Safari Club International and Rocky Mountain Elk
Foundation to protect our hunting heritage. But someone needs to
talk to of the twenty million new gun owners that
we've seen join our ranks since COVID, we study, we
(04:08):
know they go ahead.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Tom, I'm just going to say, you know, in everything
I've done over the past fifty years and looking back
and every survey this it's ever been done about why
do people own guns? The number one reason that people
own guns has always been self defense.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
And what I.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
Think I hear you leading up to is that's part
of the message and the outgrowth and why you formed
this new group.
Speaker 5 (04:29):
Well, you're exactly right, and we see it right now.
I mean, we need a voice, not just in good times,
but when self defense is under attack. We see it
right now. In Georgia with this horrific event. You know
where the groups or witch group rathers out there reminding
the American people why gun ownership matters. Witch groups out
there explaining that self defense is important and work protecting well,
(04:52):
I can tell you there's one group doing it right now,
and that's the Secure our Freedom Alliance that I'm working with.
And we're just getting started.
Speaker 2 (05:00):
What is Secure our Freedom Alliance?
Speaker 3 (05:02):
Who is it? Who's behind this?
Speaker 5 (05:04):
So we've assembled Tom, the best strategist, the best pollsters,
the best ad makers, all with experience and marshaling supporters
of the Second Amendment.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
That's what this is about.
Speaker 5 (05:16):
As I said, there's one hundred million self defense supporters
in this country. We're not a membership organization at this point,
but we're working towards doing a lot of important work.
And as I said, we're just getting started, and this
is going to be an important endeavor.
Speaker 2 (05:33):
I would encourage people to go check out Secure Ourfreedomalliance
dot org really smart messagings. I got a couple of
really good TV type commercials and we've pulled up the
audio from one of Thosess Chris stand by for a second.
We're going to play this so people can get just
a sense. This is just the audio. You're not even
seeing the video of how good these are. Go ahead, Jim.
Speaker 6 (05:55):
It doesn't matter where I am, who I'm with, or
what I'm wearing. I'm always pretty.
Speaker 7 (06:00):
As soon as I turned twenty one, the first thing
I did was get my permit to carry a handgun.
My dad took me to the range all the time
when I was a teenager.
Speaker 6 (06:09):
It was common ground. As a woman, I.
Speaker 7 (06:13):
Made the decision to always be ready to carry a
gun is my freedom and my right.
Speaker 6 (06:19):
It's nice to feel protected. Gun ownership works for me.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
Chris.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
You know, people everywhere say that they're worried about crime,
and this to me seems like, at least with these
two spots you have up so far, it's an effort
to reach out to people who say, I am concerned
about crime, I'm concerned about my personal safety, and to
normalize the idea that you can and should take care
of yourself.
Speaker 5 (06:45):
Well, Tom, you're that's exactly right. And we know, based
on these twenty million new gun owners since COVID that
they skew female, they skew minority. In the first two
ads we've launched, speak directly to them that you have
a place, you have a voice, and you have the
right to be proud of yourself and the right to
(07:06):
protect yourself. And we're going to make sure that the
American people that we go out and win the hearts
and minds of those who don't understand that this right
is under attack, that don't understand why it's important, even
you know, during tough times like we're under right now.
So that's part of our message. And as I said,
I think you're really going to enjoy what you see
out of the group over the next twelve, eighteen, twenty
(07:27):
four months and.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Beyond, well, we're dropping this in right now, we're sixty
days out from the election. Is there a role to
be played for Secure our Freedom Alliance in this election?
Speaker 5 (07:38):
Well, Tom, the overall mission of the Secure Our Freedom
Alliance is to go out and make sure that the
American people understand the importance of self defense and that
it needs to be protected, and that the politicians like
Joe Biden and to others who want to blame law
abiding gun owners for their failed policies and their failure
to keep us safe is unacceptable. The general the overall
(08:00):
mission is to win hearts and minds. There are things
that legally can be done in and around political messages.
Right now, you're seeing a lot of educational outreach, but
as I said, there's much more to come. I think
you'll be pleased with what you see out of this group.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
One of the things I know for sure, and you
know clearly from your background with the NRA, it takes
a lot of money to do a lot of these things.
Do you have enough money? Where's it coming from.
Speaker 5 (08:26):
Well, we have a handful of patriots who said, look,
we've looked at this the same way you have. We
understand that the traditional voices aren't what they used to be,
and that we need someone out there, in a group,
out there getting this message out, even if it's just
during the tough times tom as I mentioned, where a
lot of groups will stick their head in the sand
(08:47):
and just take body shots and hope that it goes away.
Someone needs to be out there making sure that the
American people remind their elected officials and engage in the
process in and around self defense and the Second Amendment.
So is there a is there a role that the
self that self defense is going to play? As you said,
it already crime is a is an important issue, not
(09:08):
just the crime associated with you know, an open border,
but the crime associated with liberal prosecutors and judges who
won't prosecute actual criminals. You're seeing these stories out of
you know, Oklahoma and other places where it's just heartbreaking.
And that's what self defense. That's that's why the Second
Amendment is there.
Speaker 4 (09:28):
It's it's to.
Speaker 5 (09:30):
Give you the ability to protect yourself when nobody else
is there for you.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
And that's not powerful.
Speaker 5 (09:37):
That's a powerful narrative, powerful political narrative, powerful educational narrative,
and it's one that needs to be out consistently, not
just during the elections, not just when we're winning, but
when times are tough. That's one of the reasons we're
stepping into the stepping into the middle of it again.
Speaker 3 (09:54):
I was talking to somebody.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
I mentioned something about the post Brewin era, and you know,
kind of jokingly but realistically, said, yeah, that's also the
post in Ora era. We're looking at a lack of
dollars going into the election. Now, NRA used to pour
lots of money in We're also looking for a very
much reduction in the amount of effort that the NRA
(10:16):
could and has done in terms of working with Congress
and with the legislatures.
Speaker 3 (10:21):
And as you say, there are.
Speaker 2 (10:21):
Several groups that have picked up on the litigation side,
working in the courts, and that's being done very well,
but I'm just not seeing much going on in Congress
and the legislatures. Is that something that this new group
can do.
Speaker 5 (10:35):
Absolutely, and we're focused right now on getting the right
messages out to the right people as quickly as possible.
But as we move forward, again, this isn't about competing
with other groups. This isn't about trying to take credit
from other groups. There's plenty of people.
Speaker 3 (10:52):
Who do that.
Speaker 5 (10:53):
I've lived through it, I've witnessed it. You and I
had those conversations over a long period of time. This
is not about This is about winning. And I've always
viewed this throughout my career and I know you have
as well that as long as we win, I don't
care who takes credit for it. But the point is,
are we as strong as we were five or six
(11:13):
years ago? Is the Second Amendment as secure in the
court of public opinion? Is it a secure you know?
Is the Protection Lawful Commerce and Arms Act really secure?
Or is there a coordinated effort to undermine it is
the Second Amendment, economy under attack with a choke point
two point zero, the way we all hoped would never happen.
(11:35):
And I think an honest reflection shows that there's a
lot of work that's not being done, and I intend
to I didn't spend half my life fighting for this
right and this freedom to see it all flushed down
the toilet, So if I can play a role and
help out, then that's what I'm going to do.
Speaker 2 (11:51):
Well, I appreciate it. As you said, you and I
have not always agreed on how to get there. We
always agreed on what the goal is. And I appreciate
what you're doing. And look, would you do me a favorite?
Keep us posted on this is very encouraging and very exciting.
I applaud this smart way that you're going about the
messaging on this.
Speaker 3 (12:06):
Well.
Speaker 5 (12:07):
I appreciate your compliments. The Giffords group wasn't as excited
as you were to see us back in the back
in the fold, but that means truthfully, tome I laughed
when someone sent that to me, because what this group
has done is announced our support for this god given
right to defend yourself and the need to go out
(12:27):
and marshal the troops around this.
Speaker 4 (12:29):
Right.
Speaker 5 (12:30):
Our first two ads are a single mother who wants
to be able to protect herself and her child, A
single woman who wants to be able to protect her
body in her life. And so does Giffords hate women
or their ability to protect themselves or both? So you
just kind of have to laugh more at the attacks.
