August 4, 2024 • 43 mins
In This Hour:
-- Joel Hodgdon does the "Prodigal Son" routine, returning to Hodgdon to help run RCBS. Is there still any reason to get into handloading your own ammunition?
-- If your shooting isn't as good as you want, why not get instruction?
-- Why do most people remain clueless about their personal safety, and what can you do to get out of that rut?
Gun Talk 08.04.24 Hour 3
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/gun-talk--6185159/support.
-- Joel Hodgdon does the "Prodigal Son" routine, returning to Hodgdon to help run RCBS. Is there still any reason to get into handloading your own ammunition?
-- If your shooting isn't as good as you want, why not get instruction?
-- Why do most people remain clueless about their personal safety, and what can you do to get out of that rut?
Gun Talk 08.04.24 Hour 3
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/gun-talk--6185159/support.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
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Speaker 2 (00:12):
All right, we're back with you. I'm Tom Gresham and
this is gun Talk. If you want to be a
part of this, I want to call in. You've got
something to contribute. You think we're just off our rockers
and you want to set us straight. Would not be
the first person to do that. Okay, the number year
is Tom Talk Gun. That's me Tom, and we talk gun.
So Tom Talk Gun. We'll get you in there. We
(00:35):
had lots to talk about this hour, and some of
us about gun rights. Some of it's about Donald Trump
in the election, but we also like to talk about well,
just stuff. We like our gear and we like getting
ready for hunting season or getting ready for the competition season.
Are just going out and shooting, and part of that
(00:55):
is got to have AMMO and for a lot of us, frankly,
making our own AMMO. And I've done this all my
life really pretty much. Yeah. I like handloading, I like reloading,
but I do it for certain reasons. I guess different
people have different reasons, and we could talk about that.
But joining us right now is somebody we've had all
the show a number of times now filling a different slot.
(01:19):
Joe Hodgton joins us right now. Hey Joe, welcome back
and congrats.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
Hey Dom, thanks for having me on as always, and
it's good to be back.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
So do you want me to tell her? You want
to tell them what happened?
Speaker 3 (01:34):
Well, I guess I'm happy to talk. So some of
your listeners might remember or I've seen out there. It's
that my family company, Hodgedon Powder, recently bought our CBS
reloading gear a couple of months ago, and so you know,
since then, the folks of the hodged and Powder have
been digging in and trying to get our CBS back
(01:57):
up and going at full speed, and so they've were
kind of recruited me back home. Right So, as of
this last week, I'm taking over marketing and product management
responsibilities for our CBS.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
So the prodigal sun has returned. So when you are
working now at Hodgdon, does that make you third or
fourth generation?
Speaker 3 (02:19):
So I'm fourth generation. My great granddaddy, Bruce Hodgden started
the company back in nineteen forty seven, and that's just
a few short years after Fred Huntington started our CBS
in Obvil, California. I've believed in nineteen forty two Mante
forty three or so, so kind of a fun shared
(02:40):
history there. But yeah, fourth generation Hodgdon back in Hodgton,
and you know, I've kind of spent my adult life
outside of the family business and working for other fine
folks like Remington Ammo and Cederal Lamo, the Congressional Sportsman's Foundation.
So it's good to be back home. And got a
(03:00):
lot of work too.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Okay, So our CBS is probably still I would offer,
the biggest name in metallic reloading presses, scales, accessories, dies
on and on and on. Been around, as you say,
since right after World War Two. When somebody asked you
what our CBS is, what do you tell him?
Speaker 3 (03:24):
That's exactly right? Well, I usually I explained the name.
So our CBS is an acronym and it stands for
a rock chuck bullet swage because Fred, the company founder,
was a big barmut shooter and the part of northern
California where he's from, he liked to shoot at a
prairie dog, right or a couple of a sort of
(03:45):
a ground squirrel critter that they called a rock chuck.
So his first product was a bullet swaging dye that
he put on the market that he liked to use.
And she had a rock chuck, right, And I don't
know what cartridge or caliber he used to use that in,
So somebody else knows, call in and give me a
(04:05):
history of lessons, but I'd like to learn. But that
being said, that was kind of his start. And just
like Hodgden, you know, Fred and the folks at heart,
CBS grew as a family business for a long time
before they ended up selling out to other ownership. But yeah,
the whole host of reloading gear and tooling, you know,
everything from dies and presses to precision powder measurement tools,
(04:30):
powder throwers, scales, calibers, kind of everything you need to
go out and roll your own.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
Where is the reloading market these days or handloading market?
Because I mean, obviously, as you know, having just come
from animal companies, the AMMO we have now Factory Animal
is really very good. So a lot of people used
to you know, a lot of people got into hand
learning because they could actually make better ammo than the
factories could in many ways, that's more difficult these days.
(05:02):
So where are we with handloading? Is it still as
popular as it used to be?
Speaker 3 (05:06):
You know, that's a good question. I would say there's
still lots of reasons to handload. I don't think it's
quite as common, right. I think it used to be,
as you mentioned, Tom, because the everyday AMO coming out
of an ammunition factory wasn't quite to the standards that
we have now. More hunters, more casual shooters would reload
(05:27):
and do a lot on their own. Well, well, now,
still lots of people still do it, but I think
it's for for different reasons. So that that drive to
produce the most precise, ultra high end, ultra custom AMMO
that you can is still there. And so I think
you know, all the top competitors whether you're shooting, you know,
especially disciplines like like PRS. You know, you and I,
(05:50):
d p A some others. Right, it's still challenge. You're
probably still handloading your own AMMO, right, just to get
that extra little umph over the finish line and knowledge
of your plot form and your firearm. And then you know,
some folks still reload for cost savings. So you know,
I know, powder and bullets and brass and primers and
(06:10):
everything else is expensive these days, but at high, high volumes.
You know, if you're going out and hey, say you
are that IDPA shooter and you're moving through just pallets
and pallets of ammo right on the shot shells side,
right if you're a big trap shooter and you're going
through a case to day or whatever, I mean, you
you pretty much got a handload to make your buck
(06:31):
go a little bit further and shoot a little bit longer.
So those are a couple of reasons. I'm kind of
like you too, Tom. You know, some of us just
like to do it for fun. And that's okay.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
Too, Absolutely, Okay, I'm gonna you crack the door open.
So I'm gonna kick it open and ask the question
you mentioned. Shot shells our CBS is metallic. Is there
a chance or an option of our CBS getting into
the shotgun loading you?
Speaker 3 (06:57):
Yeah, great question. So you know some of our listeners
I remember, Tom, You know, years ago our CBS had
a pretty well regarded shot shell press called the Grand
And these days our CBS still sells some accessory and
some different kinds of tools for shots well reloading, but
we we don't have a flagship model press anymore. And
(07:19):
I'm excited to talk about new products and what's going
on the pipe for our CBS. Well, I'll just say
that you never know, and we'll be taking a hard
look at it. I think it'd be be nice to
have one again on my bench.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
Oh man, you're just saying everything without saying it, aren't you.
Speaker 3 (07:37):
I mean, you never know. And and there's look, I've
got a I've got a mech sitting downstairs right now
as we speak. You know, awesome, awesome presses. Lots of
other folks out there make a great shot shell press
and so you know, I don't want to do something
just to do it right. If our CBS is going
to come out with a new product, a press or
a die or whatever else, it's got to be you know,
(07:58):
it's got to be good. It's got to America made.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
Yeah, okay, so it's all made in America. Then, and
then you lead me to the question, which is you
already make really good stuff. I mean it's like, okay,
you got dies loading, dies canny, any of that be improved.
It's like the rock Chucker is there's the that's the
standard by which other presses are measured. What else can
you do in the line too? I mean it's already
(08:23):
very good.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
Yeah, and it's a big line, right. I think, you know,
there's us and maybe a couple other companies out there
that have the same size and scale of options for
you as a handloader. But there is a lot out there.
