August 31, 2025 • 43 mins
In This Hour:
-- Although it's usually strong on Second Amendment rights, the Fifth Circuit renders a surprising loss to gun rights supporters. Kostas Moros, of the Second Amendment Foundation, explains what happened and where this case now goes.
-- Shooting a lever action rifle with a suppressor is so much fun we did it live on the radio!
-- Field stripping a 1911 pistol may look hard, but you can learn how.
Gun Talk 08.31.25 Hour 3
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/gun-talk--6185159/support.
-- Although it's usually strong on Second Amendment rights, the Fifth Circuit renders a surprising loss to gun rights supporters. Kostas Moros, of the Second Amendment Foundation, explains what happened and where this case now goes.
-- Shooting a lever action rifle with a suppressor is so much fun we did it live on the radio!
-- Field stripping a 1911 pistol may look hard, but you can learn how.
Gun Talk 08.31.25 Hour 3
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/gun-talk--6185159/support.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
The Ruger Light RAG Security three eighty is easy to
shoot and easy to wreck, small enough to carry concealed
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more at Ruger dot com.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
And we're back with you, Tom Gresham, Gun talk here.
If you want to send us a range of fort
just give me a call. We can talk about that.
The number here, we you know what, let's do it
the easy way, Tom talk gun. That's the easy way
for you to remember the number. Just give you a holler, Tom,
Talk gun and we're open lines. If there's something on
your mind, you've got a question, or you think I
screwed up which is actually off in the case, and
give me a holler. We'll talk about that as well.
(00:35):
Now we have been talking over the last few weeks,
even months, about we're winning. We're winning, we're winning. We
have all these great cases and we're getting these really
good decisions out of the courts, and it's like, wow,
this is really good. And now we've got the DOJ,
you got Pam Bond, you got good things going on,
and then wow, you get blindside. Something comes around the
corner and you hit you Well, that's just what happened
(00:56):
from my really unexpected place where you are right now
by Costas Morros. Now, you just recently joined the Second
Amendment Foundation as the director of Legal Research and Education.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
Their congratulations, Thanks so much, Tom, and thanks for having
me on again on the show.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
Absolutely Okay, I mean, now, for those who don't know,
you're not new to the Second Amendment fight. You have
been doing litigation on Second Amendment cases for a number
of years.
Speaker 4 (01:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
So I worked for Michelle and Associates from twenty nineteen
until a few months ago. Great experience there. You know,
we still work with them because saf is of course
a client of michellan Associates. They partner with CRPA in
a number of cases. But yeah, I was there for
six years and recently moved over in house to the
Second Amendment Foundation.
Speaker 4 (01:43):
Okay, so we're on this street.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
We're going, well, that's all looking good, and we're thinking,
you know, I mean, we've got some circuits, some appeals
courts where you know it's going to be tough, but
we can usually count on the fifth Circuit to get
things right on guns. We've had some good decisions out
of them. And then this past week was like what
the devil just happened. You want to explain the case
and what happened here?
Speaker 3 (02:06):
Yeah, sure, so it was definitely a sort of at
two brute moments, you know, we did. But that said,
it was it was not that surprising because a few
months ago the Fifth Circuit issued a ruling in this
case and said suppressors are not even arms under the
Second Amendment and yet no protection essentially. But then something
strange happened, which is that the Trump administration's DOJ partially
(02:29):
reversed its position. What they said was no, no, no,
we think suppressors are arms. However, we think that the
NFA's regulations are nonetheless constitutional, so they get some protection.
You can't totally ban them, but the registration and taxation
provisions are fine.
Speaker 4 (02:49):
So then the.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
Fifth Circuit this week issued another ruling and they said, okay,
we'll take we'll we'll soume without deciding that they are arms,
but nonetheless the restrictions are still constitutional. They basically sided
with the government because even if they are arms, this
is just like the shall issue permitting that Bruin talked about,
like the government can require you to register and even
(03:13):
tax an arm, which I think was an extremely disturbing ruling,
especially coming from the Fifth Circuit. You know, even if
they thought registration, which one was fine, which I think
has no historical tradition, certainly a two hundred dollars tax
should have been found to violate the Second Amendment. But
that's that's where we're at now.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
You said something as that went by, I'm trying to
remember what does this mean when you said they assumed
without deciding, what does that mean?
Speaker 3 (03:42):
And that was a frustrating part of the ruling because
if they had decided and said we were changing our
ruling suppressors our arms, that would have been helpful for
those of us in the Ninth Circuit, for example, where
we're just trying to get that much because we can't
even in California do the NFA process, even if we're
cool with registration, suppressors are totally banned here. So when
(04:03):
they say assume without deciding, what they're essentially saying is
we're not going to rule suppressors our arms. We reserve
the right in another case to say they are not,
but for the sake of this one case, we will
assume they are arms without deciding it and rule on
other grounds. Because the government isn't contending they aren't arms.
So again a frustrating ruling in every way. What does
(04:25):
this case mean right now? What it means right now
is for this defend this criminal defending, because it is
a criminal case US v. Peterson, he has to go
back down. His motion to dismiss essentially fails, and the
charges against him proceed. Now what could happen is he
might petition for what's called on bank review. Because this
(04:45):
was a three judge panel of the Fifth Circuit, and
if other judges on the Fifth Circuit disagree with it,
he can do what's called the petition for on bank review,
which is very familiar for those of us who follow
our liditation in the Ninth Circuit. And what that would
do is it would essentially they'd essentially vacate this ruling
if the petition were granted, and rehear the case with
the entire Fifth Circuit, all the judges, so that could reverse,
(05:09):
So that could come to a different conclusion. I don't
know whether that's going to happen at this point. I
would suggest that they do that, but I'm not privy
to it.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
All right, check me out on this. See if I
explain this correctly. Talk about a circuit court, a core
US Court of Appeals, fifth Circuit, ninth Circuit, whatever, made
up of a number of judges, and they span the
gamut from far on the left side to far on
the right side. And then you have a case and
three judges from this entire group on the circuit. They
(05:44):
are selected at random, and so you can get three
judges that represent the middle that's spread out from the
left to the right, or it's possible you get three
that are very much on the right, or like in
this case, you get three that may be very much
on the left.
Speaker 4 (06:00):
It's kind of the luck of the drawer. Sometimes you
don't win on that.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
Draw absolutely, and that's when, to be clear, I haven't
checked the ideological makeup of this panel. Sometimes you also
have squish Republicans, even if they're all Republicans, you know
they're not program But but you're right though, that they're
selected at random. And if that's when you're most likely
to get an on boank petition. Granted, if you if
(06:24):
you had bad luck in the panel draw and the
whole circuit knows it, you know, then they'll they'll do
an on bunk to correct if it's not in line
with the circuit. I know, the Fifth Circuit is majority conservative,
majority pro gun. That said, you know, there could be
a sort of fud element there where they might be programmed,
but they don't like scary suppressors.
Speaker 4 (06:42):
I don't know. We'll have to see, yeah, you know.
Speaker 2 (06:44):
And so it goes. It's like it is always a fight.
Even when you say, well, things are going our way
and Trump won and we've got the DJ kind of
working on kind of sort of on our side, you
never know exactly what's going on there, but you never
know what the decisions are going to be, which goes
back to what we're talking about all the time. You
have to keep fighting. You're going to have to keep
(07:05):
pushing to get things to the Supreme Court. And honestly,
this fight is never going to be over, is it.
Speaker 5 (07:13):
No.
Speaker 3 (07:13):
I mean, because even if we win and we get
all these victories up the Supreme Court and they finally
start granting cert on every case and all that, it's
only you know, there's always a next election. There's always
a you know, a president New sum or somebody like
that on the horizon who can appoint new Supreme Court judges.
Speaker 4 (07:29):
So you know, like they like.
Speaker 3 (07:31):
I know it's been said a lot, but it's true
that price of liberty is eternal vigilance. You know, you
always have to be ready to defend your rights because
there's no end point where we're done, unfortunately, and I'm
not saying that for job security. I'd love to be
done and go do something else, but there is no
end point here. There's we're always going to have a battle.
That said, compared to where we were twenty thirty years ago,
(07:54):
the progress has been immense, you know, and I think
people need to take the long term view more.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
You know, critical that is being informed. And let me
just give you a shout out right now. You do
a wonderful job over on x of educating and bringing
yourself up to speed and really starting to explain things
and people can follow you.
Speaker 4 (08:13):
There's Kostus Morris.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
KOs Tas Morris and more ro os. Congratulations on the
new gig and thanks for keeputting us up to speed
on all this.
Speaker 3 (08:23):
Yeah, Tom, thanks a lot, Thanks for having me on
all right.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
Guy, talk will be right back eight six six talk gun.
I am Tom Gresham.
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what you're not gonna have in a fight.
Speaker 6 (10:09):
Gun Talk should be in your podcast feed. Check out
gun Talk Nation.
Speaker 4 (10:13):
What's it like to be blown up?
Speaker 3 (10:15):
You know, if it's like C four, it's almost like
a smack hunting.
Speaker 6 (10:19):
Yeah, we talk about that too. On your crosshairs, I
like a thin crosshair, Aje. You're really dating yourself by
calling things crosshairs.
