March 15, 2025 • 34 mins
John Zeaman, award-winning journalist and author, recently released his book, Dog Walks Man: A Six-Legged Odyssey. During the podcast, I asked John to share with me why he wrote the book about the added benefits he discovered from walking his dog. In addition, he also provided an overview of the book, discussed his background as an art critic and how it helped him to write his book, and what makes a walk with a dog more meaningful than simply walking alone. If you’ve ever wanted to know more about the metaphysical joys of walking with your dog, be sure and listen to this episode.
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
You're listening to Petlife Radio dot com.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Welcome to Animal Rights on pet Life Radio. I'm your
host as always, Timlink really pleased to be here today.
We've got an exciting show again today, so I want
to thank everybody for joining us. My guest today is
award winning journalist and author John Zeeman. John's here to
talk to us about his recently released book, Dog Walks Man,
(00:28):
a Six Legged Odyssey. Really great book. It's it's humorous,
it's thoughtful, it's an absorbing narrative, and you know, it
deals sort of with you know, everything with dogs. But
also we're talking about sort of a metaphysical joys of
just the simple task of walking your dog. And I
think people sometimes often feel that walking the dog is
a little bit of a chore. So we're gonna teach
me maybe a little bit about how to actually enjoy
(00:50):
it and actually tap into your inner consciousness there. So
it's gonna be it's gonna be really cool. So we
look forward to talking to John. But before we get started,
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stay tuned. We'll be back with John Zeeman to talk
to us about his book Dog walks Man, a six
(02:57):
Legged Odyssey. You're listening to Animal Rights on pet Life Radio.
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Let's talk pets on petlife Radio dot com.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
Welcome back to Animal Rights on pet Life Radio. Thanks
for joining me today. I got an exciting guest with
a great new book out joining me today as award
winning journalist and author John Zeemany. And John has recently
released his book Dog Walks Man, a six Legged Odyssey.
So John, Welcome to Animal Rights on pet Life Radio.
Speaker 8 (06:16):
Thanks Tim. Glad to be here.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
Oh we're glad to have you. Now, this is an
exciting new book. I love the perspective because we're not
only talking about our wonderful dogs, and we're talking about
the benefits and everything about walking your dog and what
you should do, but also a little bit about the
joys behind it and some of the things that you
should really take advantage of when you're out walking the dog.
So tell us a little bit about the book, and hey,
(06:38):
he came about to write it.
Speaker 8 (06:39):
I began walking my dogs about twenty years ago, and
I was at the time. I was a new father
and new also to the suburbs, having moved to a
suburb of New York City from the city and a
very different kind of hborhood. We've lived in a loft
(07:03):
former zipper factory actually, and had moved to a suburb
for the kids, and they wanted a dog. And so
after trying out a succession of smaller easier to care for,
it seemed to us at the time pets. Having very
(07:25):
small pets can be more traumatic, given that you know,
so many of them seemed to meet terrible ends. The
Gerbils would eat their babies and so on. So finally
we decided we needed a real pet that was sort
of on the same scale, lived on the same level
(07:47):
that we did. And we got a dog, a standard poodle,
and in the beginning, everybody was expected to share in
the care of the animal. I think that's a very
typical thing that families start out with those kinds of intentions.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
That's right, kids, if we get you a dog, you're
going to take care of it, right. Oh yes, yes, yes, all.
Speaker 8 (08:08):
The kids cerewana and they did do. They would help
to feed it, and they would take it out on
them walks. But once the novelty wears off, and kids
nowadays are very busy, they have these very scheduled lives,
and I became by default the family dog walker, and
(08:28):
it started a series of discoveries where totally unexpectedly, this
activity became a bigger and bigger part of my life.
I wasn't a retired person with nothing else to do.
I had and have a very rewarding job as an
(08:49):
art critic, and I get to go to museums in
the day and look at paintings and write about that.
So I had outside interests, so to speak. But nevertheless,
this seeming task or chore sort of crept up on
me as something in a kind of a sneaky way.
(09:11):
It became more and more interesting, and in the beginning,
I think it's more like a kind The first thing
it reminded me of, I guess, is childhood, because for
the first time in a long time, I was regularly
going out with no particular purpose really or direction. I
(09:34):
mean it was purpose was to take the dog and
take care of its needs, but beyond that we could
go anywhere or stay out as long as we wanted.
And it was that sort of aimlessness, that sense of
doing having unexpected experiences, unplanned things that reminded me of
(09:54):
when I was a kid and you would just go out.
And when you're with a dog, the dog has a
kind of juvenile nature. Dogs are very fun, loving and curious.
They're like kids in a way, and so that spirit
is infectious and you find yourself getting as excited in
(10:16):
a way, not as visibly perhaps with the dog. When
you tell a dog it's going out, they they practically
turn themselves inside out. And it's just but that is
there's something you know that communicates to you, and you
find yourself you know this is going to be something.
(10:36):
You know. They're so certain that you're going to have
this experience, experience something an adventure, so to speak. But
I think then I began to realize that I was
sort of connecting with a with an ancient relationship that
when people formed this partnership with dogs in the very
(11:00):
beginning in prehistory, it wasn't about sitting around in in
your you know, in your cave, surrounded by all your
creature comforts and petting your dog at your side. It
was really about going out and whether it was to
hunt in and the dog, with its superior sense of
(11:20):
smell and its hearing UH, added to the to the
you made, you know, extended the senses of the hunter
and finding game and tracking and treeing animals in UH,
later in domess hurting domesticated animals, or pulling sleds, or
or guarding the home or even fighting. UH. They had jobs.
