Steve Hartman and Rich Ohrnberger talk Nuggets and Jokic!

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
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Speaker 2 (00:04):
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(00:24):
be Richie, how are you on this Sunday morning?

Speaker 3 (00:26):
Man? We're good, We're good. We're just I'm better than
the heat. I can tell you that much. The heat
don't look like they're gonna make it much longer.

Speaker 2 (00:36):
All right now, I need to open up the show today.
By the way, we're gonna have John Paul Morosi join
us our Fox Sports Radio MLB Insider all of us,
give us his insights on whether or not the Golden
Knights are about to wrap up a first Stanley Cup victory.
And of course we've got much to talk about as
far as the NBA Finals concern. But I want to

(00:56):
start with an apology today, Sam, do you have As
rich and I closed our show last Sunday. Richie and
I were making our picks for Game two of the
NBA Finals, and the Nuggets were eight and a half
point favorites, and you said, even though you, you know,

(01:17):
try to make a case for Miami that you know
your gut tells you that the Denver is going to
cover that spread. Now, as you know, when it comes
to making any kind of predictions, usually my track record
isn't very good. So these are my words, my exact words,
as we were closing out last Sunday show. I'm always wrong, folks.

(01:39):
Here it is, I'll lock it, take the Heat, cover
the spread. This it's Fox Sports Radio. So I gave
them that that the Heat will cover the spread, knowing
that you should bet against me because I'm never right.
So not only did the Heat cover the spread, they
actually won the game outright. And so I know a

(02:00):
lot of people were just you know, running, you know,
and calling their bookies or whatever and putting money down
on Denver because I had locked the Miami Heat. And
unfortunately for those that followed my lead, you lost. And
so I want to apologize why the Heat actually won
that game. I have no clue, Rich, because they haven't

(02:21):
shown any signs since then that they should have won
any games in this series. It was a freakish fourth
quarter in Denver in Game two that led to Miami
actually salvaging a game. So we're gonna have to wait
till tomorrow. By the way, the scheduling in these NBA
four wis witch. I mean, no games this weekend. We

(02:42):
got to wait until tomorrow night to watch the Nuggets
wrap up these NBA finals. That just seems crazy to me. Yeah,
it's all very silly.

Speaker 3 (02:52):
I don't understand why they're doing that, and I don't
think it's going to change. Unfortunately. I think they. I
think they the league owners are the committee alongside their
network partners, have assigned this as the best way to
keep traction alive and to booy their ratings during the finals.

(03:12):
I can't figure out why though, but this is what
it is, and like I said, I don't think it's
gonna go away in the interim. All we can do
is sit here and say, well, with plenty of time
to rest and recover. With as highly as everybody has
been talking about Eric Spolstra as a coach and his
ability to scheme opponents and with the flowers that Jimmy

(03:35):
Butler was getting through the majority of the playoffs, including
the Eastern Conference Finals. I mean, not only are they
getting beat but I mean these scores at the end
of these games aren't even really representative of the effort
the Nuggets are taking.

Speaker 2 (03:52):
Apart.

Speaker 3 (03:53):
Miami and the Nuggets were in some close contests leading
up to the finals. Here the finals have been I mean,
outside of Game two, where the Heat just found their
stroke from three point, especially in that fourth quarter on
the road in Denver, it just the Nuggets have done
whatever they've wanted this entire series.

Speaker 2 (04:15):
I think the takeaway, honestly, when this is all said
and done, and I think we're in a cord here
to say that we expect this series to be over
tomorrow in Denver and we'll get much more into that
whole dynamic of what it means for this Nuggets organization
and the city of Denver. But a lot of people
are going to look back on this saying, how exactly
do Miami even get to the finals? I mean, they

(04:37):
have now lost four straight home games in the playoffs. Yeah,
so they lost the last two home games against Boston
and now they've lost two home games against Denver. So
you don't see that often on a resume of a
team that actually makes it to the NBA Finals that
they concluded with four straight home losses. So I mean,

(04:58):
I think Eric Spolstro did a t menus job to
get his team that this far. But you know, when
we look at this Denver Nuggets team, there's there's a
lot to be said because, you know, I think back
a couple of years ago when the Milwaukee Bucks won
the NBA Championship, and in some ways, it's a very
similar situation to Denver. Like it was a team that

(05:21):
you know, couldn't win the big one, led by a
superstar player who couldn't win the big one, and then
all of a sudden they had a breakout season and
they end up winning an NBA Championship. And I know
after Milwaukee won, a lot of people were saying, hey,
you know, this is just the beginning. Look at that
nucleus there, right, They've got Holiday, they got Middleton, they
got obviously one of the greatest, greatest players at the time.

(05:44):
Everyone's like the best player in the league in Giannis.
They're going to be back. And a couple of years later,
their coach gets fired because they couldn't get back. And
so when I'm looking at this Denver team and trying
to look into my crystal ball. Is this just that
one run where everything came together, sort of like the
year that Dallas on on with Dirk finally getting a championship.

(06:07):
Is that going to be the story here for Jokic
and company that you know, they just they got their
one or is this now a team that is going
to be the team to beat and another when we
talk about team to beat in other words, they're in
the new bar And I specifically talk about the Lakers

(06:29):
here Rich because the Lakers just got eliminated by this team.
And he had Lebron James after that final when he
was asked about the future, saying that, well, I don't
even know how our team is going to look, which
was his way of saying the team we have right
now isn't good enough to beat that team, right. So
I'm just I'm going to be curious, assuming Denver wins this,

(06:53):
especially on Monday, how the rest of the league looks
at this, like, is Denver now the ball are like,
that's the team we have to figure out how to beat.
Or are they going to be dismissed as a team that, hey,
the pieces just finally fell in their place, and they're
sort of a one and done champion.

Speaker 3 (07:10):
It does have some feel of that Milwaukee Bucks team.
Jokichen Janis are similar players, not the same. Jannis his
game looks different than Jokic, but they are dominant stars
on their team and the whole, the whole offensive success
of that team, that franchise revolves around Jannis, Whereas you know,

(07:35):
if you look at some of the other multiple repeat
champions over the years, you really didn't have that. Yeah,
I mean, Lebron is a dominant star in terms of
the headlines, but Lebron shares the basketball extremely well. Lebron
James would facility facilitate Dwayne Wade extremely well, Chris Bosh

(07:59):
extremely well. You know, you look at his run with
the Cavs. I mean, he needed Kyrie, you know, he
needed Kevin Love to hit threes for him when when
they won with the Lakers, and and I don't know
if this formula is gonna net them another championship, but
during the bubble season down there in Orlando, I mean,

(08:20):
Anthony Davis you could argue was the better player, the
more the more necessary star for the Lakers to win
that championship. Now Lebron James. I'm not trying to say
he can't or or won't be a champion again, but
he he definitely needs help. And one of the reasons
why is because part of his game, part of what

(08:41):
makes his game so special is he's a great distributor.
Like I just think that the ship has sailed on,
you know, the the one the one man band. You
know you can you can win one. Well in terms
of a dynasty, like you can win one like that,
You could win one with Jokic doing everything standing on

(09:02):
his head. I mean, Jamal Murray is a very talented
basketball player. I don't want to throw water on his
game and say like Jokich is the only star, but
he is. I mean, he's the sun in that solar system.
I mean everything revolves around him, same way it was
with Giannis in Milwaukee, or I should say still is
you know, with Steph Curry and Klay Thompson and Draymond Green. Yeah,

(09:25):
Steph again, he's the overwhelming star. But the fact of
the matter is in Golden State, like it takes the
three of them, like you truly need the part of
the reason why the people, especially Bay Area fans of
the Golden State Warriors will say that the Cavs won
that Finals was because Draymond got suspended. That's how important

(09:45):
he was to those finals runs. So I guess what
I'm trying to say is like, yeah, listen, there's a
firm belief in my mind that you need to have
you know, that that high flying superstar, you know, highlight
reel player like that certainly helps, but you need you
need a squad around that player. And I don't know

(10:06):
if Denver necessarily has a strong enough team around Nikolojokic
to be a dynasty. I think they're probably a piece
or two away from that.

Speaker 2 (10:16):
Well, Murray obviously is a guy that a lot of
people are now gonna watch to see will he take
his game from what we've seen here in the finals. Again,
he had an offshooting night on you know, the game
four Friday was a weird game. Miami had a chance here.
I mean, you know, Jokic got hurt, then he got
enoughoul trouble, Murray couldn't make a shot, and then Gordon
goes off. So I mean that's why there is some

(10:39):
intrigue in this Denver team that maybe they do have
enough pieces to be more than a one and done champion. Well,
much more on the NBA Finals, on the aftermath of
what's gonna happen if indeed the Nuggets close it out
on Monday. Coming up on the other side, we're gonna
check in with our Fox Sports Radio MLB insider, also
an NHL insider, the great John Paulmer, will join us.

(11:01):
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Speaker 2 (11:44):
Steve Harvin rich Ormberger, this is Fox Sports Sunday and
we are live from the tire rac dot Com studios.
All Right, joining us right now. Man that wears many hats,
an expert on more things than you and I Rich combined.
No doubt, he is our Fox Sports Radio MLB insider.

(12:05):
He is mister Hockey. He is John Palmer ROSI JP.

Speaker 5 (12:09):
How are you today, outstanding, my friends, We've got a
very compelling Stanley Cup Final unfolding, perhaps the Vegas Golden
Knights one game away from their first ever Stanley Cup.
We know the Panthers will not go down easily, of course,
but with Kachuk's status somewhat in doubt, you've got to
think advantage Golden Knights. You've got the Braves playing very

(12:32):
good baseball as well, so a lot of great storylines
right now.

Speaker 2 (12:35):
Well, the parallels between the NBA Finals and the Stanley
Cup Final are very similar. You have two teams based
in Florida, underdog teams trying to take down franchises that
are looking for their first ever championship. What do you
think a Golden Knights victory on Tuesday means not just

(12:56):
for a very young franchise just in their sixth year
of exist, but what do you think would mean for
the city of Las Vegas to actually be the home
of a professional team champion.

Speaker 5 (13:10):
Steve it the nexcellent question because I remember years ago
when the Golden Knights first came into existence a conversation
that I had with one of the most famous athletes
ever from Las Vegas, that of course being Bryce Harper,
and Bryce talked about how to him, the Golden Knights
were really important to the city because of the fact

(13:31):
that they were the first team, the first major league
pro sports franchise in Las Vegas. And I really believe
that hockey has such a home in that community and
has become so special to the identity of Las Vegas
because it was first. And I think it's important to
credit Gary Bettman and Bill Foley all that were involved

(13:52):
in the franchise being placed there, because you've seen the
city in the community really supported, as both of you
know and all of us who've had the pleasure of
traveling to Las Vegas in the past in different contexts.
One interesting part about it is a lot of people
who live in the community don't actually go to the
strip very often at all. They either will relax in

(14:16):
Summer Lane or downtown, whatever it might be. But the
point is it's important that this franchise has given depth
and texture to the city's identity to the rest of
the country that does not necessarily relate to the Las
Vegas Strip and everything that goes into the entertainment, gambling, etc.

(14:36):
This is a community with a lot of very proud residents. Yes,
they certainly rely a lot on tourism in so many ways,
but it is a very proud sports community as well.
And I think you're seeing that bride come through. And
Bryce always told me Steve, one of the most important
things was that that was not a relocated franchise, that
was a team that was born in Las Vegas. And

(14:57):
I think you're seeing that and how the franchise has
been supported and what's going to be an extraordinary atmosphere
for Game five on Tuesday night.

Speaker 3 (15:05):
JP. I've been looking at the National League standings lately
and something sticks out. The New York Mets and the
San Diego Padres, both teams that have made i mean
extreme investments in payroll. San Diego top five, Mets, I
think their top five as well, Mets sitting at thirty

(15:26):
one and thirty four, padre is sitting at thirty one
and thirty three. Sub five hundred baseball teams who met
in the wild Card last year, both with owners who
are sticking to the script. They're saying that their general
managers are people they trust in Billy Eppler and New
York and Aj Prewler in San Diego. They've got all
stars everywhere you look. They got some young players with talent.

(15:49):
What's wrong with these two franchises that money apparently has
not yet fixed.

Speaker 5 (15:54):
Well, it's a really important question, rich and I think
that it's a little bit different the answer on Bulls It.
I think with the Padres, and they've shown a little
bit of a sign of life here lately. As you know,
they've won three straight, they've won six to ten. They're
still not above five hundred, but they're playing better baseball,

(16:15):
and I think you're seeing the at least in the
case of the Podres, their extreme reliance on Machado, who
obviously has been injured for part of the season, and
they're extreme reliance on just a superstar driven lineup overall,
where a number of them got off to slow starts.
And when you have a team that is so top

(16:38):
heavy and then you don't have a lot of organizational
depth because you've traded it away or it's just a
bit of a hollow center to the team in general.
When those superstars either don't produce or are injured, you
are left with a gigantic hole in your lineup. And
I think that's exactly what's happened for the San Diego Padres,

(17:00):
that they've had some issues with the rotation. Musgrove began
the year injured, Blake Snell has never really gotten to
his potential, as you both know from watching that franchise.
So that, to me is what I see with the Padres.
And you contrast them with the Diamondbacks, who right now
are the first place team in that division and are
the exact opposite, incredibly home grown. When you talk about

(17:23):
Corbyn Carroll, who right now I was just thinking about
that this morning, he might be one of the best
ten players in the game right now as a rookie.
And then I think on the Mets side of things,
it's an older rotation that has now had some different rotation,
injuries over the course of the year, and honestly some

(17:43):
below par performances from Verlander and Schurezer. If you were
to total up the number of wins that Verlander and
Suzer have right now, and you would have said at
the beginning of the year that this is how many
wins these two have combined for the answer would be
the Mets would be in and lo and behold, the
Mets are in trouble. They also at the moment are

(18:05):
missing pet Alnzo was on the injured list and will
likely be there for a few weeks. This is, again
a team that relies on a handful of superstars. Lindor's
average not especially high. He's been producing runs, but this
is a team in the Mets that relies on Alonzo
in the way that the Mets or the Yankees rather
rely on Aaron Judge, and neither team, in my opinion,

(18:26):
can really achieve its full potential without that major bat
in the lineup.

Speaker 2 (18:31):
John Palmosi, Johnny Us, we're talking some Major League Baseball JP.
It's not often that we get into the middle of
June and we look at the major league leaders and
we see someone hitting above four hundred. But we have that. Now.
I got to ask you, because I've heard two different
pronunciations of his last name, Ares and Ares. Now I

(18:55):
want to ask you the definitive answer. When you have
a guy that is sixty six points higher in batting
average and any other player in the major leagues, what
is the proper pronunciation and how legitimate is this guy
in terms of I don't know a modern day Rod Carew,
Tony Gwen those that had very high batting averages.

Speaker 5 (19:16):
All right, So to begin, when you see the double
R in Spanish, of course you're supposed to roll it.
The other part is if you're going to phonetically present
his name properly, there is an accent on the second
a right, which tells you that that is the syllable
that has the emphasis. So I'll say it. I'll say
it slowly here, Luis. So think about it as like

(19:51):
at the in that middle part of the name, it
should you should hear the word I like your yes, Luis. Okay,
there you go. So now on the the rest of
the commentary, he's got a shot, and he's got a
shot because his ability to place the baseball is Tony
Gwynn esque and I know that that is high praise.

(20:13):
And yet look at the numbers this is right now
in terms of what he's on pace to do, or
even even this deep into his season, what he is
doing in terms of a relatively low amount of home runs.
But still a ton of on base and a ton
of doubles, and obviously the average is extraordinary. This is

(20:34):
the territory of George Brett and Tony Gwynn in terms
of the last twenty five thirty years. Those are the
only guys who have approached what Arayas is doing right now.
And so I look at his ability to have great
bats of all skills. We are in a post shifting
world which allows him to have even more green space

(20:56):
in which to operate. So will he do it, anyone's guess.
But honestly, guys, we're at a spot with this record
and this standard of a foreigner batting average. We're in
the same spot now with him that we were with
Judge and sixty two a year ago, where it came

(21:16):
down to the last couple of days for Aaron. It
obviously happened, it very easily could have fallen just short.
But the key thing is with Arias, I fully expect it.
We'll be having the same conversation in September that we're
having right now, which is just tells you how highly
I think of his ability and him as a person.

Speaker 3 (21:32):
That's incredible, That is incredible, especially for it to happen
in back to back years with two players like that
Judges right season last year and not Rayahs this year.
It's just unpredievable.

Speaker 2 (21:43):
Thank you JP.

Speaker 3 (21:45):
Is there a team or teams as we're look, we're
not nearing the deadline yet it's August first, but we're
we're approaching the dog days this summer here? Is there
a team or teams that you're hearing are our intro
std in blowing up their team or even being sellers
at the deadline that you would not have expected at

(22:07):
the beginning of the season.

Speaker 5 (22:10):
One team that I think will have to contemplate some
pretty significant movement that I didn't think would have to
think about it in this area is the Seattle Mariners.
They have excellent pitching, but their power is just not
shown up and they've lost seven out of ten. They
have not been able to string together a consistent winning

(22:30):
months in my opinion, And you look at how well
the Texas Rangers are playing right now at the top
of their division, and they need to reassess where they're at.
You've got Texas who is ten games ahead of Seattle.
And while the Mariners had a very strong second half
last year, they did not. They were helped by the

(22:51):
fact that Texas and to some extent the Angels were
just not factors in the postseason picture last year, and
now they are, especially Texas, and so I think that
they have to really reevalue it where they're at. I
think the White Sox have been a little bit in
a little bit out their four and a half games back.
I think for now they are more likely to be

(23:12):
at least holding paton. Maybe they try to find a
way to buy, but they're playing better in a division that,
in my view, is very, very winnable. The other team
that I think has to be a clear cellar at
the moment is Saint Louis. My goodness, one of the
worst teams in the National League right now. I thought
they were going to be a division winner or very

(23:33):
close to it, and they just have not put together
any kind of consistency this season. So for me, the
Cardinals have to really contemplate trading one of their young bats.
It might be hard to give up a Nolan Gorman
or a Dylan Carlson, but I think they have to
consider it to get in the pitching that they need,
because frankly, they are so far, so far off the

(23:54):
pace in the kind of pitching they need for the future.
And we know, of course, this is the last year
of Adam Wayne, right, so this team right now, the
Saint Louis Cardinals, they had better be open minded to
moving their bats for pitching, not just for twenty twenty three,
but for the future as well.

