June 19, 2024 • 37 mins
Silencer Central is not only the current leader in the suppressor game, they’ve literally changed the game. Brandon Maddox of Silencer Central sits down with Gun Talk Nation’s Ryan Gresham for an in-depth discussion on what’s going on with NFA products, these record-fast approval times we’re hearing about, what the future holds and much more.
Learn more about Silencer Central here: https://snp.link/3bbd05c1
Check out the new Banish Speed K Ti here: https://snp.link/a8668bfd
This Gun Talk Nation is brought to you by B5 Systems, Stag Arms, SecureIt, Vortex Optics, Black Hills Ammunition, Range Ready Studios, Ruger, SDS Imports and Aero Precision.
For more content, subscribe to Gun Talk at guntalktv.com, on Gun Talk's Roku, Apple TV, iOS app, Android app, or find Gun Talk on YouTube, Facebook, Instagram, X and guntalk.com. Listen to all Gun Talk Podcasts with Spreaker, iHeart, Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you find podcasts.
Copyright ©2024 Freefire Media, LLC
Gun Talk Nation 06.19.24
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/gun-talk--6185159/support.
Learn more about Silencer Central here: https://snp.link/3bbd05c1
Check out the new Banish Speed K Ti here: https://snp.link/a8668bfd
This Gun Talk Nation is brought to you by B5 Systems, Stag Arms, SecureIt, Vortex Optics, Black Hills Ammunition, Range Ready Studios, Ruger, SDS Imports and Aero Precision.
For more content, subscribe to Gun Talk at guntalktv.com, on Gun Talk's Roku, Apple TV, iOS app, Android app, or find Gun Talk on YouTube, Facebook, Instagram, X and guntalk.com. Listen to all Gun Talk Podcasts with Spreaker, iHeart, Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you find podcasts.
Copyright ©2024 Freefire Media, LLC
Gun Talk Nation 06.19.24
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/gun-talk--6185159/support.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Silence or such as a unique positionthat typically most manufacturers we buy from where
their biggest seller. So we're ina good position to bring inventory and quickly
and continue to keep it on theshelf. So I mean we're excited.
Goal is to make it when youcan, right, Sure? Do I
think it'll be this way forever?I hope? So who knows what the
government? I'll be honest. Itold someone I would never have bet money
ever that they would have real timeapprovals. I could have seen like ninety
(00:23):
days, thirty days, sixty days, fifteen days. When it first started,
it was two weeks, so Icould, I could, I could
fathom that, but like this realtime concept, it was hard for me
to swallow at first. I'm RyanGresham and this this is guntognation. This
(00:50):
gun Tognation is brought to you byB five Systems, stag Arms, secure
It, Vortex Optics, Black Hills, Ammunition Range Ready, Ruger and SDS
Imports. All right, welcome intogun tog Nation. Today. On gun
tog Nation, we're talking I don'tknow what we're gonna talk about, Brandon
silencers, machine guns, the ATFall the fun stuff. He sounds like
(01:11):
fun to me, like the guywho the ATF came into his office,
Sheriff Jim Wilson. He has asheriff Jim ATF here he has alcohol,
tobacco, and firearms. I loveall your products. It's perfect. So
Silencers Central, I whan we hadyou on before. You guys have kind
of changed the world and how peoplebuy silencers. But I was kind of
(01:36):
thinking about just the latest with everythinggoing on, maybe maybe give people We've
talked about it a little bit onthe show, but give them just a
brief update on what's going on withprocessing times because they are really fast all
of a sudden, and it's great, but then people go, but what's
going on? Yeah, so areyou curious? You're curious about the why
behind it? And then also like, actually what's happening? Yeah? Okay,
(01:59):
sure, okay, Look you talkedto the ATF more than most of
us, right, So what's thestory here? Yeah. So a couple
of weeks ago, I had ameeting with the people that lead sort of
the NFA branch up in West Virginia, So the National Farms Branch, they're
the ones that approve all the suppressors. And I've been doing this about twenty
(02:20):
years, so I you know,they're not gonna be able to convince me
of something that, you know,unless it's actually true. So I spent
a half a day there. Sohere's what my take on the situation was.
So the acting director of the NFAis what I would consider a gun
guy. I just did a tourwith him in the reference library where they
have really kind of every gun that'sever been made type situation. He knew
(02:40):
a lot about them, so Ican tell he's a gun guy. So
he put on his attorney hat andI think he started working the the you
know, the approvals, the Formfour US, and what he found or
what he's a reported he found wasseventy to eighty percent of the processes they
were doing digitally they did not needto be doing. Wow. So essentially
a lot of things had carried overfrom the processes they had done from a
(03:04):
verification on paper had just had kindof come over to digital. And no
one had gone through with their lawyerhad and said what's actually required by statute
to be done? And they said, why are we doing this? I
don't know. It's because it's theway we've always done it. Yeah,
So I think it was brilliant,like basically said, I'm going to try
to do one hundred of these aweek, and by doing them, he
realized a lot of the computer systemwas able to verify check stuff that there
(03:25):
was no need to do manually.So they were able to cut seventy to
eighty percent of the actual work fromdoing an approval out gone. So are
you saying that the acting director ofthe NFA went in there and got his
hands dirty and was doing the processinghimself. Yes, absolutely, and so
was his boss actually, and hewas wanting to make things more efficient.
(03:46):
That's the impression I got. He'sgoing to get fired right away. Why
are you here? You don't understandwhat we're doing here? Totally. Yeah,
it was just it was fascinating tome. And you know, we
conference called in Larry Keene from an SSF and he pushed them pretty hard
a questions like that, and Imean, I was like, wow,
that's that's pretty impressive to learn itis. So the other analogy that they
gave me that I could kind ofCOMPREHENDI and visualize is so pretend like you're
(04:11):
at a fast food restaurant and youorder a burger that you want it,
you know, extra pickles, extramustard, whatever, you have a special
order. So before the ATF wouldlet you sit in line and then everyone
backed up behind you. Now theysay, sir, go park over here
and we're going to process everybody else. So that's the analogy. So what
they're doing is ATF the rate limitingstep has mostly been background checks, so
(04:31):
they're relying on the FBI. Sowhat they're doing now is they're submitting as
soon as they get a day's worthof data submitted to them on form fours,
they submit that data each day tothe FBI, and the FBI seventy
one percent of the background checks getan instant approval. Instant approval. Yeah,
so what that means is twenty largefries, large fries, large fries,
(04:53):
large fries. Yeah, so easyone. Yeah, so seventy one
percent of people that do an individualare going through pretty much real time.
So if they submit them to themon a batch, say on a Monday,
they said, typically they hear backwithin twenty four hours from ATF on
all those So what the reasons whyyou'd be in that twenty nine percent?
So if you've ever been arrested,they typically have to look and make sure
that, ever how it ended,is not something that would make you a
(05:15):
prohibited person. The other thing isif there's a fellon with the same day
to birth or same name in yourstate, they have to check and make
sure you're not them, and thattakes a man interview, and then that's
what slows it down. But stillin house right now we're seeing a little
over one hundred days and approvals onaverage. That's everything that's all together,
and we trust take longer, yousay, typically, So yeah, So
what's interesting in silence or essential isnow we do both. I mean silence
(05:39):
essential has sort of been famous ofhey we give you a trust free,
you know, no charge. Soa lot of people think of us as
doing just trust, but we doboth. So we submit it as an
individual or a trust. So againjust to recap the individual. So if
an individual, if we submit youas an individual atf is telling us seventy
one percent of the time, they'llbe approved within twenty four hours. Wow,
yeah, that's impressive. So thenthe trust their goal is to be
(06:00):
at two to three weeks. Andthe reason why it takes a little bit
longer is they have to man interviewthem. Last I checked, we were
forty percent of the volume at ATFfor Trust. That's based on them saying
how many they had pending their weretrust, and then us looking at our
internal numbers and their goals to getdown to two to three weeks. But
the benefit is because we submit somany, they know ours and so they
kind of have what they call ita fast lane or swim lane. So
(06:20):
like if a sign once er CentralTrust comes in, it goes into a
fast lane because they're familiar with it. They know that on page nine or
whatever is where the people would bethey need to have a background check.
