May 26, 2025 • 39 mins
Let's talk friendship! Morgan and Friendship Coach Sabrina share their hot takes when it comes to everything surrounding friendships like why you shouldn't ignore your friends when you get into a new relationship, showing up in the good times (not just the bad), and why low maintenance friends aren't really a thing. Sabrina validates friendship breakups and why they are some of the most painful splits. Get ready for Mean Girls and Toy Story references because this will be the guide you need to surviving friendship as an adult.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
Personally Feldsman.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Y'all remember that song I Need a Little Help from
my Friends. Well, that's what this next series is all about.
This week, we're talking to Sabrina, the friendship Coach. She's
sharing why friendship heartbreak hurts something bad and why low
maintenance friendships really aren't a thing. Then next week, my
best friends from over a decade joined. We recorded the
episode when they were visiting Nashville on our yearly bestie trip,
(00:40):
and one of them is my friend who I made
via a guy we were both dating at the same time,
which is a story for next week.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
So let's get into this chat with Sabrina.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
We've talked about a lot of friendships on this podcast,
and I've had many of my friends on, but I
think where this friendship coach really excels is her blutness
and honesty for what happens in friendship, and that's why
I'm bringing her on. Hi Spriena, thanks for joining me.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
Hi, thanks for having me. I'm super excited to be
on your podcast.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
I love your content so fun to watch because I
think there's so many different spaces within the friendship world
when it comes to the coaches, and I really do
believe where your bread and butter is being brutally honest
and telling us the things that we need to hear.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
I try not to be brutally honest.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
I try to be as kind as possible with the truth,
or at least like my opinion of how I see things.
But yeah, I'm not trying to like hurt anyone's feelings.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
But no, brutally honest is a good thing. We're at
a time and place right now where sometimes tough love
is necessary. And I really feel like in the space
that friendships are right now across the board is we're
in some desperate need of some tough love.
Speaker 1 (02:05):
I think so too, to be honest, you see, And
this is what we're talking about.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
And it's interesting because I do have an incredible group
of friends. I have wonderful friends who have kept up
and done all the right things, and they've maintained for
several years, some even decades. But as you get older
I'm thirty one now, time changes, things happen and life
gets different, and especially when it comes to friendship. So
(02:32):
why is that what's happening with friendships as we get older?
Speaker 1 (02:36):
I think it's part of it is intentionality, windles when
you grow up with your friends, you're in the same environment,
you're in proximity, whether that's school, whether that's like different
hobbies or college. What ends up happening as we grow
older is life happens, marriage, kids work, all of these
(02:59):
like life moments, and we forget to put intention and
more effort into keeping up with our friends. We coasted
as kids just having people there, but we forget that
we actually need to put in a little bit more
effort when it comes to our friends.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
And when you say put in more effort, I would
love to paint this picture of what effort can look
like in friendships, because something that's a hot topic on
social media right now is low maintenance friendships.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
Oh no, you hit me her.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
I know. So we'll get into that a little bit further,
but show me a little bit what effort may look
like in friendships before we dive into that very spicy topic.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
Yes, I think we confuse effort with constant communication versus
consistent communication. I think everyone's frequency of communication differs. So
for me, it could be every two weeks, reach out
to me, let's chat. For you, it could be every month,
every two months, three months, whatever it is, And I
(04:06):
think that these conversations need to be had with our
friends where we have a consistent frequency of communication. So,
for example, if me and you were friends and we
have this consistency of talking every month, then if you
don't end up reaching out every month, then I start
to wonder if everything's okay with you, And that's when
(04:29):
I would reach out and be like, hey, are you okay?
I haven't heard from you in over a month. But
what people tend to confuse is that oh, we have
to put in more effort where it's oh, I have
to be there for you twenty four to seven, which
is not the case.
Speaker 3 (04:43):
No one's asking for that. We are all too busy
for that. We're all too overwhelmed and stressed for that.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
So it's about just having conversations with your friends as
life grows on, as they have kids or whatever. The
vibe is, what is a good communication for frequency for you?
Speaker 3 (05:00):
Do you want us to keep up?
Speaker 1 (05:02):
And I know that sounds redundant, but you know what,
we have to schedule our friends in. It's like those
text messages that we have with our friends.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
Hey what are you free?
Speaker 1 (05:11):
I'm free in March, I'm free in May, in April.
But it's the same thing where it's like, hey, what
kind of frequency do you want? Two weeks once a month?
What is it that you want for us to keep
this going? And we tend to not have these conversations unfortunately.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
It's funny. We like to be communicators, but that we
don't communicate our needs and our desires very common word.
It is awkward in a way, right because friendships we
don't see in the same capacity as romantic relationships for
some reason. But in romantic partnerships you have these conversations
or you should be of this is what I need,
(05:52):
These are what will keep me happy in this partnership.
So why would that be any different in a friendship
that was once a stranger and who's now not a stranger.
It's the same kind of thing. You're just having a
different type of love.
Speaker 3 (06:06):
It's true.
Speaker 1 (06:07):
And I know that is also a hot topic because
a lot of us talk about it's a platonic relationship.
It's not as significant as.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
A romantic one.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
But for me, at least from my opinion, whether it's
romantic or platonic friendship is the basis, Yes, there's more
when it comes to romantic relationship but I think the
basis of it is that basic communication that you do
with your partner, you should also do with your friends
and whoever else is in your vicinity, Like it's the
(06:38):
same with coworkers and your boss, Like you have to
communicate unfortunately, in order to keep that relationship going.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
It's funny one of my newer friends that I've made
as an adult, I really feel a different type of
connection to her because we and we've had this conversation
a few times where we're like, we've never had I
had a friend who just would look out for us
in this way or take pictures of us. That was
one thing that we both noticed is we want to
take pictures of each other all the time. And we
always felt like we were in friendships that were super
(07:10):
one sided in that that we were both performing a
certain way and the other friend wasn't. And it was
this kind of realization for both of us, especially at
this point in our life, where Huh, that shouldn't be
happening for the first time, but it is. Do you
see that happen often when you're talking to people as
they get older and just understanding the things that they
want out of friendships.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
More, Yes, I'm pretty sure we can all agree that
the things that we wanted in our younger years is
not the same things that we want in our adult years.
And that's the same when it comes to friendships.
Speaker 3 (07:42):
We grow, we want.
Speaker 1 (07:44):
Different types of friends, and it's okay to want different things,
and we want and hope that our friends grow with
us at least like that's the goal. But unfortunately, sometimes
it's looking at it from an outside lens and realizing
that we're not as compatible as we used to be.
Speaker 3 (08:06):
And that's okay.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
Maybe at this point in time we need to go
our separate ways. Maybe we'll find each other in the
later years, but sometimes it can hurt. It's not the
greatest situation to be in when.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
You mentioned that, And something that really hurts in friendships
is the friendship breakup that happens. It's super painful, and
I don't think it gets enough credit for how hard
it is. There's been friends over the course of my
life who I've lost, whether they got into relationships or
marriages and they just stopped being the friend that I
once had, and naturally, because I wanted a very solid
(08:44):
friendship that moved away and it didn't happen. Anymore because
they weren't the person that when we first became friends.