Speaker 2 (24:10):
It's always that time of the year, even though we're
in June and the trade deadline is August. Who's a buyer?
Who's a seller? Something we'll definitely talk about over the
next six weeks or so. Can we make it a
Father's Day date with you? I mean, you know us
Dad's next Sunday? Is that okay with you?

Speaker 3 (24:27):
JP?

Speaker 5 (24:28):
I think so it's a great plan. And by the way,
speaking of a wonderful Father's Day celebration one week early,
how about the low family Nathaniel of the Rangers Joshua
of the Rays playing a series in the major leagues
against each other for the first time. So they're family
based in Florida, is able to go their father, Lieutenant

(24:48):
Commander David Lowe of the US Navy, a former top
gun tactics instructor. So what a great weekend for David
and Wendy Low to see their sons in the field.
So yes, in honor of them, in honor of all dads,
will reconvene a week from now.

Speaker 2 (25:03):
Perfect JP or the absolute best, have a tremendous week
and we'll talk to you next Sunday.

Speaker 5 (25:08):
Sounds great, guys enjoying all the best things.

Speaker 2 (25:09):
That's John Palmer Rosi our Fox Sports Radio MLB insider,
and I really have a problem with rolling those rs.
I'm gonna have to work on that. Find out right
now what is trending. Perhaps Mansi Blanos can help me.

Speaker 6 (25:26):
So this is so funny, I can't. A couple of
days ago, I was like, oh, this guy's hitting for
three let me see if I can find a clip
of his and this is I was like, a rise.

Speaker 7 (25:38):
That's not all right?

Speaker 6 (25:39):
Yeah, and it's like I heard multiple people.

Speaker 2 (25:42):
This is why I asked the question, because I had
the little rise far and judge, forget the rolling ours.
I heard ares.

Speaker 7 (25:51):
Right, and I was like, this can't And this is.

Speaker 2 (25:53):
Why I asked John Palmer Rosi because I knew he
would know the answer. The problem is the way he
pronounced it does not come out of my mouth right.

Speaker 6 (26:02):
Even if you don't roll the r's properly.

Speaker 7 (26:05):
I was still like, it can't be a rise. There's
no way a rise. I was like, he's Venezolano, absolutely.

Speaker 6 (26:12):
Not, and I, you know, I didn't want to sound
like the stupid one. So the first time I said
his name, I said a rise because.

Speaker 7 (26:19):
I was like, maybe I'm stupid, maybe it's not correct.

Speaker 2 (26:22):
I did this for you because cute rich and I
will never mention him again unless I's still hitting for
two months from now.

Speaker 6 (26:28):
Everyone's a probably a rise, which is what I thought,
which is what I thought, which I understand is very difficult.

Speaker 7 (26:34):
So I get that.

Speaker 6 (26:34):
I understand, you know, I'm saying like Moncey evolved because
one I hated my name. When I was little. I
hated mon I hated that. I wanted to change my
name to Selena. Yes, the rip Stow, Yes, I used
to sing and dance just you know, I loved her
and I want to change my name to Selena in
the first grade, and my mom was like, absolutely not.

Speaker 7 (26:54):
I hated my name.

Speaker 6 (26:54):
I hated being called and then somebody like obviously read
my name Monzy, and I was like, oh, that's.

Speaker 2 (27:01):
It, that is it.

Speaker 7 (27:02):
I don't you guys.

Speaker 2 (27:03):
By the way, it's grateful. It's as well. Yeah, promise
you a good name.

Speaker 3 (27:07):
It's a unique name.

Speaker 6 (27:09):
But once somebody called I don't know what, teacher called
me that it's stuck.

Speaker 7 (27:13):
I liked it. I was like, this is it, and
like you're.

Speaker 3 (27:15):
You're the only person who really is fluent in Spanish.
You have to you have to rank me and Steve
saying this gentleman's last name.

Speaker 6 (27:23):
All right, you ready, okay, Gorias, oh man, that's pretty good.

Speaker 2 (27:33):
Okay, they're trying to get a rise out of you.

Speaker 7 (27:36):
That's really good.

Speaker 2 (27:39):
The Ice speak French. You see a late team. I
didn't take Spanish like most people did in French.

Speaker 7 (27:52):
Right, right, most people did take Spanish. But Spanish is hard,
just like French.

Speaker 6 (27:55):
I mean, they're they're hard to teach.

Speaker 7 (27:57):
I'm speak.

Speaker 6 (28:02):
People ask me like Spanish words is like, I don't
know how to explain it. I can just tell you
it's wrong either right or rob, But I.

Speaker 7 (28:07):
Just don't how to explain it.

Speaker 6 (28:08):
We have a full day of baseball today, fellas, no hockey,
no NBA, A full day of baseball on this Sunday.
A lot of games kicking off right now. But two
games already underway, with the Tigers.

Speaker 7 (28:21):
Up on the Diamondbacks at home in Detroit.

Speaker 6 (28:23):
It's five to two bottom of the seventh inning and
the Guardians andres heiman Is hit a two run homer.

Speaker 7 (28:28):
I give you another one there.

Speaker 6 (28:29):
They're currently beating the Astros three zero bottom of the
fourth inning. Now we know the Mets have not had
the greatest start to the season despite the very big payroll.
Owner Steve Cohen spoke to the New York Post and
he said that he's not going to blow up the team.
He thinks that the problem actually is inconsistent pitching staff,

(28:51):
but that no, Buck Showalter is not gonna get fired.
The Mets, coming into today Sunday are thirty one and
thirty four for this season. They're only nine and a
half games behind the first place Braves in the NL East.
They had lost seven in a row prior to yesterday's
win against Pittsburgh. But Steve Cohen says, no, they are
not going to blow up the Mets.

Speaker 2 (29:14):
Yeah, they say that. Yes, I mean, if they're ten
games a low five hundred I at the play deadline.

Speaker 3 (29:21):
They're born until this keeps going for another month.

Speaker 6 (29:25):
Yeah, of course, And Novak Djokovic has won his third
French Open title, beating Casper Root in three sets for
a record twenty third glance Grand Slam men's title. He
officially passes Rafael in the doll for the most That's
not a bad day.

Speaker 2 (29:40):
That's not a bad day.

Speaker 7 (29:41):
It's not a bad day.

Speaker 2 (29:42):
Yeah, I got much more on him in a moment here, Manzi,
thanks so much for checking with you a little bit
later on ry awful. I'm good at this. We are
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(30:05):
was you know, MONSI was talking about Djokovic winning the
French Earlier this year, he course won the Australian Open,
and he'll be the overwhelming favorite next month at Wimbledon,
considering he's won the last four Wimbledon's. Of course, they
canceled it in twenty twenty with the COVID shutdown, which
would really put the US Open in a precarious situation.

(30:25):
Rich because two years ago he won the first three
lost the US Open final, but last year was not
allowed to participate in the US Open because he wouldn't
get vaccinated. Now, I don't know what the laws are now,
but can you imagine if he wins Wimbledon and would
have a chance to, by the way, only the second

(30:47):
man ever in the Open era. Last time a man
won the Grand Slam was Rod labor way back in
nineteen sixty nine. And if he doesn't get vaccinated, he
wouldn't even be allowed to participate in the US. So
I'm trying to figure this whole thing out. Are we
still there now where they had these rules or have

(31:07):
they been taking off the books, because that would be unreal,
right if he had three of the four in his pocket,
ready to make history and they're like, no, you're gonna
have to get vaccinated if you want to play in
the US.

Speaker 3 (31:20):
So, but I'm not educated enough in that space in
tennis and their.

Speaker 2 (31:25):
Rules, because that's what happened last year.

Speaker 3 (31:27):
No I remember, and I think year, I mean year
over year when we compare where we're at as a
society this year versus last year. Even though at that
point there were some people who felt like it was
too strict of a policy. I think we're in a
much different place. So yeah, I would be, I would be.

(31:50):
I guess I would be shocked, frankly if there were
still mandates of that nature in place. And yeah, you know, furthermore, look,
you know, the reason why there are people who demand
asterisks with certain achievements or non achievements is because they
want to outline, like a specific era.

Speaker 2 (32:12):
We talk about Baseball's Hall.

Speaker 3 (32:14):
Of Fame and some of the guys and some of
the numbers that we saw over the course of the
steroid era, and people are demanding asterisks. The reason is
is because then it notates like, Okay, well this was different,
this was a special time, or these were special occurrences,
or rules were broken that in the history of baseball,

(32:35):
for example, weren't broken in the past, or at very
least to our knowledge, etc.

Speaker 2 (32:41):
Etc.

Speaker 3 (32:41):
So there's people who demand those notations. I really do
feel like in a lot of sports debates, say a
decade out from today, a decade out from maybe a
year ago, there are going to be people who look
back on championships one you know where you know, for example,
Baseball's playse the majority or the entirety of it occurred

(33:02):
in Texas that year.

Speaker 2 (33:04):
The NBA.

Speaker 3 (33:06):
Championships for the twenty twenty twenty one season was in Orlando,
you know, the end of the playoffs into the championship
round in the bubble in Orlando. I mean, there's gonna
be a lot of moments in sports that people are
gonna call for, Hey, we need to notate that that
was different, that that was a different time. I don't

(33:26):
think I care, you know what I mean, Like Djokovic
made a decision that had an ill effect on his career,
you know, and those were the rules at the time.
And I'm not saying this in support of the rule
or not, or in support of Djokovic or not. But
I think that we get too caught up in trying
to say, like, hey, we need to notate this as

(33:48):
different or special. It's sports. Sometimes sports are fair. Sometimes
sports aren't fair, you know. I mean, we change playoff
rules all the time. Like in Major League Baseball, there's
more teams in the playoffs now than they weren't. Are
we gonna asterisk that? In the NFL postseason, there's more
teams in the postseason than there used to be. Are
we gonna astorisk that? You know? I mean, rules change. Yeah,

(34:11):
it's just I kind of feel like these debates are
too sensitive.

Speaker 2 (34:15):
Just deal with it. Well, here, here's the other thing
about Djokovic which really makes his record even more amazing,
is that he has twenty three. Nadal twenty two, Federer twenty.
I mean, Sampras retired after winning the two thousand and
two US Open with fourteen, which was the record, So
for Djokovic to put up twenty three having to play

(34:35):
against arguably the two other best players, most dominant players
in the history of men's tennis. I think of years,
I mean, you know, fifty, people are going to say,
how is it possible that you had three players at
the same time put up those kind of numbers having
to go up against each other. Imagine how how many

(34:56):
championships Djokovic were it won if there wasn't a n
adull In an Federer fifty. I'm not quite sure. I mean,
I'm trying to I'm trying to put you know, a
read on, but that's a that's an unbelievable number.

Speaker 3 (35:07):
It's an unbelievable number. And I mean, frankly, like there,
I bet you there there are people who love tennis
and who are obsessed with tennis. Who would make the argument,
whether it be for Federer and at all or Djokovic,
yeah that matter. Who would say, hey, like, we need
to notate this time as separate from other times in
tennis because of the wildly successful triumvirent that reigned over

(35:30):
tennis during this time. Again, it will the US Open
that he missed out on playing because he was in
vaccinated have an effect on his overall standing in terms
of like his greatness and impact on the game. I
really personally don't think so, but there are people who
would disagree and may feel like missing that US Open

(35:53):
will have some sort of substantial effect on his legacy.

Speaker 2 (35:56):
All right, Coming up on the other side, we got
a lot of things you're gonna be covering the course
of the day. We'll get back to the NBA Finals
Game five tomorrow in Denver. I want to bring up
a NFL story with you, Rich on the other side,
one that has to do with what players are doing
off the field. This is Fox Sports Sunday, Steve Hartman
and Rich Harberger Fox Sports Sunday. We're live from the

(36:19):
Tairaq dot Com studios. It's been a lot of talk
about hypocrisy. We're going to get into the golf situation
coming up in the next hour, Rich, but I want
to zero in on the NFL here. So the NFL
for years try to dismiss the idea that their success,

(36:39):
their growth had anything to do with gambling, which we
all knew was not true. False. Gambling had a major
impact on the growth of the National Football League and
continues to do so now that they're in bed with
gambling institutions that provide about a billion dollars worth of
revenue into the league every year, and the sports gambling

(37:03):
industry is increasing increasing Now there's you know, we're multi billions,
with the NFL obviously being the number one sport to
be bet on. So the NFL is really trying to
clamp down on players and gambling rich and they try
to explain to them some really cockamamy rules. My favorite

(37:24):
one is this is that obviously you're never allowed to
bet on NFL games. That I get, Okay, I get
that part of it. Now you are allowed to gamble
on other sports with legal gambling mechanisms like those that
are tied to the NFL, as long as you're not
on the facility. Now that This is the one that

(37:48):
really gets to me, right, the idea And what was
interesting because some of these players that have been you know,
suspended or brought in for questioning, weren't even clear on
the rules. So they said, all right, so the NBA
Finals are going on, and I want to place a
legal bet on the NBA Finals. I can do that
from my house, you know, on my phone or whatever,

(38:10):
but I can't do that if I'm at the facilities.
I mean, this to me is just ridiculous. It's absolutely absurd.
What the NFL is trying to do is maintain this
image that, all right, we're clean. We're not allowing our
players to bet on anything if they're at the facilities.
Where are we going with this?

Speaker 3 (38:28):
Rich?

Speaker 2 (38:29):
Is what I want to know. And how many times
can you hammer these players for doing something that, Frankly,
in my opinion, it's hypocrisy to punish them. And again,
I'm not talking about betting on the NFL or their
own games. I'm just talking about gambling in general.

Speaker 3 (38:45):
Well, Frankly, and I was talking about this yesterday in
Fox Sports Radio, I don't really find that big of
a problem with them betting on themselves. Now, I think
individual player props would be a place where you need
to draw the line. I think betting on an opponent
against you certainly would be would be crossing a line,

(39:07):
but betting on your team to win. Like, I never
understood how that should be viewed as something that's something
that we should look down on. I mean, that's just confidence,
that's just bravado. Like you're a boxing fan. I'm a
boxing fan. Isn't it kind of cool when you hear
how much money that a boxer wagered on himself to

(39:29):
beat his opponent?

Speaker 2 (39:30):
Yeah, Like I think Mayweather did it all the time,
all the time.

Speaker 3 (39:33):
That was the example. I you, Steve, I knew you
would understand this argument. Like Floyd Medweather Junior spent his
career betting hundreds of thousands of dollars, so instead of
just earning his purse, he would earn you know, sometimes
payouts as much as half a million dollars or millions
of dollars on winning fights. And we're talking about big matches.

(39:54):
So like, I look at this whole thing and I say,
you know, it's just again the NFL getting in the
way of players' ability to earn, because if you allow
players to live bet during the season. Hey, follow my betting.
I'm Dak Prescott, and I think we're gonna beat the
Philadelphia Eagles on the road this weekend, so much so
that I put ten thousand dollars on the game, like

(40:16):
you know, brought to you by DraftKings. Yeah, I mean
like that's the reason why all of this makes so
little sense to me. So I don't know. I think
there should be less rules, not more.

Speaker 2 (40:26):
Well when it comes to money. Obviously, this was the
biggest story in sports this week. How what happened to
golf could happen to the rest of the sports world.
This is Fox Sports Sunday, rolling along on another beautiful Sunday.
This is Fox Sports Sunday, and we are broadcasting live
from the ti raq dot com studios tyrack dot com.
We're gonna help get you there and I matched selection

(40:49):
fast re shipping, free roadhas or protection over ten thousand
recommended installers ti raq dot com. The way tire buying
should be. By the way rich here in So col
I was in San Diego a little bit last week.
I wasn't the weather wasn't a whole lot better than
was here in Los Angeles. And then I took a
little side trip to Phoenix on Thursday. Thursday Friday, I

(41:14):
was there for a celebration of life of a friend
of mine that recently passed away, and it was one
hundred degrees rich.

Speaker 3 (41:21):
Oh wow.

Speaker 2 (41:22):
Like I'll put it this way. When I was driving
back Friday and I hit blythe at about seven o'clock
in the evening, it was ninety seven degrees. I'll say this,
you missed the heat. I mean, it's been unseasonably cool
here in Socow.

Speaker 3 (41:40):
Yeah. I don't miss the heat. I do not miss
the heat. Yeah. I also don't miss the snow. So
I've had the I've had the you know, kind of
like the globe trotting experience where I've lived various states,
various regions of this country and grew up in New York,
played in New England, played for the Arizona card So

(42:01):
I know what the extreme cold feels like. I know
what the extreme heat feels like. And I'll tell you
a quick story. When I first landed for training camp,
I had signed as a free agent with the with
the Arizona Cardinals, and they do their training camp. I
don't know if they still do, but at the time
up in Flagstaff on the campus of NAU. And so

(42:24):
you land obviously in Phoenix, and you do your medical
in Phoenix and then they put you in a shuttle
van they drive you the two hours north to the
Northern Arizona University campus. Well, when I was in the valley,
I remember thinking, like, I've never felt hotter weather in
my life. It was like one ten that day when

(42:44):
I landed, it was so hot that I couldn't sweat.
That when I was sweating, it got up to one fifteen,
like you know the in the in the late afternoon,
when I felt perspiration, it would evaporate immediately. So I
get to the hotel and I'm like, Okay, I'm hungry,
but I'm gonna wait this out because I'm not leaving

(43:05):
until the sun sets. So it's probably it got late.
It probably got to like nine thirty at night. And
then I'm like, what is even open anymore? I'm taking
a nap. I look and I see that there's an
in out Burger fast food burger restaurant out here on
the West coast. They had one in Phoenix where I
was staying across the street. So I'm like, okay, that's
where I'm heading. So I'm walking down to the front lobby.

