July 19, 2024 • 53 mins
On today’s episode, Jason shares a few quick thoughts on the Denver Nuggets inexplicably trading for Russell Westbrook and Bronny James slowly rounding into form at the NBA Summer League. Later, Phoenix Suns broadcaster Cindy Brunson swings by to discuss Caitlin Clark’s impact on the Indiana Fever and the WNBA at-large, why she doesn’t believe Clark deserves a spot on the Olympic team, the narrative that the WNBA has never seen a player like Clark before, how the schedule makers actually did the Fever a favor heading into the second half of the season and much more!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
This is Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
What is up Straight Fire, Fam, It's me Jason McIntyre.
Straight Fire for Friday, July nineteenth. Oh, the weekend is here,
so exciting. Don't have a whole hell of a lot planned.
But one of my buddies is moving east and for
his like going away party, he wanted to play basketball.
(00:32):
He's one of the guys on The Great Foxes. So
we have a pretty stacked lineup for hoops this weekend
and I couldn't be more excited. Yes, that's the kind
of stuff that gets me pumped up. It's like, oh,
you want to go out to a bar, you want
to go out for drinks. It's like maybe you're gonna
play hoops? Hell Yeah? Who hoops with good players who
are your friends and know how to ball? Yeah, that
(00:53):
to me is super exciting. Anyways, we have a phenomenal
guest today, first timer on the podcas Cindy Brunson. She
used to work at ESPN. She's now a w NBA
announcer for the Phoenix Mercury. Guess who's hosting the WNBA
Al Star Game this weekend The Phoenix Mercury. So Cindy
(01:15):
is boots on the ground, all sorts of interesting Kitlin
Clark nuggets. Now, I will say this, I'll preface it.
I knew Cindy Brunson's way back when. I you know,
we're not like best friends or anything, but she had
recently heard something we were talking about on the herd
and ended up texting me, and I was like, oh,
(01:35):
I totally forgot, you know, Cindy, even though I follow
her on social media, totally forgot. You know, she's plugged in,
she knows, and she knows what's going on, and she's
got some interesting Kitlin Clark takes. I'll say this, and
I'm not saying she's not a fan, but there's definitely
a I've been with the WNBA forever, I know a
(01:56):
lot of these hoopers. Caitlin Clark is great. It's been
great for the league, but like, let's slow down. That's
the vibe. I God, it's not a negative vibe. It's
just that, you know, for instance, we get into the
Olympic thing and she just doesn't think on a guard
heavy team that there was room for Caitlin Clark. And
she does remind me that Diana Tarassi is the logo
(02:18):
of the WNBA. That is something I had totally forgotten.
And how they're gonna pull the logo off the Olympic
team who's trying for the sixth time to let some
rookie on. Well, they're definitely not doing that. There's no
question they just they're not doing that. And she makes
some interesting comments about Clark's defensive lapses, obviously, the turnovers, obviously,
(02:41):
the assists, the positive, the good and the bad. You know,
it's a good discussion. I think you guys will really
enjoy it. Listen. I think you're gonna enjoy this. I'll
just leave it at that. A couple quick notes before
we get to it. The Russell Westbrook to Denver thing,
which feels very odd. I don't understand the affinity. I mean,
(03:01):
the only thing I can think of is when Russ
was averaging a triple double that year and won the MVP.
I feel like that's what maybe Jokic thinks he's getting
from Russ, because you know, Russ has had some good years,
just not like in the last five when Denver's ascended.
But this idea that he's gonna like help. I did
(03:24):
read that in Denver. Michael Malone. If you remember in
the playoffs. Like Peyton, Watson was pretty solid in the
regular season. He's spicy, He's considered to be like an
up and coming player for the Nuggets, a rotational guy.
He like, barely played in the playoffs for whatever reason,
just reduced to bench fodder and Malone trusts veterans in
(03:44):
his court. Now, Christian Brown two years ago, yes he
did play as a rookie, but by and large this
season he didn't play the young guys. Julian Strawther from
Good Zaga. They've got some young dude, Zeke Naji who
they paid a lot of money, and for whatever reason,
Malone just he's not paying these guys playing these guys.
(04:05):
So it's like one of these hmm. And now you
go out and get Russell Westbrook, what's he a veteran
And it's just I don't know if this is a
I'm not sure what this could possibly be about other
than I need vets because I'll tell you right now, Yes,
KCP got cooked by Anthony Edwards in the playoffs. Well,
(04:25):
it's not like Russell Westbrook's coming into Guardian. That's not happening.
And if you want to make the argument, listen, we
need rush to boost the second unit when Murray's getting
a breather and Yoki's just getting a breather. Okay, hey,
you know he tried that with the Lakers and it
didn't quite work out. Then he tried it with the
Clippers and it worked out for like flashes. So I
(04:48):
don't see why it's going to be different Denver. I'm
kind of out on the Nuggets. Fox asked me for
my over unders this year, and I took under Nuggets
fifty two and a half. I don't see them as
a fifty two win team. I don't love them anyways.
The other thing is Bronnie James had another good game
for the Lakers. Is back to back wins where Bronnie
(05:09):
has played good, got double digit points. He had a
step back three Like, listen, are you guys surprised that
a nineteen year old struggled out of the gate in
the summer League? Not the nineteen year old number two
pick overall, the fifty fifth pick. By the way, Alex Sar,
who went number two overall, had a game where he
was oh for fifteen. You didn't hear about it because
nobody cares about Alex Sar. But Bronnie James is oh
(05:30):
for fifteen and four games from deep and it's oh
my gosh, he's a bum. He's a bus you see
how that works. So anyways, Bronnie James bouncing back nicely,
happy to see it. Just get off the kids back, guys,
you know. Anyways, without further ado, let's get to our guest,
former Sports Center anchor and WNBA announcer, Cindy Brounson.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
You know, guy Jason likes to think he knows everything
when it comes to sports. I know what sports fans want,
but for everything he doesn't, he knows the guy who does.
Speaker 3 (06:01):
Let's just say I know a guy who knows a
guy who knows another guy.
Speaker 2 (06:06):
All right, let's welcome into straight Fire, a first time
guest on the podcast. Although you obviously know who she is.
She's been on Sports Center hosting for years. She is
been an announcer in the WNBA, and she just so
happens to be working with the Phoenix Mercury where the
NBA a WNBA All Star Game is this weekend. Cindy Brunson, Cindy,
(06:29):
how you doing.
Speaker 3 (06:30):
I'm great, thanks so nice to see your face again
and chat with you it's been too long.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
It has.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Indeed, So you've been around basketball your entire life. You
obviously played sports growing up, correct mm hmm.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
I did until my left knee stopped cooperating and forced
me to talk about basketball instead of play basketball. I've
had my left acl repair three different times, so it
was easy for me to focus on, Hey, I'm going
to be involved from the sideline. So for more twenty years,
I've been receiving my mail at the corner of women's
college basketball and the WNBA.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
See, now, that's incredible. So you've been doing this for
twenty years, and then I'm going to go ahead and
guess that you're seeing on your end kind of what
we're seeing just a tsunami of interest and discussion around both.
You know, women's college basketball last year was unbelievable. I mean,
the final four, the tournament was incredible and the WNBA
(07:27):
obviously have you seen a massive change? Would you call
it gradual? Has it been building up to this or
I don't know. Does some of those Yukon teams back
in the day have have massive interest.
Speaker 3 (07:37):
The Yukon teams have always had interests. It's why Geno
Arima has more national championships than any other coach in
women's college basketball with his eleven, but he was the
first and up until Kitlyn Clark and IOWA, the only
traveling circus as far as women's basketball is concerned. Now
with Caitlyn Clark and to your word, tsunami that she
(07:59):
has created, ratings wise, folks are paying acute attention and
it's good to see because for those of us that
have been involved with the game for decades, we've always
known the product was great. The product was never the problem,
it was the promotion. So now the two have finally merged,
and having been in the halls of ESPN from nineteen
(08:21):
ninety nine to twenty thirteen, I left and headed west
when my husband, Steve Berthhume got hired to be the
play by play voice for the Arizona Diamondbacks on the
TV side. So I fought those battles in those halls
in Bristol, just begging for a promo during Sports Center
about an upcoming WNBA game on our air. And credit
(08:42):
to Carol Stiff and Pat Lowry, who are no longer
with ESPN, they fought the good fight. They did the
best that they could in a territory that just was
not open to promoting women's sports. It just wasn't. It
paid it lip service over and over and over again.
And when I left, I was beyond frustrated because I
(09:02):
just saw the potential for what it could be the
explosion that we're having right now, that could have happened
fifteen twenty years ago. Shoot, when Diana Tarasi came out
of Yukon in two thousand and four, she could have
created this same kind of swell of interest that we're
seeing with Caitlin Clark now, because Caitlin is just Diana
(09:22):
two point zero just twenty years later. The talent has
always been there, it's just the amplification and the availability
and access on TV.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
So you you followed up obviously WNBA twenty years announcing games.
You mentioned the ratings and I saw it stat that
like the last sixteen years there hadn't been an audience
of a million for a game, and then boom, now
like almost every game on TV featuring Clark has has
topped to a million. Or when you're.
Speaker 3 (09:53):
Yeah, and it doesn't just have to feature Clark either,
I mean, yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
There's been Vegas aces. I guess had had one of
the top games and then I think an Angel rees
game against someone. Yeah, but like in the arena, are
you seeing a difference in terms of just volume of
fans interest? Are people stopping you in the street at
Starbucks whereas stuff that had not happened in the past
(10:17):
is now happening more frequently.
Speaker 3 (10:19):
Yeah, I'm getting stopped at Starbucks. I'm getting stopped at Safeway.
It's kind of cool. Somebody asked me today if I
had our All Star Game tickets. I'm like, are you
kidding me? No, no, goo boo, you didn't get that
many advans. I'm sorry. Check the secondary sites. Yeah, it's
it's been really cool to see. But again, the product
has always been outstanding. We have had so many unbelievably
(10:42):
talented female basketball players booping and I mean Age OPI
and Apostrophe all caps for decades and we just haven't
had the promotion. And now the Caitlin Clark train is
forcing the promotion and everybody else is getting to learn
(11:02):
more names, more teams, more storylines, and it's fantastic.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
What do you think it is. I don't know how
much time you spent around Clark, but what is it
about her? Or has she just captured like a time
and a place. You know. Listen, I'm not gonna make
it too much about me a low it is my podcast,
but like I got, I'm not gonna lie. I got
super lucky with my website. Back in the day, you know,
websites were just popping up. There wasn't release social media,
(11:27):
and you had to come to my website multiple times
a day to get the updates on whatever. And I
was fortunate. Now, if somebody tried to start a website
in twenty twenty four, it's like good luck, you know,
just people don't go to website. So I was fortunate.
Clark's timing social media. What's going on in the country
at large, I don't know. Can you pinpoint one thing
or is it just a confluence of events.
Speaker 3 (11:49):
I think it is a couple of factors. The Peacock
Big ten television deal and more television access on different platforms.
I'm also a member of Nbcpeacock. So I did a
Caitlin Clark game at Minnesota and the place had never
been that full in its history. More than fourteen thousand fans,
(12:12):
like it was crazy, and it was seventy five to
eighty percent Iowa fans and the rest Minnesota and just
general basketball fans. So she has had a Tim Tebow
esque effect on the college campus and that has now
transferred to the WNBA and it's been fantastic. And the
(12:34):
wild thing that I never thought I would see was
that her fan base is taking away home court advantage
from stout venues. Indiana came to Phoenix. We have what
we call the X factor. We were the worst team
in the WNBA last season, and yet we finished second
in attendance. Our fan base is elite. It is smart,
(12:57):
very educated, and diehard, and it was drowned out by
the voices that were supporting Caitlin Clark and not kind
of the fever, but mostly Caitlin Clark. And I had
never experienced that on the WNBA level, and that was wild,
and I've seen it. I saw Indiana do that at Minnesota.