So their main goal is making surethat the background check's done on anyone that's
listed in the trust. So that'swhy it takes a little bit longer on
average, but their goals to godown to two to three weeks, we're
probably seeing about, you know,maybe five weeks, four to five weeks
(06:42):
right now for Trust, so it'stightening that gap a little bit. So
it's interesting because I think most ofour consumers are our customers that are repeats
have kind of bought into the Trustthing. So they're like, hey,
if it's only going to take amonth, and I thought it was going
to take ten to twelve. I'mokay with continued of trust, then faster.
Yeah, But then there's some peoplewho are like, no, I
wanted instantly want to use it tohunt next week. I want to roll
the wheel and hopefully I'm the guythat's in that you know, seventy one
(07:03):
percent, and I'm going to submitas individuals so I can get it tomorrow.
So it does both. But that'sthe background on the ATF cutting out,
you know, the duplicative processes theydidn't need to be doing, then
them changing their format. I thinktheir goal also is to bring a small
FBI division into the NFA branch sothat they can do background checks and have
(07:24):
a little bit more control over thatas well. So I see a lot
of improvements that the question I normallyget is is this sustainable? Because what
happened typically is as approval rates godown, demand goes up, and then
they get back in the same boatthey were in before. I feel like
that could happen, but right now, I think they're going to continue to
prove seventy one percent of them realtime. It just is it's less,
(07:45):
it's not that hard to do througha digital system, and when I was
there three weeks ago, they justhired nine more people, so that I
think that's also helped the form threesbecause before form threes, which transfer between
dealer and dealer manufacturer or wholesaler,those had gotten a little bit longer,
and people, you know, hypothesizethat'd be the new bottleneck, and it
probably was for a while. Butnow we're getting those real time as well.
(08:05):
At least it sounds like they aremaking an effort to make it go
faster, and it's there's not.It doesn't sound like it's a smoking mirrors
gotcha thing. Oh they really aretrying to just get this stuff out there.
Yeah, no, totally. Imean some people think, well,
they want the money, and thattwo hundred dollars goes directly the treasury,
so they don't get the tax stampmoney. It goes to the treasury.
I think it's just I think that, you know, the industry groups have
(08:28):
done a really good job putting pressureon Congress to put pressure on ATF because
you notice, as soon as wegot a Republican House of Representatives, we're
majority, saw a lot of additionalscrutiny. Any industry events I went to
where ATF presented. Even if itwas a broad audience, they always started
with NFA. It was just hardto explain, Hey, why, you
know, why can I buy agun, have a background check and walk
(08:48):
out the same day, And whenI buy a silencer it takes a year.
So there's just that much pressure.I think just continuing to put that
pressure on. They just didn't likethe scrutiny, is my assessment, and
they found a way to fix it. So when you shine the light on
things, they actually will adjust theirbehavior. Agreed. So, and I
might even take a step further whenyou put bright people. And I'm not
saying the person that was in asthe acting director before wasn't bright, but
(09:11):
they basically have two attorneys that Ifind to be extremely bright. I know
they're gun guys just because when Itour with them and they talk about guns,
I could tell they know the guns. So if you put bright people
and people that are you know,probably gun friendly, if you will in
a place that can make a difference, I think it helps total game changer.
All right, let's take a quickbreak. We'll be back after this.
(09:33):
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(11:00):
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(14:58):
right, so the ATF we're enjoyingsome much faster processing times, which is
awesome. What's that doing to silencersales? Obviously it increases demand significantly,
but I have to qualify it,like, so what I just told you
Now, we haven't really told anyone. No one has told anyone because no
one has the inventory, right,so the only people that really know about
(15:20):
it are hearsay or they talk totheir friends, they read online. I'd
say the average consumer has very littleinclination that there is a faster approval times
because I mean, Silence or Centralhas inventory because we were always trying to
scale up what we need to sowe have inventory, but our backlog honestly
has been shipping because you know,at times we might have sixty or seventy
(15:41):
thousand penning applications and when you startgetting one thousand a day or fifteen hundred
or two thousand a day, yeah, because you see, we could ship
out a thousand a day, noproblem. Now we have to ship two
or three thousand out a day,so it creates a different demand on us.
But now that we're caught up onshipping out, we're going to start
promoting. May fifteenth is when we'regoing to start talking about, Hey we
could do an individual. Hey we'reseeing seventy one percent approved within twenty four
hours. Get one. Now youmight as well. It's quicke. As
(16:04):
you know, we've said for yearsthat the two hundred dollars fee tax stamp,
it's a bummer. But that's notthe big challenge for most people.
The most big challenges it's a longwait and it's also not predictable. It's
like it might be nine months,it might be eleven, it might be
twelve, who knows. So yeah, the fact that it's a lot faster
(16:26):
is a big deal. That's cooland probably thinking about people not knowing that
this is happening. Most people havetheir lives. Yeah, it's right,
like they get it. They're runninga business whatever. You and I are
in the gun in the industry,and we're nerding out about this, like
whoa did you hear? But mostpeople they own guns, they buy Ammo
(16:47):
or whatever. But like, Igot stuff, I gotta drive to kids
to soccer games. I'm not keepingup with weight times at the ATA.
It's only underc No. I agree. That's why I think we'll start pushing
it pretty hard. Because I saidwe're I feel like Silence are such as
a unique position that typically most manufacturersbuy from where their biggest seller. So
we're in a good position to bringinventory and quickly and continue to keep it
on the shelf. So I meanwe're excited. Goal is to make it
(17:10):
when you can, right, Sure? Do I think it'll be this way
forever? I hope? So whoknows what the government? I'll be honest.
So I told someone I would neverhave bet money ever that they would
have real time approvals. I couldhave seen like ninety days, thirty days,
sixty days, fifteen days. Iwhen it first started, it was
two weeks, so I could,I could. I could fathom that.
But like this real time concept,it was hard for me to swallow at
first, Like wait, what itwas even on my wish list? That
(17:33):
was even better than I thought Icould be. So the other day I
was talking one of your guys andthey were talking about you. You have
to have a lot of guns aroundto do testing, and you've also been
in the the NFA game for along time. Yeah, and you're kind
(17:53):
of a machine gun guy, aren'tyou. Yeah. I don't ever tell
anyone that, Like it's so I'llhave to figure out who told you.
But but like, just I mean, you know, people in our world
the own machine guns, and Ithink it's something that people have a curiosity
about, right, but they don'tknow a whole lot about it because they're
not easy to own and all thisstuff, and so like, I just
(18:15):
think it's an interesting subject that Idon't know a lot about because two things
in the gun world that I amnot super knowledgeable on historical guns and machine
guns. Sure, because they'll say, you know, oh, it's an
it's an MG forty. I'm like, cool, I don't I'm not super
familiar with that, right, You'veshot a bunch of everyone. Do you
(18:37):
have a favorite machine guns? Yeah? Yeah, Well I say have two
favorites, But my favorite favorite isP five. Yeah. Lot, it
just runs like a sewing machine.Anytime I tell that someone who's shot one,
they agree it just a lot oftimes, like if I if I
go to events like my bank putson a Pheazna in South Dakota, so
every year I always bring the MPfive and the AMMO and it's always the
(19:02):
cool thing. Are like, whatweekends mattics going on, We're going to
want to go shoot that machine gun. So the MP five is super cool.
I've even got MP five's. Igot two of those FBI briefcases where
the machine guns on the inside andthe actual handle has the trigger. That's
pretty cool. That's really cool.It's pretty cool. That's pick up.
It's probably one of the people haveseen, but it's like, no,
it really exists. And I meanthere are yes, you can own machine
(19:25):
guns any well. Most people listeningto this can own a machine gun.
Yeah, And a lot of peopleare doing it as investments because I mean
they the prices can get kind ofcrazy, but you know, it's just
it's just an interesting subject to getinto of like collecting stuff. And I
mean there's people there's a lot ofpeople getting machine guns who like that is
(19:48):
their four one K. They're like, yeah, I'm just I'm just buying
machine guns. Yeah. So oneinteresting fact people don't realize is in May
of nineteen eighty six, the governmentbasically said you can't make it anymore.
So what's out there? And what'savailable is all that will ever be available
for consumers. They're not making newones for law enforcement military, so we
call them like transferable, so inother words, you could transfer to consumers.
(20:11):
And you know, like you saidmost states, or silencers are legal,
then machine guns are legal some stateslike Minnesota. It has to be
a CNR, a Curros relics,it has to be old enough. But
almost everything is old enough now orit's going to fit into that category.
What is the how old does ithave to be for you? It's seventy
five years old and that's so that'sa moving target. Then totally everything and
now that machine guns are pretty muchall going to be in that category.