(43:28):
The sliding glass doors open, and I am hit with
what I can only describe as that first gust of
wind that comes out of your oven.

Speaker 2 (43:36):
It's like almost ten o'clock.

Speaker 3 (43:37):
At night, and it was still one hundred and three
degrees outside.

Speaker 2 (43:43):
I just went straight back up to my room and
went to bed. So it was a reminder just how
hot it can get in the desert, no question about that.
Not ideal.

Speaker 3 (43:52):
Those people who live out there, they're made of different
stuff than me. Because I'm like Frosty the snowman. I'm like,
see you next year.

Speaker 2 (43:59):
Yeah, go kids. I want to throw a number at you.
I want to just sort of inhale this number. Okay, okay,
seven hundred billion dollars, not million, seven hundred billion dollars,
which isn't which isn't even that far away from a

(44:22):
trillion dollars, right?

Speaker 3 (44:23):
You could argue it's two hundred and fifty billion away
from a trillion.

Speaker 2 (44:26):
Correct, So seven hundred billion dollars billions and billions, So
where is that number coming from? That is the number
in Saudi Arabia's Sovereign Wealth Fund, the Sovereign wealth fund
that just bought the world of golf. It was a

(44:51):
number that the PGA Tour couldn't help but battle because
they just don't have seven hundred billion dollar. So what
started off as sort of a crazy idea of an
alternate golf league, in less than two years, the people

(45:12):
that started this league, which by the way, no one watches.
I know my TV station LA Carries love Golf and
the numbers will prove nobody's watching, have mission accomplished. They
now own the world of golf. Now what that means

(45:34):
moving forward, we're not exactly sure. But the one thing
we are sure of is they are now running the
Golf World, the PGA Tour, the European Tour, which is
the DP something Tour nowadays DP World Tour, DP World Tour.
This seven hundred billion dollar sovereign Wealth fun of Saudi

(45:56):
Arabia has accomplished something that a lot of people say
would not be accomplished. And by the way, I was
getting some criticism because I want to bring up some
ideas of where they're going next, because I don't believe
they're stopping in golf.

Speaker 3 (46:09):
No they're not.

Speaker 2 (46:10):
Golf was sort of the test. It's an easy test
because they knew that there was no way that the
PGA Tour had any hope of holding them off, and
that somebody would bring it up the idea because I'm
going to bring up some team sports that might get
involved in this, saying well, this was an individual sports,
so you could buy individuals. First of all, in golf,

(46:31):
there's only one individual that moves the needle one and
his name is Tiger Woods. And they didn't get Tiger Woods,
Bryceon de Shamba, Brooks, Koepka, whatever, whatever. Golfers made the
jump to live for one hundred million dollars plus, none
of them moved the needle. There's only one golfer ever

(46:52):
that moved the needle and his name is Tiger Woods.
So what was this all about? Well, it was, like
I say, in my opinion, it's the idea that Saudi
Arabia says, all right, now we have taken control of
one entity. What's next. Sports has changed so dramatically in
my lifetime. It used to be niche. Believe me, Back

(47:14):
in the day, being a sports fan was very niche.
It was a mainstream. But the amount of money that
sports is generating around the world these days has changed
the whole dynamic of the business dramatically. Oh yeah, and
the Saudis are looking at it as an opportunity.

Speaker 3 (47:29):
Well yeah, because think of it from this standpoint. So,
say you have acquired a tremendous amount of wealth and
real estate, for example, in a certain area, but then
all of a sudden, for one reason or another, the
real estate in your area is becoming less and less valuable,
Like maybe there's new land development around you where there

(47:53):
didn't used to be, or maybe all of a sudden,
you know, there's news reports that say it's a coastal
area you own real estate, that erosion over the next
twenty years is going to slowly eat away at the
land that you own. And you've made so much money
in this little real estate empire you have, so all

(48:14):
of a sudden, you got to start thinking about your
exit strategy. You got to start thinking about how am
I going to pivot from real estate? Well that's what
Saudi Arabia is doing. The Saudis have a tremendous amount
of money. Their wealth comes from oil. There's a lot
of global manufacturers who are turning away from oil now.
So in order to pivot to capitalize on this extreme

(48:37):
wealth that they have. They don't want just to lay
dormant and just invest in Wall Street or other stock
markets around the world. They want to actually own tangible assets.
So sports leagues are.

Speaker 2 (48:51):
Tangible, absolutely so now that they own golf, give me
another target. This is something we actually brought up a
year ago, I think when we started talking about more
on this Live Golf and I mentioned college football because
the landscape of college sports have completely changed in this
country with name, image and likeness. We have these collectives
now that all the universities are putting together money in

(49:13):
the coffer so they can compete with top high school
athletes as well as transfer athletes that are accepting more
money from schools to leave one school to go elsewhere.
And it's huge business, especially college football because it's not
under really anymore the jurisdiction of the NCAA. They've gone rogue.

(49:33):
Oh Ji, I mean, college football is an entity onto themselves.
So what is to prevent And I asked this question
a year ago, but now even more so that again,
what they've been able to do in a very short
amount of time taking over the world to golf. What
is to prevent from this sovereign Wealth Fund of Saudi
Arabia to approach any university, any university, and say, would

(49:56):
you be interested in us, you know, contributing to your
collective so that you're in a better position to acquire
the best talent out there. I can't imagine too many
universities saying no. Now, they could try to take the
high road, whatever that might be. And I laugh at this.
I laugh at this when I consider, you know, I'll

(50:20):
put it this way, the NBA brings in five billion
dollars a year of revenue from China. Every year, five
billion dollars of revenue comes in from China, and human
rights are a question. Everything else. By the way, this
live golf is the best thing ever happened in the
NBA because no one's talking about the NBA and their
marriage with China. But five billion dollars. None of the

(50:41):
economics of this league would be possible without that money
being poured into But let me ask you this rich
you know, if you if you get a paycheck, yeah,
does it really matter to you where the money for
that paycheck comes from?

Speaker 3 (51:02):
Well, what's interesting about that question is, over the course
of my professional life, I could not tell you because
I've worked in the NFL and for major corporations after that.
Exactly where the money comes from?

Speaker 2 (51:18):
Mm hm.

Speaker 3 (51:19):
So I mean to answer your question with a question,
does it sound like I care?

Speaker 2 (51:24):
No, I would say, And I'm not saying it's right
or wrong to care or not care, but I would
think the overwhelming majority of us that collect a paid
check really are not concerned about the origins of that paycheck. Yeah,
see a lot of the checks, oh yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (51:42):
Because most people don't have the time to look. Most people,
and this is true of my parents, this is true
of a lot of people who listen to our show.

Speaker 2 (51:51):
You know.

Speaker 3 (51:51):
They make enough money to get by, you know, and
a lot of times what that means is they're living
with a little credit card debt, or maybe they got
a line of credit out on their home, whatever equity
they have in their home, or maybe they rent and
sometimes rent gets paid on time, and sometimes it doesn't,
because if you want to go out and have dinner
a couple of nights, maybe maybe you can't pay your

(52:13):
electrical rent on time. Like a lot of people are
just getting by man and so the stress of you know,
the rat race of life a little bit keeps you
from really pondering the existential questions that come up when
these sort of enormous mergers occur that are so above
hour even pay grade, even though we're paid to try

(52:37):
to investigate these things and discuss them and have opinions
on these things. There's so much we don't know about
what happened between the Saudi royal family and the discussions
that Jay Monahan, the commissioner of the PGA, and his
two lieutenants that he was bringing in on these discussions
had over the course of the eight weeks plus or

(52:59):
whatever was to get this merger accomplished. But what we
do know is that A. This is going to have
a profound impact on the world of golf. B this
is going to have a profound impact on the world
of sports and how sports are governed. And see they're
not done yet. No, because this is a treasure troph

(53:21):
Like you said, the amount of money that this private
investment fund has, I mean they they could buy the
NBA five times over and still have money to buy
the NFL.

Speaker 2 (53:33):
Yeah, that's that's my whole point. So the idea that
they just wanted to take over golf. Golf was easy
prey that was low hanging fruit. I mean it was
easy because they just didn't have the finances to battle
them well.

Speaker 3 (53:46):
And they did it perfectly because they attacked a nonprofit
entity correct that doesn't want to open their books, right,
And they were so fearful that this litigation that they
were going to be tied up in because again you're
talking about a bottomless pit of money that the Saudis
have to throw at this. They weren't worried about live
golf stealing viewership. They weren't about live golf finding a

(54:10):
way to get more ratings than the PGA had. That
was never going to happen. That was never going to happen,
especially with the demographic that golf really does ensnare They
weren't switching to live golf. But what the PGA was
most afraid of him, what j Monaghan was most afraid of,
was the lawsuits against the PGA that if they went

(54:34):
to trial, discovery would begin, which means that the PGA
would have to open their books and all of these
golfers would see how much money the PJA actually is
benefiting from their work and how little they're getting paid
by comparison, while still flying under the banner as a nonprofit.

Speaker 2 (54:53):
That's the reason why this merger happened.

Speaker 3 (54:55):
That's the reason why because I'm sure every time J
Monaghan tried to take the moral high ground or try
to reason with these people behind the scenes, every single
time he came with a plan that kept the PGA
and the Live Golf Tour separate, they said, okay, well
we'll see you in court, and he went, no, we

(55:18):
can't let that happen, So we have to get back
to the bargaining table. And what's occurred is now the
primary and sole investor in the PGA, which I think
the initial investment now is something like two or three
billion dollars from this this conglomerate that is going to
oversee the world of golf. J Monaghan the commissioner of

(55:39):
the PGA, which I don't know how much longer he's
going to.

Speaker 2 (55:41):
Be the Yeah, I figure, Look, he has a new boss.

Speaker 3 (55:46):
Though, so he's getting broke off in this deal too.

Speaker 2 (55:49):
Yeah. Okay, you remember in Wall Street where the Charlie
Sheen character was running an airline that no longer existed.
You're still the CEO. We're just selling off all the asset.
That is exactly what's happened.

Speaker 3 (56:01):
What's crazy is he's he's not even it's not even
like the CEO of the PGA, because that that ship
is sailed. The PGA is going to exist in name only, correct.
So the CEO of this now company, this parent company,
over the DP World Tour, right over.

Speaker 2 (56:16):
The live well, if he covers his job as long
as it may last, he's going to have to trumpet
the the new regime that has taken over golf. But yes,
it is very real that this is just the beginning.

Speaker 3 (56:28):
I think we both agree there. I don't I don't
begin insight.

Speaker 2 (56:32):
This is this is very small money, much bigger money
to be made, all right. Coming up on the other side,
we're going to get back to the NBA Finals Game
five tomorrow and the Denver Nuggets and Yogicic and Murray
are they the new faces of the NBA. We'll discuss
This is Fox Sports Sunday, Steve Harman or Ritch Hamburger,

(56:56):
Fox Sports Sunday Live from the Tirak Doc Studios Game
five NBA Finals tomorrow in Denver, the Nuggets try to
wrap up their first ever championship. By the way, yesterday
I was asking about ticket prices for that game. Somebody
actually sent me a screenshot from one of the ticket

(57:17):
agencies upper level seats, I mean top level, you know,
those three hundred level seats, twelve to fifty each, twelve
hundred and fifty dollars each. So it's going to be
rockets in Denver tomorrow as they hope to make history
with the Nuggets winning their first ever championship. Could be

(57:37):
a problem for the NBA, though, Rich. I mean, when
you think about the current NBA, there are only two
players in the NBA right now that could late claim
to be or have been, the face of the NBA.
That would be Lebron James and Steph Curry. These are
the two most recognizable marketable faces for the NBA. There's

(58:01):
a lot of great players, it's just that because of
their exploits individually and team wise, they're the guys. And
we were talking a little bit earlier about whether or
not this Nuggets team's won and done or more than that.
I mean, think back to Game three, right, you lose
Game two, played horribly in that fourth quarter at home,

(58:24):
and they made history in Game three. When we talked
about Yoka Chi Murray, I mean, first they talked about
the yok was the first guy ever in a Finals
game to go thirty twenty ten and then they dug
a little deeper. And this was just an unbelievable stat
that Yoka Chi Murray were the first teammates, not just
in an NBA Finals game, not just in a playoff game,

(58:46):
any game in the history of the NBA to have
teammates in the same game have triple doubles scoring at
least thirty points. It had never been done in.

Speaker 3 (58:57):
Any NBA game, let alone the final.

Speaker 2 (59:00):
Let it alone the Finals. Right, So if the Nuggets
come back next year, and again we're just assuming they're
going to close this out, and a little bit later on,
I'm like, I'll have some fun about any kind of
a heat comeback, because there is there is a scenario,
but I'll get to that later. But if the Denver
b Nuggets close it out tomorrow and let's say, come
back and win another championship, and another championship, because they

(59:25):
have that's a young nucleus, Gordon and Porter. I mean,
they got young guys Murray and Jokicic, they could do it.
I mean, if they stay healthy and you know, they've
been together for a long time, so we see it
on the court. That's a great team and they got
the right coach. Does jokicch Can Jokich get to the

(59:45):
level of a Lebron or a Steph where he actually
becomes the face of the NBA? Yo kicch Jokic?

Speaker 3 (59:59):
No, I don't think so.

Speaker 2 (01:00:01):
No matter how many what if they rattle off three
in a row, well, here's the point. I mean, Shaq
rattled off three in a row. You know, the.

Speaker 3 (01:00:11):
NBA will completely have to pivot who they are if
they're going to do that. Look, you know, it's actually
interesting that the Stanley Cup Final and the NBA Finals
occur at the same time because they both have very
different feels. Then, or I should say, the NHL has

(01:00:31):
a very international feel to it. The NBA still even
though they are global game. You know, probably at this
point more Asians I'm talking about people who live in
Asia watch the NBA than Americans. It's still very much
a national sport. They have very carefully cultivated their stars

(01:00:56):
over the years. And look, some of it's luck. Like
you can't you can't predict that a kid from Akron
is going to dominate the league for two decades. You can't.
You can't predict that you know you're going to have
a star rise to the heights of a Lebron James,
to use the example, and will will be squeak, squeaky

(01:01:20):
clean publicly, will never you know, run amiss in terms of,
you know, some of the things that other players have
gotten involved with off the court, suspensions and otherwise. And
then also be a champion and a great champion, and
a good public speaker and a movie star and all
the things that you hoped would come in the generation

(01:01:41):
after Michael Jordan, well here we are, or Kobe Bryant
for that matter.

Speaker 2 (01:01:45):
It's kept.

Speaker 3 (01:01:46):
It's kept the NBA very nationalistic. If Jokic becomes your star,
that will that will demark the moment when the NBA
had to h shift gears and become more of an
international league.

Speaker 2 (01:02:03):
They haven't done.

Speaker 3 (01:02:04):
It yet, In fact, I think it's intentionally so that
they haven't done it yet. But if if if Jogic
is the guy, if a if a Serbian superstar is
the guy, well that that officially that will be the
day that the NBA is no longer like our game
in terms of America. It becomes a global game, truly

(01:02:26):
becomes a global game for the first time in its existence,
and and it'll have a very different feel to it,
very similar to the NHL has a different feel in
the United States because it has you know, a huge
presence from you know, Russia and Eastern Europe in general,
and a huge presence from Canada and as well as

(01:02:46):
the United States and our amateur leagues filtering into the NHL.
But it Yeah, so I think they're going I think
it could head in that direction, but I think they're
gonna do as much as they possibly can to avoid
that happening.

Speaker 2 (01:02:59):
Yeah, it'll be interesting if tomorrow it ends and they
hand that Bill Russell Trophy, which is the finals MVP
Trophy to Jokic. Where do we go from there? All Right?
On the other side, though, I want to get into
it's not over yet for the heat. All right, I'll
explain why, but first let's find out what is trending
right now. So, MATSI, are you a Yokic fan.

Speaker 7 (01:03:24):
I am.

Speaker 6 (01:03:25):
It's impressive to see him be so fundamental, using techniques left.

Speaker 7 (01:03:31):
And right where it's like, I know he knows what
he's gonna do, we know what he's gonna do.

Speaker 6 (01:03:35):
He's gonna do it slowly, but he's gonna do it effectively.

Speaker 2 (01:03:38):
He just seems to be under such control. Right.

Speaker 6 (01:03:41):
I watch him, and I'm like, I know you're not flashy,
I know what you're about to do, yet you can't
be stopped.

Speaker 2 (01:03:48):
Does he have any vertical game right?

Speaker 6 (01:03:50):
No, he barely gets somebody doesn't mean to. He just
but his I think guy jump higher than Yokich, but.

Speaker 2 (01:03:57):
It doesn't ens of awareness around the basket, like where
he is. He can shoot from any annual and he
always seems to know exactly where he is in relation
to the rim on the court right, and.

Speaker 6 (01:04:12):
His shots always touch the top or like the front
of the rim and bounce in very soft.

Speaker 7 (01:04:19):
It's never a swoosh hardly ever.

Speaker 6 (01:04:21):
He has such control, just awareness where the rim is,
where his teammates are.

Speaker 7 (01:04:26):
It's incredible to watch. Again, not flashy, still incredible to watch.

Speaker 6 (01:04:32):
What's incredible to watch is the Diamondbacks right now in
Major League Baseball.

