May 30, 2025 • 11 mins
George Noory and Iraq War veteran Joseph Soel explore the emotional toll he faced during combat, if he felt the war was justified without a proven link to the 9/11 attacks, and his guilt over surviving battles where other soldiers were killed.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Now here's a highlight from Coast to Coast AM on iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Then welcome back to Coast to Coast. George Nori with you.
Joseph Soul with us in Iraq War combat veteran author.
The name of his book is The Broken Mirror of
Memory and current Worshipful Master of the Olympia at Lodge
Number one, the oldest Masonic lodge in the state of Washington.
He's the author of the book I just mentioned, The
Broken Mirror of Memory, Iraq and Other Tales, which is
(00:27):
a powerful fusion of poetry and reflection, chronicalizing the psychological
wounds of war, addiction, and the struggle for redemption. Joe,
Welcome to the program.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
George is a thrill and an honor. Thank you so
much for having me.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
And Tom tells me you're going to be at our
live event in every Washington the end of June.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
I sure am looking forward to it.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
I'm looking forward to that and thank you for your service.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
Joe, thank you for yours.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
When you went to Iraq, that was gul four number two, right,
I almost went to number one, which was in the
early nineties.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
Yeah, that was that was Golf War number two for me,
it was two thousand and eight.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
What was it like for you?
Speaker 3 (01:10):
It was an interesting experience there. There was, of course,
many attacks and a long periods of boredom sort of
punctuated by sheer terror. And really what impressed me most
was getting to know the Iraqi people and just learning
(01:30):
that I didn't have a particular quarrel with them whatsoever,
and it changed my perspective and really sent me on
a spiritual journey.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
During Gulf Wur one, I think we had to do
something because Saddam Hussein attacked Kuwait with his excuse of
slanted oil drilling. They claimed me that Kuwait was stealing
the Iraqi oil. But we had to do something there.
With Golf War number two, Joe, I'm not so sure
that was justified. They talked about weapons of mass destruction.
(02:01):
It never really found anything. What do you think of that?
Speaker 3 (02:04):
Well, I never really found him, and it's I think
it was a shame. I think it was a distraction
from the war in Afghanistan where the attacks from nine
to eleven originated, and I did not support it before
I was deployed, and did not support it while I
was deployed. But I did my duty anyway, because that's
(02:25):
what a soldier does. But I was opposed to it
from the start.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
Was this a ploy to get Saddam Hussein? You think?
Speaker 3 (02:35):
I think it was. I think it was George W.
Bush's revenge for Saddam trying to kill his father in Kuwait,
and I think it was a personal vendetta.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
Didn't various committees report that the Iraq had nothing to
do with it.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
Various committees had reported that, and even the nine to
eleven Commission found no link between Saddam Hussein and the
nine to eleven attacks. The WMD investigation by Congress found
that there had not been a substantial weapons program since
the since the First Golf War, and that Saddam was
(03:14):
merely making it look like he had weapons to intimidate
the West when in fact there were none, and that strategy,
unfortunately for him, backfired.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Tell me about the title of your book, the Broken
Mirror of Memory.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
The Broken Mirror of Memory is really my attempt to
put everything in order, because when you go to war,
things get jumbled around, at least they did for me.
Sometimes Iraq feels like one long day, and sometimes it
feels like broken up pictures that you can't quite put together.
Some of them are very terrifying, some of them are
(03:52):
quite happy, and you can't quite put them on A timeline.
Therapist calls it traumatic memory, and for me, writing the
book was an attempt at healing and an attempt to
put everything in order, so hence the title the Broken
Mirror of Memory.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
Did the healing work for you.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
I'm still healing. I believe healing is a process, George,
and it's something I'll be doing the rest of my life,
as so many other veterans of so many conflicts will
be doing for the rest of their lives. You don't
come home from a combat zone unchanged. No one does,
(04:36):
and we all have to find our own ways to
deal with that, whatever that may be.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
May seventeenth, two thousand and eight, the night of the
attack on the base of that or what happened.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
We were hit with five rockets that night. One hit
one hundred and ninety eight meters from our position. We
were in living quarters a friend of mine were preparing
to onto a night guard shift. We were already geared up. So,
and I take this all from statements for my commanders
(05:09):
and my first sergeant. I have very little memory of
the event, myself only four little snippets. We were hit
with five rockets. One came in first, landed one hundred
and ninety eight meters from our position, and we immediately
went into action, and eight or nine folks from the
nine to sixty second went out to try to get
(05:32):
accountability of three missing soldiers from our unit, and they
were found, thankfully alive, at the restaurant known as six
Pozzi on cobadd that was hit by I believe it
was one hundred and twenty millimeter mortar. It could have
been a rocket. I don't really remember the details on that.
