September 5, 2023 • 54 mins
The Book of Joe Podcast with hosts Tom Verducci and Joe Maddon begins with troubles continuing for the Angels and Shohei Ohtani. What are the different ways the franchise can pivot in order to be competitive? Onto the rookie class of 2023 in MLB, Tom highlights Gunnar Henderson and the season he's having with the Orioles. Looking to the postseason, should MLB look to add some time to pitch clocks? We wrap up with a few memories of Jimmy Buffett and his connection to Wrigley Field and meeting Joe at the White House!
The Book of Joe Podcast is a production of iHeart Radio.
#fsr
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
The Book of Joe Podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
Hey there, welcome back.
Speaker 1 (00:15):
To the latest episode of the Book of Joe Podcast
with me, Tom Verducci and Joe Madden.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Joe, how is your holiday weekend?
Speaker 3 (00:23):
It was wonderful, Tommy. I played every day Friday, Saturday, Sunday, Monday,
little picnic at the Lindy's last night. Yeah, the weather
was wormed up a little bit. Also air rating today
the back nine. How about that? So I only got
the front nine to play. But overall a really good time.
And how about yourself down there in Princeton.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Awesome, man, As you said, the weather was great, A
little golfing, a little biking, a little swimming in the pool.
It was perfect way to end or so unofficially in
the summer. And by the way, I capped the weekend
by doing the Orioles Angels game on FS one.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
OK.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
And we've got to start with that because these angels,
your angels, Joe Madden, keep giving us angel moments.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
How about this? This is so angels.
Speaker 1 (01:15):
They get back off a road trip and show Hey,
o'tani who like rarely, if ever, takes batting practice on
the field.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
It's very unusual for him to hit on the field.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
Decides, first day back at home, he's going to hit
on the field. The batting practice picture throws him a
nasty cutter down and end. He tries to hold up
his swing and there goes his oblique. He had to
walk out of the cage, off the field, scratched, not
in the lineup for the first time since May second.
And Joe, you know how these oblique things go. Oh,
(01:47):
I mean, we don't know yet the severity of the injury,
but there's a possibility because those things sometimes, if you
do it badly enough, can be weeks. That may be
the last time we see shoe hey Otani in an
angel's uniform. That to me is just such an angel's moment.
And of course this came basically minutes after his agent,
Nez Bolelo, talked about show Hayes elbow. Of course, he
(02:10):
has the tear in the UCL and nes to Nobody's surprised,
I don't think, said listen, it's inevitable he's going to
need some procedure on the elbow. But he's going to
hit and he's going to pitch again. So he painted
as optimistic a picture as you can about the injury,
but now you got to deal with oblique. I mean,
come on, you can't make this stuff up. What a season,
(02:32):
sixty two players the Angels have gone through this year
and now we'll have to see how long show Hey
o Tani is out.
Speaker 3 (02:39):
Yeah, I'm just going unpacking that whole thing. A the
fact that he was on the field, probably because he's
not pitching anymore, so he has all this extra time,
and he felt as though, I need to get out
on the field, to just go out there because I
don't want to sit inside all day. It's going to
drive me crazy. So I don't doubt that that was
part of it. And then maybe just having the fans
see him for the last time, possibly in Angel Stadium there, whatever,
(03:02):
whatever the the thoughts process was. But then to injure
himself like that, and if if in fact it isn't oblique,
and there's no reason to doubt that he probably is
done for the season. Those things do take a while
to heal, if anygether. There's different degrees or levels, but
even an average kind of an average oblique situation, he's
probably done for three weeks or whatever it's going to be,
(03:25):
and that would be so awkward the way he has
appeared in an Angel uniform for the very last time.
Moving it forward, I do believe Nez though. I do
believe that he will play and he's going to do
both things. I'm just curious as to their strategy with
the arm surgery, etc. And how that's going to play out.
I read something about a new technique or some kind
of a sleeve or something that they're wearing these days
(03:46):
to help the healing process. I think I read something
like that. But he's going to primarily be a hitter,
it sounds like next year, and then move back into
the pitching market. I don't doubt, knowing that his level
degree of professionalism and how badly he wants to both,
that he will do both. But I also believe the
(04:08):
hitting part will come back a little bit more readily.
I think the throwing part may take more time.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
Yeah, and listen, and nes was optimistic, saying that the
injury in the UCL was not the same area that
was repaired back in twenty eighteen or whenever he had
the surgery. And you know, he had the surgery then
in October October first, and he missed the first month
of the next season. Came back in May of the
(04:33):
following season after Tommy John surgery, and Nez pretty much
guaranteed that show Hey will be in somebody's opening lineup
next year, that the recovery is at least he's implying,
will be a little bit quicker here.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
And I'm with you, Joe.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
I don't doubt that whoever signed Sho Hey o Tani,
they're going to get him as a two way player.
Maybe not for twenty twenty four, but you know how
much this guy loves to play baseball, and he's bound
and determined to keep doing this. And I know a
lot of people are saying, well, why not just have
the surgery now? Angels are out of it meaningless games,
They're not meaningless to show Hey, and you know that
(05:09):
this guy loves to play baseball, and is he chasing
the MVP, of course, and he's got some other numbers.
The Angels single season home run record is forty seven
by Troy Glass.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
He's got a shot at that.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
But it just comes down to the fact he loves
to play baseball and he can hit. Right now, there's
absolutely no limitation on him as a hitter right now.
So I'm not surprised he's continuing to play. He just
loves to play, and I think it really is that simple.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
It is that simple. It's not complicated at all. I
just hearing about as long as there's an assurance kind
of that he's going to be able to hit at
an earlier month next baseball season, that he'll be able
to participate as a hitter for sure, that would be
all he needs to know. If he's getting those kind
of assurances, then he's going to want to play the
(05:54):
rest of the month. Maybe outside of the oblique right now,
but yeah, that's he is. I mean, yes, he wants
to have the Angels record from home runs, he wants
to win an MVP Award. He wants all that stuff,
absolutely does. That's how he's driven, and there's nothing wrong
with that. It's a part of the greatness as a
part of being driven, it's a part of being able
to perform annually at a level that maybe others can't perform.
(06:17):
Part of it is the fact that he is very talented.
The other part is that he's just not going to
be denied. I mean, you could go into other sports
primarily look Tom Brady or Michael Jordan or Larry Bird
in our sport, he'd have to. I mean more recently,
I think the Yankees run in general, which youeter in
that particular group, but it takes a different mental method
(06:40):
annually daily that causes or permits guys like this to
be that good day after day after day. It's not easy,
and then year after year after year, because once you've
achieved certain things, I think human nature almost causes you
to kind of step back a bit. It's not as
important as it had been. But then there's this other
group that it is as important to continue to be
(07:02):
that great, continued to perform at mv MVP caliber, and
to win championships. So that's that's him. He is Bird,
he is Michael Jordan, he is Tom Brady's all those
guys in a baseball uniform. And that's what sets him apart.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
And think about when shohe was an international free agent.
First of all, he came over here at an age
where if he had waited a year or two, he
could have been an unrestricted free agent, but his earnings
were limited, so he basically gave up probably two hundred
million dollars of earnings at that point to sign because
he wanted to come to Major League Baseball to be
a two way player, and he essentially fell into the
(07:43):
lapse of the Angels, right. I mean, one of the
first things he said was I don't want to play
on the East Coast at National League at the time
did not have.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
The designated hitter.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
It probably made him lean more towards an American League
team to be able to be a two way player.
And again, as I said, he pretty much fell into
the lapse of the of the Angels, and you got
him at somewhat of a bargain price. And now here
we are six years with the Angels, and he's played
on teams that have never finished closer than ten games
(08:16):
in first place, that over the course of the six
years are sixty two games under five hundred. And he
will not see a playoff game, at least if he
doesn't return with the Angels in an Angel's uniform. It's
just amazing to me and Joe, I'll go back to
and I know you won't bring this up, but when
you were let go as the Angels manager, the team
was just two games under five hundred. Since then, they're
(08:39):
twenty four games under five hundred. They're eight and twenty
three in their last thirty one games here. Once they
were all in at the deadline, and I was a
big fan of what they did because they still had
a winning record at that time. You had Otana, you
had Trout coming back. You don't punt a season when
you have a winning record, a positive run. Differentially, you
haven't been to the postseason in eight years. I get
(09:01):
all that, but man, it has just fallen part and
now this is just the latest. So I don't know, Joe.
I know that Mike Trout has talked about wanting to
talk to the front office at the end of the season.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
That's kind of boiler played stuff.
Speaker 1 (09:16):
When you're a franchise player like that, you've got seven
years on the contract with the organization. You want to
know what the future is, what the plans are. I
don't think Mike's got kind of guy who's go don't
force anything. You know him well, Joe, and I don't
know what those conversations are going to be like. But man,
the Angels, and I'll say this, Mike Trout, they're at
(09:36):
a tough spot here and how they pivot out of
this position they're in.
Speaker 3 (09:40):
Yeah, I just compared Showy to some really iconic players,
but the difference was that they were on championship teams.
And that's the one thing that's been driving show. I mean,
physical talent wise, he is on par with those guys,
but when missing element is the most important element that's
to win championships. Yeah, with Michael, I read all that,
I just like Shuzer had done. I guess with the
(10:02):
Mets wants a meeting that The part that strikes me
about that is how foreign that is from back in
the day, where a player would ever never even ask
for a summit number or two B granted one. That's
that's kind of the difference in today's world compared to
the past. For Michael. I mean, he's got a pretty
ironclad contract, and I do believe he sees himself as
(10:25):
an angel now and forever. I do. I also believe
that he believes that somehow they're going to work through
this and it's gonna they're gonna get back on the
winning ways. So I'm curious. I mean, I don't see
Michael as being demanding. I don't see him that way.
I think more curious than anything, as he may, you know,
sit with Artie or John or or Perry whomever and
(10:48):
ask different questions about the future. I don't think it'll
get too heavy with him, I don't think so. Just
trying to find out exactly what everybody's thinking, and they
just try to move it forward. So I don't think
it's the monstrative situation. I don't think it's like he's
going to make any kind of demands or any kind
of threats. I don't see him doing that kind of thing.
It's just a curiosity thing, I think, and just to
ameliorate his mind and find out or figure out what's happening.
(11:09):
Because I think back to original point. I think part
of why showhe wanted to be there the Angels were
on the West Coast, but they also had Mike Trapp.
I think maybe he thought being a part of that
dynamic would help propel this team to the point where
they would be a championship team. Yeah, I mean last point. Yeah.
When I left there, was gotten off to the best
start they had gotten off to in years years and
(11:31):
ran into a mad moment. We just like Showy stopped
hitting for a bit, Michael stopped hitting for a bit,
and the bullpen was struggling. That's pretty much what it happened,
and from that part, it was disappointing because I've always
saw myself as a California Angel, and I think we've
talked about this. I've never liked the moniker Los Angeles
Angels or Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim, even Anaheim Angels,
(11:51):
even though we went a world series that way, saw
us as California Angels, and that was something that I
had near and dear to my heart. Was still wanted
to be part of that resurgence. But again, it's not
necessarily like that anymore. It's not disloyalty factor, traditions not
as important to different groups. So yeah, yeah, I was
disappointed to be able let go to being let go there.
(12:12):
I really there's a lot of unfinished work and I
do I love that organization, So that part was disappointing.
But moving it forward it's going to be hard, very hard.
It's going to take a while to get back on
the winning track.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
I think, yeah, I'm with you, Mike.
Speaker 1 (12:26):
I think you said this well in the book that
Mike is the gun and gut kind of player, kind
of person who never wants to disappoint anybody, and I've
always felt like he is such a loyal soldier, if
you will, especially for a guy who was sitting there
through the first half of the draft and waiting for
someone to take him, and the Angels did, and they've
(12:47):
signed him to a couple of extensions in that contract,
and I think his loyalty is really strong to the
Angels in general, to Artie Moreno in particular. So I
you know, he's got what like seven years, two hundred
and forty five million left on his contract. I'm sure
he's as frustrated as anybody about not being able to
get back to the postseason. But I have a hard
(13:08):
time thinking that Mike is going to say, hey, get
me out of here.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
And I mean, who knows.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
It might be tough to move Mike Trout because he
hasn't been healthy the last four years and with the
money left on the contract.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
Listen, you can trade anybody. We all know that. And
he's still Mike Trout.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
But he has questions Joe that I think everybody has
looking at the Angels, like where do you pivot from here?