Speaker 4 (10:26):
You're redical whatever.
Speaker 6 (10:28):
Have some fun and stay informed with the gun Talk podcast.
Speaker 5 (10:37):
Hey guys, Max Michelle here, captain of the SIGSUR Shooting Team.
I just wanted to take a moment to congratulate Tom
on hitting thirty years on the air with gun Talk.
It's an incredible accomplishment and well deserved. Tom has always
brought us the information that we wanted and needed to
know as it relates to the Second Amendment or a
gun enthusiast or anyone out there that's carying to protect
(10:57):
our loved ones and our great nation. Time. We thank
you for these last thirty years, and we look forward
to thirty more. Buddy.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
So I'm looking at the story out of Wyoming, Big
Horn County School District number three has posted a notice
saying it intends to adopt new rules for employees and
volunteers who wish to conceal carry firearms on its campuses.
Speaker 4 (11:25):
I like it.
Speaker 2 (11:26):
We know that gun free zones are not gun free.
Gun free zone to want to attract mass murderers in
their writings, in their manifestos, they say, hey, I'm going
to the gun free zone so that I can kill
a lot of people and no one will be able
to stop you. They actually say it out loud. They
tell us that these are very attractive places for murdering people.
(11:49):
So she got the school district in Wyoming. It says
we're going to it's part of the law, and we're
going to put this law into practice. All of the
people on the school board are keen on that. This
quote says, I know it's the law and you have
(12:10):
to follow it. I accept that, said trustee Lynette Murray quote.
But I think anything we do is futile. There's nothing
we can do to make students safer. The fact that
staff can have a concealed weapon on their person and
(12:32):
be working closely with students really bothers me. Really, we
trust these teachers to not only teach, but to protect
their students. No one, ever, in my knowledge, has ever
(12:55):
said we're going to require student or teachers to be armed.
People say, well, we're arming teachers. No, no, no, no,
I've never heard of proposal it says we're going to
require teachers to be armed. All the proposals are if
a teacher volunteers or a staff member and meets the qualifications,
(13:15):
than that person could have a gun to protect the students,
completely voluntary. Remember, we got a lot of teachers, We've
got a lot of staff members who are former military,
who are former cops, who are lifetime shooters. And usually
these programs come with required training, and the training is good,
(13:37):
it's extensive. Why is this woman wringing her hands about this?
Why is she more worried about responsible adults protecting kids
than she is about people who want to murder the kids.
And I'm willing to do anything. It's saying there's nothing
(14:00):
we can do to make kids safer, and she got
to be fired.
Speaker 4 (14:08):
Holy cow.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
Doug is with US now of Martinsburg, West Virginia with
a range report.
Speaker 4 (14:13):
Hey Doug, what do you got there?
Speaker 8 (14:16):
I have a Henry X model in three point fifty seven.
Picked it up on Gunberger this week and it has
been tactical Cowboy modified with an alumnum four piece and
a long sight rail and I've got a can on
it and I am having a vault on the range.
(14:38):
In fact, I was just getting ready to shoot when you.
Speaker 4 (14:41):
Answered are you at the range? Now?
Speaker 9 (14:44):
Yes?
Speaker 8 (14:45):
I am.
Speaker 4 (14:46):
Do you have the gun? Can you shoot it on
the air for us?
Speaker 8 (14:49):
I absolutely can.
Speaker 4 (14:51):
The go for it, man, let's have some live fire
on gun Talk. Now.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
You got the can on it, so we may not
be able to hear it. Will let's see it sounds.
Oh that's wonderful.
Speaker 8 (15:16):
How to puffs seven hundred foot per second loads and yeah,
amazing it is.
Speaker 2 (15:25):
You know the fact that it's a closed breach is
not a semiato, So until you opened it manually, that's
a closed breach. So all the power has to go
out of the barrel and then through the suppressor and
you're using substomic loads. It's unbelievable how quiet those.
Speaker 8 (15:39):
Are, even with three fifty seven, and it's it's really quiet.
Speaker 9 (15:44):
It's it's shocking.
Speaker 2 (15:47):
The first time you fired it, you could admit it publicly.
It made you grin didn't it.
Speaker 8 (15:57):
I'm still grinned. Yeah, yeah, these these things are just fun.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
They are you know, I love I mean, it doesn't
really matter if you had a forty four as long
as you got a can that takes that caliber. You know,
put a can on a Lever Action and look, it's
not classic and John Wayne didn't do it and all that,
but when it comes to just having fun, man, those
things are a blast.
Speaker 8 (16:23):
Well this thing looks more like a John Wick Lever
action than a John Wayne Lever action.
Speaker 4 (16:29):
Oh god, that's beautiful. I love that. You ought to
be a copywriter. That's great.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
Well, that is wonderful. That is like the best range
report ever. So what's you're playing with this?
Speaker 8 (16:42):
You know, they're all just they're all just toys. You know,
it may be a defensive weapon or anything else, but
you know, there's a broad range of stuff I've got.
I've had a soft spot for Lever actions for years
and years. I have just about every model Marlin that
was ever built. And this is just fun. You know.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
People say, well, hear me self defense. Let me tell
you three P fifty seven magnum lever action is a
serious self defense rig.
Speaker 8 (17:16):
I'm horned the self defense leads that are just beautiful
for this type of thing.
Speaker 4 (17:21):
Oh okay, yeah, those are good loads. Good deal.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
Well, look I appreciate it, sir. Great range report, and
you know, keep shooting. You're having a good time. Still
green and I love that. Let's grab Greg out of
helling them. On ten on four, Hey Greg, you're on
gun talk.
Speaker 4 (17:35):
What's that?
Speaker 9 (17:37):
Well, at the top of the hour news break on
the Fox News on the radio station that I'm listening
to you on, they had the Pope come on talking
about the murders in Minneapolis and he said, we need
to stop the pandemic of arms large and small around
(17:58):
the world. To that, I say, hey, mister Pope, why
don't you show us by example and disarm the Vatican
guards I believe they're called the Swiss Guard. Yes, disarm
them and show us how well that works. And then
why don't you do something that's in your control, like
(18:19):
go after pedophile priests instead of trying to get rid
of guns.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
Can't disagree with any of that, and look, great points,
I appreciate the call. Yeah, a lot of these leaders
have arm protection. Well, all of them have arm protection.
And you want to say, okay, if you think we
should all be giving up our guns and we should
just depend upon I don't know what for our protection,
then you should give up your security, give up your
(18:44):
armed security. And you know they'll say, well, you know,
I feel perfectly safe walking around Washington, d C.
Speaker 4 (18:49):
Sure you do.
Speaker 2 (18:50):
You got secret service all around you, for heaven's sakes.
So and look, I remember, where's the pope from Chicago, Illinois.
The pope is infused with the Chicago Democratic infection of
way of thinking and believes this whole idea that if
we only got rid of the guns, the bad people
(19:11):
wouldn't be bad anymore.
Speaker 4 (19:13):
No, the good people would obey the law.
Speaker 2 (19:17):
Which, by the way, it's time to say the quiet
part out loud, and it's going to make some people
nervous if and when they come to take guns. I'm
remembering this this twentieth anniversary of contreating, when they went
door to door, kicked indoors and took guns from everybody
and Mayo ray Nake and said there will be no
guns in New Orleans. And they confiscated them and stole them,
(19:41):
and then they denied they ever did until the Second
Amendment Foundation sued them. By the way, happy anniversary fifty
one years for the Second Amendment Foundation, and they sued
them and found a warehouse full of guns that they
had stolen from the citizens. Make no mistake, the police
will come to take your guns.
Speaker 4 (20:02):
If they're told to.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
People say, well, they wouldn't actually do that, They would
refuse that order. They don't refuse any orders. They never
refuse any orders. They will do what they're told to do.
They will come to take your guns. And ultimately, if
the government takes your guns, the government will kill you
because there's nothing to stop them.
Speaker 4 (20:26):
Here's the quiet part out loud. There are now.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
Millions of people in America who will simply not give
up their guns. And you can say that's good, you
can say that's bad. I'm just telling you it's what
is or what do you meantime? They're not going to
give up their guns. They will shoot whoever comes to
take their guns. You mean they shoot the police. Yes,
(20:52):
that's exactly what I mean. If you come to take
the guns, to confiscate the guns. If you're gonna hi
late the Second Amendment, you're saying the Constitution doesn't matter.
You're saying all bets are off. And you got to
understand when you say all bets are off, what's that actually.
Speaker 4 (21:10):
Going to mean?
Speaker 2 (21:12):
And I'm I'm talking about, you know, promoting this or
saying I support this. I'm just telling you what I
think would happen. I think you know, we got what
one hundred million gun owners owning five hundred million guns
in America. Take one percent of that. You said, we're
(21:32):
not going to do that one percent, one hundred No,
a million people call that A million people who say no,
not going to do it, and you're not going to
take them. I don't think the gun banners have thought
this through. I don't think they actually understand where this
(21:56):
is going to end up if they want to push
this that far.