(05:54):
I'd have to look at the documents. But the blast
wall collapsed on the restaurant. There was a lot of fire,
a lot of smoke. What I personally remember is a
lot of screaming for combat life savers, a lot of chaos.
I remember running with a combat lifesaver bag, and I
remember yelling in bunkers in various areas of the base.
(06:14):
You know where is Sergeant Taylor. I'll use a synonym
because I know that the person I'm speaking about likes
as privacy. But thankfully we found the soldiers, and many
soldiers in the unit were retroactively awarded the Combat Action Badge,
which I was in twenty twenty four after we got
(06:36):
our Congress people to fight with the army for it.
So we're very proud that we were able to basically
achieve full accountability and not have any fatalities in that attack,
because it was very close and we could have lost
three good people that night.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
You dedicate the book to Corporal Michael Thompson of Red
River forty four, where I believe seven member died in
that unit.
Speaker 3 (07:02):
Yes, they did. That was September seventeenth, two thousand and eight.
I dedicated to Corporal Michael Thompson because he was the
closest to me in age at the time. Let me
tell you, George, once you go to a dignified transfer
ceremony in a combat zone, although I imagine they are
very similar everywhere, but when you're in a combat zone,
when you're in that situation and you know that you
(07:22):
could be next, a dignified transfer becomes something extremely sacred, terrifying,
and beautiful and horrifying all at the same time. We
stood there saluting as seven flag draped coffins came off
of trucks and went on to a c. Seventeen to
return to Dover Air Force Base. And I write in
(07:45):
the book that I feel stuck in my boots and
I want out that that should be me in that box,
and I know it. I can't live it down. I
can't move, So I'll just stand there saluting on this
tarmac in the middle of the night for the rest
of my life. And I've never really left that moment
knowing that they had died and I had survived. There
(08:06):
is a great amount of kilt in that and while
it has gotten slightly easier over time, it has never
gone away. And there who I remember on Memorial Day
and every day.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
We're talking with Joe Soul, who's written a book called
The Broken Mirror of Memory. Iraq and other Tales. The
Second Gulf War was around two thousand and three to
two thousand and eleven, if I can recall, is that right, Joe, yes,
Georgia was What did they train you for?
Speaker 3 (08:42):
They trained us for munitions handling. We were a munitions unit.
Our job was to issue out all of the bombs
and bullets for Multinational Core Iraqs South and we were
involved in the Battle of Bosra issuing out bombs, healthfire
missiles bullets to go to both the Iraqi Army and
(09:04):
to close air support for them in the Siege of Bospra,
which took place about less than a month after we
got there. It would have been probably the twenty fourth,
and we would have gotten there on the fifth, I believe,
of March. So we ended up supporting that major engagement
(09:25):
with lots of fires and ammunition. And that's when I
started to develop a distaste for war and killing because
in most especially in an urban area, there is never
the real chance that you're going to avoid all possible
collateral damage, although the military does try. I find that
(09:49):
warfare is a horrible thing we visit upon our fellow
human beings.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
No question about it. I mean, we've got to get
the above this In Vietnam, which was a horrible situation,
the mistake that the protesters made they attacked the troops
coming home. Rather than protest the actual war, they went
after the troops as well, and I think that was wrong.
Speaker 3 (10:16):
Joe, Yes, my dad told me stories about that. He's
a Vietnam veteran, and he's the reason I joined the army.
He's the reason I am the man I am today.
He took care of my mother through twenty years of sickness,
and he served as country honorably in Vietnam, and he
(10:36):
told me he was spit on when he came home,
and oh, I find that reprehensible.
Speaker 2 (10:41):
Yes, I agree. They did not do that to you, folks,
So did they?
Speaker 3 (10:45):
They did not. They Everyone was very supportive of the
troops and what we went through, And although the VA
took a while to catch up in realizing what a
large problem had been created by the global War on terrorism,
the society at large was very supportive, and I'm thankful
for that. I'm thankful for the American people. Even though
(11:07):
I didn't support the specific war in Iraq, I was
proud to volunteer after nine to eleven to try to
respond to those attacks. I was proud to serve my country.
And I'm proud of every American who supports the troops,
because they are the Americans worth fighting for.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
You think the punishment of hanging Saddam Hussein after he
was finally captured was justified.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
I don't particularly like the death penalty, but I can
see where it was justified. There were a lot of
mass graves in that country, and sometimes you got to
wonder what else you can do with someone like that.
He was quite monsters.