(11:46):
And but at the beginning, the basis of all these
jobs that dogs do was that you went out, you
left the den. And that also reflects an instinctive behavior
in dogs that people observe the behavior of wolves in
the wild. They'll go out several times a day just
(12:09):
the reconnoiter, not necessarily to go hunting. Or to look
for a mate, but just to walk around their territories,
see what happened, what the storm did last night.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
Yeah, just to sort of be in the moment and
get in touch with the world.
Speaker 8 (12:24):
Well, that's it's adaptive to know what's out there and
how that environment may have changed, and who's been by
which dogs are very good at. So so I've you know,
this feeling of sort of of connection that the dog
and I we're doing something that felt right in going out,
(12:45):
and then I felt much closer to my dog when
I was out than I did in the house. I
think because in the house the dog is so clueless
really about so many things a dog can't really. I mean, people,
I think like to imagine that they're doing can do
all these things with them and watch television and look
at the computer and so on. But I think the
(13:08):
truth is that that that they don't. They're they're they're
not privy to phone conversations and they have I don't
think any idea what you're doing when you're either talking
on the phone, or if you sit and talk on
the phone and you get mad and you yell at somebody,
as I did once h a store clerk about something,
and I looked at my dog was under the table.
(13:29):
Because of course they don't see anyone else in the room.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
They figure it's got to be them.
Speaker 8 (13:35):
So you get out and you put all those electronic devices,
hopefully I mean less nowadays people bring them. But you're
leaving a lot behind, and you're leaving your human life,
much of it behind as well, and all the concerns
that go with that, the things you have to do
your job, and the bills and some of you're You're
out in this much more innocent kind of exploratory activity.
(14:00):
And in my case, being new both to the suburbs
in general and in to my particular neighborhood, I was
ready for this exploration. We were. And of course you
meet people, and you see late at night, you see
how many animals live right in your neighborhood that you
(14:20):
might not notice, for the raccoons and the possums, and
even the foxes or deer depending on where you live,
and all kinds of things begin. You see things, and
that I think is the most important. And maybe because
I'm an art critic, seeing new things and sensitivity to
(14:42):
landscapes and made me very receptive to this. But I
think it's there for anybody if you want to pay attention.
And pretty soon I just found that there were so
many things in my life that were tied up with
this activity, getting most of my exercise from it. I
(15:05):
was getting some of my best thinking done. I'd be
out in the morning and ideas once I got walking
and we were out, and this sense of being alive,
and suddenly I would figure out some problem that I've
been working on, something to do with my job or whatever.
You step away from your life and you get a
perspective on it and you enter this zone. I guess,
(15:29):
this state of mind that you return to, and I
began to look for while there places nearby. You began
to get tired. Once you've dog walked for a while,
you want to get somewhere. You want to let your
(15:49):
dog free, if possible. You don't want to just go
around the block over and over again, Like I remember
writing in the book and thinking to myself time it's
like on a monopoly board. It can get very tedious
if you don't exercise a little imagination and give yourself
to that sense of adventure. And so in my case,
(16:11):
that's why I guess the book is called an odyssey
because it was about traveling through a series of what
I call fringe places, places that are every town or
wherever you live, there are these little pockets left and
fewer than there were when I was a kid, but
almost little places that you sought out when you were
(16:32):
a kid, that woulds behind the shopping center, the abandoned lot,
the place where you could go and build a hut maybe,
or play war games, or make a dam, and some
little stream that those kinds of places are the same
places you go looking for as a dog walker, because
you can let your dog loops there. You're a little outside.
(16:53):
Just like as a kid, you get away from your
parental supervision, you went outside the you're alone in this
fringy place, and so you go there as a dog walker.
You can let your dog go and a much more
natural condition for walking. I never really took to the leash.
(17:15):
They always say dog You know all this part I
never got into. This is not the kind of book
you can read to find out how to make your
dog heal or how to be happy you're walking together
on a leash necessarily.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
Yeah, this is more about getting back in touch with
the world, the nature around you, and your animal get
in touch with them as well. Well, John, we're going
to go to a quick commercial break, but I want
to come back to you and talk to you a
little bit about that. But I also want to talk
about the some of the other books that you've written
and how this one may be a little bit different
in the process of writing it. So everybody say tuned.
We're with John Ziemon talking about his book Dog Walks Man,
(17:49):
a six Legged Odyssey. You're listening to Animal Rights on
pet Life Radio.
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Speaker 2 (20:04):
Com Welcome back, Welcome back, everybody. This is Animal Rights
on pet Life Radio. It's your host Tim Blink and
I'm here with John Ziemon today talking about his wonderful
book Dog Walks Man. Now, John, we were talking right
before the break about how, you know, we with going
out with our dog, whether we're talking about walking them
(20:24):
on a leash or getting them out and let him
run about. You know, it really gives us the opportunity
to get back in touch with with nature, find all
these unique places like you had mentioned with when we
were children, we found all these wonderful little hiding places
that our parents didn't know about, and they sort of
made our own little kingdom. How did your dog come
into play with that? I mean, does your dog enjoy
finding those little fringe places and help you locate those
(20:46):
places as well?