I think you can improve on things, Tom and I
never want to stop trying, right, And there's little things
we've seen in the handloading world in the last five
ten years where, you know, especially at the higher end
(08:47):
of the market, where some folks are coming out with
some really new and exciting things to make your experience faster, right,
or to you know, eck out that last little bit
of quality, right, a little bit of precision out of
the round that you're loading. And so I think there's
some things we can go do. But you know, I'm
a big proponent of if it ain't broke, don't fix it.
So I don't see us messing with a rock chucker
(09:09):
anytime soon. But if there's a way we can make
a rock chucker better or cheaper, you know, we're going
to figure that out.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
It's still it's all still made in America.
Speaker 3 (09:19):
You got it, You got it, Yes, exactly right. And
and by cheaper, I mean make it cheaper for us
lets manufacture and field. Let's just a lot, you got it,
Yet not not reduce quality. We're never going to do that.
And so yes, all our CBS tooling minus some of
our electronic items are made here in America. So man,
ninety percent of our products online, our dies, our presses,
(09:43):
et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, all of our metallic tools,
probably manufacturing or of the California. By it just a
great group of people. And you know I won't I
won't make any California jokes, but these are these are
assaults of the earth, are working folks, and you know,
I think they're gonna right in with us that at
Hodgon Powder.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
Well, I know you've been on the job, the new job,
for a full week now, so we appreciate you. You're
coming over, and as soon as you can actually talk
about the new stuff, let's get you back on.
Speaker 3 (10:12):
Okay, I'd love to do that. I think you kind
of keep an eye out if you're a handloader. We
should have some news for you around Shot Show next
year and kind of coming into fall. We're gonna crank
the innovation pipeline back on and get things moving.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
Sounds good, Joel Hodgson. Congratulations on the new gig and
also being there with the rest of the family. Hey, thanks, Tom,
appreciate you having me all right, you take care of
eighty six to six talk gun We are flat out
open lines right now. I'm Tom Gresham. This is Gun Talk.
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Speaker 2 (13:03):
We're getting some mixed decisions some of the courts around
the country. Out of Maryland District Court has held that
Maryland's Sensitive Places Carrie ban is unconstitutional in some locations
this will all continue. We're just going to keep chasing
this thing, and we have several outfits. The NRA is
(13:24):
still involved in some of these, although the NRA wow
I just got decision from the New York Court and
the judge really chastised the leadership there because they're telling
everybody they have won several of these cases when they've
actually lost, and they're telling the members that they keep
winning in court when they're not winning. The reality is
(13:47):
the same clowns are in charge of the NRA. Nothing's
really changed. And Bill Brewer with the Brewer Law Firm,
I think is running the NRA. I think I saw
the number. Could it possibly be right? They spend one
hundred and sixty one hundred and eighty million dollars in
legal fees with Bill Brewer's firm. It's unbelievable. But all
(14:14):
that aside, they still are involved in some of the lawsuits.
Secondment Foundation, of course isn't the lead on a lot
of them, along with the Fire's Policy Coalition. So and
Naggar National Association for Gun Rights is doing some interesting
good things. Quite a change from where they were just
a few years ago. They've really changed, so that's interesting.
(14:36):
And also it just helps. We've got more good firms
and organizations working on this, so we're going to continue
to make headway. And sometimes it's two steps forward, one
step back, and then you have to appeal, and some
of these they know they're going to have to keep Appealingum, eventually,
I hope fingers crossed knock on wood, that we get
(14:57):
some of these cases back before the Supreme and they
actually give us some solid decisions that tell the courts,
knock it off, the lower courts, we really didn't mean this.
There really is a second Amendment. You really can't continue
to do the things you've been doing again. That takes
time again, that involves having good judges and justices. Again.
That spends us all the way back to the election
(15:19):
that we're facing right now. And we've got mister imperfect
and miss absolutely perfectly awful. This is what we got
right now. Donald Trump is imperfect. Got it, understand it,
get over it, grow up, just quit whiny. For heaven's sakes.
Some people seem to be saying it's like, well, you know,
(15:40):
he cave into pressure. He wasn't good on this, you know,
but he wasn't it. And I said, yeah, it sounds
to me like you're doing the exact same thing when
you say, yeah, I mean he's going to be better
than her, but he's not great. It sounds like you're
equivocating on this. You got to make a decision. I mean,
I guess you don't have to make a decision to
(16:02):
vote for him. You can say I'm not going to
vote Okay, that's a decision to vote for her. I mean, realistically,
it is. And a lot of people don't seem to
understand that, or aren't willing to accept that, or won't
own up to it, or the one I don't get.
And maybe you can help me with this as people say, well,
(16:22):
you know, I don't like her, but I just can't
vote for Trump. Really, why explain that to me? I
just can't vote for Trump? Really? What's behind that? If
you know he's better than the alternative? And in a
(16:43):
real world, an adult world where we look at things
realistically and say, Okay, we don't get perfect, we're just
going to get the best we can get, it appears
to me he's the best we can get. I don't
get the whole I just can't vote for him. Are
you saying that somehow this is more about you than
(17:07):
it is about the election. Is it more about your
self image or how you appear to your friends, or
you want to just stake out this position public or
here's a question. Are people actually just saying that when
they're actually going to vote for him anyway? But somehow
it gives them some sort of social status to be
(17:28):
able to say, I just can't vote for Trump. Really,
well you could, I guess, vote for the woman who's
very openly says you're going to take your guns away.
She's okay sending people with guns to take your guns.
And please understand, this is not an academic exercise. When
(17:51):
they send people to take your guns, they will kill you.
They will shoot you, and they will kill you if
you don't give them your guns. This is not metaphors,
not hyperbole, This is not I mean, this is what
they do. And I love when people say, well, you know,
(18:12):
the police won't actually go door to door confiscates gun. Really,
they will go door to door. They will confiscate your guns.
They already have a list with your address who owns guns.
You can't prevent them from having your name. That's already
(18:33):
out there. So the only question is would you hold
your nose and vote for somebody who will prevent that
from happening. Will you vote for somebody who will put
in judges and justices who will prevent that from happening,
whereas some kind of weird I just can't vote for
(18:54):
Trump self image thing enough to turn you off of that.
I don't know, it's just it's one of those weird thing.
And I thought about it a good bit and I
get it. I mean, I understand that he's not perfect.
I have said the same things. Well, you know, he
supported the bomb stock Man, he did this. Yeah, great,
But when you really bought that down, you go, Okay.
I got two choices or I have one choice between
(19:15):
two options. That's just where we are. Hey, let's grab Maurice.
He called back out of Lake Charles, Louisiana on Lane one. Hey, Marias,
you're on gun talk. What do you have there?
Speaker 9 (19:27):
Well, have you ever been sitting down reading a gun
magazine and saw a gun that you liked and then
tore the page out and run up to the house.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
And ordered it.
Speaker 9 (19:36):
Well, I did that with a with a new taurust depy.
I call my gun shop. Now there was a brand
new gun. I said, okay, can you get one? He
said no. Two days later he called said I got it.
So I had to have a chance to go to
the range with it. I shouted a couple of times
at my little makeshift indoor range. I re losed my
(19:56):
own ambunition, and I was tested to loads, and I
found out something about that gun that so far, everything
I've seen about it, I like. Price point four hundred
and sixty nine dollars for a single action revolver, not
bad at all. Now I got into forty five colds,
but I loaded. I load forty five long cold for
(20:16):
Smith and Wesson that I have. And when I when
I ran the bullets through the press and tried to
run up through the gun, they were too long. So
I laid the cylinder up next to the smith, and
the cylinder on that is actually about I'm not quite
sixteenth a little more than sixteenth inch shorter than on
the smith. So I got to do it some measurements,
(20:38):
and it requires the one point six inch sandy length.