I mean, you were basically all in with Mike and
with shohe on the same group. They've really been aggressive
promoting their young players to the big leagues. I'm not
sure how many are going to be impact players. But man,
if you're Mike Trout or an Angels fan, you have
to wonder where do we go from here.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
I look at teams like.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
The Padres, the White Sox, even the Yankees, the Angels,
a lot of disappointing teams who are all in the Mets,
and it's hard to see where those teams pivot to
get really good again.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
I can't disagree with that. You just can't go out
and buy yourself a whole new team. I have seen
some of the players. They've brought up, nice players, but
I don't see them as being like lead singers. I
see them being more part of the support group, a
nice support group. And yeah, it's just you just can't
there's nothing to trade. You can't really trade for guys
that all of a sudden are going to make it
(14:20):
all work. It's going to be difficult. There's no question
how they're going to do it. Probably an amalgam of
a lot of different things in an attempt. But it's
it's going to take a while. It's just gonna especially
after this blood letting right now, letting all putting all
those guys out on the irrevocable waivers and having them
all leave, I know most of them probably maybe we're
(14:42):
not going to be part of the future. However, had
they hit it, some of these guys might have stuck
around for a bit. They still have nice players. I
like Dreary a lot. I like Renfro. Renfro is like
one of those mercenaries over the last couple of years
that always ends up playing for a winning situation. Drury,
to me, is one of the better hitters that nobody
talks about. And I love these guy Mistokas. These are guys,
(15:02):
but you got to build it around them. Their pitching
staff has to be more productive consistently. They have something.
I know Sandy had a tough year and I'm a
big Patrick Sandoval fan. Huge. I love the fact that
Griff Canning has really made a nice comeback. I've watched
him pitch a couple of times, and I like what
he's doing stuff wise. I like his delivery, I like
the shape of his pitches. I like a lot of
(15:23):
that redebtmers. I still believe he's going to find his
confidence and once he does, he'll be a really solid
major league pitcher. They got some nice arms in the bullpen,
but then again they let them go, So this is
interesting to be able. Probably their goal would be to
be able to put together some kind of competitive team
next year, as opposed to a Pennant when he kind
(15:44):
of team next year. So it'll be very creative in
regards to the offseason trying to figure out the method,
the way we're going to go about this. And I
think finally you have to define exactly what are we
going to try to do, what do we want to
be going into the season, what is realistic and then
try to attempt to work around that thought.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
Yeah, there's not an easy answer to that.
Speaker 1 (16:08):
I know that Ardie Moreno has never really been interested
in doing a full on rebuild. It's a great fan
base out there. He's very much into the entertainment side
of the business. Nothing wrong with that, because you know,
they do keep taking prices down. They do a pretty
good job of feeling that place. But man, everything this
year that could go wrong has gone wrong. Even you know,
(16:30):
I thought they made a brilliant move by putting those
veteran players on the waiver wire to try to get
under the luxury tax limit. I mean, the worst thing
to do is is you go over the luxury tax
threshold and you're not even a postseason team.
Speaker 2 (16:43):
Right. That's what the Padres are doing, the Yankees are doing.
But for the.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
Angels, you know, they were trying to limbo under that number.
And it looks like, and it's going to come down
to an eleventh hour accounting. It looks like by not
having someone take Randall Gritchick and what was left on
his contract, they wind up being.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
A little bit over the threshold.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
And man, it reminds me of the great Sparky Anderson
once said the three Detroit Tigers, they lost one hundred
and nineteen games, one short of the Mets one hundred
and twenty back in nineteen sixty two, and he said,
even when we were losing, we couldn't lose the right way.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
You might as well break the record. That's been the
year for the Angels.
Speaker 3 (17:28):
That's outstanding. Yeah, I was just curious too, like when
they went through the sole process of acquiring these guys
was the escape patch this particular strategy today, having the
back of their minds if it did not go well,
that we could still do this and come out kind
of being okay with the whole process or situation. I'm
(17:49):
just curious if it was something they thought of after
they made the acquisition. How could we write this and
then we put these guys out on waivers or going
into it. If they knew that this was part of
the potential process, that would be a great foresight on
their part.
Speaker 2 (18:04):
I think, yeah, really good question.
Speaker 3 (18:06):
Yeah, I'm just curious about that, because if you had
that thought out all the way, that's pretty solid.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Yeah, it was a brilliant move.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
I got to give him credit for that, and it's
something I think you're going to see in future years
going forward at August thirty, first deadline, because veterans have
to be on your club at that point to be
postseason eligible.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
So you put these players out on.
Speaker 1 (18:25):
The curb, so to speak, where teams can acquire them
without giving up any prospect capital, no capital at all.
You're just assuming the contract. But you're going to see
that I think happened years four. We're going to call
that waiver day when these players are put out there
on the curve for other teams to pick up.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
No such problem in Baltimore, Joe. I want to talk.
Speaker 1 (18:46):
About Gunner Henderson and this class of rookies that we're
looking at this year.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
He is just so impressive.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
And I want to get your take on Gunner Henderson
and the rookie class of twenty twenty three when we
get back right.
Speaker 2 (18:59):
After this.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Welcome Back to the Book of Joe podcast. Hey Joe,
I mentioned Gunner Henderson and man, he is just so impressive.
Speaker 2 (19:15):
Brandon Hyde's done a great job.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
You know, this is a kid goes back and forth
between shortstop and third base.
Speaker 2 (19:21):
He loses nothing.
Speaker 1 (19:23):
I mean, generally you think for a young player, you
want to leave him at one position, but it doesn't
seem to bother this kid to me, he's the favorite
the American League for the Rookie of the Year. You've
got Corbyn Carroll in the America in the National League.
Very similar type player when you talk about a combination
of power and speed, just super athletic, high baseball IQs.
Speaker 2 (19:44):
I was looking at this, Joe just the other day.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
We have eight rookies this year who've already hit twenty
home runs, and the record for any one season most
rookies with twenty home runs is nine, and that was
back in twenty seventeen. You had one of those in
Ian happ But Matn what a group you talked about
co Carol Gunner Henderson, Tristan Cassas, Josh Young, Jiner Diaz
(20:10):
with the Astros, Francisco Alvarez Young catcher with the Mets,
Anthony Volpi, Spencer Steer, and maybe Josh Autman with the
Dodgers is going to get there to tie that record.
Maybe Masataka Yoshida will get there as well. But man,
let's start with Gunner Henderson. You tell me you've watched him.
What do you like about this player for the Baltimore Orioles.
Speaker 3 (20:31):
Energy, enthusiasm. I just love the way he goes about
his business, very athletic, and the fact that you mentioned
the fact that he's going between two positions. I think
with Hydra season there is a little bit of Hobby
bias regarding athleticism. When we had Hobby with the Cubbies,
he was playing second base, then eventually shortstop whatever, and
(20:53):
third base when John Lester pitched. We liked him at
third base because he took all the pressure of Johnny
regarding bunts. KB worked his way into being a good
defensive third base. But Hobby was extraordinary. So when you
have a guy like this, athletically. You could whether it's
based on who's pitching that day for the opposition and
how you want to set up your lineup, or maybe
(21:14):
it's a defensive situation based on a pitcher who lacks
some kind of fielding acumen where he might be challenged
during the course of the game. Because it was definitely
a safety net for John but Henderson, I'm watching the
ball comes off the bad hot I watched him. I
know early on he struggled. I'm just you know, listening
about him, hearing about his pedigree whatever. But I'm watching
him go dang. I mean, there's a lot to like there.
(21:37):
You can see why. And people liked him. And I
also liked that he did not seem to get easily
frustrated when things weren't going as way. I took that
as a good sign. Also, so I'm strike out a
little bit. Didn't see the bat getting flipped and thrown.
I didn't see him arguing with umpires things like that.
So these these are the kind of signs because you
know the guy's good. You know he's good. You're watching
in MVP. Look at his numbers in the minor leagues.
(22:00):
You hear all the instructors, what they say about them. Okay,
it's good, solid, but then you watch his demeanor and
how he approaches failure. Those are the kind of things
that set people apart really good players and athletes. So
that's my take on him. Watching from a distance, so athletic,
and you could actually play them based on defensively how
you want it set up, possibly rearrange your team to
(22:21):
get somebody else involved because he can do this. And
then again, just a live body and a live bat
that's going to keep getting better.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:30):
First one hundred and sixty games in the Big leagues,
twenty two homers, eighty eight RBIs, ninety three runs scored,
twenty two years old, middle infielder with speed and as
you mentioned power. I mean, that's a franchise player and
you've already got one behind a plate in Adlie Rushman.
And there was news this week about another I believe
franchise player for Baltimore, Jackson Holiday Joe. He's just nineteen
(22:55):
years old and he has absolutely torn up every single level.
He has shot through four levels this year the minor
leagues and the Orioles promoted him to Triple A. I
don't know how you feel about a teenager and pushing
a kid like that to the big leagues in a
pennant race, no less. But I'm of the mind, given
(23:17):
this kid's pedigree, how well he has succeeded at each level.
Speaker 2 (23:21):
If I'm Brandon Hyde, I'm Micha.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Elias, the GM of the Baltimore Orioles, I'm not ruling
out the possibility and maybe even probability, that this kid
is on my playoff roster. Get him up in September,
give him at bats. I'm not saying he has to
be an everyday player, but if he's tearing up Triple
A like he's done every other level this year, and
you're the Baltimore Orioles and you get a chance to
(23:45):
win the American League pennant and you've got someone that talented,
it doesn't matter to me if he's nineteen years old.
I mean, I'll watched Andrew Jones walking the Yankee Stadium
in the World Series game at nineteen.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
It hit two home runs. You know, talent plays.
Speaker 1 (23:58):
So I don't know how aggressive the Orioles want to
be with Jackson Holliday, but I would not rule out
the possibility that Matt Holliday's kid will be in the
big leagues by the time this year is out, and
maybe on a playoff roster.
Speaker 3 (24:10):
So that's where to me, like a good old fashioned
Scott he comes into play. There's always the anomaly guy.
Remember what the Rays were playing the Rangers in Texas
in a playoff game, and Matt Moore, who had been
up I think for a cup of coffee with us
Rocco Baldelli vehemently argued in the office in Texas that
(24:30):
he was ready to pitch that game and to be
the starting pitcher in Texas. I remember the first pitch
of the game, Ian Kinsler filed it off right over
their doug out. He was so late on the fastball.
But that was a situation that we thought that Matt
was ready to rock and roll, and the fact that
Rocco really promoted it made all the difference in the
(24:51):
world in regards to us giving him that opportunity. So
I do believe every situation has to be handled uniquely individually,
and I do believe this is where real scouting takes
shape or takes form. There's no way an analytical model
can tell you that Matt Moore is ready to pitch
that game, where Jackson's ready to play in the big
league game in this particular time of the year. This
(25:12):
is where eyeballs really mattered. This is where really true
scouting matters. Knowing your player really matters. Frankie Rodriguez another
guy with the Angels. That was wow. He came up
and you know, social was kind of reticent putting him
in the game, even though we had heard everything we
had heard, and then Fly popped him in the game,
and wow, it was electric. And then we ended up
(25:34):
going to the World Series and winning it. Probably could
not have done it without him. You know, we had
a nice bullpen and everything. Percy was our guy, but
Frankie came up at a young age and impacted that
that run in that series in a way that nobody
else could have. Real scouting, So I think when he
gets to this time of the year, if in fact
you want to take a shot at a kid like that,
(25:54):
you have to have some real strong opinions in a room.
Of course, the guys had to have done well, something
that's obvious to everybody. But makeup is a way that
gets bandied about a lot, and how he handles adversity,
how he handles failure will he be able to, you know,
process this moment and not become overwhelmed by it. Those
are the kind of that's the kind of commentary you
(26:17):
want to hear to feel confident to give somebody this
kind of opportunity.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
That's interesting, Joe, because that assumes that there's people in
the front office who have that kind of sway, who
have that kind of eye for talent, right, because what
you're saying is that no matter what his numbers are,
no matter what his ex velocity is and his launch angle,
you need someone with wisdom and experience to look at
the kid playing and say, you know what, he's major
(26:42):
league ready, and we don't worry about him falling on
his face, how he might handle, say a slow start.