Speaker 8 (20:47):
Well? They can? I think in my case, it was
just getting tired of the leash and thinking about it
a little bit and being willing to put a little
more effort into you know, where could we go and
thinking about, well, there's the woods I know about, and
maybe we'd have to put the dog in a car,
but that would be better, I think than what we
(21:09):
were doing. And so it was really it's the dog's
enthusiasm for these places, the way they take to them
once you find them. But often I think it's human
intelligence and the knowledge of a town or a place
that you rely on. And in my case, there was
a small woods about seven blocks from my house that
(21:32):
only maybe fourteen acres are pretty small, hardly a real
not a forest or hardly a woods, but there was
enough of a woods that you could feel that you
were away, a little bit away from civilization. And we
would walk through these trails and some when they created
(21:53):
this place and they called it a nature area, they
made more trails than you really needed, just but it
increased the complexity the possible paths you could take. And anyway,
we trapsed around that place for about five years, and
from there I discovered there was where I lived in
(22:16):
New Jersey. We were right at the edge of the
northern end of the New Jersey Meadowlands, which is enjoys
a kind of notorious reputation where gangsters would you know,
finish off their rivals and people would dump toxic chemicals
(22:37):
and you know, and there was a lot of that,
but not so much where we are, although there had
been dumping, and years ago it had been used as
a landfill, and then the landfill had been capped, and
you know, you've seen those places where they you know,
they put a big layer of dirt over and then
you know, it sometimes looks sort of like a mound
(22:59):
where we were because it had started out as the
meadowlands are naturally marshy and swampy, it had just everything
had kind of sunk down, I guess, and so what
you saw was fields and still some marshy areas. But
because of the reputation, nobody in town went near the place.
(23:21):
And yet it was huge. We're in a very densely
populated area in northern New Jersey and a mile or
so from the George Washington Bridge, one of the busiest,
the busiest carbridge in the world, I think, and here
was this little wilderness, as it turned out to be,
(23:43):
that was kind of like the enchanted forest in a story,
or the forbidden forest, the place in the fairy tales
where you're not supposed to go there. And for ten years,
like everybody else in town, I just kind of ignored it.
But one day I got the idea. I think I
heard some kids and motorbikes were in there, and I
never realized that there was enough solid ground in there
(24:05):
that you could do that. And I got curious and
we crossed over this little stream or canal to get
I had to walk on a plank just like a kid,
and then we were in there. And this turned out
to be a kind of a paradise for us, because
it had been left alone for so long that it
(24:27):
had really reverted to a natural, almost kind of primeval place.
It was wilder than any nature area I've ever been
to because nobody was managing it. What grew there was
just what grew naturally, and nobody was trimming it. Nobody
was taking out the fallen trees or doing any of
that kind of maintenance work that keeps or putting chips
(24:50):
and cutting trails or anything like that. When trails were
sort of there because people stomped down the reeds. And
I found that it was possible to to get lost
in there, and that was a kind of a wonderful
feeling in a way, not literally lost in that they
thought I wouldn't get out, not knowing exactly where I was.
(25:12):
I could hear the hum of the New Jersey Turnpike
but I and my dog was in heaven because the
place was filled with animals living wild lives, and he
was raising them all these little Kirby trails and dogs.
I discovered love a path or a trail, And there's
a chapter in my book just about the joy of
(25:35):
being on the trail, on a path with your dog,
and the running ahead of you and coming around the bend.
And there was a place we used to come to.
It was a little pool of kind of like a waterhole,
we called it. And my dog because there were attracted animals.
There would often be a heron there's something waiting in there,
(25:58):
or an animal or a muskrat, or there was often
something there, and my dog would I'd always be hurrying
off trying to catch up to my dog because he
would get there ahead of me, and I'd get there
and I'd see just these sort of spreading rings on
the water or some rustling in the brush, and I
would miss it. And I became very intent on trying to,
(26:22):
you know, experiencing this this wild place, and it gave
me this great feeling of to be out there exploring
and seeing, say a fox. I remember how founded I
was to's just see a fox out rising chasing another animal,
and it was just like, you know, I realized that
(26:42):
here right by my house, these experiences that people imagine
that you have to travel hundreds of miles to have,
or to go way out to Yosemite or something, that
I could have this and nobody at town. It was
like an open secret there. It was anybody could go there,
but people didn't know it. And without a dog, I
never would have done that. And one thing led to another.
(27:05):
Pretty soon I had a companion, the king, who I
had told about some of my experiences, and even though
he didn't have a dog, he wanted to come just
for the exercise and the conversation. And so one thing
leads to another, and it all seems to come back
to this what started out as this very simple chore.
(27:26):
And I, you know, eventually my kids grew up. I
no longer had the excuse of being the dutiful father,
but I had become attached. This had become this essential
thing in my life that I had to do. And
so as my first dog died, and that you know,
it was very sad, and as we got to the
point where he really didn't want to go out, especially
(27:49):
in the winter, and I was the one that needed
to go out now, and I can remember trying to
coax him and I got ramps to get him into
the car and ways that we could continue to do
this activity. We had gotten a second dog by this time.
It kind of rejuvenated the older dog for a number
of years, but eventually time catches up the dogs too fast.
Speaker 2 (28:11):
Yeah, unfortunately.
Speaker 8 (28:13):
So I have now the second dog that I got
when he was alive, and and now a third as
his companion. So I've gotten used to having two dogs,
which really makes it important to kind of get out
somewhere where you can get away from the leash, because
it's not walking two dogs on a leaf.
Speaker 2 (28:31):
Keep dog.