(13:21):
You know, Minnesota is kind of they call it carb
North because that's where the Big Ten tournament was held,
and so Iowa fans are used to going there and supporting.
But I think it really it unsettled the links. You
could tell it was just well, wait a minute, we
can't hear our own fans Why are they cheering for
the opposing team. We're supposed to happen a home court
advantage here. So that's the singular thing that has stuck
(13:44):
out to me, like, Wow, that is really changing the
scales in a way that I didn't anticipate. I knew
that she would challenge for Rookie of the Year. I
knew she would challenge to break the assists record, which
she has done. She has also set the record for
the most turnovers in a season and she still got
fifteen games ago, so that'll be interesting. And I didn't
(14:07):
think the three point shooting would translate, and to this
point it hasn't, just because she's meeting bigger, faster, stronger
defenders and as quick as she is to go to
that left to shoot that logo three, somebody's in her face.
But she can get that pass off and fire it
in a variety of different ways and that has been
really cool to see. So not only is she in
(14:28):
the Rookie of the Year conversation at the top of
the table, she's also now in the MVP conversation for
the league, and the WNBA has only had one person
when Rookie of the Year and MVP in the same
season and that was the amazing canvas partner.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
M that's right. She was a legend. Now, wait, let
me go back to the Phoenix game where it was noisy.
I can't imagine that many. I can't imagine say, ten
thousand people traveling from Indiana to Phoenix for a game.
Speaker 3 (15:00):
So well, we average ten thousand. We vacillate between ten
and fourteen, so right around twelve, so five to six
thousand that day were her fans, Indiana fans, Kate Clark fans,
and so when the X factor was trying to boom,
they were getting tamped down. I was in the seats.
I bought a ticket to the game because it was
(15:21):
an ESPN game. I'd never seen anything like it.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
Okay, so let's say five thousand Fever fans. Do you
think they traveled from Indiana or is this just basketball
fans in Phoenix in the area maybe an hour way,
two hours whatever, who just have got the Caitlyn Clark
bug and they're like, let's check this out.
Speaker 3 (15:38):
Yeah, I think yeah, I think they weren't able to
get tickets to see her in Los Angeles or in
Las Vegas. They came to Phoenix because we're all in
close proximity, a four and a half hour drive away
from Las Vegas, a six hour drive from Los Angeles,
so it's easy to get to a b She is
one of those players because of the logo three. Just
(15:58):
like everybody wanted to see step they want to see
Caitlin Clark and person, and to her absolute credit, despite
only being a pro for five minutes, she puts on
a show.
Speaker 2 (16:11):
Yeah, I'm loath to mention, but Curry did have a
lot of detractors in the league. When like around twenty fifteen,
I remember going to a game in Philadelphia with my
kid and it was like Steph Curry jerseys all over
the Lower Bowl and there was still pushback about Curry.
This was before he got his first MVP, and it
was like Chris Paul was like, I don't know, I'm
(16:33):
not a fan whatever. Russell Westbrook like this stuff is
documented to somebody wrote a book essentially about this, a
writer for The Athletic, And it was like there was
almost so much excitement for Curry that there was some
jealousy among the guards, like what's so special about this guy?
He's making some long threes, so what And then all
of a sudden, you couldn't You couldn't like, you couldn't
say that anymore. Steph Curry just took over the league.
(16:55):
Do you feel there is some pushback from players around
the Clark circus if you will.
Speaker 3 (17:00):
It'll be interesting to see how Indiana proceeds as a team.
They have a highly touted player at two time All
Star in Kelsey Mitchell, who will be an unrestricted free
agent next year, and will she stay with a fever?
Does she want to be one of the pips next
to Gladys Knight or does she want to be a
(17:20):
star in her own right? Because before Kateland Clark came along,
it was Kelsey Mitchell who was the business coming out
of Ohio State. She had the three point shooting record,
she had the big ten scoring record, she was one
of the top five all time scores in NCAA history,
and all of that just kind of went to the
side when Kitlyn Clark came along. So I'm curious to
(17:44):
see how that because they've got a nice core for
together right now, if that stays that way, is that
big ass sorry about wow?
Speaker 2 (17:52):
No, no, I got a dog now, this is something
I didn't know that Yeah, like I didn't know about that.
I do have a friend who's in dp's from Iowa's
he's a huge fan. So I'm looking at Kelsey Mitchell stats. Yeah,
she's got good numbers. But that's interesting. So I don't
have you heard anything or are you just speculating?
Speaker 3 (18:07):
No, no, I'm I'm just curious now because we saw
Marina Maybury ask for a trade out of Chicago and
the Angel ree Show, so they why she left. I
don't know why, but I thought it was interesting to
demand the trade as we hit the All Star Olympic
break when the team is doing really well. They just
(18:29):
beat Las Vegas, the two time defending champs on there
for to hit the All Star break, and now Mayby
says I need, I need to go somewhere else. So
to me that was like, hmmm, why don't you like winning?
Speaker 2 (18:46):
Yeah, well, it's weird because.
Speaker 3 (18:49):
Chicago, thanks to Angel Reese and her record string of
double doubles, is in the playoff hunt and that is
so surprising. And to me it gives me a no
for Angel Rees for Rookie of the Year over Caitlin Clark,
because only because Chicago was in rebuild mode. They were
(19:09):
in revamp mode. They were supposed to be bottom four,
if not the worst, so the fact that they are
competing for playoff positioning is jarring. Indiana was supposed to
make the playoffs. Caitlyn Clark was supposed to perform really well,
so the fact that she's doing that is not a surprise.
And the fact that they stubbed their toe Indiana did
(19:32):
against Dallas, a team that was the bottom of the league.
You're not supposed to do that. You're not supposed to
set the assists. Yeah, you're not supposed to set the
assist record all time in a game with nineteen dimes
and then commit a late turnover that cost your team
of victory if you are the Rookie of the Year
and or MVP. Where Angel Reese and her team's victories
(19:53):
late in crunch time against great competition has stepped up,
hit big free throws, got big reback, whatever her team needs.
So it's it'll be interesting Rookie of the Year conversation
going down the stretch and Rakia Jackson has entered the
chat from Los Angeles. Kurt Miller has discovered how slippery
and awesome she is, so yeah, tons to be excited about.
Speaker 1 (20:17):
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Speaker 2 (20:29):
This Mitchell things fascinating. So I looked up the fever.
They have not been good for a while. They won
the title in twelve twelve, but they haven't made the
playoffs since twenty sixteen. I mean single digit wins most
of the time. So she do you think she would
actually want to leave a winning team? I mean they're
gonna set obviously, they'll finish the season more wins they've
had in the last like eight years, so that that
(20:52):
would be interesting. You want to win? Or do you
want to be like the show? Because, like you said,
the girl Jackson on the sparks like they're terrible. Brink
got in I think during I think I saw this
at during Angel Reset. What you have sixteen double doubles
in a row? They were like six and ten or something,
So like, yeah, these rookies, they're they're not going to
impact winning that much. But the fact that Chicago and
(21:14):
Indiana are kind of creeping on the playoffs, that's kind
of interesting though.
Speaker 3 (21:18):
Yeah, if the playoffs started today. Both teams are in
and that is now Indiana was supposed to be in.
You've got back back number one draft picks overall, you've
got the number two draft pick, and Melissa Smith, who
plays with a huge chip on her shoulder. She is outstanding.
She's just a walking double double waiting to happen. And
then you know Eliah Boston, the reigning rookie of the Year.
(21:39):
They have a core four that is really nice. And
if they don't make the playoffs, you will hear calls
for Christie Sides and her job as head coach because
all of the pieces are there and they've already survived
the gauntlet of the season. Right. They had to play
New York a bunch of times, they had to play
Connecticut out of the gate. They were terrible at the beginning.
(22:00):
But now that they've been able to spend time together
and develop some cohesion, they are showing everybody what Indiana
basketball can be. And again, my expectation for Caitlin Clark
coming out of Iowa was to get Indiana into the playoffs.
My big bar of whether she is it the deal,
(22:22):
the transformational aura, you name it, is if she makes
Indiana nine wins better than they were a year ago.
I use that standard because that's what Diana Tarassi did
when she left Yukon in two thousand and four. She
made the Mercury, who were terrible nine wins better. And
when you only have thirty six at the time or
(22:44):
forty games now, that's a quarter of the season. So
if you turn those losses into wins, you have my attention,
and it's enough to get a team comfortably into the
playoffs and possibly hold home court advantage as well. So
they would have to get to twenty two wins for
that to happen Indiana. So that's the last little piece
(23:05):
that I'm looking for, because I think she's gonna set
the rookie record for a sisper game at Tisha Pennacherial
in nineteen ninety eight said that at seven and a
half per Clark is leading the league right now. And
what was my other metric, Well, I'm trying that twenty
two wins.
Speaker 2 (23:21):
They would have to go eleven and three down the stretch.
I don't know if that's forty game regular seasons, So yeah,
that would be tough, but it's doable. The schedule, it's.
Speaker 3 (23:32):
Doable, and there their second half schedule is Sharman saw
it's very second easy schedule left so they could do it.
Speaker 2 (23:42):
Did you think it was unfair that they front loaded
her schedule coming right off the college basketball run.
Speaker 3 (23:47):
Nope, nope, you got you got to play those teams
at some point, and you would rather play them while
you're figuring it out and just take those losses and
figure out how to beat the teams that you know
you can beat, because even at their best, Indiana hasn't
been able to figure out how to beat the Liberty
And that's tough because the Liberty are really good. There's
(24:07):
a reason why they are at the top of the table.
Minnesota really good. So Indiana gets that win, that's a
feather in their cap. But then you can't stub your
toe against the Washington Midsticks and the Dallas Wings. You
just can't do that. So we're going to see what
Indiana is made of when everybody comes back from the
Olympic break and the All Star break after hopefully Team
(24:30):
USA wins an eighth straight gold medal in tenth overall. Yeah, well,
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (24:34):
Of course, a second hold on.
Speaker 3 (24:39):
France is coming, Germany is coming, Belgium is coming like
there are Australia. Australia has dusted off forty three year
old Lauren Jackson, who has the distinction of being a
three time in WNBA MVP. She is special and now
(24:59):
that she is playing paying free, Australia is a problem.
Speaker 2 (25:03):
Okay, hold on, we'll come back to I just one
last thing. So in the end, we know the NBA
is a players league where I don't want to say
the stars get to pick the coaches. But we just
saw Donovan Mitchell and Bickerstaff blow up. Donovan Mitchell gets
a new coach, Lebron and Darvin Ham Lebron gets a
new coach. This is not like a strange thing. And
the NFL, to an extent, quarterback has a say on
(25:24):
the coach. I'm curious you mentioned the Indiana Fever coach.
You know the fans don't love her. She takes a
beating from some of these analytical Caitlin Clark fans online.
Do you think if they replaced the coach, Kaitlin Clark
should have a say in all your time around basketball.
Speaker 3 (25:44):
I think to put that at her feet would be
a lot. They are already asking her to hold for
the first time in my life. I'd never seen this
a visiting team holding a news conference pre game. I
attended the Caitlyn Clark pre game news conference. I've never
seen that before in the WNBA, So I think they're
(26:06):
already putting a lot on her. The thing that I
do think is interesting is that Lisa Bluter, her former
coach at Iowa, did retire and handed the keys to
the car to Jan Jensen for the Hawkeyes. So her
coach who they took Iowa from nowhere to a pair
(26:27):
of final fours and champ games. So I'm just I
always leave that simmering on the back burner.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
Yeah, no, that's interesting, and you just made a good point.