You need people in your organization then who are in
position to make those kind of judgments. I don't know
whether that's Michaelias the GM, whether he's got people that
he trusted in that position, but you're making a good
case of having people who have the baseball acumen besides
(27:04):
the technology to make those kind of determinations.
Speaker 3 (27:08):
That's all about balance. We talk about that all the time.
I do believe it's good and necessary when you have
that when you have people that have seen like a
Frankie Rodriguez show up or whomever. That the night we
put Kevin Kiermeyer in center field in the latter part
of the game in Texas, it was his first appearance.
This was the I think it was the one game
(27:29):
playoff against the Rangers before we went on and played Cleveland,
and Cleveland it was like a pre wild card game
because we have been tied. But the again Andrew Andrew Friedman,
who I consider a really good scout. Andrew and I
used to talk about We've talked about this before, but
there was other minor league personnel in that group that
(27:49):
was adamant. Yeah, put him out there. He's not gonna
have any problems. You're gonna love this. He could run
anything down. He's better than what you have. You hear
all those kind of phrases, and then you feel confident
doing it. And the other part is everybody being on
the same page, just in just in fact, if something
were to go wrong, and it's not the point, fingers,
(28:10):
it's just that if it doesn't play out, the whole
group was on the same page philosophically, and that is
the proverbial having one another's back, and that's really a
wonderful place to be, and it makes your decision making
feel more accurate and sure when you have that kind
of support. So that was it too with KK put
(28:31):
a minute about the seventh or eighth inning and text,
I remember running out there. The old Texas Ballpark was
kind of dark in the outfield from the dugout and
there is out there like nothing like APPS like he
was shagging balls and BP. But again, that was the
assurance of minor league personnel that had been around him.
So this is the kind of stuff that I don't
know to what level organizations really rely on this kind
(28:55):
of stuff anymore. To me running an organization, I want
all of that I want again because a manager, I
want all of that. I want power. I want power pitching.
I want guys to throw under armed. I want guys
that are good against lefties. I want guys they're not
to steal base, guys who know how to make contact
ladder part of the game when it's necessary. I want
all of that. So I want to be able to
(29:15):
balance whether my data and eyeballs come together. I need that.
I need to hear both. I need to hear the
analytical side of the numerical side, what what plays, what
you think plays with this person brings to bear that
I also need. I always use the term Larry Bow,
but Larry Boat type looking out in the minor league system,
(29:36):
walk in the fields and seeing them during the year,
reporting back and telling me what they see also really
important to me. So again, balance is the key word here. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
I love hearing those examples about deciding when someone is
ready for the big leagues. So the Orioles may be
up against that decision. Hey, hey, Joe, I want to
get your take and pick your manager brain. On a
big announcement, I think it was big for Major League
Baseball the past week where they decided they will not
change the playing rules, specifically the pitch timer for postseason play.
(30:09):
There had been some chatter among players that, hey, postseason games,
they're more important. Slow the game down. We need more
time because there's more on the line. Penance and history
are decided, and some people thought maybe we can add
some time to the clock.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
Uh uh, not happening.
Speaker 1 (30:24):
I am a big proponent of playing the game the
same way we've been playing it for six months, and
the numbers back it up. We're now, at a point
where seventy five percent of Major League games are played
with no violations at all, it's rare to see a
pitch timer violation. And major League Baseball looked at the numbers,
(30:44):
and of course, with the bass is empty, that pitch
timer is fifteen seconds. The average time remaining on the
timer when a pitch is thrown with the bases empty
is six point five seconds. And when there's someone on
base and the timer goes to twenty seconds, the average
time remaining on the timer when the pitch is thrown
is seven point four seconds.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
So these guys are not up.
Speaker 1 (31:08):
Against this you know timer that's far too fast, and
they're down to the last second every single time. The
players have done a great job adjusting to life with
a pitch timer, and I think it's second nature to them.
Now why would you change it? And the example that
I use Joe when people say, well, listen, it's more
dramatic to have these long moments, these battles between the
(31:31):
pitcher and the hitter. Well, I tell people you will
not find a more dramatic at bet in postseason history
than Kirk Gibson against Dennis Acresley in nineteen eighty eight,
and I went back and looked at that game in
real time and assume there was a timer in place,
and other than Eckrousley picking at first base with Mike
(31:53):
Davis over there more than two times, which would have
been a violation under the pitch timer, there would have
been no violations, including the one timeout that Kirk Gibson
took before he hit that three to.
Speaker 2 (32:07):
Two slider out for the home run.
Speaker 1 (32:09):
So don't tell me we need thirty five forty seconds
between pitches to be more dramatic. So I love the
fact that we're playing by the same rules. Nothing changes,
the game will still be dramatic. I want to get
your take as a manager, Joe, and whether you think
players deserve more time because the games are quote unquote
more meaningful.
Speaker 3 (32:30):
I thought earlier in the year we talked it wasn't
based on meaningful games. Let's talk about meaningful innings. I
thought earlier in the year and again just when it
was fresh, that it might be wise to consider the latters.
A couple of innings of a game like the eighth
and ninth inning possible. It was just at least the
ninth inning to permit a couple more seconds, just for
(32:51):
the like you're talking about the strategy. I thought that
at that time, I never that was as deep as
I got with that. But now that we're talking about it,
now that you're saying all this stuff accurately, I think
what happen, what would happen, is that you would you
would you would mess with the tempo. Uh, these guys,
it's no different than a good golf swing right where
(33:12):
you have tempo in it. When you have tempo and
a good golf swing, normally your ball striking ability increases.
I think these pictures and even the hitters have gotten
to do a tempo now. I think if you gave
them more time, they wouldn't know what to do with it.
I in the beginning was uncomfortable only because they were
accustomed to different habits. But now the habit's been made
that to get in the box, get ready and swing
(33:33):
the bat, and let's go from the hitting perspective and
the pitching perspective. So I think if you permitted more time,
the potential to destroy temp would be there. Number one.
Number two, I don't think it would change. I think,
for the most part, even if you permitted more time,
it would be rare that guys would take more time
on either side. So yeah, I don't I would not
(33:54):
do it, as I guess in my conclusion, I would
not add any more time. I don't think it's necessary.
I think they've learned how to construct their strategy within
the parameters right now, and I don't if anything, you'd
become even more creative regarding getting your strategy across, whether
it's a sign from the bench or something you do
before the game, in regards to staying within this temple
(34:14):
that you've created, and again, I think it would be
actually detrimental. Last point, now that you've brought that up.
The one role I don't like is a throw over.
I mean, listen, base dealing is base even that throws
over to first base to permit it at two say,
I don't agree with that. The bigger bases, I don't
think I've been impactful more still on bases are primarily
(34:34):
because of the fact that you can't throw over more
than two times. If we've remedied the fact that the
pace of the game has been accelerated just based on
the clock, there's different things that can be revisited, as
for example, throwing over to first space not being as
pertinent now, so in other words, permitting the third or
(34:56):
the fourth time to be thrown over because in fact
we're getting the ball to the plate more quickly in
between pitches, and then thus strategic lee being able to
control the running game better as a manager. Managers today
have I think less and less potential impact on the
game because what they're able to do is being mitigated
by rules. Whether it's how to use your bullpen. You
(35:19):
know the fact that how many times you could throw
over and try to control running game. We talked about
the acceleration of pitch outs. You know that better than
me if that's actually occurred. But the more we include
these new rules in the game, run around second base
and a tenth inning, it really mitigates the importance of
a creative manager in a dugout because again, you're making
(35:39):
everything the same, where people that are more creative and
there thinking, more willing to take chances can't because there's
no chance to be taken. It's all the same stuff.
But even when the national leagueslad national league rules and
we different things. I was thinking about the game where
we popped Travis Wooden left field because we had to
(35:59):
based on number of relief pitchers available to us that night.
Things like that you take advantage of the situation as
it is and actually have to be creative and manage
the game that's no longer as necessary. And maybe that
partly speaks to the trend to going towards a middle
management situation as opposed to management situation. So again, this
(36:22):
is a long answer to your question, but I think
temple is important. I think throwing over the first space argument,
if in fact the temple has been impacted in a
positive way, should then get rid of the two over
throwover rule completely, and even to the point where runn
around second base and x R innings. And I know
you kind of like that, but I think we continually
take away strategical analysis from the manager's perspective, where a
(36:48):
team could actually have an edge because somebody's creative in
the dugout.
Speaker 1 (36:52):
Now, I would not argue that, Joe, And that's one
reason why I didn't like the three batter minimum rule.
You're tying the hands of the manager, and I definitely
agree that the manager's input has been mitigate by a
lot of reasons, but even from a strategy standpoint, But
I will say that these new rules have allowed the
(37:12):
style of the game to be better, and I think
about Brandon Hydes. Orioles is my number one example. The
team is six in the major leagues and runs per game,
but they're nowhere near the top in terms of slugging
and home runs. You look at how they win baseball games,
and they take the extra base more than any team in.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
Baseball except the Braves.
Speaker 1 (37:35):
They are second in the major leagues to Tampa Bay
hitting with runners in scoring position, and their defense because
they have athletes all over the field, is exceptional. So
this style of play, and Brandon Hyde said, listen, I
can hit and run, I can bunt, I can move
players to different positions. I've got a lot of flexibility.
(37:55):
You know, the game wasn't played like that for the
last decade. So I'm glad to see that not only
can you play that way, but you can win. This
is a team that doesn't win with slugging. It wins
with athleticism speed. As Brandon Hyde told me, we play
faster than other teams. And it's literally true. When I
watched the Orioles play teams like the Yankees. Man, it's
(38:18):
a mismatch, you know, it is a Formula one race
car going against a jalape because one team is playing
a completely different speed.
Speaker 2 (38:27):
So I like that.
Speaker 1 (38:28):
As far as the base running and the stolen base,
I'll give you some numbers, Joe, because the impact really
hasn't been as great as you might think. In terms
of limits on throwing over, pickoff attempts per game is
down by one point two.
Speaker 2 (38:43):
That's it, okay.
Speaker 1 (38:45):
Stolen base percentage is in terms of stolen based attempts,
it's gone from one point four per game to one
point eight, so that's gone up a bit. Stolen based
success rate is the highest of all time, eighty percent.
It was seventy five percent last year. That's not a
lot in my book. And as far as disengaged, I
(39:05):
was really shocked to hear these.
Speaker 2 (39:07):
Numbers the stolen base percentage.
Speaker 1 (39:09):
You would think that after a guy's picked twice, the
stolen base percentage would be just astronomical right in the
high nineties, because now you can't throw over a third time.
If you do and you don't get the runner, that's
a buck and the guy moves up disengagements without any
being made. The stolen base rate is eighty point seven
percent after one disengagement, it actually goes down slightly to
(39:33):
seventy nine point eight and after two this is really weird.
It goes down to seventy six percent. This success rate
is actually lowest after two disengagements. I guess that means
the pitcher has kept the guy close. So I get
what you're saying that. I would not disagree. There are
more governors on a guy running a game in today's
game than I think there's ever been. It's probably one
(39:55):
reason why no manager has been fired at all this year, and.
Speaker 2 (39:58):
We were just loaded with disappointing teams.
Speaker 1 (40:01):
Correct, But I don't think that the gagement rule has
really changed the game that much. And I like to
see more stolen bases and even the threat of stolen bases.
Speaker 2 (40:11):
I think it's more exciting.
Speaker 3 (40:12):
Well, you've kind of put to bed the thought I thought,
maybe by the thought of the third throwover has actually
increased stolen bases. But you're telling me that it has not,
So I accept that. But I don't even know if
that means the balls being put in play like earlier
in the account. Who knows. There's different things with that,
But that's kind of interesting to me. Any role that
(40:34):
had been put in play in order to implement or
create a better pace of the game. Again, I think
has is not as necessary as it once was thought
to be because the one and only rule that's been
implemented that has made the change or has created to
the desired result is the pitch clock. I mean I
(40:54):
said that from the beginning, I thought that all these
other things are being bandied about or thought about her
and implement it. But the last thing that we put
in play was the one thing that has changed the game,
and that is the fact that you have to throw
the ball within so many seconds. With that, all this
other stuff, to me, should is not necessary. And if
you can get rid of that some of that stuff,
then that puts the game back more into the hands
(41:17):
mentally of the manager and is being able to utilize
his own devices to try to help influence the game
in the favor of his team. Final point that you're saying, agreed,
no managerial firings actually points directly to the point or
fact that these guys are definitely kind of the middle
(41:40):
manager that we've talked about because they're basically implementing what
they've been told to implement before the game begins and
it's kind of a passive method where it's easily deniable
that no, I didn't tell this manager to do whatever,
But in fact, the way these meetings are run and
how the day is set up anymore, and the fact
(42:01):
that you could be horrible on the field and not
feel the pain of it regarding being retained or not.