They couldn't provide that anymore for whatever reason, and it
was really painful. And there's moments where it's really painful
and you really miss them and you just want to
talk to them, but you also have to have this
(09:05):
level of respect for yourself. So can we dive into
the friendship breakup?
Speaker 1 (09:10):
Friendship breakups are honestly, in my opinion, more painful than
any romantic relationship breakup ever, and it's probably because we've
never been taught how to handle a friendship breakup. Like
when it comes to romantic relationships, we all know, okay,
we're going into it. We're seeing if this person's compatible
(09:31):
with us, we're seeing if they're long term, and we
know eventually there's going to be a breakup if ever.
But when it comes to friends, we think to ourselves,
they're going to be in our life forever until we
grow old and we're in wheelchairs. But it's it's like
a difficult place to be when you're going through that
(09:55):
because sometimes it's just pure growth. Sometimes you just drift
part because you're in different life life cycles and you're
going one way there going another way, and there's no
animosity there. It's just like life happens and we have
to drift apart and we can't keep holding on for
dear life when it's not working. Other parts of it
(10:18):
can be harsh and cruel, where I've heard a lot
of clients tell me about friends that have done terrible
things like sleeping with their fiances and just horrible things.
So that's also like part of it. And I think
also another portion of it that's become very relevant is
quiet quitting friendships or ghosting.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
I'm not a fan of it.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
I would only say it's okay to do that if
you're in danger. If you've attempted to communicate with somebody
over and over again and they just continue to disrespect you, yeah,
then cut them off. But I've seen a lot of
friendships where people see their friends like their toys and
with them, enjoy them for a good little abount of time,
(11:03):
and then discard them and ghost and don't say anything,
and you can feel icky, Wow, this person was all
excited to be my friend, and now suddenly I don't
hear from them.
Speaker 3 (11:16):
They throw me away.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
And then sometimes when you confront that, you get the
narrative of oh, I don't owe you anything, and that
really sucks.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
That really sucks.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
Yeah, there's so many different painful steps to that friendship breakup.
To your point, there's just many different levels, and none
of them get easier, especially even with time. You think,
as you get older, you just and you learn. I
don't feel like they've ever gotten easier, even especially as
an adult. I feel like it's more painful because when
you watch your circle get smaller, you know that it's
(11:50):
important because you're getting these quality friendships, but watching it
get smaller feels like you have to grieve an entire
life that's ending.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
Yeah, And it's also you second guess yourself too, because
as you grow up, at least I know, in our
femininity and with womenhood, our friends.
Speaker 3 (12:14):
Make up a big part of that.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
And when you see your friends trickle away, it kills
a little bit of your girlhood inside and it makes
you feel like am I.
Speaker 3 (12:27):
Good enough? Am I worthy?
Speaker 1 (12:30):
All these friends just keep leaving and disappearing? Is there
something wrong with me? And it's a very difficult place
to be in when you start to feel that way.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
And I can also speak from an experience of some
trauma when I was in high school, I was bullied
by girls who were once my friends, and that experience
in high school really dictated how friendships looked for me
for a really long time. So you see some clients
come in who have trauma like this, and building friendships
(13:04):
just becomes an increasingly harder situation than just your day
to day life.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
Oh yes, and I can relate to that very much.
Having your best friend be your bully not the greatest experience.
But I think we're also taught in society in the
shows that we grow up when that having that toxic
best friend and no matter what they do, you still
(13:34):
have to be best friends with them at the end.
Take Gossip Girl for example, it's like Serena and Blair
are best friends, but they're horrible to each other. They
do horrible things, sabotage gossip, go behind each other's backs
and just stab each other like figuratively, of course.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
And then you have mean girls where they push each
other in front of buses. So there's that.
Speaker 1 (13:57):
Too, allegedly, But we grow up watching this and then
it's subconsciously drilled into our heads that we have to
tolerate bad behaviors from our friends and then when we
grow older, we start to realize, oh, we shouldn't be
(14:18):
doing that, and it becomes like this thing where we're
fighting ourselves. We're building standards for ourselves.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
We don't want to.
Speaker 1 (14:26):
Accept bad behavior from people anymore, whether it's romantic or friendship,
and then we're fighting ourselves because we've been taught to
accept everyone's flaws and taught to accept all these bad behaviors.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
So where's the line? And that's what I'm trying to
teach here.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
Yeah, And it is because so much of my relearning
experience from high school and dealing with these friends who
I had sleepovers with and we talk to each other
about everything to one day just slipping on a dime
and saying horrible things and doing horrible things to me
that I had to teach myself a new pattern of friendship.
(15:08):
And as a sixteen year old girl to eighteen to
then in her early twenties and joining a sorority in college,
the emotional ways that my brain went through having friends
was just beyond me. Like I look back at the
time of my life and I'm like, how did I
even do that? Because my brain was genuinely trying to
(15:30):
develop at the same time I was being rejected and
bullied and then also okay, by the way, you have
to throw yourself into an completely new city and make
new friends while trusting that they're actually gonna be kind
to you and not do the same thing to you.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
Again, true, that's a lot of us are experienced too,
same thing in college. Same thing.
Speaker 3 (15:51):
It's learning who you are.
Speaker 1 (15:54):
You don't know who you are, you don't know anything
about yourself, and then on top of that, trying to
figure out romantically who you like, hoping that that person's
not toxic. Then trying to figure out friendships, and yeah,
dealing with friends that are mean to you and bully
to you, but at the same time trying to find
good long term friendships. And it's very overwhelming.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
Do you feel like this is why friendship gets the
low on the totem pole, because life is so overwhelming,
and then friendship you just pushed to the side because
it's the easy thing that you can always go after
at another time, and it just keeps getting knocked down
a few pegs because of this process of us being
so overwhelmed with life.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
I think yes and no, But I also think that
we've been conditioned to prioritize other things in our life.
And we've also been conditioned that boys may come and go,
but friends are forever.
Speaker 3 (16:53):
So you sit there waiting for your.
Speaker 1 (16:56):
Friend to come back around, and it's just a waiting game,
and you start to tolerate behaviors that you would not
accept anywhere else. So, yeah, when things are convenient, people
put it in the back burner. They forget about it
because you'll always be there at the end of the day.
Speaker 2 (17:15):
And this now leads me into the hot topic of
low maintenance friendships. So give me your hot take. Low
maintenance friendships. We're seeing all over the internet people are
creating all kinds of reels about how they love their
low maintenance friends.
Speaker 3 (17:29):
Oh my goodness.
Speaker 1 (17:31):
So a lot of the clients that I've had also
different people on TikTok that I've talked to about low
maintenance friendships. When I ask them, what is a low
maintenance friendship to you, everything they bring back to me
is things that I would consider a normal friendship. And
all you're doing is maintaining that friendship. You. In order
(17:55):
to gain a friendship, you need to have a base,
a foundation where you meet that person, you hang out
for quite a while. You build, start to get to
know them, you start to love them, they love you. You
hang out a lot, a lot of secrets are spilled,
live life with each other, and then time moves on
and things change, and of course you can't be communicating
(18:19):
all the time. No one's asking for twenty four to seven.