You can't go any longer whereas on that smith you can.
So if you're going to load for that gun, you
better you better let that bullet stick out too. Far
or the cylinder.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Will returned, So you got to stay with the standard
factory length on that if you're handloading. Okay, that's good
to know.
Speaker 9 (21:00):
Great. Yeah, and one thing too about the handloading. I'm
glad you had that little segment. I handload as a hobby.
When I like the idea of making my own bullets
that I take it one self further. I cast my
own bullets that I have for years. And I look
at all these nice Shiver bullets I just cast, said hey,
I made dad, you know, And and I say I
(21:24):
can go out and shoot all. I won't because it's
cheap until I start buying primers.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
Well yeah, and the problem is we can't make our
own primers and we're kind of stuck. Although there are
some kind of I would call off brand primers hit
in the market now, or at least primers I don't
know about. I'm starting to see some people testing them
and they're they're pretty good. So maybe buying primers that
are not the known brands if that's what's available. Don't
be afraid of doing that, Maurice. Look, I appreciate the
(21:53):
range report. Now, I appreciate the story. I just it
didn't really know much about the Taurist Deputy, but it
sounds like a very nice revolver. Look anything in forty
five colt. I'm all about it. Whether you call it
the long colt or the colt, that matter to me.
I don't care. That's a great caliber. All right, eighty
six ' six talk gun. This is gun taking Hey,
(22:20):
gun talks back with you here. I'm Tom Gresham, your host.
You can join us by calling Tom Talk Gun. Couldn't
be easier than that. John figured that out, he called it.
He's online five out of Claremore, Oklahoma. John talk about
the Olympics throughout the idea of three gun at the Olympics.
What do you think?
Speaker 10 (22:41):
I agree with that one hundred percent. But I also
think that probably no shooting event is more fun to
watch than shooting bowling pins.
Speaker 2 (22:51):
Yeah it is, but I mean, can you imagine.
Speaker 10 (22:56):
Where the table is the winner?
Speaker 2 (22:58):
It really is. It's as simple as that you got.
I can't remember five or six pin.
Speaker 10 (23:03):
I don't recall.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
Yeah, it's five or six pins. And the deal is
you got to get them off the table, not just
knocked over. They got to be off the table. So
you're balancing out speed because it's just a speed event.
It's speed versus power. Yeah, you can shoot a forty
four magnum and knock them off, but can you shoot
it quickly? Or when you go with a lesser caliber,
but you may have to hit them two or three
(23:25):
times and knock them off. Kind of fun deal. But yeah, God,
I would love to see a three gun competition at
the Olympics. But we know that's anything I'm going to
use an AR fifteen in that ain't happening. Right then,
you had a thought about elections together.
Speaker 10 (23:44):
I did. I'm seventy one years old, and every election
I've voted in was always a compromise. You pick the
person that checks the most boxes for you, and you
go with that one.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
That's really all there is, isn't it. I mean, I
have never seen anybody who agreed with me on anything,
most certainly including my wife, so you know, and I've
been with her for fifty years. So you just you
do the best you can with the choices you're offered.
Speaker 10 (24:13):
Right, Nobody's ever perfect, now.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
You know, in this case, but in this case it's
really important. It's not like you go, well, you know,
I'll just sit this one out, can't do that this time.
I'm afraid where you're going to have a course correction
at this election. That's going to stay with us for
quite some time. Excuse me, especially if it's Kadell Harris, yes, sir.
Speaker 10 (24:38):
Or a gun owner and a shooter. There only seems
to be one choice this time.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
Yeah, I would agree with you there, Thank you, John,
I appreciate that. Hey, I want to take just a
minute talk about something here. I was having a conversation
with my wife after we were watching the local news.
And we live in a what normally people would say, oh,
this is a safe area. I hear people say that,
we don't go to bad parts, we don't go to
the bad part of town, we don't go to unsafe areas.
(25:06):
And we're watching local news and there's a guy who
escaped from prison and god around the state and this
is one I'm bad dude. I mean, he's got the
full born, you know, the whole I don't know if
be prison tats or whatever, but the facial tattoos of this,
that the record to go with it, violent criminal murder,
(25:28):
all the rest of it. And I'm watching this story
and them talking about how far he went all over
the state, and it occurred to me. And I've said
all the time that people need to get out of
this idea of well, we're in a safe place. I
don't wear my gun because where we are it's safe.
(25:51):
You know what, unsafe can come to you. You don't
have to go to unsafe. It can come to you.
Crazy can show up in front of you at any
given time. Murderers can pop up where you least expect them,
and the problem is you don't know when that's going
(26:12):
to be. And I understand there some people say I'm
just not going to live that way. Okay, you might
die that way, but you could choose not to live
that way. I, on the other hand, choose to take
responsibility for me and my family. I choose to be
my own first responder. And there are a lot of
(26:33):
people who say that and say they do, but I
don't know if they really have the commitment. The commitment involves, yeah,
you got to commit to putting it on every day,
you got to carry that gun every day. But I'm
only going I don't care. You don't know what's there.
(26:54):
You don't know if it's an escaped prisoner who's a murderer.
You don't care. You don't know if it's going to
be some neighbors pitbull who decides to tear your legs
off and kill you. You don't know, if it's just some
goofball road rage nutbar who decides to get his ego
wrapped up and is driving and is going to cut
(27:17):
you off for some perceived slight and come try to
hurt you or your family members. I guess the bottom
line is you don't know. If you knew, then you
can make a course of action based on that. But
since you don't know, since there's a possibility that crazy
(27:38):
pops up, the murderer pops up, and an attack pops up,
what are you going to do about it? Well, Number one,
you got to carry. Number two, you got to get training,
a lot of training. And it's not just how to
shoot training. In fact, actually I would submit that's probably
the least of it. What you really need training on.
What I would encourage you to consider is mental training.
(28:00):
Working on your situational awareness. When you're driving. Are you
looking left and right all the time. It's like a scan,
a pile of the thing we do an instrument scan
and driving I do a scan, I do left right
and near Far. I look to the left of the road,
I look to the right of the road, I look
up right in front of the car, and then I
(28:22):
look way down, look deep down the road, left right,
near Far. While I'm driving, it's just part of what
I do. It's a scan. I want to know what's
going on in a store left right, dear Far, I
want to know what's going on. I want to know
who's there in a restaurant, same thing. And then it's
a case of what am I seeing that doesn't look right?
(28:45):
Here in lies one of our problems. We are socialized
to say, well, you can't make a judgment about somebody
by the way they look. Yes you can. If you
have a brain left in your body, you most certainly
can make a judgment about somebody based on the way
they look and based on the way they act. Now
(29:05):
you have to temper that with common sense and judgment. Okay,
I get that, And they may not be dressed like you.
Who cares? But you can put two and two and
fourteen together and come up with that doesn't look right.
Doesn't mean you're gonna do anything right now. It just
means you're going to start paying close attention to what's
going on, and maybe you start easing yourself out of
(29:27):
the situation, or maybe you just are a bit more alert.
The point is if you can see it, and the
only way you can see it is to be looking
for it. But if you look for it and then
you see it, then you can take an action, which
means you don't have to engage it and you don't
(29:49):
have to use deadly forced to defend yourself. That's a
really good day. As we say, any day you don't
have to shoot somebody is a particularly good day. When
we come back, i'll talk just a little bit more
about this concept of awareness and also who is the
most dangerous person around? Hmm. There's something he hadn't thought
(30:12):
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Speaker 2 (31:20):
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Speaker 2 (32:33):
I want to finish up. I thought I had there.
I was remembering. Walt Rausch was a gun writer, former
law enforcement guy, had a very no nonsense way about him.
In one of his books, he was his self defense book.