(20:32):
But yeah, you know, honestly, like as more people bought suppressors and
went through the process, it's exactlythe same for a machine gun. I
was surprised more people didn't buy machineguns. Yeah, And I even tried,
like some like wealthier customers, I'llbe like, you should really look
at machine guns. I mean,you've gone through the process, you got
a silencer from us. I'm like, I'm not trying to sell you machine
guns because I'm a consumer machine gunsa seller. But I was like you
should look into it, and noone ever really does. It's interesting,
(20:55):
Yeah, because and I've talked toI don't know if you know Dirry's guns
Johnny Derry Downstadt. He's one ofthose guys where I'm like, hey,
I would I need help if I'mgoing to go buy something like that,
tell me what I should buy,right, Like, I don't. I
don't know enough, but I don'twant to screw it up. Yeah.
So I would say the most commonin the one I like to get are
(21:15):
like the it's the like the MPfive trigger kits. So basically that trigger
is what is actually it's the seer. So the seer is what is licensed
as the machine gun. Wow.And what's cool about that is this plug
in place you can put it intomodern versions of MP five's Okay, So
basically you take out the trigger groupand you can put it in another one.
So those are really popular, theMP five seers. So you could
(21:37):
you do that because they sell asemi auto MP five. Yeah, you
can take it out, plug inthe full ot oversure and then the regtro
machine gun would be the actual triggerpack. Yeah. Yeah, So I've
bought a lot of those. KanshThompson's are cool to have. I mean,
uzzy stuff shot Thompson's, They're justthey're so neat. And then you
get into kind of the Thompson's havethis crazy weight to them, the very
(22:00):
heavy yes shooting a forty five aCP. They're so fun. And I
guess the ones that are really fastsick sick, little slick cyclical rate.
Wow, that's easy to say,are fun. And the ones with a
slow yes rate of fire it's alsofun. Totally. Yeah. And of
course we're spoiled being a dealer becauseI can get dealer samples. So I've
(22:22):
got some Chris Vectors that are reallynice, kind of the modern Tompson if
you will. And then I've gota clock eighteen which is super cool.
Yeah, a stock on it soyou can lean into it and shoot it.
That's fine. I have an FNsaw. I got a lot.
I'm bad about collecting them over theyears. Well, there is no such
thing as a cheap hobby. Ifyou get into collecting something, it could
be jeep wranglers, it could bestamps, it could be knives. You're
(22:45):
gonna you're gonna start out collecting knives, and you know you're gonna have several
different buck knives, and then you'regonna be at blade show and you're gonna
be buying a thousand dollars knives,swords or battle axes, and you go,
whoa this guy out of hand quicklytotally. It always tell people,
you know my background, I workedin I'm a pharmacist, so I had
a day job and I did thesileuncers on the side. When I first
(23:07):
started, obviously I had no money. But then as I started making a
little bit, it always said that, you know, if I make too
much, the government's gonna take fortypercent. My wife's gonna spend the other
sixty percent. So why not buymore machine guns? So I've got like
safe lined up full of machine gunsand just till the wife every year,
I'm sorry, the side hobby justhasn't made any money this year. I'll
try harder next year. Going outof business for ten years in a row.
Here, it's it's only totally Ohmy gosh. So what's in the
(23:32):
world of silencers. What are thetrends that you're seeing these days? For
what are people buying what seems tobe hot? Has anything changed or maybe
not changed? Yeah, I'd saythat. One thing I've seen change is
when I first started doing titanium atsilences essential, people thought we were crazy.
You know, oh those won't bedurable. They're you know, that's
not going to work. And nowI'd say that titanium is really the standard.
(23:55):
It's it's it's harder material to workwith. You got to get the
right manufacturing equipment, right manufacturers todo it. But it's just lighter weight
and it's stronger. So you seea transition. More to that, I
see the transition of hunting. Lesspeople used to use them in hunting.
Now more people are using them inhunting, which is great. I see
shorter, fatter, so people don'tnecessarily like that long length on the end,
So a little bit fatter, shorter. So we talked about, you
(24:17):
know, the banished backcountry is anice you know, five and a half
inch short titanium yet for hunting.And then our speed K titanium version is
really nice for like an R platformjust to stop the blow back but then
also have a chance to mitigate twoby four yes, the two explain you
guys called the speed K the twoby four y Yeah, just because four
inches long, two inch diameter it'sit's a fatty short fatty yeah, totally,
(24:40):
because you're going to get that volume, reduce the length of it.
But this is a new technology.This particular, the banished speed k is
really a little bit of a newanimal for you guys. Yeah, you
know, I tell people, Isend it to an attorney to make sure
we didn't copy anyone, because youknow, you don't want to do anything
that would infringe on someone else's inintellectual property. And they came back with,
hey, we see four things thatwe think are patentable and no one
(25:02):
else has done. Like the wehave like a fin baffle. The first
baffles a fin which helps with theblowback. It actually disperses it so you
have less coming out as quickly,so that's also helps flash mitigation. We
have like the last baffles vented soat the top you have holes where it
could come out. That helps withthe blowback as well, and it's called
controlled flow technology. Then also justthe short nature of it is nice.
(25:26):
And then we have what they callclipped a wall baffles, so different baffles
built with inside it because it's threeD printed, so a lot of new
technology in there that people haven't seen. People haven't heard of. I think
that having a full titanium version thatwe're launching an NRA is going to give
people more interesting because they're gonna ableto actually feel how light it is that
a point six ounce is super light, really light, really light. All
(25:48):
right, dumb question three D printingtitanium. Yes, are they doing that
with titanium dust? Yes, exactly. So it took us a long time
to find a man actually that wewere comfortable with that. Yeah, that
seems really you can't just find anymachine shop to do oh absolutely, but
yeah, it's it's some kind ofdust they make it from you. You
know. What's what's been great aswe partnered with Federal Premium ammunition to make
(26:12):
these, so we tested these withthirty thousand rounds. We were not ammunition
through those wow yeah, wow,Yeah, we got you know, we
got good pricing on ammunition, somade it helpful. And then also partnering
with some other optics manufacturers that doa lot of testing with filauto and also
you know, optics and suppressors,has been nice to sort of partner with
the people to let them help usget that many rounds through these things.
(26:34):
Speed K is a thirty cal canor five five six can five five six
Okay, that's an important notation.Yes, don't screw this onto your thirty
cal Yes, yes, exactly,it'll be somewhat quiet for one shot.
Yes, yes, yes, yes, just talk about dedicated suppressors, so
a five five six can. Alot of people will start out with either
(26:56):
a twenty two can because they're justfun and light and quiet and little yep,
or they start out with a thirtycow can like the Banish thirty,
because part of the logic is Ican put it on a lot of different
guns. I can use it onmy six five, I can use it
on my two two three. Butwhy would someone go to a dedicated two
two three, five five six canfor their regular ar versus just throw a
(27:18):
thirty cow can on? Yeah?Good question. I mean, so this
is my own experience doing it twentyyears. I usually say, whatever gun
do you shoot the most and youenjoy shooting, get a suppressor dedicated for
it because it's going to work betterthan you thought it would. And then
it's easier to mentally justify buying moresilencers because obviously you can buy a thirty
cow like the Banish thirty. Ismodular, so you can make it shorter.
(27:41):
And you could take a thirty cowsuppressor and put it on a five
five six and it'll work well.But it's going to work better if you
get one made specifically for that.It's gonna because the hole is. That's
the whole deal, right, thewhole deal. Get it. Yeah,
the hole is is tighter, sonot as much gas, not as much
sound escaping. Yeah, And thefact of the matter is once you get
(28:02):
that suppressor on that gun and sidedin and really tuned in, now you
kind of I mean, my thoughtis just leave it on there. Oh
yeah. And people I always say, people love the suppressor, using it
more than they thought they would,and then once they used they're like,
okay, you're right, I gotto get more than one. And I
think some people are scared to jumpinto the suppresser game because they're like,
oh, what if I like itbetter I thought it would, then I
got to buy one for everything.So sometimes you can start. I would
(28:26):
say our best seller is the Banishthirty because you could kind of use it
on all rifles, you know,five, five six up to you know,
three to win mag during a weatherbyso it's it's very versatile. But
then then they start specializing after that. Like you said, I feel like,
because the processing times have gotten somuch faster, you guys have helped
make the paperwork part really not abig deal. Yeah. I think what's
(28:48):
happening is you had that transition ifwe go back seventy years where most guns
were iron sights, yeah, andthen they started putting rifle scopes on and
like, but well, I don'tneed that. I can hit whatever I
need to hit with these iron sights. Well you can, but it's going
to be better. And now theidea of having like one scope that I
(29:10):
put on each gun when I wantto go shoot is absurd. You're like,
no, we need to put anoptic on all the guns solely.