Speaker 8 (28:34):
I've seen neighbors of mine, you know, the father, you know,
with the dog entangling the leash around these legs because
people have those expandable leashes now and they look like
they're doing some kind of lassuse trick.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
Exactly now, John, real quick, We got a couple more
minutes here. But I want to ask you, know you
you've also written the series of children's books, and you
have a book on for young adults. How is the
process of writing this book different from writing for children
and for young adults.
Speaker 8 (29:02):
Well, it was much harder in the sense that for
the longest time I wasn't really sure what kind of
book this was. And I had read a few dog books,
but I didn't really want to read a lot of
dog books because I didn't think that my book was
like that exactly, because it was more about It wasn't
focused essentially on the dog, but what the world that
(29:23):
a dog brought you into, in this world that the
two of you shared, right, And so it wasn't like
the book that really tells the story of the relationship
with the dog. And I didn't like I didn't want
to answer morphize and try to turn my dog into
a person, because what I like about my dogs are
those qualities that are different from humans. So I didn't
(29:46):
know what kind of book it was, and it was
to tell you the truth I was most I found
that it had the most in common with books about
fishing and people who discover through fishing, who kind of
get beyond all the you know, I'm going to catch
the biggest fish or so on, and there's some spiritual
(30:06):
like you know, a river runs through it, a kind
of a spiritual feeling enters into it exactly and it's
more about what they see in nature and what they
feel out there than how many fish they catch. And
it's you know, it's a kind of a meditative thing.
And dog walking is something that happens twice a day
actually fits a pattern that if you've ever been told
(30:27):
by a doctor or somebody or wanted to try a
relaxation exercise or to meditate, or they'll tell you half
hour in the morning and a half hour in the evening.
Speaker 2 (30:38):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 8 (30:38):
What do you know that's that's the dog.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
That's the dog walk. Yeah, exactly. Now, I tell people
all the time when we talk about you going into meditation,
a lot of people think that you have to set
their legs crossing, a lotus position, chanting. But one of
the best ways to do it is to go out
with your dog, go out for a dog walk, mix
it up a little bit, go to those new places,
and it really just clears your mind and lets you
think of things that it just all becomes clear at
(31:02):
that point.
Speaker 8 (31:03):
Meditation was always too hard for me to tell you
the truth of the idea that I would have to
clear my mind of my thoughts, and I was always
sort of chasing my tail when I was trying to meditate,
but being out having it's like Western style meditation perhaps,
but it does make you pay attention and you do.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
See things that's right.
Speaker 8 (31:22):
That's the work, and I think that's that's a form
of attention, learning how to read, center yourself. And there's
a great sense of well being that you get from it.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Absolutely, and that's what you're gonna learn when you read
Dog Walks Man. That's why you know. I think the
great thing about the book it gets you connected with dogs.
We always love to hear stories about dogs. More importantly,
get you reconnected with the earth, the world around you,
and your inner self. The books available everywhere, but you
can also go to John Zeman dot com it's j
O H N z E A M A n. Or
(31:54):
as always can go to pat Life Radio dot com
click on the animal rights tab and will lead you
to the book as well. So John, I want to
thank you for coming on the show today. It's a
great book. Congratulations. I wish you the very best and
keep us posted on all those wonderful journeys and odyssees
that you go on. It's never thanks ever and you're welcome.
(32:16):
You're welcome. So we're coming to the end of the
show today. I want to thank once again everybody for
listening to Animal Rights on pet Life Radio. I also
want to thank John Zeman for coming on board. Pick
up a copy of his book, Dog Walks Man's Great
Book and get back in touch with your dog in
the world around you and to swellows your inner self.
So thanks to John Zemon for being on the show today.
(32:36):
I want to thank all the sponsors and producers are
putting on a fabulous show as usual. Now to find
out more about me and other guests that I've interviewed
on the Animal Rights Show and stories, so you can
check it out by visiting my blog which is Animal
Rights and you can go to pet Life Radio petlife
radio dot com click on Animal Rights, read the blogs,
listen to the shows, listen to the other shows we've recorded,
(32:57):
and while you're there, check out all the other hosts
and shows. The great cavalcade of interesting guests and hosts
that we have on pet Life Radio and you can
catch it all at pet life radio dot com. If
you have any questions, comments, or ideas for the show,
people that you'd like for me to interview on the show,
drop me a line you can drop me an email
at timat petlifradio dot com. It's Tim at petlife radio
dot com. Now I'll do my very best to answer
(33:19):
your questions, entertain your comments, and get the people you
want the most on the show. So until next time,
write a great story about the animals in your life,
share it on a blog, article, or in a book,
and who knows, you may be the next guest on
animal rights on pet Life Radio. Have a great day.
Speaker 7 (33:36):
Let's talk pets every week on demand only on petlfradio
dot com.
Speaker 4 (34:00):
A constattag
You're listening to Petlife Radio dot com.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Welcome to Animal Rights on pet Life Radio. I'm your
host as always, Timlink really pleased to be here today.