But you still keep up with your friends, even if it's.
Speaker 3 (18:25):
Once a month. You're like, hey, how's it going.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Let me text you, let me tell you about my day,
let me tell you the news.
Speaker 3 (18:32):
And people are.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
Referring to that as low maintenance friendships, when I'm like, no,
that's just maintaining the friendship.
Speaker 3 (18:42):
As you should. That's just a friendship period.
Speaker 1 (18:46):
Like this whole narrative of low and high friendships is,
it's confusing, and it's confusing people, and it's also allowing
a lot of manipulative people come in and take advantage
of those terms where they come in and say, oh,
I want a low maintenance friendship so that they don't
(19:07):
have to put in work. It's a friendship on their terms.
It's I show up whenever I need to show up,
whenever it's convenient for me. And you can't say anything
because if you do, I'm going to call you high maintenance, and.
Speaker 3 (19:21):
It's a power struggle.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
I don't think friendship should be leveled at low or high.
Speaker 3 (19:28):
It just should be equal. It's a balancing game.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
And if you're low and the other one's high, then
there's a power struggle and you're probably not compatible and
you probably shouldn't be friends. So there's no such thing
as a low maintenance friendship. It's just a friendship that
you are maintaining at a pace that you are comfortable with,
that you and your friend have agreed upon.
Speaker 3 (19:54):
And that's all it is.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
And the rest of it is just a way to
avoid emotional responsible ability, avoid accountability, and to shift the
blame on somebody else that's actually asking for consistency.
Speaker 3 (20:08):
That's all.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
That's a mic draft hot take, and I love it
because I agree when you sit here and explain it
that way. I agree. Because you think of a relationship,
and as you stay with a person, you get more
comfortable with them, and life becomes easy and communication becomes
easy because you're used to this life with this person.
The same thing is happening in friendships. But we're not
(20:31):
calling relationships low maintenance relationships. No, no, But here we
are doing it to friendships.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
It's because I guess it gots skewed somewhere where it's Oh,
I don't have to constantly be on top of my friend.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
Which I think is good. That's healthy. Like you're not
supposed to be on top.
Speaker 1 (20:55):
Of your friend being like, hey, when are you texting
me back?
Speaker 3 (20:58):
Why haven't you answered?
Speaker 2 (21:01):
I think we have bigger problems there.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
Yes, And if you have to do that, maybe you
need to revisit whether this friendship dynamic is good for
you or not, because if they're ignoring you, maybe we
shouldn't be friends.
Speaker 3 (21:15):
That's all. But people that are friends, you don't have
to talk every day.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
You just have to be consistently there for each other,
no matter how that looks. For your relationship, that's between
you and that friend.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
And that's it.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
And here we're gonna continue some hot takes. I'm gonna
tell you a few thoughts that I have, and I
want to know your opinion. Okay, if you are in
a relationship, you should always make time with your friends
outside of that relationship. Even if you hang out with
that partner and your friend, you should also make time
for solo time with your friend.
Speaker 3 (21:50):
Amen.
Speaker 2 (21:51):
Okay, thank you preach. I feel like this is so
important that I don't understand why I have to keep
saying this. But you can have a life outside of
your partner with your friends.
Speaker 1 (22:03):
You should have a life outside your partner with your friend,
and if you do not, then we need to talk
about that some way, somehow, because if you're already your
independent self before a man comes in or whoever your
preference is, you cannot just completely neglect your individual self
(22:25):
and everything that makes you you, including your friends.
Speaker 3 (22:28):
Once the romantic.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
Box has been checked, this person cannot be your entirety.
And I think that kind of happens way too much,
where we're striving so much to get married, to find
the one, and then once we do.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
It's like, all right, now what.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
I don't have any friends because I didn't keep up
with them. I don't have any individual self because I
haven't taken.
Speaker 3 (22:57):
Care of myself.
Speaker 1 (22:58):
I don't have any hobbies, I don't know what to do,
and then depression hits.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
It's a vicious cycle that we get into. So thank you,
hot take. Yes, we're on the same page. This other
one is that you should be there for your friends,
not just when times are very tough, but especially when
times are very good. Yes, I think showing up for
both is what makes a good friend, because there's this
(23:27):
belief in my eyes that if all you can do
is show up for the bad times, are you here
to see that I failed? Or are you really here
to be there for me? If you're not here in
any other time of my life, but this is the
only time. Why, That's how exactly that's how I view that.
And then but if you can't show up for me
in the good times, and you're celebrating me like I
(23:49):
had a big party when I started this podcast with
my friends. I did a big dinner and everybody who
shut it up. I was so thankful because me getting
married or having a baby or no, it was me
just creating a podcast. But I wanted to celebrate it
because it was important to me, and they showed up
and celebrated it like it was my birthday.
Speaker 3 (24:07):
I love that.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
See, And this is like my hot take because I
think a lot of people feel like when they have
a friend who shows up in the dark times, that's
a great friend. But I just do they also show
up in both so.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
Thoughts, Yes, one hundred percent, I think they need to
show up in both, Like you cannot have a friend
that only shows up for you in the darkest times,
because sooner or later they're conditioned to see you in
your lowest point. And some people get a kick out
of it. It sucks, but they get a kick out
(24:41):
of watching someone have it worse than they do. And
it sucks to realize that in a friend that you
really love and care about, But you have to pay
attention to whether they're there to celebrate you or not.
Speaker 3 (24:56):
And if they're not there.
Speaker 1 (24:58):
To pull you out of the muck, clean you off,
and then be like.
Speaker 3 (25:04):
You're out of there, let's go get drinks.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
I don't think that's a good friend.
Speaker 3 (25:10):
And I think we agree on that.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Yep.
Speaker 4 (25:13):
See, these are hot takes though, and I don't I
just wish they weren't. I know, I don't understand why
these are like controversial beliefs in friendships, but they are.
Speaker 2 (25:23):
And I think it's also really easy for things to
get lost in life and you just make sure, oh,
my friend's going through it. I need to make sure
I'm there, But you also need to make sure you're
there in the mundane and the normal, and also not
forgetting about your friend when you decide to find a
boyfriend or a girlfriend. YEH think those are a reasonable
(25:45):
ass of a friend.
Speaker 3 (25:46):
I think that's a reasonable ask.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Yes. And speaking of these high value because you know what,
we're putting this on high value friends. This is what
high value friends do. You had done a content piece
on social media where you're talking about the three behaviors
of high val value friends you should be looking for.
And I'm so curious like to detail what these are
because when you are an adult, making friends is hard
(26:09):
and finding the right friends is also hard. So what
should we be looking for?
Speaker 1 (26:14):
I think you need to figure out exactly what you're
looking for in a friend, exactly what you're looking for.
It's the same as you're looking for the one or
your romantic partner.
Speaker 3 (26:24):
You have a list.