It just proves how much the front offices are involved
in the daily running of the team on the field. Because,
after all, if you fired somebody after you've told them
what to do constantly, there'd be a good argument for
that manager to come back and say, listen, I was
just doing what they told me to do, and that
(42:22):
in fact is true. I mean, anybody, they could argue
it as much as they want, but it is true.
So all these things are again interrelated and interconnected. End
of the day, pace, clock, love it, everything else. Go
back to playing baseball and that and the last point
what you were saying about the Orioles, they're pretty much
the latter day race. That's exactly what we did in
(42:43):
two thousand and six, seven and eight to become pertinent.
We played that style of baseball. We have the right
kind of athletes, we had the pitching and defense to
back it up, and we developed the method of style
that catapulted us and it's still being utilized today in
Tapa base I like to believe what hiders doing there
in Baltimore should be able to would permit this team
to be that or that kind of a team for
(43:05):
years to come, because obviously, look, this is what Beta's great.
I think the Rays got away from that for wabbly.
They got away from their pitching and defense and try
to become more offensive oriented and they found out didn't work.
I just try to get home runs, the three true outcomes.
But the Ools are doing again copycat situation. More groups
are going to want to do that next year and
again I think hopefully they're learning their lesson there when
(43:28):
it comes to playing baseball on an annual basis, to
be pertinent, this is the way.
Speaker 1 (43:32):
To do it, as always, Joe, great discussion, great insight,
And after that deep dive, we need to take a
break and when we get back, we deserve a little
getaway and we are going to Margueriteville right after this,
(43:57):
all right, Joe, Jimmy Buffett, we lost the great Jimmy Buffett,
and I got a great story to tell. You and
and I'm sure you probably cross paths at some point
because the connection is to Chicago and Wrigley Field. Okay,
back in the early nineteen seventies, before Margaritaville even was
a thing, Jimmy Buffett would play a place called the
(44:21):
Quiet Night, that's with a K, Quiet Night on Belmont Avenue.
He was just one of the many singers, songwriters trapesing
around Chicago, and he fell into a friendship with a
guy named Steve Goodman. He was the headliner at Earl
of Old Town Daga Friendly collaborate on some albums. Actually,
(44:42):
one of Steve Goodman's albums, Jimmy Buffett is on the
cover sitting next to John Prine.
Speaker 2 (44:48):
How about that?
Speaker 3 (44:49):
And you know.
Speaker 2 (44:51):
They played on each other's albums.
Speaker 1 (44:53):
They shared love of music obviously, and a love of
baseball too. Both of them would sit in the Rayfield
bleachers at Wrigley.
Speaker 2 (45:01):
And take in those afternoon games. Nothing better.
Speaker 1 (45:04):
By the way, if you go to Wrigley, I always
recommend you go to a day game first because the
vibe is just it's unbelievable. So Steve Goodman, Actually, in
nineteen eighty four, he was asked by the radio station
there to write a song about the Cubs, and he did,
and that is Go Cubs Go. And unfortunately, Steve Goodman
(45:28):
passed away later that year from leukemia. And Jimmy Buffett,
obviously he wound up playing he was a Cubs fan,
wound up playing the first concert ever at Wrigley Field
back in two thousand and five, wearing his Cubs jersey,
and he promised if the Cubs won the World Series
(45:49):
that he would come back and play Wrigley again, and
he did. He came back twice, and I think it
was twenty seventeen and twenty eighteen. So Jimmy Buffett has
a strong connection or had a strong connection to Wrigley
Go Cubs Go. Oh and the first concert at Wrigley
Field was played by Jimmy Buffett. I'm not sure if
you ever ran across or maybe even you went to
(46:12):
one of these concerts after you won the World Series
with Chicago, Joe, but one of a kind a true
baseball fan. If you're sitting in a bleachers Rayfield bleachers
at Wrigley on an afternoon playing a gig that night
at the Quiet Night Man, you're a true baseball fan.
Speaker 3 (46:28):
Well, let me unpack that a little bit too. For years,
the Red Sox Sweet Caroline came on, and there's nothing
I love more than to be leading that ballgame whenever
that song came on, and after the game, I could
get kind of vicious and how I yelled out towards
(46:49):
the crowd after a victory walking off the mound and
tell them what to do with Sweet Caroline what I
wanted with the Rays. If you ever looked at you've
seen Tropicana Field, of course I always still had it
looked like a big cheeseburger, and I wanted us to
do the same thing. Cheeseburger in Paradise. I thought that'd
be a great middle inning song down there with the Rays.
(47:12):
They get the all ten thousand fans involved, there's seven
thousand fans involved.
Speaker 2 (47:16):
Great sing along tune, absolutely right.
Speaker 3 (47:18):
So I thought it'd be like the and I brought
it up, and of course it never did happen. But yeah,
the Sweet Caroline thing caused me to promote the idea
of Cheeseburger in Paradise for the trot because I've also
thought McDonald or somebody should have just bought the building
or put their name on it, and they made it
look like a cheeseburger from the outside, you know, put
it make the top look like a bun, the middle
(47:39):
looked like a burger, et cetera. It was perfect, perfect
advertising situation. Last thing with him, Yeah, I did meet him.
I met him at the White House with the Cubs
after the World Series when we went there to see
President Obama and he was sitting down in a chair.
He came up introduced himself to I didn't know, sorry, man,
(47:59):
I didn't you know. You got so much going on,
but it came up. Great conversation, sweet man, A totally
total Cub fan. So that was my one moment with
greatness there meeting Jimmy Buffett. I can't remember specifically what
rumor was in the White House and him relating to
me how excited he was for us and the team
(48:21):
and how much of a diehard Cup fan that he was.
So that's why I got to know all that about
mister Buffett.
Speaker 2 (48:26):
That is so cool.
Speaker 1 (48:27):
And by the way, after he won the World Series
in twenty sixteen, Go Cubs Go actually went up to
number three on the Billboard chart. How many years after
Steve Goodman wrote that in nineteen eighty four, got a
lot of airtime and a lot of play in twenty sixteen,
and it's back again.
Speaker 3 (48:46):
By the way, I'll be a Homer a little bit because, yes,
after we won a game at home when that song
came on, that's pretty cool feeling. It's pretty cool feeling.
Everybody there, all the fans are pretty much singing the refrain,
everybody standing up. It's the biggest fraternity party on the
planet every home game. It's wonderful. That's what it is.
It's a frat house. It's beautiful. I love the place,
(49:07):
absolutely loved that place. Was the best time five years
of my life. And that song was perfectly written. The
w flag is a tremendous tradition and that fan base
there is there's nothing like it. Nobody liked them.
Speaker 2 (49:19):
Yeah, you know what, that vibe is starting to come back.
Speaker 3 (49:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (49:22):
Cubs under David Ross look like they're playing again, a
very active style of baseball. I watched that team play
offensive baseball, Joe, and they're moving the baseball. Cody Bellinger
is become a pure hitter, not a slugger. You've got
Madrigall and Horner and all these guys putting the ball
in play again. They run the bases aggressively, a great
(49:42):
defensive team. They're sort of a National League version of
the Baltimore Orioles.
Speaker 2 (49:47):
They are a fun watch.
Speaker 3 (49:50):
I think their middle infield is just throwback as you
get it. I mean, those two guys together could have
played in any Irran baseball once in Horner. I was
with Horner for a bit when I was there. I
love the guy znercom Swamp. I just like the way
they interact, the way they played baseball. It's contagious to
the rest of the group. Bellinger with the renaissance he's
(50:11):
experiencing right now, Ian and leftfield looks outstanding. You mentioned Madrigal,
and I like games John Gomes. I liked that when
he was with Cleveland. Behind the plate. I liked that
part of it too. The kids steal that pitched yesterday.
I never saw him before, but I watched it a
little bit. I didn't realize not a high velocity guy,
but my god, his fastball gets on the hitter. It's
kind of like Andrew Heeny esque in the American League.
(50:33):
It's just that this guy might be a little bit
more demonstrative and how he feels about himself when he's pitching,
but that was that was interesting. And then as Ole Adbert,
I mean I saw him as a starter, but he
all of a sudden he's developed his front hip comebacker
to lefties and did the writings from the back door
really interesting? So yeah, I wish them well. Love ROSSI
(50:54):
loved that whole group. There's a lot of coaches left there,
like guys inside the building, and of course Vja, the
traveling secretary of the whole group. Wonderful.
Speaker 2 (51:02):
Yeah, it's a good vibe.
Speaker 1 (51:03):
And speaking of good vibes, I don't know whether the
Quiet Night is still there on Belmont Avenue. But in
honor of Jimmy Buffett, you have something to take us
out here, this latest edition of the Book of Joe.
Speaker 3 (51:15):
Well, I don't have a Jimmy by just gave you
my Jimmy Buffett. Cheezburger in Paradise got him.
Speaker 1 (51:20):
So, by the way, the Rays have to follow up
on that, because I'm with you. That place does look
like a burger at a box from the outside, So
a little bit of paint, a little bit of ingenuity,
I can definitely see that happening.
Speaker 3 (51:32):
Oh my god, that I could see them staying there
for the next fifty years if they did something like that.
But I was going a different direction. Gosh, I should
have gotten mister Buffet. But I just based on everything
else we're talking about, and because it does come. I mean,
I had this thing about energy plus enthusiasm that's where
victory or success occurs. But knowledge is power, but enthusiasm
(51:56):
pulls the switch. Oh like that, you know, because we
all be like every organization, right, every one of them,
they're working from the same to music. There's a lot
of parody in the game. And there's a lot teams
that are considered good teams, that are playoff caliber, teams
that are just a couple games over five hundred. I mean,
fifteen we came. We're the second wildcard team with ninety
(52:18):
seven wins behind. Then there's Pittsburgh and then there was
the Cardinals went into the division. So I'm looking at that.
I mean, it's kind of interesting the teams that are
barely above five hundred. Even the Twins who are leading
their division are just what there are six games over,
I think, and the Indians are six under. So there's
(52:38):
this is part of it, the sameness of what's going on.
Everybody's trying to play from the same sheet of music.
And then you got the Orioles who are listening to
a little bit of a different tune right now. Look
where they're sitting as an example. So anyway, knowledge is power.
Everybody's got that. But enthusiasm pulls the switch. Creativity pulls
the switch. Not being afraid to go out on the
(52:59):
limb because that's where the fruit is. That's the difference.
Those are the difference makers, and that's what I love.
Speaker 1 (53:04):
I love that, Joe, and that does capture the Orioles
because you watch them play, they smile. I love to
see that. Listen, this game is hard. You have to
be intense to play it. But what you just described there,
that enthusiasm they have. That it's a younger team, yes,
but I like the fact that they enjoy competing intensity
(53:25):
with enthusiasm.
Speaker 2 (53:26):
Tough to beat.
Speaker 3 (53:27):
Well, that's part of why I think some teams have
maybe hit their waterloo a bit based a lot of
if you just want to go with agism, like you
just go with older experienced players, which I like a
smattering of them, but you have to be able to
get normally. The youth is who brings the enthusiasm daily.
After all, everybody fell in love with the Cincinnati Reds.
(53:47):
This year, justifiably everybody's falling with the Orioles in love
with the Ools, although that began last year. I still
think that the Rays capture that kind of vibe and
people glom onto them, Whereas, like the Padres, we keep
asking what's wrong with the Padres? I don't think you
see the same kind of enthusiasm generated this method of play.
(54:09):
That's just kind of like hair on fire stuff. If
you're talented and play with your hair on fire, you
have a pretty good chance of doing well.
Speaker 1 (54:16):
Now that sounds like a whole nother episode What's wrong
with the Padres? But in the meantime, this has been
a blast. And have a toast, have a margarita in
honor of Jimmy Buffet as you call them.