We've got an exciting show again today, so I want
to thank everybody for joining us. My guest today is
award winning journalist and author John Zeeman. John's here to
talk to us about his recently released book, Dog Walks Man,
(00:28):
a Six Legged Odyssey. Really great book. It's it's humorous,
it's thoughtful, it's an absorbing narrative, and you know, it
deals sort of with you know, everything with dogs. But
also we're talking about sort of a metaphysical joys of
just the simple task of walking your dog. And I
think people sometimes often feel that walking the dog is
a little bit of a chore. So we're gonna teach
me maybe a little bit about how to actually enjoy
(00:50):
it and actually tap into your inner consciousness there. So
it's gonna be it's gonna be really cool. So we
look forward to talking to John. But before we get started,
you know, I always like to leave you some help,
will hints, tidbits, things in the news, things I think
they're interesting, and hopefully you'll find them interesting. As well,
and today I'd like to talk to you about Remind
my Pet service, Remind my Pet service, and that's a
(01:12):
great little service that has started. You know, if you're
like me, sometimes it's difficult to remember everything that you
need to do in a given day. For me, if
it's not written down somewhere, or if it's not posted
on a sticky note, I'll never remember it. So if
you've ever found yourself in a difficult to remember situation
when it's time to give your pet his or her
(01:33):
next dose of medication, that's where remind my Pet will
come into play. It's great solution, great service. Give you
a little bit of detail about it. There's a website
where you can register your pets medication requirements and remind
my Pet will send you a text or email reminder
the day it is due, so once you're registered, you
don't have to remember anything else. They contact you to
(01:55):
give you your reminder and you can get your fluffy
or your spot all sco wear it away, so you
can now, you know, save a tree, save some sticky notes,
you know, have someone else do all the work. So
the service called Remind my Pet. For more information about
Remind my Pet, service. You can go to my blog,
the Animal Rights Blog on pet Life Radio pet Life
(02:16):
radio dot com. Click on the link to the website
to the blog, and while you're at it, remember to
request your free emergency Save my Pet stickers from Remind
my Pet as well, so they'll give you some freebies
and you post those on all your windows and doors
to make sure that you keep your pet nice and
safe in case of emergency. So that's my little help
(02:36):
will hint. For today's Remind my Pet. Go to the
Animal Rights Blog on pet Life Radio's pet Life Radio
dot com. Click on Animal Rights and read a little
bit more about it and find out about how you
can sign up for this free, wonderful service. So we're
gonna go into little bit of commercial break, but everybody
stay tuned. We'll be back with John Zeeman to talk
to us about his book Dog walks Man, a six
(02:57):
Legged Odyssey. You're listening to Animal Rights on pet Life Radio.
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Let's talk pets on petlife Radio dot com.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
Welcome back to Animal Rights on pet Life Radio. Thanks
for joining me today. I got an exciting guest with
a great new book out joining me today as award
winning journalist and author John Zeemany. And John has recently
released his book Dog Walks Man, a six Legged Odyssey.
So John, Welcome to Animal Rights on pet Life Radio.
Speaker 8 (06:16):
Thanks Tim. Glad to be here.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
Oh we're glad to have you. Now, this is an
exciting new book. I love the perspective because we're not
only talking about our wonderful dogs, and we're talking about
the benefits and everything about walking your dog and what
you should do, but also a little bit about the
joys behind it and some of the things that you
should really take advantage of when you're out walking the dog.
So tell us a little bit about the book, and hey,
(06:38):
he came about to write it.
Speaker 8 (06:39):
I began walking my dogs about twenty years ago, and
I was at the time. I was a new father
and new also to the suburbs, having moved to a
suburb of New York City from the city and a
very different kind of hborhood. We've lived in a loft
(07:03):
former zipper factory actually, and had moved to a suburb
for the kids, and they wanted a dog. And so
after trying out a succession of smaller easier to care for,
it seemed to us at the time pets. Having very
(07:25):
small pets can be more traumatic, given that you know,
so many of them seemed to meet terrible ends. The
Gerbils would eat their babies and so on. So finally
we decided we needed a real pet that was sort
of on the same scale, lived on the same level
(07:47):
that we did. And we got a dog, a standard poodle,
and in the beginning, everybody was expected to share in
the care of the animal. I think that's a very
typical thing that families start out with those kinds of intentions.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
That's right, kids, if we get you a dog, you're
going to take care of it, right. Oh yes, yes, yes, all.
Speaker 8 (08:08):
The kids cerewana and they did do. They would help
to feed it, and they would take it out on
them walks. But once the novelty wears off, and kids
nowadays are very busy, they have these very scheduled lives,
and I became by default the family dog walker, and
(08:28):
it started a series of discoveries where totally unexpectedly, this
activity became a bigger and bigger part of my life.
I wasn't a retired person with nothing else to do.
I had and have a very rewarding job as an
(08:49):
art critic, and I get to go to museums in
the day and look at paintings and write about that.
So I had outside interests, so to speak. But nevertheless,
this seeming task or chore sort of crept up on
me as something in a kind of a sneaky way.
(09:11):
It became more and more interesting, and in the beginning,
I think it's more like a kind The first thing
it reminded me of, I guess, is childhood, because for
the first time in a long time, I was regularly
going out with no particular purpose really or direction. I
(09:34):
mean it was purpose was to take the dog and
take care of its needs, but beyond that we could
go anywhere or stay out as long as we wanted.
And it was that sort of aimlessness, that sense of
doing having unexpected experiences, unplanned things that reminded me of
(09:54):
when I was a kid and you would just go out.
And when you're with a dog, the dog has a
kind of juvenile nature. Dogs are very fun, loving and curious.
They're like kids in a way, and so that spirit
is infectious and you find yourself getting as excited in
(10:16):
a way, not as visibly perhaps with the dog. When
you tell a dog it's going out, they they practically
turn themselves inside out. And it's just but that is
there's something you know that communicates to you, and you
find yourself you know this is going to be something.