Now it's like, okay, I'vegot all these guns, I'm gonna safe.
I need to have a suppressor oneach gun, and there is an
argument for optimizing what suppressor that ison that particular platform, right, yeah,
absolutely, yeah, just and youknow, once you cite it in
(29:33):
and you take it off, it'salways going to be sited in once you
put it back on there. ButI think some people do worry about Okay,
well, which one did I puton that one last? Because I
have that problem because I'm like,all right, what riflem I take?
And one? Hon am I goingon? And what silence? Or do
we have it on it last time? So now I almost label them like
almost put like a telet posher puta piece of tape on there, so
like blue tape on the on thesilence or blue tape on that gun,
so that I know every time theygo together. Yeah, just not you
(29:55):
know, And I'm I'm fortunate Ihave a team that's, you know,
helping me manage all this stuff,but it could be difficult. You have
a safe with you know. SometimesI've seen as much as one hundred and
fifty thousand Suncer's inventory once, sojust keeping up with which ones are mine
verse which ones everybody else's. Youguys are pretty good at paperwork though,
Yeah. I mean, I youknow what, ATF has been good to
work with, allowing us to dosome all of our processes digitally, so
(30:15):
that works out well where the consumercan do everything DOCU sign Yeah, so
nice. I like the stories oflike ATF going, I don't think that
that's legal, and Brandon is overhere going no, actually it is let
me explain. You're the guy.You're the guy where they're like, well,
the government's going, well, thisneeds to be filled out in triple
kit and you need to send thiscopy here, in this copy here and
(30:37):
then, and most of us arelike, oh, and you're going okay,
so just triple kit. That's fine, yeah, done, Yeah,
you know. And it's evolved,and I would say we're still educating people
because our business model is so unique. But one of the ones I do
remember is my I think it wasmy third license was Montana. We would
work a lot of shows up inNorth Dakota and a lot of the oil
fields had Montana residents. So Montanawanted to be able to buy from US.
(30:57):
I got a call from the regionalman and so, I see your
application to be an SOT dealer herein Montana. It's like, I've been
doing this like twenty five years,and I don't think what you want to
do is going to work. Sobut I'm happy to come me with you
and talk about it. He so, I just don't see this possible.
So of course I flew in,drove there and met with him and opened
up. You know, the federalstatutes, they used to give you a
printed book and I had highlighted andhe read it and he goes, Okay,
(31:18):
clearly you know more about this thanI do. We're going to approve
your license and you know, bestof luck in Montana. If you have
any questions, let us know.So I was like, oh, wow,
this is kind of cool. Thisguy's been there forever and everyone knows
them, and he'd never heard ofwhat we were doing. So yeah,
if you're willing to dig into allthat stuff and highlight it, totally know
it's funny. I've been told that'sthe same way for gun people gun in
(31:41):
industry that they should handle Facebook andInstagram and YouTube is dig into their policies.
Yeah, copy them, highlight them, send it to them. When
they say, well you can't postthis picture of a gun, no in
your policy, you say I can. Yeah, Oh we said that.
Yeah. I mean it's same thing, right. The government has this big
(32:02):
organization. True, Facebook is anenormous organization, and bureaucracy is what it
is at this point. Yeah.And the hard part with the social media
folks is typically they're in areas wherethose people have just never seen farms.
I mean, when I lived inNew Jersey. I was a manager up
there, and people are like,do you actually own farms? I told
them how many. They're like,oh my god, why would anyone?
And once you talk to me,you find out they've never seen a farm
(32:23):
unless it's with law enforcement that Inever owned one. They don't know anyone
that owns one. So I couldsee the same thing with Facebook. You
know, you got someone in Californiawho has never seen a farm reviewing your
post and going, well, it'sclearly not legal. My dad likes to
tell this story occasionally. He wouldget people find out what he does or
talking to him. They're like,and there's somebody from New York or someone
(32:45):
from Massachusetts and they're like, oh, I don't know anyone who owns guns,
and he would go, yeah,you do. You guys just don't
talk about it like we talk aboutit because my friends we all know each
other, we know we own guns. Yeah, he said, go ask
around when next time you're at adinner party, you're hanging out, ask
them do you guys own guns?Like, do I know anybody? He
(33:05):
goes. Every time, I'd geta call a month later, Tom,
You're right, Yeah, like halfthe people I know own guns. Like,
yeah, you guys just are keepinga seat from each other. That's
funny. That's cool. You allown guns. Yeah, I like it.
That's good. That's cool. Andand that's fairly true across the country.
Certainly there's higher gun ownership in certainstates Ohio and Texas or whatever.
(33:27):
Yeah, and maybe a little bitlower in certain states. But I mean
it's like it's not like zero,Like even in a state I don't pick
one, California, Yeah, it'sstill like thirty percent of the people own
guns. Yeah. So if youdon't own a gun, someone on either
side of you and you know yourneighbors owns a gun, right, yeah,
like every other third house has agun. Wow, even in a
(33:49):
in a state that doesn't have alot of guns. Yeah. Yeah,
So I mean, and it's kindof becoming that way with silencers, I
think, I mean more and it'sit's becoming less unique, yes, agreed.
Yeah, because there's so many benefitsif you think about it, produce
recoil, don't have to wear yourplugs, and better accuracy. There's really
there's still downside. Any idea howmany silencers I'm how many people not maybe
(34:13):
how many silencers but how many peopleown silencers in the US. So I
know there's about four million that havebeen issued, and that's probably old day.
There's probably more, maybe four anda half million, but typically what
I see is most people that buyone buy more than one, So it's
probably two and a half million peopleown all four and a half million of
them out there. Okay, yeah, okay, it's very concentrated, which
you know, from a political standpoint, I want as many people to own
(34:36):
them, just because that's where Iwas going to get deregulated. Yeah,
there's enough people that are voting andeducating their elected officials that then they get
deregulated. They don't even sell more. If you could go to Walmart and
buy it just like a rare backgroundcheck, that'd be pretty amazing. It'd
be amazing. Yeah, I thinkthat's the goal. Everybody, if you're
listening to this, go buy themjust because not because they're cool, but
we need to get those numbers up, rookie numbers, you know, like
(34:57):
if we're at three million people inthe US that own silencers, that's it's
not significant enough perhaps for politicians tocare, right because when the NRA,
the NRA has had their troubles lately. But when the NRA, which has
been the biggest lobbyist group for gunrights, would walk into a senator's office
(35:20):
or a congressman's office, you knowwhat, the first question they ask NRA
is how's membership? Yeah? Basically, should I care that you're coming in
here to talk to me? Whenyou say, well, we're at three
million, okay, Yeah, that'sinteresting. If you say we're at twenty
million membership, now it's like Ihave to listen to these people totally.
(35:45):
Yeah, agreed. Yeah. SoI mean I think they say, what
could the NRA do if they hadtwenty million members? The answer is anything
they want. Yeah. True,you're at that point you're AARP or one
of these giant lobbyist groups, whichis what the AARP is everybody, Just
in case you didn't know, you'rea lobbyist group. Yeah, so I
(36:06):
think that that's a big deal.So maybe you don't need that fifth ar,
that fifth block. Maybe go buya silencer. Yeah. I always
say I've never found anyone that balland I didn't love it and said,
hey, I wish I've done thisa whole lot. Sooner you probably see
the same thing. Oh yeah,absolutely reduce recoil. Fantastic for getting new
shooters into it, or your wifeor your kids or whatever. Maybe they're
(36:29):
going to be more comfortable shooting theseguns. And even if you know,
hey, if your goal is selfish, like I just want them to get
into my hobby. Yeah, cool, that works too, awesome. Any
new updates with sounds are essential thatwe want to share, Brandon. I
mean, you guys are rocking it. Yeah, I mean, I guess
the only updates are Some people don'trealize we sell every product. Some people
(36:51):
don't realize that we're do individuals,not just trust. And maybe if people
haven't heard that we shipped silence throughyour front door, do you do all
the paper for your dock signed soyou can essential order a silencer from your
couch. Never leave your house andsilencer shows up to your front don't show
up. That's my favorite part becauseI've I've sent several friends to you guys,
and I'm like and and guys whohave never owned a silencer and go,
(37:14):
here's the best part. It's gonnashow up on your door one day
and you're gonna go, is thisreal? And I and you know what
happens every time I get a textmessage of a picture of a silencer,
you're like, dude, you wereright. They just delivered it. I
know. That's awesome. That's perfectawesome, Brandon, thanks for coming on
man. Yeah, that's actually theopportunity. All right, that's it for
(37:36):
us. We will see you allnext time on guntaw Nation.