He was trying to get citizens, like US civilians, if
you will, to understand what cops and law enforcement people understand,
(32:55):
because we citizens don't deal with the bad guys from
where they do. And I mentioned before the break, you
know who's the most dangerous person around? And people will think, oh,
this's the mixed martial arts guy, or it's this guy,
it's that guy. Now it's not. It's the guy who
Walt called the other human in the way he ascribed it.
(33:18):
And the problem is you don't know this person. You
can't recognize this person, and that makes him particularly dangerous.
This person started being beaten when he was very very young,
been physically abused, been emotionally abused, maybe sexually abused, lived
through violence, practiced violence all of his life, had contact
(33:44):
with the criminal justice system throughout his life, has been beaten,
has given beatings, doesn't care. He is a sociopath. Psychopath maybe,
but certainly a sociopath would no more worry about hurting
or killing you. Then he was stepping on a bug.
(34:04):
And as I say, doesn't wear a sign. This says
that's who he is. That's your most dangerous person, the
one that you don't recognize, You don't know, and it
will hurt you without even thinking about it. Will sircer,
you will stalk, you will get your pumping gas and
(34:26):
you're wonder, what's what's that person in over there? Well,
that may be a really dangerous person. I was just
reading a piece online and it was saying, and the
hope is that if you end up having contact with
that person, you need to flip that around and that
person is no longer the most dangerous person. You have
(34:46):
sucked that title out and put it on yourself, and
you now have become the most dangerous person in the world,
because if you are not that most dangerous person or
the few seconds, you may not survive. What I'm describing
as a way of thinking, in a way of preparing
(35:10):
and a situational awareness and understanding what's going on around you.
You got to look for it before you can see it,
and once you see it, you got to make a
decision on how you got to act, or at least
have a bit of a plan. And then if you
end up getting into it, swift, absolutely violent, savage reaction
(35:31):
is what will save your life. This does not come
naturally to most of us. You have to go get
training and how to change the way you think, as
well as develop the skills you need. A lot of
those lines are I'm a switch. Just for a second,
we are going to have a class arrange reading studios
with Steve Trani and Max Michelle is. Tarranni is the
(35:54):
hand to hand, knife club, everything else guide. Obviously Max
Michelle is world class pistol shooter. That's going to be
a fascinating class if you're interested in that kind of thing.
I guess what I'm asking you to do, or urging
you to do, is to take a hard look at yourself.
(36:15):
And all I'm doing is asking you to make yourself safe.
I want you to be safer. I want you to
be have a safer family. And these are conversations you
can have with your family without scaring them. You have
to figure out how you present it. But it's awareness.
If you're sitting in the restaurant, you can ask, you know,
who's sitting behind you, what's that conversation going on over there? Well,
(36:39):
I don't I haven't been paying attention. Well that's the point,
isn't it. You need to be paying attention. You know,
you're pumping gas when you get out of your car,
or even before you get out of your car. Who's
walking around outside? Here? Is that guy standing over there
just been staring there at you the whole time. He's
leaning up against the wall. He was there when he
(37:00):
got there. He's just staring. He's not doing anything. He
wondered what does all that about? I don't know, And
maybe it's not a problem, but it's probably worth paying
attention to and keeping your focus there. Typically a lot
of people worth actually literally look away from something like that.
I don't want to cause any embarrassment. I don't want
(37:21):
this person to think that I've singled him out because
he looks a certain way. That's a fool's Errand you
look at him, you steer at him, you let him
know I see you over there. I'm looking at you.
I am not the easy prey. I am not the
(37:41):
slow wounded impalla at the back of the herd. And
if you can be the predator, but I am not
here to play with you, and I am not here
to be your prey today. He had a strong look,
an upright posture, A swell of the head identifies you
as somebody who knows what's going on, is paying attention.
(38:03):
You know, we have a saying about that. People go
through the parking lots and they're staring at their phone,
they're looking down at their keys, they're not paying attention
to anything around. If you look like food, you will
be eating. You look like the easy target to take down.
(38:25):
If you're preoccupied in talking on your phone, and lord knows,
if you're texting on your phone with your head down,
you now have become the wound. It's low impella and
you can well expect a lion to take you down.
It's about changing the way you live so that you
have a safer life. Yeah, I know it may not
(38:48):
be if you everybody, but if you're serious about this,
you need to make it for you. We'll be right
back by the way. I'm looking at the Olympics and
the shooters there, they're incredibly good. Question, does your shooting suck?
(39:11):
Could you be better at shooting? Well, do something about it.
Go take a lesson somewhere if you're outkare with a shotgun, rifle, pistol.
There are classes everywhere. Now, there are trainers everywhere, and
you would be stunned if you've never taken a class.
You can be amazed at how much a good trainer
can help you in a really short period of time,
(39:31):
very quickly, you can become a better shooter than you
are now. So if your shooting sucks, do something about it. Okay, Hey,
if you want to be part of the after show,
give me a call right now. Eight six y six
talk gun. Let's go talk with Joe in Jefferson, Texas. Hey, Joe,
thanks for your patience here.
Speaker 13 (39:49):
On all right, chom, just real quick, anybody on the
fence about voting for Trump. Let's put it like is
it's like shooting the high point pistol. I'd be the
greatest thing in your arsenal, but it's better than nothing
at all, And when.
Speaker 2 (40:06):
You need it, you need it more than anything else.
Speaker 13 (40:08):
Right, that's right. It's not my every day Carrie but
I got one, and I'm proud to own it because
it does run. It just it's like carrying a break.
Speaker 2 (40:19):
There you go, that'll work. Hey, I love the analogy
very good. Just to know what it's what you need
at the moment, and it may not be what you'd
like to have, but it's what you got and it'll
get the job done. I appreciate that. Very well done.
By the way, I don't really know. I mean, all
I can do is throw out my thoughts on this.
(40:40):
If you have any ideas on better ways to explain
the election, or maybe you want to try to tell
me why you won't vote for Trump even though you
own guns and support the Second Amendment, I'd love to
hear about that. You can call me right now eight
six six Talk Gun. We can get you into the
after show. By the way, after show, it's just part
of the podcast version of this show. So however, you
(41:02):
get your podcasts, and I would suggest that you have
a regular podcast app to get the Gun Talk podcast
because right now I'm just seeing that Ryan has interviewed
Vincent Hancock, who just won gold at the Olympics. We're
talking with Steve Trani. We have other podcasts as well
as the gun Talk radio show that you're listening to
right now. So get a regular podcast app and just download.
(41:27):
It'll automatically download gun Talk once't you subscribe to it.
So if you want to be a part of that
after show, call me eight sixty six Talk Gun. I
do like that analogy of you know, any gun is
better than no gun in a gunfight. That's really what
he was saying. Rule number one in a gunfight is
to have a gun. Rule number one in a political
(41:47):
fight about gun rights is to have somebody who will
support your rights, or you can flip it around, somebody
who will not try to strip you of your gun rights.
Whether you think Donald Trump is perfect, I can just
clue you in He's not. Okay, he's not perfect. All
(42:08):
he is is better than the alternative. And I think
is my belief that this election is going to make
a course change in American politics where we are, especially
when it comes to gun rights in the Second Amendment.
I think if we get Harris, we're going to get
eight years of her. I honestly don't know how you
(42:31):
we survive twelve years of Biden and then eight years
of Harris. As far as gun rights, because a few wins,
then she's going to bring in the down ballot. We'll
have they'll have control of the Senate, they'll get all
the judges and justices they want. I just try to envision.
(42:52):
I don't know how we survive that. I really don't.
I don't know how the Second Amendment survives that, honestly.
So that's kind of where we are. Time. I'm going
to ask you to do a thing. Talk this up,
talk with your friends about it, have real world adult conversations,
and you can do it at the shooting range. Invite
them to go shooting with you. You can even bring
the AMMO. That's okay, you can provide that AMMO. It's worthwhile.