Speaker 7 (01:04:35):
They're in first place in the NLS.

Speaker 6 (01:04:37):
Let's not talk about it because the Dodgers are not
in first place, but they were down. They scored four
runs in the top of the ninth inning and have
taken the lead over the Tigers, so right now they're
up seven to five.

Speaker 7 (01:04:50):
It's the bottom of the ninth inning.

Speaker 6 (01:04:52):
The Tigers have a man on first and third, but
they're down to their final out. So the Diamondbacks are
either going to extend their wind streak to five and
the Tigers are going to extend their losing streak to nine,
or both of those are going to be snapped. But
right now, Arizona up seven to five.

Speaker 7 (01:05:08):
Bottom of the ninth inning.

Speaker 6 (01:05:09):
The Guardians have had a couple of home runs from
Andresi Menez and Josh Bell and they're still shutting out
the Astros. It's five zero. They're about to start the
eighth inning. Royals and Orioles are tied at three apiece.
Bottom of the third. Phillies beating my Dodgers one zero.
Bottom of the third. It was thanks to Bryce Harper
and RBI single to put the Phillies on the scoreboard.
Matt Olsen hit a two run homer four hundred and

(01:05:30):
twenty one feet, his eighteenth of the season, and the
Braves are beating the Nationals two to one.

Speaker 7 (01:05:35):
Bottom of the fourth inning.

Speaker 6 (01:05:36):
The Mets and the Pirates are tied at one apiece.
Bottom of the fourth, Jeff McNeil hit that solo home
run four New York to put them on the scoreboard.
But Andrew McCutcheon of the Pirates, he recorded his two
thousandth career hit. In the bottom of the first inning.
The Twins are beating the Blue Jays four to one.
Bottom of the third, the Rays are up on the Rangers,
but the Rangers scored three runs in the third inning

(01:05:58):
to make it interesting, so are up four to three.
They're about to start the fourth inning and the Reds
have scored first against the Cardinals.

Speaker 7 (01:06:05):
It's one zero.

Speaker 6 (01:06:05):
They're about to start the second inning. A little NBA
news that came out and no, this is not about
Miami Heat's poor mascot, Bernie.

Speaker 7 (01:06:15):
That was the lawsuit.

Speaker 8 (01:06:17):
I just was hospitalized, was hospitalized.

Speaker 7 (01:06:21):
It was a bit with Connor McGregor.

Speaker 6 (01:06:23):
It's like, Connor McGregor, did you really punch him like I.

Speaker 2 (01:06:26):
Understood he did. Did you see the video?

Speaker 6 (01:06:29):
I did see the video, But it's like, are you
that dumb UFC champion and his Scott?

Speaker 7 (01:06:36):
Would you give.

Speaker 3 (01:06:36):
Him a left cross that would have knocked me, you know,
off the planet Earth? And you just saw the heat
what's the name of the mascot? Oh Bernie, Oh, Bernie Bernie.

Speaker 2 (01:06:47):
By the way, there's an actual person in that mascot.
Alpha guys, you understand that, I know? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (01:06:52):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:06:53):
Does he have a lawsuit like up the his name's
also Bernie. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:06:57):
I don't know.

Speaker 6 (01:06:58):
I just don't get How did you really punch him?

Speaker 7 (01:07:02):
If this was a bit, I will.

Speaker 3 (01:07:04):
Say this, the mascot has a glass chin because he
was talking some smack. Yeah, and I thought he'd at
least make his way out of the first round. But he,
I mean, he went down like a sack of potadis.

Speaker 7 (01:07:16):
They just don't get it.

Speaker 6 (01:07:17):
But the Celtics are finalizing a deal to hire Charles
Lee as their lead assistant coach. This is according to
ESPN and Bobby Jackson, a twelve year NBA veteran and
former six Man of the Year, is joining the Philadelphia seventy.

Speaker 7 (01:07:29):
Six ers coaching staff. This is according to The Athletic
Back to you, guys.

Speaker 2 (01:07:33):
Hi monse, thank you very much. Yeah, that was bizarre,
And I mean, did he sign a waiverers they'll allow
that to happen. I hope they didn't, because otherwise.

Speaker 3 (01:07:43):
Connor McGregor's sake. I hope he did.

Speaker 2 (01:07:46):
Wow, because Wow, all of.

Speaker 3 (01:07:48):
A sudden, you may be paying for that for Bernie's
new house, and he's going to need a big front
door to fit that head through.

Speaker 7 (01:07:53):
I don't care what I signed.

Speaker 6 (01:07:55):
I'm not expecting McGregor to actually punch me the way
he would punch if he was in the ring.

Speaker 2 (01:08:00):
It was so stunning. I don't know why you would
get him involved in the first place, but that was
not pretty all right. Well, speaking of knockout punches, a
lot of people believe that by winning two games in
Miami that the Nuggets have delivered the knockout punch and
they're going to wrap it up tomorrow at home. But
if you're the Miami Heat, if you're Eric Spolster, and

(01:08:22):
he's a pretty smart coach, all you have to remind
your team of, as you had to Denver for Game five,
is what happened in the Eastern Conference Finals. Game three
of the Eastern Conference Finals in Miami. The Boston Celtics
didn't just lose to go down three games to none,
they quit, At least according to just about everybody that

(01:08:44):
watched that game. It was over. Game four in Miami
sweep done. Number Magic Johnson said, in my forty four
years in this league, I never envisioned the time when
I would see a seventeen time champion like the Celtics
on the court. The next thing you know, Boston is

(01:09:04):
hosting a Game seven. Yep, and unlike what Boston was
trying to do having never happened before, what Miami is
trying to do has happened before, and it happened against
the team with the greatest regular season of all time.

(01:09:25):
The Cleveland Cavaliers are down three games to one, and
they go back to Golden State for Game five, figuring
it's over right wrong. Cavs beat them, went home, evened up,
the series, went back to Golden State, and one again

(01:09:47):
two out of three. Now you're saying, well, this team
doesn't have Lebron James, Okay, but also the Heat are
not playing a team that was seventy three and nine
in the regular season. So I'm not going to say
Miami will win this series. But a team that's already
gotten this far as an eight seed, I can't see

(01:10:09):
them rolling over. I know one guy that knows that,
and that's Mike Malone. I mean, he is just screaming
at the top of his lungs. We haven't done anything yet.
You got to win four games, So I think that
the heater going to be relaxed. The place is going
to be rocking. But what the heater trying to do

(01:10:29):
to win this series has happened before. Winning two out
of three on the road and sweeping the last three
games has happened. And so I'm not counting this Heat
team out. When you got a special player like a
Jimmy Butler, bam Adebayo has been outstanding in the series,
they just need somebody, somebody else has got to sort
of emerge as a surprise star for this Heat in

(01:10:52):
order for them to win tomorrow's game, because if they
win tomorrow, all bets are off.

Speaker 5 (01:10:56):
Well.

Speaker 3 (01:10:56):
Jimmy has to have a Jimmy game like Jimmy Buckets
is the reason why the Heat are here, and he
still hasn't had that, you know, forty fifty point game
like he's had in virtually every other series in these
playoffs for the Heat where he completely dominates, He carries
the team for a night and it inspires the rest

(01:11:18):
of the roster to play up.

Speaker 2 (01:11:19):
They've got a lot out of their role players.

Speaker 3 (01:11:21):
You mentioned some of the other stars on this starting five,
but you know, even their bench and.

Speaker 2 (01:11:29):
The depth of.

Speaker 3 (01:11:29):
This team has done some great things. So if he
can have a night like that and the Heat maybe
combine that with a little bit of luck. I mean,
this series could be evened out here and all of
a sudden, we may have a game seven four US.
Now that I just said if many many times in
a row, and that's what happens when you get yourself

(01:11:51):
into a hole the way the Heat have. But it,
like you said, it wouldn't be the first time we
ever saw this. And then second of all, it's it's likely.
I don't want to say likely. That's probably untrue because
Nicolo Jokic and Jamal Murray have played unbelievable basketball, and
I don't I see the more likely scenario the Nuggets

(01:12:12):
winning this championship in hoist Ilario O'Brien for the first
time in Denver's forty seven year existence as a franchise.
But I don't rule it out as a possibility. That's
the best way I could phrase it, because Jimmy Butler
is a talented enough player. Eric Spolstra for what an
NBA coach is worth to a team these days, is
a talented enough coach and has been in these circumstances before.

(01:12:36):
And I think the role players around Jimmy Butler, if
they step up, are a talented enough cast of characters
that this is conceivable. I don't think it's likely, but
it's conceivable.

Speaker 2 (01:12:48):
Oh, it's conceivable. It's very conceivable. Because again, the thing
that I loved about Spolstra and really Jimmy Butler throughout
this playoff run for the Heat is their demeanor doesn't
really seem to change win or lose. They just sort
of seemed to be saying, Hey, people have been doubting
us from the first games, so what's changed. Nothing's changed.

(01:13:10):
Our mentality is the same. If we go out and
we can do what we didn't think about it. They
did it in that fourth quarter in Game two on
the road against Denver. They took over the game, and
even the Nuggets had admitt afterwards. We suddenly were prayed
to their game. They completely took us out of our game.
If they could do it once, they can certainly do

(01:13:31):
it again.

Speaker 3 (01:13:32):
All right, Hey, coming up next, I have a theory
about the XFL.

Speaker 2 (01:13:38):
Oh I've been waiting for this. All right, all right,
and again we're talking with you know, Rich Ornberger, remember
of the Alliance of American Football Broadcasting Hall of Fame,
so he knows about these outlier leagues. All Right, Rich
is going to break us all the news, the latest
on the future of the XFL. This is Fox Sports Sunday.
This Steve Harvey, Rich Harberger here, Fox Sports Sunday. We

(01:14:05):
are back in our tiraq dot com studios. All Right, well, Rich,
we've been long awaiting the update on the future of
the XFL, and you have some inside information that you
are now going to share with our vast radio audience.

Speaker 3 (01:14:21):
Well, I don't have any new information on the XFL
outside of what I've read in an article posted by
Sports Illustrated yesterday that the XFL apparently estimated its loss
is at sixty million dollars in its first season of

(01:14:41):
its latest iteration. So this is the first season for
the XFL since twenty twenty, when the week's return was
spoiled by the coronavirus pandemic. Obviously, there was a lot
of pomp and circumstance around this relaunch, with Dwayne the
Rock Johnson involved, who now has controlling interest over the league. However,

(01:15:05):
they have really fouled to make anything nearing what they
projected their revenue would be. In fact, they've gone in
the hole north of sixty million dollars and they're hoping
next year to bring in revenues of one hundred million
or more.

Speaker 2 (01:15:21):
Okay, now I saw this as well. I'm trying to
figure out, all right, you just lost sixty million, right right, right, right,
but we're expected to be making one hundred million of revenue.
How does that work? Well, it's a love and for
my own personal economics, I'd love to know how that works.

Speaker 3 (01:15:37):
It's a long term view, and Dane Dwane Johnson said, look,
you know, my goal was to get through the first season.
This is not just an in Denver that's going to
fill up a portfolio and one day we flip it
and we're out. This is a legacy. This is the
long game. Okay. I want to focus on that for

(01:15:58):
a second. Yeah, because I know what he's saying. I
know that's what he's hoping. But at the end of
the day, Dwayne the Rock Johnson is a businessman and
we were just talking about what happened to Live Golf right,
I Live comes on the scene. They challenge the PGA,

(01:16:19):
They pay players to defect to their league. They open
lawsuits against the league from its new players, its cast
of superstars. The PGA folds into a merger with Live Golf.

Speaker 2 (01:16:33):
What if? What if?

Speaker 3 (01:16:35):
Now I wrote this tweet, I'm gonna read it to
you and I want I want you to respond to this.

Speaker 2 (01:16:39):
Yeah, what if the Saudi.

Speaker 3 (01:16:41):
Public Investment Fund does the same thing to the NFL.
So the Saudi PIF and the XFL they announce a partnership.
They're keeping all the main players in place. Dwayne the
Rock Johnson still has his his role with the XFL,
but they start dumping insane amounts of money into thes
of NFL stars to turn their back on the NFL

(01:17:03):
and join the XFL. And then the XFL and PIF
encourages its new stars to sue the NFL and never
back down because they don't need to, because they can
pay lawyer fees until the end of the world, because
they have a bottomless pit of money. The NFL, in
my opinion, will never go to trial because they're never
gonna want to open their books because they're a nonprofit

(01:17:24):
entity and they've never had to, just like the PGA.
And so what happens. The NFL agrees to merge with
the XFL, which is backed by the PFF PIF just
like the PGA did with Live Golf. It is the
same exact plan, but instead of Phil Mickelson jumping ship
on the PGA to join Live, it's a superstar NFL

(01:17:47):
quarterback defecting to the XFL. And that is the first
domino that falls.

Speaker 2 (01:17:51):
Well, first of all, we've been down this path before,
and that was called the American Football League. Lamar Hunt
was a twenty seven year old son of one of
the wealthiest people in the world, Hl Hunt, and he
was frustrated because he tried to buy his way into
the NFL with a Dallas franchise, and when the NFL
said no, he said, well, the heck with it, I'll
just start my own league. And he had the money,

(01:18:13):
and they were losing gobs of money in the beginning.
Several franchises, the Raiders, the Jets, Titans as they were
then known, had to be subsidized by rich owners like
not only Lamar Hunt, but a young Bud Adams with
the Oilers. They had all this money, young guys because
they were from wealthy families to keep the league alive.
And then what they did was they started buying off

(01:18:36):
NFL players. They started signing NFL players to futures contracts.
This is how the whole merger happened. The NFL had
to wave the flight because they knew that the AFL
had the money.

Speaker 3 (01:18:48):
Yep.

Speaker 2 (01:18:49):
And you know, here's the thing about the XFL, though,
about twenty five percent of their revenue comes from their
parent broadcast company ESPN, and it's very public knowledge nowadays
that Disney, which operates ESPN among other entities, is cutting money.
You know, they're they're they're they're having to make some

(01:19:10):
tough decisions. Without that money, the XFL is not around. So,
like you said, maybe there's an alternate means for them
to get revenue.

Speaker 3 (01:19:22):
Well, imagine paying off Disney and ESPN to back out
of this.

Speaker 2 (01:19:25):
Sure. I mean, look, when you have seven hundred billion
dollars in the conference, I'm just saying you can buy
a lot of things.

Speaker 3 (01:19:32):
If there is an opportunity or an avenue for the
Public Investment Fund, the Saudi Public Investment Fund to do
to the NFL what adjusted to golf, There there's a lane.
And for anybody out there who said, well, this will
never happen to the NFL because all of these owners

(01:19:52):
will never count out, well, hang on, what happens if
all of their dirty laundry is out there on Main Street?
Because all of a sudden, the XFL players, backed by
the Saudi Public Investment Fund, are suing the NFL for mistreatment.
So do you think the owners are going to just
allow their skeletons to come tumbling out.

Speaker 2 (01:20:12):
Of the closet? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (01:20:14):
Or are they together going to say, you know what,
we'll merge with the XFL.

Speaker 2 (01:20:16):
They have the money to do it. They have the
money to do whatever they want to do. Now, speaking
of the NFL, we have the updated news. This is
Fox Sports Sunday, all right, much more to get to
here on a busy Sunday. This is Fox Sports Sunday,
and we are broadcasting live from the tirag dot com studios.
Tyrad dot com. We're gonna help get you there in

(01:20:37):
unmatched selection, fast free shipping. Free road has a protection
over ten thousand recommended installers. Tyrack dot com. The way
tire buying should be. All right, much more coming up
on the NBA Finals rezumes tomorrow in Denver. Now gets
trying to wrap it up there to win their first
ever NBA championship. I also want to get to some golf.

(01:20:59):
The US Open is getting underway this week. We'll get
to that a little bit later on Rich, but I
want to get some NFL news out of the way.
Get your thoughts. One of the big stories this week
in the NFL did not come as a surprise, but
I'm still trying to figure out where this team is
going next. The Minnesota Vikings released Dalvin Cook. This is

(01:21:23):
Dalvin Cook, who has been in the Pro Bowl the
last four years in a row. Over the last four years,
only Derrick Henry has more yards per scrimmage amongst running
backs in the NFL. He's also running back to played
all seventeen games last year, all seventeen games. I know

(01:21:45):
he has a fairly hefty price tag. He has not
even turned twenty eight yet, and based on his availability,
and I know he did suffer a shoulder injury last
year that had it's not as legs. So Dalvin Cook
is still one of the elite running backs in this league.

(01:22:08):
And the Vikings determine that we need to spend our
money elsewhere. So my question to you is is this
a wise move by the Vikings and which teams or
teams should be interested in acquiring Dalvin Cook? And then
I guess the follow up is exactly how do you
use a Dalvin Cook or a running back in general

(01:22:33):
in today's NFL?

Speaker 3 (01:22:35):
Well, all of those are great questions. To start with
the Minnesota Vikings. I think the reason why they moved
on from Dalvin Cook is because, given where they're at
from a payroll standpoint or salary cap standpoint, they don't
see the value in paying ten million dollars to a
running back, which is a lot of money in today's NFL.