Speaker 4 (22:00):
Yeah, I get it, I get it.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
It makes everybody on both sides nervous when you say
things like that. I'm sorry, but if you won't think
about it, then you can't acknowledge it, you can't plan
for it, and you can't deal with this reality at
least that's where I am. That's what I think it
is to welcome your ideas here. I'll be right back
with more gun talking. Yeah, we just need to talk
(22:24):
about all things gun. I'm Tom Gresham. If you want
to see more of what we do, go to gun
talk dot com. If you want to know more about
what I'm thinking about and what I'm covering and reading,
you can follow me over on Twitter, where I am
at gun Talk and I'm posting there all the time
with news stories, basically trying to help you know what's
going on, because you know, I follow all this stuff
(22:46):
and I realize I get deep into it, but sometimes
I know that some folks would really like to know
more of what's going on. So I'll post links to
stories and you can be better informed by following me
on Twitter. Yet I'm at gun Talk over there. So
Sean called in out Littleton, Colorado. Sean, thanks for your
patience you have made on the gun Talk. How can
we help you?
Speaker 10 (23:07):
Hey, Tom, I have a question for a couple. My
dad had a nineteen eleven that he used in the
military in the sixties and he passed away, and it
was supposed to go to me and we've shot it
several times, and he asked me to clean it one
(23:29):
time so I could know how to take it apart.
And I did that, and I did not enjoy the
process at all because of all the moving parts and
all the functionality that is contained in that handgun. So
my question is, is there a nine millimeter nineteen eleven
(23:55):
with a fairly reputable name out there that isn't going
to break the bank that takes down more like a
SIG PT twenty six or a glock where there's not
all the turn the barrel bushing and pull this lock
out of the where normally a takedown level would be
(24:17):
on a SIG or whatnot. I just I don't really
like the way they take down. I'll take my glocks
and my SIG takedowns over that any day. But I
hear you talk about the nineteen eleven and how sweet
it is to shoot. So I shot it when I
was like about twelve or thirteen, and.
Speaker 4 (24:39):
Let me jump in here. I think I can help you.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
The quick answer is no, if it's a nineteen eleven,
it's a nineteen eleven if it's not at something else.
But I can also help you when it comes to
there's two different levels of takedown on nineteen eleven. There's
field stripping, which is pretty easy and frank it's all
I ever don and then there's a total disassembly, which
involves it's a little bit more.
Speaker 4 (25:04):
I can just tell you it.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
Feel stripping is easy once you've done it three times,
just like, ah, okay, that's not a big deal. I
would really really recommend to use something we didn't have
when you first started doing this, which is YouTube. There
are all sorts of YouTube videos on feel stripping in
nineteen eleven, and you'll find that it's actually pretty simple.
It's like, really maybe six steps, it's not much to it.
(25:29):
The key is to have a barrel bushing wrench. If
you have that, it makes it really easy. And you know,
for like five bucks you can pick up one of those.
Speaker 10 (25:41):
Gotcha. Okay, Yeah, I love shooting it because I idolized
my dad as a Vietnam vet and everything and that done,
which is another story was supposed to go to me,
but anyway, I want to get another one. But I'm
just like, am I really you've committed to take this
(26:02):
thing apart?
Speaker 4 (26:02):
It's just not a big deal.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
Honestly, it's really not difficult to feel strip in nineteen eleven.
It's just it takes, you know, two minutes once you
get it figured out. The first time it takes ten minutes,
the second time it takes four minutes, and the third
time it takes two minutes, and from then on it's
two minutes.
Speaker 4 (26:19):
It's not a big deal.
Speaker 10 (26:20):
Well, that's why I call you Tom for wisdom. So
I'm gonna give it a go. I'm getting a bonus
at work next month and I'm considering getting a cult
or a. I'm not going to get a staccato because
I can afford the stacado.
Speaker 4 (26:40):
They're pretty pricey.
Speaker 10 (26:42):
Yeah, well, I would love to have a Wilson Combat
nineteen eleven, nine million year, but I edc but I
that's the same price as as staccato almost.
Speaker 4 (26:53):
But let me make a suggestion. Take a do your research,
but take a look.
Speaker 2 (26:58):
Ruger makes a really nice snin the millimeter nineteen eleven,
and so does Smith, and they're both in that I'm.
Speaker 4 (27:05):
Guessed they haven't looked it up.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
Probably seven hundred dollars range very affordable and very nice,
and I think you could probably find what you're looking for.
And there are probably another half a dozen makers that
do the same thing and have those in the same
price range.
Speaker 10 (27:22):
Okay, great, Yeah, I love Ruger. I got that R
Exam on your your the sales pitch on it, and
couldn't be happier.
Speaker 4 (27:30):
So, yes, it's funny you mentioned that.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
Yesterday when I was out of the range, I had
my two buddies with me, and I was carrying the
R Exam and I shot it, doing speed stuff with it,
and you know, I said, you guys got to try this,
and they're going, ah, you know, it's kind of big
and feels like a glock and all that, and both
of them shot and went, wow, that is much nicer
than I thought it was going to be.
Speaker 4 (27:51):
The trigger's really good. I love the sites, and everybody
shot it really well.
Speaker 10 (27:56):
Couldn't be happier, I mean, And so the price point
is outstanding.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
By the way, Michelle just mentioned something here. She says,
you know, if you take that nineteen eleven, if you
go to a store where you buy it, have the
salesperson or a gunsmith walk you through the disassembly a
couple of times, with you know, them showing you and
then you doing it. You know, spend fifteen twenty minutes
with them. Have somebody do it so that you have
(28:23):
the confidence level that you're doing it right.
Speaker 4 (28:25):
Have them to do it right. There. That's a great idea.
I love that.
Speaker 10 (28:28):
I agree, and I should have thought about that before,
but I just listened to you for over five years.
I'm glad I found you because I've learned a hell
of a lot from this channel. But yeah, I think
that's my best option because I really do want to
have a nineteen eleven that I can shoot. And I
(28:50):
think based on all the people that have called into
your program and talk about that trigger, I remember, I
mean we're talking four years ago.
Speaker 11 (29:01):
When I it right, it was nice.
Speaker 10 (29:04):
But I just I just I.
Speaker 4 (29:11):
Get it.
Speaker 2 (29:11):
Look, the modern rifle our rifles, so modern pistols are
easier to.
Speaker 4 (29:15):
Take me out. I get it.
Speaker 2 (29:16):
But there's just kind of something fun and cool and
frankly you'll enjoy. Say I know how to do this.
I can take down do a field strip on a
nineteen eleven. I can do it in less than a minute.
And there's some pride in that. There's some pleasure in that.
I think you're going to love it. So have fun
with that, all right, be right back for more. Gun Talk.
(29:46):
Do you want to have a special rifle that can
do almost everything and that your friends don't have. Hi,
I'm Tom Gresham, host of gun Talk, and here's the deal.
Every few years we put out a special gun, a
very limited run. The GT thirty marks thirty years on
the air, and this one is really different. It's a
(30:08):
general purpose rifle you can legally have in all states
and it's crazy versatile. Based on the Ruger American Gen
two platform, we created a Scout rifle in five, five
six or three oh eight, sixteen inch threaded barrel, only
thirty seven inches long overall, extra long rail for mounting
(30:30):
a standard scope and extended Iraley scope like Colonel Jeff
Cooper preferred, or a red Dot and it comes with
great iron sights so it's ready for the range right
out of the box. It looks great too, with a
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The five five to six version takes standard armgs and
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This is a short run, so I don't miss out.
Check out gun talkscout dot com. That's gun talkscout dot com.
It's accurate, attractive, and you can take it with you
to all states. Scout scope, standard scope, or no scope
(31:15):
at all. Set it up the way you want. When
you pull it from the case, your buddies will say
what the heck is that and they're gonna want one. Seriously,
this is a great rifle do everything, rifle hunting, target shooting,
defensive use. Gun talkscout dot com. Don't put it off,
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these are going quickly get your g T thirty Gun
talkscout dot com. Hey, a big thanks to Bret and Oklahoma.
(31:57):
He called in just passing something along. He got actually
a couple of the g T thirty rifles, so you
got both the three O eight and the five five six.
Speaker 4 (32:05):
And he wanted to put the QT mounts.
Speaker 2 (32:07):
You know, the QD mounts are the for sling mounts
like you have on ars. It turns out that Ruger
actually has those on their shop Ruger website Shopbruger dot com.
The item number is eighteen one seventy five one eight
one five twenty five dollars for both of them. And
you put those on the regular like old style rifle
(32:28):
sling swivels, and then you now have QD mounts, so
you can pop on a sling that has the QD
mounts on it.
Speaker 4 (32:35):
So Brett thank you for that again.
Speaker 2 (32:37):
Shopruger dot com and the item number is one eight
one seventy five. For those who don't know, if we've
would talk about for a little while, you probably I'll
already know. We do have this short run special edition
gun talk rifle.