Speaker 1 (26:25):
I want him to have this, and I want this,
I want this, kind of the same with your friends.
Speaker 3 (26:29):
But the problem that we end up doing is we.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
Hang out with someone and we pick them because their
vibe is cool, and we're like, oh, we mesh really well,
they're my friend, and then whatever attributes or characteristics you
have created in your head, that's a friend for me,
for example, a friend to me is honest, accountable, loyal.
So I pick someone I'm like, they have a cool vibe,
(26:53):
they're my friend. I automatically think to myself, Oh, they
have to be honest, to loyal and accountable. Have they
proven that to me? No? I just met this person,
we just hung out few times. Their vibe is cool, okay,
But do I know anything about the characteristics. No? And
(27:14):
then later down the line we end up finding out
the hard way that this person's not honest and they're
a little bit of a liar, or they're disloyal, or
they can't hold themselves accountable for anything.
Speaker 3 (27:28):
And then we go.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
Into a huge cycle of having to do the difficult thing,
which is falling out of love with someone that you
care about and having to remove them from your life,
which is not easy. So I think it's a lot
easier to start to vet your friends first, figure out
your standards, figure out your non negotiables before you get
(27:51):
into a long term friendship with someone that you don't know.
Speaker 2 (27:55):
Yeah, that's really important, and it's also just a great
to have for all your things in life. Know what
you're going after, know what you want. It's something that
you can use interchangeably for so many different things, so
why should it be any different with friends. We really
like to change the game when it comes to friendships.
Speaker 1 (28:14):
Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
I don't know why.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
But also I'm trying to also change the narrative behind
it's difficult to make friends. I don't think it's difficult
to make friends.
Speaker 3 (28:26):
There are a.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
Lot of us out there that love to talk about friendship,
that are looking for genuine friendship. Of course there are outliers,
but I think it's also a mentality of how to
go in it. If you're going into it with a
desperate energy or with the mentality of it's really hard
to make friends, you're gonna have a really hard time
(28:48):
making friends, Or if you go into it saying, you
know what, I know who I am. I know I'm
a valuable friend, and whoever comes into my life and
really wants to be my friend not to.
Speaker 3 (29:01):
Be like too much, but they're blessed.
Speaker 1 (29:03):
And it's that thought process. And I had to do
that myself, moving to a new place and doing the
bumblebff thing. I was terrified, but then I was like,
you know what, No, I've healed, I've grown, i know
what I'm looking for and I'm going to go in
it and be strategic.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
And I met a lot of good girls.
Speaker 1 (29:25):
I also met a lot of flaky girls, and nothing
against them. I don't hate them, but it's like, you're
not my cup of tea. That's okay, I'll go for
the champagne.
Speaker 2 (29:36):
Over here and correct me if I'm wrong. But a
lot of my experience I was someone who moved to
a new city, created an entire life for myself, and
a lot of the questions that I always get here,
how do you do it? How do you make friends?
It's so hard. Here's all of this, and so much
(29:56):
of where I made friends and where I really thrived
was one myself out there in the first place. It's
just like with dating. You have to put yourself out there.
I know, we all want to meet people on our
couch and that's how life works. No, it's not. You
actually have to put yourself out there and go and
do life. Be living life and to just be open
to it, be open that a friends can come anywhere.
(30:19):
It's how The friend that I mentioned, who I made
as a really good friend in the last year, came
from me trying out a new gym by myself. She
was a trainer there and we would just talk every
time I came in, and over the course of time,
I went through a bad breakup and she was like,
let's go get a sandwich. You don't look like you've
eat very much. And from then on we became best friends.
(30:40):
And that was so unexpected and not anything that I
was looking for or needed. But I was open to it,
and I was willing to create a new friend because
I was just always in this space that you can
never have enough friends, you can never have enough love
in your life. And so much of me being an
adult and creating the life that I've created in a
city that I didn't know a single soul is because
(31:02):
of those two things.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
Oh, this is just such a beautiful story, honestly, and
it's so true too.
Speaker 3 (31:10):
It's so true.
Speaker 1 (31:11):
You have to be open to finding friends. You can't
tell yourself it's hard. I'm never gonna find friends because
you're going into it from a place of loneliness. And
when your energy is in a place of loneliness, you're
not really going to find quality people.
Speaker 3 (31:27):
You're going to get.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
That type of energy back, and it's not a good
place to be.
Speaker 3 (31:34):
I think how to make new friends.
Speaker 1 (31:37):
Is like you said, you have to do things that
you would normally do for yourself hobbies. Like I met
a girl through Pilate's class, and it was stupid. All
I did was give her a towel. I was like,
she's like looking around. I was like, do you need
a towel, Yeah, okay, I'll grab you one. Grab her
a towel, give her a towel. Boom we started talking.
(31:59):
See it can be that simple. You just have to
show up, go to places that you want to go
to be consistent about it, because if you show up
only once every six months, the people that are regulars
aren't going to get to know you. Show up, be present,
do the things that you like to do and you enjoy,
and you'll find like minded people.
Speaker 2 (32:21):
And you'll also find this basis that maybe you don't
want to be in. You might go and try a
new place and be like, I've been doing this for
a while and I just really can't quite seem to
stick here. I feel like I should try something new,
and you should. If that's the way that it feels.
There's a reason for that, Yep, exactly.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
But that's also part of learning who you are.
Speaker 3 (32:42):
And what you like. And it's the same when it
comes to friends.
Speaker 1 (32:45):
You got to go out there, talk to a bunch
of people, learn what you're looking for in a friend.
Speaker 3 (32:51):
And it just because you don't they don't vibe with you.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
Or they're not your cup of tea, doesn't make them
a bad person, doesn't make you a horrible person.
Speaker 3 (32:59):
For choosing them.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
It's just you need to find your people.
Speaker 2 (33:05):
That's all it is. It is. And I wanted to
ask you because we did talk about hot takes a
little bit, but and I shared some of mine. I
made you share one of yours about low maintenance. Do
you have any other hot takes about friendship? Because I
feel like this is where it's fun and sometimes again
we just need a little tough love.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
I feel like the basic ones we've hit when it
comes to friends, ditching you for another romantic person.
Speaker 3 (33:34):
I don't think that's okay.
Speaker 1 (33:36):
I think also ghosting your friends, I don't think that's
good behavior. You should not have to disappear for months
at a time and then expect everything to be there
and convenient for you. Once you decide it's convenient for
you to show back up. Sometimes, just in friendships, just
(33:59):
like in relationship. You got to do the hard things.
If you're struggling, you need to communicate that your friends
are not mind readers. They don't know what's going on
in your head. And if you're really in a place
where you're struggling, communicate that and give them the opportunity
to support you, to help you through it so that
you're not alone. But I tend to see a lot
(34:21):
of it where people just ghost disappear, don't communicate. Their
friends are texting them like, hey, what's going on. You're
not answering like are you okay? They don't hear anything,
and then you pop back in and you expect everything
to be good and dandy, and then you're mad at
(34:43):
them for being mad at you for disappearing, and it's.