I never really paid much attention to the naysayers. We
(12:52):
have a job to do. We're going to do it unapologetically.
I look forward to keeping you posted and any questions
that you or anybody else have have the website, we
just launched this thing in July, Tom, so we're building
it out. The most important thing for us was not
to spend a bunch of money on fancy websites, but
to really go out and get this message in front
(13:13):
of the people who matter, people who are to make
the decision of what this freedom looks like moving forward.
And as I said, we're excited and just getting started.
Speaker 2 (13:21):
Thanks so much, Chris, I really appreciate it. We'll keep
up to date with this with you, Thanks sir.
Speaker 4 (13:26):
Thanks Tom, take care all right.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
It is Secure our Freedom Alliance. That is the website.
Secure Ourfreedomalliance dot org. Very interesting, a new gun rights
group from some of the folks who had, Well, you
might save the old gun rights group here.
Speaker 3 (13:44):
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Speaker 2 (16:18):
All right, we're over lines now. If you want to
give me a call eight sixty six Talk Gun or
Tom Talk Gun. I'm looking at a story out of Idaho,
Montana on the line there of a bear attack a
few days ago, and this guy's got mauled. Grizzly attack
five hundred and thirty pound grizzly. I think it ends
up being they shot this bear twenty four times. Yeah,
(16:42):
you heard me right, They shot at twenty four times.
I had a forty five ACP had a ten milimeters pistol.
Two young men. This thing is mauling them, working them over,
and they are shooting this thing while it's tearing them up.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
It's a reminder of.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
People often don't understand how powerful bears are in general,
and grizzlies are in particular, how muscular they are, and
how powerful a gun has to be to stop them.
And we we always want to say, well, this is
probably good enough, you know, And I mailed me to
(17:25):
works some people that'll probably stop a bear at least. Yeah,
it'll get his attention, it'll make him run away, it'll
stop him. Maybe maybe not. Just understand that a grizzly
can sit there on a hillside and rooting around for
grubs and worms or whatever it's digging for, and rolling
rocks effortless, just just flipping them out of the way,
(17:45):
rocks that you and I couldn't together pick up and
move or roll. They're just so incredibly powerful. The idea
being that the biggest thing you can carry is barely
enough for this. And you know you I know ten
milimeter is very popular for beer protection. I would probably
(18:06):
describe the ten millimeter as the very bottom level. And look,
I know about Phil Shoemaker, I know about the nine millimeter.
I know he's using buffalo board amo and it worked
really well. And I think Phil would probably still be
because he's a bear expert, the first one to tell
you that's not really the best thing. It would be
better to have something a little bit bigger. I don't
(18:28):
know if you can hear in the background, I got
airplanes going by. We have fire tankers going by. There's
a formation of for them that go by. There's they
call them the fire hogs. We have fires all around
us right now. I'll get to that in a minute.
Because we had to evacuate, we had to share a
deputy can bang on the door. You got to go.
You got to get out here now. Oh yeah, that
was great. We'll tell you about that a little bit.
(18:48):
And the idea of being prepared to go. Do you
have backpacked but yeah, we've got these they call them
fire hogs. It's a seat seat, single engineer tanker on
floats and they scoop water out of our lake that's
right next to our cabin here and then they dump
it on the fires that are nearby, and you know,
we like having them. It's like having an air show,
(19:10):
a little bit of an Oskosh air show. Right here
in the middle of the fire and smoke. I can't
even see the lake from where I am. Mean, usually
you can almost throw a rock that far. So the
smoke is really heavy. We have I don't know within
thirty miles of us. I bet we have twelve to fifteen,
maybe twenty fires going big fires. So we'll talk a
little bit about having a go bag, not just for this,
(19:30):
for anything, a basic go bag, because you never know
when you're going to get that banging on the door
and says, hey, something's going on. You got to get
out now. Not like you know, you got an hour
to get out. You got thirty seconds to get out
of your house. It's time to roll interesting stuff there. Yeah,
we got we got airplanes in the background. Got You
(19:51):
never know what's going to be going on around here.
That's why I grab John and Palmer Alaska Line three.
Hey John, you are on gun talk. What's on your mind, sir?
Speaker 11 (19:59):
Well, I know we don't have smoke up here.
Speaker 3 (20:02):
Well, sometimes you do but not this time.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
Huh oh.
Speaker 11 (20:05):
I know it's either a smoky summer or rainy summer.
Speaker 4 (20:07):
But anyway, let me get to my point here. I reload,
I reload a lot, and.
Speaker 11 (20:11):
What I've been coming into contact with the last couple
of years is ten millimeters, forty cal and forty five
are starting to come with small primers, and that is
mainly from Blazer and Federal. There may be some other manufacturers.
But I've got a progressive loader and it'll jam me up.
I mean, if you're blowing and going through that thing
and boom, you got a small primer, then you gotta okay.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
So let me explain to people what you're what you're
dealing with is uh empty get brass, empty cases that
have a pocket in it for a small primer and
not a large pistol primer. And so if you're just
you got a whole bunch of brass in there and
you're running through a loader, and all of a sudden
you get a case that has the smaller primer pocket,
(20:54):
you can't get a large primer in there, and it's
just going to stop the whole works.
Speaker 11 (21:00):
That is correct, And I don't know mind changing things.
Speaker 3 (21:04):
Up like that.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
But that's what I'm just going to say. I don't
know what has made this happen. And maybe they just said, look,
we have one hundred million small pistol primers. Uh, just
go ahead and make the brass for those and we'll
make it all work. Not really worrying about the reloaders
out there. But it's one of those deals that what
I guess the bottom line on this, and you know
(21:27):
where I'm going to go with this, is you have
to sort your brash. You have to check it out carefully.
If you particularly if you're picking up brains brass, you
got to really look it over carefully. And now we
never had to do this before, and look, I appreciate
the call it. We never had to check whether it
have small pistol primer pocket or a large pistol primer pocket.
And if you have that, you got to work those out.
(21:50):
And whether you sort them out and keep the small
ones or you toss theme or you give them to
a buddy, I don't know. You got to work all
that yourself out. By the way I'm doing, some are
reloading for my new three thirty eight olls.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
I get to the range.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
Maybe tomorrow we'll see what works have been able to
get to the rais recently, but I'm working up some
loads there.
Speaker 3 (22:06):
I'll talk a little bit about that as we go along.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
If you want to join us eight sixty six Talk
Gun we are open lines. I am Tom Gresham and
this is gun Talk and we were back the of course,
we have the opening of a lot of hunting seasons
going on right now around the country. And I see
(22:30):
that Louisiana is today is actually the last day of
the three day holiday.
Speaker 3 (22:36):
They have a special tax free holiday.
Speaker 2 (22:41):
They've removed sales taxes on Second Amendment items on guns
and AMMO.
Speaker 3 (22:46):
And archery gear.
Speaker 2 (22:48):
And it's Friday, September sixteenth, Saturday the seventh seventh, or
the sixth seventh, and the eighth, that'd be today the eighth.
So basically in a lot of places that would amount
to about a ten percent saving on guns and AMMO.
And it really has worked to the advantage of not
just the people who are buying, but the people who
are selling. That works for the gun stores and they
(23:11):
don't have to collect sales tax. That's a serious reduction.
Look is ten percent, As I say, that's real money,
works for it. And I see in Alabama. I don't
understand this. In Montgomery, Alabama, the mayor has decided he's
signed a law and local ordinance which probably is illegal,
(23:35):
requiring anyone carrying a concealed firearm also has to carry
a photo ID.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
Think of the irony here.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
You have a Democrat he was saying that photo IDs
are good at the same time that Democrat party is
telling us that photo IDs are racist. To require a
photo ID for voting, well, that's ridiculous, that would be racist.
What's going on here is that Alabama has constitutional carry.
The mayor doesn't like that, and so the mayor says,
(24:04):
what am I going to do about it? Well, probably nothing,
because Alabama has preemption laws, so cities cannot pass their
own gun control laws. So it will get challenged and
it will get tossed. But in the meantime, you have
this virtue signaling thing going on where he's saying, well,
we're going to require anybody who is legally carrying a
(24:25):
firearm to have a photo ID. Why who's going to
be impacted by this?