Speaker 4 (32:53):
It's up.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
We call it a scout rifle and it's in the
Scout configuration. It's basically what we could come up with
as a general per us do everything rifle. Call it
a truck gun, call it a fifty state gun. You
can have it in your car, your vehicle. It's leading
in all fifty states. A bult axe and rifle in five, five, six,
or two or three or eight. In my conversation with
(33:14):
Richard Mann, who we had that interview earlier on the show,
and we were talking about the two eighty four Winchester,
which is a great cartiss by the way, but we
were talking about two two three. He said, he told me,
he said, you know, I've shot a lot of deer
with two two three, so okay, And he said, well
he has found and this just passing this along. He's
(33:36):
found that the sixty grain partition master partition bullet works great.
And he said, but Melvin Forbes was the one who
told him. He says that that's a good bullet. He said,
but you got to well, he said, kick it in
the ass. You really got to make it go fast.
So Richard was loading it up. He said, it really
wasn't wasn't grouping that well. He took it up to
(33:59):
right maximum and called Melvin and said, hey, this thing's
just not me. I says, what did I tell you?
He's just bumping up some more.
Speaker 4 (34:08):
He says.
Speaker 2 (34:09):
He threw a little bit more powder in it, bumped up,
you know, to max, or even a little bit more
of recommended max. He says, the group's size went down
to one hole. Okay, I'm going to file that one away,
because that would be a really great bullet if you're
going to be hunting with the two two three, the
sixty graine nozzle partition, if you're going to handload it.
(34:30):
What Melvin said, I got to work it up, of
course from the lower make sure that you're safe from
the lower charge weights. But bump it up, kick it.
Speaker 10 (34:36):
In the rear end.
Speaker 2 (34:37):
Norman's and Grant Pass Oregon. Hey, Norman, got a range report.
What in the world have you been doing?
Speaker 9 (34:46):
Well?
Speaker 11 (34:46):
I really like my lever actions, and I've got a
couple of them that I put scopes on because I'm
sixty five, and transition lensers and the old story that
you talk about occasionally of you know, front sight for
insights within a hundred yards. But I've got a couple
(35:08):
of older ones. I've got a nineteen ten thirty two
Winchester and I've just picked up a forty four Magnum
and I just got I just have this thing of
it just seems wrong to put a scope on a
lever action.
Speaker 4 (35:23):
It's just an American, Okay.
Speaker 8 (35:27):
So I've tried a whole bunch.
Speaker 11 (35:29):
Of different open iron sights, and again because of my
you know, longtime vision issues, it just doesn't work. I
mean that though I was sure it was a good
buck until I looked through the scope and that was
the trees behind it, you know sort of thing. But
I recently tried by it's called Bullseye by Marble Arms,
(35:58):
and it has it's it's the rear sight and it
has two rings on it.
Speaker 2 (36:06):
Oh, I'm looking at it now online marble Marble arms
dot com. And the rear site is actually two circles,
a smaller aperture and a larger aperture around.
Speaker 11 (36:17):
That, and it really has helped me. You know, look,
everything's a bit blurry anyways, but those two rings have
helped me to be able to almost most of the time,
even both eyes open, get a much better vision within
(36:39):
one hundred yards or so, and still keep it on
the dinner plate, you know, on the target and I
range because that those two rings helped me much better
judge some elevation and some windage compensations.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
Well, and we used to point out the rear sits
supposed to be blurry anyway, but your eye will naturally
center the front site in a circle. I mean, it's
just what we do. We put it right in the
middle of the circle. But having two circles there, a
small one and a bigger one. And even the small
one is as big as a lot of ghost ring sites,
(37:17):
but the big one's.
Speaker 11 (37:17):
Really big, yes it is, and so it helps me.
You know, at one hundred yards, I've got a steel
plate out there about the size of the black tail's body,
and I'll put the paper plate about the chest and
where that would be. I can see the whole plate
in the big rings, I mean the whole steel plate, right,
(37:42):
and I can center that white plate in the small ring,
and I'm keeping it near the center of the plate
free standing, and.
Speaker 2 (37:52):
I would this set up would be pretty This should
be pretty fast too.
Speaker 4 (37:58):
It had a pretty fast site to use.
Speaker 11 (38:01):
Yes, yes it is. It's a quick acquisition. And yet
if the thing's moving, it's also letting me see wider
because I tried like a peep site and it just
it just really narrow division that I didn't like. And
I'm in the deep woods, so there's a lot of
scrub and everything else. So I'm stalt hunting, and so
(38:23):
I'm anxious to try that in a hunt this fall.
Speaker 2 (38:28):
All right, Well, do us a favor here once you
get it on a hunt and get a report there,
I'd love to get a follow up range report. I
was frankly unfamiliar with this Marble Arms dot com and
they call it their bullseye sight I have. I don't
think i've ever seen that before. It's really different looking,
kind of cool, and I could sure see where it
(38:49):
would work for you. So Norman, thank you for passing
that along. I just learned something I was not aware of.
This rear site looks cool.
Speaker 4 (38:57):
Go check it out. You can see what I'm talking about.
Speaker 2 (38:59):
Marble bullarms dot Com take a look at their Bullbye back.
Let's start to talk to Paul and Shadow Louisiana down
there on the Red River.
Speaker 4 (39:17):
Hey, Paul, what's up? Hey? Hey day?
Speaker 12 (39:20):
I was calling up. I listened to your program and
I I mean I hear you emphasize over and over
again that just because you shoot a lot doesn't mean
you're ready to defend yourself should someone come in your
house or your family. Do you have any suggestions for
any classes or programs around in my area that northwest
Louisiana that you would recommend that I could go to.
(39:41):
That would be you know, repuable and it's a good
class to learn for self defense.
Speaker 2 (39:46):
Well, I'm not sure what's going on. Of course, you
got Clark Custom Guns up there in uh Houghton, which
is not too far from you. The other thing you
could do, you could jump on I forty nine and
run straight down and go to Robert just outside of
Baton Rouge, and that's where we have our training facility.
For a gun talk we call it range Ready Studios.
We have classes there, so you could always just go
(40:08):
check out, and those classes are not held all the time.
Speaker 4 (40:11):
We have some.
Speaker 2 (40:12):
Schedule for the fall range Ready Studios dot com. You
can take a look at that or go to gun
talk dot com. But I think if you do a
little calling around, you could find what you're looking for.
And I would probably start by calling Clark Custom Guns
in hot and just say, hey, you know who's given
good classes because they know the good from the bad,
and they'll know who the right people are and see
(40:33):
what they recommend. I mean, if you want to stay
up in northwest Louisiana. But if you want to, it's
what like a three and a half four hour drive
for you down to Robert If you want to run
down there, you can take a look at the classes
we have down there too, Okay, okay, in a.
Speaker 12 (40:49):
Type of deal, I mean that would be several days.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
I mean, is it?
Speaker 12 (40:53):
I mean, how does how do these classes work today?
Like have weekend you come back other weekends? How does
it usually work down there?
Speaker 2 (40:58):
As y'all program and our program, but usually a two
or three day class and you'll it'll say what it is,
it's a couple of them. They've got a two day
class and then they'll offer a one day class in
advance of that that a lot of people would benefit from.
But you don't have to take the one day prep class.
You could take the two day class. But yeah, I
(41:18):
would say go down and do a two day class,
would be what I would do. And remember that's just
a kind of a starter class. You're going to get
you going. If you say, Okay, I like this, I've
just learned that there's a lot of stuff I don't know.
Then you can start finding other schools around and you
may have to travel a bit to find you know,
the ones you're looking for, but they are definitely out there,
and a lot more of them now than we've had
(41:39):
in the past. Can I just say this, congratulations on
making the leap and saying, Okay, I'm going to go
find out what I don't know.
Speaker 4 (41:45):
That's a big thing to do.
Speaker 9 (41:46):
Man.
Speaker 4 (41:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 12 (41:48):
Well, Ye'll listen to you all the time. And the
more I'll listen to you, the more I realize I
don't know nearly as much as I think I do,
and I need, you know, I need to really, you know,
get better at it. So that's what I want. I
just want to be as responsibles.
Speaker 4 (42:01):
I can with it.
Speaker 2 (42:03):
That's a great idea, Michelle just pointed out. She said, also,
local sheriff's departments probably have a good idea of who
the good instructors are, so you know, in fact, even
right there in red River you can ready repairs. You
can ask the sheriff's department there, look who's doing good
classes and that kind of thing, and they may be
able to give you some instruction or head you towards
(42:23):
somebody that I wouldn't know about that's in your area.
But yeah, we sometimes forget to mention sheriff's departments are
great sources of information and a lot of times you
can call them and the person who's asked answering that
dispatch may not know, but he or she may say, look,
I'll have somebody call you back, and they may have
one of their firearm trainers call you back and say, look.
Speaker 4 (42:43):
This is how you really need to go to.
Speaker 2 (42:45):
So check out the sheriff's office, not just where you are,
but everybody who's listening, thanks for the call. I appreciate that.
All right, here's the deal. You have to decide that
you are your own first responder. You have to decide
that you are going to be the one who takes
care of other peop people, whether it's kids in school,
people in church, or anywhere where you are. The police
(43:06):
will show up, but it's gonna take them a while.
And while that's happening, people are dying, and you got
to figure that out. I would really, really really recommend
you go grab Edmunk's book First thirty Seconds, that's on Amazon.
Speaker 4 (43:21):
Really worthwhile. It's great information. It will make you.