Speaker 3 (34:49):
A vicious cycle. And I don't think it's okay.
Speaker 1 (34:51):
And I think it's okay to hold your friends accountable
if they're going through those ghosting spells, And like, you
wouldn't let a man back into your life if he's
ghosted you for months, Why are you going to allow
that same treatment from your friends?
Speaker 2 (35:06):
It is Hey, ghosting is never a good thing. Honestly,
it's one of the worst things we can do to people.
And the only time I've ever approved of it is
if you've taken a lot of effort to really try
and put into something and it's just not being heard.
You just have to back away sometimes and let life happen.
And if you're supposed to have that conversation, then it'll
(35:28):
come to fruition. But that's truly the only time where
I'm like, it's okay if you need to disappear. Beyond that,
we're adults, we're supposed to have conversations, agreed.
Speaker 1 (35:38):
I think you can disappear, go no contact if you're
really in danger this person's not okay, do what you
need to do to protect yourself. Or you've attempted to
communicate on multiple occasions, You've attempted to set boundaries on
multiple occasions, the person just doesn't want to change, they
don't want to respect back to your boundaries, then it's
(36:01):
okay to just end it. But at the end of
the day, that's to me, is not ghosting, because ghosters
tend to always come back.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
They do. They're on this little rotation of the earth
cycle or something.
Speaker 1 (36:14):
To me, that's going no contact, that's the end of
a relationship. You're not going back to that person because
you've had enough.
Speaker 3 (36:20):
Is enough if you had enough.
Speaker 1 (36:22):
But ghosters tend to they get a high from disappearing
and coming back and just having people that they pluck
and having friendship on their terms.
Speaker 3 (36:32):
And I go back.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
To people using people like their toys. Oh, I'm bored
with this toy, Chuck, Let's use this truck.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
Apparently we're in toy story and who is the child
that they're out all the toys?
Speaker 3 (36:50):
I don't know the evil one.
Speaker 2 (36:53):
There was a few of them and they just kept
getting like discarded. So basically we're discarded Toy story toys.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
Horrible.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
I know it is, but you know what, the toy
story toys have great lives. So that means that we
can all also have good lives and make new friends.
That's exactly what that means.
Speaker 1 (37:11):
Yes, and the discarded toys always end up getting saved
and make great friendships.
Speaker 2 (37:18):
Yep, exactly, So life happens on the other side of it.
This is what we're paying attention to. Sabrina. I'm so
happy that you came on. I like to end the
podcast with whether it be a piece of advice, motivation, inspiration,
or just something that maybe we didn't even get to
an address and you just want to talk about it,
but the platform might serve over to you and say,
(37:40):
end us on something that you'd like to end us on.
Speaker 1 (37:43):
Okay, let's see drum roll please, Okay. I think that
each one of us should know that we are enough
and we're never asking for too much.
Speaker 3 (37:59):
We're women. We can do it all.
Speaker 1 (38:02):
Career, romantic relationships, family, we can do it all. Why
not friendships so we can have amazing friends in our life.
We can have the career that we dream of, we
can have the man that we dream of, or whatever
our preferences, and we can honestly have it all. So
don't think you're asking for too much, because you're not.
(38:25):
You're just building the whole package for your life. And
That's where I'm going to end it.
Speaker 2 (38:31):
I love it. See, this is why we turn it
over because it's always a fun little thing to end on.
So Sabrina, thank you for joining me, Thanks for sharing
your expertise and taking some time to hang out.
Speaker 3 (38:41):
Thank you for having me. I'm so excited.
Speaker 2 (38:45):
Tough love is important, and this episode feels like it
reminded us all what we deserve in every relationship in
our lives, but particularly with friendships. So go out today
and be a good friend. Call or send a tex
to that friend who means everything to you always. I'm
so happy you're here. I can't wait for y'all to
hear the Girl Chat in coming next week. Love you bye,
Personally Feldsman.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Y'all remember that song I Need a Little Help from
my Friends. Well, that's what this next series is all about.
This week, we're talking to Sabrina, the friendship Coach. She's
sharing why friendship heartbreak hurts something bad and why low
maintenance friendships really aren't a thing. Then next week, my
best friends from over a decade joined. We recorded the
episode when they were visiting Nashville on our yearly bestie trip,
(00:40):
and one of them is my friend who I made
via a guy we were both dating at the same time,
which is a story for next week.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
So let's get into this chat with Sabrina.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
We've talked about a lot of friendships on this podcast,
and I've had many of my friends on, but I
think where this friendship coach really excels is her blutness
and honesty for what happens in friendship, and that's why
I'm bringing her on. Hi Spriena, thanks for joining me.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
Hi, thanks for having me. I'm super excited to be
on your podcast.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
I love your content so fun to watch because I
think there's so many different spaces within the friendship world
when it comes to the coaches, and I really do
believe where your bread and butter is being brutally honest
and telling us the things that we need to hear.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
I try not to be brutally honest.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
I try to be as kind as possible with the truth,
or at least like my opinion of how I see things.
But yeah, I'm not trying to like hurt anyone's feelings.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
But no, brutally honest is a good thing. We're at
a time and place right now where sometimes tough love
is necessary. And I really feel like in the space
that friendships are right now across the board is we're
in some desperate need of some tough love.
Speaker 1 (02:05):
I think so too, to be honest, you see, And
this is what we're talking about.
Speaker 2 (02:09):
And it's interesting because I do have an incredible group
of friends. I have wonderful friends who have kept up
and done all the right things, and they've maintained for
several years, some even decades. But as you get older
I'm thirty one now, time changes, things happen and life
gets different, and especially when it comes to friendship. So
(02:32):
why is that what's happening with friendships as we get older?
Speaker 1 (02:36):
I think it's part of it is intentionality, windles when
you grow up with your friends, you're in the same environment,
you're in proximity, whether that's school, whether that's like different
hobbies or college. What ends up happening as we grow
older is life happens, marriage, kids work, all of these
(02:59):
like life moments, and we forget to put intention and
more effort into keeping up with our friends. We coasted
as kids just having people there, but we forget that
we actually need to put in a little bit more
effort when it comes to our friends.
Speaker 2 (03:20):
And when you say put in more effort, I would
love to paint this picture of what effort can look
like in friendships, because something that's a hot topic on
social media right now is low maintenance friendships.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
Oh no, you hit me her.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
I know. So we'll get into that a little bit further,
but show me a little bit what effort may look
like in friendships before we dive into that very spicy topic.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
Yes, I think we confuse effort with constant communication versus
consistent communication. I think everyone's frequency of communication differs. So
for me, it could be every two weeks, reach out
to me, let's chat. For you, it could be every month,
every two months, three months, whatever it is, And I
(04:06):
think that these conversations need to be had with our
friends where we have a consistent frequency of communication. So,
for example, if me and you were friends and we
have this consistency of talking every month, then if you
don't end up reaching out every month, then I start
to wonder if everything's okay with you, And that's when
(04:29):
I would reach out and be like, hey, are you okay?