I think we've touched on this before. But like U,
Coon's had some amazing runs with Gino, They've had stacked
teams undefeated. All that is part of what's made Clerk special.
We saw Curry dominate at Davidson Little Davidson made a
run to the Elite eight, and that kind of put
him on the map. I mean, he had already been
(26:56):
doing good things going against Blake Griffin and stuff, but
that tournament run against the big boys, pushing Kansas to
the limit, taking down a Gonzaga and then a Georgetown.
Is that part of the allure to Clark that, Hey,
she didn't go to Hong Kon or a factory, you
went to the championship with Iowa.
Speaker 3 (27:15):
Right, That's part of the mystique for sure. But funny
thing is is Caitlin Clark was a huge Yukon fan
growing up. Her favorite player was Maya Moore and she
wanted to attend Yukon and Gino Rima had the choice,
am I going with Paige Beckers or am I going
with Caitlin Clark? And he chose Paige Beckers. He said
(27:38):
Paige had way more upside. We'll make a better pro,
We'll be a better Olympian. And just like Caitlin, she's
been a National Player of the Year already and now
that she's healthy, she probably has the best chance to
break the drought, right because since Stewie four peeded, Yukon
hasn't won a title. Twenty sixteen was the last one.
(28:01):
That's where I got unnerved when people said Caitlin Clark
was the best player in college period. Now, Rianna Stewart
won four championships in a row, and in women's basketball,
unlike the men winning means more. The more gold medals,
(28:21):
the more championships, the more euro League championships, whatever. If
you're getting a prize for crossing the street faster than
your teammate, that matters more than just getting to the
final four or putting your program on the map. You
got to seal the deal. Diane and I won three
championships at Yukon. Coming into the WNBA, she was a
(28:44):
venerable force because she had proven it at the collegiate level. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
I think my guess is the people who were saying
that is wait a minute, hold on Yukon had how
many McDonald's all Americans of those teams, like maybe the
entire starting lineup, and Iowa has like two star kids.
I mean, I think, uh, Martin is a pro right
on Vegas. And then other than that, Yes, yeah, I
don't know, maybe the big kids. Stokey, I don't know
(29:08):
if she's uh, I don't know what her at pro
prospects are.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
She she needs she needs to get in the gym
and learn how to play defense and finish at the rim.
But yeah, she has potential.
Speaker 2 (29:20):
And those Yukon teams were absolutely loaded.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
Now.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
Beckers, though had the unfortunate. Didn't you have back to
back injuries? Like yes out, yeah, yeah, she's a superstar.
There was when when Indiana was stinking up the joint,
going like what one intend to start the season or
whatever against the competition. It was like, oh, Page Page
and uh Caitlin back court next. Everybody's all excited. Well,
no chance of that happened. Now, all right, let's get
(29:44):
to the go ahead, Go ahead.
Speaker 3 (29:46):
No, I would just I would not want Indiana to
take Page Beckers as well. That I don't think would
be good for the league. I think we need to
spread the talent around Indiana. Indiana has its point guard.
Speaker 2 (29:57):
So all right, let's get to the Olympics.
Speaker 3 (30:00):
Now.
Speaker 2 (30:01):
This is obviously a very dicey issue. Almost it's almost
gotten a little political. I don't know if you've felt that,
but people are just so worked up about it. Obviously,
listen from from a from a my standpoint, like Cindy,
I'd never been to a w NBA game. My daughter,
I coached her.
Speaker 3 (30:18):
And who.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
Well, no hold on Kitlin Clark. She went back East
with my wife and son during the holiday break. I
couldn't go because I had to work, And they're like, please,
get us tickets to the Rutgers Kaitland Clark game. So
we came through. So then Caitlin Clark comes out here
to face the Sparks and we got tickets, and it's like,
oh my gosh, I voted for the w NBA. I'll
start getting like I'm interested in the Caitlin Clark show
(30:42):
if I'm laying on the couch and I'm like, let
me just check the w NBA. Scorse, Oh, Kitlin Clark's
playing altroarn game. Now the Olympics not gonna lie. I
couldn't tell you who were the starting five on the
Olympic team for the women's The last time around, I
will say I'm shocked Clark because not on the team.
I know she didn't make the camp because she's in
(31:03):
the final four. And this is a very A lot
of women's basketball diehards are like, no, she can't be
on the team. Now, I want you to has opinion.
First of all, tell me do you think she should
have made it?
Speaker 3 (31:16):
Then?
Speaker 2 (31:17):
And now? Given how herst numbers match up extremely favorably
with the girls who are on the Olympic team, and
in several categories she's beating them in WNBA status here
at least. I'm just curious how you've gone, and you
could be as honest as you want. I don't mind disagree.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
I don't think Caitlin Clark should be on the twenty
twenty four Olympic team. I think it's a team that's
already guard heavy, so to add another guard is just nonsensical.
And then who are you going to take off? Are
you going to deny Diana Tarassi who has spent more
than half of her life with USA Basketball and opportunity
(31:56):
to do the unprecedented win a six straight gold medal
for her comfort, for her country. She's the logo of
the WNBA, the layand with the bun. That's Diana, So
you don't want to take her off. You can't take
off Chelsea Gray, she's amazing, Jackie Young, Kelsey Plumb Sabrina Yonescue, Like,
(32:17):
which guard are you going to take away to give
Caitlin an opportunity? When defense and physicality is going to
be the name of the game at the Olympics. In
Paris late game situations, Christy Sides has to take out
Caitlin because they're afraid she'll get beat. You cannot take
(32:39):
out anybody when you are on the Olympic stage, they
have to be able to defend. So it's the lack
of ability to play defense, which she will shore up
and she will get better at and she will have
a chance to represent Team USA for years to come.
It's just not her turn now, and that's okay. Everybody
(33:01):
just needs to get out of their feelings about it
and get behind the fact that Team USA has two
first timers on it already, Kalia Copper of the Mercury
and Alissa Thomas of the Connecticut Sun, the all time
triple doubles leader in WNBA history. Are you going to
take one of those two players off to put Caitlyn on?
(33:24):
I don't think so. So I love the way that
the team is constructed. I think it is constructed to
win an eighth straight gold medal and stand on that
metal stand and let everybody hear the Star spangled banner
and all of it. With Team USA winning an eighth
straight gold medal, I think Caitlyn is going to help
(33:46):
Team USA win down the road, So she just doesn't
have to help in twenty twenty four.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Okay, So the counter would be I had to look
this up just because you made a good point about
winning an eighth straight. So two thousand eight eight Summer
Olympics US women won every game by fifteen or more.
Twenty twelve, they won every game by thirteen or more.
Twenty sixteen, every game by nineteen or more, so zero
single digit games. Twenty twenty they had one single digit game,
(34:15):
beating Nigeria by nine everything else. So basically, in the
last four Olympics they have utterly been dominant, like nobody
can touch them. My guess, I know you said that
everybody else is better, but my guess is they're going
to steamroll and win every game by double digits again.
So if we are to assume that, hey, they've got
the gold locked up, then don't you kind of sort
(34:36):
of want to say, you know what, it would be
great for the WNBA and women's basketball in general to
have Clark on the team. Who's going to generate more eyeballs.
We've seen her do it for the league. Wouldn't she
do it for the Olympics. But I guess your counter
would be the Caitlin Clark circus. And I am curious
where you are on whether or not the circus is
(34:58):
a bad thing.
Speaker 3 (35:00):
Well in this instance, it might be a distraction, and
nothing can detract from the mission. Team USA is all
about the mission of completing the assignment, and that is
an eighth straight gold medal. And just like in the WNBA,
where it's not like New York woke up and isn't
(35:22):
as good as it was last season, or Las Vegas
for that matter, they've dealt with injuries and what has
happened is the rest of the league has leveled up.
Everybody else has gotten better. Even the worst team, the
Washington Mystics, can get you if you're not buttoned up.
And the same goes on the world stage. Australia is better,
(35:45):
France is better, Belgium is better. Belgium has a former
Finals MVP in Ma Mesiman from the twenty nineteen Washington
Mystics sitting out this WNBA season getting her team ready
for this fight. All of the other teams are together.
(36:05):
Gabby Williams sitting out from the Storm. She's helping Team
France get better. The competition this year will be unlike
any other, and that's why Cheryl Reeve and the committee
leaned into veteran leadership ability to score off the bounce,
(36:25):
create off the bounce and defend as if your ability
to breathe depends on it. It will all be needed
to triumph in Paris.
Speaker 1 (36:36):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
the nation. Catch all of our shows at Foxsports Radio
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listen live.
Speaker 2 (36:47):
So you don't think they're like kind of a lock
with or without Clark.
Speaker 3 (36:52):
No, don't. I don't take anything for granted at all.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
So you know, again, the gambling markets are just one
aspect us. According to you know, DraftKings minus eighteen hundred
to win gold. So Australia is second, Belgium is looks
like fifth. So basically Vegas is saying you've got to
lay a ton of money to win a little bit
of money. That's how heavy they are. Famous. Now, upsets
(37:19):
do happen. I get that. But regarding to circus, I
am curious, And this is a loaded word that people
don't seem to like. But do you, Cindy, think that
there's any jealousy over the attention Clark's getting. Whether it's
Reeve who has made some pointed comments, I think Cheryl
Swoots had a couple comments. TARROSSI had a comment, and again,
(37:40):
nothing really that harsh, except maybe Reeve if you want
to dig into it. But do you think there is like, Hey,
we've had a good league, We've got a lot of
great players. What's the big deal about Caitlin Clark. Do
you think jealousy works? Maybe not for all. I don't
want a blanket statement, but there is some jealousy around
the league with the intention she's getting.
Speaker 3 (38:01):
I think what's disquieting for a lot of people, and
myself included, is that the focus is on one when
the greater good is fantastic. We've never been a league
just about Diana or Cheryl Swoops or Lisa Leslie or
Lauren Jackson or Sue Byrd. It's always been about the collective,
(38:23):
and that, for me is what is jarring. That all
of the focus is on one person, and it just
goes against everything we fought for for decades, like look
at us, look at us as a collective. We are
a great product. And to have it boiled down to
a singular thing, I think everybody's just trying to navigate
(38:46):
that because it runs contrary to everything that we have
ever experienced before. But nobody discounts that Caitlin is a
generational talent that I have said time and again. When
I was on the call at Minnesota, I said, she
is Dinah TARROSSI two point zero like this, this is it.
(39:07):
And I know that the women's fans and some of
the pundits hate the male comp but she, Caitlin Clark
is Larry Bird. Just write it down with a sharpie,
just that that same vibe, that killer instinct, just makes
his teammates better, terrific passing and just goes about his business,
never really gets ruffled, just just as a killer and
(39:29):
gets it done, period, full stop. So yeah, So that's
that's kind of where I stand on it. It's just it's
jarring because all of the focus is on one person.
That's why I'm very curious to see if what we
see as an Indiana Fever roster currently stays together, because
that's a lot. You are dealing with alpha's at every position,
(39:52):
and does an alpha want to give up and concede?
Oh I'm I'm on her team and that's the best
I get.
Speaker 2 (40:02):
So wait, are you what were you getting that? Are
you hearing that? Are you seeing that? Are you speculated? Like?
Speaker 1 (40:09):
That?
Speaker 2 (40:09):
To me? Is interesting? I had not even considered. Listen,
you know, I play in men's leagues out here, Obviously
nobody cares. But I'm out here recruiting for a team.