Speaker 3 (24:35):
Have you thought this through?
Speaker 2 (24:38):
And of course you always get the same thing of well,
you know, the police say this constitutional carry things made
it harder for them to identify people with illegal guns.
Speaker 3 (24:50):
Let me get this said very clearly.
Speaker 2 (24:53):
As much as I support law enforcement and I support
the police, I am not willing to give up even
half of a right, much less any given right to make.
Speaker 3 (25:04):
Your job easier.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
We don't give up our rights to make the police's
job easier. That would be like one of the most
foolish things we could do. So I'm just saying when
you say, well, you know, it makes the police's job harder,
not my problem. I don't care. I mean, really, it's
not that I don't care that the police's job is harder.
(25:28):
They have to work a little harder. It's just that
making their job easier is not worth it for me
to give up any right, whether it's a right against
illegal search and seizure or right against well anything literally anything,
free speech, search and seizure, carrying a gun, anything else. No,
(25:48):
I'm not going to give up a single right to
make it the jobs easier for law enforcement. And anybody
who really cares about the rule of law would understand that.
And we say, yeah, no, we're not going to do that,
Are you kidding me? No, you just find a way
the cops already know who the bad guys are. I mean,
that's basic rule there, So you understand starting off with that,
(26:13):
we probably should off. I'm gonna touch on this BRIEFEO,
but I'm not gonna spend a lot of time on it.
We had another school shooting. They are, unlike what the
media tells you, pretty rare if you start doing the
research into what they're calling school shootings. And Amy Square
did that and she said, you know what we're finding
(26:33):
is if you start looking at each one of them individually,
not like, oh, there's been all these numbers.
Speaker 3 (26:38):
You say, oh, well, that.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
Was a shooting at eleven o'clock at night between gang
members when they ran into the parking lot of a school,
and the gun band people call that a school shooting.
Speaker 3 (26:53):
Yeah no. Or when a school resource officer.
Speaker 2 (26:59):
Has a firearm go off inadvertently, unattended, negligently, if you will,
that gets counted as a school shooting. Of course, what
they're doing is inflating the numbers. Why would they do that.
It's the same reason they have inflated the numbers on
so called mass shootings. When the FBI said there are
(27:20):
twenty to thirty a year, the gun band people said, well,
that's not nearly enough to frighten the public. And their
goal here is we have to frighten the public so
that they will want to take action on this. So
we formed they we they the gun band people formed
this group called the Gun Violence Archive, and they redefined
(27:40):
what a mass shooting was in such a way to
inflate the numbers greatly. And then they did a very smart,
from their standpoint, marketing effort to get that out to
the media. And now you see the media quoting the
Gun Violence Archive. Phony group completely debunked, and of course
they're using these bogus defintions of what a mass shooting is.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
But then now they have their numbers way.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
Up, and so the media can say, well, we've had
hundreds of mass shootings in the US, Well, how can
we have hundreds of those when the FBI says it's
like twenty to thirty a year. Well, the only way
we can have that happen is if you simply change
the definition of what that is. You know, I mean,
I would think you'd call Chicago mass shooting every single
(28:26):
weekend for what's going on over there. But just so
you understand, when you see these numbers being paraded around
about school shootings. Most of them don't have to do
with what we think of as a school shooting. Someone
goes into a school and shoots it up. It's something else, entirely,
not trying to lessen the impact or the horror or
(28:49):
the tragedy of someone murdering kids. But I will say
this in Alabama, what happened to stop the shooting. A
good with a gun showed up. Once again, a good
guy with a gun shows up, and the murderers stop.
In this case, it's a school resource officer didn't have
(29:11):
to shoot this murderous youngster. But when a good guy
with a gun, whether it's that person is a man
or a woman, whether that person is wearing a uniform
or not, when that person shows up. By showing up
I mean on scene pointing a gun at the murderer,
the shooting stops. The reverse of that, of course, is Uvaalde, Texas.
(29:35):
The good guys with the guns kind of showed up,
but then they wouldn't go in. They hung around the hall,
they hung around in the offices. They stood around for
an hour while kids are getting murdered. No showing up
means you have to be eyeball to eyeball with the
murderer of being willing to shoot that sob right now
and as soon as that happens, whether the bad guy
(29:59):
shoots himself, which happens fairly frequently, or gives up, either
way works because the murdering stops at that point. All
that goes to how quickly can we get a good
guy with a gun to show up? Wow, wouldn't it
be something if the staff of the school, the ones
who volunteered, the ones who got training, the ones who
(30:22):
knew what they were doing, the ones who were responsible,
if one or more of those people were there and
could in fact stop it even more quickly, Because the
more quickly you can stop it, the more lives you save.
And that's the calculus of this, all right. Our numbers
eight sixty six Talk Gun. I'm Tom Gresham. This is
(30:44):
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Speaker 2 (32:56):
Hey, let's talk about preparedness because I'm just getting a
note during the uh during the break here, if I
have to go, you'll understand, somebody came and banged on
the door. A neighbors said, hey, fires are blown up
on the mountain behind us again. So I was just
sending a note to my wife saying, hey, you might
want to go ahead and make sure your bags packed
again because we had to leave earlier this week. We
(33:17):
were watching We're They have a deal here. They call
it ready, set and go. Different stages of getting ready.
Ready is, you know, just thinking about it. Set means
your bags are packed and you can go if you
need to. And go means get out of the house
and boogie.
Speaker 3 (33:28):
So we went.
Speaker 2 (33:29):
We're living under set the middle level right now, and
we did get the go command earlier this week we
had to get out here. We were gone for a
couple of nights until they took the level back down.
And we'll see. But if you hear me say, okay,
I got to get out of here. You'll know what's
going on, because it means somebody's coming, said fire's coming.
Speaker 3 (33:50):
You need to leave.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Toward that end, having a go back. We've talked about
this before, not just for this but for any time.
Speaker 3 (34:00):
It's not a real bad idea.
Speaker 2 (34:01):
If you just had a backpack or a duffel bag
or a suitcase, whatever you have, you say, okay, I'm
just going to permanently leave three days of clothes in there,
and an extra toothbrush and toothpaste and a couple of.
Speaker 3 (34:16):
Things, knowing that.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
In five minutes you could go get all your cosmetics,
you could get your bathroom stuff. You could get all
that stuff and shove it in there, and you could
get out the door and go. And I know there
are people think, why would I want that? Why would
I need that? Well, I don't know what exactly might
happen in your situation. I just know what could happen.
What has happened. You could have a train derailment in
(34:44):
your area, and now there is a big cloud of ugly, noxious,
toxic gas drifting your direction, and the emergency people come
and they're run the sirens and on the bullhorns and
beating on door and saying you need to get out.
Speaker 3 (35:01):
Like now, we're not talking about like in an hour.
I'm talking about.
Speaker 2 (35:05):
In the next sixty seconds. You need to be out
of your house. What would you grab? What would you
have in your bag? Would you have cash? And people say, well,
I'll have a gun. Well, okay, fine, there's nothing wrong
with that. I'm not sure that's going to be necessary
in most of these situations, but then again, I'm pretty
much always have a gun with me anyway, so that's
a given. It's like having a wallet or pocket knife.
(35:27):
They're always there. Just kind of a you know what
it is. It's a mindset exercise of doing the what ifs,
and I you know, I mentioned all the time. People
always say, well, you know, I can never imagine needing that,
And my answer is always to say, I think you
need to work on your imagination. You need to think
(35:49):
about what could happen, what has happened to other people.
And I guess the real question is which group of
people do you want to be? Do you want to
be the ones who are prepared that can go and
take care of yourself and your family? Are you do
you want to be the ones who are standing around
going huh, what what are you talking about?
Speaker 7 (36:05):
You?
Speaker 3 (36:06):
I don't know what to do here. I'm not.
Speaker 2 (36:08):
You know, if you've thought about it ahead of time,
you'll have a plan. You'll just kick it into action.
You'll go just you know. It's that preparedness mindset I
call it. Hey, let's talk to Craig. He's in Big Timber, Montana.
On one.