Speaker 2 (43:25):
So much smarter and I'll actually open your eyes. In
the meantime, go out, there's some shooting, take somebody with you,
watch those muscles and be careful in those public ranges.
Speaker 4 (43:34):
So watch what's
Speaker 2 (43:34):
Going on around you with the next time right here
on gun Talk
The Ruger Light RAG Security three eighty is easy to
shoot and easy to wreck, small enough to carry concealed
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Speaker 2 (00:14):
And we're back with you, Tom Gresham, Gun talk here.
If you want to send us a range of fort
just give me a call. We can talk about that.
The number here, we you know what, let's do it
the easy way, Tom talk gun. That's the easy way
for you to remember the number. Just give you a holler, Tom,
Talk gun and we're open lines. If there's something on
your mind, you've got a question, or you think I
screwed up which is actually off in the case, and
give me a holler. We'll talk about that as well.
(00:35):
Now we have been talking over the last few weeks,
even months, about we're winning. We're winning, we're winning. We
have all these great cases and we're getting these really
good decisions out of the courts, and it's like, wow,
this is really good. And now we've got the DOJ,
you got Pam Bond, you got good things going on,
and then wow, you get blindside. Something comes around the
corner and you hit you Well, that's just what happened
(00:56):
from my really unexpected place where you are right now
by Costas Morros. Now, you just recently joined the Second
Amendment Foundation as the director of Legal Research and Education.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
Their congratulations, Thanks so much, Tom, and thanks for having
me on again on the show.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
Absolutely Okay, I mean, now, for those who don't know,
you're not new to the Second Amendment fight. You have
been doing litigation on Second Amendment cases for a number
of years.
Speaker 4 (01:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
So I worked for Michelle and Associates from twenty nineteen
until a few months ago. Great experience there. You know,
we still work with them because saf is of course
a client of michellan Associates. They partner with CRPA in
a number of cases. But yeah, I was there for
six years and recently moved over in house to the
Second Amendment Foundation.
Speaker 4 (01:43):
Okay, so we're on this street.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
We're going, well, that's all looking good, and we're thinking,
you know, I mean, we've got some circuits, some appeals
courts where you know it's going to be tough, but
we can usually count on the fifth Circuit to get
things right on guns. We've had some good decisions out
of them. And then this past week was like what
the devil just happened. You want to explain the case
and what happened here?
Speaker 3 (02:06):
Yeah, sure, so it was definitely a sort of at
two brute moments, you know, we did. But that said,
it was it was not that surprising because a few
months ago the Fifth Circuit issued a ruling in this
case and said suppressors are not even arms under the
Second Amendment and yet no protection essentially. But then something
strange happened, which is that the Trump administration's DOJ partially
(02:29):
reversed its position. What they said was no, no, no,
we think suppressors are arms. However, we think that the
NFA's regulations are nonetheless constitutional, so they get some protection.
You can't totally ban them, but the registration and taxation
provisions are fine.
Speaker 4 (02:49):
So then the.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
Fifth Circuit this week issued another ruling and they said, okay,
we'll take we'll we'll soume without deciding that they are arms,
but nonetheless the restrictions are still constitutional. They basically sided
with the government because even if they are arms, this
is just like the shall issue permitting that Bruin talked about,
like the government can require you to register and even
(03:13):
tax an arm, which I think was an extremely disturbing ruling,
especially coming from the Fifth Circuit. You know, even if
they thought registration, which one was fine, which I think
has no historical tradition, certainly a two hundred dollars tax
should have been found to violate the Second Amendment. But
that's that's where we're at now.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
You said something as that went by, I'm trying to
remember what does this mean when you said they assumed
without deciding, what does that mean?
Speaker 3 (03:42):
And that was a frustrating part of the ruling because
if they had decided and said we were changing our
ruling suppressors our arms, that would have been helpful for
those of us in the Ninth Circuit, for example, where
we're just trying to get that much because we can't
even in California do the NFA process, even if we're
cool with registration, suppressors are totally banned here. So when
(04:03):
they say assume without deciding, what they're essentially saying is
we're not going to rule suppressors our arms. We reserve
the right in another case to say they are not,
but for the sake of this one case, we will
assume they are arms without deciding it and rule on
other grounds. Because the government isn't contending they aren't arms.
So again a frustrating ruling in every way. What does
(04:25):
this case mean right now? What it means right now
is for this defend this criminal defending, because it is
a criminal case US v. Peterson, he has to go
back down. His motion to dismiss essentially fails, and the
charges against him proceed. Now what could happen is he
might petition for what's called on bank review. Because this
(04:45):
was a three judge panel of the Fifth Circuit, and
if other judges on the Fifth Circuit disagree with it,
he can do what's called the petition for on bank review,
which is very familiar for those of us who follow
our liditation in the Ninth Circuit. And what that would
do is it would essentially they'd essentially vacate this ruling
if the petition were granted, and rehear the case with
the entire Fifth Circuit, all the judges, so that could reverse,
(05:09):
So that could come to a different conclusion. I don't
know whether that's going to happen at this point. I
would suggest that they do that, but I'm not privy
to it.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
All right, check me out on this. See if I
explain this correctly. Talk about a circuit court, a core
US Court of Appeals, fifth Circuit, ninth Circuit, whatever, made
up of a number of judges, and they span the
gamut from far on the left side to far on
the right side. And then you have a case and
three judges from this entire group on the circuit. They
(05:44):
are selected at random, and so you can get three
judges that represent the middle that's spread out from the
left to the right, or it's possible you get three
that are very much on the right, or like in
this case, you get three that may be very much
on the left.
Speaker 4 (06:00):
It's kind of the luck of the drawer. Sometimes you
don't win on that.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
Draw absolutely, and that's when, to be clear, I haven't
checked the ideological makeup of this panel. Sometimes you also
have squish Republicans, even if they're all Republicans, you know
they're not program But but you're right though, that they're
selected at random. And if that's when you're most likely
to get an on boank petition. Granted, if you if
(06:24):
you had bad luck in the panel draw and the
whole circuit knows it, you know, then they'll they'll do
an on bunk to correct if it's not in line
with the circuit. I know, the Fifth Circuit is majority conservative,
majority pro gun. That said, you know, there could be
a sort of fud element there where they might be programmed,
but they don't like scary suppressors.
Speaker 4 (06:42):
I don't know. We'll have to see, yeah, you know.
Speaker 2 (06:44):
And so it goes. It's like it is always a fight.
Even when you say, well, things are going our way
and Trump won and we've got the DJ kind of
working on kind of sort of on our side, you
never know exactly what's going on there, but you never
know what the decisions are going to be, which goes
back to what we're talking about all the time. You
have to keep fighting. You're going to have to keep
(07:05):
pushing to get things to the Supreme Court. And honestly,
this fight is never going to be over, is it.
Speaker 5 (07:13):
No.
Speaker 3 (07:13):
I mean, because even if we win and we get
all these victories up the Supreme Court and they finally
start granting cert on every case and all that, it's
only you know, there's always a next election. There's always
a you know, a president New sum or somebody like
that on the horizon who can appoint new Supreme Court judges.
Speaker 4 (07:29):
So you know, like they like.
Speaker 3 (07:31):
I know it's been said a lot, but it's true
that price of liberty is eternal vigilance. You know, you
always have to be ready to defend your rights because
there's no end point where we're done, unfortunately, and I'm
not saying that for job security. I'd love to be
done and go do something else, but there is no
end point here. There's we're always going to have a battle.
That said, compared to where we were twenty thirty years ago,
(07:54):
the progress has been immense, you know, and I think
people need to take the long term view more.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
You know, critical that is being informed. And let me
just give you a shout out right now. You do
a wonderful job over on x of educating and bringing
yourself up to speed and really starting to explain things
and people can follow you.
Speaker 4 (08:13):
There's Kostus Morris.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
KOs Tas Morris and more ro os. Congratulations on the
new gig and thanks for keeputting us up to speed
on all this.
Speaker 3 (08:23):
Yeah, Tom, thanks a lot, Thanks for having me on
all right.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
Guy, talk will be right back eight six six talk gun.
I am Tom Gresham.
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inventory today at dirrysguns dot com. Put all your gear
on the chicurry and then roll around on the ground. Now,
get up all your gear that's on the ground. That's
what you're not gonna have in a fight.
Speaker 6 (10:09):
Gun Talk should be in your podcast feed. Check out
gun Talk Nation.
Speaker 4 (10:13):
What's it like to be blown up?
Speaker 3 (10:15):
You know, if it's like C four, it's almost like
a smack hunting.
Speaker 6 (10:19):
Yeah, we talk about that too. On your crosshairs, I
like a thin crosshair, Aje. You're really dating yourself by
calling things crosshairs.
Speaker 4 (10:26):
You're redical whatever.
Speaker 6 (10:28):
Have some fun and stay informed with the gun Talk podcast.
Speaker 5 (10:37):
Hey guys, Max Michelle here, captain of the SIGSUR Shooting Team.
I just wanted to take a moment to congratulate Tom
on hitting thirty years on the air with gun Talk.