Silence or such as a unique positionthat typically most manufacturers we buy from where
their biggest seller. So we're ina good position to bring inventory and quickly
and continue to keep it on theshelf. So I mean we're excited.
Goal is to make it when youcan, right, Sure? Do I
think it'll be this way forever?I hope? So who knows what the
government? I'll be honest. Itold someone I would never have bet money
ever that they would have real timeapprovals. I could have seen like ninety
(00:23):
days, thirty days, sixty days, fifteen days. When it first started,
it was two weeks, so Icould, I could, I could
fathom that, but like this realtime concept, it was hard for me
to swallow at first. I'm RyanGresham and this this is guntognation. This
(00:50):
gun Tognation is brought to you byB five Systems, stag Arms, secure
It, Vortex Optics, Black Hills, Ammunition Range Ready, Ruger and SDS
Imports. All right, welcome intogun tog Nation. Today. On gun
tog Nation, we're talking I don'tknow what we're gonna talk about, Brandon
silencers, machine guns, the ATFall the fun stuff. He sounds like
(01:11):
fun to me, like the guywho the ATF came into his office,
Sheriff Jim Wilson. He has asheriff Jim ATF here he has alcohol,
tobacco, and firearms. I loveall your products. It's perfect. So
Silencers Central, I whan we hadyou on before. You guys have kind
of changed the world and how peoplebuy silencers. But I was kind of
(01:36):
thinking about just the latest with everythinggoing on, maybe maybe give people We've
talked about it a little bit onthe show, but give them just a
brief update on what's going on withprocessing times because they are really fast all
of a sudden, and it's great, but then people go, but what's
going on? Yeah, so areyou curious? You're curious about the why
behind it? And then also like, actually what's happening? Yeah? Okay,
(01:59):
sure, okay, Look you talkedto the ATF more than most of
us, right, So what's thestory here? Yeah. So a couple
of weeks ago, I had ameeting with the people that lead sort of
the NFA branch up in West Virginia, So the National Farms Branch, they're
the ones that approve all the suppressors. And I've been doing this about twenty
(02:20):
years, so I you know,they're not gonna be able to convince me
of something that, you know,unless it's actually true. So I spent
a half a day there. Sohere's what my take on the situation was.
So the acting director of the NFAis what I would consider a gun
guy. I just did a tourwith him in the reference library where they
have really kind of every gun that'sever been made type situation. He knew
(02:40):
a lot about them, so Ican tell he's a gun guy. So
he put on his attorney hat andI think he started working the the you
know, the approvals, the Formfour US, and what he found or
what he's a reported he found wasseventy to eighty percent of the processes they
were doing digitally they did not needto be doing. Wow. So essentially
a lot of things had carried overfrom the processes they had done from a
(03:04):
verification on paper had just had kindof come over to digital. And no
one had gone through with their lawyerhad and said what's actually required by statute
to be done? And they said, why are we doing this? I
don't know. It's because it's theway we've always done it. Yeah,
So I think it was brilliant,like basically said, I'm going to try
to do one hundred of these aweek, and by doing them, he
realized a lot of the computer systemwas able to verify check stuff that there
(03:25):
was no need to do manually.So they were able to cut seventy to
eighty percent of the actual work fromdoing an approval out gone. So are
you saying that the acting director ofthe NFA went in there and got his
hands dirty and was doing the processinghimself. Yes, absolutely, and so
was his boss actually, and hewas wanting to make things more efficient.
(03:46):
That's the impression I got. He'sgoing to get fired right away. Why
are you here? You don't understandwhat we're doing here? Totally. Yeah,
it was just it was fascinating tome. And you know, we
conference called in Larry Keene from an SSF and he pushed them pretty hard
a questions like that, and Imean, I was like, wow,
that's that's pretty impressive to learn itis. So the other analogy that they
gave me that I could kind ofCOMPREHENDI and visualize is so pretend like you're
(04:11):
at a fast food restaurant and youorder a burger that you want it,
you know, extra pickles, extramustard, whatever, you have a special
order. So before the ATF wouldlet you sit in line and then everyone
backed up behind you. Now theysay, sir, go park over here
and we're going to process everybody else. So that's the analogy. So what
they're doing is ATF the rate limitingstep has mostly been background checks, so
(04:31):
they're relying on the FBI. Sowhat they're doing now is they're submitting as
soon as they get a day's worthof data submitted to them on form fours,
they submit that data each day tothe FBI, and the FBI seventy
one percent of the background checks getan instant approval. Instant approval. Yeah,
so what that means is twenty largefries, large fries, large fries,
(04:53):
large fries. Yeah, so easyone. Yeah, so seventy one
percent of people that do an individualare going through pretty much real time.
So if they submit them to themon a batch, say on a Monday,
they said, typically they hear backwithin twenty four hours from ATF on
all those So what the reasons whyyou'd be in that twenty nine percent?
So if you've ever been arrested,they typically have to look and make sure
that, ever how it ended,is not something that would make you a
(05:15):
prohibited person. The other thing isif there's a fellon with the same day
to birth or same name in yourstate, they have to check and make
sure you're not them, and thattakes a man interview, and then that's
what slows it down. But stillin house right now we're seeing a little
over one hundred days and approvals onaverage. That's everything that's all together,
and we trust take longer, yousay, typically, So yeah, So
what's interesting in silence or essential isnow we do both. I mean silence
(05:39):
essential has sort of been famous ofhey we give you a trust free,
you know, no charge. Soa lot of people think of us as
doing just trust, but we doboth. So we submit it as an
individual or a trust. So againjust to recap the individual. So if
an individual, if we submit youas an individual atf is telling us seventy
one percent of the time, they'llbe approved within twenty four hours. Wow,
yeah, that's impressive. So thenthe trust their goal is to be
(06:00):
at two to three weeks. Andthe reason why it takes a little bit
longer is they have to man interviewthem. Last I checked, we were
forty percent of the volume at ATFfor Trust. That's based on them saying
how many they had pending their weretrust, and then us looking at our
internal numbers and their goals to getdown to two to three weeks. But
the benefit is because we submit somany, they know ours and so they
kind of have what they call ita fast lane or swim lane. So
(06:20):
like if a sign once er CentralTrust comes in, it goes into a
fast lane because they're familiar with it. They know that on page nine or
whatever is where the people would bethey need to have a background check.
So their main goal is making surethat the background check's done on anyone that's
listed in the trust. So that'swhy it takes a little bit longer on
average, but their goals to godown to two to three weeks, we're
probably seeing about, you know,maybe five weeks, four to five weeks
(06:42):
right now for Trust, so it'stightening that gap a little bit. So
it's interesting because I think most ofour consumers are our customers that are repeats
have kind of bought into the Trustthing. So they're like, hey,
if it's only going to take amonth, and I thought it was going
to take ten to twelve. I'mokay with continued of trust, then faster.
Yeah, But then there's some peoplewho are like, no, I
wanted instantly want to use it tohunt next week. I want to roll
the wheel and hopefully I'm the guythat's in that you know, seventy one
(07:03):
percent, and I'm going to submitas individuals so I can get it tomorrow.
So it does both. But that'sthe background on the ATF cutting out,
you know, the duplicative processes theydidn't need to be doing, then
them changing their format. I thinktheir goal also is to bring a small
FBI division into the NFA branch sothat they can do background checks and have
(07:24):
a little bit more control over thatas well. So I see a lot
of improvements that the question I normallyget is is this sustainable? Because what
happened typically is as approval rates godown, demand goes up, and then
they get back in the same boatthey were in before. I feel like
that could happen, but right now, I think they're going to continue to
prove seventy one percent of them realtime. It just is it's less,
(07:45):
it's not that hard to do througha digital system, and when I was
there three weeks ago, they justhired nine more people, so that I
think that's also helped the form threesbecause before form threes, which transfer between
dealer and dealer manufacturer or wholesaler,those had gotten a little bit longer,
and people, you know, hypothesizethat'd be the new bottleneck, and it
probably was for a while. Butnow we're getting those real time as well.