Speaker 3 (36:21):
Hey Creig, you're on gun Talk. What's up, hey?
Speaker 16 (36:25):
Tom?
Speaker 2 (36:25):
Uh?
Speaker 16 (36:26):
Well, I have a range report. I have an old
Russian SBT forty and I had her out yesterday and
never missed it, never missed around.
Speaker 3 (36:37):
What is that?
Speaker 4 (36:38):
Amazing?
Speaker 1 (36:38):
How?
Speaker 4 (36:39):
What's that?
Speaker 3 (36:40):
What is that? What? What kind of gun is that?
Speaker 16 (36:44):
The Russian SBT forty was their semi auto answer to
the Grand uh the German uh G forty threes, that
sort of thing. It was their semi automatic okay, and
they fielded it. It shoots the seven six two by
fifty four r Most of them come with ten round magazines.
(37:07):
I think they all came with ten rounders. The only
hiccup I had I've got to figure out I've got
a eighth round feed for some reason. It hangs up,
and so I've I've got to figure out what's causing
that that. Otherwise it shoots great accurate. I have a
full sizific out at three hundred and thirty yards and
(37:29):
I can bang her all day long.
Speaker 2 (37:31):
What was it that made you get this rifle in
the first place.
Speaker 16 (37:37):
Well, I've talked to you before. I've collected World War
two small arms for almost forty years now, and I
collect all. I've got most of the Axis and the
Allied Powers weapons small arms and short long long rifles.
Speaker 3 (37:56):
Wow, I've got.
Speaker 17 (37:57):
Italian, Russian, Uerman, uh, Swedish, Finnish, uh, all, American of course,
British have Wow.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
Real, let's not a museum.
Speaker 16 (38:13):
Yeah, I've worked real hard of it. And I know
that you know Mike Entarnal, Sure, I've heard of him. Yeah,
and uh I would occasionally go shooting together and uh
uh we kind of compared notes and he was a
fantastic guy. God rest his soul.
Speaker 3 (38:31):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 2 (38:32):
Yeah, we we missed, we missed Duke. We're gonna we're
gonna miss him. He was a good writer, historian, a
gun guy and sounds like you are too. And look,
I appreciate the call I'm sorry. We got to get
out of it because got their break coming up. A
lot of people collect these old guns, if military guns,
as a way of preserving history and like in this case,
like having your own museum and other people can learn
(38:54):
from that.
Speaker 3 (38:55):
I appreciate you guys doing that.
Speaker 2 (38:57):
For the rest of us eight sixty six talk gun
Tom Gresha'll be right back. There's more gun talking. A
couple up on gun talk in just a few minutes.
We're gonna have a gentleman who stopped the mass shooting
using his AR fifteen save lives. The actually been a
(39:19):
number of good guys who have stopped mass shootings with
their guns. Typically, those don't really make the news a lot.
It's like there's a story and then it just poof,
it's gone, Oh you mean a good guy with a gun.
There's a good story about guns. I remember Michael Bain
telling me he was talking to one of his media
people that he knows in the general media and they
(39:41):
know him and they know about guns, and he said, well,
why don't you guys ever cover like the good news,
the good stories about guns? He said, because we'll get fired.
And Michael says, what they said, Oh yeah, says, no,
get we'll get fired if we run a story that's
positive about guns. And so what we do is we
turn down any invitation to any of event where there
could be a good story about guns. That way, we
(40:04):
can't cover it if we weren't there. So if you
are ever thinking, wow, they just never cover that, They
never say anything good about that.
Speaker 3 (40:12):
They're under orders.
Speaker 2 (40:14):
Their instructions are we don't run positive stories about guns.
We don't run positive stories about people using guns in
self defense or to save lives. So when you get
an Eli Dicken or a Stephen Williford or one of
the people who has stopped mass shootings with a gun,
maybe sometimes shooting the bad guy, sometimes not shooting the
(40:36):
bad guy, and the story is there, and then it
just is gone. That's what's going on. They just what
do they call it, the memory hold it. That's what
it is. Yeah, and you can hear the airplanes going
by now, Yeah, they're they're fighting. The fire is pretty
close by here, So that's what's going on.
Speaker 3 (40:53):
And you know, it just is.
Speaker 2 (40:57):
The media is almost one hundred percent on the side
of the gun banners now, and it makes the fight
more difficult. It makes the fight difficult because when the
public is voting, they work with whatever information they have,
and it makes sense. It's only normal. And if all
you've ever heard is guns equal crime, guns are used
(41:19):
for crime. Air fifteens are never used for anything other
than crime. Air fifteens are only used for mass shootings
and to kill people and to murder people.
Speaker 3 (41:30):
And you've never heard anything else, you simply know that
to be.
Speaker 2 (41:34):
True, even though it's not true, even though I mean,
I had people this week posting things online saying, well,
you know, the air fifteen is so inaccurate, no one
would ever use it for anything other than a mass shooting. Well,
I take it you're not aware that in the National
Championships at Camp Perry they use air fifteens. They're shooting
(41:55):
smaller targets at six hundred yards where they are fifteens.
These are it'll be accurate guns. You're also not aware
that they're using three gun competition. You're not aware that
thousands or hundreds of thousands of hunters use air fifteens
every year. And I can quickly say and all of
that doesn't matter, because the Second Amendment is not about hunting,
(42:17):
and the Second Amendment is not about target shooting. The
Second Amendment is about a couple of things. One is
defending yourself against attack and helping to defend the country
against all enemies, foreign and domestic. And so the hunting
part and the competition part really don't matter. The reality
(42:40):
of it is when you talk about what's the Second
Amendment all about? But in terms of air fifteens, it's
I mean, let me get it to the bottom line again,
and we'll be talking in just a few minutes with
a fellow who stopped a mass shooting with his AR fifteen.
He'll have some lessons for us to pass along. It's
a rifle, that's all it is. It's a semi automatic rifle.
There have been a lot of different semi automatic rifles
(43:02):
through the last one hundred years. They all work exactly
the same in general. Mostly the AR fifteen is chambered
for a rifle cartridge that is very weak, if you will,
it's moderate empower, it's not very powerful. Any anything can
be used to kill people. They also are used to
(43:22):
save people. There's a reason why police departments issue them
because they're useful in saving lives. So we'll talk about
that when we get back our numbers. Eight six six
Talk Gun. I'm Tom Gresham. Check us out at guntalk
dot com.
Speaker 3 (43:36):
We'll be right back
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Speaker 2 (00:16):
Well, you've better buckle up because we got a lot
of things to talk about today. Hey, I am Tom
Gresham and I am your host. This is Gun Talk.
We're going to be talking about web guns and shooting
and AMMO and scopes and all the rest of it.
But of course we'll also talk about the Second Amendment
and the fight to preserve it, expand it, to enlarge it,
(00:38):
and to fight back those efforts of those and there
are a lot of them out there who want to
take away your gun rights and consequently your guns.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
As a result of all of that, Today.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
We're going to be talking about gun rights and a
brand new gun rights group. Also, we're going to have
a hero on who stopped a mass shooting using his
AR fifteen rifle. Then we're going to talk to our
the pioneers in the development of in terms of getting
out to the public the AAR fifteen platform and what
an AR fifteen is actually good for. If you don't
(01:11):
know much about it. You may be amazed at this
because there's so much misinformation out there about that. So
you could be a part of this. All you have
to do is give us a call. Of course, we
love those range reports. Have you been shooting, You've been
taking somebody out to the range, did you buy a
new gun, did you trade for a gun. We're looking
for all those stories, and that's pretty easy. Just give
(01:32):
me a call. Eight six six Talk gun or Tom
Talk Gun. One of the pioneers who's been in the
lead in the battle to preserve the Second Amendment for
decades is Chris Cox, says, the head of the NRA's
Institute for Legislative Action, the NRAILA. He was in the
(01:52):
lead for many many years on this, and then of
course we had the thing over at the NRA which
you kind of imploded, blew up, and then Chris wasn't there.
But now Chris is back on board and he joined
us right now. Chris, how are you, my friend.