It's an incredible accomplishment and well deserved. Tom has always
brought us the information that we wanted and needed to
know as it relates to the Second Amendment or a
gun enthusiast or anyone out there that's carying to protect
(10:57):
our loved ones and our great nation. Time. We thank
you for these last thirty years, and we look forward
to thirty more. Buddy.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
So I'm looking at the story out of Wyoming, Big
Horn County School District number three has posted a notice
saying it intends to adopt new rules for employees and
volunteers who wish to conceal carry firearms on its campuses.
Speaker 4 (11:25):
I like it.
Speaker 2 (11:26):
We know that gun free zones are not gun free.
Gun free zone to want to attract mass murderers in
their writings, in their manifestos, they say, hey, I'm going
to the gun free zone so that I can kill
a lot of people and no one will be able
to stop you. They actually say it out loud. They
tell us that these are very attractive places for murdering people.
(11:49):
So she got the school district in Wyoming. It says
we're going to it's part of the law, and we're
going to put this law into practice. All of the
people on the school board are keen on that. This
quote says, I know it's the law and you have
(12:10):
to follow it. I accept that, said trustee Lynette Murray quote.
But I think anything we do is futile. There's nothing
we can do to make students safer. The fact that
staff can have a concealed weapon on their person and
(12:32):
be working closely with students really bothers me. Really, we
trust these teachers to not only teach, but to protect
their students. No one, ever, in my knowledge, has ever
(12:55):
said we're going to require student or teachers to be armed.
People say, well, we're arming teachers. No, no, no, no,
I've never heard of proposal it says we're going to
require teachers to be armed. All the proposals are if
a teacher volunteers or a staff member and meets the qualifications,
(13:15):
than that person could have a gun to protect the students,
completely voluntary. Remember, we got a lot of teachers, We've
got a lot of staff members who are former military,
who are former cops, who are lifetime shooters. And usually
these programs come with required training, and the training is good,
(13:37):
it's extensive. Why is this woman wringing her hands about this?
Why is she more worried about responsible adults protecting kids
than she is about people who want to murder the kids.
And I'm willing to do anything. It's saying there's nothing
(14:00):
we can do to make kids safer, and she got
to be fired.
Speaker 4 (14:08):
Holy cow.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
Doug is with US now of Martinsburg, West Virginia with
a range report.
Speaker 4 (14:13):
Hey Doug, what do you got there?
Speaker 8 (14:16):
I have a Henry X model in three point fifty seven.
Picked it up on Gunberger this week and it has
been tactical Cowboy modified with an alumnum four piece and
a long sight rail and I've got a can on
it and I am having a vault on the range.
(14:38):
In fact, I was just getting ready to shoot when you.
Speaker 4 (14:41):
Answered are you at the range? Now?
Speaker 9 (14:44):
Yes?
Speaker 8 (14:45):
I am.
Speaker 4 (14:46):
Do you have the gun? Can you shoot it on
the air for us?
Speaker 8 (14:49):
I absolutely can.
Speaker 4 (14:51):
The go for it, man, let's have some live fire
on gun Talk. Now.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
You got the can on it, so we may not
be able to hear it. Will let's see it sounds.
Oh that's wonderful.
Speaker 8 (15:16):
How to puffs seven hundred foot per second loads and yeah,
amazing it is.
Speaker 2 (15:25):
You know the fact that it's a closed breach is
not a semiato, So until you opened it manually, that's
a closed breach. So all the power has to go
out of the barrel and then through the suppressor and
you're using substomic loads. It's unbelievable how quiet those.
Speaker 8 (15:39):
Are, even with three fifty seven, and it's it's really quiet.
Speaker 9 (15:44):
It's it's shocking.
Speaker 2 (15:47):
The first time you fired it, you could admit it publicly.
It made you grin didn't it.
Speaker 8 (15:57):
I'm still grinned. Yeah, yeah, these these things are just fun.
Speaker 2 (16:05):
They are you know, I love I mean, it doesn't
really matter if you had a forty four as long
as you got a can that takes that caliber. You know,
put a can on a Lever Action and look, it's
not classic and John Wayne didn't do it and all that,
but when it comes to just having fun, man, those
things are a blast.
Speaker 8 (16:23):
Well this thing looks more like a John Wick Lever
action than a John Wayne Lever action.
Speaker 4 (16:29):
Oh god, that's beautiful. I love that. You ought to
be a copywriter. That's great.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
Well, that is wonderful. That is like the best range
report ever. So what's you're playing with this?
Speaker 8 (16:42):
You know, they're all just they're all just toys. You know,
it may be a defensive weapon or anything else, but
you know, there's a broad range of stuff I've got.
I've had a soft spot for Lever actions for years
and years. I have just about every model Marlin that
was ever built. And this is just fun. You know.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
People say, well, hear me self defense. Let me tell
you three P fifty seven magnum lever action is a
serious self defense rig.
Speaker 8 (17:16):
I'm horned the self defense leads that are just beautiful
for this type of thing.
Speaker 4 (17:21):
Oh okay, yeah, those are good loads. Good deal.
Speaker 2 (17:23):
Well, look I appreciate it, sir. Great range report, and
you know, keep shooting. You're having a good time. Still
green and I love that. Let's grab Greg out of
helling them. On ten on four, Hey Greg, you're on
gun talk.
Speaker 4 (17:35):
What's that?
Speaker 9 (17:37):
Well, at the top of the hour news break on
the Fox News on the radio station that I'm listening
to you on, they had the Pope come on talking
about the murders in Minneapolis and he said, we need
to stop the pandemic of arms large and small around
(17:58):
the world. To that, I say, hey, mister Pope, why
don't you show us by example and disarm the Vatican
guards I believe they're called the Swiss Guard. Yes, disarm
them and show us how well that works. And then
why don't you do something that's in your control, like
(18:19):
go after pedophile priests instead of trying to get rid
of guns.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
Can't disagree with any of that, and look, great points,
I appreciate the call. Yeah, a lot of these leaders
have arm protection. Well, all of them have arm protection.
And you want to say, okay, if you think we
should all be giving up our guns and we should
just depend upon I don't know what for our protection,
then you should give up your security, give up your
(18:44):
armed security. And you know they'll say, well, you know,
I feel perfectly safe walking around Washington, d C.
Speaker 4 (18:49):
Sure you do.
Speaker 2 (18:50):
You got secret service all around you, for heaven's sakes.
So and look, I remember, where's the pope from Chicago, Illinois.
The pope is infused with the Chicago Democratic infection of
way of thinking and believes this whole idea that if
we only got rid of the guns, the bad people
(19:11):
wouldn't be bad anymore.
Speaker 4 (19:13):
No, the good people would obey the law.
Speaker 2 (19:17):
Which, by the way, it's time to say the quiet
part out loud, and it's going to make some people
nervous if and when they come to take guns. I'm
remembering this this twentieth anniversary of contreating, when they went
door to door, kicked indoors and took guns from everybody
and Mayo ray Nake and said there will be no
guns in New Orleans. And they confiscated them and stole them,
(19:41):
and then they denied they ever did until the Second
Amendment Foundation sued them. By the way, happy anniversary fifty
one years for the Second Amendment Foundation, and they sued
them and found a warehouse full of guns that they
had stolen from the citizens. Make no mistake, the police
will come to take your guns.
Speaker 4 (20:02):
If they're told to.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
People say, well, they wouldn't actually do that, They would
refuse that order. They don't refuse any orders. They never
refuse any orders. They will do what they're told to do.
They will come to take your guns. And ultimately, if
the government takes your guns, the government will kill you
because there's nothing to stop them.
Speaker 4 (20:26):
Here's the quiet part out loud. There are now.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
Millions of people in America who will simply not give
up their guns. And you can say that's good, you
can say that's bad. I'm just telling you it's what
is or what do you meantime? They're not going to
give up their guns. They will shoot whoever comes to
take their guns. You mean they shoot the police. Yes,
(20:52):
that's exactly what I mean. If you come to take
the guns, to confiscate the guns. If you're gonna hi
late the Second Amendment, you're saying the Constitution doesn't matter.
You're saying all bets are off. And you got to
understand when you say all bets are off, what's that actually.
Speaker 4 (21:10):
Going to mean?
Speaker 2 (21:12):
And I'm I'm talking about, you know, promoting this or
saying I support this. I'm just telling you what I
think would happen. I think you know, we got what
one hundred million gun owners owning five hundred million guns
in America. Take one percent of that. You said, we're
(21:32):
not going to do that one percent, one hundred No,
a million people call that A million people who say no,
not going to do it, and you're not going to
take them. I don't think the gun banners have thought
this through. I don't think they actually understand where this
(21:56):
is going to end up if they want to push
this that far.
Speaker 4 (22:00):
Yeah, I get it, I get it.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
It makes everybody on both sides nervous when you say
things like that. I'm sorry, but if you won't think
about it, then you can't acknowledge it, you can't plan
for it, and you can't deal with this reality at
least that's where I am. That's what I think it
is to welcome your ideas here. I'll be right back
with more gun talking. Yeah, we just need to talk
(22:24):
about all things gun. I'm Tom Gresham. If you want
to see more of what we do, go to gun
talk dot com. If you want to know more about
what I'm thinking about and what I'm covering and reading,
you can follow me over on Twitter, where I am
at gun Talk and I'm posting there all the time
with news stories, basically trying to help you know what's
going on, because you know, I follow all this stuff
(22:46):
and I realize I get deep into it, but sometimes
I know that some folks would really like to know
more of what's going on. So I'll post links to
stories and you can be better informed by following me
on Twitter. Yet I'm at gun Talk over there. So
Sean called in out Littleton, Colorado. Sean, thanks for your
patience you have made on the gun Talk. How can
we help you?