(10:36):
You know. They're so certain that you're going to have
this experience, experience something an adventure, so to speak. But
I think then I began to realize that I was
sort of connecting with a with an ancient relationship that
when people formed this partnership with dogs in the very
(11:00):
beginning in prehistory, it wasn't about sitting around in in
your you know, in your cave, surrounded by all your
creature comforts and petting your dog at your side. It
was really about going out and whether it was to
hunt in and the dog, with its superior sense of
(11:20):
smell and its hearing UH, added to the to the
you made, you know, extended the senses of the hunter
and finding game and tracking and treeing animals in UH,
later in domess hurting domesticated animals, or pulling sleds, or
or guarding the home or even fighting. UH. They had jobs.
(11:46):
And but at the beginning, the basis of all these
jobs that dogs do was that you went out, you
left the den. And that also reflects an instinctive behavior
in dogs that people observe the behavior of wolves in
the wild. They'll go out several times a day just
(12:09):
the reconnoiter, not necessarily to go hunting. Or to look
for a mate, but just to walk around their territories,
see what happened, what the storm did last night.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
Yeah, just to sort of be in the moment and
get in touch with the world.
Speaker 8 (12:24):
Well, that's it's adaptive to know what's out there and
how that environment may have changed, and who's been by
which dogs are very good at. So so I've you know,
this feeling of sort of of connection that the dog
and I we're doing something that felt right in going out,
(12:45):
and then I felt much closer to my dog when
I was out than I did in the house. I
think because in the house the dog is so clueless
really about so many things a dog can't really. I mean, people,
I think like to imagine that they're doing can do
all these things with them and watch television and look
at the computer and so on. But I think the
(13:08):
truth is that that that they don't. They're they're they're
not privy to phone conversations and they have I don't
think any idea what you're doing when you're either talking
on the phone, or if you sit and talk on
the phone and you get mad and you yell at somebody,
as I did once h a store clerk about something,
and I looked at my dog was under the table.
(13:29):
Because of course they don't see anyone else in the room.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
They figure it's got to be them.
Speaker 8 (13:35):
So you get out and you put all those electronic devices,
hopefully I mean less nowadays people bring them. But you're
leaving a lot behind, and you're leaving your human life,
much of it behind as well, and all the concerns
that go with that, the things you have to do
your job, and the bills and some of you're You're
out in this much more innocent kind of exploratory activity.
(14:00):
And in my case, being new both to the suburbs
in general and in to my particular neighborhood, I was
ready for this exploration. We were. And of course you
meet people, and you see late at night, you see
how many animals live right in your neighborhood that you
(14:20):
might not notice, for the raccoons and the possums, and
even the foxes or deer depending on where you live,
and all kinds of things begin. You see things, and
that I think is the most important. And maybe because
I'm an art critic, seeing new things and sensitivity to
(14:42):
landscapes and made me very receptive to this. But I
think it's there for anybody if you want to pay attention.
And pretty soon I just found that there were so
many things in my life that were tied up with
this activity, getting most of my exercise from it. I
(15:05):
was getting some of my best thinking done. I'd be
out in the morning and ideas once I got walking
and we were out, and this sense of being alive,
and suddenly I would figure out some problem that I've
been working on, something to do with my job or whatever.
You step away from your life and you get a
perspective on it and you enter this zone. I guess,
(15:29):
this state of mind that you return to, and I
began to look for while there places nearby. You began
to get tired. Once you've dog walked for a while,
you want to get somewhere. You want to let your
(15:49):
dog free, if possible. You don't want to just go
around the block over and over again, Like I remember
writing in the book and thinking to myself time it's
like on a monopoly board. It can get very tedious
if you don't exercise a little imagination and give yourself
to that sense of adventure. And so in my case,
(16:11):
that's why I guess the book is called an odyssey
because it was about traveling through a series of what
I call fringe places, places that are every town or
wherever you live, there are these little pockets left and
fewer than there were when I was a kid, but
almost little places that you sought out when you were
(16:32):
a kid, that woulds behind the shopping center, the abandoned lot,
the place where you could go and build a hut maybe,
or play war games, or make a dam, and some
little stream that those kinds of places are the same
places you go looking for as a dog walker, because
you can let your dog loops there. You're a little outside.
(16:53):
Just like as a kid, you get away from your
parental supervision, you went outside the you're alone in this
fringy place, and so you go there as a dog walker.
You can let your dog go and a much more
natural condition for walking. I never really took to the leash.
(17:15):
They always say dog You know all this part I
never got into. This is not the kind of book
you can read to find out how to make your
dog heal or how to be happy you're walking together
on a leash necessarily.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
Yeah, this is more about getting back in touch with
the world, the nature around you, and your animal get
in touch with them as well. Well, John, we're going
to go to a quick commercial break, but I want
to come back to you and talk to you a
little bit about that. But I also want to talk
about the some of the other books that you've written
and how this one may be a little bit different
in the process of writing it. So everybody say tuned.
We're with John Ziemon talking about his book Dog Walks Man,
(17:49):
a six Legged Odyssey. You're listening to Animal Rights on
pet Life Radio.