I haven't heard from you in over a month. But
what people tend to confuse is that oh, we have
to put in more effort where it's oh, I have
to be there for you twenty four to seven, which
is not the case.
Speaker 3 (04:43):
No one's asking for that. We are all too busy
for that. We're all too overwhelmed and stressed for that.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
So it's about just having conversations with your friends as
life grows on, as they have kids or whatever. The
vibe is, what is a good communication for frequency for you?
Speaker 3 (05:00):
Do you want us to keep up?
Speaker 1 (05:02):
And I know that sounds redundant, but you know what,
we have to schedule our friends in. It's like those
text messages that we have with our friends.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
Hey what are you free?
Speaker 1 (05:11):
I'm free in March, I'm free in May, in April.
But it's the same thing where it's like, hey, what
kind of frequency do you want? Two weeks once a month?
What is it that you want for us to keep
this going? And we tend to not have these conversations unfortunately.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
It's funny. We like to be communicators, but that we
don't communicate our needs and our desires very common word.
It is awkward in a way, right because friendships we
don't see in the same capacity as romantic relationships for
some reason. But in romantic partnerships you have these conversations
or you should be of this is what I need,
(05:52):
These are what will keep me happy in this partnership.
So why would that be any different in a friendship
that was once a stranger and who's now not a stranger.
It's the same kind of thing. You're just having a
different type of love.
Speaker 3 (06:06):
It's true.
Speaker 1 (06:07):
And I know that is also a hot topic because
a lot of us talk about it's a platonic relationship.
It's not as significant as.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
A romantic one.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
But for me, at least from my opinion, whether it's
romantic or platonic friendship is the basis, Yes, there's more
when it comes to romantic relationship but I think the
basis of it is that basic communication that you do
with your partner, you should also do with your friends
and whoever else is in your vicinity, Like it's the
(06:38):
same with coworkers and your boss, Like you have to
communicate unfortunately, in order to keep that relationship going.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
It's funny one of my newer friends that I've made
as an adult, I really feel a different type of
connection to her because we and we've had this conversation
a few times where we're like, we've never had I
had a friend who just would look out for us
in this way or take pictures of us. That was
one thing that we both noticed is we want to
take pictures of each other all the time. And we
always felt like we were in friendships that were super
(07:10):
one sided in that that we were both performing a
certain way and the other friend wasn't. And it was
this kind of realization for both of us, especially at
this point in our life, where Huh, that shouldn't be
happening for the first time, but it is. Do you
see that happen often when you're talking to people as
they get older and just understanding the things that they
want out of friendships.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
More, Yes, I'm pretty sure we can all agree that
the things that we wanted in our younger years is
not the same things that we want in our adult years.
And that's the same when it comes to friendships.
Speaker 3 (07:42):
We grow, we want.
Speaker 1 (07:44):
Different types of friends, and it's okay to want different things,
and we want and hope that our friends grow with
us at least like that's the goal. But unfortunately, sometimes
it's looking at it from an outside lens and realizing
that we're not as compatible as we used to be.
Speaker 3 (08:06):
And that's okay.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
Maybe at this point in time we need to go
our separate ways. Maybe we'll find each other in the
later years, but sometimes it can hurt. It's not the
greatest situation to be in when.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
You mentioned that, And something that really hurts in friendships
is the friendship breakup that happens. It's super painful, and
I don't think it gets enough credit for how hard
it is. There's been friends over the course of my
life who I've lost, whether they got into relationships or
marriages and they just stopped being the friend that I
once had, and naturally, because I wanted a very solid
(08:44):
friendship that moved away and it didn't happen. Anymore because
they weren't the person that when we first became friends.
They couldn't provide that anymore for whatever reason, and it
was really painful. And there's moments where it's really painful
and you really miss them and you just want to
talk to them, but you also have to have this
(09:05):
level of respect for yourself. So can we dive into
the friendship breakup?
Speaker 1 (09:10):
Friendship breakups are honestly, in my opinion, more painful than
any romantic relationship breakup ever, and it's probably because we've
never been taught how to handle a friendship breakup. Like
when it comes to romantic relationships, we all know, okay,
we're going into it. We're seeing if this person's compatible
(09:31):
with us, we're seeing if they're long term, and we
know eventually there's going to be a breakup if ever.
But when it comes to friends, we think to ourselves,
they're going to be in our life forever until we
grow old and we're in wheelchairs. But it's it's like
a difficult place to be when you're going through that
(09:55):
because sometimes it's just pure growth. Sometimes you just drift
part because you're in different life life cycles and you're
going one way there going another way, and there's no
animosity there. It's just like life happens and we have
to drift apart and we can't keep holding on for
dear life when it's not working. Other parts of it
(10:18):
can be harsh and cruel, where I've heard a lot
of clients tell me about friends that have done terrible
things like sleeping with their fiances and just horrible things.
So that's also like part of it. And I think
also another portion of it that's become very relevant is
quiet quitting friendships or ghosting.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
I'm not a fan of it.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
I would only say it's okay to do that if
you're in danger. If you've attempted to communicate with somebody
over and over again and they just continue to disrespect you, yeah,
then cut them off. But I've seen a lot of
friendships where people see their friends like their toys and
with them, enjoy them for a good little abount of time,
(11:03):
and then discard them and ghost and don't say anything,
and you can feel icky, Wow, this person was all
excited to be my friend, and now suddenly I don't
hear from them.
Speaker 3 (11:16):
They throw me away.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
And then sometimes when you confront that, you get the
narrative of oh, I don't owe you anything, and that
really sucks.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
That really sucks.
Speaker 2 (11:29):
Yeah, there's so many different painful steps to that friendship breakup.
To your point, there's just many different levels, and none
of them get easier, especially even with time. You think,
as you get older, you just and you learn. I
don't feel like they've ever gotten easier, even especially as
an adult. I feel like it's more painful because when
you watch your circle get smaller, you know that it's
(11:50):
important because you're getting these quality friendships, but watching it
get smaller feels like you have to grieve an entire
life that's ending.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
Yeah, And it's also you second guess yourself too, because
as you grow up, at least I know, in our
femininity and with womenhood, our friends.
Speaker 3 (12:14):
Make up a big part of that.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
And when you see your friends trickle away, it kills
a little bit of your girlhood inside and it makes
you feel like am I.
Speaker 3 (12:27):
Good enough? Am I worthy?
Speaker 1 (12:30):
All these friends just keep leaving and disappearing? Is there
something wrong with me? And it's a very difficult place
to be in when you start to feel that way.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
And I can also speak from an experience of some
trauma when I was in high school, I was bullied
by girls who were once my friends, and that experience
in high school really dictated how friendships looked for me
for a really long time. So you see some clients
come in who have trauma like this, and building friendships
(13:04):
just becomes an increasingly harder situation than just your day
to day life.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
Oh yes, and I can relate to that very much.
Having your best friend be your bully not the greatest experience.
But I think we're also taught in society in the
shows that we grow up when that having that toxic
best friend and no matter what they do, you still
(13:34):
have to be best friends with them at the end.