(43:15):
Have some fun out there, get them laughing, get them
to having fun, and then you can weave into politics too.
It's all right, you can do that. You're not going
to spend anybody. Hey, I'm Tom Gregson. Thank you so much.
Check us out at gun talk dot com and over
on Twitter. I am at gun Talk. We'll see you
next week.
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Speaker 2 (00:12):
All right, we're back with you. I'm Tom Gresham and
this is gun Talk. If you want to be a
part of this, I want to call in. You've got
something to contribute. You think we're just off our rockers
and you want to set us straight. Would not be
the first person to do that. Okay, the number year
is Tom Talk Gun. That's me Tom, and we talk gun.
So Tom Talk Gun. We'll get you in there. We
(00:35):
had lots to talk about this hour, and some of
us about gun rights. Some of it's about Donald Trump
in the election, but we also like to talk about well,
just stuff. We like our gear and we like getting
ready for hunting season or getting ready for the competition season.
Are just going out and shooting, and part of that
(00:55):
is got to have AMMO and for a lot of us, frankly,
making our own AMMO. And I've done this all my
life really pretty much. Yeah. I like handloading, I like reloading,
but I do it for certain reasons. I guess different
people have different reasons, and we could talk about that.
But joining us right now is somebody we've had all
the show a number of times now filling a different slot.
(01:19):
Joe Hodgton joins us right now. Hey Joe, welcome back
and congrats.
Speaker 3 (01:24):
Hey Dom, thanks for having me on as always, and
it's good to be back.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
So do you want me to tell her? You want
to tell them what happened?
Speaker 3 (01:34):
Well, I guess I'm happy to talk. So some of
your listeners might remember or I've seen out there. It's
that my family company, Hodgedon Powder, recently bought our CBS
reloading gear a couple of months ago, and so you know,
since then, the folks of the hodged and Powder have
been digging in and trying to get our CBS back
(01:57):
up and going at full speed, and so they've were
kind of recruited me back home. Right So, as of
this last week, I'm taking over marketing and product management
responsibilities for our CBS.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
So the prodigal sun has returned. So when you are
working now at Hodgdon, does that make you third or
fourth generation?
Speaker 3 (02:19):
So I'm fourth generation. My great granddaddy, Bruce Hodgden started
the company back in nineteen forty seven, and that's just
a few short years after Fred Huntington started our CBS
in Obvil, California. I've believed in nineteen forty two Mante
forty three or so, so kind of a fun shared
(02:40):
history there. But yeah, fourth generation Hodgdon back in Hodgton,
and you know, I've kind of spent my adult life
outside of the family business and working for other fine
folks like Remington Ammo and Cederal Lamo, the Congressional Sportsman's Foundation.
So it's good to be back home. And got a
(03:00):
lot of work too.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Okay, So our CBS is probably still I would offer,
the biggest name in metallic reloading presses, scales, accessories, dies
on and on and on. Been around, as you say,
since right after World War Two. When somebody asked you
what our CBS is, what do you tell him?
Speaker 3 (03:24):
That's exactly right? Well, I usually I explained the name.
So our CBS is an acronym and it stands for
a rock chuck bullet swage because Fred, the company founder,
was a big barmut shooter and the part of northern
California where he's from, he liked to shoot at a
prairie dog, right or a couple of a sort of
(03:45):
a ground squirrel critter that they called a rock chuck.
So his first product was a bullet swaging dye that
he put on the market that he liked to use.
And she had a rock chuck, right, And I don't
know what cartridge or caliber he used to use that in,
So somebody else knows, call in and give me a
(04:05):
history of lessons, but I'd like to learn. But that
being said, that was kind of his start. And just
like Hodgden, you know, Fred and the folks at heart,
CBS grew as a family business for a long time
before they ended up selling out to other ownership. But yeah,
the whole host of reloading gear and tooling, you know,
everything from dies and presses to precision powder measurement tools,
(04:30):
powder throwers, scales, calibers, kind of everything you need to
go out and roll your own.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
Where is the reloading market these days or handloading market?
Because I mean, obviously, as you know, having just come
from animal companies, the AMMO we have now Factory Animal
is really very good. So a lot of people used
to you know, a lot of people got into hand
learning because they could actually make better ammo than the
factories could in many ways, that's more difficult these days.
(05:02):
So where are we with handloading? Is it still as
popular as it used to be?
Speaker 3 (05:06):
You know, that's a good question. I would say there's
still lots of reasons to handload. I don't think it's
quite as common, right. I think it used to be,
as you mentioned, Tom, because the everyday AMO coming out
of an ammunition factory wasn't quite to the standards that
we have now. More hunters, more casual shooters would reload
(05:27):
and do a lot on their own. Well, well, now,
still lots of people still do it, but I think
it's for for different reasons. So that that drive to
produce the most precise, ultra high end, ultra custom AMMO
that you can is still there. And so I think
you know, all the top competitors whether you're shooting, you know,
especially disciplines like like PRS. You know, you and I,
(05:50):
d p A some others. Right, it's still challenge. You're
probably still handloading your own AMMO, right, just to get
that extra little umph over the finish line and knowledge
of your plot form and your firearm. And then you know,
some folks still reload for cost savings. So you know,
I know, powder and bullets and brass and primers and
(06:10):
everything else is expensive these days, but at high, high volumes.
You know, if you're going out and hey, say you
are that IDPA shooter and you're moving through just pallets
and pallets of ammo right on the shot shells side,
right if you're a big trap shooter and you're going
through a case to day or whatever, I mean, you
you pretty much got a handload to make your buck
(06:31):
go a little bit further and shoot a little bit longer.
So those are a couple of reasons. I'm kind of
like you too, Tom. You know, some of us just
like to do it for fun. And that's okay.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
Too, Absolutely, Okay, I'm gonna you crack the door open.
So I'm gonna kick it open and ask the question
you mentioned. Shot shells our CBS is metallic. Is there
a chance or an option of our CBS getting into
the shotgun loading you?
Speaker 3 (06:57):
Yeah, great question. So you know some of our listeners
I remember, Tom, You know, years ago our CBS had
a pretty well regarded shot shell press called the Grand
And these days our CBS still sells some accessory and
some different kinds of tools for shots well reloading, but
we we don't have a flagship model press anymore. And
(07:19):
I'm excited to talk about new products and what's going
on the pipe for our CBS. Well, I'll just say
that you never know, and we'll be taking a hard
look at it. I think it'd be be nice to
have one again on my bench.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
Oh man, you're just saying everything without saying it, aren't you.
Speaker 3 (07:37):
I mean, you never know. And and there's look, I've
got a I've got a mech sitting downstairs right now
as we speak. You know, awesome, awesome presses. Lots of
other folks out there make a great shot shell press
and so you know, I don't want to do something
just to do it right. If our CBS is going
to come out with a new product, a press or
a die or whatever else, it's got to be you know,
(07:58):
it's got to be good. It's got to America made.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
Yeah, okay, so it's all made in America. Then, and
then you lead me to the question, which is you
already make really good stuff. I mean it's like, okay,
you got dies loading, dies canny, any of that be improved.
It's like the rock Chucker is there's the that's the
standard by which other presses are measured. What else can
you do in the line too? I mean it's already
(08:23):
very good.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
Yeah, and it's a big line, right. I think, you know,
there's us and maybe a couple other companies out there
that have the same size and scale of options for
you as a handloader. But there is a lot out there.
I think you can improve on things, Tom and I
never want to stop trying, right, And there's little things
we've seen in the handloading world in the last five
ten years where, you know, especially at the higher end
(08:47):
of the market, where some folks are coming out with
some really new and exciting things to make your experience faster, right,
or to you know, eck out that last little bit
of quality, right, a little bit of precision out of
the round that you're loading. And so I think there's
some things we can go do. But you know, I'm
a big proponent of if it ain't broke, don't fix it.