Speaker 4 (02:08):
I'm doing well. Tom. It's always great.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
To be with you, always a pleasure to have you here.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
Now I know that you haven't been like hiding because
you've been in DC and You've been doing things that
maybe people weren't aware of.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
If you want to bring us up to speed.
Speaker 5 (02:22):
Sure, I mean, Tom, you and I have been having direct,
tough but honest conversations for the past twenty plus years,
as you mentioned, and I think all of us, if
we have an honest reflection on the overall state of
affairs within the Second Amendment community, you've got to conclude
that they are important gaps that need to be filled.
So I looked at this, and I looked at the
(02:45):
one hundred million Americans who cherish the right of self
defense and cherish their ability to choose for themselves the
weapon that they want to have to protect themselves and
their family.
Speaker 4 (02:55):
God forbid they ever need it.
Speaker 5 (02:58):
And I look at it. There's there are gaps, Tom,
and we don't have time to sit back and hope
that everything just comes together on its own. I think
there are groups that are doing a phenomenal job in
certain areas you and I have talked about the Second
Amendment Foundation. They're leading the charge with an effective legal
(03:18):
strategy to not only expand upon bruing, but to fight
back against these ongoing legal, legislative and regulatory attacks. I
think the work that staff is doing is honestly more
important now than ever. I think the National Shooting Sports
Foundation is doing great works on behalf of the manufacturers
to give them a chance of actually manufacturing. I mean,
(03:41):
there are attacks on the industry, on the Protectional Lawful
Commerce and Arms.
Speaker 4 (03:45):
Act that we all work so hard for.
Speaker 5 (03:47):
And I think in the hunting arena there's phenomenal work
being done by Safari Club International and Rocky Mountain Elk
Foundation to protect our hunting heritage. But someone needs to
talk to of the twenty million new gun owners that
we've seen join our ranks since COVID, we study, we
(04:08):
know they go ahead.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Tom, I'm just going to say, you know, in everything
I've done over the past fifty years and looking back
and every survey this it's ever been done about why
do people own guns? The number one reason that people
own guns has always been self defense.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
And what I.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
Think I hear you leading up to is that's part
of the message and the outgrowth and why you formed
this new group.
Speaker 5 (04:29):
Well, you're exactly right, and we see it right now.
I mean, we need a voice, not just in good times,
but when self defense is under attack. We see it
right now. In Georgia with this horrific event. You know
where the groups or witch group rathers out there reminding
the American people why gun ownership matters. Witch groups out
there explaining that self defense is important and work protecting well,
(04:52):
I can tell you there's one group doing it right now,
and that's the Secure our Freedom Alliance that I'm working with.
And we're just getting started.
Speaker 2 (05:00):
What is Secure our Freedom Alliance?
Speaker 3 (05:02):
Who is it? Who's behind this?
Speaker 5 (05:04):
So we've assembled Tom, the best strategist, the best pollsters,
the best ad makers, all with experience and marshaling supporters
of the Second Amendment.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
That's what this is about.
Speaker 5 (05:16):
As I said, there's one hundred million self defense supporters
in this country. We're not a membership organization at this point,
but we're working towards doing a lot of important work.
And as I said, we're just getting started, and this
is going to be an important endeavor.
Speaker 2 (05:33):
I would encourage people to go check out Secure Ourfreedomalliance
dot org really smart messagings. I got a couple of
really good TV type commercials and we've pulled up the
audio from one of Thosess Chris stand by for a second.
We're going to play this so people can get just
a sense. This is just the audio. You're not even
seeing the video of how good these are. Go ahead, Jim.
Speaker 6 (05:55):
It doesn't matter where I am, who I'm with, or
what I'm wearing. I'm always pretty.
Speaker 7 (06:00):
As soon as I turned twenty one, the first thing
I did was get my permit to carry a handgun.
My dad took me to the range all the time
when I was a teenager.
Speaker 6 (06:09):
It was common ground. As a woman, I.
Speaker 7 (06:13):
Made the decision to always be ready to carry a
gun is my freedom and my right.
Speaker 6 (06:19):
It's nice to feel protected. Gun ownership works for me.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
Chris.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
You know, people everywhere say that they're worried about crime,
and this to me seems like, at least with these
two spots you have up so far, it's an effort
to reach out to people who say, I am concerned
about crime, I'm concerned about my personal safety, and to
normalize the idea that you can and should take care
of yourself.
Speaker 5 (06:45):
Well, Tom, you're that's exactly right. And we know, based
on these twenty million new gun owners since COVID that
they skew female, they skew minority. In the first two
ads we've launched, speak directly to them that you have
a place, you have a voice, and you have the
right to be proud of yourself and the right to
(07:06):
protect yourself. And we're going to make sure that the
American people that we go out and win the hearts
and minds of those who don't understand that this right
is under attack, that don't understand why it's important, even
you know, during tough times like we're under right now.
So that's part of our message. And as I said,
I think you're really going to enjoy what you see
out of the group over the next twelve, eighteen, twenty
(07:27):
four months and.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Beyond, well, we're dropping this in right now, we're sixty
days out from the election. Is there a role to
be played for Secure our Freedom Alliance in this election?
Speaker 5 (07:38):
Well, Tom, the overall mission of the Secure Our Freedom
Alliance is to go out and make sure that the
American people understand the importance of self defense and that
it needs to be protected, and that the politicians like
Joe Biden and to others who want to blame law
abiding gun owners for their failed policies and their failure
to keep us safe is unacceptable. The general the overall
(08:00):
mission is to win hearts and minds. There are things
that legally can be done in and around political messages.
Right now, you're seeing a lot of educational outreach, but
as I said, there's much more to come. I think
you'll be pleased with what you see out of this group.
Speaker 2 (08:16):
One of the things I know for sure, and you
know clearly from your background with the NRA, it takes
a lot of money to do a lot of these things.
Do you have enough money? Where's it coming from.
Speaker 5 (08:26):
Well, we have a handful of patriots who said, look,
we've looked at this the same way you have. We
understand that the traditional voices aren't what they used to be,
and that we need someone out there, in a group,
out there getting this message out, even if it's just
during the tough times tom as I mentioned, where a
lot of groups will stick their head in the sand
(08:47):
and just take body shots and hope that it goes away.
Someone needs to be out there making sure that the
American people remind their elected officials and engage in the
process in and around self defense and the Second Amendment.
So is there a is there a role that the
self that self defense is going to play? As you said,
it already crime is a is an important issue, not
(09:08):
just the crime associated with you know, an open border,
but the crime associated with liberal prosecutors and judges who
won't prosecute actual criminals. You're seeing these stories out of
you know, Oklahoma and other places where it's just heartbreaking.
And that's what self defense. That's that's why the Second
Amendment is there.
Speaker 4 (09:28):
It's it's to.
Speaker 5 (09:30):
Give you the ability to protect yourself when nobody else
is there for you.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
And that's not powerful.
Speaker 5 (09:37):
That's a powerful narrative, powerful political narrative, powerful educational narrative,
and it's one that needs to be out consistently, not
just during the elections, not just when we're winning, but
when times are tough. That's one of the reasons we're
stepping into the stepping into the middle of it again.
Speaker 3 (09:54):
I was talking to somebody.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
I mentioned something about the post Brewin era, and you know,
kind of jokingly but realistically, said, yeah, that's also the
post in Ora era. We're looking at a lack of
dollars going into the election. Now, NRA used to pour
lots of money in We're also looking for a very
much reduction in the amount of effort that the NRA
(10:16):
could and has done in terms of working with Congress
and with the legislatures.
Speaker 3 (10:21):
And as you say, there are.
Speaker 2 (10:21):
Several groups that have picked up on the litigation side,
working in the courts, and that's being done very well,
but I'm just not seeing much going on in Congress
and the legislatures. Is that something that this new group
can do.
Speaker 5 (10:35):
Absolutely, and we're focused right now on getting the right
messages out to the right people as quickly as possible.
But as we move forward, again, this isn't about competing
with other groups. This isn't about trying to take credit
from other groups. There's plenty of people.
Speaker 3 (10:52):
Who do that.