(08:05):
At least it sounds like they aremaking an effort to make it go
faster, and it's there's not.It doesn't sound like it's a smoking mirrors
gotcha thing. Oh they really aretrying to just get this stuff out there.
Yeah, no, totally. Imean some people think, well,
they want the money, and thattwo hundred dollars goes directly the treasury,
so they don't get the tax stampmoney. It goes to the treasury.
I think it's just I think that, you know, the industry groups have
(08:28):
done a really good job putting pressureon Congress to put pressure on ATF because
you notice, as soon as wegot a Republican House of Representatives, we're
majority, saw a lot of additionalscrutiny. Any industry events I went to
where ATF presented. Even if itwas a broad audience, they always started
with NFA. It was just hardto explain, Hey, why, you
know, why can I buy agun, have a background check and walk
(08:48):
out the same day, And whenI buy a silencer it takes a year.
So there's just that much pressure.I think just continuing to put that
pressure on. They just didn't likethe scrutiny, is my assessment, and
they found a way to fix it. So when you shine the light on
things, they actually will adjust theirbehavior. Agreed. So, and I
might even take a step further whenyou put bright people. And I'm not
saying the person that was in asthe acting director before wasn't bright, but
(09:11):
they basically have two attorneys that Ifind to be extremely bright. I know
they're gun guys just because when Itour with them and they talk about guns,
I could tell they know the guns. So if you put bright people
and people that are you know,probably gun friendly, if you will in
a place that can make a difference, I think it helps total game changer.
All right, let's take a quickbreak. We'll be back after this.
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Those are probably ones you're going towant to take a look at over
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a gun vault so to speak?Well secure gun storage? As you covered,
(13:20):
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They also have kits which I reallylike the gun Wall Vault Armory Kit
where you can store a bunch oflong guns vertically, which is a great
(13:41):
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cave, very cool and you cankind of go as big as the heart
desires. You could go to theArmory Kit number eight, which looks like
you could store I don't know,maybe like forty or fifty long guns,
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(14:07):
They make rifle scopes, they makebinos, they make rangefinders, they make
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radical with a thirty millimeter tube.When success rides on the perfect shot,
(14:30):
rely on the exceptional versatility and opticalperformance of the Viper HD. From big
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different magnifications. You can learn moreover at vortexoptics dot com. All
(14:58):
right, so the ATF we're enjoyingsome much faster processing times, which is
awesome. What's that doing to silencersales? Obviously it increases demand significantly,
but I have to qualify it,like, so what I just told you
Now, we haven't really told anyone. No one has told anyone because no
one has the inventory, right,so the only people that really know about
(15:20):
it are hearsay or they talk totheir friends, they read online. I'd
say the average consumer has very littleinclination that there is a faster approval times
because I mean, Silence or Centralhas inventory because we were always trying to
scale up what we need to sowe have inventory, but our backlog honestly
has been shipping because you know,at times we might have sixty or seventy
(15:41):
thousand penning applications and when you startgetting one thousand a day or fifteen hundred
or two thousand a day, yeah, because you see, we could ship
out a thousand a day, noproblem. Now we have to ship two
or three thousand out a day,so it creates a different demand on us.
But now that we're caught up onshipping out, we're going to start
promoting. May fifteenth is when we'regoing to start talking about, Hey we
could do an individual. Hey we'reseeing seventy one percent approved within twenty four
hours. Get one. Now youmight as well. It's quicke. As
(16:04):
you know, we've said for yearsthat the two hundred dollars fee tax stamp,
it's a bummer. But that's notthe big challenge for most people.
The most big challenges it's a longwait and it's also not predictable. It's
like it might be nine months,it might be eleven, it might be
twelve, who knows. So yeah, the fact that it's a lot faster
(16:26):
is a big deal. That's cooland probably thinking about people not knowing that
this is happening. Most people havetheir lives. Yeah, it's right,
like they get it. They're runninga business whatever. You and I are
in the gun in the industry,and we're nerding out about this, like
whoa did you hear? But mostpeople they own guns, they buy Ammo
(16:47):
or whatever. But like, Igot stuff, I gotta drive to kids
to soccer games. I'm not keepingup with weight times at the ATA.
It's only underc No. I agree. That's why I think we'll start pushing
it pretty hard. Because I saidwe're I feel like Silence are such as
a unique position that typically most manufacturersbuy from where their biggest seller. So
we're in a good position to bringinventory and quickly and continue to keep it
on the shelf. So I meanwe're excited. Goal is to make it
(17:10):
when you can, right, Sure? Do I think it'll be this way
forever? I hope? So whoknows what the government? I'll be honest.
So I told someone I would neverhave bet money ever that they would
have real time approvals. I couldhave seen like ninety days, thirty days,
sixty days, fifteen days. Iwhen it first started, it was
two weeks, so I could,I could. I could fathom that.
But like this real time concept,it was hard for me to swallow at
first, Like wait, what itwas even on my wish list? That
(17:33):
was even better than I thought Icould be. So the other day I
was talking one of your guys andthey were talking about you. You have
to have a lot of guns aroundto do testing, and you've also been
in the the NFA game for along time. Yeah, and you're kind
(17:53):
of a machine gun guy, aren'tyou. Yeah. I don't ever tell
anyone that, Like it's so I'llhave to figure out who told you.
But but like, just I mean, you know, people in our world
the own machine guns, and Ithink it's something that people have a curiosity
about, right, but they don'tknow a whole lot about it because they're
not easy to own and all thisstuff, and so like, I just
(18:15):
think it's an interesting subject that Idon't know a lot about because two things
in the gun world that I amnot super knowledgeable on historical guns and machine
guns. Sure, because they'll say, you know, oh, it's an
it's an MG forty. I'm like, cool, I don't I'm not super
familiar with that, right, You'veshot a bunch of everyone. Do you
(18:37):
have a favorite machine guns? Yeah? Yeah, Well I say have two
favorites, But my favorite favorite isP five. Yeah. Lot, it
just runs like a sewing machine.Anytime I tell that someone who's shot one,
they agree it just a lot oftimes, like if I if I
go to events like my bank putson a Pheazna in South Dakota, so
every year I always bring the MPfive and the AMMO and it's always the
(19:02):
cool thing. Are like, whatweekends mattics going on, We're going to
want to go shoot that machine gun. So the MP five is super cool.
I've even got MP five's. Igot two of those FBI briefcases where
the machine guns on the inside andthe actual handle has the trigger. That's
pretty cool. That's really cool.It's pretty cool. That's pick up.
It's probably one of the people haveseen, but it's like, no,
it really exists. And I meanthere are yes, you can own machine
(19:25):
guns any well. Most people listeningto this can own a machine gun.
Yeah, And a lot of peopleare doing it as investments because I mean
they the prices can get kind ofcrazy, but you know, it's just
it's just an interesting subject to getinto of like collecting stuff. And I
mean there's people there's a lot ofpeople getting machine guns who like that is
(19:48):
their four one K. They're like, yeah, I'm just I'm just buying
machine guns. Yeah. So oneinteresting fact people don't realize is in May
of nineteen eighty six, the governmentbasically said you can't make it anymore.
So what's out there? And what'savailable is all that will ever be available
for consumers. They're not making newones for law enforcement military, so we
call them like transferable, so inother words, you could transfer to consumers.
(20:11):
And you know, like you saidmost states, or silencers are legal,
then machine guns are legal some stateslike Minnesota. It has to be
a CNR, a Curros relics,it has to be old enough. But
almost everything is old enough now orit's going to fit into that category.
What is the how old does ithave to be for you? It's seventy
five years old and that's so that'sa moving target. Then totally everything and
now that machine guns are pretty muchall going to be in that category.
(20:32):
But yeah, you know, honestly, like as more people bought suppressors and
went through the process, it's exactlythe same for a machine gun. I
was surprised more people didn't buy machineguns. Yeah, And I even tried,
like some like wealthier customers, I'llbe like, you should really look
at machine guns. I mean,you've gone through the process, you got
a silencer from us. I'm like, I'm not trying to sell you machine
guns because I'm a consumer machine gunsa seller. But I was like you
should look into it, and noone ever really does. It's interesting,
(20:55):
Yeah, because and I've talked toI don't know if you know Dirry's guns
Johnny Derry Downstadt. He's one ofthose guys where I'm like, hey,
I would I need help if I'mgoing to go buy something like that,
tell me what I should buy,right, Like, I don't. I
don't know enough, but I don'twant to screw it up. Yeah.