So I don't see us messing with a rock chucker
(09:09):
anytime soon. But if there's a way we can make
a rock chucker better or cheaper, you know, we're going
to figure that out.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
It's still it's all still made in America.
Speaker 3 (09:19):
You got it, You got it, Yes, exactly right. And
and by cheaper, I mean make it cheaper for us
lets manufacture and field. Let's just a lot, you got it,
Yet not not reduce quality. We're never going to do that.
And so yes, all our CBS tooling minus some of
our electronic items are made here in America. So man,
ninety percent of our products online, our dies, our presses,
(09:43):
et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, all of our metallic tools,
probably manufacturing or of the California. By it just a
great group of people. And you know I won't I
won't make any California jokes, but these are these are
assaults of the earth, are working folks, and you know,
I think they're gonna right in with us that at
Hodgon Powder.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
Well, I know you've been on the job, the new job,
for a full week now, so we appreciate you. You're
coming over, and as soon as you can actually talk
about the new stuff, let's get you back on.
Speaker 3 (10:12):
Okay, I'd love to do that. I think you kind
of keep an eye out if you're a handloader. We
should have some news for you around Shot Show next
year and kind of coming into fall. We're gonna crank
the innovation pipeline back on and get things moving.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
Sounds good, Joel Hodgson. Congratulations on the new gig and
also being there with the rest of the family. Hey, thanks, Tom,
appreciate you having me all right, you take care of
eighty six to six talk gun We are flat out
open lines right now. I'm Tom Gresham. This is Gun Talk.
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Speaker 2 (13:03):
We're getting some mixed decisions some of the courts around
the country. Out of Maryland District Court has held that
Maryland's Sensitive Places Carrie ban is unconstitutional in some locations
this will all continue. We're just going to keep chasing
this thing, and we have several outfits. The NRA is
(13:24):
still involved in some of these, although the NRA wow
I just got decision from the New York Court and
the judge really chastised the leadership there because they're telling
everybody they have won several of these cases when they've
actually lost, and they're telling the members that they keep
winning in court when they're not winning. The reality is
(13:47):
the same clowns are in charge of the NRA. Nothing's
really changed. And Bill Brewer with the Brewer Law Firm,
I think is running the NRA. I think I saw
the number. Could it possibly be right? They spend one
hundred and sixty one hundred and eighty million dollars in
legal fees with Bill Brewer's firm. It's unbelievable. But all
(14:14):
that aside, they still are involved in some of the lawsuits.
Secondment Foundation, of course isn't the lead on a lot
of them, along with the Fire's Policy Coalition. So and
Naggar National Association for Gun Rights is doing some interesting
good things. Quite a change from where they were just
a few years ago. They've really changed, so that's interesting.
(14:36):
And also it just helps. We've got more good firms
and organizations working on this, so we're going to continue
to make headway. And sometimes it's two steps forward, one
step back, and then you have to appeal, and some
of these they know they're going to have to keep Appealingum, eventually,
I hope fingers crossed knock on wood, that we get
(14:57):
some of these cases back before the Supreme and they
actually give us some solid decisions that tell the courts,
knock it off, the lower courts, we really didn't mean this.
There really is a second Amendment. You really can't continue
to do the things you've been doing again. That takes
time again, that involves having good judges and justices. Again.
That spends us all the way back to the election
(15:19):
that we're facing right now. And we've got mister imperfect
and miss absolutely perfectly awful. This is what we got
right now. Donald Trump is imperfect. Got it, understand it,
get over it, grow up, just quit whiny. For heaven's sakes.
Some people seem to be saying it's like, well, you know,
(15:40):
he cave into pressure. He wasn't good on this, you know,
but he wasn't it. And I said, yeah, it sounds
to me like you're doing the exact same thing when
you say, yeah, I mean he's going to be better
than her, but he's not great. It sounds like you're
equivocating on this. You got to make a decision. I mean,
I guess you don't have to make a decision to
(16:02):
vote for him. You can say I'm not going to
vote Okay, that's a decision to vote for her. I mean, realistically,
it is. And a lot of people don't seem to
understand that, or aren't willing to accept that, or won't
own up to it, or the one I don't get.
And maybe you can help me with this as people say, well,
(16:22):
you know, I don't like her, but I just can't
vote for Trump. Really, why explain that to me? I
just can't vote for Trump? Really? What's behind that? If
you know he's better than the alternative? And in a
(16:43):
real world, an adult world where we look at things
realistically and say, Okay, we don't get perfect, we're just
going to get the best we can get, it appears
to me he's the best we can get. I don't
get the whole I just can't vote for him. Are
you saying that somehow this is more about you than
(17:07):
it is about the election. Is it more about your
self image or how you appear to your friends, or
you want to just stake out this position public or
here's a question. Are people actually just saying that when
they're actually going to vote for him anyway? But somehow
it gives them some sort of social status to be
(17:28):
able to say, I just can't vote for Trump. Really,
well you could, I guess, vote for the woman who's
very openly says you're going to take your guns away.
She's okay sending people with guns to take your guns.
And please understand, this is not an academic exercise. When
(17:51):
they send people to take your guns, they will kill you.
They will shoot you, and they will kill you if
you don't give them your guns. This is not metaphors,
not hyperbole, This is not I mean, this is what
they do. And I love when people say, well, you know,
(18:12):
the police won't actually go door to door confiscates gun. Really,
they will go door to door. They will confiscate your guns.
They already have a list with your address who owns guns.
You can't prevent them from having your name. That's already
(18:33):
out there. So the only question is would you hold
your nose and vote for somebody who will prevent that
from happening. Will you vote for somebody who will put
in judges and justices who will prevent that from happening,
whereas some kind of weird I just can't vote for
(18:54):
Trump self image thing enough to turn you off of that.
I don't know, it's just it's one of those weird thing.
And I thought about it a good bit and I
get it. I mean, I understand that he's not perfect.
I have said the same things. Well, you know, he
supported the bomb stock Man, he did this. Yeah, great,
But when you really bought that down, you go, Okay.
I got two choices or I have one choice between
(19:15):
two options. That's just where we are. Hey, let's grab Maurice.
He called back out of Lake Charles, Louisiana on Lane one. Hey, Marias,
you're on gun talk. What do you have there?
Speaker 9 (19:27):
Well, have you ever been sitting down reading a gun
magazine and saw a gun that you liked and then
tore the page out and run up to the house.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
And ordered it.
Speaker 9 (19:36):
Well, I did that with a with a new taurust depy.
I call my gun shop. Now there was a brand
new gun. I said, okay, can you get one? He
said no. Two days later he called said I got it.
So I had to have a chance to go to
the range with it. I shouted a couple of times
at my little makeshift indoor range. I re losed my
(19:56):
own ambunition, and I was tested to loads, and I
found out something about that gun that so far, everything
I've seen about it, I like. Price point four hundred
and sixty nine dollars for a single action revolver, not
bad at all. Now I got into forty five colds,
but I loaded. I load forty five long cold for
(20:16):
Smith and Wesson that I have. And when I when
I ran the bullets through the press and tried to
run up through the gun, they were too long. So
I laid the cylinder up next to the smith, and
the cylinder on that is actually about I'm not quite
sixteenth a little more than sixteenth inch shorter than on
the smith. So I got to do it some measurements,
(20:38):
and it requires the one point six inch sandy length.
You can't go any longer whereas on that smith you can.
So if you're going to load for that gun, you
better you better let that bullet stick out too. Far
or the cylinder.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Will returned, So you got to stay with the standard
factory length on that if you're handloading. Okay, that's good
to know.
Speaker 9 (21:00):
Great. Yeah, and one thing too about the handloading. I'm
glad you had that little segment. I handload as a hobby.