Speaker 3 (17:56):
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Speaker 2 (20:04):
Com Welcome back, Welcome back, everybody. This is Animal Rights
on pet Life Radio. It's your host Tim Blink and
I'm here with John Ziemon today talking about his wonderful
book Dog Walks Man. Now, John, we were talking right
before the break about how, you know, we with going
out with our dog, whether we're talking about walking them
(20:24):
on a leash or getting them out and let him
run about. You know, it really gives us the opportunity
to get back in touch with with nature, find all
these unique places like you had mentioned with when we
were children, we found all these wonderful little hiding places
that our parents didn't know about, and they sort of
made our own little kingdom. How did your dog come
into play with that? I mean, does your dog enjoy
finding those little fringe places and help you locate those
(20:46):
places as well?
Speaker 8 (20:47):
Well? They can? I think in my case, it was
just getting tired of the leash and thinking about it
a little bit and being willing to put a little
more effort into you know, where could we go and
thinking about, well, there's the woods I know about, and
maybe we'd have to put the dog in a car,
but that would be better, I think than what we
(21:09):
were doing. And so it was really it's the dog's
enthusiasm for these places, the way they take to them
once you find them. But often I think it's human
intelligence and the knowledge of a town or a place
that you rely on. And in my case, there was
a small woods about seven blocks from my house that
(21:32):
only maybe fourteen acres are pretty small, hardly a real
not a forest or hardly a woods, but there was
enough of a woods that you could feel that you
were away, a little bit away from civilization. And we
would walk through these trails and some when they created
(21:53):
this place and they called it a nature area, they
made more trails than you really needed, just but it
increased the complexity the possible paths you could take. And anyway,
we trapsed around that place for about five years, and
from there I discovered there was where I lived in
(22:16):
New Jersey. We were right at the edge of the
northern end of the New Jersey Meadowlands, which is enjoys
a kind of notorious reputation where gangsters would you know,
finish off their rivals and people would dump toxic chemicals
(22:37):
and you know, and there was a lot of that,
but not so much where we are, although there had
been dumping, and years ago it had been used as
a landfill, and then the landfill had been capped, and
you know, you've seen those places where they you know,
they put a big layer of dirt over and then
you know, it sometimes looks sort of like a mound
(22:59):
where we were because it had started out as the
meadowlands are naturally marshy and swampy, it had just everything
had kind of sunk down, I guess, and so what
you saw was fields and still some marshy areas. But
because of the reputation, nobody in town went near the place.
(23:21):
And yet it was huge. We're in a very densely
populated area in northern New Jersey and a mile or
so from the George Washington Bridge, one of the busiest,
the busiest carbridge in the world, I think, and here
was this little wilderness, as it turned out to be,
(23:43):
that was kind of like the enchanted forest in a story,
or the forbidden forest, the place in the fairy tales
where you're not supposed to go there. And for ten years,
like everybody else in town, I just kind of ignored it.
But one day I got the idea. I think I
heard some kids and motorbikes were in there, and I
never realized that there was enough solid ground in there
(24:05):
that you could do that. And I got curious and
we crossed over this little stream or canal to get
I had to walk on a plank just like a kid,
and then we were in there. And this turned out
to be a kind of a paradise for us, because
it had been left alone for so long that it
(24:27):
had really reverted to a natural, almost kind of primeval place.
It was wilder than any nature area I've ever been
to because nobody was managing it. What grew there was
just what grew naturally, and nobody was trimming it. Nobody
was taking out the fallen trees or doing any of
that kind of maintenance work that keeps or putting chips
(24:50):
and cutting trails or anything like that. When trails were
sort of there because people stomped down the reeds. And
I found that it was possible to to get lost
in there, and that was a kind of a wonderful
feeling in a way, not literally lost in that they
thought I wouldn't get out, not knowing exactly where I was.
(25:12):
I could hear the hum of the New Jersey Turnpike
but I and my dog was in heaven because the
place was filled with animals living wild lives, and he
was raising them all these little Kirby trails and dogs.
I discovered love a path or a trail, And there's
a chapter in my book just about the joy of
(25:35):
being on the trail, on a path with your dog,
and the running ahead of you and coming around the bend.
And there was a place we used to come to.
It was a little pool of kind of like a waterhole,
we called it. And my dog because there were attracted animals.
There would often be a heron there's something waiting in there,
(25:58):
or an animal or a muskrat, or there was often
something there, and my dog would I'd always be hurrying
off trying to catch up to my dog because he
would get there ahead of me, and I'd get there
and I'd see just these sort of spreading rings on
the water or some rustling in the brush, and I
would miss it. And I became very intent on trying to,
(26:22):
you know, experiencing this this wild place, and it gave
me this great feeling of to be out there exploring
and seeing, say a fox. I remember how founded I
was to's just see a fox out rising chasing another animal,
and it was just like, you know, I realized that
(26:42):
here right by my house, these experiences that people imagine
that you have to travel hundreds of miles to have,
or to go way out to Yosemite or something, that
I could have this and nobody at town. It was
like an open secret there. It was anybody could go there,
but people didn't know it. And without a dog, I
never would have done that. And one thing led to another.
(27:05):
Pretty soon I had a companion, the king, who I
had told about some of my experiences, and even though
he didn't have a dog, he wanted to come just
for the exercise and the conversation. And so one thing
leads to another, and it all seems to come back
to this what started out as this very simple chore.
(27:26):
And I, you know, eventually my kids grew up. I
no longer had the excuse of being the dutiful father,
but I had become attached. This had become this essential
thing in my life that I had to do. And
so as my first dog died, and that you know,
it was very sad, and as we got to the
point where he really didn't want to go out, especially
(27:49):
in the winter, and I was the one that needed
to go out now, and I can remember trying to
coax him and I got ramps to get him into
the car and ways that we could continue to do
this activity. We had gotten a second dog by this time.