Speaker 2 (11:48):
He was not a good guy.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
Was he Listen to more Coast to Coast AM every
weeknight at one am Eastern and go to Coast to
coastam dot com for more
Now here's a highlight from Coast to Coast AM on iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Then welcome back to Coast to Coast. George Nori with you.
Joseph Soul with us in Iraq War combat veteran author.
The name of his book is The Broken Mirror of
Memory and current Worshipful Master of the Olympia at Lodge
Number one, the oldest Masonic lodge in the state of Washington.
He's the author of the book I just mentioned, The
Broken Mirror of Memory, Iraq and Other Tales, which is
(00:27):
a powerful fusion of poetry and reflection, chronicalizing the psychological
wounds of war, addiction, and the struggle for redemption. Joe,
Welcome to the program.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
George is a thrill and an honor. Thank you so
much for having me.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
And Tom tells me you're going to be at our
live event in every Washington the end of June.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
I sure am looking forward to it.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
I'm looking forward to that and thank you for your service.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
Joe, thank you for yours.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
When you went to Iraq, that was gul four number two, right,
I almost went to number one, which was in the
early nineties.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
Yeah, that was that was Golf War number two for me,
it was two thousand and eight.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
What was it like for you?
Speaker 3 (01:10):
It was an interesting experience there. There was, of course,
many attacks and a long periods of boredom sort of
punctuated by sheer terror. And really what impressed me most
was getting to know the Iraqi people and just learning
(01:30):
that I didn't have a particular quarrel with them whatsoever,
and it changed my perspective and really sent me on
a spiritual journey.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
During Gulf Wur one, I think we had to do
something because Saddam Hussein attacked Kuwait with his excuse of
slanted oil drilling. They claimed me that Kuwait was stealing
the Iraqi oil. But we had to do something there.
With Golf War number two, Joe, I'm not so sure
that was justified. They talked about weapons of mass destruction.
(02:01):
It never really found anything. What do you think of that?
Speaker 3 (02:04):
Well, I never really found him, and it's I think
it was a shame. I think it was a distraction
from the war in Afghanistan where the attacks from nine
to eleven originated, and I did not support it before
I was deployed, and did not support it while I
was deployed. But I did my duty anyway, because that's
(02:25):
what a soldier does. But I was opposed to it
from the start.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
Was this a ploy to get Saddam Hussein? You think?
Speaker 3 (02:35):
I think it was. I think it was George W.
Bush's revenge for Saddam trying to kill his father in Kuwait,
and I think it was a personal vendetta.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
Didn't various committees report that the Iraq had nothing to
do with it.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
Various committees had reported that, and even the nine to
eleven Commission found no link between Saddam Hussein and the
nine to eleven attacks. The WMD investigation by Congress found
that there had not been a substantial weapons program since
the since the First Golf War, and that Saddam was
(03:14):
merely making it look like he had weapons to intimidate
the West when in fact there were none, and that strategy,
unfortunately for him, backfired.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Tell me about the title of your book, the Broken
Mirror of Memory.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
The Broken Mirror of Memory is really my attempt to
put everything in order, because when you go to war,
things get jumbled around, at least they did for me.
Sometimes Iraq feels like one long day, and sometimes it
feels like broken up pictures that you can't quite put together.
Some of them are very terrifying, some of them are
(03:52):
quite happy, and you can't quite put them on A timeline.
Therapist calls it traumatic memory, and for me, writing the
book was an attempt at healing and an attempt to
put everything in order, so hence the title the Broken
Mirror of Memory.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
Did the healing work for you.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
I'm still healing. I believe healing is a process, George,
and it's something I'll be doing the rest of my life,
as so many other veterans of so many conflicts will
be doing for the rest of their lives. You don't
come home from a combat zone unchanged. No one does,
(04:36):
and we all have to find our own ways to
deal with that, whatever that may be.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
May seventeenth, two thousand and eight, the night of the
attack on the base of that or what happened.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
We were hit with five rockets that night. One hit
one hundred and ninety eight meters from our position. We
were in living quarters a friend of mine were preparing
to onto a night guard shift. We were already geared up. So,
and I take this all from statements for my commanders
(05:09):
and my first sergeant. I have very little memory of
the event, myself only four little snippets. We were hit
with five rockets. One came in first, landed one hundred
and ninety eight meters from our position, and we immediately
went into action, and eight or nine folks from the
nine to sixty second went out to try to get
(05:32):
accountability of three missing soldiers from our unit, and they
were found, thankfully alive, at the restaurant known as six
Pozzi on cobadd that was hit by I believe it
was one hundred and twenty millimeter mortar. It could have
been a rocket. I don't really remember the details on that.