When I like the idea of making my own bullets
that I take it one self further. I cast my
own bullets that I have for years. And I look
at all these nice Shiver bullets I just cast, said hey,
I made dad, you know, And and I say I
(21:24):
can go out and shoot all. I won't because it's
cheap until I start buying primers.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
Well yeah, and the problem is we can't make our
own primers and we're kind of stuck. Although there are
some kind of I would call off brand primers hit
in the market now, or at least primers I don't
know about. I'm starting to see some people testing them
and they're they're pretty good. So maybe buying primers that
are not the known brands if that's what's available. Don't
be afraid of doing that, Maurice. Look, I appreciate the
(21:53):
range report. Now, I appreciate the story. I just it
didn't really know much about the Taurist Deputy, but it
sounds like a very nice revolver. Look anything in forty
five colt. I'm all about it. Whether you call it
the long colt or the colt, that matter to me.
I don't care. That's a great caliber. All right, eighty
six ' six talk gun. This is gun taking Hey,
(22:20):
gun talks back with you here. I'm Tom Gresham, your host.
You can join us by calling Tom Talk Gun. Couldn't
be easier than that. John figured that out, he called it.
He's online five out of Claremore, Oklahoma. John talk about
the Olympics throughout the idea of three gun at the Olympics.
What do you think?
Speaker 10 (22:41):
I agree with that one hundred percent. But I also
think that probably no shooting event is more fun to
watch than shooting bowling pins.
Speaker 2 (22:51):
Yeah it is, but I mean, can you imagine.
Speaker 10 (22:56):
Where the table is the winner?
Speaker 2 (22:58):
It really is. It's as simple as that you got.
I can't remember five or six pin.
Speaker 10 (23:03):
I don't recall.
Speaker 2 (23:05):
Yeah, it's five or six pins. And the deal is
you got to get them off the table, not just
knocked over. They got to be off the table. So
you're balancing out speed because it's just a speed event.
It's speed versus power. Yeah, you can shoot a forty
four magnum and knock them off, but can you shoot
it quickly? Or when you go with a lesser caliber,
but you may have to hit them two or three
(23:25):
times and knock them off. Kind of fun deal. But yeah, God,
I would love to see a three gun competition at
the Olympics. But we know that's anything I'm going to
use an AR fifteen in that ain't happening. Right then,
you had a thought about elections together.
Speaker 10 (23:44):
I did. I'm seventy one years old, and every election
I've voted in was always a compromise. You pick the
person that checks the most boxes for you, and you
go with that one.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
That's really all there is, isn't it. I mean, I
have never seen anybody who agreed with me on anything,
most certainly including my wife, so you know, and I've
been with her for fifty years. So you just you
do the best you can with the choices you're offered.
Speaker 10 (24:13):
Right, Nobody's ever perfect, now.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
You know, in this case, but in this case it's
really important. It's not like you go, well, you know,
I'll just sit this one out, can't do that this time.
I'm afraid where you're going to have a course correction
at this election. That's going to stay with us for
quite some time. Excuse me, especially if it's Kadell Harris, yes, sir.
Speaker 10 (24:38):
Or a gun owner and a shooter. There only seems
to be one choice this time.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
Yeah, I would agree with you there, Thank you, John,
I appreciate that. Hey, I want to take just a
minute talk about something here. I was having a conversation
with my wife after we were watching the local news.
And we live in a what normally people would say, oh,
this is a safe area. I hear people say that,
we don't go to bad parts, we don't go to
the bad part of town, we don't go to unsafe areas.
(25:06):
And we're watching local news and there's a guy who
escaped from prison and god around the state and this
is one I'm bad dude. I mean, he's got the
full born, you know, the whole I don't know if
be prison tats or whatever, but the facial tattoos of this,
that the record to go with it, violent criminal murder,
(25:28):
all the rest of it. And I'm watching this story
and them talking about how far he went all over
the state, and it occurred to me. And I've said
all the time that people need to get out of
this idea of well, we're in a safe place. I
don't wear my gun because where we are it's safe.
(25:51):
You know what, unsafe can come to you. You don't
have to go to unsafe. It can come to you.
Crazy can show up in front of you at any
given time. Murderers can pop up where you least expect them,
and the problem is you don't know when that's going
(26:12):
to be. And I understand there some people say I'm
just not going to live that way. Okay, you might
die that way, but you could choose not to live
that way. I, on the other hand, choose to take
responsibility for me and my family. I choose to be
my own first responder. And there are a lot of
(26:33):
people who say that and say they do, but I
don't know if they really have the commitment. The commitment involves, yeah,
you got to commit to putting it on every day,
you got to carry that gun every day. But I'm
only going I don't care. You don't know what's there.
(26:54):
You don't know if it's an escaped prisoner who's a murderer.
You don't care. You don't know if it's going to
be some neighbors pitbull who decides to tear your legs
off and kill you. You don't know, if it's just some
goofball road rage nutbar who decides to get his ego
wrapped up and is driving and is going to cut
(27:17):
you off for some perceived slight and come try to
hurt you or your family members. I guess the bottom
line is you don't know. If you knew, then you
can make a course of action based on that. But
since you don't know, since there's a possibility that crazy
(27:38):
pops up, the murderer pops up, and an attack pops up,
what are you going to do about it? Well, Number one,
you got to carry. Number two, you got to get training,
a lot of training. And it's not just how to
shoot training. In fact, actually I would submit that's probably
the least of it. What you really need training on.
What I would encourage you to consider is mental training.
(28:00):
Working on your situational awareness. When you're driving. Are you
looking left and right all the time. It's like a scan,
a pile of the thing we do an instrument scan
and driving I do a scan, I do left right
and near Far. I look to the left of the road,
I look to the right of the road, I look
up right in front of the car, and then I
(28:22):
look way down, look deep down the road, left right,
near Far. While I'm driving, it's just part of what
I do. It's a scan. I want to know what's
going on in a store left right, dear Far, I
want to know what's going on. I want to know
who's there in a restaurant, same thing. And then it's
a case of what am I seeing that doesn't look right?
(28:45):
Here in lies one of our problems. We are socialized
to say, well, you can't make a judgment about somebody
by the way they look. Yes you can. If you
have a brain left in your body, you most certainly
can make a judgment about somebody based on the way
they look and based on the way they act. Now
(29:05):
you have to temper that with common sense and judgment. Okay,
I get that, And they may not be dressed like you.
Who cares? But you can put two and two and
fourteen together and come up with that doesn't look right.
Doesn't mean you're gonna do anything right now. It just
means you're going to start paying close attention to what's
going on, and maybe you start easing yourself out of
(29:27):
the situation, or maybe you just are a bit more alert.
The point is if you can see it, and the
only way you can see it is to be looking
for it. But if you look for it and then
you see it, then you can take an action, which
means you don't have to engage it and you don't
(29:49):
have to use deadly forced to defend yourself. That's a
really good day. As we say, any day you don't
have to shoot somebody is a particularly good day. When
we come back, i'll talk just a little bit more
about this concept of awareness and also who is the
most dangerous person around? Hmm. There's something he hadn't thought
(30:12):
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Speaker 2 (31:20):
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Speaker 12 (31:51):
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Speaker 2 (32:33):
I want to finish up. I thought I had there.
I was remembering. Walt Rausch was a gun writer, former
law enforcement guy, had a very no nonsense way about him.
In one of his books, he was his self defense book.
He was trying to get citizens, like US civilians, if
you will, to understand what cops and law enforcement people understand,
(32:55):
because we citizens don't deal with the bad guys from
where they do. And I mentioned before the break, you
know who's the most dangerous person around? And people will think, oh,
this's the mixed martial arts guy, or it's this guy,
it's that guy. Now it's not. It's the guy who
Walt called the other human in the way he ascribed it.