Speaker 5 (10:53):
I've lived through it, I've witnessed it. You and I
had those conversations over a long period of time. This
is not about This is about winning. And I've always
viewed this throughout my career and I know you have
as well that as long as we win, I don't
care who takes credit for it. But the point is,
are we as strong as we were five or six
(11:13):
years ago? Is the Second Amendment as secure in the
court of public opinion? Is it a secure you know?
Is the Protection Lawful Commerce and Arms Act really secure?
Or is there a coordinated effort to undermine it is
the Second Amendment, economy under attack with a choke point
two point zero, the way we all hoped would never happen.
(11:35):
And I think an honest reflection shows that there's a
lot of work that's not being done, and I intend
to I didn't spend half my life fighting for this
right and this freedom to see it all flushed down
the toilet, So if I can play a role and
help out, then that's what I'm going to do.
Speaker 2 (11:51):
Well, I appreciate it. As you said, you and I
have not always agreed on how to get there. We
always agreed on what the goal is. And I appreciate
what you're doing. And look, would you do me a favorite?
Keep us posted on this is very encouraging and very exciting.
I applaud this smart way that you're going about the
messaging on this.
Speaker 3 (12:06):
Well.
Speaker 5 (12:07):
I appreciate your compliments. The Giffords group wasn't as excited
as you were to see us back in the back
in the fold, but that means truthfully, tome I laughed
when someone sent that to me, because what this group
has done is announced our support for this god given
right to defend yourself and the need to go out
(12:27):
and marshal the troops around this.
Speaker 4 (12:29):
Right.
Speaker 5 (12:30):
Our first two ads are a single mother who wants
to be able to protect herself and her child, A
single woman who wants to be able to protect her
body in her life. And so does Giffords hate women
or their ability to protect themselves or both? So you
just kind of have to laugh more at the attacks.
I never really paid much attention to the naysayers. We
(12:52):
have a job to do. We're going to do it unapologetically.
I look forward to keeping you posted and any questions
that you or anybody else have have the website, we
just launched this thing in July, Tom, so we're building
it out. The most important thing for us was not
to spend a bunch of money on fancy websites, but
to really go out and get this message in front
(13:13):
of the people who matter, people who are to make
the decision of what this freedom looks like moving forward.
And as I said, we're excited and just getting started.
Speaker 2 (13:21):
Thanks so much, Chris, I really appreciate it. We'll keep
up to date with this with you, Thanks sir.
Speaker 4 (13:26):
Thanks Tom, take care all right.
Speaker 2 (13:28):
It is Secure our Freedom Alliance. That is the website.
Secure Ourfreedomalliance dot org. Very interesting, a new gun rights
group from some of the folks who had, Well, you
might save the old gun rights group here.
Speaker 3 (13:44):
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Speaker 2 (16:18):
All right, we're over lines now. If you want to
give me a call eight sixty six Talk Gun or
Tom Talk Gun. I'm looking at a story out of Idaho,
Montana on the line there of a bear attack a
few days ago, and this guy's got mauled. Grizzly attack
five hundred and thirty pound grizzly. I think it ends
up being they shot this bear twenty four times. Yeah,
(16:42):
you heard me right, They shot at twenty four times.
I had a forty five ACP had a ten milimeters pistol.
Two young men. This thing is mauling them, working them over,
and they are shooting this thing while it's tearing them up.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
It's a reminder of.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
People often don't understand how powerful bears are in general,
and grizzlies are in particular, how muscular they are, and
how powerful a gun has to be to stop them.
And we we always want to say, well, this is
probably good enough, you know, And I mailed me to
(17:25):
works some people that'll probably stop a bear at least. Yeah,
it'll get his attention, it'll make him run away, it'll
stop him. Maybe maybe not. Just understand that a grizzly
can sit there on a hillside and rooting around for
grubs and worms or whatever it's digging for, and rolling
rocks effortless, just just flipping them out of the way,
(17:45):
rocks that you and I couldn't together pick up and
move or roll. They're just so incredibly powerful. The idea
being that the biggest thing you can carry is barely
enough for this. And you know you I know ten
milimeter is very popular for beer protection. I would probably
(18:06):
describe the ten millimeter as the very bottom level. And look,
I know about Phil Shoemaker, I know about the nine millimeter.
I know he's using buffalo board amo and it worked
really well. And I think Phil would probably still be
because he's a bear expert, the first one to tell
you that's not really the best thing. It would be
better to have something a little bit bigger. I don't
(18:28):
know if you can hear in the background, I got
airplanes going by. We have fire tankers going by. There's
a formation of for them that go by. There's they
call them the fire hogs. We have fires all around
us right now. I'll get to that in a minute.
Because we had to evacuate, we had to share a
deputy can bang on the door. You got to go.
You got to get out here now. Oh yeah, that
was great. We'll tell you about that a little bit.
(18:48):
And the idea of being prepared to go. Do you
have backpacked but yeah, we've got these they call them
fire hogs. It's a seat seat, single engineer tanker on
floats and they scoop water out of our lake that's
right next to our cabin here and then they dump
it on the fires that are nearby, and you know,
we like having them. It's like having an air show,
(19:10):
a little bit of an Oskosh air show. Right here
in the middle of the fire and smoke. I can't
even see the lake from where I am. Mean, usually
you can almost throw a rock that far. So the
smoke is really heavy. We have I don't know within
thirty miles of us. I bet we have twelve to fifteen,
maybe twenty fires going big fires. So we'll talk a
little bit about having a go bag, not just for this,
(19:30):
for anything, a basic go bag, because you never know
when you're going to get that banging on the door
and says, hey, something's going on. You got to get
out now. Not like you know, you got an hour
to get out. You got thirty seconds to get out
of your house. It's time to roll interesting stuff there. Yeah,
we got we got airplanes in the background. Got You
(19:51):
never know what's going to be going on around here.
That's why I grab John and Palmer Alaska Line three.
Hey John, you are on gun talk. What's on your mind, sir?
Speaker 11 (19:59):
Well, I know we don't have smoke up here.
Speaker 3 (20:02):
Well, sometimes you do but not this time.
Speaker 2 (20:04):
Huh oh.
Speaker 11 (20:05):
I know it's either a smoky summer or rainy summer.
Speaker 4 (20:07):
But anyway, let me get to my point here. I reload,
I reload a lot, and.
Speaker 11 (20:11):
What I've been coming into contact with the last couple
of years is ten millimeters, forty cal and forty five
are starting to come with small primers, and that is
mainly from Blazer and Federal. There may be some other manufacturers.
But I've got a progressive loader and it'll jam me up.
I mean, if you're blowing and going through that thing
and boom, you got a small primer, then you gotta okay.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
So let me explain to people what you're what you're
dealing with is uh empty get brass, empty cases that
have a pocket in it for a small primer and
not a large pistol primer. And so if you're just
you got a whole bunch of brass in there and
you're running through a loader, and all of a sudden
you get a case that has the smaller primer pocket,
(20:54):
you can't get a large primer in there, and it's
just going to stop the whole works.
Speaker 11 (21:00):
That is correct, And I don't know mind changing things.
Speaker 3 (21:04):
Up like that.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
But that's what I'm just going to say. I don't
know what has made this happen. And maybe they just said, look,
we have one hundred million small pistol primers. Uh, just
go ahead and make the brass for those and we'll
make it all work. Not really worrying about the reloaders
out there. But it's one of those deals that what
I guess the bottom line on this, and you know
(21:27):
where I'm going to go with this, is you have
to sort your brash. You have to check it out carefully.
If you particularly if you're picking up brains brass, you
got to really look it over carefully. And now we
never had to do this before, and look, I appreciate
the call it. We never had to check whether it
have small pistol primer pocket or a large pistol primer pocket.
And if you have that, you got to work those out.
(21:50):
And whether you sort them out and keep the small
ones or you toss theme or you give them to
a buddy, I don't know. You got to work all
that yourself out. By the way I'm doing, some are
reloading for my new three thirty eight olls.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
I get to the range.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
Maybe tomorrow we'll see what works have been able to
get to the rais recently, but I'm working up some
loads there.
Speaker 3 (22:06):
I'll talk a little bit about that as we go along.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
If you want to join us eight sixty six Talk
Gun we are open lines. I am Tom Gresham and
this is gun Talk and we were back the of course,
we have the opening of a lot of hunting seasons
going on right now around the country. And I see
(22:30):
that Louisiana is today is actually the last day of
the three day holiday.