I want the best players. I don't care if I
play let's. I want to win.
Speaker 1 (40:21):
I want championships.
Speaker 2 (40:22):
I want my name on the band. We've got one,
I want another. So I'm out there. I want to win,
and I think I'm an alpha. I'm obviously not at
my age, but uh, I'm surprised that people would not
like I'm trying to think like you. Historically Lebron and
his prime, it's guys Steph Curry and his prime. Yeah,
Kevin Durant, I want to go play there.
Speaker 3 (40:40):
Yeah, but they did that as established players. This is
a rookie, okay, who is ringing the bell? So do
you want to get in line behind a rookie who?
Speaker 1 (40:51):
Okay?
Speaker 2 (40:52):
One min yumpa. Well, I guess you know he just
finished his rookie season. But in this off season, Chris
Paul now that could have been a financial thing. Nobody
was given him total million bucks. But Chris now goes,
maybe he's just like, hey, I'll collect twelve million. And
then at the deadline, they'll ship me when we're not good.
But I don't know what wem Begnama's generational. My guess
is people would want to play with him, right.
Speaker 3 (41:16):
I think it's different in the NBA because there's so
many more teams and more options. We've got twelve teams now,
we'll expand to thirteen next season and fourteen and twenty
twenty six when Toronto comes on board after the Golden
State Valkyries. So there are still a finite number of spots,
and there are other things that players are chasing, like amenities.
(41:41):
There are only three teams in the WNBA, that's Las Vegas,
Seattle and now Phoenix that have dedicated practice facilities for
the women's teams in town. Our practice facility just opened.
One hundred million dollars was spent by owner Matt Ishbia,
and I always say Matt with one tea and a
(42:02):
whole lot of zeros, and it was ready. It was
supposed to take two years to build and get done,
and of course he had it done for all Stars
so it could be displayed as the crown jewel that
it is. But it's the amenities that players are also
looking for, in addition to more money and all of
the other things that they have been chasing for decades.
(42:24):
So does Indiana have that? Not at this juncture. It
doesn't have a practice facility, It doesn't have dedicated resources
to the fever. At this point. Now that could change.
Gamebridge and all of the associates with the arena and
everything is getting a lot of cash flow like they've
never seen before. So you would hope that would happen.
(42:46):
But until it does, free agents are going to go, well,
Seattle's got this, Vegas has that, and Seattle, Vegas and
Phoenix will run players through their practice facility just to
show them what they are missing, because the magic stuff matters.
Speaker 2 (43:03):
So how about this, I'd counter and say, hey, you
know what, you know who's getting all the great primetime
games and the most coverage and the most promo Indiana.
You come on this team with.
Speaker 3 (43:12):
Everybody, everybody, everybody's boat is rising because of that. All
are ye are getting more coverage than they ever have before. True,
So my counter to your counter is all the boats
are rising. That really doesn't That really doesn't resonate.
Speaker 2 (43:28):
Well, I would I would counter to the to the
to the potential free agent. I would say, hey, just
for fun watch Sports Center on a night the Caitlin
Clark plays, and I guarantee you she's in the A bloc.
I guarantee you that's not the case for any other team,
Like the Las Vegas Aces play, they're not making early
in the show Kitlin Clark plays, it's early. And if
you look at some of the social metrics, and again
(43:48):
I don't know what social media is totally worth, but
like the Indian and the Fever are now the league's
leader in I think social media followers and they were
like middle of the pack. This is all obviously because
of Clark.
Speaker 3 (44:01):
Yes, but that's Caitlyn Clark, right.
Speaker 2 (44:04):
But proximity to greatness does an equal greatness, but it
puts you on the map a little bit more.
Speaker 3 (44:09):
No, again, you're dealing with women that have busted their tails.
Can I swear on this that I can see whatever
you are past is for years looking for this kind
of shine. And on a night that Caitlyn Clark leads
Sports Center or is in the A block, to your point,
(44:30):
she's doing so when you could talk about four other
players for the opposing team and two on her team
that were just as special, that put up what we
haven't seen before this Steaven has just been the season
of records all over the place. Cop Copper KFC for
(44:51):
Phoenix Mercury, the first player in WNBA history with back
to back thirty seven point games. She's put up eight
thirty point games already this season. The record for the
franchise is ten that was held by Diana Tarassi set
in two thousand and nine. So everything can be highlighted
and talked about.
Speaker 2 (45:11):
Not just just Clark. All right, so we got to
wrap on. I know, I went because you said some
defensive stuff that I hadn't noticed on Clark getting pulled
lat in games.
Speaker 3 (45:22):
Again, defense created offense for defense, and defense is the
last thing that a player will take from college to
the WNBA. They have to learn how to depend I
talked to a lot of my yeah, yeah, upper body strength.
But I talked to a lot of my friends, and
we cannot believe how teams just don't drive at her
because she will olay out of the way and hope
(45:43):
her rim protection is there, or she will commit the foul.
She just doesn't have the footwork necessary to move against
the speed of a Khalia Copper or an a Rique
at gloom a Rique kept going at her and she
would just get out of the way. So o, Rique
had shots that were open. And you don't want to
leave Rique open available to hit shots because she will
(46:08):
kill you. She's the only player this season that had
a forty piece. She had a forty point game and
happened against the Mercury. I was their courts at But
she is a bucket. So yeah. And is she the
one who was.
Speaker 2 (46:20):
Snubbed from the from the Olympic team as well or
didn't make it? Yeah, you could, so there was another
one based on points. So I looked this up. This
is this is surprising to me, given you know that
the defense has been suspect. So she's And again, defensive
stats are hard, even in the NBA. You know, defensive
wind shares. I mean, you can look at whatever. But
(46:40):
Kalen Clark is tenth in the league in steels and
thirteenth in blocks, So I know that's you can't really
it's tough to chirt blowbys. But I mean, for instance,
she has twenty two blocks. Angel Reese only has ten
angel Resa center. I was stung by that note many
more minutes.
Speaker 3 (46:56):
Yeah, Angel Reese is a boer who plays the She's
an undersize center and when you're asking her to block
a shot, you're asking her to take a shot away
from six foot nine inch Britney grinder or six foot
seven inch Tierram account Like her ask is a little
bit more than what Caitlyn is asked to defend on
(47:18):
the perimeter. Like I think she blocked one of odyssey
sims shots. Odyssey is three four inches shorter than she is,
so Caitlyn should get that block and while she does
come through, she'll get the block on a swipe right
after the person has gone by. Don't want to have
that kind of block follow you all the time. And
then the steals come up because she does have very excellent,
(47:39):
excellent hand eye coordination. I mean she can see it.
She can pick up a rhythm and then she can
pick your pocket. But usually only happens once and then
the blitz comes at her the next two or three
times down the floor and you can see her get
a little unsteady and then figure it out. So teams,
I know will go into the lab and look at
film and really key on slowing her down after the
(48:03):
all star break and teams will be healthier, Like if
Satu Sodily comes back after representing Germany and the Olympics
and rejoins the wings. That is a six foot four
inch unicorn nightmare at the top. That will defend Caitlyn Clark.
It is Clark's worst nightmare because that's what she ran
into in college, right, Nebraska through size at her to
(48:24):
beat her, Indiana through size at her to beat her.
So that size is there in the WNBA. Now they
just have to get into the lab and figure out
how to counter because what's more devastating from Caitlyn than
anything else is her finding her open teammates, and so
there's going to be a lot more concentration on We
(48:47):
got to slow that down. We got to cross the
head of snake.
Speaker 2 (48:50):
It feels like a Yokic deal. Like Yokic is just
too good. Okay, you can either double team him and
let Jamal Murray go off reporter, or you can just say,
you know what yokis, We're going to man you up
and you're gonna score forty eight and we're just gonna
hope that nobody else goes off and we're able to win. Right,
I don't know that, Clark.
Speaker 3 (49:06):
So what makes Dallas interesting? Right with Luca and now
Clay and Kyrie. You know, pick your poison, but Luca
is the one you really focus on because he's the
triple double waiting to happen and can pass like nobody's business.
So you've got to approach it the same way.
Speaker 2 (49:20):
Yeah, well, this has been great, Cindy, illuminating stuff from
somebody who's boots on the ground. I mean, you're you're
in arena seeing all this stuff. I think I'm frankly
stunned that you think there's a chance people just not
want to be part of the circus. I think that
is that's a great take, and we'll see what happens.
I mean, maybe there is. I don't know. I guess
you probably don't know off the top of your head.
(49:41):
But like, what do you think the fever would need
in free agency to get better? You have Clark, you
have the two bigs. I don't what do they need?
I mean, Indiana fans would say a new coach.
Speaker 3 (49:52):
But itsides is a really good coach. I've had a
lot of time spent with her because I was in
the room when nobody cared about Indiana asking questions, and
she knows her stuff. She is really good and it
has been a lot to handle everything that goes along
with Kitlyn Clark. Not only do you have increased security
(50:15):
in the WNBA, Caitlyn has her own security. Like Britney
Griner has her own security, but Britney Griner had death
threats and was wrongfully detained in Russia. Caitlyn just has
her own extra layer of security. So there's just a
lot that gets baked into the Caitlin Clark cake that
people just aren't used to and are navigating how to
(50:37):
figure it out. And I think, if I'm a player,
I just want to hoop. I want it to be
about the team. I want a chance to get the shine,
you know. And case in point Aliah Boston comes through
with a double double, has a career high with sixteen rebounds,
made some critical plays down the stretch, and they interviewed
(51:00):
Caitlin after the game and she had a bunch of
turnovers and really didn't score, and it was just like,
wait a minute, what are we doing. That's not the
person you should be interviewing.
Speaker 2 (51:11):
But Cindy, you got to give the people what they want,
like congrats on your game, if.
Speaker 3 (51:16):
You're gonna if you're gonna do that, interview them both,
or start with the Leah then bring in Caitlyn. There's
a way to do this so that just by how
it's approached it's not alienating. Because the way I see
it sitting on my couch, I don't like how it's going.
Speaker 2 (51:33):
Well that's that Part's a media thing. That's not a
Caitlyn thing. Right, it's not her fault that they're grabbing her.
I mean, I guess she could say, hey, no, no,
go talk to Aleah Boston. It's like, come on, what
are you talking about?
Speaker 3 (51:43):
Yeah? No, I remember, well what's going on with my hair?
I remember when uh, there we go? H Cameron Brent
was very intentional about No, I don't want to just talk.
Let's pull in Deerca Handy or or whoever it was
for the La Spark. I think that the player could
be more intentional and just make it easy on the media.
(52:06):
The media can't do the right thing. Caitlyn can help
them take the right exit on the preway.
Speaker 2 (52:12):
Well that's another good take. All right, City ones, and
enjoy the All Star Game this weekend. And you know,
if the Caitlyn Clark mob comes after you after listening
to this, you know, just listen.
Speaker 3 (52:23):
I love Caitlyn's game. I do. I knew when she
hit this league that she would take it by storm.
I want her to improve defensively. I want her to
get in the weight room. She could be what she
could pass Sue Bird's all time assists record. Now, the
question is will she hoop that long? She's not going
(52:43):
to have to play ten years, fifteen years. She's already
got transformational money thanks to just her deal with Wilson Basketball,
let alone Nike like. She has gotten generational wealth and
she hasn't even played a WNBA complete season. So is
she going to play long enough to break all of
(53:04):
these records? Because Sue was around for a long time,
Diana's been around for twenty years. These records, you know,
I think they could fall. But she will she hoop
that long? I hope she does, but she certainly won't
have to to chase a paycheck.