(01:22:56):
And the reasons are obvious because we see this year
after year. There are running backs who appear to come
from obscurity, undrafted free agents, guys who were scrapped heaped
by a different team, come to a different franchise and
end up having success beyond anything anybody could have foreseen

(01:23:21):
or predicted. You know, lower round draft picks breaking into
the NFL and having unbelievable seasons. This happens routinely. You know.
Bygone are the days where teams you know, typically spend
high round draft picks on running backs. Although I say
that and two running backs went within the first twelve

(01:23:42):
picks of this year's NFL draft. We could get to
that in a moment. But focusing on Dalvin Cook and
where he goes next and how he's going to be utilized,
I think it's going to be very similar to how
Christian McCaffrey was utilized by the San Francisco forty nine ers.
They had this space in their payroll, they brought him aboard,
and they found a way to highlight him not only

(01:24:02):
in the run game, but also in the passing game
because he's such a talented receiver. Dalvin Cook not nearly
the receiver Christian McCaffrey is, but but is a talented
receiver and can threaten you in the passing game. And
also we've seen what he's done on the ground year
after year for the past four seasons. So I think
whatever team picks him up is probably going to try

(01:24:23):
to get him for a bargain, Maybe get him to
restructure his contract compared to what he's worth right now
in free agency, or you know, pay some of that
money upfront and guarantees and get his get his h hit.
What he's what he's doue this year in terms of
his salary down this way, it doesn't affect his next

(01:24:44):
team salary cap as much, and then they're going to
try to use him similarly to how the San Francisco
forty nine ers used Christen McCaffrey. We'll see if all
that happens, but I think I think two things about
this story. I think one which what ever team ends
up signing Dalvin Cook is going to be very happy
with the signing, assuming they don't overpay him and he

(01:25:06):
stays healthy. The other thing I feel about this is
the NFL is just heading in a different direction where
typically the only big contracts you see running backs get
typically are going to be the first contract they get
in the draft, and after that it's been somewhat devalued.
Unless you're Dereck Henry and you know you're the exception.

Speaker 2 (01:25:26):
Well, and let's see what happened with Ezekiel Elliott, right,
the Cowboys gave him all that money and got very
diminished returns. There's another story that's a big story in
terms of running backs. The league's leading rusher, Josh Jacobs,
has yet to sign his franchise tag agreement with the Raiders,
and he's trying to get a deal done by July fifteenth,

(01:25:47):
and with Dalvin Cook on the open market, it is
conceivable that the Raiders could withdraw their franchise tag offer
to Josh Jacobs go and try to bring in a
Dalvin Cook at less money. If you're Josh Jacobs, so

(01:26:08):
under the franchise tag he could make ten million guarantee
fully guaranteed in twenty twenty three and a twenty percent
raise the following year, or you know, apply for free agency.
And that's that's a lot of money for any running
back out there. I agree with you, Rich, it's it's
it's a very precarious situation. Austin Eckler prime example of

(01:26:28):
this with the Chargers, you know who was just a
gem for the Chargers. Undrafted rookie has been a highly
productive running back and the best thing you could get
out of the Chargers were a little few more incentives
in his contract. You know, if you do well, we'll
pay you a little bit more money. He had zero leverage.

Speaker 3 (01:26:45):
Well I was, I was saying this yesterday. Look at
a running back, for example in the NFL today, like
a good season for running back is thousand yards, you know,
something north of a five yard or I should say
north of a four yard per tarry stat line. You know, honestly,

(01:27:06):
that even has diminished in its importance. It's really how
many yards you can gain after contact. I think some
of the more advanced analytics on the running backs are
the more reliable analytics. But I digress to prove the
point that when you are relying on a run game,
the yards that you can gain per touch are so
much inferior to those that you can gain per touch

(01:27:29):
in the passing game. Like a good season for a receiver,
instead of it being somewhere hovering around four or five
yards per touch as compared to the run game, it's
something like fourteen or fifteen yards per per catch, you know.
So the value in the NFL, especially the way they've
changed the rules to highlight the pass game, really goes

(01:27:50):
to the receivers. And that's the reason why you're seeing
these absurd contracts. The same thing that happened to running
backs in the nineties is happening to receivers now in
the twenty twenties because the game has changed into a
passing game.

Speaker 2 (01:28:03):
You know, I was thinking about this, and I mentioned
this to Bucky yesterday. So you know how it is
in high school. Go back to your days when you
were the first lineman ever to be named the New
York high school football player of the Year, still the
only one, I think, But I mean when you went
to Penn State, you you were thinking in terms of
being probably a defensive lineman unless you went up against

(01:28:27):
Lomas Brown, and then all of a sudden you realize, Okay,
Levi Brown, Levi Brown, and you realize, well, maybe maybe
this is not where I attend to be, and then
they switch you to offensive line and you became an
All American and then onto the NFL. So if you're
if you have the athletic skills to be a running back,

(01:28:47):
you pretty much have the athletic skills to play any
position on the field.

Speaker 3 (01:28:51):
Yeah, you could argue that.

Speaker 2 (01:28:52):
And so if I'm thinking to myself, all right, my
college guy wants to make me a running back. And
by the way, that also probably means if you're an
elite running back at the collegiate level, you're going to
carry the ball twenty five to thirty times a game.
On top of catching the ball, They're going to use
you a lot, which is gonna limit how much gas

(01:29:12):
is left in your tank when he gets to the
next level. My point being is, if I'm that level
of athlete, I don't know if I really want to
play running back anymore.

Speaker 3 (01:29:21):
Dude, it's changing.

Speaker 2 (01:29:22):
I mean, I don't change. You don't make me. I
want to be a receiver. I want to do a
defensive back, cornerback. I don't want to be running back
because running back, to me offers me probably the shortest
amount of time in the NFL, which in turns means
the least amount of possible money. It's a dying position,

(01:29:42):
and I just wonder, as we continue to evolve with
this position, whether or not we are headed toward extinction.

Speaker 3 (01:29:52):
Well, I think that's probably a step too far down
the roads as of yet.

Speaker 2 (01:29:58):
But what you're saying is true.

Speaker 3 (01:30:00):
If you go to any pee wee or youth league
clinic or practice or game, everybody wants to play wide receiver.
Everyone wants to be a quarterback or a wide receiver.
It used to be everybody wanted to be the team's
running back.

Speaker 2 (01:30:14):
Absolutely.

Speaker 3 (01:30:15):
It used to be that way because every team was
running the option in high school or the zone game
in high school and they wanted to be the star
of that of that team. And typically the passing game,
especially at the youth league level and even at the
high school level, was a run first, play action pass
style offense. Well, that's all changed. That's all changed. Seven

(01:30:38):
on seven football is played everywhere all season, all seasons
during the fall. You're seeing certain high schools never go
under center. They're playing exclusively out of the gun. In fact,
I think within the next decade that's going to be
the majority of teams. And so as a result, with
the diminishment of the old school pro style offense where

(01:30:59):
the run back truly is the feature of the offense.
Even when we got away from you know, the the fullback,
the running back still was the future piece of the offense.
In the zone game, that has dissipated and it's really
turned into your running back has to be equally as
good a pass catcher as he is a ball carrier.
And so I think very soon here you're going to

(01:31:21):
see a steep decline in the talent level at running
back or just you know, sort of what's happened to
the tight end. I mean, tight ends are barely involved
in the blocking game. Anymore outside of you know, say
George Kittle or Rob Gronkowski, who are the rare and
unique birds in all this. I mean, for the most part,
tight ends are wide receivers. I think the same thing

(01:31:43):
is going to happen to the running back position here
pretty soon, because everybody wants to be a wide receiver.
In fact, tight ends now who are so involved in
the passing game, who are on their rookie contract and
the NFLPA, with the help of the NFLPA, they're trying
to fight to have tight ends included in the wide
receiver franchise tag money because they don't want to be

(01:32:05):
tagged like their tight ends anymore. They want to be
tagged like their wide receivers because the majority of their
importance is served in the passing game, in while running
routes and catching footballs. So the point is well founded
and it's well heard here. But I don't know if
that means that we're going to see the extinction of
the running back position. I think what we're going to
see is it sort of morph into what the tight

(01:32:28):
end position has become.

Speaker 2 (01:32:29):
All right. On the other side, I want to get
to a story again out of the NFL and let
let's let's be clear about this. In a team sport,
the pieces have to fit, pieces have to fit. The
teams that find the right formula for the puzzle are
the teams that are most successful. By the way, we're
brought to by Progressive Insurance. Progressive makes bundling easy and affordable.

(01:32:51):
Get a multi policy discount by combining your motorcycle, RV
boat ATVN more all your prediction in one place, Bundle
and save at Progressive dot Com. We're gonna be talking
about a piece, aka a player, whether or or not
he's the right fit for a certain team. Who is it?
Which team are we talking about? This is Fox Sports Sunday,

(01:33:12):
Steve Hartman and Ritchrnberger, Fox Sports Sunday Live from the
tire rack dot Com studios, watching a variety of things here.
By the way, Freddie Freeman, Yeah, just hit a home
run for the Dodgers. This guy awful lefty too. He's uh,
he's sitting in about three point forty this year with power.

(01:33:36):
Pretty talented guy. Uh, he's a Hall of Famer. I
mean what he did in Atlanta, he's done the last
couple of years with the Dodgers. I mean that guy.
He's good. He's really good. One of the reasons. How
about the Arizona Cardinals, I've excuse me, the Arizona Diamondbacks
leading the N West.

Speaker 3 (01:33:58):
Yeah, it's shocking.

Speaker 2 (01:33:59):
I mean because I told you I was just in Phoenix,
you know, on Thursday and Friday. And I have to admit,
because I talked to some of the locals at this
celebration of life that I was at, They're like, where
did this come from? This steam lots like one hundred
and ten games a couple of years ago, and they're
in a shock right now. And I said, well, you know,

(01:34:21):
it's funny because I was in San Diego for several
years and the Padres seemingly came out of nowhere. I mean,
from like dead, like nobody going to the ballpark to
a wildly hot ticket. So yeah, we'll see how this
plays out. But the Dodgers are where they are despite
their lack of pitching, thanks to guys like Freddie Freeman. Now,

(01:34:42):
in any sport, rich the pieces have to fit, and
this is the jigsaw puzzle for general managers, for managers,
for coaches, finding the right combination of players and franchises
that are successful long periods of time very simply have
been able to master the puzzle fitting better than others.

(01:35:06):
And the New England Patriots have obviously been that with
Bill Belichick, they've been able to plug in the right
pieces and eliminate the bad pieces quickly. We've said this
many times. One of the great parts of the Patriots'
success over the years is recognizing mistakes yep, and eliminating

(01:35:27):
them immediately, whether it was a high draftic high price
free agent. If they feel like this is a bad fit,
they don't try to force it in, like I'm convinced
this is gonna fit. It's not gonna fit, and they unload.
And that's how they operate, and that's how they stayed
where they are. So DeAndre Hopkins is going to visit
with the Patriots, and there's so many different storylines. Bill

(01:35:50):
O'Brien is now the offensive coordinator. This is the same
Bill O'Brien who's head coach and general manager dumped DeAndre
Hopkins at the top of his game yep. And then
on top of that, when you hear about d hop
he's not a practice guy like he was a guy
that and maybe this was a frustration with Bill O'Brien

(01:36:11):
is that d hop was a gamer, and maybe we
wouldn't practice all the time or didn't practice at a
high level. And when you that can be very frustrating
for coaches, but for someone like yourself that knows all
too well how the New England Patriots operate. Because here's
the thing about d hop some of the other teams

(01:36:31):
that you're talking about, you don't talking about the Bills
and the Chiefs, And you know, he might be the
second or third option in New England. He could be
the number one.

Speaker 3 (01:36:39):
Option, Oh no question.

Speaker 2 (01:36:41):
I mean he would be better certainly than anyone they
have on their current roster. But in a need where
they're competing against you know, the high flying Jets now
with Aaron Rodgers, certainly a team on the upswing, the Dolphins,
the Bills are the Bills. Do you think that the
Patriots may been the rules a little bit in order

(01:37:02):
to accommodate a talent like DeAndre Hopkins, hoping that his
game would help them win additional games. Will they make
exceptions or would he have to play the normal game
in order to be a New England Patriot.

Speaker 3 (01:37:17):
No, they absolutely would make us exceptions. And I think
that's actually a little bit, and it's not your fault
because I think you sort of outlined what the New
England Patriots are and what they aren't perfectly, you know.
I think they are pretty ego lists. And this is
all really around Bill Belichick and his vision of what

(01:37:38):
success looks like in terms of if they sign a
bad contract, or if they sign even a good contract,
they'd rather cut ties earlier than later. Whereas like in
terms of a good contract, a player may even still
have a good season or two left in New England,
but they're going to get rid of him before he'st

(01:38:00):
it's rotting on the vine, you know. So we've seen
this many times before with superstars with the New England
Patriots who were traded or they were released because the
thought process in New England was this is an aging
veteran and we need to start cultivating the next iteration
of that position group otherwise we're going to get old
really fast all of a sudden. So we've seen that

(01:38:24):
with good contracts end bad like you described. However, when
when some of these contracts are minted, like where they
bring in an aging veteran free agent who still has
some tread left on the tires. They will accommodate that player.
They'll accommodate that player. When during my time there, it
was Randy Moss, and if Randy needed a day, if

(01:38:45):
he needed a VET day where he needed to be
out there in sweats instead of practicing, he would get
a VET day. You know, if a guy, you know,
all of a sudden kind of had a lingering lower
back situation going on, where you know, whenever it sparks up,
he can go into the training room and get a
massage and then watch practice for a day. Yeah, I mean, like,

(01:39:07):
I'm sure the coaching staff knows what's that all about.
But there's a legitimate excuse. There's a quote unquote injury there,
and you have a veteran player who understands how to
get ready for the game, but isn't putting themselves through
the riggers of practice to save themselves for a game day.
I saw that stuff happen my entire time in New England,

(01:39:29):
and it still happens to this day. So Bill Belichick
he gets labeled as this tyrant, and really he's a
player's coach, he really is. He understands how physical the
game is. He understands how certain players are better game
players than they are practice players, and he makes those
accommodations for certain players. So if DeAndre Hopkins is interested

(01:39:51):
in playing in a place where obviously you're gonna work
really hard and it's gonna be one voice and one
vision at the top and everybody has to do it
the quote unquote Patriot way, if he can do it
that way, well, I don't think that the practice schedule
is going to be the reason why they can't make
this work.

Speaker 2 (01:40:08):
You know, it's interesting you mentioned that about Belichick, and
really I would say that would be a common denominator
for all successful coaches. John Wooden, Yeah, I remember talking
to coach Woulden several times about different personalities that he
had to work with, especially during the late sixties early seventies,
right it was it was a time of college unrest,

(01:40:28):
you know, with all the protests and everything else. And
his two biggest stars, Leuel Cinder became Kareem abdul Jabbar
and Bill Walt, were very strong minded, very bright young
guys there were very much a part of their time,
and so he admitted that, you know, in order for
them to focus on what he needed them to focus on,

(01:40:49):
along with school obviously was basketball that he had to,
you know, sort of play to their personalities. Let be
who they wanted it right, And he goes, look, there
were some guys that you need to coddle and there
are other guys where you need to kick him the ass.
And you have to play everybody differently. You have to
understand each individual person. I know two people are alike

(01:41:12):
and what makes them tick, what gets them going, And
it sounds like Belichick certainly has that all right. On
the other side, I want to get We were talking
a little bit about the AFC East. Are we all
on a cord right now? It could be. Bob Kraft
said it was the toughest division. By the way, your
patriots only have been given an eight percent chance to

(01:41:34):
win the AFC East. When is the last time that happened?
Percent chance of winning the AFC East? But I want
to stay with the AFC East. But first let is
find out what is trending right now. Matzie, you always
have struck me as a very self motivated individual. I mean,

(01:41:54):
were you raised with someone kicking you in the butt
to get you going or were you always self motivated?

Speaker 6 (01:42:00):
My brothers definitely kicked me in the butt.

Speaker 2 (01:42:02):
Real.

Speaker 7 (01:42:02):
Yes, they were much older than me, so but you.

Speaker 6 (01:42:06):
Were self motivated, Yeah, but I think it was following
them too.

Speaker 5 (01:42:10):
You know.

Speaker 6 (01:42:10):
They were very active, they played club sports, they had
One of my brothers had like a job very early
on because he wanted to buy his own car when
he was like seventeen.

Speaker 2 (01:42:19):
Wow.

Speaker 6 (01:42:19):
Yeah, so he was like, my oldest brother is ten
years older, and when he turned eighteen, my dad bought
him like a little car, you know, something super cheap,
just to get him around. And when my other brother,
who's two years younger than him, eight years older than me,
was approaching, you know, eighteen years old, he was like, yeah, no,
I can't drive around a bad car, Dad, I have
to get a good car. Like from the beginning, he
was like, I need something better than what you could

(01:42:41):
offer me. When I turned eighteen, my dad also gave
me a little Nissan Sentra, like all little car to
get me around.

Speaker 7 (01:42:48):
And I didn't even want to drive. When I was eighteen.

Speaker 6 (01:42:50):
I used to be driven around by my mom all
my club sports, and then when I turned eighteen, she
was like, I am done.

Speaker 7 (01:42:55):
You're gonna go get your driver's license.

Speaker 6 (01:42:57):
So on my eighteenth birthday, she made me take my
driving test.

Speaker 2 (01:43:01):
Like it's amazing you mentioned that. All right, all of
my kids, all of my two sons and my youngest me,
my daughter, they weren't all that anxious to get their
drivers Like this was not literally I turned sixteen. I'm like,
that's the day because my birthday's the fourth of July.
With their clothes nowadays, like yeah, sort.

Speaker 7 (01:43:23):
Of yeah, like oh man to try myself.

Speaker 2 (01:43:26):
No, I guess because my daughter has two older brothers,
she never really felt that. I mean I could tell
she was a go give ry of that day. Yeah.

Speaker 6 (01:43:36):
Yeah, I think it was just in our family, you know,
from the beginning. It's all I've ever known some you know,
hustler baby for sure.

Speaker 2 (01:43:43):
Guys.

Speaker 7 (01:43:44):
I just saw a.

Speaker 6 (01:43:45):
Video I was looking right before you cut to me.
It is a YouTuber called mister Beast. He's doing like
a video about this one billion dollar yacht.

Speaker 7 (01:43:53):
Here's the thing.