Take Gossip Girl for example, it's like Serena and Blair
are best friends, but they're horrible to each other. They
do horrible things, sabotage gossip, go behind each other's backs
and just stab each other like figuratively, of course.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
And then you have mean girls where they push each
other in front of buses. So there's that.
Speaker 1 (13:57):
Too, allegedly, But we grow up watching this and then
it's subconsciously drilled into our heads that we have to
tolerate bad behaviors from our friends and then when we
grow older, we start to realize, oh, we shouldn't be
(14:18):
doing that, and it becomes like this thing where we're
fighting ourselves. We're building standards for ourselves.
Speaker 3 (14:25):
We don't want to.
Speaker 1 (14:26):
Accept bad behavior from people anymore, whether it's romantic or friendship,
and then we're fighting ourselves because we've been taught to
accept everyone's flaws and taught to accept all these bad behaviors.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
So where's the line? And that's what I'm trying to
teach here.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
Yeah, And it is because so much of my relearning
experience from high school and dealing with these friends who
I had sleepovers with and we talk to each other
about everything to one day just slipping on a dime
and saying horrible things and doing horrible things to me
that I had to teach myself a new pattern of friendship.
(15:08):
And as a sixteen year old girl to eighteen to
then in her early twenties and joining a sorority in college,
the emotional ways that my brain went through having friends
was just beyond me. Like I look back at the
time of my life and I'm like, how did I
even do that? Because my brain was genuinely trying to
(15:30):
develop at the same time I was being rejected and
bullied and then also okay, by the way, you have
to throw yourself into an completely new city and make
new friends while trusting that they're actually gonna be kind
to you and not do the same thing to you.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
Again, true, that's a lot of us are experienced too,
same thing in college. Same thing.
Speaker 3 (15:51):
It's learning who you are.
Speaker 1 (15:54):
You don't know who you are, you don't know anything
about yourself, and then on top of that, trying to
figure out romantically who you like, hoping that that person's
not toxic. Then trying to figure out friendships, and yeah,
dealing with friends that are mean to you and bully
to you, but at the same time trying to find
good long term friendships. And it's very overwhelming.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
Do you feel like this is why friendship gets the
low on the totem pole, because life is so overwhelming,
and then friendship you just pushed to the side because
it's the easy thing that you can always go after
at another time, and it just keeps getting knocked down
a few pegs because of this process of us being
so overwhelmed with life.
Speaker 1 (16:41):
I think yes and no, But I also think that
we've been conditioned to prioritize other things in our life.
And we've also been conditioned that boys may come and go,
but friends are forever.
Speaker 3 (16:53):
So you sit there waiting for your.
Speaker 1 (16:56):
Friend to come back around, and it's just a waiting game,
and you start to tolerate behaviors that you would not
accept anywhere else. So, yeah, when things are convenient, people
put it in the back burner. They forget about it
because you'll always be there at the end of the day.
Speaker 2 (17:15):
And this now leads me into the hot topic of
low maintenance friendships. So give me your hot take. Low
maintenance friendships. We're seeing all over the internet people are
creating all kinds of reels about how they love their
low maintenance friends.
Speaker 3 (17:29):
Oh my goodness.
Speaker 1 (17:31):
So a lot of the clients that I've had also
different people on TikTok that I've talked to about low
maintenance friendships. When I ask them, what is a low
maintenance friendship to you, everything they bring back to me
is things that I would consider a normal friendship. And
all you're doing is maintaining that friendship. You. In order
(17:55):
to gain a friendship, you need to have a base,
a foundation where you meet that person, you hang out
for quite a while. You build, start to get to
know them, you start to love them, they love you. You
hang out a lot, a lot of secrets are spilled,
live life with each other, and then time moves on
and things change, and of course you can't be communicating
(18:19):
all the time. No one's asking for twenty four to seven.
But you still keep up with your friends, even if it's.
Speaker 3 (18:25):
Once a month. You're like, hey, how's it going.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Let me text you, let me tell you about my day,
let me tell you the news.
Speaker 3 (18:32):
And people are.
Speaker 1 (18:34):
Referring to that as low maintenance friendships, when I'm like, no,
that's just maintaining the friendship.
Speaker 3 (18:42):
As you should. That's just a friendship period.
Speaker 1 (18:46):
Like this whole narrative of low and high friendships is,
it's confusing, and it's confusing people, and it's also allowing
a lot of manipulative people come in and take advantage
of those terms where they come in and say, oh,
I want a low maintenance friendship so that they don't
(19:07):
have to put in work. It's a friendship on their terms.
It's I show up whenever I need to show up,
whenever it's convenient for me. And you can't say anything
because if you do, I'm going to call you high maintenance, and.
Speaker 3 (19:21):
It's a power struggle.
Speaker 1 (19:22):
I don't think friendship should be leveled at low or high.
Speaker 3 (19:28):
It just should be equal. It's a balancing game.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
And if you're low and the other one's high, then
there's a power struggle and you're probably not compatible and
you probably shouldn't be friends. So there's no such thing
as a low maintenance friendship. It's just a friendship that
you are maintaining at a pace that you are comfortable with,
that you and your friend have agreed upon.
Speaker 3 (19:54):
And that's all it is.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
And the rest of it is just a way to
avoid emotional responsible ability, avoid accountability, and to shift the
blame on somebody else that's actually asking for consistency.
Speaker 3 (20:08):
That's all.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
That's a mic draft hot take, and I love it
because I agree when you sit here and explain it
that way. I agree. Because you think of a relationship,
and as you stay with a person, you get more
comfortable with them, and life becomes easy and communication becomes
easy because you're used to this life with this person.
The same thing is happening in friendships. But we're not
(20:31):
calling relationships low maintenance relationships. No, no, But here we
are doing it to friendships.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
It's because I guess it gots skewed somewhere where it's Oh,
I don't have to constantly be on top of my friend.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
Which I think is good. That's healthy. Like you're not
supposed to be on top.
Speaker 1 (20:55):
Of your friend being like, hey, when are you texting
me back?
Speaker 3 (20:58):
Why haven't you answered?
Speaker 2 (21:01):
I think we have bigger problems there.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
Yes, And if you have to do that, maybe you
need to revisit whether this friendship dynamic is good for
you or not, because if they're ignoring you, maybe we
shouldn't be friends.
Speaker 3 (21:15):
That's all. But people that are friends, you don't have
to talk every day.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
You just have to be consistently there for each other,
no matter how that looks. For your relationship, that's between
you and that friend.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
And that's it.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
And here we're gonna continue some hot takes. I'm gonna
tell you a few thoughts that I have, and I
want to know your opinion. Okay, if you are in
a relationship, you should always make time with your friends
outside of that relationship. Even if you hang out with
that partner and your friend, you should also make time
for solo time with your friend.
Speaker 3 (21:50):
Amen.
Speaker 2 (21:51):
Okay, thank you preach. I feel like this is so
important that I don't understand why I have to keep
saying this. But you can have a life outside of
your partner with your friends.