Speaker 2 (53:20):
Another good question. All right, Cindy Brunson, thanks a lot.
We'll talk to you. Sue, thanks so
Speaker 3 (53:24):
Much for having me be good
This is Straight Fire with Jason McIntyre.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
What is up Straight Fire, Fam, It's me Jason McIntyre.
Straight Fire for Friday, July nineteenth. Oh, the weekend is here,
so exciting. Don't have a whole hell of a lot planned.
But one of my buddies is moving east and for
his like going away party, he wanted to play basketball.
(00:32):
He's one of the guys on The Great Foxes. So
we have a pretty stacked lineup for hoops this weekend
and I couldn't be more excited. Yes, that's the kind
of stuff that gets me pumped up. It's like, oh,
you want to go out to a bar, you want
to go out for drinks. It's like maybe you're gonna
play hoops? Hell Yeah? Who hoops with good players who
are your friends and know how to ball? Yeah, that
(00:53):
to me is super exciting. Anyways, we have a phenomenal
guest today, first timer on the podcas Cindy Brunson. She
used to work at ESPN. She's now a w NBA
announcer for the Phoenix Mercury. Guess who's hosting the WNBA
Al Star Game this weekend The Phoenix Mercury. So Cindy
(01:15):
is boots on the ground, all sorts of interesting Kitlin
Clark nuggets. Now, I will say this, I'll preface it.
I knew Cindy Brunson's way back when. I you know,
we're not like best friends or anything, but she had
recently heard something we were talking about on the herd
and ended up texting me, and I was like, oh,
(01:35):
I totally forgot, you know, Cindy, even though I follow
her on social media, totally forgot. You know, she's plugged in,
she knows, and she knows what's going on, and she's
got some interesting Kitlin Clark takes. I'll say this, and
I'm not saying she's not a fan, but there's definitely
a I've been with the WNBA forever, I know a
(01:56):
lot of these hoopers. Caitlin Clark is great. It's been
great for the league, but like, let's slow down. That's
the vibe. I God, it's not a negative vibe. It's
just that, you know, for instance, we get into the
Olympic thing and she just doesn't think on a guard
heavy team that there was room for Caitlin Clark. And
she does remind me that Diana Tarassi is the logo
(02:18):
of the WNBA. That is something I had totally forgotten.
And how they're gonna pull the logo off the Olympic
team who's trying for the sixth time to let some
rookie on. Well, they're definitely not doing that. There's no
question they just they're not doing that. And she makes
some interesting comments about Clark's defensive lapses, obviously, the turnovers, obviously,
(02:41):
the assists, the positive, the good and the bad. You know,
it's a good discussion. I think you guys will really
enjoy it. Listen. I think you're gonna enjoy this. I'll
just leave it at that. A couple quick notes before
we get to it. The Russell Westbrook to Denver thing,
which feels very odd. I don't understand the affinity. I mean,
(03:01):
the only thing I can think of is when Russ
was averaging a triple double that year and won the MVP.
I feel like that's what maybe Jokic thinks he's getting
from Russ, because you know, Russ has had some good years,
just not like in the last five when Denver's ascended.
But this idea that he's gonna like help. I did
(03:24):
read that in Denver. Michael Malone. If you remember in
the playoffs. Like Peyton, Watson was pretty solid in the
regular season. He's spicy, He's considered to be like an
up and coming player for the Nuggets, a rotational guy.
He like, barely played in the playoffs for whatever reason,
just reduced to bench fodder and Malone trusts veterans in
(03:44):
his court. Now, Christian Brown two years ago, yes he
did play as a rookie, but by and large this
season he didn't play the young guys. Julian Strawther from
Good Zaga. They've got some young dude, Zeke Naji who
they paid a lot of money, and for whatever reason,
Malone just he's not paying these guys playing these guys.
(04:05):
So it's like one of these hmm. And now you
go out and get Russell Westbrook, what's he a veteran
And it's just I don't know if this is a
I'm not sure what this could possibly be about other
than I need vets because I'll tell you right now, Yes,
KCP got cooked by Anthony Edwards in the playoffs. Well,
(04:25):
it's not like Russell Westbrook's coming into Guardian. That's not happening.
And if you want to make the argument, listen, we
need rush to boost the second unit when Murray's getting
a breather and Yoki's just getting a breather. Okay, hey,
you know he tried that with the Lakers and it
didn't quite work out. Then he tried it with the
Clippers and it worked out for like flashes. So I
(04:48):
don't see why it's going to be different Denver. I'm
kind of out on the Nuggets. Fox asked me for
my over unders this year, and I took under Nuggets
fifty two and a half. I don't see them as
a fifty two win team. I don't love them anyways.
The other thing is Bronnie James had another good game
for the Lakers. Is back to back wins where Bronnie
(05:09):
has played good, got double digit points. He had a
step back three Like, listen, are you guys surprised that
a nineteen year old struggled out of the gate in
the summer League? Not the nineteen year old number two
pick overall, the fifty fifth pick. By the way, Alex Sar,
who went number two overall, had a game where he
was oh for fifteen. You didn't hear about it because
nobody cares about Alex Sar. But Bronnie James is oh
(05:30):
for fifteen and four games from deep and it's oh
my gosh, he's a bum. He's a bus you see
how that works. So anyways, Bronnie James bouncing back nicely,
happy to see it. Just get off the kids back, guys,
you know. Anyways, without further ado, let's get to our guest,
former Sports Center anchor and WNBA announcer, Cindy Brounson.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
You know, guy Jason likes to think he knows everything
when it comes to sports. I know what sports fans want,
but for everything he doesn't, he knows the guy who does.
Speaker 3 (06:01):
Let's just say I know a guy who knows a
guy who knows another guy.
Speaker 2 (06:06):
All right, let's welcome into straight Fire, a first time
guest on the podcast. Although you obviously know who she is.
She's been on Sports Center hosting for years. She is
been an announcer in the WNBA, and she just so
happens to be working with the Phoenix Mercury where the
NBA a WNBA All Star Game is this weekend. Cindy Brunson, Cindy,
(06:29):
how you doing.
Speaker 3 (06:30):
I'm great, thanks so nice to see your face again
and chat with you it's been too long.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
It has.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Indeed, So you've been around basketball your entire life. You
obviously played sports growing up, correct mm hmm.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
I did until my left knee stopped cooperating and forced
me to talk about basketball instead of play basketball. I've
had my left acl repair three different times, so it
was easy for me to focus on, Hey, I'm going
to be involved from the sideline. So for more twenty years,
I've been receiving my mail at the corner of women's
college basketball and the WNBA.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
See, now, that's incredible. So you've been doing this for
twenty years, and then I'm going to go ahead and
guess that you're seeing on your end kind of what
we're seeing just a tsunami of interest and discussion around both.
You know, women's college basketball last year was unbelievable. I mean,
the final four, the tournament was incredible and the WNBA
(07:27):
obviously have you seen a massive change? Would you call
it gradual? Has it been building up to this or
I don't know. Does some of those Yukon teams back
in the day have have massive interest.
Speaker 3 (07:37):
The Yukon teams have always had interests. It's why Geno
Arima has more national championships than any other coach in
women's college basketball with his eleven, but he was the
first and up until Kitlyn Clark and IOWA, the only
traveling circus as far as women's basketball is concerned. Now
with Caitlyn Clark and to your word, tsunami that she
(07:59):
has created, ratings wise, folks are paying acute attention and
it's good to see because for those of us that
have been involved with the game for decades, we've always
known the product was great. The product was never the problem,
it was the promotion. So now the two have finally merged,
and having been in the halls of ESPN from nineteen
(08:21):
ninety nine to twenty thirteen, I left and headed west
when my husband, Steve Berthhume got hired to be the
play by play voice for the Arizona Diamondbacks on the
TV side. So I fought those battles in those halls
in Bristol, just begging for a promo during Sports Center
about an upcoming WNBA game on our air. And credit
(08:42):
to Carol Stiff and Pat Lowry, who are no longer
with ESPN, they fought the good fight. They did the
best that they could in a territory that just was
not open to promoting women's sports. It just wasn't. It
paid it lip service over and over and over again.
And when I left, I was beyond frustrated because I
(09:02):
just saw the potential for what it could be the
explosion that we're having right now, that could have happened
fifteen twenty years ago. Shoot, when Diana Tarasi came out
of Yukon in two thousand and four, she could have
created this same kind of swell of interest that we're
seeing with Caitlin Clark now, because Caitlin is just Diana
(09:22):
two point zero just twenty years later. The talent has
always been there, it's just the amplification and the availability
and access on TV.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
So you you followed up obviously WNBA twenty years announcing games.
You mentioned the ratings and I saw it stat that
like the last sixteen years there hadn't been an audience
of a million for a game, and then boom, now
like almost every game on TV featuring Clark has has
topped to a million. Or when you're.
Speaker 3 (09:53):
Yeah, and it doesn't just have to feature Clark either,
I mean, yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
There's been Vegas aces. I guess had had one of
the top games and then I think an Angel rees
game against someone. Yeah, but like in the arena, are
you seeing a difference in terms of just volume of
fans interest? Are people stopping you in the street at
Starbucks whereas stuff that had not happened in the past
(10:17):
is now happening more frequently.
Speaker 3 (10:19):
Yeah, I'm getting stopped at Starbucks. I'm getting stopped at Safeway.
It's kind of cool. Somebody asked me today if I
had our All Star Game tickets. I'm like, are you
kidding me? No, no, goo boo, you didn't get that
many advans. I'm sorry. Check the secondary sites. Yeah, it's
it's been really cool to see. But again, the product
has always been outstanding. We have had so many unbelievably
(10:42):
talented female basketball players booping and I mean Age OPI
and Apostrophe all caps for decades and we just haven't
had the promotion. And now the Caitlin Clark train is
forcing the promotion and everybody else is getting to learn
(11:02):
more names, more teams, more storylines, and it's fantastic.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
What do you think it is. I don't know how
much time you spent around Clark, but what is it
about her? Or has she just captured like a time
and a place. You know. Listen, I'm not gonna make
it too much about me a low it is my podcast,
but like I got, I'm not gonna lie. I got
super lucky with my website. Back in the day, you know,
websites were just popping up. There wasn't release social media,
(11:27):
and you had to come to my website multiple times
a day to get the updates on whatever. And I
was fortunate. Now, if somebody tried to start a website
in twenty twenty four, it's like good luck, you know,
just people don't go to website. So I was fortunate.
Clark's timing social media. What's going on in the country
at large, I don't know. Can you pinpoint one thing
or is it just a confluence of events.
Speaker 3 (11:49):
I think it is a couple of factors. The Peacock
Big ten television deal and more television access on different platforms.
I'm also a member of Nbcpeacock. So I did a
Caitlin Clark game at Minnesota and the place had never
been that full in its history. More than fourteen thousand fans,
(12:12):
like it was crazy, and it was seventy five to
eighty percent Iowa fans and the rest Minnesota and just
general basketball fans. So she has had a Tim Tebow
esque effect on the college campus and that has now
transferred to the WNBA and it's been fantastic. And the
(12:34):
wild thing that I never thought I would see was
that her fan base is taking away home court advantage
from stout venues. Indiana came to Phoenix. We have what
we call the X factor. We were the worst team
in the WNBA last season, and yet we finished second
in attendance. Our fan base is elite. It is smart,
(12:57):
very educated, and diehard, and it was drowned out by
the voices that were supporting Caitlin Clark and not kind
of the fever, but mostly Caitlin Clark. And I had
never experienced that on the WNBA level, and that was wild,
and I've seen it. I saw Indiana do that at Minnesota.