So I would say the most commonin the one I like to get are
(21:15):
like the it's the like the MPfive trigger kits. So basically that trigger
is what is actually it's the seer. So the seer is what is licensed
as the machine gun. Wow.And what's cool about that is this plug
in place you can put it intomodern versions of MP five's Okay, So
basically you take out the trigger groupand you can put it in another one.
So those are really popular, theMP five seers. So you could
(21:37):
you do that because they sell asemi auto MP five. Yeah, you
can take it out, plug inthe full ot oversure and then the regtro
machine gun would be the actual triggerpack. Yeah. Yeah, So I've
bought a lot of those. KanshThompson's are cool to have. I mean,
uzzy stuff shot Thompson's, They're justthey're so neat. And then you
get into kind of the Thompson's havethis crazy weight to them, the very
(22:00):
heavy yes shooting a forty five aCP. They're so fun. And I
guess the ones that are really fastsick sick, little slick cyclical rate.
Wow, that's easy to say,are fun. And the ones with a
slow yes rate of fire it's alsofun. Totally. Yeah. And of
course we're spoiled being a dealer becauseI can get dealer samples. So I've
(22:22):
got some Chris Vectors that are reallynice, kind of the modern Tompson if
you will. And then I've gota clock eighteen which is super cool.
Yeah, a stock on it soyou can lean into it and shoot it.
That's fine. I have an FNsaw. I got a lot.
I'm bad about collecting them over theyears. Well, there is no such
thing as a cheap hobby. Ifyou get into collecting something, it could
be jeep wranglers, it could bestamps, it could be knives. You're
(22:45):
gonna you're gonna start out collecting knives, and you know you're gonna have several
different buck knives, and then you'regonna be at blade show and you're gonna
be buying a thousand dollars knives,swords or battle axes, and you go,
whoa this guy out of hand quicklytotally. It always tell people,
you know my background, I workedin I'm a pharmacist, so I had
a day job and I did thesileuncers on the side. When I first
(23:07):
started, obviously I had no money. But then as I started making a
little bit, it always said that, you know, if I make too
much, the government's gonna take fortypercent. My wife's gonna spend the other
sixty percent. So why not buymore machine guns? So I've got like
safe lined up full of machine gunsand just till the wife every year,
I'm sorry, the side hobby justhasn't made any money this year. I'll
try harder next year. Going outof business for ten years in a row.
Here, it's it's only totally Ohmy gosh. So what's in the
(23:32):
world of silencers. What are thetrends that you're seeing these days? For
what are people buying what seems tobe hot? Has anything changed or maybe
not changed? Yeah, I'd saythat. One thing I've seen change is
when I first started doing titanium atsilences essential, people thought we were crazy.
You know, oh those won't bedurable. They're you know, that's
not going to work. And nowI'd say that titanium is really the standard.
(23:55):
It's it's it's harder material to workwith. You got to get the
right manufacturing equipment, right manufacturers todo it. But it's just lighter weight
and it's stronger. So you seea transition. More to that, I
see the transition of hunting. Lesspeople used to use them in hunting.
Now more people are using them inhunting, which is great. I see
shorter, fatter, so people don'tnecessarily like that long length on the end,
So a little bit fatter, shorter. So we talked about, you
(24:17):
know, the banished backcountry is anice you know, five and a half
inch short titanium yet for hunting.And then our speed K titanium version is
really nice for like an R platformjust to stop the blow back but then
also have a chance to mitigate twoby four yes, the two explain you
guys called the speed K the twoby four y Yeah, just because four
inches long, two inch diameter it'sit's a fatty short fatty yeah, totally,
(24:40):
because you're going to get that volume, reduce the length of it.
But this is a new technology.This particular, the banished speed k is
really a little bit of a newanimal for you guys. Yeah, you
know, I tell people, Isend it to an attorney to make sure
we didn't copy anyone, because youknow, you don't want to do anything
that would infringe on someone else's inintellectual property. And they came back with,
hey, we see four things thatwe think are patentable and no one
(25:02):
else has done. Like the wehave like a fin baffle. The first
baffles a fin which helps with theblowback. It actually disperses it so you
have less coming out as quickly,so that's also helps flash mitigation. We
have like the last baffles vented soat the top you have holes where it
could come out. That helps withthe blowback as well, and it's called
controlled flow technology. Then also justthe short nature of it is nice.
(25:26):
And then we have what they callclipped a wall baffles, so different baffles
built with inside it because it's threeD printed, so a lot of new
technology in there that people haven't seen. People haven't heard of. I think
that having a full titanium version thatwe're launching an NRA is going to give
people more interesting because they're gonna ableto actually feel how light it is that
a point six ounce is super light, really light, really light. All
(25:48):
right, dumb question three D printingtitanium. Yes, are they doing that
with titanium dust? Yes, exactly. So it took us a long time
to find a man actually that wewere comfortable with that. Yeah, that
seems really you can't just find anymachine shop to do oh absolutely, but
yeah, it's it's some kind ofdust they make it from you. You
know. What's what's been great aswe partnered with Federal Premium ammunition to make
(26:12):
these, so we tested these withthirty thousand rounds. We were not ammunition
through those wow yeah, wow,Yeah, we got you know, we
got good pricing on ammunition, somade it helpful. And then also partnering
with some other optics manufacturers that doa lot of testing with filauto and also
you know, optics and suppressors,has been nice to sort of partner with
the people to let them help usget that many rounds through these things.
(26:34):
Speed K is a thirty cal canor five five six can five five six
Okay, that's an important notation.Yes, don't screw this onto your thirty
cal Yes, yes, exactly,it'll be somewhat quiet for one shot.
Yes, yes, yes, yes, just talk about dedicated suppressors, so
a five five six can. Alot of people will start out with either
(26:56):
a twenty two can because they're justfun and light and quiet and little yep,
or they start out with a thirtycow can like the Banish thirty,
because part of the logic is Ican put it on a lot of different
guns. I can use it onmy six five, I can use it
on my two two three. Butwhy would someone go to a dedicated two
two three, five five six canfor their regular ar versus just throw a
(27:18):
thirty cow can on? Yeah?Good question. I mean, so this
is my own experience doing it twentyyears. I usually say, whatever gun
do you shoot the most and youenjoy shooting, get a suppressor dedicated for
it because it's going to work betterthan you thought it would. And then
it's easier to mentally justify buying moresilencers because obviously you can buy a thirty
cow like the Banish thirty. Ismodular, so you can make it shorter.
(27:41):
And you could take a thirty cowsuppressor and put it on a five
five six and it'll work well.But it's going to work better if you
get one made specifically for that.It's gonna because the hole is. That's
the whole deal, right, thewhole deal. Get it. Yeah,
the hole is is tighter, sonot as much gas, not as much
sound escaping. Yeah, And thefact of the matter is once you get
(28:02):
that suppressor on that gun and sidedin and really tuned in, now you
kind of I mean, my thoughtis just leave it on there. Oh
yeah. And people I always say, people love the suppressor, using it
more than they thought they would,and then once they used they're like,
okay, you're right, I gotto get more than one. And I
think some people are scared to jumpinto the suppresser game because they're like,
oh, what if I like itbetter I thought it would, then I
got to buy one for everything.So sometimes you can start. I would
(28:26):
say our best seller is the Banishthirty because you could kind of use it
on all rifles, you know,five, five six up to you know,
three to win mag during a weatherbyso it's it's very versatile. But
then then they start specializing after that. Like you said, I feel like,
because the processing times have gotten somuch faster, you guys have helped
make the paperwork part really not abig deal. Yeah. I think what's
(28:48):
happening is you had that transition ifwe go back seventy years where most guns
were iron sights, yeah, andthen they started putting rifle scopes on and
like, but well, I don'tneed that. I can hit whatever I
need to hit with these iron sights. Well you can, but it's going
to be better. And now theidea of having like one scope that I
(29:10):
put on each gun when I wantto go shoot is absurd. You're like,
no, we need to put anoptic on all the guns solely.
Now it's like, okay, I'vegot all these guns, I'm gonna safe.