Speaker 6 (01:43:54):
Tom Brady joins him at the end of this video
and they start throwing the football, and the guys like,
all right, let's see if you can hit my drone,
and he starts flying a drone off the yacht and
Tom Brady says, if I get it on the first try.
Maybe I should think about unretiring. He gets it on
the first track. So this was posted yesterday. It's mister

(01:44:15):
Beast is the YouTuber if you want to check it out.

Speaker 7 (01:44:17):
You can also see this one billion dollar yacht. Holy mackerel.

Speaker 2 (01:44:21):
Ops.

Speaker 6 (01:44:22):
I can't even but he does hit it, and he
says that all right. Let's go on to Major League Baseball.
The Dodgers are on the scoreboard thanks to a solo
home run which you mentioned by Freddie Freeman, but the
Phillies are still up. It's four to one top of
the seventh inning in Philadelphia, the Nationals of taking the
lead over the Braves. It's six to two bottom of
the seventh inning. The Mets are still losing to the Pirates.

(01:44:43):
In Pittsburgh, two to one. Top of the eighth inning.
The Royals and the Orioles.

Speaker 7 (01:44:47):
That's hard.

Speaker 6 (01:44:48):
We're tying at one point, but Baltimore is up seven
to three. Top of the seventh inning. The Blue Jays
have scored, but it doesn't matter. Twins still on top.
It's six y four bottom of the fifth inning, the
Rangers taking on the best team in baseball the Rays
and Tampa Bay is up seven to three. Bottom of
the seventh, Marlins have scored first against the White Sox.
It's one zero. They're about to start the sixth inning.

(01:45:08):
How about this guy is the A's. This is not
a typo. The A's have won four in a row.

Speaker 2 (01:45:13):
What going on here?

Speaker 6 (01:45:16):
They've won four in a row and they just took
the lead over the Brewers. Seth Brown hit a three
run homer in the fourth inning. I mean it took
eleven pitches, but he got it. And the A's are
beating the Brewers four to two. In Milwaukee, bottom of
the fifth, the Cardinals up on the Reds three to two.
They're about to start the sixth inning. And the Rockies
have scored first against the Padres. It's one zero, top

(01:45:37):
of the second inning. Two games have finished today. The
Diamondbacks have now won officially six in a row. The
Tigers have lost nine in a row. Arizona had to
score four runs in the ninth inning, but they beat
Detroit seven to five, and the Guardians this shout out
the Astros at home five zero. Shane Bieber pitched seven innings,
only gave up three hits, and struck out nine in

(01:45:58):
the victory.

Speaker 7 (01:45:59):
Back to you guys.

Speaker 2 (01:46:00):
By the way, every time I check my Twitter accounts
uh and again, you can follow us at Ormberger, at
Cannon Hartman, at Moncey Belanas. By the way, cor I
always I look down and like comments Moncey is the best.
That's all I get. I get. I get a lot
of Moncey is the best, Moncey, this Moncey that not

(01:46:21):
much about you and.

Speaker 7 (01:46:22):
Me rich, but a lot because we already know you're
the best.

Speaker 2 (01:46:25):
I don't know, but I usually not what I hear,
although somebody last week I believe, said that I was
the Let me see if I can find actually, you.

Speaker 3 (01:46:36):
Know what I'm thinking to myself. I've never actually been
called the best. I've been called the worst. Oh yeah
on Twitter.

Speaker 2 (01:46:41):
No, here was one somebody said, I'm talking about Austin
Reeves and that potential hundred million dollar deal, and someone
said Reeves the unsung hero of the Lakers, like Hartman
is to f s R. I had to do a
double take. I was like, is that actually a compliment?
I can't read all the negative things here because frankly,

(01:47:04):
I can't read them on the on the devil. Yeah,
so there's a lot of that to believe me exactly.
That's exactly that. All right, Moncie, thank you very much.
Checking with you a little bit later on. All right,
we were talking a little bit about the Patriots whether
or not de Hop would be a nice move for them.
Anything would be an upgrade, certainly with a receiving corps,

(01:47:24):
that's for sure help out Mac Jones and Bill O'Brien
with that offense. But there's one team that is pretty
well set right now in terms of their offense, and
that is the New York Jets with the addition of
Aaron Rodgers. So Aaron Rodgers came out this week saying
this is the most fun he's had in years. He
showed up for every single day of OTAs everyone didn't

(01:47:47):
miss a single one. Now, he had what was it,
a little injury there for a while, missed a couple
of practices, but he was still there. So how does
that translate to you in terms of what we're actually
going to see on the field. By the way, he
will turn forty during this season. All this enthusiasm. If

(01:48:07):
you're a Jets fan, like if you're Jason Smith, you
know lives and Breeze, Jets football is the enthusiasm coming
out of Aaron Rodgers' mouth translate into huge I mean,
expectations are obviously there, but will translate into huge success
on the field in twenty twenty three.

Speaker 3 (01:48:30):
I think that I think that Aaron Rodgers, when surrounded
with talented players in healthy is one of those players
still who tilts things dramatically in the direction of success,
and will with the New York Jets, again, assuming health,

(01:48:51):
will have one of those seasons we look back on
and we say to ourselves, like, yeah, this is all
that was missing. Like what we said all throughout the
twenty twenty two season was accurate, that the Jets really
need a starting quarterback, really need a guy who can
get the football to his playmakers consistently and accurately, who

(01:49:13):
understands the offense, who can help add some wrinkles to
the offense, to teach and to motivate like a veteran
quarterback can that. You know, Frankly, it's not his fault,
but at this young point of his progression, Zach Wilson
couldn't do, Joe Flacco didn't have enough left to really do,
and Mike White couldn't as well. I mean, those are

(01:49:34):
your three starting quarterbacks in New York last year. It
just wasn't gonna happen. But with Aaron Rodgers, I mean,
regardless of what anybody thinks of him personally, and a
lot of people can't separate how they feel about him
personally from the player himself, is inarguably still a top
five performer in the NFL when he has a surrounding

(01:49:56):
cast that's worth their salt, and when he's healthy. And
that's plain and simple. That is an accurate statement.

Speaker 2 (01:50:04):
By the way, the Jets are one of three teams
that have said no, no, no, no, no to hard knocks. Yeah,
apparently there's only one team that hasn't said no. Maybe
the NFL will say no, and that's the Commanders, which
is a very awkward situation with a transition and ownership
and everything else. So the Jets are the team we

(01:50:25):
want to see, right, So if you're the Jets and
the NFL steps in and said, all right, we know
you don't want to do this, but we need you.
You need to do this, And if I'm the Jets,
I'm saying, all right, what's our trade off? In other words,
if we're going to do you a favor by exposing
ourselves and Hard Knocks. What are you going to give
us in return? Let's say a deal gets done. If

(01:50:48):
you're the Jets and obviously Hard Knocks won, it says
much of Aaron Rodgers as humanly possible. How would you
handle that in terms of accommodating the producers? Are hard
Knocks for this Jets team? Listen?

Speaker 3 (01:51:08):
I feel like hard Knocks unless uh it's it's somewhat
run its course.

Speaker 2 (01:51:16):
Well got a revival thanks to Dan Campbell.

Speaker 3 (01:51:18):
Yeah, okay, so that's the only time Hard Knocks is
successful anymore. If there's a head coach who can really
keep the thing.

Speaker 2 (01:51:27):
Afloat, how about Robert Salah. Is he that kind of guy?

Speaker 3 (01:51:30):
I mean, potentially, although I don't think I see it, not,
not quite the way I did with Dan Campbell. Or
for example, the last time the New York Jets were
on I believe it was when Rex Ryan was a
head coach.

Speaker 2 (01:51:39):
I told you I went to Courtland for that one.

Speaker 3 (01:51:41):
I was actually there, and I think I think he
did a great job keeping it entertaining Dan Campbell the same.
I mean, that's what hard knocks. That's what I've found
out that Hard Knocks relies on now because if you
want access to players during social during excuse me, training camp,
just go to social media. All those clips are posted
throughout throughout a camp. Like, you know, guys, it's not

(01:52:02):
like they're entering solitary confinement or or being jailed. Like,
they still have their cell phones. They can still interact
and tweet and put out Instagram videos and TikTok videos,
and so we have that kind of insight now that
we didn't frankly have when Hard Knocks first launched. But
what Hard Knocks needs is a coach. They need the

(01:52:25):
coach to be the character. So I mean, I don't know,
maybe maybe Pete Carroll, Maybe maybe he's an interesting enough
head coach character. I'm certain that people would be fascinated
to see Bill Belichick if he were to welcome in
the Hard Knocks camera.

Speaker 2 (01:52:41):
Dennis Allen and New Orleans.

Speaker 3 (01:52:43):
I don't, I mean, I winn't you know, probably not.

Speaker 2 (01:52:48):
No, that's not a draw. Well it's a conundrum, right,
how about Denver?

Speaker 3 (01:52:53):
How about Sean Payton?

Speaker 2 (01:52:54):
Absolutely know, well, these are these are names, these are
recognizable names.

Speaker 3 (01:52:58):
And that's my point is, like, if Hard Knocks is
going to work, they're going to have to attach themselves
because we don't hear from coaches on social media all
that often. We hear from players all the time. But
Mike McDaniel with the Miami Dolphins is a fascinating character. Yeah, like,
get him on hard knocks. I think you would be
going the wrong direction if you were going to say, hey,

(01:53:19):
we're going to do hard knocks, but we're going to
be reliant on these player profiles. You can't do it
that way anymore. You need access to a unique head
coach or a famous head coach that people are really
excited to get inside. The mind of Andy Reid is
another one. I think the Kansas City Chiefs would be
a good example.

Speaker 2 (01:53:37):
Especially after his commercial is drawing mustaches on people on airlines.

Speaker 3 (01:53:41):
Yeah. Yeah, I just think that they're going in the
wrong direction.

Speaker 2 (01:53:45):
Oh I speaking of wrong direction in the NBA, I'm
thinking of a team that may be going in the
wrong direction if they were to pursue a certain player.
Tell you who that is. This is Fox Sports Sunday,
Steve Harbin and Rich Hornberger Fox Sports Sunday. We are
live from the Tyraq dot Com studios. So, after the

(01:54:11):
Lakers were swept by the Denver Nuggets in the Western
Conference Finals. Lebron James was asked about what do you
think about next season? And his response I thought was
pretty on the mark when he said, well, I don't
even know what our roster is going to look like,
so I have no idea. I mean, I don't know,

(01:54:31):
which was his way of saying to the Laker organization,
where our roster is now, is not good enough to
beat that team, the Denver Nuggets. Yeah, so that's the
bar right now in the hurdle the Lakers are gonna
have to get over if they want to win a championship,
which Lebron says that's the only thing that matters to him,
and I love when he says something like that. So

(01:54:55):
now there's all this buzz that the Phoenix Suns are
about to part ways with Chris Baul eight years old.
So he's had a Hall of Fame career minus a championship,
but he's been a great, great player, and he's still
an elite player when he's actually healthy and on the court.
But there's all this buzz. You know, Chris Paul could
be a Laker, And I'm thinking to myself, if you're

(01:55:15):
the Lakers. Is Chris Paul going to help you neutralize Jokic?
I'm sorry, I mean I get the idea that it's
nice to have or a real point guard, and maybe
it relieves some of the offensive pressure on Lebron to
have to be the ball handler on top of everything else,
or maybe he helps the game of Anthony Davis. That's

(01:55:37):
not your problem, though. What the Lakers have to figure
out is what we need to get past Jokic, And
all I say is what happened three years ago. Now,
I understand Denver was a much younger team, but the
one guy that was not covering Jokics three years ago
is Anthony Davis. Right, you had McGee and he had
Dwight Howard. You had this, you know, two big guys

(01:56:00):
handling the big guy under the mill. So if I'm
the Lakers right now, Chris Paul, are you kidding? You
need bigs? One thing that we're finding out about this
Denver Nuggets team why they're so good. They're big. I mean,
they're skilled, but they're really big. So if I'm the Lakers,
forget Chris Paul. Chris Paul is not going to do

(01:56:22):
anything for you in terms of what you want to
win is a championship. I just I they need to
focus on getting some big body. Look you bring Reeves back, Hatchamura.
That's fine. Those two guys have proven they are valuable
assets to your team. But you need some bigs man
if you want to even come close to challenging the

(01:56:43):
Denver Nuggets.

Speaker 3 (01:56:45):
I mean, I don't disagree with you, but I will
I will say this. There's more than one ways to
handle this situation. I do think that getting bigger can work.
And I don't know if Chris Paul is the answer
to this question, so I have doubts that as well.
But sometimes the best way to stop a great offense

(01:57:05):
is to outscore them, you know, like sometimes the answer
is just to add to your offensive firepower. And it
feels like the Lakers aren't thinking in terms of like
how do we defend Nikola Jokic. They're more thinking along
the lines of how can we become so consistent offensively
that it doesn't matter that Jokic can get his thirty

(01:57:29):
or his forty against us? And we have good enough defenders,
but most importantly, a great enough offense to outscore the Nuggets.
I feel like it's an arms race in the NBA,
and a lot of teams are going to go in
that direction because the truth is, you can't really defend
Jokic if he stays healthy, six foot ten, six foot eleven.

(01:57:52):
He's got great court vision, he has great handles, he
can shoot the jumper. You know, he's really a complete player.
He's fundamentally sound in every way. He's good at the
foul line. There's really no weaknesses there. So let him
get his defend the rest of the cast members, but
most importantly, become an offensive juggernaut. That's the only way

(01:58:13):
to contend with the Nuggets. And so that's the reason
I think you're hearing reports of the Lakers interested in
adding offensive players as opposed to adding a big who
can effectively defend Jokisch.

Speaker 2 (01:58:25):
Well, imagine also this part though you're adding another old body. Yeah,
you know, Lebron obviously is already there. And if you're
Darvin Ham, the coach of the Lakers, you got to
play this juggling act and you got to figure out
how to keep Anthony Davis on the court when the
games matter most. Now, let's throw in Chris Paul, so
it'd be a juggling act with these three guys to
at least keep one or two of them on the

(01:58:47):
court at all times to navigate through the regular season
so you don't end up as a sixth seed or
a seventh seed where you can actually get some you know,
home court advantage in the playoffs. You want to be,
you know, a top three seed. Well, you're only going
to do that if you win let's say, I don't know,
fifty five games, and it's gonna be hard to do
if you're juggling a lineup where Lebron and Ad and

(01:59:07):
Chris Paul are constantly in and out of the lineup.
I again, you have a clear bar. Now you know
what you have to do. You just face this team
on the Western Conference Finals, and even though you played hard,
I mean, the Lakers were competitive in that series. They were,
but they weren't good enough. And that was the point
Lebron was making, is I'm not saying we didn't show effort,

(01:59:29):
because we did. They're just better than us. If you
clean it to get better.

Speaker 3 (01:59:33):
And look at that series and compared to that effort,
the heat have shown like the Lakers looked like they
could contend better. He obviously won a game here and
you know, you could say, Luk, I don't know if
I necessarily completely agree with that, because Jimmy Butler is
an excellent player, and you know, any team can get
hot from the three point line here and there, But

(01:59:55):
the point being, and also they had an enormous high,
enormously high three point percentage in the regular season and
throughout the postseason, so it aligned with what we've seen.

Speaker 2 (02:00:05):
But yeah, if the Lakers are.

Speaker 3 (02:00:07):
Gonna beat the Nuggets, assuming the Nuggets keep everything the
same next year, they're going to have to add and frankly,
I think offense is the better, better side of the
ball to add to.

Speaker 2 (02:00:17):
Much more coming up. This is Fox Sports Radio covering
it all here on a very busy sports Sunday, Fox
Sports Sunday, and we are broadcasting live from the ti
rack dot Com studios tyrack dot com. We're gonna help
get you there and unmatched selection, fast reshipping, free road
hads a protection over ten thousand recommended installers, tire rack

(02:00:37):
dot com the way tire buy in should be. Before
the Conference finals in the NBA, we had the potential
of a Lakers Celtics NBA Finals. I remember we were
thinking ourselves the worst case scenario is if they both
lose and we end up with the Nuggets in the Heat. Well,

(02:00:58):
the TV ratings are in and there's good news for
the NBA. The ratings so far for this Nuggets Heat
series are almost identical to last year's matchup between the
Warriors and the Celtics. It really is no difference, Rich.
I mean, the numbers are in terms of television ratings,

(02:01:19):
the number of viewers, and by the way, they're both
significantly up from where they were in twenty twenty one
with the Bucks Sun series. Of course, that bubble situation
down there was a disaster in twenty twenty because they're
going up against the NFL. And yes, we're not talking
about the great numbers that we saw maybe when the
Cavaliers and the Warriors are getting together. But there's been

(02:01:42):
no significant drop off, is what I'm trying to say,
which is good for the NBA. They had to be worried.
You eliminate the Celtics, you eliminate the Lakers. Those are
two big, big time basketball markets. So I think there's
a lot of intrigue in terms of scenes something new.
But I'll tell you this, if the Heat do win tomorrow,

(02:02:05):
I think these numbers are going to go up significantly
because I've always said this about you know, ratings for
you know, World Series or NBA Finals or whatever. Really
they take on their own life. If there's something compelling
happening in the series, then people are starting to talk
about it and they're like, man, I haven't really been watching.

(02:02:25):
Let me find out what's going on.

Speaker 3 (02:02:27):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:02:28):
So I still think there's a potential here to go
to a much higher level. But at least the idea
that somehow Nuggets Heat were going to be a ratings
disaster has proven to be wrong. It is not, by
any stretch of the imagination, been a disaster.