It kind of rejuvenated the older dog for a number
of years, but eventually time catches up the dogs too fast.
Speaker 2 (28:11):
Yeah, unfortunately.
Speaker 8 (28:13):
So I have now the second dog that I got
when he was alive, and and now a third as
his companion. So I've gotten used to having two dogs,
which really makes it important to kind of get out
somewhere where you can get away from the leash, because
it's not walking two dogs on a leaf.
Speaker 2 (28:31):
Keep dog.
Speaker 8 (28:34):
I've seen neighbors of mine, you know, the father, you know,
with the dog entangling the leash around these legs because
people have those expandable leashes now and they look like
they're doing some kind of lassuse trick.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
Exactly now, John, real quick, We got a couple more
minutes here. But I want to ask you, know you
you've also written the series of children's books, and you
have a book on for young adults. How is the
process of writing this book different from writing for children
and for young adults.
Speaker 8 (29:02):
Well, it was much harder in the sense that for
the longest time I wasn't really sure what kind of
book this was. And I had read a few dog books,
but I didn't really want to read a lot of
dog books because I didn't think that my book was
like that exactly, because it was more about It wasn't
focused essentially on the dog, but what the world that
(29:23):
a dog brought you into, in this world that the
two of you shared, right, And so it wasn't like
the book that really tells the story of the relationship
with the dog. And I didn't like I didn't want
to answer morphize and try to turn my dog into
a person, because what I like about my dogs are
those qualities that are different from humans. So I didn't
(29:46):
know what kind of book it was, and it was
to tell you the truth I was most I found
that it had the most in common with books about
fishing and people who discover through fishing, who kind of
get beyond all the you know, I'm going to catch
the biggest fish or so on, and there's some spiritual
(30:06):
like you know, a river runs through it, a kind
of a spiritual feeling enters into it exactly and it's
more about what they see in nature and what they
feel out there than how many fish they catch. And
it's you know, it's a kind of a meditative thing.
And dog walking is something that happens twice a day
actually fits a pattern that if you've ever been told
(30:27):
by a doctor or somebody or wanted to try a
relaxation exercise or to meditate, or they'll tell you half
hour in the morning and a half hour in the evening.
Speaker 2 (30:38):
Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 8 (30:38):
What do you know that's that's the dog.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
That's the dog walk. Yeah, exactly. Now, I tell people
all the time when we talk about you going into meditation,
a lot of people think that you have to set
their legs crossing, a lotus position, chanting. But one of
the best ways to do it is to go out
with your dog, go out for a dog walk, mix
it up a little bit, go to those new places,
and it really just clears your mind and lets you
think of things that it just all becomes clear at
(31:02):
that point.
Speaker 8 (31:03):
Meditation was always too hard for me to tell you
the truth of the idea that I would have to
clear my mind of my thoughts, and I was always
sort of chasing my tail when I was trying to meditate,
but being out having it's like Western style meditation perhaps,
but it does make you pay attention and you do.
Speaker 2 (31:20):
See things that's right.
Speaker 8 (31:22):
That's the work, and I think that's that's a form
of attention, learning how to read, center yourself. And there's
a great sense of well being that you get from it.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Absolutely, and that's what you're gonna learn when you read
Dog Walks Man. That's why you know. I think the
great thing about the book it gets you connected with dogs.
We always love to hear stories about dogs. More importantly,
get you reconnected with the earth, the world around you,
and your inner self. The books available everywhere, but you
can also go to John Zeman dot com it's j
O H N z E A M A n. Or
(31:54):
as always can go to pat Life Radio dot com
click on the animal rights tab and will lead you
to the book as well. So John, I want to
thank you for coming on the show today. It's a
great book. Congratulations. I wish you the very best and
keep us posted on all those wonderful journeys and odyssees
that you go on. It's never thanks ever and you're welcome.
(32:16):
You're welcome. So we're coming to the end of the
show today. I want to thank once again everybody for
listening to Animal Rights on pet Life Radio. I also
want to thank John Zeman for coming on board. Pick
up a copy of his book, Dog Walks Man's Great
Book and get back in touch with your dog in
the world around you and to swellows your inner self.
So thanks to John Zemon for being on the show today.
(32:36):
I want to thank all the sponsors and producers are
putting on a fabulous show as usual. Now to find
out more about me and other guests that I've interviewed
on the Animal Rights Show and stories, so you can
check it out by visiting my blog which is Animal
Rights and you can go to pet Life Radio petlife
radio dot com click on Animal Rights, read the blogs,
listen to the shows, listen to the other shows we've recorded,
(32:57):
and while you're there, check out all the other hosts
and shows. The great cavalcade of interesting guests and hosts
that we have on pet Life Radio and you can
catch it all at pet life radio dot com. If
you have any questions, comments, or ideas for the show,
people that you'd like for me to interview on the show,
drop me a line you can drop me an email
at timat petlifradio dot com. It's Tim at petlife radio
dot com. Now I'll do my very best to answer
(33:19):
your questions, entertain your comments, and get the people you
want the most on the show. So until next time,
write a great story about the animals in your life,
share it on a blog, article, or in a book,
and who knows, you may be the next guest on
animal rights on pet Life Radio. Have a great day.
Speaker 7 (33:36):
Let's talk pets every week on demand only on petlfradio
dot com.
Speaker 4 (34:00):
A constattag
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