(33:18):
And the problem is you don't know this person. You
can't recognize this person, and that makes him particularly dangerous.
This person started being beaten when he was very very young,
been physically abused, been emotionally abused, maybe sexually abused, lived
through violence, practiced violence all of his life, had contact
(33:44):
with the criminal justice system throughout his life, has been beaten,
has given beatings, doesn't care. He is a sociopath. Psychopath maybe,
but certainly a sociopath would no more worry about hurting
or killing you. Then he was stepping on a bug.
(34:04):
And as I say, doesn't wear a sign. This says
that's who he is. That's your most dangerous person, the
one that you don't recognize, You don't know, and it
will hurt you without even thinking about it. Will sircer,
you will stalk, you will get your pumping gas and
(34:26):
you're wonder, what's what's that person in over there? Well,
that may be a really dangerous person. I was just
reading a piece online and it was saying, and the
hope is that if you end up having contact with
that person, you need to flip that around and that
person is no longer the most dangerous person. You have
(34:46):
sucked that title out and put it on yourself, and
you now have become the most dangerous person in the world,
because if you are not that most dangerous person or
the few seconds, you may not survive. What I'm describing
as a way of thinking, in a way of preparing
(35:10):
and a situational awareness and understanding what's going on around you.
You got to look for it before you can see it,
and once you see it, you got to make a
decision on how you got to act, or at least
have a bit of a plan. And then if you
end up getting into it, swift, absolutely violent, savage reaction
(35:31):
is what will save your life. This does not come
naturally to most of us. You have to go get
training and how to change the way you think, as
well as develop the skills you need. A lot of
those lines are I'm a switch. Just for a second,
we are going to have a class arrange reading studios
with Steve Trani and Max Michelle is. Tarranni is the
(35:54):
hand to hand, knife club, everything else guide. Obviously Max
Michelle is world class pistol shooter. That's going to be
a fascinating class if you're interested in that kind of thing.
I guess what I'm asking you to do, or urging
you to do, is to take a hard look at yourself.
(36:15):
And all I'm doing is asking you to make yourself safe.
I want you to be safer. I want you to
be have a safer family. And these are conversations you
can have with your family without scaring them. You have
to figure out how you present it. But it's awareness.
If you're sitting in the restaurant, you can ask, you know,
who's sitting behind you, what's that conversation going on over there? Well,
(36:39):
I don't I haven't been paying attention. Well that's the point,
isn't it. You need to be paying attention. You know,
you're pumping gas when you get out of your car,
or even before you get out of your car. Who's
walking around outside? Here? Is that guy standing over there
just been staring there at you the whole time. He's
leaning up against the wall. He was there when he
(37:00):
got there. He's just staring. He's not doing anything. He
wondered what does all that about? I don't know, And
maybe it's not a problem, but it's probably worth paying
attention to and keeping your focus there. Typically a lot
of people worth actually literally look away from something like that.
I don't want to cause any embarrassment. I don't want
(37:21):
this person to think that I've singled him out because
he looks a certain way. That's a fool's Errand you
look at him, you steer at him, you let him
know I see you over there. I'm looking at you.
I am not the easy prey. I am not the
(37:41):
slow wounded impalla at the back of the herd. And
if you can be the predator, but I am not
here to play with you, and I am not here
to be your prey today. He had a strong look,
an upright posture, A swell of the head identifies you
as somebody who knows what's going on, is paying attention.
(38:03):
You know, we have a saying about that. People go
through the parking lots and they're staring at their phone,
they're looking down at their keys, they're not paying attention
to anything around. If you look like food, you will
be eating. You look like the easy target to take down.
(38:25):
If you're preoccupied in talking on your phone, and lord knows,
if you're texting on your phone with your head down,
you now have become the wound. It's low impella and
you can well expect a lion to take you down.
It's about changing the way you live so that you
have a safer life. Yeah, I know it may not
(38:48):
be if you everybody, but if you're serious about this,
you need to make it for you. We'll be right
back by the way. I'm looking at the Olympics and
the shooters there, they're incredibly good. Question, does your shooting suck?
(39:11):
Could you be better at shooting? Well, do something about it.
Go take a lesson somewhere if you're outkare with a shotgun, rifle, pistol.
There are classes everywhere. Now, there are trainers everywhere, and
you would be stunned if you've never taken a class.
You can be amazed at how much a good trainer
can help you in a really short period of time,
(39:31):
very quickly, you can become a better shooter than you
are now. So if your shooting sucks, do something about it. Okay, Hey,
if you want to be part of the after show,
give me a call right now. Eight six y six
talk gun. Let's go talk with Joe in Jefferson, Texas. Hey, Joe,
thanks for your patience here.
Speaker 13 (39:49):
On all right, chom, just real quick, anybody on the
fence about voting for Trump. Let's put it like is
it's like shooting the high point pistol. I'd be the
greatest thing in your arsenal, but it's better than nothing
at all, And when.
Speaker 2 (40:06):
You need it, you need it more than anything else.
Speaker 13 (40:08):
Right, that's right. It's not my every day Carrie but
I got one, and I'm proud to own it because
it does run. It just it's like carrying a break.
Speaker 2 (40:19):
There you go, that'll work. Hey, I love the analogy
very good. Just to know what it's what you need
at the moment, and it may not be what you'd
like to have, but it's what you got and it'll
get the job done. I appreciate that. Very well done.
By the way, I don't really know. I mean, all
I can do is throw out my thoughts on this.
(40:40):
If you have any ideas on better ways to explain
the election, or maybe you want to try to tell
me why you won't vote for Trump even though you
own guns and support the Second Amendment, I'd love to
hear about that. You can call me right now eight
six six Talk Gun. We can get you into the
after show. By the way, after show, it's just part
of the podcast version of this show. So however, you
(41:02):
get your podcasts, and I would suggest that you have
a regular podcast app to get the Gun Talk podcast
because right now I'm just seeing that Ryan has interviewed
Vincent Hancock, who just won gold at the Olympics. We're
talking with Steve Trani. We have other podcasts as well
as the gun Talk radio show that you're listening to
right now. So get a regular podcast app and just download.
(41:27):
It'll automatically download gun Talk once't you subscribe to it.
So if you want to be a part of that
after show, call me eight sixty six Talk Gun. I
do like that analogy of you know, any gun is
better than no gun in a gunfight. That's really what
he was saying. Rule number one in a gunfight is
to have a gun. Rule number one in a political
(41:47):
fight about gun rights is to have somebody who will
support your rights, or you can flip it around, somebody
who will not try to strip you of your gun rights.
Whether you think Donald Trump is perfect, I can just
clue you in He's not. Okay, he's not perfect. All
(42:08):
he is is better than the alternative. And I think
is my belief that this election is going to make
a course change in American politics where we are, especially
when it comes to gun rights in the Second Amendment.
I think if we get Harris, we're going to get
eight years of her. I honestly don't know how you
(42:31):
we survive twelve years of Biden and then eight years
of Harris. As far as gun rights, because a few wins,
then she's going to bring in the down ballot. We'll
have they'll have control of the Senate, they'll get all
the judges and justices they want. I just try to envision.
(42:52):
I don't know how we survive that. I really don't.
I don't know how the Second Amendment survives that, honestly.
So that's kind of where we are. Time. I'm going
to ask you to do a thing. Talk this up,
talk with your friends about it, have real world adult conversations,
and you can do it at the shooting range. Invite
them to go shooting with you. You can even bring
the AMMO. That's okay, you can provide that AMMO. It's worthwhile.
(43:15):
Have some fun out there, get them laughing, get them
to having fun, and then you can weave into politics too.
It's all right, you can do that. You're not going
to spend anybody. Hey, I'm Tom Gregson. Thank you so much.
Check us out at gun talk dot com and over
on Twitter. I am at gun Talk. We'll see you
next week.
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