Speaker 3 (54:26):
I just mind today, brother, Thanks man.
Speaker 1 (54:33):
The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.
For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you get your podcasts.
The Book of Joe Podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
Hey there, welcome back.
Speaker 1 (00:15):
To the latest episode of the Book of Joe Podcast
with me, Tom Verducci and Joe Madden.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Joe, how is your holiday weekend?
Speaker 3 (00:23):
It was wonderful, Tommy. I played every day Friday, Saturday, Sunday, Monday,
little picnic at the Lindy's last night. Yeah, the weather
was wormed up a little bit. Also air rating today
the back nine. How about that? So I only got
the front nine to play. But overall a really good time.
And how about yourself down there in Princeton.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Awesome, man, As you said, the weather was great, A
little golfing, a little biking, a little swimming in the pool.
It was perfect way to end or so unofficially in
the summer. And by the way, I capped the weekend
by doing the Orioles Angels game on FS one.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
OK.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
And we've got to start with that because these angels,
your angels, Joe Madden, keep giving us angel moments.
Speaker 2 (01:12):
How about this? This is so angels.
Speaker 1 (01:15):
They get back off a road trip and show Hey,
o'tani who like rarely, if ever, takes batting practice on
the field.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
It's very unusual for him to hit on the field.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
Decides, first day back at home, he's going to hit
on the field. The batting practice picture throws him a
nasty cutter down and end. He tries to hold up
his swing and there goes his oblique. He had to
walk out of the cage, off the field, scratched, not
in the lineup for the first time since May second.
And Joe, you know how these oblique things go. Oh,
(01:47):
I mean, we don't know yet the severity of the injury,
but there's a possibility because those things sometimes, if you
do it badly enough, can be weeks. That may be
the last time we see shoe hey Otani in an
angel's uniform. That to me is just such an angel's moment.
And of course this came basically minutes after his agent,
Nez Bolelo, talked about show Hayes elbow. Of course, he
(02:10):
has the tear in the UCL and nes to Nobody's surprised,
I don't think, said listen, it's inevitable he's going to
need some procedure on the elbow. But he's going to
hit and he's going to pitch again. So he painted
as optimistic a picture as you can about the injury,
but now you got to deal with oblique. I mean,
come on, you can't make this stuff up. What a season,
(02:32):
sixty two players the Angels have gone through this year
and now we'll have to see how long show Hey
o Tani is out.
Speaker 3 (02:39):
Yeah, I'm just going unpacking that whole thing. A the
fact that he was on the field, probably because he's
not pitching anymore, so he has all this extra time,
and he felt as though, I need to get out
on the field, to just go out there because I
don't want to sit inside all day. It's going to
drive me crazy. So I don't doubt that that was
part of it. And then maybe just having the fans
see him for the last time, possibly in Angel Stadium there, whatever,
(03:02):
whatever the the thoughts process was. But then to injure
himself like that, and if if in fact it isn't oblique,
and there's no reason to doubt that he probably is
done for the season. Those things do take a while
to heal, if anygether. There's different degrees or levels, but
even an average kind of an average oblique situation, he's
probably done for three weeks or whatever it's going to be,
(03:25):
and that would be so awkward the way he has
appeared in an Angel uniform for the very last time.
Moving it forward, I do believe Nez though. I do
believe that he will play and he's going to do
both things. I'm just curious as to their strategy with
the arm surgery, etc. And how that's going to play out.
I read something about a new technique or some kind
of a sleeve or something that they're wearing these days
(03:46):
to help the healing process. I think I read something
like that. But he's going to primarily be a hitter,
it sounds like next year, and then move back into
the pitching market. I don't doubt, knowing that his level
degree of professionalism and how badly he wants to both,
that he will do both. But I also believe the
(04:08):
hitting part will come back a little bit more readily.
I think the throwing part may take more time.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
Yeah, and listen, and nes was optimistic, saying that the
injury in the UCL was not the same area that
was repaired back in twenty eighteen or whenever he had
the surgery. And you know, he had the surgery then
in October October first, and he missed the first month
of the next season. Came back in May of the
(04:33):
following season after Tommy John surgery, and Nez pretty much
guaranteed that show Hey will be in somebody's opening lineup
next year, that the recovery is at least he's implying,
will be a little bit quicker here.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
And I'm with you, Joe.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
I don't doubt that whoever signed Sho Hey o Tani,
they're going to get him as a two way player.
Maybe not for twenty twenty four, but you know how
much this guy loves to play baseball, and he's bound
and determined to keep doing this. And I know a
lot of people are saying, well, why not just have
the surgery now? Angels are out of it meaningless games,
They're not meaningless to show Hey, and you know that
(05:09):
this guy loves to play baseball, and is he chasing
the MVP, of course, and he's got some other numbers.
The Angels single season home run record is forty seven
by Troy Glass.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
He's got a shot at that.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
But it just comes down to the fact he loves
to play baseball and he can hit. Right now, there's
absolutely no limitation on him as a hitter right now.
So I'm not surprised he's continuing to play. He just
loves to play, and I think it really is that simple.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
It is that simple. It's not complicated at all. I
just hearing about as long as there's an assurance kind
of that he's going to be able to hit at
an earlier month next baseball season, that he'll be able
to participate as a hitter for sure, that would be
all he needs to know. If he's getting those kind
of assurances, then he's going to want to play the
(05:54):
rest of the month. Maybe outside of the oblique right now,
but yeah, that's he is. I mean, yes, he wants
to have the Angels record from home runs, he wants
to win an MVP Award. He wants all that stuff,
absolutely does. That's how he's driven, and there's nothing wrong
with that. It's a part of the greatness as a
part of being driven, it's a part of being able
to perform annually at a level that maybe others can't perform.
(06:17):
Part of it is the fact that he is very talented.
The other part is that he's just not going to
be denied. I mean, you could go into other sports
primarily look Tom Brady or Michael Jordan or Larry Bird
in our sport, he'd have to. I mean more recently,
I think the Yankees run in general, which youeter in
that particular group, but it takes a different mental method
(06:40):
annually daily that causes or permits guys like this to
be that good day after day after day. It's not easy,
and then year after year after year, because once you've
achieved certain things, I think human nature almost causes you
to kind of step back a bit. It's not as
important as it had been. But then there's this other
group that it is as important to continue to be
(07:02):
that great, continued to perform at mv MVP caliber, and
to win championships. So that's that's him. He is Bird,
he is Michael Jordan, he is Tom Brady's all those
guys in a baseball uniform. And that's what sets him apart.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
And think about when shohe was an international free agent.
First of all, he came over here at an age
where if he had waited a year or two, he
could have been an unrestricted free agent, but his earnings
were limited, so he basically gave up probably two hundred
million dollars of earnings at that point to sign because
he wanted to come to Major League Baseball to be
a two way player, and he essentially fell into the
(07:43):
lapse of the Angels, right. I mean, one of the
first things he said was I don't want to play
on the East Coast at National League at the time
did not have.
Speaker 2 (07:52):
The designated hitter.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
It probably made him lean more towards an American League
team to be able to be a two way player.
And again, as I said, he pretty much fell into
the lapse of the of the Angels, and you got
him at somewhat of a bargain price. And now here
we are six years with the Angels, and he's played
on teams that have never finished closer than ten games
(08:16):
in first place, that over the course of the six
years are sixty two games under five hundred. And he
will not see a playoff game, at least if he
doesn't return with the Angels in an Angel's uniform. It's
just amazing to me and Joe, I'll go back to
and I know you won't bring this up, but when
you were let go as the Angels manager, the team
was just two games under five hundred. Since then, they're
(08:39):
twenty four games under five hundred. They're eight and twenty
three in their last thirty one games here. Once they
were all in at the deadline, and I was a
big fan of what they did because they still had
a winning record at that time. You had Otana, you
had Trout coming back. You don't punt a season when
you have a winning record, a positive run. Differentially, you
haven't been to the postseason in eight years. I get
(09:01):
all that, but man, it has just fallen part and
now this is just the latest. So I don't know, Joe.
I know that Mike Trout has talked about wanting to
talk to the front office at the end of the season.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
That's kind of boiler played stuff.
Speaker 1 (09:16):
When you're a franchise player like that, you've got seven
years on the contract with the organization. You want to
know what the future is, what the plans are. I
don't think Mike's got kind of guy who's go don't
force anything. You know him well, Joe, and I don't
know what those conversations are going to be like. But man,
the Angels, and I'll say this, Mike Trout, they're at
(09:36):
a tough spot here and how they pivot out of
this position they're in.
Speaker 3 (09:40):
Yeah, I just compared Showy to some really iconic players,
but the difference was that they were on championship teams.
And that's the one thing that's been driving show. I mean,
physical talent wise, he is on par with those guys,
but when missing element is the most important element that's
to win championships. Yeah, with Michael, I read all that,
I just like Shuzer had done. I guess with the
(10:02):
Mets wants a meeting that The part that strikes me
about that is how foreign that is from back in
the day, where a player would ever never even ask
for a summit number or two B granted one. That's
that's kind of the difference in today's world compared to
the past. For Michael. I mean, he's got a pretty
ironclad contract, and I do believe he sees himself as
(10:25):
an angel now and forever. I do. I also believe
that he believes that somehow they're going to work through
this and it's gonna they're gonna get back on the
winning ways. So I'm curious. I mean, I don't see
Michael as being demanding. I don't see him that way.
I think more curious than anything, as he may, you know,
sit with Artie or John or or Perry whomever and
(10:48):
ask different questions about the future. I don't think it'll
get too heavy with him, I don't think so. Just
trying to find out exactly what everybody's thinking, and they
just try to move it forward. So I don't think
it's the monstrative situation. I don't think it's like he's
going to make any kind of demands or any kind
of threats. I don't see him doing that kind of thing.
It's just a curiosity thing, I think, and just to
ameliorate his mind and find out or figure out what's happening.
(11:09):
Because I think back to original point. I think part
of why showhe wanted to be there the Angels were
on the West Coast, but they also had Mike Trapp.
I think maybe he thought being a part of that
dynamic would help propel this team to the point where
they would be a championship team. Yeah, I mean last point. Yeah.
When I left there, was gotten off to the best
start they had gotten off to in years years and
(11:31):
ran into a mad moment. We just like Showy stopped
hitting for a bit, Michael stopped hitting for a bit,
and the bullpen was struggling. That's pretty much what it happened,
and from that part, it was disappointing because I've always
saw myself as a California Angel, and I think we've
talked about this. I've never liked the moniker Los Angeles
Angels or Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim, even Anaheim Angels,
(11:51):
even though we went a world series that way, saw
us as California Angels, and that was something that I
had near and dear to my heart. Was still wanted
to be part of that resurgence. But again, it's not
necessarily like that anymore. It's not disloyalty factor, traditions not
as important to different groups. So yeah, yeah, I was
disappointed to be able let go to being let go there.
(12:12):
I really there's a lot of unfinished work and I
do I love that organization, So that part was disappointing.
But moving it forward it's going to be hard, very hard.
It's going to take a while to get back on
the winning track.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
I think, yeah, I'm with you, Mike.
Speaker 1 (12:26):
I think you said this well in the book that
Mike is the gun and gut kind of player, kind
of person who never wants to disappoint anybody, and I've
always felt like he is such a loyal soldier, if
you will, especially for a guy who was sitting there
through the first half of the draft and waiting for
someone to take him, and the Angels did, and they've
(12:47):
signed him to a couple of extensions in that contract,
and I think his loyalty is really strong to the
Angels in general, to Artie Moreno in particular. So I
you know, he's got what like seven years, two hundred
and forty five million left on his contract. I'm sure
he's as frustrated as anybody about not being able to
get back to the postseason. But I have a hard
(13:08):
time thinking that Mike is going to say, hey, get
me out of here.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
And I mean, who knows.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
It might be tough to move Mike Trout because he
hasn't been healthy the last four years and with the
money left on the contract.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
Listen, you can trade anybody. We all know that. And
he's still Mike Trout.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
But he has questions Joe that I think everybody has
looking at the Angels, like where do you pivot from here?