(13:21):
You know, Minnesota is kind of they call it carb
North because that's where the Big Ten tournament was held,
and so Iowa fans are used to going there and supporting.
But I think it really it unsettled the links. You
could tell it was just well, wait a minute, we
can't hear our own fans Why are they cheering for
the opposing team. We're supposed to happen a home court
advantage here. So that's the singular thing that has stuck
(13:44):
out to me, like, Wow, that is really changing the
scales in a way that I didn't anticipate. I knew
that she would challenge for Rookie of the Year. I
knew she would challenge to break the assists record, which
she has done. She has also set the record for
the most turnovers in a season and she still got
fifteen games ago, so that'll be interesting. And I didn't
(14:07):
think the three point shooting would translate, and to this
point it hasn't, just because she's meeting bigger, faster, stronger
defenders and as quick as she is to go to
that left to shoot that logo three, somebody's in her face.
But she can get that pass off and fire it
in a variety of different ways and that has been
really cool to see. So not only is she in
(14:28):
the Rookie of the Year conversation at the top of
the table, she's also now in the MVP conversation for
the league, and the WNBA has only had one person
when Rookie of the Year and MVP in the same
season and that was the amazing canvas partner.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
M that's right. She was a legend. Now, wait, let
me go back to the Phoenix game where it was noisy.
I can't imagine that many. I can't imagine say, ten
thousand people traveling from Indiana to Phoenix for a game.
Speaker 3 (15:00):
So well, we average ten thousand. We vacillate between ten
and fourteen, so right around twelve, so five to six
thousand that day were her fans, Indiana fans, Kate Clark fans,
and so when the X factor was trying to boom,
they were getting tamped down. I was in the seats.
I bought a ticket to the game because it was
(15:21):
an ESPN game. I'd never seen anything like it.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
Okay, so let's say five thousand Fever fans. Do you
think they traveled from Indiana or is this just basketball
fans in Phoenix in the area maybe an hour way,
two hours whatever, who just have got the Caitlyn Clark
bug and they're like, let's check this out.
Speaker 3 (15:38):
Yeah, I think yeah, I think they weren't able to
get tickets to see her in Los Angeles or in
Las Vegas. They came to Phoenix because we're all in
close proximity, a four and a half hour drive away
from Las Vegas, a six hour drive from Los Angeles,
so it's easy to get to a b She is
one of those players because of the logo three. Just
(15:58):
like everybody wanted to see step they want to see
Caitlin Clark and person, and to her absolute credit, despite
only being a pro for five minutes, she puts on
a show.
Speaker 2 (16:11):
Yeah, I'm loath to mention, but Curry did have a
lot of detractors in the league. When like around twenty fifteen,
I remember going to a game in Philadelphia with my
kid and it was like Steph Curry jerseys all over
the Lower Bowl and there was still pushback about Curry.
This was before he got his first MVP, and it
was like Chris Paul was like, I don't know, I'm
(16:33):
not a fan whatever. Russell Westbrook like this stuff is
documented to somebody wrote a book essentially about this, a
writer for The Athletic, And it was like there was
almost so much excitement for Curry that there was some
jealousy among the guards, like what's so special about this guy?
He's making some long threes, so what And then all
of a sudden, you couldn't You couldn't like, you couldn't
say that anymore. Steph Curry just took over the league.
(16:55):
Do you feel there is some pushback from players around
the Clark circus if you will.
Speaker 3 (17:00):
It'll be interesting to see how Indiana proceeds as a team.
They have a highly touted player at two time All
Star in Kelsey Mitchell, who will be an unrestricted free
agent next year, and will she stay with a fever?
Does she want to be one of the pips next
to Gladys Knight or does she want to be a
(17:20):
star in her own right? Because before Kateland Clark came along,
it was Kelsey Mitchell who was the business coming out
of Ohio State. She had the three point shooting record,
she had the big ten scoring record, she was one
of the top five all time scores in NCAA history,
and all of that just kind of went to the
side when Kitlyn Clark came along. So I'm curious to
(17:44):
see how that because they've got a nice core for
together right now, if that stays that way, is that
big ass sorry about wow?
Speaker 2 (17:52):
No, no, I got a dog now, this is something
I didn't know that Yeah, like I didn't know about that.
I do have a friend who's in dp's from Iowa's
he's a huge fan. So I'm looking at Kelsey Mitchell stats. Yeah,
she's got good numbers. But that's interesting. So I don't
have you heard anything or are you just speculating?
Speaker 3 (18:07):
No, no, I'm I'm just curious now because we saw
Marina Maybury ask for a trade out of Chicago and
the Angel ree Show, so they why she left. I
don't know why, but I thought it was interesting to
demand the trade as we hit the All Star Olympic
break when the team is doing really well. They just
(18:29):
beat Las Vegas, the two time defending champs on there
for to hit the All Star break, and now Mayby
says I need, I need to go somewhere else. So
to me that was like, hmmm, why don't you like winning?
Speaker 2 (18:46):
Yeah, well, it's weird because.
Speaker 3 (18:49):
Chicago, thanks to Angel Reese and her record string of
double doubles, is in the playoff hunt and that is
so surprising. And to me it gives me a no
for Angel Rees for Rookie of the Year over Caitlin Clark,
because only because Chicago was in rebuild mode. They were
(19:09):
in revamp mode. They were supposed to be bottom four,
if not the worst, so the fact that they are
competing for playoff positioning is jarring. Indiana was supposed to
make the playoffs. Caitlyn Clark was supposed to perform really well,
so the fact that she's doing that is not a surprise.
And the fact that they stubbed their toe Indiana did
(19:32):
against Dallas, a team that was the bottom of the league.
You're not supposed to do that. You're not supposed to
set the assists. Yeah, you're not supposed to set the
assist record all time in a game with nineteen dimes
and then commit a late turnover that cost your team
of victory if you are the Rookie of the Year
and or MVP. Where Angel Reese and her team's victories
(19:53):
late in crunch time against great competition has stepped up,
hit big free throws, got big reback, whatever her team needs.
So it's it'll be interesting Rookie of the Year conversation
going down the stretch and Rakia Jackson has entered the
chat from Los Angeles. Kurt Miller has discovered how slippery
and awesome she is, so yeah, tons to be excited about.
Speaker 1 (20:17):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
the nation. Catch all of our shows at Foxsports Radio
dot com and within the iHeartRadio app. Search FSR to
listen live.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
This Mitchell things fascinating. So I looked up the fever.
They have not been good for a while. They won
the title in twelve twelve, but they haven't made the
playoffs since twenty sixteen. I mean single digit wins most
of the time. So she do you think she would
actually want to leave a winning team? I mean they're
gonna set obviously, they'll finish the season more wins they've
had in the last like eight years, so that that
(20:52):
would be interesting. You want to win? Or do you
want to be like the show? Because, like you said,
the girl Jackson on the sparks like they're terrible. Brink
got in I think during I think I saw this
at during Angel Reset. What you have sixteen double doubles
in a row? They were like six and ten or something,
So like, yeah, these rookies, they're they're not going to
impact winning that much. But the fact that Chicago and
(21:14):
Indiana are kind of creeping on the playoffs, that's kind
of interesting though.
Speaker 3 (21:18):
Yeah, if the playoffs started today. Both teams are in
and that is now Indiana was supposed to be in.
You've got back back number one draft picks overall, you've
got the number two draft pick, and Melissa Smith, who
plays with a huge chip on her shoulder. She is outstanding.
She's just a walking double double waiting to happen. And
then you know Eliah Boston, the reigning rookie of the Year.
(21:39):
They have a core four that is really nice. And
if they don't make the playoffs, you will hear calls
for Christie Sides and her job as head coach because
all of the pieces are there and they've already survived
the gauntlet of the season. Right. They had to play
New York a bunch of times, they had to play
Connecticut out of the gate. They were terrible at the beginning.
(22:00):
But now that they've been able to spend time together
and develop some cohesion, they are showing everybody what Indiana
basketball can be. And again, my expectation for Caitlin Clark
coming out of Iowa was to get Indiana into the playoffs.
My big bar of whether she is it the deal,
(22:22):
the transformational aura, you name it, is if she makes
Indiana nine wins better than they were a year ago.
I use that standard because that's what Diana Tarassi did
when she left Yukon in two thousand and four. She
made the Mercury, who were terrible nine wins better. And
when you only have thirty six at the time or
(22:44):
forty games now, that's a quarter of the season. So
if you turn those losses into wins, you have my attention,
and it's enough to get a team comfortably into the
playoffs and possibly hold home court advantage as well. So
they would have to get to twenty two wins for
that to happen Indiana. So that's the last little piece
(23:05):
that I'm looking for, because I think she's gonna set
the rookie record for a sisper game at Tisha Pennacherial
in nineteen ninety eight said that at seven and a
half per Clark is leading the league right now. And
what was my other metric, Well, I'm trying that twenty
two wins.
Speaker 2 (23:21):
They would have to go eleven and three down the stretch.
I don't know if that's forty game regular seasons, So yeah,
that would be tough, but it's doable. The schedule, it's.
Speaker 3 (23:32):
Doable, and there their second half schedule is Sharman saw
it's very second easy schedule left so they could do it.
Speaker 2 (23:42):
Did you think it was unfair that they front loaded
her schedule coming right off the college basketball run.
Speaker 3 (23:47):
Nope, nope, you got you got to play those teams
at some point, and you would rather play them while
you're figuring it out and just take those losses and
figure out how to beat the teams that you know
you can beat, because even at their best, Indiana hasn't
been able to figure out how to beat the Liberty
And that's tough because the Liberty are really good. There's
(24:07):
a reason why they are at the top of the table.
Minnesota really good. So Indiana gets that win, that's a
feather in their cap. But then you can't stub your
toe against the Washington Midsticks and the Dallas Wings. You
just can't do that. So we're going to see what
Indiana is made of when everybody comes back from the
Olympic break and the All Star break after hopefully Team
(24:30):
USA wins an eighth straight gold medal in tenth overall. Yeah, well,
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (24:34):
Of course, a second hold on.
Speaker 3 (24:39):
France is coming, Germany is coming, Belgium is coming like
there are Australia. Australia has dusted off forty three year
old Lauren Jackson, who has the distinction of being a
three time in WNBA MVP. She is special and now
(24:59):
that she is playing paying free, Australia is a problem.
Speaker 2 (25:03):
Okay, hold on, we'll come back to I just one
last thing. So in the end, we know the NBA
is a players league where I don't want to say
the stars get to pick the coaches. But we just
saw Donovan Mitchell and Bickerstaff blow up. Donovan Mitchell gets
a new coach, Lebron and Darvin Ham Lebron gets a
new coach. This is not like a strange thing. And
the NFL, to an extent, quarterback has a say on
(25:24):
the coach. I'm curious you mentioned the Indiana Fever coach.
You know the fans don't love her. She takes a
beating from some of these analytical Caitlin Clark fans online.
Do you think if they replaced the coach, Kaitlin Clark
should have a say in all your time around basketball.
Speaker 3 (25:44):
I think to put that at her feet would be
a lot. They are already asking her to hold for
the first time in my life. I'd never seen this
a visiting team holding a news conference pre game. I
attended the Caitlyn Clark pre game news conference. I've never
seen that before in the WNBA, So I think they're
(26:06):
already putting a lot on her. The thing that I
do think is interesting is that Lisa Bluter, her former
coach at Iowa, did retire and handed the keys to
the car to Jan Jensen for the Hawkeyes. So her
coach who they took Iowa from nowhere to a pair
(26:27):
of final fours and champ games. So I'm just I
always leave that simmering on the back burner.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
Yeah, no, that's interesting, and you just made a good point.