Speaker 3 (22:36):
They have a special tax free holiday.
Speaker 2 (22:41):
They've removed sales taxes on Second Amendment items on guns
and AMMO.
Speaker 3 (22:46):
And archery gear.
Speaker 2 (22:48):
And it's Friday, September sixteenth, Saturday the seventh seventh, or
the sixth seventh, and the eighth, that'd be today the eighth.
So basically in a lot of places that would amount
to about a ten percent saving on guns and AMMO.
And it really has worked to the advantage of not
just the people who are buying, but the people who
are selling. That works for the gun stores and they
(23:11):
don't have to collect sales tax. That's a serious reduction.
Look is ten percent, As I say, that's real money,
works for it. And I see in Alabama. I don't
understand this. In Montgomery, Alabama, the mayor has decided he's
signed a law and local ordinance which probably is illegal,
(23:35):
requiring anyone carrying a concealed firearm also has to carry
a photo ID.
Speaker 3 (23:42):
Think of the irony here.
Speaker 2 (23:44):
You have a Democrat he was saying that photo IDs
are good at the same time that Democrat party is
telling us that photo IDs are racist. To require a
photo ID for voting, well, that's ridiculous, that would be racist.
What's going on here is that Alabama has constitutional carry.
The mayor doesn't like that, and so the mayor says,
(24:04):
what am I going to do about it? Well, probably nothing,
because Alabama has preemption laws, so cities cannot pass their
own gun control laws. So it will get challenged and
it will get tossed. But in the meantime, you have
this virtue signaling thing going on where he's saying, well,
we're going to require anybody who is legally carrying a
(24:25):
firearm to have a photo ID. Why who's going to
be impacted by this?
Speaker 3 (24:35):
Have you thought this through?
Speaker 2 (24:38):
And of course you always get the same thing of well,
you know, the police say this constitutional carry things made
it harder for them to identify people with illegal guns.
Speaker 3 (24:50):
Let me get this said very clearly.
Speaker 2 (24:53):
As much as I support law enforcement and I support
the police, I am not willing to give up even
half of a right, much less any given right to make.
Speaker 3 (25:04):
Your job easier.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
We don't give up our rights to make the police's
job easier. That would be like one of the most
foolish things we could do. So I'm just saying when
you say, well, you know, it makes the police's job harder,
not my problem. I don't care. I mean, really, it's
not that I don't care that the police's job is harder.
(25:28):
They have to work a little harder. It's just that
making their job easier is not worth it for me
to give up any right, whether it's a right against
illegal search and seizure or right against well anything literally anything,
free speech, search and seizure, carrying a gun, anything else. No,
(25:48):
I'm not going to give up a single right to
make it the jobs easier for law enforcement. And anybody
who really cares about the rule of law would understand that.
And we say, yeah, no, we're not going to do that,
Are you kidding me? No, you just find a way
the cops already know who the bad guys are. I mean,
that's basic rule there, So you understand starting off with that,
(26:13):
we probably should off. I'm gonna touch on this BRIEFEO,
but I'm not gonna spend a lot of time on it.
We had another school shooting. They are, unlike what the
media tells you, pretty rare if you start doing the
research into what they're calling school shootings. And Amy Square
did that and she said, you know what we're finding
(26:33):
is if you start looking at each one of them individually,
not like, oh, there's been all these numbers.
Speaker 3 (26:38):
You say, oh, well, that.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
Was a shooting at eleven o'clock at night between gang
members when they ran into the parking lot of a school,
and the gun band people call that a school shooting.
Speaker 3 (26:53):
Yeah no. Or when a school resource officer.
Speaker 2 (26:59):
Has a firearm go off inadvertently, unattended, negligently, if you will,
that gets counted as a school shooting. Of course, what
they're doing is inflating the numbers. Why would they do that.
It's the same reason they have inflated the numbers on
so called mass shootings. When the FBI said there are
(27:20):
twenty to thirty a year, the gun band people said, well,
that's not nearly enough to frighten the public. And their
goal here is we have to frighten the public so
that they will want to take action on this. So
we formed they we they the gun band people formed
this group called the Gun Violence Archive, and they redefined
(27:40):
what a mass shooting was in such a way to
inflate the numbers greatly. And then they did a very smart,
from their standpoint, marketing effort to get that out to
the media. And now you see the media quoting the
Gun Violence Archive. Phony group completely debunked, and of course
they're using these bogus defintions of what a mass shooting is.
Speaker 3 (28:02):
But then now they have their numbers way.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
Up, and so the media can say, well, we've had
hundreds of mass shootings in the US, Well, how can
we have hundreds of those when the FBI says it's
like twenty to thirty a year. Well, the only way
we can have that happen is if you simply change
the definition of what that is. You know, I mean,
I would think you'd call Chicago mass shooting every single
(28:26):
weekend for what's going on over there. But just so
you understand, when you see these numbers being paraded around
about school shootings. Most of them don't have to do
with what we think of as a school shooting. Someone
goes into a school and shoots it up. It's something else, entirely,
not trying to lessen the impact or the horror or
(28:49):
the tragedy of someone murdering kids. But I will say
this in Alabama, what happened to stop the shooting. A
good with a gun showed up. Once again, a good
guy with a gun shows up, and the murderers stop.
In this case, it's a school resource officer didn't have
(29:11):
to shoot this murderous youngster. But when a good guy
with a gun, whether it's that person is a man
or a woman, whether that person is wearing a uniform
or not, when that person shows up. By showing up
I mean on scene pointing a gun at the murderer,
the shooting stops. The reverse of that, of course, is Uvaalde, Texas.
(29:35):
The good guys with the guns kind of showed up,
but then they wouldn't go in. They hung around the hall,
they hung around in the offices. They stood around for
an hour while kids are getting murdered. No showing up
means you have to be eyeball to eyeball with the
murderer of being willing to shoot that sob right now
and as soon as that happens, whether the bad guy
(29:59):
shoots himself, which happens fairly frequently, or gives up, either
way works because the murdering stops at that point. All
that goes to how quickly can we get a good
guy with a gun to show up? Wow, wouldn't it
be something if the staff of the school, the ones
who volunteered, the ones who got training, the ones who
(30:22):
knew what they were doing, the ones who were responsible,
if one or more of those people were there and
could in fact stop it even more quickly, Because the
more quickly you can stop it, the more lives you save.
And that's the calculus of this, all right. Our numbers
eight sixty six Talk Gun. I'm Tom Gresham. This is
(30:44):
gun Talk.
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Speaker 2 (32:56):
Hey, let's talk about preparedness because I'm just getting a
note during the uh during the break here, if I
have to go, you'll understand, somebody came and banged on
the door. A neighbors said, hey, fires are blown up
on the mountain behind us again. So I was just
sending a note to my wife saying, hey, you might
want to go ahead and make sure your bags packed
again because we had to leave earlier this week. We
(33:17):
were watching We're They have a deal here. They call
it ready, set and go. Different stages of getting ready.
Ready is, you know, just thinking about it. Set means
your bags are packed and you can go if you
need to. And go means get out of the house
and boogie.
Speaker 3 (33:28):
So we went.
Speaker 2 (33:29):
We're living under set the middle level right now, and
we did get the go command earlier this week we
had to get out here. We were gone for a
couple of nights until they took the level back down.
And we'll see. But if you hear me say, okay,
I got to get out of here. You'll know what's
going on, because it means somebody's coming, said fire's coming.
Speaker 3 (33:50):
You need to leave.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Toward that end, having a go back. We've talked about
this before, not just for this but for any time.
Speaker 3 (34:00):
It's not a real bad idea.
Speaker 2 (34:01):
If you just had a backpack or a duffel bag
or a suitcase, whatever you have, you say, okay, I'm
just going to permanently leave three days of clothes in there,
and an extra toothbrush and toothpaste and a couple of.
Speaker 3 (34:16):
Things, knowing that.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
In five minutes you could go get all your cosmetics,
you could get your bathroom stuff. You could get all
that stuff and shove it in there, and you could
get out the door and go. And I know there
are people think, why would I want that? Why would
I need that? Well, I don't know what exactly might
happen in your situation. I just know what could happen.