I mean, you were basically all in with Mike and
with shohe on the same group. They've really been aggressive
promoting their young players to the big leagues. I'm not
sure how many are going to be impact players. But man,
if you're Mike Trout or an Angels fan, you have
to wonder where do we go from here.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
I look at teams like.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
The Padres, the White Sox, even the Yankees, the Angels,
a lot of disappointing teams who are all in the Mets,
and it's hard to see where those teams pivot to
get really good again.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
I can't disagree with that. You just can't go out
and buy yourself a whole new team. I have seen
some of the players. They've brought up, nice players, but
I don't see them as being like lead singers. I
see them being more part of the support group, a
nice support group. And yeah, it's just you just can't
there's nothing to trade. You can't really trade for guys
that all of a sudden are going to make it
(14:20):
all work. It's going to be difficult. There's no question
how they're going to do it. Probably an amalgam of
a lot of different things in an attempt. But it's
it's going to take a while. It's just gonna especially
after this blood letting right now, letting all putting all
those guys out on the irrevocable waivers and having them
all leave, I know most of them probably maybe we're
(14:42):
not going to be part of the future. However, had
they hit it, some of these guys might have stuck
around for a bit. They still have nice players. I
like Dreary a lot. I like Renfro. Renfro is like
one of those mercenaries over the last couple of years
that always ends up playing for a winning situation. Drury,
to me, is one of the better hitters that nobody
talks about. And I love these guy Mistokas. These are guys,
(15:02):
but you got to build it around them. Their pitching
staff has to be more productive consistently. They have something.
I know Sandy had a tough year and I'm a
big Patrick Sandoval fan. Huge. I love the fact that
Griff Canning has really made a nice comeback. I've watched
him pitch a couple of times, and I like what
he's doing stuff wise. I like his delivery, I like
the shape of his pitches. I like a lot of
(15:23):
that redebtmers. I still believe he's going to find his
confidence and once he does, he'll be a really solid
major league pitcher. They got some nice arms in the bullpen,
but then again they let them go, So this is
interesting to be able. Probably their goal would be to
be able to put together some kind of competitive team
next year, as opposed to a Pennant when he kind
(15:44):
of team next year. So it'll be very creative in
regards to the offseason trying to figure out the method,
the way we're going to go about this. And I
think finally you have to define exactly what are we
going to try to do, what do we want to
be going into the season, what is realistic and then
try to attempt to work around that thought.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
Yeah, there's not an easy answer to that.
Speaker 1 (16:08):
I know that Ardie Moreno has never really been interested
in doing a full on rebuild. It's a great fan
base out there. He's very much into the entertainment side
of the business. Nothing wrong with that, because you know,
they do keep taking prices down. They do a pretty
good job of feeling that place. But man, everything this
year that could go wrong has gone wrong. Even you know,
(16:30):
I thought they made a brilliant move by putting those
veteran players on the waiver wire to try to get
under the luxury tax limit. I mean, the worst thing
to do is is you go over the luxury tax
threshold and you're not even a postseason team.
Speaker 2 (16:43):
Right. That's what the Padres are doing, the Yankees are doing.
But for the.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
Angels, you know, they were trying to limbo under that number.
And it looks like, and it's going to come down
to an eleventh hour accounting. It looks like by not
having someone take Randall Gritchick and what was left on
his contract, they wind up being.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
A little bit over the threshold.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
And man, it reminds me of the great Sparky Anderson
once said the three Detroit Tigers, they lost one hundred
and nineteen games, one short of the Mets one hundred
and twenty back in nineteen sixty two, and he said,
even when we were losing, we couldn't lose the right way.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
You might as well break the record. That's been the
year for the Angels.
Speaker 3 (17:28):
That's outstanding. Yeah, I was just curious too, like when
they went through the sole process of acquiring these guys
was the escape patch this particular strategy today, having the
back of their minds if it did not go well,
that we could still do this and come out kind
of being okay with the whole process or situation. I'm
(17:49):
just curious if it was something they thought of after
they made the acquisition. How could we write this and
then we put these guys out on waivers or going
into it. If they knew that this was part of
the potential process, that would be a great foresight on
their part.
Speaker 2 (18:04):
I think, yeah, really good question.
Speaker 3 (18:06):
Yeah, I'm just curious about that, because if you had
that thought out all the way, that's pretty solid.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
Yeah, it was a brilliant move.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
I got to give him credit for that, and it's
something I think you're going to see in future years
going forward at August thirty, first deadline, because veterans have
to be on your club at that point to be
postseason eligible.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
So you put these players out on.
Speaker 1 (18:25):
The curb, so to speak, where teams can acquire them
without giving up any prospect capital, no capital at all.
You're just assuming the contract. But you're going to see
that I think happened years four. We're going to call
that waiver day when these players are put out there
on the curve for other teams to pick up.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
No such problem in Baltimore, Joe. I want to talk.
Speaker 1 (18:46):
About Gunner Henderson and this class of rookies that we're
looking at this year.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
He is just so impressive.
Speaker 1 (18:53):
And I want to get your take on Gunner Henderson
and the rookie class of twenty twenty three when we
get back right.
Speaker 2 (18:59):
After this.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Welcome Back to the Book of Joe podcast. Hey Joe,
I mentioned Gunner Henderson and man, he is just so impressive.
Speaker 2 (19:15):
Brandon Hyde's done a great job.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
You know, this is a kid goes back and forth
between shortstop and third base.
Speaker 2 (19:21):
He loses nothing.
Speaker 1 (19:23):
I mean, generally you think for a young player, you
want to leave him at one position, but it doesn't
seem to bother this kid to me, he's the favorite
the American League for the Rookie of the Year. You've
got Corbyn Carroll in the America in the National League.
Very similar type player when you talk about a combination
of power and speed, just super athletic, high baseball IQs.
Speaker 2 (19:44):
I was looking at this, Joe just the other day.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
We have eight rookies this year who've already hit twenty
home runs, and the record for any one season most
rookies with twenty home runs is nine, and that was
back in twenty seventeen. You had one of those in
Ian happ But Matn what a group you talked about
co Carol Gunner Henderson, Tristan Cassas, Josh Young, Jiner Diaz
(20:10):
with the Astros, Francisco Alvarez Young catcher with the Mets,
Anthony Volpi, Spencer Steer, and maybe Josh Autman with the
Dodgers is going to get there to tie that record.
Maybe Masataka Yoshida will get there as well. But man,
let's start with Gunner Henderson. You tell me you've watched him.
What do you like about this player for the Baltimore Orioles.
Speaker 3 (20:31):
Energy, enthusiasm. I just love the way he goes about
his business, very athletic, and the fact that you mentioned
the fact that he's going between two positions. I think
with Hydra season there is a little bit of Hobby
bias regarding athleticism. When we had Hobby with the Cubbies,
he was playing second base, then eventually shortstop whatever, and
(20:53):
third base when John Lester pitched. We liked him at
third base because he took all the pressure of Johnny
regarding bunts. KB worked his way into being a good
defensive third base. But Hobby was extraordinary. So when you
have a guy like this, athletically. You could whether it's
based on who's pitching that day for the opposition and
how you want to set up your lineup, or maybe
(21:14):
it's a defensive situation based on a pitcher who lacks
some kind of fielding acumen where he might be challenged
during the course of the game. Because it was definitely
a safety net for John but Henderson, I'm watching the
ball comes off the bad hot I watched him. I
know early on he struggled. I'm just you know, listening
about him, hearing about his pedigree whatever. But I'm watching
him go dang. I mean, there's a lot to like there.
(21:37):
You can see why. And people liked him. And I
also liked that he did not seem to get easily
frustrated when things weren't going as way. I took that
as a good sign. Also, so I'm strike out a
little bit. Didn't see the bat getting flipped and thrown.
I didn't see him arguing with umpires things like that.
So these these are the kind of signs because you
know the guy's good. You know he's good. You're watching
in MVP. Look at his numbers in the minor leagues.
(22:00):
You hear all the instructors, what they say about them. Okay,
it's good, solid, but then you watch his demeanor and
how he approaches failure. Those are the kind of things
that set people apart really good players and athletes. So
that's my take on him. Watching from a distance, so athletic,
and you could actually play them based on defensively how
you want it set up, possibly rearrange your team to
(22:21):
get somebody else involved because he can do this. And
then again, just a live body and a live bat
that's going to keep getting better.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:30):
First one hundred and sixty games in the Big leagues,
twenty two homers, eighty eight RBIs, ninety three runs scored,
twenty two years old, middle infielder with speed and as
you mentioned power. I mean, that's a franchise player and
you've already got one behind a plate in Adlie Rushman.
And there was news this week about another I believe
franchise player for Baltimore, Jackson Holiday Joe. He's just nineteen
(22:55):
years old and he has absolutely torn up every single level.
He has shot through four levels this year the minor
leagues and the Orioles promoted him to Triple A. I
don't know how you feel about a teenager and pushing
a kid like that to the big leagues in a
pennant race, no less. But I'm of the mind, given
(23:17):
this kid's pedigree, how well he has succeeded at each level.
Speaker 2 (23:21):
If I'm Brandon Hyde, I'm Micha.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Elias, the GM of the Baltimore Orioles, I'm not ruling
out the possibility and maybe even probability, that this kid
is on my playoff roster. Get him up in September,
give him at bats. I'm not saying he has to
be an everyday player, but if he's tearing up Triple
A like he's done every other level this year, and
you're the Baltimore Orioles and you get a chance to
(23:45):
win the American League pennant and you've got someone that talented,
it doesn't matter to me if he's nineteen years old.
I mean, I'll watched Andrew Jones walking the Yankee Stadium
in the World Series game at nineteen.
Speaker 2 (23:55):
It hit two home runs. You know, talent plays.
Speaker 1 (23:58):
So I don't know how aggressive the Orioles want to
be with Jackson Holliday, but I would not rule out
the possibility that Matt Holliday's kid will be in the
big leagues by the time this year is out, and
maybe on a playoff roster.
Speaker 3 (24:10):
So that's where to me, like a good old fashioned
Scott he comes into play. There's always the anomaly guy.
Remember what the Rays were playing the Rangers in Texas
in a playoff game, and Matt Moore, who had been
up I think for a cup of coffee with us
Rocco Baldelli vehemently argued in the office in Texas that
(24:30):
he was ready to pitch that game and to be
the starting pitcher in Texas. I remember the first pitch
of the game, Ian Kinsler filed it off right over
their doug out. He was so late on the fastball.
But that was a situation that we thought that Matt
was ready to rock and roll, and the fact that
Rocco really promoted it made all the difference in the
(24:51):
world in regards to us giving him that opportunity. So
I do believe every situation has to be handled uniquely individually,
and I do believe this is where real scouting takes
shape or takes form. There's no way an analytical model
can tell you that Matt Moore is ready to pitch
that game, where Jackson's ready to play in the big
league game in this particular time of the year. This
(25:12):
is where eyeballs really mattered. This is where really true
scouting matters. Knowing your player really matters. Frankie Rodriguez another
guy with the Angels. That was wow. He came up
and you know, social was kind of reticent putting him
in the game, even though we had heard everything we
had heard, and then Fly popped him in the game,
and wow, it was electric. And then we ended up
(25:34):
going to the World Series and winning it. Probably could
not have done it without him. You know, we had
a nice bullpen and everything. Percy was our guy, but
Frankie came up at a young age and impacted that
that run in that series in a way that nobody
else could have. Real scouting, So I think when he
gets to this time of the year, if in fact
you want to take a shot at a kid like that,
(25:54):
you have to have some real strong opinions in a room.
Of course, the guys had to have done well, something
that's obvious to everybody. But makeup is a way that
gets bandied about a lot, and how he handles adversity,
how he handles failure will he be able to, you know,
process this moment and not become overwhelmed by it. Those
are the kind of that's the kind of commentary you
(26:17):
want to hear to feel confident to give somebody this
kind of opportunity.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
That's interesting, Joe, because that assumes that there's people in
the front office who have that kind of sway, who
have that kind of eye for talent, right, because what
you're saying is that no matter what his numbers are,
no matter what his ex velocity is and his launch angle,
you need someone with wisdom and experience to look at
the kid playing and say, you know what, he's major
(26:42):
league ready, and we don't worry about him falling on
his face, how he might handle, say a slow start.
You need people in your organization then who are in
position to make those kind of judgments. I don't know
whether that's Michaelias the GM, whether he's got people that
he trusted in that position, but you're making a good
case of having people who have the baseball acumen besides
(27:04):
the technology to make those kind of determinations.