(05:54):
I'd have to look at the documents. But the blast
wall collapsed on the restaurant. There was a lot of fire,
a lot of smoke. What I personally remember is a
lot of screaming for combat life savers, a lot of chaos.
I remember running with a combat lifesaver bag, and I
remember yelling in bunkers in various areas of the base.
(06:14):
You know where is Sergeant Taylor. I'll use a synonym
because I know that the person I'm speaking about likes
as privacy. But thankfully we found the soldiers, and many
soldiers in the unit were retroactively awarded the Combat Action Badge,
which I was in twenty twenty four after we got
(06:36):
our Congress people to fight with the army for it.
So we're very proud that we were able to basically
achieve full accountability and not have any fatalities in that attack,
because it was very close and we could have lost
three good people that night.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
You dedicate the book to Corporal Michael Thompson of Red
River forty four, where I believe seven member died in
that unit.
Speaker 3 (07:02):
Yes, they did. That was September seventeenth, two thousand and eight.
I dedicated to Corporal Michael Thompson because he was the
closest to me in age at the time. Let me
tell you, George, once you go to a dignified transfer
ceremony in a combat zone, although I imagine they are
very similar everywhere, but when you're in a combat zone,
when you're in that situation and you know that you
(07:22):
could be next, a dignified transfer becomes something extremely sacred, terrifying,
and beautiful and horrifying all at the same time. We
stood there saluting as seven flag draped coffins came off
of trucks and went on to a c. Seventeen to
return to Dover Air Force Base. And I write in
(07:45):
the book that I feel stuck in my boots and
I want out that that should be me in that box,
and I know it. I can't live it down. I
can't move, So I'll just stand there saluting on this
tarmac in the middle of the night for the rest
of my life. And I've never really left that moment
knowing that they had died and I had survived. There
(08:06):
is a great amount of kilt in that and while
it has gotten slightly easier over time, it has never
gone away. And there who I remember on Memorial Day
and every day.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
We're talking with Joe Soul, who's written a book called
The Broken Mirror of Memory. Iraq and other Tales. The
Second Gulf War was around two thousand and three to
two thousand and eleven, if I can recall, is that right, Joe, yes,
Georgia was What did they train you for?
Speaker 3 (08:42):
They trained us for munitions handling. We were a munitions unit.
Our job was to issue out all of the bombs
and bullets for Multinational Core Iraqs South and we were
involved in the Battle of Bosra issuing out bombs, healthfire
missiles bullets to go to both the Iraqi Army and
(09:04):
to close air support for them in the Siege of Bospra,
which took place about less than a month after we
got there. It would have been probably the twenty fourth,
and we would have gotten there on the fifth, I believe,
of March. So we ended up supporting that major engagement
(09:25):
with lots of fires and ammunition. And that's when I
started to develop a distaste for war and killing because
in most especially in an urban area, there is never
the real chance that you're going to avoid all possible
collateral damage, although the military does try. I find that
(09:49):
warfare is a horrible thing we visit upon our fellow
human beings.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
No question about it. I mean, we've got to get
the above this In Vietnam, which was a horrible situation,
the mistake that the protesters made they attacked the troops
coming home. Rather than protest the actual war, they went
after the troops as well, and I think that was wrong.
Speaker 3 (10:16):
Joe, Yes, my dad told me stories about that. He's
a Vietnam veteran, and he's the reason I joined the army.
He's the reason I am the man I am today.
He took care of my mother through twenty years of sickness,
and he served as country honorably in Vietnam, and he
(10:36):
told me he was spit on when he came home,
and oh, I find that reprehensible.
Speaker 2 (10:41):
Yes, I agree. They did not do that to you, folks,
So did they?
Speaker 3 (10:45):
They did not. They Everyone was very supportive of the
troops and what we went through, And although the VA
took a while to catch up in realizing what a
large problem had been created by the global War on terrorism,
the society at large was very supportive, and I'm thankful
for that. I'm thankful for the American people. Even though
(11:07):
I didn't support the specific war in Iraq, I was
proud to volunteer after nine to eleven to try to
respond to those attacks. I was proud to serve my country.
And I'm proud of every American who supports the troops,
because they are the Americans worth fighting for.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
You think the punishment of hanging Saddam Hussein after he
was finally captured was justified.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
I don't particularly like the death penalty, but I can
see where it was justified. There were a lot of
mass graves in that country, and sometimes you got to
wonder what else you can do with someone like that.
He was quite monsters.
Speaker 2 (11:48):
He was not a good guy.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
Was he Listen to more Coast to Coast AM every
weeknight at one am Eastern and go to Coast to
coastam dot com for more
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