What has happened. You could have a train derailment in
(34:44):
your area, and now there is a big cloud of ugly, noxious,
toxic gas drifting your direction, and the emergency people come
and they're run the sirens and on the bullhorns and
beating on door and saying you need to get out.
Speaker 3 (35:01):
Like now, we're not talking about like in an hour.
I'm talking about.
Speaker 2 (35:05):
In the next sixty seconds. You need to be out
of your house. What would you grab? What would you
have in your bag? Would you have cash? And people say, well,
I'll have a gun. Well, okay, fine, there's nothing wrong
with that. I'm not sure that's going to be necessary
in most of these situations, but then again, I'm pretty
much always have a gun with me anyway, so that's
a given. It's like having a wallet or pocket knife.
(35:27):
They're always there. Just kind of a you know what
it is. It's a mindset exercise of doing the what ifs,
and I you know, I mentioned all the time. People
always say, well, you know, I can never imagine needing that,
And my answer is always to say, I think you
need to work on your imagination. You need to think
(35:49):
about what could happen, what has happened to other people.
And I guess the real question is which group of
people do you want to be? Do you want to
be the ones who are prepared that can go and
take care of yourself and your family? Are you do
you want to be the ones who are standing around
going huh, what what are you talking about?
Speaker 7 (36:05):
You?
Speaker 3 (36:06):
I don't know what to do here. I'm not.
Speaker 2 (36:08):
You know, if you've thought about it ahead of time,
you'll have a plan. You'll just kick it into action.
You'll go just you know. It's that preparedness mindset I
call it. Hey, let's talk to Craig. He's in Big Timber, Montana.
On one.
Speaker 3 (36:21):
Hey Creig, you're on gun Talk. What's up, hey?
Speaker 16 (36:25):
Tom?
Speaker 2 (36:25):
Uh?
Speaker 16 (36:26):
Well, I have a range report. I have an old
Russian SBT forty and I had her out yesterday and
never missed it, never missed around.
Speaker 3 (36:37):
What is that?
Speaker 4 (36:38):
Amazing?
Speaker 1 (36:38):
How?
Speaker 4 (36:39):
What's that?
Speaker 3 (36:40):
What is that? What? What kind of gun is that?
Speaker 16 (36:44):
The Russian SBT forty was their semi auto answer to
the Grand uh the German uh G forty threes, that
sort of thing. It was their semi automatic okay, and
they fielded it. It shoots the seven six two by
fifty four r Most of them come with ten round magazines.
(37:07):
I think they all came with ten rounders. The only
hiccup I had I've got to figure out I've got
a eighth round feed for some reason. It hangs up,
and so I've I've got to figure out what's causing
that that. Otherwise it shoots great accurate. I have a
full sizific out at three hundred and thirty yards and
(37:29):
I can bang her all day long.
Speaker 2 (37:31):
What was it that made you get this rifle in
the first place.
Speaker 16 (37:37):
Well, I've talked to you before. I've collected World War
two small arms for almost forty years now, and I
collect all. I've got most of the Axis and the
Allied Powers weapons small arms and short long long rifles.
Speaker 3 (37:56):
Wow, I've got.
Speaker 17 (37:57):
Italian, Russian, Uerman, uh, Swedish, Finnish, uh, all, American of course,
British have Wow.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
Real, let's not a museum.
Speaker 16 (38:13):
Yeah, I've worked real hard of it. And I know
that you know Mike Entarnal, Sure, I've heard of him. Yeah,
and uh I would occasionally go shooting together and uh
uh we kind of compared notes and he was a
fantastic guy. God rest his soul.
Speaker 3 (38:31):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 2 (38:32):
Yeah, we we missed, we missed Duke. We're gonna we're
gonna miss him. He was a good writer, historian, a
gun guy and sounds like you are too. And look,
I appreciate the call I'm sorry. We got to get
out of it because got their break coming up. A
lot of people collect these old guns, if military guns,
as a way of preserving history and like in this case,
like having your own museum and other people can learn
(38:54):
from that.
Speaker 3 (38:55):
I appreciate you guys doing that.
Speaker 2 (38:57):
For the rest of us eight sixty six talk gun
Tom Gresha'll be right back. There's more gun talking. A
couple up on gun talk in just a few minutes.
We're gonna have a gentleman who stopped the mass shooting
using his AR fifteen save lives. The actually been a
(39:19):
number of good guys who have stopped mass shootings with
their guns. Typically, those don't really make the news a lot.
It's like there's a story and then it just poof,
it's gone, Oh you mean a good guy with a gun.
There's a good story about guns. I remember Michael Bain
telling me he was talking to one of his media
people that he knows in the general media and they
(39:41):
know him and they know about guns, and he said, well,
why don't you guys ever cover like the good news,
the good stories about guns? He said, because we'll get fired.
And Michael says, what they said, Oh yeah, says, no,
get we'll get fired if we run a story that's
positive about guns. And so what we do is we
turn down any invitation to any of event where there
could be a good story about guns. That way, we
(40:04):
can't cover it if we weren't there. So if you
are ever thinking, wow, they just never cover that, They
never say anything good about that.
Speaker 3 (40:12):
They're under orders.
Speaker 2 (40:14):
Their instructions are we don't run positive stories about guns.
We don't run positive stories about people using guns in
self defense or to save lives. So when you get
an Eli Dicken or a Stephen Williford or one of
the people who has stopped mass shootings with a gun,
maybe sometimes shooting the bad guy, sometimes not shooting the
(40:36):
bad guy, and the story is there, and then it
just is gone. That's what's going on. They just what
do they call it, the memory hold it. That's what
it is. Yeah, and you can hear the airplanes going
by now, Yeah, they're they're fighting. The fire is pretty
close by here, So that's what's going on.
Speaker 3 (40:53):
And you know, it just is.
Speaker 2 (40:57):
The media is almost one hundred percent on the side
of the gun banners now, and it makes the fight
more difficult. It makes the fight difficult because when the
public is voting, they work with whatever information they have,
and it makes sense. It's only normal. And if all
you've ever heard is guns equal crime, guns are used
(41:19):
for crime. Air fifteens are never used for anything other
than crime. Air fifteens are only used for mass shootings
and to kill people and to murder people.
Speaker 3 (41:30):
And you've never heard anything else, you simply know that
to be.
Speaker 2 (41:34):
True, even though it's not true, even though I mean,
I had people this week posting things online saying, well,
you know, the air fifteen is so inaccurate, no one
would ever use it for anything other than a mass shooting. Well,
I take it you're not aware that in the National
Championships at Camp Perry they use air fifteens. They're shooting
(41:55):
smaller targets at six hundred yards where they are fifteens.
These are it'll be accurate guns. You're also not aware
that they're using three gun competition. You're not aware that
thousands or hundreds of thousands of hunters use air fifteens
every year. And I can quickly say and all of
that doesn't matter, because the Second Amendment is not about hunting,
(42:17):
and the Second Amendment is not about target shooting. The
Second Amendment is about a couple of things. One is
defending yourself against attack and helping to defend the country
against all enemies, foreign and domestic. And so the hunting
part and the competition part really don't matter. The reality
(42:40):
of it is when you talk about what's the Second
Amendment all about? But in terms of air fifteens, it's
I mean, let me get it to the bottom line again,
and we'll be talking in just a few minutes with
a fellow who stopped a mass shooting with his AR fifteen.
He'll have some lessons for us to pass along. It's
a rifle, that's all it is. It's a semi automatic rifle.
There have been a lot of different semi automatic rifles
(43:02):
through the last one hundred years. They all work exactly
the same in general. Mostly the AR fifteen is chambered
for a rifle cartridge that is very weak, if you will,
it's moderate empower, it's not very powerful. Any anything can
be used to kill people. They also are used to
(43:22):
save people. There's a reason why police departments issue them
because they're useful in saving lives. So we'll talk about
that when we get back our numbers. Eight six six
Talk Gun. I'm Tom Gresham. Check us out at guntalk
dot com.
Speaker 3 (43:36):
We'll be right back
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