Speaker 3 (27:08):
That's all about balance. We talk about that all the time.
I do believe it's good and necessary when you have
that when you have people that have seen like a
Frankie Rodriguez show up or whomever. That the night we
put Kevin Kiermeyer in center field in the latter part
of the game in Texas, it was his first appearance.
This was the I think it was the one game
(27:29):
playoff against the Rangers before we went on and played Cleveland,
and Cleveland it was like a pre wild card game
because we have been tied. But the again Andrew Andrew Friedman,
who I consider a really good scout. Andrew and I
used to talk about We've talked about this before, but
there was other minor league personnel in that group that
(27:49):
was adamant. Yeah, put him out there. He's not gonna
have any problems. You're gonna love this. He could run
anything down. He's better than what you have. You hear
all those kind of phrases, and then you feel confident
doing it. And the other part is everybody being on
the same page, just in just in fact, if something
were to go wrong, and it's not the point, fingers,
(28:10):
it's just that if it doesn't play out, the whole
group was on the same page philosophically, and that is
the proverbial having one another's back, and that's really a
wonderful place to be, and it makes your decision making
feel more accurate and sure when you have that kind
of support. So that was it too with KK put
(28:31):
a minute about the seventh or eighth inning and text,
I remember running out there. The old Texas Ballpark was
kind of dark in the outfield from the dugout and
there is out there like nothing like APPS like he
was shagging balls and BP. But again, that was the
assurance of minor league personnel that had been around him.
So this is the kind of stuff that I don't
know to what level organizations really rely on this kind
(28:55):
of stuff anymore. To me running an organization, I want
all of that I want again because a manager, I
want all of that. I want power. I want power pitching.
I want guys to throw under armed. I want guys
that are good against lefties. I want guys they're not
to steal base, guys who know how to make contact
ladder part of the game when it's necessary. I want
all of that. So I want to be able to
(29:15):
balance whether my data and eyeballs come together. I need that.
I need to hear both. I need to hear the
analytical side of the numerical side, what what plays, what
you think plays with this person brings to bear that
I also need. I always use the term Larry Bow,
but Larry Boat type looking out in the minor league system,
(29:36):
walk in the fields and seeing them during the year,
reporting back and telling me what they see also really
important to me. So again, balance is the key word here. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
I love hearing those examples about deciding when someone is
ready for the big leagues. So the Orioles may be
up against that decision. Hey, hey, Joe, I want to
get your take and pick your manager brain. On a
big announcement, I think it was big for Major League
Baseball the past week where they decided they will not
change the playing rules, specifically the pitch timer for postseason play.
(30:09):
There had been some chatter among players that, hey, postseason games,
they're more important. Slow the game down. We need more
time because there's more on the line. Penance and history
are decided, and some people thought maybe we can add
some time to the clock.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
Uh uh, not happening.
Speaker 1 (30:24):
I am a big proponent of playing the game the
same way we've been playing it for six months, and
the numbers back it up. We're now, at a point
where seventy five percent of Major League games are played
with no violations at all, it's rare to see a
pitch timer violation. And major League Baseball looked at the numbers,
(30:44):
and of course, with the bass is empty, that pitch
timer is fifteen seconds. The average time remaining on the
timer when a pitch is thrown with the bases empty
is six point five seconds. And when there's someone on
base and the timer goes to twenty seconds, the average
time remaining on the timer when the pitch is thrown
is seven point four seconds.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
So these guys are not up.
Speaker 1 (31:08):
Against this you know timer that's far too fast, and
they're down to the last second every single time. The
players have done a great job adjusting to life with
a pitch timer, and I think it's second nature to them.
Now why would you change it? And the example that
I use Joe when people say, well, listen, it's more
dramatic to have these long moments, these battles between the
(31:31):
pitcher and the hitter. Well, I tell people you will
not find a more dramatic at bet in postseason history
than Kirk Gibson against Dennis Acresley in nineteen eighty eight,
and I went back and looked at that game in
real time and assume there was a timer in place,
and other than Eckrousley picking at first base with Mike
(31:53):
Davis over there more than two times, which would have
been a violation under the pitch timer, there would have
been no violations, including the one timeout that Kirk Gibson
took before he hit that three to.
Speaker 2 (32:07):
Two slider out for the home run.
Speaker 1 (32:09):
So don't tell me we need thirty five forty seconds
between pitches to be more dramatic. So I love the
fact that we're playing by the same rules. Nothing changes,
the game will still be dramatic. I want to get
your take as a manager, Joe, and whether you think
players deserve more time because the games are quote unquote
more meaningful.
Speaker 3 (32:30):
I thought earlier in the year we talked it wasn't
based on meaningful games. Let's talk about meaningful innings. I
thought earlier in the year and again just when it
was fresh, that it might be wise to consider the latters.
A couple of innings of a game like the eighth
and ninth inning possible. It was just at least the
ninth inning to permit a couple more seconds, just for
(32:51):
the like you're talking about the strategy. I thought that
at that time, I never that was as deep as
I got with that. But now that we're talking about it,
now that you're saying all this stuff accurately, I think
what happen, what would happen, is that you would you
would you would mess with the tempo. Uh, these guys,
it's no different than a good golf swing right where
(33:12):
you have tempo in it. When you have tempo and
a good golf swing, normally your ball striking ability increases.
I think these pictures and even the hitters have gotten
to do a tempo now. I think if you gave
them more time, they wouldn't know what to do with it.
I in the beginning was uncomfortable only because they were
accustomed to different habits. But now the habit's been made
that to get in the box, get ready and swing
(33:33):
the bat, and let's go from the hitting perspective and
the pitching perspective. So I think if you permitted more time,
the potential to destroy temp would be there. Number one.
Number two, I don't think it would change. I think,
for the most part, even if you permitted more time,
it would be rare that guys would take more time
on either side. So yeah, I don't I would not
(33:54):
do it, as I guess in my conclusion, I would
not add any more time. I don't think it's necessary.
I think they've learned how to construct their strategy within
the parameters right now, and I don't if anything, you'd
become even more creative regarding getting your strategy across, whether
it's a sign from the bench or something you do
before the game, in regards to staying within this temple
(34:14):
that you've created, and again, I think it would be
actually detrimental. Last point, now that you've brought that up.
The one role I don't like is a throw over.
I mean, listen, base dealing is base even that throws
over to first base to permit it at two say,
I don't agree with that. The bigger bases, I don't
think I've been impactful more still on bases are primarily
(34:34):
because of the fact that you can't throw over more
than two times. If we've remedied the fact that the
pace of the game has been accelerated just based on
the clock, there's different things that can be revisited, as
for example, throwing over to first space not being as
pertinent now, so in other words, permitting the third or
(34:56):
the fourth time to be thrown over because in fact
we're getting the ball to the plate more quickly in
between pitches, and then thus strategic lee being able to
control the running game better as a manager. Managers today
have I think less and less potential impact on the
game because what they're able to do is being mitigated
by rules. Whether it's how to use your bullpen. You
(35:19):
know the fact that how many times you could throw
over and try to control running game. We talked about
the acceleration of pitch outs. You know that better than
me if that's actually occurred. But the more we include
these new rules in the game, run around second base
and a tenth inning, it really mitigates the importance of
a creative manager in a dugout because again, you're making
(35:39):
everything the same, where people that are more creative and
there thinking, more willing to take chances can't because there's
no chance to be taken. It's all the same stuff.
But even when the national leagueslad national league rules and
we different things. I was thinking about the game where
we popped Travis Wooden left field because we had to
(35:59):
based on number of relief pitchers available to us that night.
Things like that you take advantage of the situation as
it is and actually have to be creative and manage
the game that's no longer as necessary. And maybe that
partly speaks to the trend to going towards a middle
management situation as opposed to management situation. So again, this
(36:22):
is a long answer to your question, but I think
temple is important. I think throwing over the first space argument,
if in fact the temple has been impacted in a
positive way, should then get rid of the two over
throwover rule completely, and even to the point where runn
around second base and x R innings. And I know
you kind of like that, but I think we continually
take away strategical analysis from the manager's perspective, where a
(36:48):
team could actually have an edge because somebody's creative in
the dugout.
Speaker 1 (36:52):
Now, I would not argue that, Joe, And that's one
reason why I didn't like the three batter minimum rule.
You're tying the hands of the manager, and I definitely
agree that the manager's input has been mitigate by a
lot of reasons, but even from a strategy standpoint, But
I will say that these new rules have allowed the
(37:12):
style of the game to be better, and I think
about Brandon Hydes. Orioles is my number one example. The
team is six in the major leagues and runs per game,
but they're nowhere near the top in terms of slugging
and home runs. You look at how they win baseball games,
and they take the extra base more than any team in.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
Baseball except the Braves.
Speaker 1 (37:35):
They are second in the major leagues to Tampa Bay
hitting with runners in scoring position, and their defense because
they have athletes all over the field, is exceptional. So
this style of play, and Brandon Hyde said, listen, I
can hit and run, I can bunt, I can move
players to different positions. I've got a lot of flexibility.
(37:55):
You know, the game wasn't played like that for the
last decade. So I'm glad to see that not only
can you play that way, but you can win. This
is a team that doesn't win with slugging. It wins
with athleticism speed. As Brandon Hyde told me, we play
faster than other teams. And it's literally true. When I
watched the Orioles play teams like the Yankees. Man, it's
(38:18):
a mismatch, you know, it is a Formula one race
car going against a jalape because one team is playing
a completely different speed.
Speaker 2 (38:27):
So I like that.
Speaker 1 (38:28):
As far as the base running and the stolen base,
I'll give you some numbers, Joe, because the impact really
hasn't been as great as you might think. In terms
of limits on throwing over, pickoff attempts per game is
down by one point two.
Speaker 2 (38:43):
That's it, okay.
Speaker 1 (38:45):
Stolen base percentage is in terms of stolen based attempts,
it's gone from one point four per game to one
point eight, so that's gone up a bit. Stolen based
success rate is the highest of all time, eighty percent.
It was seventy five percent last year. That's not a
lot in my book. And as far as disengaged, I
(39:05):
was really shocked to hear these.
Speaker 2 (39:07):
Numbers the stolen base percentage.
Speaker 1 (39:09):
You would think that after a guy's picked twice, the
stolen base percentage would be just astronomical right in the
high nineties, because now you can't throw over a third time.
If you do and you don't get the runner, that's
a buck and the guy moves up disengagements without any
being made. The stolen base rate is eighty point seven
percent after one disengagement, it actually goes down slightly to
(39:33):
seventy nine point eight and after two this is really weird.
It goes down to seventy six percent. This success rate
is actually lowest after two disengagements. I guess that means
the pitcher has kept the guy close. So I get
what you're saying that. I would not disagree. There are
more governors on a guy running a game in today's
game than I think there's ever been. It's probably one
(39:55):
reason why no manager has been fired at all this year, and.
Speaker 2 (39:58):
We were just loaded with disappointing teams.
Speaker 1 (40:01):
Correct, But I don't think that the gagement rule has
really changed the game that much. And I like to
see more stolen bases and even the threat of stolen bases.
Speaker 2 (40:11):
I think it's more exciting.
Speaker 3 (40:12):
Well, you've kind of put to bed the thought I thought,
maybe by the thought of the third throwover has actually
increased stolen bases. But you're telling me that it has not,
So I accept that. But I don't even know if
that means the balls being put in play like earlier
in the account. Who knows. There's different things with that,
But that's kind of interesting to me. Any role that
(40:34):
had been put in play in order to implement or
create a better pace of the game. Again, I think
has is not as necessary as it once was thought
to be because the one and only rule that's been
implemented that has made the change or has created to
the desired result is the pitch clock. I mean I
(40:54):
said that from the beginning, I thought that all these
other things are being bandied about or thought about her
and implement it. But the last thing that we put
in play was the one thing that has changed the game,
and that is the fact that you have to throw
the ball within so many seconds. With that, all this
other stuff, to me, should is not necessary. And if
you can get rid of that some of that stuff,
then that puts the game back more into the hands
(41:17):
mentally of the manager and is being able to utilize
his own devices to try to help influence the game
in the favor of his team. Final point that you're saying, agreed,
no managerial firings actually points directly to the point or
fact that these guys are definitely kind of the middle
(41:40):
manager that we've talked about because they're basically implementing what
they've been told to implement before the game begins and
it's kind of a passive method where it's easily deniable
that no, I didn't tell this manager to do whatever,
But in fact, the way these meetings are run and
how the day is set up anymore, and the fact
(42:01):
that you could be horrible on the field and not
feel the pain of it regarding being retained or not.