I think we've touched on this before. But like U,
Coon's had some amazing runs with Gino, They've had stacked
teams undefeated. All that is part of what's made Clerk special.
We saw Curry dominate at Davidson Little Davidson made a
run to the Elite eight, and that kind of put
him on the map. I mean, he had already been
(26:56):
doing good things going against Blake Griffin and stuff, but
that tournament run against the big boys, pushing Kansas to
the limit, taking down a Gonzaga and then a Georgetown.
Is that part of the allure to Clark that, Hey,
she didn't go to Hong Kon or a factory, you
went to the championship with Iowa.
Speaker 3 (27:15):
Right, That's part of the mystique for sure. But funny
thing is is Caitlin Clark was a huge Yukon fan
growing up. Her favorite player was Maya Moore and she
wanted to attend Yukon and Gino Rima had the choice,
am I going with Paige Beckers or am I going
with Caitlin Clark? And he chose Paige Beckers. He said
(27:38):
Paige had way more upside. We'll make a better pro,
We'll be a better Olympian. And just like Caitlin, she's
been a National Player of the Year already and now
that she's healthy, she probably has the best chance to
break the drought, right because since Stewie four peeded, Yukon
hasn't won a title. Twenty sixteen was the last one.
(28:01):
That's where I got unnerved when people said Caitlin Clark
was the best player in college period. Now, Rianna Stewart
won four championships in a row, and in women's basketball,
unlike the men winning means more. The more gold medals,
(28:21):
the more championships, the more euro League championships, whatever. If
you're getting a prize for crossing the street faster than
your teammate, that matters more than just getting to the
final four or putting your program on the map. You
got to seal the deal. Diane and I won three
championships at Yukon. Coming into the WNBA, she was a
(28:44):
venerable force because she had proven it at the collegiate level. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
I think my guess is the people who were saying
that is wait a minute, hold on Yukon had how
many McDonald's all Americans of those teams, like maybe the
entire starting lineup, and Iowa has like two star kids.
I mean, I think, uh, Martin is a pro right
on Vegas. And then other than that, Yes, yeah, I
don't know, maybe the big kids. Stokey, I don't know
(29:08):
if she's uh, I don't know what her at pro
prospects are.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
She she needs she needs to get in the gym
and learn how to play defense and finish at the rim.
But yeah, she has potential.
Speaker 2 (29:20):
And those Yukon teams were absolutely loaded.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
Now.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
Beckers, though had the unfortunate. Didn't you have back to
back injuries? Like yes out, yeah, yeah, she's a superstar.
There was when when Indiana was stinking up the joint,
going like what one intend to start the season or
whatever against the competition. It was like, oh, Page Page
and uh Caitlin back court next. Everybody's all excited. Well,
no chance of that happened. Now, all right, let's get
(29:44):
to the go ahead, Go ahead.
Speaker 3 (29:46):
No, I would just I would not want Indiana to
take Page Beckers as well. That I don't think would
be good for the league. I think we need to
spread the talent around Indiana. Indiana has its point guard.
Speaker 2 (29:57):
So all right, let's get to the Olympics.
Speaker 3 (30:00):
Now.
Speaker 2 (30:01):
This is obviously a very dicey issue. Almost it's almost
gotten a little political. I don't know if you've felt that,
but people are just so worked up about it. Obviously,
listen from from a from a my standpoint, like Cindy,
I'd never been to a w NBA game. My daughter,
I coached her.
Speaker 3 (30:18):
And who.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
Well, no hold on Kitlin Clark. She went back East
with my wife and son during the holiday break. I
couldn't go because I had to work, And they're like, please,
get us tickets to the Rutgers Kaitland Clark game. So
we came through. So then Caitlin Clark comes out here
to face the Sparks and we got tickets, and it's like,
oh my gosh, I voted for the w NBA. I'll
start getting like I'm interested in the Caitlin Clark show
(30:42):
if I'm laying on the couch and I'm like, let
me just check the w NBA. Scorse, Oh, Kitlin Clark's
playing altroarn game. Now the Olympics not gonna lie. I
couldn't tell you who were the starting five on the
Olympic team for the women's The last time around, I
will say I'm shocked Clark because not on the team.
I know she didn't make the camp because she's in
(31:03):
the final four. And this is a very A lot
of women's basketball diehards are like, no, she can't be
on the team. Now, I want you to has opinion.
First of all, tell me do you think she should
have made it?
Speaker 3 (31:16):
Then?
Speaker 2 (31:17):
And now? Given how herst numbers match up extremely favorably
with the girls who are on the Olympic team, and
in several categories she's beating them in WNBA status here
at least. I'm just curious how you've gone, and you
could be as honest as you want. I don't mind disagree.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
I don't think Caitlin Clark should be on the twenty
twenty four Olympic team. I think it's a team that's
already guard heavy, so to add another guard is just nonsensical.
And then who are you going to take off? Are
you going to deny Diana Tarassi who has spent more
than half of her life with USA Basketball and opportunity
(31:56):
to do the unprecedented win a six straight gold medal
for her comfort, for her country. She's the logo of
the WNBA, the layand with the bun. That's Diana, So
you don't want to take her off. You can't take
off Chelsea Gray, she's amazing, Jackie Young, Kelsey Plumb Sabrina Yonescue, Like,
(32:17):
which guard are you going to take away to give
Caitlin an opportunity? When defense and physicality is going to
be the name of the game at the Olympics. In
Paris late game situations, Christy Sides has to take out
Caitlin because they're afraid she'll get beat. You cannot take
(32:39):
out anybody when you are on the Olympic stage, they
have to be able to defend. So it's the lack
of ability to play defense, which she will shore up
and she will get better at and she will have
a chance to represent Team USA for years to come.
It's just not her turn now, and that's okay. Everybody
(33:01):
just needs to get out of their feelings about it
and get behind the fact that Team USA has two
first timers on it already, Kalia Copper of the Mercury
and Alissa Thomas of the Connecticut Sun, the all time
triple doubles leader in WNBA history. Are you going to
take one of those two players off to put Caitlyn on?
(33:24):
I don't think so. So I love the way that
the team is constructed. I think it is constructed to
win an eighth straight gold medal and stand on that
metal stand and let everybody hear the Star spangled banner
and all of it. With Team USA winning an eighth
straight gold medal, I think Caitlyn is going to help
(33:46):
Team USA win down the road, So she just doesn't
have to help in twenty twenty four.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Okay, So the counter would be I had to look
this up just because you made a good point about
winning an eighth straight. So two thousand eight eight Summer
Olympics US women won every game by fifteen or more.
Twenty twelve, they won every game by thirteen or more.
Twenty sixteen, every game by nineteen or more, so zero
single digit games. Twenty twenty they had one single digit game,
(34:15):
beating Nigeria by nine everything else. So basically, in the
last four Olympics they have utterly been dominant, like nobody
can touch them. My guess, I know you said that
everybody else is better, but my guess is they're going
to steamroll and win every game by double digits again.
So if we are to assume that, hey, they've got
the gold locked up, then don't you kind of sort
(34:36):
of want to say, you know what, it would be
great for the WNBA and women's basketball in general to
have Clark on the team. Who's going to generate more eyeballs.
We've seen her do it for the league. Wouldn't she
do it for the Olympics. But I guess your counter
would be the Caitlin Clark circus. And I am curious
where you are on whether or not the circus is
(34:58):
a bad thing.
Speaker 3 (35:00):
Well in this instance, it might be a distraction, and
nothing can detract from the mission. Team USA is all
about the mission of completing the assignment, and that is
an eighth straight gold medal. And just like in the WNBA,
where it's not like New York woke up and isn't
(35:22):
as good as it was last season, or Las Vegas
for that matter, they've dealt with injuries and what has
happened is the rest of the league has leveled up.
Everybody else has gotten better. Even the worst team, the
Washington Mystics, can get you if you're not buttoned up.
And the same goes on the world stage. Australia is better,
(35:45):
France is better, Belgium is better. Belgium has a former
Finals MVP in Ma Mesiman from the twenty nineteen Washington
Mystics sitting out this WNBA season getting her team ready
for this fight. All of the other teams are together.
(36:05):
Gabby Williams sitting out from the Storm. She's helping Team
France get better. The competition this year will be unlike
any other, and that's why Cheryl Reeve and the committee
leaned into veteran leadership ability to score off the bounce,
(36:25):
create off the bounce and defend as if your ability
to breathe depends on it. It will all be needed
to triumph in Paris.
Speaker 1 (36:36):
Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in
the nation. Catch all of our shows at Foxsports Radio
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listen live.
Speaker 2 (36:47):
So you don't think they're like kind of a lock
with or without Clark.
Speaker 3 (36:52):
No, don't. I don't take anything for granted at all.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
So you know, again, the gambling markets are just one
aspect us. According to you know, DraftKings minus eighteen hundred
to win gold. So Australia is second, Belgium is looks
like fifth. So basically Vegas is saying you've got to
lay a ton of money to win a little bit
of money. That's how heavy they are. Famous. Now, upsets
(37:19):
do happen. I get that. But regarding to circus, I
am curious, And this is a loaded word that people
don't seem to like. But do you, Cindy, think that
there's any jealousy over the attention Clark's getting. Whether it's
Reeve who has made some pointed comments, I think Cheryl
Swoots had a couple comments. TARROSSI had a comment, and again,
(37:40):
nothing really that harsh, except maybe Reeve if you want
to dig into it. But do you think there is like, Hey,
we've had a good league, We've got a lot of
great players. What's the big deal about Caitlin Clark. Do
you think jealousy works? Maybe not for all. I don't
want a blanket statement, but there is some jealousy around
the league with the intention she's getting.
Speaker 3 (38:01):
I think what's disquieting for a lot of people, and
myself included, is that the focus is on one when
the greater good is fantastic. We've never been a league
just about Diana or Cheryl Swoops or Lisa Leslie or
Lauren Jackson or Sue Byrd. It's always been about the collective,
(38:23):
and that, for me is what is jarring. That all
of the focus is on one person, and it just
goes against everything we fought for for decades, like look
at us, look at us as a collective. We are
a great product. And to have it boiled down to
a singular thing, I think everybody's just trying to navigate
(38:46):
that because it runs contrary to everything that we have
ever experienced before. But nobody discounts that Caitlin is a
generational talent that I have said time and again. When
I was on the call at Minnesota, I said, she
is Dinah TARROSSI two point zero like this, this is it.
(39:07):
And I know that the women's fans and some of
the pundits hate the male comp but she, Caitlin Clark
is Larry Bird. Just write it down with a sharpie,
just that that same vibe, that killer instinct, just makes
his teammates better, terrific passing and just goes about his business,
never really gets ruffled, just just as a killer and
(39:29):
gets it done, period, full stop. So yeah, So that's
that's kind of where I stand on it. It's just it's
jarring because all of the focus is on one person.
That's why I'm very curious to see if what we
see as an Indiana Fever roster currently stays together, because
that's a lot. You are dealing with alpha's at every position,
(39:52):
and does an alpha want to give up and concede?
Oh I'm I'm on her team and that's the best
I get.
Speaker 2 (40:02):
So wait, are you what were you getting that? Are
you hearing that? Are you seeing that? Are you speculated? Like?
Speaker 1 (40:09):
That?
Speaker 2 (40:09):
To me? Is interesting? I had not even considered. Listen,
you know, I play in men's leagues out here, Obviously
nobody cares. But I'm out here recruiting for a team.
I want the best players. I don't care if I
play let's. I want to win.
Speaker 1 (40:21):
I want championships.