Speaker 3 (02:02:46):
No, I agree, and I think there were certain analysts
or writers who were counting on it, and I've seen
some headlines that don't really jibe with what we're seeing,
you know, where it's like NBA Finals numbers way down
from last year, and then you look at it and
you're like, three percent is way down. No, you know,

(02:03:08):
we're not talking about heroically bad ratings here. We're talking about,
you know, per the NBA over the course of the
past two decades. This is way down from where they were,
say in the early two thousands or the nineties, but
it's not way down from last year. And to your point,
with Golden State in and Boston in last year, those

(02:03:30):
being much larger media markets. The thought process was, well,
you know, all of the predictive measures tell us that
this is going to be a far worse rated Finals,
and it hasn't been because I think, and myself included,
a lot of people missed a very important thing. Yeah,
Denver and Miami are two smaller media markets. We're talking

(02:03:53):
about probably the sixteenth and seventeenth ranked media markets in
the country.

Speaker 2 (02:03:58):
But like, Denver isn't just Denver.

Speaker 3 (02:04:01):
Denver is basically like the state of Colorado and some
of the surrounding areas. You know, Miami isn't just Miami
or Fort Lauderdale. It's also like a big majority of
Florida are Heat fans. It's it's it's like there's a
lot more traction in those states rooting for those NBA

(02:04:23):
teams that I think people realize prior to this Finals,
which also may change the way the NBA looks at
Miami and Denver, like these may be way more promotable
markets than they thought prior to this series, and maybe
next year if Jimmy sticks around, and well, obviously Nikola
Jokic and that core if they stay together, which I'd

(02:04:45):
assumed they would, maybe the promotion of those two markets
is more intense because a lot of times it's just
your coastal cities like La with the Lakers, Boston, New
York with the Knicks whenever they have any talent, Oaklyn
with the Nets. You know, these markets are the ones
that are highlighted. We may see sort of a shift

(02:05:06):
in the way this league is promoted.

Speaker 2 (02:05:08):
Denver's an interesting sports city and I know we have
listeners out in the Denver area, and they've had a
lot of history. The Broncos obviously have won three Super Bowls.
They had the back to back with Elway and of
course the added Super Bowl win against Carolina in Peyton
Manning's last game. And the Avalanche have won three Stanley Cups,

(02:05:28):
including a year ago they were Stanley Cup champions. I'm
just trying to figure out because you played for a franchise,
the Patriots, that was always the weak link in Boston.
I mean, the Patriots are last on the total pole
for many many years, obviously had the Celtics, the Red Sox,
even if they weren't winning World Series. Back in the day,

(02:05:50):
were simply Boston's team, and the Bruins were highly popular
although they had not won a lot of championships. The
Patriots always last, and then that all changed with their dominance.
I'm curious to see. I mean, I don't know enough
about Denver where the Nuggets rank, but obviously adding a

(02:06:11):
championship to the resume is gonna help immensely. Well, I'll
give you.

Speaker 3 (02:06:16):
I'll give you an example that I think can we
can draw parallels to, like Arizona. The state of Arizona
feels very similar in some ways to me to the
state of Colorado. Now I've lived in Arizona, I've never
lived in Colorado. When I was living in Arizona, what
I found was whatever sports franchise within the state, pro

(02:06:39):
sport franchise within the state that was most popular, having
the most success, the fans were most interested in that
sports franchise. Like there wasn't like this. You wouldn't describe
Arizona or the greater Phoenix area as like a football city.
It's just not. It's whatever sport is having the most success,

(02:07:00):
that's the kind of city it is. And Colorado feels
like that to me. So when the Broncos are great,
which they've been more so than the other sports franchise, well,
guess what, they're gonna get the most attention. But if
the basketball team's great, they're gonna get the most attention
if the hockey teams, you know. Like so that to
me is it's that's the type of market it is.

(02:07:22):
And I kind of feel that way about Miami too, frankly.
I mean, when the Dolphins are good, they'll fill up
that stadium. When they're bad, that it will be a
ghost town. And there are certain places that aren't like that.
Obviously Green Bay, Wisconsin, they're coming out to root on
their packers, win loser draw. Those tickets are sold out
for years in advance. That's a football city. That's not

(02:07:45):
That's not what Miami is. That's not what Denver is.
That's not what a city like Phoenix is. They're a hey,
we're gonna root for the popular hot team right now,
and in Denver right now, especially after disappointing Broncos, and
it's the Nuggets.

Speaker 2 (02:08:02):
You know. You mentioned Phoenix and I was just there
last a couple of days ago, actually yesterday. But think
about Phoenix. You have the Coyotes, they've never won a
Stanley Cup. You have the Arizona Cardinals, they never won
a Super Bowl. Yep. You have the Phoenix Suns, they've

(02:08:22):
never won an NBA championship. The only team that won
a championship was the Arizona Diamondbacks. They won that one
World Series in two thousand and one. That's it. Yep,
it's interesting how that works Denver. Like I said, I mean,
the Avalanche have certainly had success. The Broncos obviously have
had success, the Rockies not so much. But yeah, it

(02:08:45):
will be interesting to see. And when I hate the
term bandwagon, bandwagon is just a normal state of mind people.
I never hold it against any so called fan when
they're a bandwagon fan. Somehow the purists say, well, you know,

(02:09:05):
I I stick with his team good or bad. Good
for you, good for you. But that doesn't diminish the
idea that someone could join the party.

Speaker 3 (02:09:14):
Yeah, like that would be to me like like hating
on the guy who won a bunch of money at
a hot blackjack table.

Speaker 2 (02:09:23):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 3 (02:09:23):
Like you know, it's like, okay, I get it. Maybe
they didn't sit through eight shoes like the degenerate on
the end of the bench.

Speaker 2 (02:09:31):
Right, like he earned it? Yeah, like yeah like it?

Speaker 3 (02:09:34):
Well, well he had to eat some bad hands until
you know, the dealer they changed dealers and the pit
boss came over, and but.

Speaker 2 (02:09:42):
Yeah, who cares? Who cares?

Speaker 3 (02:09:45):
Like jump on in, Like you know, if if you're
riding a hot hand and it's fun and then it's
and it's exciting, who cares how long you were at
the table prior to that that, Like, I completely agree
with you, I think and in most in most sports cities,
guess what, the majority of your fans are bandwagon fans,
because what are sports if they aren't hope? Right, you're

(02:10:09):
pitching hope. You're hopeful that the team does good in
the draft. Then you're hopeful that the team has a
good offseason or spring training, you know, or preseason. Then
you're hopeful that the team is ready for the regular
season and nobody gets hurt. And then you're hopeful that
they're gonna make the playoffs, and then you're hopeful that
they're gonna make the super Bowl. When all of a sudden,
your hopes are crushed because a team is absolutely out

(02:10:29):
of it by the time the all star break hits
in Major League Baseball or in the NBA and it
looks like they're tanking for the draft, or in the NFL.
You know they're off to a three or an zero
to three start and it looks like the playoffs hopes
are sailing away at first. Blush, what you're gonna throw
good money after bad? Save up your dough, go watch

(02:10:50):
a game when hope is renewed. I completely agree with you, man.
I think attacking a sports fan because they're not there
for the down times two is like the opposite of what.

Speaker 2 (02:11:02):
You should do should You should hope.

Speaker 3 (02:11:04):
That those fans show back up to create a raucous
environment for your opponents when the team starts having their resurgence.

Speaker 2 (02:11:14):
The best thing I ever saw, and I've mentioned this before,
was the La Kings hockey team back in twenty twelve
when they eventually went on to win their first Stanley Cup.
And they had this huge bus and you could see
it all over town and on the side it said
the La Kings Bandwagon. And I'll never get this because
we were doing our show from the same studios that

(02:11:34):
we are here and they parked this thing right out front.
I was doing the show with Pat O'Brien and pack
gets on this bus because they wanted to show us
this huge bus, beautiful bus, and they said welcome to
the bandwagon. And he didn't understand. He's sort of like, no, no, no,
I've been rooting for you guys. I'm like, no, you
literally are on the bandwagon. It says it on the

(02:11:54):
side of the bus. It says the La Kings Bandwagon.
They embraced it, they didn't fight it. I thought it
was brilliant marketing. And the idea is, Hey, we're going
to bring new fans in, people that haven't even known
we were alive, and now that we're winning something, they
want to be a part of it. Everyone does, so
it'll be interesting. The Nuggets. It's a golden opportunity. It's

(02:12:16):
a franchise that has had a lot of great individual players.
But the other part of this was they kept this
nucleus together for a few years, including their coach, a
little bit of patience, something that not all nbas are
doing these days. I want to get back to something
we've talked about before, not just in the NBA, but

(02:12:37):
coaching in general. In this day and age, a big
money in sports and takeovers by huge money people. Where
do coaches actually sit and how much of a factor
ultimately are they in winning championships? How much credit should
Mike Malone get if the Nuggets actually win this championship
Tomorrow we'll break it down. This is Fox Sports Sunday,

(02:13:00):
Steve Hartman, Rich Ornberger, Fox Sports Sunday Live from the
tai Iraq dot Com studios. Again, I'm checking my Twitter account,
which apparently is just connected to Monsei's whatever. I'm tagged
in with everything with Monsei. But here's the thing they

(02:13:21):
had this this guy said, Ormberger and Hartman can't wait
to flex on social media with their inner Miami hot
pink messy gear. Yeah, like the rest of the followers
are in now. Of course MESSI is going to be
coming to MLS. I was, yeah, I was in LA
when Beckham you know, showed up with a gallop. It

(02:13:44):
was a huge story. I mean, and at least for
one match, everybody showed up. I remember Tom Cruise was
everybody was there, and then not so much. But do
you have a lot of pink gear? I'm gonna ask
him before I get to Monts Rich, do you do
you sport a lot of pink.

Speaker 3 (02:14:04):
No, and that was at the behest of my wife.
I call it medium, rare or salmon. When I'm wearing pink,
you know, I try to. I try to, you know,
man it up a little bit, but but the the
reality is it's pink, and I think I look devastatingly
handsome in it.

Speaker 2 (02:14:24):
Yeah. And I have actually one pink like dress shirt,
like you know, it's a custom shirt. It is pink.

Speaker 3 (02:14:32):
I've got a pink polo. I think it's a Walker
cup polo that I wear and absolutely love it. But again, yeah,
it much to the chagrin and my wife that I
even have it in the closet and rare do I
ever put it on in her presence because her her
instantaneous commentary is take that off immediately, you look like

(02:14:54):
an idiot. I don't know if it's because I don't
have the complection for the color, or maybe it's my
body type doesn't suit her eye.

Speaker 2 (02:15:02):
Actually, you know, first of all, I don't have to
ask Sam, because I've seen Sam and pink many times.
Sam's Sam's a big wink guy. Actually, I'm wearing pink
right now.

Speaker 3 (02:15:12):
Yeah, you're basically pink all the time.

Speaker 2 (02:15:14):
It's very while Bo is not a pink person at all.
He's a Kelly Green, He's a green guy. Monsy, I'm
sure you're looking at the same picture.

Speaker 7 (02:15:24):
Oh yeah, yeah, no, I I that's it. Buy me one.
I'm wearing that.

Speaker 2 (02:15:27):
You're wearing that got that pink in Miami, hot pig, messy.

Speaker 7 (02:15:31):
Gear, ready ready to rocket. We can switch up your
polo for one of these.

Speaker 2 (02:15:39):
Steve, there's also a first of all, Moncy, nothing's going
to switch up my weekend gear. Yeah. I wear literally
the same thing every Saturday and Sunday, and I never
gonna change.

Speaker 8 (02:15:50):
Steve, aren't you going to jump on the bandwagon of
dressing like Ken from bar There's this thing now, this
trend of dressed like Ken from Barbie and Ken. Well
the movie coming out, Well, the movie Barbie.

Speaker 2 (02:16:00):
Some of the looks really good. The movie looks compelling.
It doesn't. The plot looks cool. It looks stupid. No,
what is it? I mean, I'm trying to figure out
the audience and look at I'm it looks kind interesting.
It's not against Ryan Goslin or.

Speaker 8 (02:16:16):
It's not something I'd usually follow up on. But honestly,
the plot looks sort of interesting, like they're taking out
of their perfect little world and they're thrown.

Speaker 2 (02:16:24):
In this part becoming humanized doesn't really intrigue.

Speaker 5 (02:16:26):
I don't know.

Speaker 6 (02:16:27):
I I think it can be stupid and compelling at
the same time.

Speaker 2 (02:16:30):
Yeah, well, Greta Gerway, who's a very great director. I mean,
I don't know where she's going with this. We'll find out.

Speaker 7 (02:16:37):
Yeah, you know, but I think it could be both.

Speaker 2 (02:16:39):
No, I pink's okay with me. I don't mind the
color pink. I think I think it's good, you know.

Speaker 3 (02:16:45):
I I look the messy jersey. I think it is
going to give you a street credit. Yeah, certainly if
you're planning a trip to South Beach. So if I
ordered it, I'm gonna have to hide it from my
wife otherwise she'll throw it in the trash can. I
have no idea how how much those are going for,
but I'm guessing considering how much inter Miami just paid him,

(02:17:05):
those are probably one thousand dollars jerseys. Yeah, he off
the official i'mlst website.

Speaker 2 (02:17:11):
Well, of course, EMLS coming to San Diego Rich So
I guess eventually you'll be able to see Messi out there.
If he's still playing out there. Hey, I want to
get to this point of it. I don't know about you,
but Michael Malone, Mike Malone, I guess he likes Michael,
like he's like Michael Jordan. Right. So Michael Malone, the
coach of the Denver Nuggets is he's hilarious. Right. Remember

(02:17:33):
when they won Game one of the Western Conference Finals
and he was bitching a moaning that everyone was only
talking about the Lakers. He was saying, you know, we
win the game and all you want to talk about
is the Lakers. Now it's the opposite. All you guys
want to talk about is us, and you don't want

(02:17:54):
to talk about the other team. I've been wildly entertained
by Malone. I mean, this guy has got a loose screw.
He's all over the place. First he's complaining they're not
getting enough attention. Then he's there were getting too much attention.
I also love when he said when they go back
to Denver, I don't want the players reading the newspapers.
How many Denver Nuggets players you think are reading a newspaper?

(02:18:17):
My guess is money. Maybe they're checking out the Internet
and stuff like that.

Speaker 3 (02:18:21):
Yeah, I mean looks but he's trying to find unique
ways to motivate his team, and he's using the press
in order to do it well.

Speaker 2 (02:18:29):
Isn't that really all it comes down to? Now? For
a coach, I mean, in some ways, it's always been
that your job is to win. That's why we hired you.
We hired you to win more games than you lose.
And how you motivate a team, I mean you've seen
it all in your career. Yeah, I mean there's different approaches.
You could be low key, you could be a holler guy,

(02:18:50):
a scream guy. It works for some doesen for others.
But personally, if the Nuggets close it out tomorrow or
eventually do win this series, I give them a long credits.
It's got to be difficult in a day and age
where the players are so handsomely compensated for their play,

(02:19:11):
and I don't begrudge that you get what you whatever
they give you. But I've said this. I was in
the company of Pat Riley as a coach and Phil Jackson,
and the reason they were so successful coaching superstar players
is that they were the biggest ego in the room.
Pat Riley's ego was bigger than magic Johnson and Kareem A.

Speaker 3 (02:19:34):
Dil Jabbar.

Speaker 2 (02:19:35):
Phil Jackson's ego was bigger than Kobe Bryant and Shaquille O'Neal.
I know, and sometimes that's what it takes. And so
you know, I know you're one to quickly dismiss the
impact of these coaches, especially managers in Major League Baseball
and the coaches in the NBA. But it's it's a
different game, and I think at very least give them

(02:19:58):
credit for figuring out whatever takes to motivate their team.
That's where they get the credit.

Speaker 3 (02:20:03):
Well, look, you know, I mean, in the grand scheme
of things, do I think the head coach is as
important as it used to be. No, but does it
have a level of importance absolutely. Managers in Major League
Baseball basically have been replaced by analytics teams who are
printing out lineups for them. Who are, you know, helping

(02:20:23):
in game decision making. Whether or not, you know, the
writers of baseball want to admit it, or they're trying
to maybe even help sustain this falsehood that managers have
some profound impact on the decisions that are made at
the field level.

Speaker 2 (02:20:41):
I don't buy it.

Speaker 3 (02:20:43):
I just I don't think there's a general manager in
Major League Baseball who allow them to have that sort
of power. But in the NBA, the psychology of the
locker room and having somebody who can be sort of
an armchair therapist and help navigate a regular season of
eighty two games, forty of which you're on the road,

(02:21:03):
and having the ability to manipulate emotions in the postseason
because it's a long postseason for these NBA players, I
think there's a higher level of importance. And frankly, if
you look at the compensation, that's the reason why baseball
managers are paid so much less than NBA head coaches,

(02:21:24):
because I do think that the job requires a lot
more talent and tact I just don't think it necessarily
requires them to be great basketball minds. They have to
be great people persons. They have to be able to
understand the chemistry of the locker room. Like you said,
sometimes it takes a big ego. Sometimes it takes somebody
like Steve Kerr, who appears to have zero ego at all.

Speaker 2 (02:21:45):
What Yeah, smug is what he is.

Speaker 3 (02:21:49):
But the public appearance, at least of Steve Kerr is
he wants the players to lead this team. He wants
to hand over decision making to the players. He wants
them to have a role. Sometimes he'll take a seat
on a bench and if a player like Draymond or
Staff or Clay is interested and they're having a night off,
they'll coach the team.

Speaker 2 (02:22:07):
Like you know, I w there. I mean, I get again.
This is the one thing that does always bothered me
about coaches. Like again, there's only one stat for a coach.
It's called wins and losses. That's all I can go by.
If you win more games, you keep your job. You
lose more games, you lose your job. But you know,
I when when I see when I hear a coach

(02:22:32):
or a manager saying we were we didn't play with
motivation tonight. You know, these players have really got to
step it up. And I'm thinking to myself, isn't that
your job?