Speaker 10 (23:07):
Hey, Tom, I have a question for a couple. My
dad had a nineteen eleven that he used in the
military in the sixties and he passed away, and it
was supposed to go to me and we've shot it
several times, and he asked me to clean it one
(23:29):
time so I could know how to take it apart.
And I did that, and I did not enjoy the
process at all because of all the moving parts and
all the functionality that is contained in that handgun. So
my question is, is there a nine millimeter nineteen eleven
(23:55):
with a fairly reputable name out there that isn't going
to break the bank that takes down more like a
SIG PT twenty six or a glock where there's not
all the turn the barrel bushing and pull this lock
out of the where normally a takedown level would be
(24:17):
on a SIG or whatnot. I just I don't really
like the way they take down. I'll take my glocks
and my SIG takedowns over that any day. But I
hear you talk about the nineteen eleven and how sweet
it is to shoot. So I shot it when I
was like about twelve or thirteen, and.
Speaker 4 (24:39):
Let me jump in here. I think I can help you.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
The quick answer is no, if it's a nineteen eleven,
it's a nineteen eleven if it's not at something else.
But I can also help you when it comes to
there's two different levels of takedown on nineteen eleven. There's
field stripping, which is pretty easy and frank it's all
I ever don and then there's a total disassembly, which
involves it's a little bit more.
Speaker 4 (25:04):
I can just tell you it.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
Feel stripping is easy once you've done it three times,
just like, ah, okay, that's not a big deal. I
would really really recommend to use something we didn't have
when you first started doing this, which is YouTube. There
are all sorts of YouTube videos on feel stripping in
nineteen eleven, and you'll find that it's actually pretty simple.
It's like, really maybe six steps, it's not much to it.
(25:29):
The key is to have a barrel bushing wrench. If
you have that, it makes it really easy. And you know,
for like five bucks you can pick up one of those.
Speaker 10 (25:41):
Gotcha. Okay, Yeah, I love shooting it because I idolized
my dad as a Vietnam vet and everything and that done,
which is another story was supposed to go to me,
but anyway, I want to get another one. But I'm
just like, am I really you've committed to take this
(26:02):
thing apart?
Speaker 4 (26:02):
It's just not a big deal.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
Honestly, it's really not difficult to feel strip in nineteen eleven.
It's just it takes, you know, two minutes once you
get it figured out. The first time it takes ten minutes,
the second time it takes four minutes, and the third
time it takes two minutes, and from then on it's
two minutes.
Speaker 4 (26:19):
It's not a big deal.
Speaker 10 (26:20):
Well, that's why I call you Tom for wisdom. So
I'm gonna give it a go. I'm getting a bonus
at work next month and I'm considering getting a cult
or a. I'm not going to get a staccato because
I can afford the stacado.
Speaker 4 (26:40):
They're pretty pricey.
Speaker 10 (26:42):
Yeah, well, I would love to have a Wilson Combat
nineteen eleven, nine million year, but I edc but I
that's the same price as as staccato almost.
Speaker 4 (26:53):
But let me make a suggestion. Take a do your research,
but take a look.
Speaker 2 (26:58):
Ruger makes a really nice snin the millimeter nineteen eleven,
and so does Smith, and they're both in that I'm.
Speaker 4 (27:05):
Guessed they haven't looked it up.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
Probably seven hundred dollars range very affordable and very nice,
and I think you could probably find what you're looking for.
And there are probably another half a dozen makers that
do the same thing and have those in the same
price range.
Speaker 10 (27:22):
Okay, great, Yeah, I love Ruger. I got that R
Exam on your your the sales pitch on it, and
couldn't be happier.
Speaker 4 (27:30):
So, yes, it's funny you mentioned that.
Speaker 2 (27:33):
Yesterday when I was out of the range, I had
my two buddies with me, and I was carrying the
R Exam and I shot it, doing speed stuff with it,
and you know, I said, you guys got to try this,
and they're going, ah, you know, it's kind of big
and feels like a glock and all that, and both
of them shot and went, wow, that is much nicer
than I thought it was going to be.
Speaker 4 (27:51):
The trigger's really good. I love the sites, and everybody
shot it really well.
Speaker 10 (27:56):
Couldn't be happier, I mean, And so the price point
is outstanding.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
By the way, Michelle just mentioned something here. She says,
you know, if you take that nineteen eleven, if you
go to a store where you buy it, have the
salesperson or a gunsmith walk you through the disassembly a
couple of times, with you know, them showing you and
then you doing it. You know, spend fifteen twenty minutes
with them. Have somebody do it so that you have
(28:23):
the confidence level that you're doing it right.
Speaker 4 (28:25):
Have them to do it right. There. That's a great idea.
I love that.
Speaker 10 (28:28):
I agree, and I should have thought about that before,
but I just listened to you for over five years.
I'm glad I found you because I've learned a hell
of a lot from this channel. But yeah, I think
that's my best option because I really do want to
have a nineteen eleven that I can shoot. And I
(28:50):
think based on all the people that have called into
your program and talk about that trigger, I remember, I
mean we're talking four years ago.
Speaker 11 (29:01):
When I it right, it was nice.
Speaker 10 (29:04):
But I just I just I.
Speaker 4 (29:11):
Get it.
Speaker 2 (29:11):
Look, the modern rifle our rifles, so modern pistols are
easier to.
Speaker 4 (29:15):
Take me out. I get it.
Speaker 2 (29:16):
But there's just kind of something fun and cool and
frankly you'll enjoy. Say I know how to do this.
I can take down do a field strip on a
nineteen eleven. I can do it in less than a minute.
And there's some pride in that. There's some pleasure in that.
I think you're going to love it. So have fun
with that, all right, be right back for more. Gun Talk.
(29:46):
Do you want to have a special rifle that can
do almost everything and that your friends don't have. Hi,
I'm Tom Gresham, host of gun Talk, and here's the deal.
Every few years we put out a special gun, a
very limited run. The GT thirty marks thirty years on
the air, and this one is really different. It's a
(30:08):
general purpose rifle you can legally have in all states
and it's crazy versatile. Based on the Ruger American Gen
two platform, we created a Scout rifle in five, five
six or three oh eight, sixteen inch threaded barrel, only
thirty seven inches long overall, extra long rail for mounting
(30:30):
a standard scope and extended Iraley scope like Colonel Jeff
Cooper preferred, or a red Dot and it comes with
great iron sights so it's ready for the range right
out of the box. It looks great too, with a
cryptech camel finish topped with a smoke bronze metal treatment.
The five five to six version takes standard armgs and
(30:53):
the three oh eight uses standard AICs pattern or pmgs.
This is a short run, so I don't miss out.
Check out gun talkscout dot com. That's gun talkscout dot com.
It's accurate, attractive, and you can take it with you
to all states. Scout scope, standard scope, or no scope
(31:15):
at all. Set it up the way you want. When
you pull it from the case, your buddies will say
what the heck is that and they're gonna want one. Seriously,
this is a great rifle do everything, rifle hunting, target shooting,
defensive use. Gun talkscout dot com. Don't put it off,
(31:36):
these are going quickly get your g T thirty Gun
talkscout dot com. Hey, a big thanks to Bret and Oklahoma.
(31:57):
He called in just passing something along. He got actually
a couple of the g T thirty rifles, so you
got both the three O eight and the five five six.
Speaker 4 (32:05):
And he wanted to put the QT mounts.
Speaker 2 (32:07):
You know, the QD mounts are the for sling mounts
like you have on ars. It turns out that Ruger
actually has those on their shop Ruger website Shopbruger dot com.
The item number is eighteen one seventy five one eight
one five twenty five dollars for both of them. And
you put those on the regular like old style rifle
(32:28):
sling swivels, and then you now have QD mounts, so
you can pop on a sling that has the QD
mounts on it.
Speaker 4 (32:35):
So Brett thank you for that again.
Speaker 2 (32:37):
Shopruger dot com and the item number is one eight
one seventy five. For those who don't know, if we've
would talk about for a little while, you probably I'll
already know. We do have this short run special edition
gun talk rifle.
Speaker 4 (32:53):
It's up.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
We call it a scout rifle and it's in the
Scout configuration. It's basically what we could come up with
as a general per us do everything rifle. Call it
a truck gun, call it a fifty state gun. You
can have it in your car, your vehicle. It's leading
in all fifty states. A bult axe and rifle in five, five, six,
or two or three or eight. In my conversation with
(33:14):
Richard Mann, who we had that interview earlier on the show,
and we were talking about the two eighty four Winchester,
which is a great cartiss by the way, but we
were talking about two two three. He said, he told me,
he said, you know, I've shot a lot of deer
with two two three, so okay, And he said, well
he has found and this just passing this along. He's
(33:36):
found that the sixty grain partition master partition bullet works great.