I need to have a suppressor oneach gun, and there is an
argument for optimizing what suppressor that ison that particular platform, right, yeah,
absolutely, yeah, just and youknow, once you cite it in
(29:33):
and you take it off, it'salways going to be sited in once you
put it back on there. ButI think some people do worry about Okay,
well, which one did I puton that one last? Because I
have that problem because I'm like,all right, what riflem I take?
And one? Hon am I goingon? And what silence? Or do
we have it on it last time? So now I almost label them like
almost put like a telet posher puta piece of tape on there, so
like blue tape on the on thesilence or blue tape on that gun,
so that I know every time theygo together. Yeah, just not you
(29:55):
know, And I'm I'm fortunate Ihave a team that's, you know,
helping me manage all this stuff,but it could be difficult. You have
a safe with you know. SometimesI've seen as much as one hundred and
fifty thousand Suncer's inventory once, sojust keeping up with which ones are mine
verse which ones everybody else's. Youguys are pretty good at paperwork though,
Yeah. I mean, I youknow what, ATF has been good to
work with, allowing us to dosome all of our processes digitally, so
(30:15):
that works out well where the consumercan do everything DOCU sign Yeah, so
nice. I like the stories oflike ATF going, I don't think that
that's legal, and Brandon is overhere going no, actually it is let
me explain. You're the guy.You're the guy where they're like, well,
the government's going, well, thisneeds to be filled out in triple
kit and you need to send thiscopy here, in this copy here and
(30:37):
then, and most of us arelike, oh, and you're going okay,
so just triple kit. That's fine, yeah, done, Yeah,
you know. And it's evolved,and I would say we're still educating people
because our business model is so unique. But one of the ones I do
remember is my I think it wasmy third license was Montana. We would
work a lot of shows up inNorth Dakota and a lot of the oil
fields had Montana residents. So Montanawanted to be able to buy from US.
(30:57):
I got a call from the regionalman and so, I see your
application to be an SOT dealer herein Montana. It's like, I've been
doing this like twenty five years,and I don't think what you want to
do is going to work. Sobut I'm happy to come me with you
and talk about it. He so, I just don't see this possible.
So of course I flew in,drove there and met with him and opened
up. You know, the federalstatutes, they used to give you a
printed book and I had highlighted andhe read it and he goes, Okay,
(31:18):
clearly you know more about this thanI do. We're going to approve
your license and you know, bestof luck in Montana. If you have
any questions, let us know.So I was like, oh, wow,
this is kind of cool. Thisguy's been there forever and everyone knows
them, and he'd never heard ofwhat we were doing. So yeah,
if you're willing to dig into allthat stuff and highlight it, totally know
it's funny. I've been told that'sthe same way for gun people gun in
(31:41):
industry that they should handle Facebook andInstagram and YouTube is dig into their policies.
Yeah, copy them, highlight them, send it to them. When
they say, well you can't postthis picture of a gun, no in
your policy, you say I can. Yeah, Oh we said that.
Yeah. I mean it's same thing, right. The government has this big
(32:02):
organization. True, Facebook is anenormous organization, and bureaucracy is what it
is at this point. Yeah.And the hard part with the social media
folks is typically they're in areas wherethose people have just never seen farms.
I mean, when I lived inNew Jersey. I was a manager up
there, and people are like,do you actually own farms? I told
them how many. They're like,oh my god, why would anyone?
And once you talk to me,you find out they've never seen a farm
(32:23):
unless it's with law enforcement that Inever owned one. They don't know anyone
that owns one. So I couldsee the same thing with Facebook. You
know, you got someone in Californiawho has never seen a farm reviewing your
post and going, well, it'sclearly not legal. My dad likes to
tell this story occasionally. He wouldget people find out what he does or
talking to him. They're like,and there's somebody from New York or someone
(32:45):
from Massachusetts and they're like, oh, I don't know anyone who owns guns,
and he would go, yeah,you do. You guys just don't
talk about it like we talk aboutit because my friends we all know each
other, we know we own guns. Yeah, he said, go ask
around when next time you're at adinner party, you're hanging out, ask
them do you guys own guns?Like, do I know anybody? He
(33:05):
goes. Every time, I'd geta call a month later, Tom,
You're right, Yeah, like halfthe people I know own guns. Like,
yeah, you guys just are keepinga seat from each other. That's
funny. That's cool. You allown guns. Yeah, I like it.
That's good. That's cool. Andand that's fairly true across the country.
Certainly there's higher gun ownership in certainstates Ohio and Texas or whatever.
(33:27):
Yeah, and maybe a little bitlower in certain states. But I mean
it's like it's not like zero,Like even in a state I don't pick
one, California, Yeah, it'sstill like thirty percent of the people own
guns. Yeah. So if youdon't own a gun, someone on either
side of you and you know yourneighbors owns a gun, right, yeah,
like every other third house has agun. Wow, even in a
(33:49):
in a state that doesn't have alot of guns. Yeah. Yeah,
So I mean, and it's kindof becoming that way with silencers, I
think, I mean more and it'sit's becoming less unique, yes, agreed.
Yeah, because there's so many benefitsif you think about it, produce
recoil, don't have to wear yourplugs, and better accuracy. There's really
there's still downside. Any idea howmany silencers I'm how many people not maybe
(34:13):
how many silencers but how many peopleown silencers in the US. So I
know there's about four million that havebeen issued, and that's probably old day.
There's probably more, maybe four anda half million, but typically what
I see is most people that buyone buy more than one, So it's
probably two and a half million peopleown all four and a half million of
them out there. Okay, yeah, okay, it's very concentrated, which
you know, from a political standpoint, I want as many people to own
(34:36):
them, just because that's where Iwas going to get deregulated. Yeah,
there's enough people that are voting andeducating their elected officials that then they get
deregulated. They don't even sell more. If you could go to Walmart and
buy it just like a rare backgroundcheck, that'd be pretty amazing. It'd
be amazing. Yeah, I thinkthat's the goal. Everybody, if you're
listening to this, go buy themjust because not because they're cool, but
we need to get those numbers up, rookie numbers, you know, like
(34:57):
if we're at three million people inthe US that own silencers, that's it's
not significant enough perhaps for politicians tocare, right because when the NRA,
the NRA has had their troubles lately. But when the NRA, which has
been the biggest lobbyist group for gunrights, would walk into a senator's office
(35:20):
or a congressman's office, you knowwhat, the first question they ask NRA
is how's membership? Yeah? Basically, should I care that you're coming in
here to talk to me? Whenyou say, well, we're at three
million, okay, Yeah, that'sinteresting. If you say we're at twenty
million membership, now it's like Ihave to listen to these people totally.
(35:45):
Yeah, agreed. Yeah. SoI mean I think they say, what
could the NRA do if they hadtwenty million members? The answer is anything
they want. Yeah. True,you're at that point you're AARP or one
of these giant lobbyist groups, whichis what the AARP is everybody, Just
in case you didn't know, you'rea lobbyist group. Yeah, so I
(36:06):
think that that's a big deal.So maybe you don't need that fifth ar,
that fifth block. Maybe go buya silencer. Yeah. I always
say I've never found anyone that balland I didn't love it and said,
hey, I wish I've done thisa whole lot. Sooner you probably see
the same thing. Oh yeah,absolutely reduce recoil. Fantastic for getting new
shooters into it, or your wifeor your kids or whatever. Maybe they're
(36:29):
going to be more comfortable shooting theseguns. And even if you know,
hey, if your goal is selfish, like I just want them to get
into my hobby. Yeah, cool, that works too, awesome. Any
new updates with sounds are essential thatwe want to share, Brandon. I
mean, you guys are rocking it. Yeah, I mean, I guess
the only updates are Some people don'trealize we sell every product. Some people
(36:51):
don't realize that we're do individuals,not just trust. And maybe if people
haven't heard that we shipped silence throughyour front door, do you do all
the paper for your dock signed soyou can essential order a silencer from your
couch. Never leave your house andsilencer shows up to your front don't show
up. That's my favorite part becauseI've I've sent several friends to you guys,
and I'm like and and guys whohave never owned a silencer and go,
(37:14):
here's the best part. It's gonnashow up on your door one day
and you're gonna go, is thisreal? And I and you know what
happens every time I get a textmessage of a picture of a silencer,
you're like, dude, you wereright. They just delivered it. I
know. That's awesome. That's perfectawesome, Brandon, thanks for coming on
man. Yeah, that's actually theopportunity. All right, that's it for
(37:36):
us. We will see you allnext time on guntaw Nation.
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