Speaker 2 (40:22):
I want my name on the band. We've got one,
I want another. So I'm out there. I want to win,
and I think I'm an alpha. I'm obviously not at
my age, but uh, I'm surprised that people would not
like I'm trying to think like you. Historically Lebron and
his prime, it's guys Steph Curry and his prime. Yeah,
Kevin Durant, I want to go play there.
Speaker 3 (40:40):
Yeah, but they did that as established players. This is
a rookie, okay, who is ringing the bell? So do
you want to get in line behind a rookie who?
Speaker 1 (40:51):
Okay?
Speaker 2 (40:52):
One min yumpa. Well, I guess you know he just
finished his rookie season. But in this off season, Chris
Paul now that could have been a financial thing. Nobody
was given him total million bucks. But Chris now goes,
maybe he's just like, hey, I'll collect twelve million. And
then at the deadline, they'll ship me when we're not good.
But I don't know what wem Begnama's generational. My guess
is people would want to play with him, right.
Speaker 3 (41:16):
I think it's different in the NBA because there's so
many more teams and more options. We've got twelve teams now,
we'll expand to thirteen next season and fourteen and twenty
twenty six when Toronto comes on board after the Golden
State Valkyries. So there are still a finite number of spots,
and there are other things that players are chasing, like amenities.
(41:41):
There are only three teams in the WNBA, that's Las Vegas,
Seattle and now Phoenix that have dedicated practice facilities for
the women's teams in town. Our practice facility just opened.
One hundred million dollars was spent by owner Matt Ishbia,
and I always say Matt with one tea and a
(42:02):
whole lot of zeros, and it was ready. It was
supposed to take two years to build and get done,
and of course he had it done for all Stars
so it could be displayed as the crown jewel that
it is. But it's the amenities that players are also
looking for, in addition to more money and all of
the other things that they have been chasing for decades.
(42:24):
So does Indiana have that? Not at this juncture. It
doesn't have a practice facility, It doesn't have dedicated resources
to the fever. At this point. Now that could change.
Gamebridge and all of the associates with the arena and
everything is getting a lot of cash flow like they've
never seen before. So you would hope that would happen.
(42:46):
But until it does, free agents are going to go, well,
Seattle's got this, Vegas has that, and Seattle, Vegas and
Phoenix will run players through their practice facility just to
show them what they are missing, because the magic stuff matters.
Speaker 2 (43:03):
So how about this, I'd counter and say, hey, you
know what, you know who's getting all the great primetime
games and the most coverage and the most promo Indiana.
You come on this team with.
Speaker 3 (43:12):
Everybody, everybody, everybody's boat is rising because of that. All
are ye are getting more coverage than they ever have before. True,
So my counter to your counter is all the boats
are rising. That really doesn't That really doesn't resonate.
Speaker 2 (43:28):
Well, I would I would counter to the to the
to the potential free agent. I would say, hey, just
for fun watch Sports Center on a night the Caitlin
Clark plays, and I guarantee you she's in the A bloc.
I guarantee you that's not the case for any other team,
Like the Las Vegas Aces play, they're not making early
in the show Kitlin Clark plays, it's early. And if
you look at some of the social metrics, and again
(43:48):
I don't know what social media is totally worth, but
like the Indian and the Fever are now the league's
leader in I think social media followers and they were
like middle of the pack. This is all obviously because
of Clark.
Speaker 3 (44:01):
Yes, but that's Caitlyn Clark, right.
Speaker 2 (44:04):
But proximity to greatness does an equal greatness, but it
puts you on the map a little bit more.
Speaker 3 (44:09):
No, again, you're dealing with women that have busted their tails.
Can I swear on this that I can see whatever
you are past is for years looking for this kind
of shine. And on a night that Caitlyn Clark leads
Sports Center or is in the A block, to your point,
(44:30):
she's doing so when you could talk about four other
players for the opposing team and two on her team
that were just as special, that put up what we
haven't seen before this Steaven has just been the season
of records all over the place. Cop Copper KFC for
(44:51):
Phoenix Mercury, the first player in WNBA history with back
to back thirty seven point games. She's put up eight
thirty point games already this season. The record for the
franchise is ten that was held by Diana Tarassi set
in two thousand and nine. So everything can be highlighted
and talked about.
Speaker 2 (45:11):
Not just just Clark. All right, so we got to
wrap on. I know, I went because you said some
defensive stuff that I hadn't noticed on Clark getting pulled
lat in games.
Speaker 3 (45:22):
Again, defense created offense for defense, and defense is the
last thing that a player will take from college to
the WNBA. They have to learn how to depend I
talked to a lot of my yeah, yeah, upper body strength.
But I talked to a lot of my friends, and
we cannot believe how teams just don't drive at her
because she will olay out of the way and hope
(45:43):
her rim protection is there, or she will commit the foul.
She just doesn't have the footwork necessary to move against
the speed of a Khalia Copper or an a Rique
at gloom a Rique kept going at her and she
would just get out of the way. So o, Rique
had shots that were open. And you don't want to
leave Rique open available to hit shots because she will
(46:08):
kill you. She's the only player this season that had
a forty piece. She had a forty point game and
happened against the Mercury. I was their courts at But
she is a bucket. So yeah. And is she the
one who was.
Speaker 2 (46:20):
Snubbed from the from the Olympic team as well or
didn't make it? Yeah, you could, so there was another
one based on points. So I looked this up. This
is this is surprising to me, given you know that
the defense has been suspect. So she's And again, defensive
stats are hard, even in the NBA. You know, defensive
wind shares. I mean, you can look at whatever. But
(46:40):
Kalen Clark is tenth in the league in steels and
thirteenth in blocks, So I know that's you can't really
it's tough to chirt blowbys. But I mean, for instance,
she has twenty two blocks. Angel Reese only has ten
angel Resa center. I was stung by that note many
more minutes.
Speaker 3 (46:56):
Yeah, Angel Reese is a boer who plays the She's
an undersize center and when you're asking her to block
a shot, you're asking her to take a shot away
from six foot nine inch Britney grinder or six foot
seven inch Tierram account Like her ask is a little
bit more than what Caitlyn is asked to defend on
(47:18):
the perimeter. Like I think she blocked one of odyssey
sims shots. Odyssey is three four inches shorter than she is,
so Caitlyn should get that block and while she does
come through, she'll get the block on a swipe right
after the person has gone by. Don't want to have
that kind of block follow you all the time. And
then the steals come up because she does have very excellent,
(47:39):
excellent hand eye coordination. I mean she can see it.
She can pick up a rhythm and then she can
pick your pocket. But usually only happens once and then
the blitz comes at her the next two or three
times down the floor and you can see her get
a little unsteady and then figure it out. So teams,
I know will go into the lab and look at
film and really key on slowing her down after the
(48:03):
all star break and teams will be healthier, Like if
Satu Sodily comes back after representing Germany and the Olympics
and rejoins the wings. That is a six foot four
inch unicorn nightmare at the top. That will defend Caitlyn Clark.
It is Clark's worst nightmare because that's what she ran
into in college, right, Nebraska through size at her to
(48:24):
beat her, Indiana through size at her to beat her.
So that size is there in the WNBA. Now they
just have to get into the lab and figure out
how to counter because what's more devastating from Caitlyn than
anything else is her finding her open teammates, and so
there's going to be a lot more concentration on We
(48:47):
got to slow that down. We got to cross the
head of snake.
Speaker 2 (48:50):
It feels like a Yokic deal. Like Yokic is just
too good. Okay, you can either double team him and
let Jamal Murray go off reporter, or you can just say,
you know what yokis, We're going to man you up
and you're gonna score forty eight and we're just gonna
hope that nobody else goes off and we're able to win. Right,
I don't know that, Clark.
Speaker 3 (49:06):
So what makes Dallas interesting? Right with Luca and now
Clay and Kyrie. You know, pick your poison, but Luca
is the one you really focus on because he's the
triple double waiting to happen and can pass like nobody's business.
So you've got to approach it the same way.
Speaker 2 (49:20):
Yeah, well, this has been great, Cindy, illuminating stuff from
somebody who's boots on the ground. I mean, you're you're
in arena seeing all this stuff. I think I'm frankly
stunned that you think there's a chance people just not
want to be part of the circus. I think that
is that's a great take, and we'll see what happens.
I mean, maybe there is. I don't know. I guess
you probably don't know off the top of your head.
(49:41):
But like, what do you think the fever would need
in free agency to get better? You have Clark, you
have the two bigs. I don't what do they need?
I mean, Indiana fans would say a new coach.
Speaker 3 (49:52):
But itsides is a really good coach. I've had a
lot of time spent with her because I was in
the room when nobody cared about Indiana asking questions, and
she knows her stuff. She is really good and it
has been a lot to handle everything that goes along
with Kitlyn Clark. Not only do you have increased security
(50:15):
in the WNBA, Caitlyn has her own security. Like Britney
Griner has her own security, but Britney Griner had death
threats and was wrongfully detained in Russia. Caitlyn just has
her own extra layer of security. So there's just a
lot that gets baked into the Caitlin Clark cake that
people just aren't used to and are navigating how to
(50:37):
figure it out. And I think, if I'm a player,
I just want to hoop. I want it to be
about the team. I want a chance to get the shine,
you know. And case in point Aliah Boston comes through
with a double double, has a career high with sixteen rebounds,
made some critical plays down the stretch, and they interviewed
(51:00):
Caitlin after the game and she had a bunch of
turnovers and really didn't score, and it was just like,
wait a minute, what are we doing. That's not the
person you should be interviewing.
Speaker 2 (51:11):
But Cindy, you got to give the people what they want,
like congrats on your game, if.
Speaker 3 (51:16):
You're gonna if you're gonna do that, interview them both,
or start with the Leah then bring in Caitlyn. There's
a way to do this so that just by how
it's approached it's not alienating. Because the way I see
it sitting on my couch, I don't like how it's going.
Speaker 2 (51:33):
Well that's that Part's a media thing. That's not a
Caitlyn thing. Right, it's not her fault that they're grabbing her.
I mean, I guess she could say, hey, no, no,
go talk to Aleah Boston. It's like, come on, what
are you talking about?
Speaker 3 (51:43):
Yeah? No, I remember, well what's going on with my hair?
I remember when uh, there we go? H Cameron Brent
was very intentional about No, I don't want to just talk.
Let's pull in Deerca Handy or or whoever it was
for the La Spark. I think that the player could
be more intentional and just make it easy on the media.
(52:06):
The media can't do the right thing. Caitlyn can help
them take the right exit on the preway.
Speaker 2 (52:12):
Well that's another good take. All right, City ones, and
enjoy the All Star Game this weekend. And you know,
if the Caitlyn Clark mob comes after you after listening
to this, you know, just listen.
Speaker 3 (52:23):
I love Caitlyn's game. I do. I knew when she
hit this league that she would take it by storm.
I want her to improve defensively. I want her to
get in the weight room. She could be what she
could pass Sue Bird's all time assists record. Now, the
question is will she hoop that long? She's not going
(52:43):
to have to play ten years, fifteen years. She's already
got transformational money thanks to just her deal with Wilson Basketball,
let alone Nike like. She has gotten generational wealth and
she hasn't even played a WNBA complete season. So is
she going to play long enough to break all of
(53:04):
these records? Because Sue was around for a long time,
Diana's been around for twenty years. These records, you know,
I think they could fall. But she will she hoop
that long? I hope she does, but she certainly won't
have to to chase a paycheck.
Speaker 2 (53:20):
Another good question. All right, Cindy Brunson, thanks a lot.
We'll talk to you. Sue, thanks so
Speaker 3 (53:24):
Much for having me be good
Fox Sports Radio News
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Jonas Knox
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