And he said, but Melvin Forbes was the one who
told him. He says that that's a good bullet. He said,
but you got to well, he said, kick it in
the ass. You really got to make it go fast.
So Richard was loading it up. He said, it really
wasn't wasn't grouping that well. He took it up to
(33:59):
right maximum and called Melvin and said, hey, this thing's
just not me. I says, what did I tell you?
He's just bumping up some more.
Speaker 4 (34:08):
He says.
Speaker 2 (34:09):
He threw a little bit more powder in it, bumped up,
you know, to max, or even a little bit more
of recommended max. He says, the group's size went down
to one hole. Okay, I'm going to file that one away,
because that would be a really great bullet if you're
going to be hunting with the two two three, the
sixty graine nozzle partition, if you're going to handload it.
(34:30):
What Melvin said, I got to work it up, of
course from the lower make sure that you're safe from
the lower charge weights. But bump it up, kick it.
Speaker 10 (34:36):
In the rear end.
Speaker 2 (34:37):
Norman's and Grant Pass Oregon. Hey, Norman, got a range report.
What in the world have you been doing?
Speaker 9 (34:46):
Well?
Speaker 11 (34:46):
I really like my lever actions, and I've got a
couple of them that I put scopes on because I'm
sixty five, and transition lensers and the old story that
you talk about occasionally of you know, front sight for
insights within a hundred yards. But I've got a couple
(35:08):
of older ones. I've got a nineteen ten thirty two
Winchester and I've just picked up a forty four Magnum
and I just got I just have this thing of
it just seems wrong to put a scope on a
lever action.
Speaker 4 (35:23):
It's just an American, Okay.
Speaker 8 (35:27):
So I've tried a whole bunch.
Speaker 11 (35:29):
Of different open iron sights, and again because of my
you know, longtime vision issues, it just doesn't work. I
mean that though I was sure it was a good
buck until I looked through the scope and that was
the trees behind it, you know sort of thing. But
I recently tried by it's called Bullseye by Marble Arms,
(35:58):
and it has it's it's the rear sight and it
has two rings on it.
Speaker 2 (36:06):
Oh, I'm looking at it now online marble Marble arms
dot com. And the rear site is actually two circles,
a smaller aperture and a larger aperture around.
Speaker 11 (36:17):
That, and it really has helped me. You know, look,
everything's a bit blurry anyways, but those two rings have
helped me to be able to almost most of the time,
even both eyes open, get a much better vision within
(36:39):
one hundred yards or so, and still keep it on
the dinner plate, you know, on the target and I
range because that those two rings helped me much better
judge some elevation and some windage compensations.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
Well, and we used to point out the rear sits
supposed to be blurry anyway, but your eye will naturally
center the front site in a circle. I mean, it's
just what we do. We put it right in the
middle of the circle. But having two circles there, a
small one and a bigger one. And even the small
one is as big as a lot of ghost ring sites,
(37:17):
but the big one's.
Speaker 11 (37:17):
Really big, yes it is, and so it helps me.
You know, at one hundred yards, I've got a steel
plate out there about the size of the black tail's body,
and I'll put the paper plate about the chest and
where that would be. I can see the whole plate
in the big rings, I mean the whole steel plate, right,
(37:42):
and I can center that white plate in the small ring,
and I'm keeping it near the center of the plate
free standing, and.
Speaker 2 (37:52):
I would this set up would be pretty This should
be pretty fast too.
Speaker 4 (37:58):
It had a pretty fast site to use.
Speaker 11 (38:01):
Yes, yes it is. It's a quick acquisition. And yet
if the thing's moving, it's also letting me see wider
because I tried like a peep site and it just
it just really narrow division that I didn't like. And
I'm in the deep woods, so there's a lot of
scrub and everything else. So I'm stalt hunting, and so
(38:23):
I'm anxious to try that in a hunt this fall.
Speaker 2 (38:28):
All right, Well, do us a favor here once you
get it on a hunt and get a report there,
I'd love to get a follow up range report. I
was frankly unfamiliar with this Marble Arms dot com and
they call it their bullseye sight I have. I don't
think i've ever seen that before. It's really different looking,
kind of cool, and I could sure see where it
(38:49):
would work for you. So Norman, thank you for passing
that along. I just learned something I was not aware of.
This rear site looks cool.
Speaker 4 (38:57):
Go check it out. You can see what I'm talking about.
Speaker 2 (38:59):
Marble bullarms dot Com take a look at their Bullbye back.
Let's start to talk to Paul and Shadow Louisiana down
there on the Red River.
Speaker 4 (39:17):
Hey, Paul, what's up? Hey? Hey day?
Speaker 12 (39:20):
I was calling up. I listened to your program and
I I mean I hear you emphasize over and over
again that just because you shoot a lot doesn't mean
you're ready to defend yourself should someone come in your
house or your family. Do you have any suggestions for
any classes or programs around in my area that northwest
Louisiana that you would recommend that I could go to.
(39:41):
That would be you know, repuable and it's a good
class to learn for self defense.
Speaker 2 (39:46):
Well, I'm not sure what's going on. Of course, you
got Clark Custom Guns up there in uh Houghton, which
is not too far from you. The other thing you
could do, you could jump on I forty nine and
run straight down and go to Robert just outside of
Baton Rouge, and that's where we have our training facility.
For a gun talk we call it range Ready Studios.
We have classes there, so you could always just go
(40:08):
check out, and those classes are not held all the time.
Speaker 4 (40:11):
We have some.
Speaker 2 (40:12):
Schedule for the fall range Ready Studios dot com. You
can take a look at that or go to gun
talk dot com. But I think if you do a
little calling around, you could find what you're looking for.
And I would probably start by calling Clark Custom Guns
in hot and just say, hey, you know who's given
good classes because they know the good from the bad,
and they'll know who the right people are and see
(40:33):
what they recommend. I mean, if you want to stay
up in northwest Louisiana. But if you want to, it's
what like a three and a half four hour drive
for you down to Robert If you want to run
down there, you can take a look at the classes
we have down there too, Okay, okay, in a.
Speaker 12 (40:49):
Type of deal, I mean that would be several days.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
I mean, is it?
Speaker 12 (40:53):
I mean, how does how do these classes work today?
Like have weekend you come back other weekends? How does
it usually work down there?
Speaker 2 (40:58):
As y'all program and our program, but usually a two
or three day class and you'll it'll say what it is,
it's a couple of them. They've got a two day
class and then they'll offer a one day class in
advance of that that a lot of people would benefit from.
But you don't have to take the one day prep class.
You could take the two day class. But yeah, I
(41:18):
would say go down and do a two day class,
would be what I would do. And remember that's just
a kind of a starter class. You're going to get
you going. If you say, Okay, I like this, I've
just learned that there's a lot of stuff I don't know.
Then you can start finding other schools around and you
may have to travel a bit to find you know,
the ones you're looking for, but they are definitely out there,
and a lot more of them now than we've had
(41:39):
in the past. Can I just say this, congratulations on
making the leap and saying, Okay, I'm going to go
find out what I don't know.
Speaker 4 (41:45):
That's a big thing to do.
Speaker 9 (41:46):
Man.
Speaker 4 (41:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 12 (41:48):
Well, Ye'll listen to you all the time. And the
more I'll listen to you, the more I realize I
don't know nearly as much as I think I do,
and I need, you know, I need to really, you know,
get better at it. So that's what I want. I
just want to be as responsibles.
Speaker 4 (42:01):
I can with it.
Speaker 2 (42:03):
That's a great idea, Michelle just pointed out. She said, also,
local sheriff's departments probably have a good idea of who
the good instructors are, so you know, in fact, even
right there in red River you can ready repairs. You
can ask the sheriff's department there, look who's doing good
classes and that kind of thing, and they may be
able to give you some instruction or head you towards
(42:23):
somebody that I wouldn't know about that's in your area.
But yeah, we sometimes forget to mention sheriff's departments are
great sources of information and a lot of times you
can call them and the person who's asked answering that
dispatch may not know, but he or she may say, look,
I'll have somebody call you back, and they may have
one of their firearm trainers call you back and say, look.
Speaker 4 (42:43):
This is how you really need to go to.
Speaker 2 (42:45):
So check out the sheriff's office, not just where you are,
but everybody who's listening, thanks for the call. I appreciate that.
All right, here's the deal. You have to decide that
you are your own first responder. You have to decide
that you are going to be the one who takes
care of other peop people, whether it's kids in school,
people in church, or anywhere where you are. The police
(43:06):
will show up, but it's gonna take them a while.
And while that's happening, people are dying, and you got
to figure that out. I would really, really really recommend
you go grab Edmunk's book First thirty Seconds, that's on Amazon.
Speaker 4 (43:21):
Really worthwhile. It's great information. It will make you.
Speaker 2 (43:25):
So much smarter and I'll actually open your eyes. In
the meantime, go out, there's some shooting, take somebody with you,
watch those muscles and be careful in those public ranges.
Speaker 4 (43:34):
So watch what's
Speaker 2 (43:34):
Going on around you with the next time right here
on gun Talk
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