Speaker 5 (02:22:47):
Now?

Speaker 2 (02:22:47):
You don't have one job that's to motivate your team
to be better. And if you're blaming the players for
not being motivated, then maybe you're not the right guy
to be in that locker room. Yeah, because if I
own that team and you're a meeting the fact that
we were unmotivated and we got to do some of
the better. The players need to step up their game.
I'm like, how much money am I paying you to

(02:23:08):
send on that bench?

Speaker 3 (02:23:09):
Die?

Speaker 2 (02:23:10):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:23:11):
Look, I think that an NBA coach is more of
a politician than they are a coach. I think that
they need to make everybody feel good. But understand that
at the end of the day, this is strictly business.
You ever meet a politician in person, like a really good, yeah,

(02:23:32):
a really powerful politician, they make you feel like you
are the only person in the room. They lead with compliments,
they make sure they know how connected they that they
are to your issues, and they make sure that they
smooth everything over. And there's no such thing as a
bad interaction, bad personal interaction with a politician. They make

(02:23:54):
sure of that.

Speaker 2 (02:23:54):
Now.

Speaker 3 (02:23:55):
Publicly, you may hate the platform that they stand on,
but almost across the when you meet somebody who's, yeah whatever,
a diehard Democrat, a far right conservative who's met a
politician on the other side and has had a personal interaction,
they go, you know what, I hate his politics, but
I have to admit he's a great guy. Or she's

(02:24:16):
a great woman. You know, I met her in person
and she was great to my family and shook my
hand and spent some time with us. Because that's what
politicians do. They make everything feel okay even though it's
not okay. That's what an NBA coach's job is. Yeah,
like I, no NBA coach is going to go into
the NBA playoffs with a bunch of scrubs and out

(02:24:37):
coach a Lebron led Lakers team. It's just not happening.
You have to have the firepower to contend in the NBA,
and everybody knows that. So if you don't have stars,
you don't have a chance because these series in the
NBA postseason or too long. So any coach, quote unquote
coach who's worth his salt knows that the most important
thing is to latch yourself to a team with super stars.

(02:25:00):
Have those superstars trust you. Have you be the politician
to smooth everything over even in times of discord or disarray,
and you will continue having coaching jobs. That's the reason
why the greatest coaches in the history of the NBA
have all been linked to absurd superstars. You know, the
Phil Jackson's of the world, or the pat Riley's of

(02:25:24):
the world, or the Steve Kerrs of the world. The
Greg Popovich's of the world. They all coached Hall of famers.
That's the reason why they had success, that's the reason
why they won champions.

Speaker 2 (02:25:34):
Well, this gets back to that old argument with Belichick
and Brady. Who made who? And I guess you know,
for years it was like, if Tom Brady played for
anyone but Belichick, we never hear of Tom Brady and
that change. But then when he went down to that
But that's true, however, and then obviously his former coach
hasn't won a single playoff game without him.

Speaker 3 (02:25:53):
At the same token, though, if you think about the NFL,
what makes the NFL different is you can have the
one off year where a team who doesn't have a
great quarterback can go on and win a Super Bowl.
Rare that it's it's rare, but it can happen. That
can't happen in the NBA. It cannot happen in the NBA.
You need superstars.

Speaker 2 (02:26:14):
Well, no, when the Pistons beat the Lakers in O four,
that team wasn't a superstar team at all. Years ago.

Speaker 3 (02:26:21):
Okay, NBA has changed a great deal. How about how
about I'll give you a recent example in the NFL
when Nick Foles out dueled Tom Brady for Super Bowl.
I mean, it can still happen in the NFL because
coaching matters in the NBA. Coaching doesn't matter, game plan
doesn't matter.

Speaker 2 (02:26:38):
Larry Brown mattered, Larry That's right, he did. It's my
personal guy. All right, let's let's find out what is
trending right now. Is Monci is sitting by the configuration
of our new studios is great because I can.

Speaker 3 (02:26:54):
Actually see we could see mons.

Speaker 8 (02:26:57):
Yeah, pretty amazing, right, if I'm busy, You know, how are.

Speaker 2 (02:27:00):
Those Dodger Stadium tours going? Because last weekend you were
you had like triple.

Speaker 7 (02:27:04):
Duty, Oh, triple duty. Yeah, No, it was a huge
Yankees were in town. Correct on Sunday.

Speaker 6 (02:27:11):
We saw three hundred and fifty guests, fifty people leaving
every ten minutes.

Speaker 7 (02:27:17):
And I don't know how we did it.

Speaker 2 (02:27:19):
We did.

Speaker 6 (02:27:21):
Yeah, I really don't know how we got through it
that Sunday, but we got through it.

Speaker 7 (02:27:25):
It was a lot of funs.

Speaker 6 (02:27:26):
Yeah, So Dodger Stadium tours happened year round. It was
just Yankee series brought in more guests than we typically get, uh,
and it was a huge, huge success. I think I
slept for like twelve hours that Sunday, Like I literally
crashed when I got home.

Speaker 7 (02:27:40):
I don't even remember.

Speaker 2 (02:27:42):
So you got your steps in that day?

Speaker 7 (02:27:43):
Oh? And then some Yeah, and then I hear that.

Speaker 2 (02:27:46):
All the time. My sunny works at a restaurant. He goes,
I got a lot of steps in today.

Speaker 6 (02:27:50):
I was drenched and swept definitely that Sunday because it
was kind of hot, like it started. The weather has
been weird, as we've been discussing, Like it doesn't the
sun's not out, it's not.

Speaker 7 (02:27:59):
As hot, but it's also not very cool.

Speaker 6 (02:28:01):
Like we get a little bit of humidity these last
couple of days. So yeah, a lot of a lot
of sweat, a lot of tears, is I think what
I tweeted or what I posted on social media. A
lot of sweat and a lot of tears. But we
got through it. But I missed you guys. So I'm
glad to be back on this Sunday. Remember a couple
of weeks ago, wander Franco of the Rays, he fielded
that ball, threw it up to himself and got the
guy out the Rays one.

Speaker 7 (02:28:22):
Okay, so the Dodgers just lost to the Phillies. Bruce
dark Grattol one of our pictures.

Speaker 6 (02:28:28):
They hit a ball to him and he fielded it
and was on the ground, and then he kissed the
ball and threw it.

Speaker 7 (02:28:32):
To first base when you're losing.

Speaker 1 (02:28:34):
Don't do that.

Speaker 7 (02:28:36):
When you're losing. Don not play fun in games. Okay,
you are zing and it wasn't even a close game.
I I just saw that, and I was like, Bruis
dar why, why don't do that?

Speaker 6 (02:28:48):
The Dodgers lost to the Phillies in Philadelphia. Seven three
was the final score.

Speaker 7 (02:28:52):
The Orioles.

Speaker 6 (02:28:53):
Hey, the gun Show was on rookie Gunner Henderson. Have
you guys seen this guy? He's really good. He hit
a three on Homer four hundred and sixty two feet
for the Orioles. Yes, they took down the Royals. I
hate the Orioles and the Royals playing together. It's a
tongue twister. But the Orioles Baltimore one eleven to three
was the final score.

Speaker 7 (02:29:12):
The Nationals avoided the sweep.

Speaker 6 (02:29:14):
They snapped the Brave seven game winning streak, coming.

Speaker 7 (02:29:17):
Out on top six to two the Rays.

Speaker 6 (02:29:19):
They win another one, a seven to three victory over
the Rangers.

Speaker 7 (02:29:23):
Wander Franco We were just talking about him. Had a
three run homer in the victory.

Speaker 6 (02:29:26):
The Rays have won eight out of their last nine
and are forty eight and twenty for this season. The Pirates,
they topped the Mets two to one, Andrew McCutchen recorded
his two thousandth career hit in the win. The Mets
have lost eight out of their last nine. But remember
Mets owner Steve Cohen spoke to the New York Posts.
He said, don't worry, We're not gonna blow anything up.

Speaker 7 (02:29:45):
This is just how the season's gonna start.

Speaker 6 (02:29:47):
Supposedly, The Guardian shout out the Astros at home five zero.
Shane Bieber pitched seven innings, only give up three hits
and struck out nine. The Diamondbacks, who are first placed
in the NL West, have won five in a row.

Speaker 7 (02:29:58):
They beat the Tigers score seven to five. Currently going on, it's.

Speaker 6 (02:30:02):
The Angels who are beating the Mariners at home three zero,
bottom of the second inning. Taylor Ward had a lead
off homer for the Angels. Jack Peterson had a home
run in the bottom of the first inning for the Giants,
who are beating the Cubs two zero in San Francisco.
Top of the second inning, the Padres with the lead
over the Rockies three to one.

Speaker 7 (02:30:20):
Top of the six.

Speaker 6 (02:30:21):
The Reds and the Cardinals have been back and forth,
but at Cincinnati on top four to three.

Speaker 7 (02:30:25):
Bottom of the eighth, the A's. Remember, guys, the A's
are winning. What is going on?

Speaker 6 (02:30:30):
They're still beating the Brewers five to three.

Speaker 7 (02:30:32):
Top of the eighth inning.

Speaker 6 (02:30:33):
The White Sox are holding on to their one run
lead over the Marlins at home.

Speaker 7 (02:30:38):
It's five to four.

Speaker 6 (02:30:39):
The Marlins have a man on first and second, but
they are down to their final out. And the Blue
Jays also holding on to one run lead over the
Twins at home, seven to six.

Speaker 7 (02:30:47):
Top of the ninth.

Speaker 6 (02:30:48):
The Twins have a man on first, but they have
two outs to go.

Speaker 7 (02:30:52):
And of course no basketball, no hockey.

Speaker 6 (02:30:54):
But we did have the French Open and it was
Novak Djokovic who won his third French Open title, beating
Cat spur Root in three sets for a record twenty
third Grand Slam Men's title, passing Raphael Nadal. And we
go back to Luis Aries back to you, guys.

Speaker 2 (02:31:13):
That is all over social media. It is yes, is
a hot of the and again I brought this up
with John Paul Morosi right at the top of the show.
Because this guy's hitting four oh two right now.

Speaker 7 (02:31:23):
He's three ninety seven.

Speaker 6 (02:31:24):
He's had five that bats, one hit for today's game
so far, top of the ninth in eight and so
three seven.

Speaker 7 (02:31:31):
I mean that's still pretty good.

Speaker 2 (02:31:33):
Yeah, but it's not for him. But no, I did.

Speaker 3 (02:31:36):
I do think a Rise is a pretty cool name too.

Speaker 2 (02:31:40):
A Rise.

Speaker 6 (02:31:42):
But already you know, with Aaron Judge, all Rise, it's
already that's already taken.

Speaker 2 (02:31:48):
We can't ra Rise Rise, all right, we found out
I can't do it, all right, Manzi. Tremendous stuff. As
always today, we always appreciate the NBA coaching vacancies have
been filled. And one guy that did not get tabbed
finally for a job is Doc Rivers. It's always amazing

(02:32:15):
to me when we talk about recycle coaches and everything else.
You know, I was looking back when he was he
started his career with Orlando, his coaching career, and he
was the coach of the year his very first year.
It really was a remarkable job. It was a roster
that completely been depleted and he actually got into five
hundred and it was it was a pretty good coaching situation.

(02:32:38):
But you're talking earlier rich about having players. So he
goes to Boston. In his first three years at Boston
he won forty five games, thirty three games, and twenty
four games. You see you downward trend on that one.
He started at forty five and thirty seven. By his
third year he's twenty four and fifty eight, and then

(02:33:00):
they bring in Garnett and Ray Allen and they win
the championship. Now, was he a different coach or whatever.
This is one of those guys that, like I said,
he's great with the media. He knows how to sell himself,
he knows how to say the right things. But in
the bottom line is he went to the Clippers. They
were a fifty five win team when he got there,

(02:33:22):
they stayed there his entire time, and then obviously with
Philadelphia he wasn't able to take him to another level either.
So I think finally around the NBA, someone's gotten why
to the fact that if you're looking to get to
that next level, this is definitely not the guy to hire. Yeah,
Doc Rivers, it looks like it's somebody eventually hired this guy.

Speaker 3 (02:33:44):
Well, yeah, look here's the I'm not sure why it's
a political position. This goes back to the conversation we
were just having. In the NBA, you have two choices.
You either hire a guy who is going to help
you develop young players into better NBA stars, or you're
going to hire somebody who can handle a locker room

(02:34:05):
with a bunch of big, high priced superstars and just
control the narrative and to play armchair psychologists throughout the
course of their journey to winning playoff series or championships.
Like that's basically your two choices. Like coach bud Out
in Milwaukee was definitely more of the former than the latter.

(02:34:27):
He's the type of coach that you bring in to
encourage young roster and to maximize the development of a
roster on your way to having success, and he was
able to net a championship out of it. But I
don't think that the current you know Yannis, is going
to put up well with a coach who asks so
much of its players, because that's not what they need

(02:34:51):
right now, or at least not in his course of development.
At this point, he's already established. So where they're at
is adding stars if they can per their salary cap
payroll restrictions and finding a coach who can lead the
way more of a psychologist and a politician, And I
think Doc Rivers, after the championship he won in Boston,

(02:35:14):
has really settled into that political role where if he's
going to get hired, it's gonna be with the team
that an ownership group feels like they are the majority
of the way there and they just need a guy
who's a veteran, who's got his hand on the tiller,
who's going to be able to guide the ship and
navigate some of the murky depths of the NBA regular

(02:35:35):
season in postseason on their way to a championship. The
problem is he doesn't have any postseason success to crow
about since the big win with Boston. So, like you said,
it's a little befuddling why he's been recycled so many
times as a head coach in this league. But at
the same token, I understand it because he can project

(02:35:57):
a level of confidence and he has a resume that
suggests you should trust him, and so a lot of teams,
a lot of teams do all right.

Speaker 2 (02:36:07):
On the other side, our picks for Game five of
the NBA Finals, Do I smell another lock? This is
Fox Sports Radio.

Speaker 9 (02:36:16):
Reinhard shoots flats, white cloud stick breaks centering pass kicked
away by Carlson five seconds to the right. A shot
walks by mcnam rebound is loose, push to the corner and.

Speaker 3 (02:36:26):
Time runs out.

Speaker 2 (02:36:27):
The game is over. The Knights survive.

Speaker 9 (02:36:31):
Now up the pile in front.

Speaker 5 (02:36:32):
Of the goal.

Speaker 9 (02:36:33):
Kel jumps in as well. His helmet is off. Several
players tackling each other. The linesman now restrained hill. Several
things are being thrown onto the ice as we speak.
The Knights have one game four, barely surviving.

Speaker 2 (02:36:50):
That is Fox Sports Las Vegas ninety eight point nine
FM and thirteen forty AM. That is our Progressive Player
the Day, Brady by Progressive Insurance Regress. That makes bundling
easy and affordable. Get a multi policy discount by combining
your motorcycle, RV, boat, a TVM more all your protection
one place, bundle and save at Progressive dot Com. Steve Hartman,

(02:37:10):
Rich Ornberger here once again live from our tire Rack
dot com studios. Now that's the way to end a
game with a full out brawl.

Speaker 3 (02:37:18):
I like that, Yeah, yeah, it's It's honestly a part
of hockey that I frankly still love and enjoy that.

Speaker 2 (02:37:27):
I love that. I'm gonna I'm gonna discuss something with
you in a second. First, I want to make sure
we thank everybody today. Sam on the board as always,
It's great to have him back. Saturday Night's all right
for fighting? Yeah, you know, I mean that is hockey.
You know, if you don't have a brawl, then why
why exactly are we playing the game? Although it's rare
in the playoffs, Yeah, it's you don't really see a
lot of that in the playoffs. But obviously last night

(02:37:51):
things boiled over as the Knights took that three one
series lead. Montay, of course, doing a brilliant job is yeah,
she's she's the one it keeps the starting the drink
around here apparently. And then there's bo bo bo bo bobo,
oh bo.

Speaker 3 (02:38:07):
What do we say about that?

Speaker 2 (02:38:08):
I can't even imagine bow and paint. You know what
I was thinking and seeing that hockey fight happen. Why
isn't there more sportsmanship in professional sports? Okay, I'm glad
you mentioned that, because very.

Speaker 3 (02:38:18):
Quickly we've run out of time on the show.

Speaker 2 (02:38:21):
Yeah, so I am going to be part of a
group discussion on Tuesday at the Rose Bowl to discuss
why the media doesn't do more to promote sportsmanship. My
goal in that meeting is to be thrown out of
the room. I'm going to show them what sportsmanship is
all about. I literally I signed up for this, and

(02:38:41):
I'm really wondering why I did, because I can only
imagine what this is, where this is going to go.
There's one thing about sportsmanship at a little league game
and another in professional sports. So just make sure it
ends up on YouTube. Please. Yeah, I'll try, but it
could be a very short stay for me in that room.
All right, Ritchie, let's let's talk about night's Game five
of the NBA Finals, Nuggets trying to wrap it up.

(02:39:04):
Of course, I made a Bowl prediction last Sunday. I
locked a Miami win against the spread, and I couldn't
believe I was actually right. Which way you're going in
this game tomorrow? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (02:39:15):
Look, I don't think there's any reason to bet against
the Denver Nuggets any longer, So I'm gonna take Denver.
I think that they are the lock to win the
NBA Finals. I what does Miami do against Nikola Jokic.
The answer is nothing. The best they could do is

(02:39:36):
shoot three point shots the way they did in Game
two and just be lights out for a dramatic fourth
quarter finish. I just don't see them being able to
replicate that success I got Denver.

Speaker 2 (02:39:47):
There's no sense to it at all, which is why
I'm going to go in Miami to win Game five
in Denver and then lose Game six at home and
in the series. There you have it, folks, nowhere to go.
Just keep it right here. This is Fox Sports Radio.

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