It just proves how much the front offices are involved
in the daily running of the team on the field. Because,
after all, if you fired somebody after you've told them
what to do constantly, there'd be a good argument for
that manager to come back and say, listen, I was
just doing what they told me to do, and that
(42:22):
in fact is true. I mean, anybody, they could argue
it as much as they want, but it is true.
So all these things are again interrelated and interconnected. End
of the day, pace, clock, love it, everything else. Go
back to playing baseball and that and the last point
what you were saying about the Orioles, they're pretty much
the latter day race. That's exactly what we did in
(42:43):
two thousand and six, seven and eight to become pertinent.
We played that style of baseball. We have the right
kind of athletes, we had the pitching and defense to
back it up, and we developed the method of style
that catapulted us and it's still being utilized today in
Tapa base I like to believe what hiders doing there
in Baltimore should be able to would permit this team
to be that or that kind of a team for
(43:05):
years to come, because obviously, look, this is what Beta's great.
I think the Rays got away from that for wabbly.
They got away from their pitching and defense and try
to become more offensive oriented and they found out didn't work.
I just try to get home runs, the three true outcomes.
But the Ools are doing again copycat situation. More groups
are going to want to do that next year and
again I think hopefully they're learning their lesson there when
(43:28):
it comes to playing baseball on an annual basis, to
be pertinent, this is the way.
Speaker 1 (43:32):
To do it, as always, Joe, great discussion, great insight,
And after that deep dive, we need to take a
break and when we get back, we deserve a little
getaway and we are going to Margueriteville right after this,
(43:57):
all right, Joe, Jimmy Buffett, we lost the great Jimmy Buffett,
and I got a great story to tell. You and
and I'm sure you probably cross paths at some point
because the connection is to Chicago and Wrigley Field. Okay,
back in the early nineteen seventies, before Margaritaville even was
a thing, Jimmy Buffett would play a place called the
(44:21):
Quiet Night, that's with a K, Quiet Night on Belmont Avenue.
He was just one of the many singers, songwriters trapesing
around Chicago, and he fell into a friendship with a
guy named Steve Goodman. He was the headliner at Earl
of Old Town Daga Friendly collaborate on some albums. Actually,
(44:42):
one of Steve Goodman's albums, Jimmy Buffett is on the
cover sitting next to John Prine.
Speaker 2 (44:48):
How about that?
Speaker 3 (44:49):
And you know.
Speaker 2 (44:51):
They played on each other's albums.
Speaker 1 (44:53):
They shared love of music obviously, and a love of
baseball too. Both of them would sit in the Rayfield
bleachers at Wrigley.
Speaker 2 (45:01):
And take in those afternoon games. Nothing better.
Speaker 1 (45:04):
By the way, if you go to Wrigley, I always
recommend you go to a day game first because the
vibe is just it's unbelievable. So Steve Goodman, Actually, in
nineteen eighty four, he was asked by the radio station
there to write a song about the Cubs, and he did,
and that is Go Cubs Go. And unfortunately, Steve Goodman
(45:28):
passed away later that year from leukemia. And Jimmy Buffett,
obviously he wound up playing he was a Cubs fan,
wound up playing the first concert ever at Wrigley Field
back in two thousand and five, wearing his Cubs jersey,
and he promised if the Cubs won the World Series
(45:49):
that he would come back and play Wrigley again, and
he did. He came back twice, and I think it
was twenty seventeen and twenty eighteen. So Jimmy Buffett has
a strong connection or had a strong connection to Wrigley
Go Cubs Go. Oh and the first concert at Wrigley
Field was played by Jimmy Buffett. I'm not sure if
you ever ran across or maybe even you went to
(46:12):
one of these concerts after you won the World Series
with Chicago, Joe, but one of a kind a true
baseball fan. If you're sitting in a bleachers Rayfield bleachers
at Wrigley on an afternoon playing a gig that night
at the Quiet Night Man, you're a true baseball fan.
Speaker 3 (46:28):
Well, let me unpack that a little bit too. For years,
the Red Sox Sweet Caroline came on, and there's nothing
I love more than to be leading that ballgame whenever
that song came on, and after the game, I could
get kind of vicious and how I yelled out towards
(46:49):
the crowd after a victory walking off the mound and
tell them what to do with Sweet Caroline what I
wanted with the Rays. If you ever looked at you've
seen Tropicana Field, of course I always still had it
looked like a big cheeseburger, and I wanted us to
do the same thing. Cheeseburger in Paradise. I thought that'd
be a great middle inning song down there with the Rays.
(47:12):
They get the all ten thousand fans involved, there's seven
thousand fans involved.
Speaker 2 (47:16):
Great sing along tune, absolutely right.
Speaker 3 (47:18):
So I thought it'd be like the and I brought
it up, and of course it never did happen. But yeah,
the Sweet Caroline thing caused me to promote the idea
of Cheeseburger in Paradise for the trot because I've also
thought McDonald or somebody should have just bought the building
or put their name on it, and they made it
look like a cheeseburger from the outside, you know, put
it make the top look like a bun, the middle
(47:39):
looked like a burger, et cetera. It was perfect, perfect
advertising situation. Last thing with him, Yeah, I did meet him.
I met him at the White House with the Cubs
after the World Series when we went there to see
President Obama and he was sitting down in a chair.
He came up introduced himself to I didn't know, sorry, man,
(47:59):
I didn't you know. You got so much going on,
but it came up. Great conversation, sweet man, A totally
total Cub fan. So that was my one moment with
greatness there meeting Jimmy Buffett. I can't remember specifically what
rumor was in the White House and him relating to
me how excited he was for us and the team
(48:21):
and how much of a diehard Cup fan that he was.
So that's why I got to know all that about
mister Buffett.
Speaker 2 (48:26):
That is so cool.
Speaker 1 (48:27):
And by the way, after he won the World Series
in twenty sixteen, Go Cubs Go actually went up to
number three on the Billboard chart. How many years after
Steve Goodman wrote that in nineteen eighty four, got a
lot of airtime and a lot of play in twenty sixteen,
and it's back again.
Speaker 3 (48:46):
By the way, I'll be a Homer a little bit because, yes,
after we won a game at home when that song
came on, that's pretty cool feeling. It's pretty cool feeling.
Everybody there, all the fans are pretty much singing the refrain,
everybody standing up. It's the biggest fraternity party on the
planet every home game. It's wonderful. That's what it is.
It's a frat house. It's beautiful. I love the place,
(49:07):
absolutely loved that place. Was the best time five years
of my life. And that song was perfectly written. The
w flag is a tremendous tradition and that fan base
there is there's nothing like it. Nobody liked them.
Speaker 2 (49:19):
Yeah, you know what, that vibe is starting to come back.
Speaker 3 (49:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (49:22):
Cubs under David Ross look like they're playing again, a
very active style of baseball. I watched that team play
offensive baseball, Joe, and they're moving the baseball. Cody Bellinger
is become a pure hitter, not a slugger. You've got
Madrigall and Horner and all these guys putting the ball
in play again. They run the bases aggressively, a great
(49:42):
defensive team. They're sort of a National League version of
the Baltimore Orioles.
Speaker 2 (49:47):
They are a fun watch.
Speaker 3 (49:50):
I think their middle infield is just throwback as you
get it. I mean, those two guys together could have
played in any Irran baseball once in Horner. I was
with Horner for a bit when I was there. I
love the guy znercom Swamp. I just like the way
they interact, the way they played baseball. It's contagious to
the rest of the group. Bellinger with the renaissance he's
(50:11):
experiencing right now, Ian and leftfield looks outstanding. You mentioned Madrigal,
and I like games John Gomes. I liked that when
he was with Cleveland. Behind the plate. I liked that
part of it too. The kids steal that pitched yesterday.
I never saw him before, but I watched it a
little bit. I didn't realize not a high velocity guy,
but my god, his fastball gets on the hitter. It's
kind of like Andrew Heeny esque in the American League.
(50:33):
It's just that this guy might be a little bit
more demonstrative and how he feels about himself when he's pitching,
but that was that was interesting. And then as Ole Adbert,
I mean I saw him as a starter, but he
all of a sudden he's developed his front hip comebacker
to lefties and did the writings from the back door
really interesting? So yeah, I wish them well. Love ROSSI
(50:54):
loved that whole group. There's a lot of coaches left there,
like guys inside the building, and of course Vja, the
traveling secretary of the whole group. Wonderful.
Speaker 2 (51:02):
Yeah, it's a good vibe.
Speaker 1 (51:03):
And speaking of good vibes, I don't know whether the
Quiet Night is still there on Belmont Avenue. But in
honor of Jimmy Buffett, you have something to take us
out here, this latest edition of the Book of Joe.
Speaker 3 (51:15):
Well, I don't have a Jimmy by just gave you
my Jimmy Buffett. Cheezburger in Paradise got him.
Speaker 1 (51:20):
So, by the way, the Rays have to follow up
on that, because I'm with you. That place does look
like a burger at a box from the outside, So
a little bit of paint, a little bit of ingenuity,
I can definitely see that happening.
Speaker 3 (51:32):
Oh my god, that I could see them staying there
for the next fifty years if they did something like that.
But I was going a different direction. Gosh, I should
have gotten mister Buffet. But I just based on everything
else we're talking about, and because it does come. I mean,
I had this thing about energy plus enthusiasm that's where
victory or success occurs. But knowledge is power, but enthusiasm
(51:56):
pulls the switch. Oh like that, you know, because we
all be like every organization, right, every one of them,
they're working from the same to music. There's a lot
of parody in the game. And there's a lot teams
that are considered good teams, that are playoff caliber, teams
that are just a couple games over five hundred. I mean,
fifteen we came. We're the second wildcard team with ninety
(52:18):
seven wins behind. Then there's Pittsburgh and then there was
the Cardinals went into the division. So I'm looking at that.
I mean, it's kind of interesting the teams that are
barely above five hundred. Even the Twins who are leading
their division are just what there are six games over,
I think, and the Indians are six under. So there's
(52:38):
this is part of it, the sameness of what's going on.
Everybody's trying to play from the same sheet of music.
And then you got the Orioles who are listening to
a little bit of a different tune right now. Look
where they're sitting as an example. So anyway, knowledge is power.
Everybody's got that. But enthusiasm pulls the switch. Creativity pulls
the switch. Not being afraid to go out on the
(52:59):
limb because that's where the fruit is. That's the difference.
Those are the difference makers, and that's what I love.
Speaker 1 (53:04):
I love that, Joe, and that does capture the Orioles
because you watch them play, they smile. I love to
see that. Listen, this game is hard. You have to
be intense to play it. But what you just described there,
that enthusiasm they have. That it's a younger team, yes,
but I like the fact that they enjoy competing intensity
(53:25):
with enthusiasm.
Speaker 2 (53:26):
Tough to beat.
Speaker 3 (53:27):
Well, that's part of why I think some teams have
maybe hit their waterloo a bit based a lot of
if you just want to go with agism, like you
just go with older experienced players, which I like a
smattering of them, but you have to be able to
get normally. The youth is who brings the enthusiasm daily.
After all, everybody fell in love with the Cincinnati Reds.
(53:47):
This year, justifiably everybody's falling with the Orioles in love
with the Ools, although that began last year. I still
think that the Rays capture that kind of vibe and
people glom onto them, Whereas, like the Padres, we keep
asking what's wrong with the Padres? I don't think you
see the same kind of enthusiasm generated this method of play.
(54:09):
That's just kind of like hair on fire stuff. If
you're talented and play with your hair on fire, you
have a pretty good chance of doing well.
Speaker 1 (54:16):
Now that sounds like a whole nother episode What's wrong
with the Padres? But in the meantime, this has been
a blast. And have a toast, have a margarita in
honor of Jimmy Buffet as you call them.
Speaker 3 (54:26):
I just mind today, brother, Thanks man.
Speaker 1 (54:33):
The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.
For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
or wherever you get your podcasts.
Fox Sports Radio News
Host
Jonas Knox
Popular Podcasts
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.