Speaker 1 (22:03):
You should have a life outside your partner with your friend,
and if you do not, then we need to talk
about that some way, somehow, because if you're already your
independent self before a man comes in or whoever your
preference is, you cannot just completely neglect your individual self
(22:25):
and everything that makes you you, including your friends.
Speaker 3 (22:28):
Once the romantic.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
Box has been checked, this person cannot be your entirety.
And I think that kind of happens way too much,
where we're striving so much to get married, to find
the one, and then once we do.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
It's like, all right, now what.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
I don't have any friends because I didn't keep up
with them. I don't have any individual self because I
haven't taken.
Speaker 3 (22:57):
Care of myself.
Speaker 1 (22:58):
I don't have any hobbies, I don't know what to do,
and then depression hits.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
It's a vicious cycle that we get into. So thank you,
hot take. Yes, we're on the same page. This other
one is that you should be there for your friends,
not just when times are very tough, but especially when
times are very good. Yes, I think showing up for
both is what makes a good friend, because there's this
(23:27):
belief in my eyes that if all you can do
is show up for the bad times, are you here
to see that I failed? Or are you really here
to be there for me? If you're not here in
any other time of my life, but this is the
only time. Why, That's how exactly that's how I view that.
And then but if you can't show up for me
in the good times, and you're celebrating me like I
(23:49):
had a big party when I started this podcast with
my friends. I did a big dinner and everybody who
shut it up. I was so thankful because me getting
married or having a baby or no, it was me
just creating a podcast. But I wanted to celebrate it
because it was important to me, and they showed up
and celebrated it like it was my birthday.
Speaker 3 (24:07):
I love that.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
See, And this is like my hot take because I
think a lot of people feel like when they have
a friend who shows up in the dark times, that's
a great friend. But I just do they also show
up in both so.
Speaker 1 (24:19):
Thoughts, Yes, one hundred percent, I think they need to
show up in both, Like you cannot have a friend
that only shows up for you in the darkest times,
because sooner or later they're conditioned to see you in
your lowest point. And some people get a kick out
of it. It sucks, but they get a kick out
(24:41):
of watching someone have it worse than they do. And
it sucks to realize that in a friend that you
really love and care about, But you have to pay
attention to whether they're there to celebrate you or not.
Speaker 3 (24:56):
And if they're not there.
Speaker 1 (24:58):
To pull you out of the muck, clean you off,
and then be like.
Speaker 3 (25:04):
You're out of there, let's go get drinks.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
I don't think that's a good friend.
Speaker 3 (25:10):
And I think we agree on that.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Yep.
Speaker 4 (25:13):
See, these are hot takes though, and I don't I
just wish they weren't. I know, I don't understand why
these are like controversial beliefs in friendships, but they are.
Speaker 2 (25:23):
And I think it's also really easy for things to
get lost in life and you just make sure, oh,
my friend's going through it. I need to make sure
I'm there, But you also need to make sure you're
there in the mundane and the normal, and also not
forgetting about your friend when you decide to find a
boyfriend or a girlfriend. YEH think those are a reasonable
(25:45):
ass of a friend.
Speaker 3 (25:46):
I think that's a reasonable ask.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Yes. And speaking of these high value because you know what,
we're putting this on high value friends. This is what
high value friends do. You had done a content piece
on social media where you're talking about the three behaviors
of high val value friends you should be looking for.
And I'm so curious like to detail what these are
because when you are an adult, making friends is hard
(26:09):
and finding the right friends is also hard. So what
should we be looking for?
Speaker 1 (26:14):
I think you need to figure out exactly what you're
looking for in a friend, exactly what you're looking for.
It's the same as you're looking for the one or
your romantic partner.
Speaker 3 (26:24):
You have a list.
Speaker 1 (26:25):
I want him to have this, and I want this,
I want this, kind of the same with your friends.
Speaker 3 (26:29):
But the problem that we end up doing is we.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
Hang out with someone and we pick them because their
vibe is cool, and we're like, oh, we mesh really well,
they're my friend, and then whatever attributes or characteristics you
have created in your head, that's a friend for me,
for example, a friend to me is honest, accountable, loyal.
So I pick someone I'm like, they have a cool vibe,
(26:53):
they're my friend. I automatically think to myself, Oh, they
have to be honest, to loyal and accountable. Have they
proven that to me? No? I just met this person,
we just hung out few times. Their vibe is cool, okay,
But do I know anything about the characteristics. No? And
(27:14):
then later down the line we end up finding out
the hard way that this person's not honest and they're
a little bit of a liar, or they're disloyal, or
they can't hold themselves accountable for anything.
Speaker 3 (27:28):
And then we go.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
Into a huge cycle of having to do the difficult thing,
which is falling out of love with someone that you
care about and having to remove them from your life,
which is not easy. So I think it's a lot
easier to start to vet your friends first, figure out
your standards, figure out your non negotiables before you get
(27:51):
into a long term friendship with someone that you don't know.
Speaker 2 (27:55):
Yeah, that's really important, and it's also just a great
to have for all your things in life. Know what
you're going after, know what you want. It's something that
you can use interchangeably for so many different things, so
why should it be any different with friends. We really
like to change the game when it comes to friendships.
Speaker 1 (28:14):
Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
I don't know why.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
But also I'm trying to also change the narrative behind
it's difficult to make friends. I don't think it's difficult
to make friends.
Speaker 3 (28:26):
There are a.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
Lot of us out there that love to talk about friendship,
that are looking for genuine friendship. Of course there are outliers,
but I think it's also a mentality of how to
go in it. If you're going into it with a
desperate energy or with the mentality of it's really hard
to make friends, you're gonna have a really hard time
(28:48):
making friends, Or if you go into it saying, you
know what, I know who I am. I know I'm
a valuable friend, and whoever comes into my life and
really wants to be my friend not to.
Speaker 3 (29:01):
Be like too much, but they're blessed.
Speaker 1 (29:03):
And it's that thought process. And I had to do
that myself, moving to a new place and doing the
bumblebff thing. I was terrified, but then I was like,
you know what, No, I've healed, I've grown, i know
what I'm looking for and I'm going to go in
it and be strategic.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
And I met a lot of good girls.
Speaker 1 (29:25):
I also met a lot of flaky girls, and nothing
against them. I don't hate them, but it's like, you're
not my cup of tea. That's okay, I'll go for
the champagne.
Speaker 2 (29:36):
Over here and correct me if I'm wrong. But a
lot of my experience I was someone who moved to
a new city, created an entire life for myself, and
a lot of the questions that I always get here,
how do you do it? How do you make friends?
It's so hard. Here's all of this, and so much
(29:56):
of where I made friends and where I really thrived
was one myself out there in the first place. It's
just like with dating. You have to put yourself out there.
I know, we all want to meet people on our
couch and that's how life works. No, it's not. You
actually have to put yourself out there and go and
do life. Be living life and to just be open
to it, be open that a friends can come anywhere.
(30:19):
It's how The friend that I mentioned, who I made
as a really good friend in the last year, came
from me trying out a new gym by myself. She
was a trainer there and we would just talk every
time I came in, and over the course of time,
I went through a bad breakup and she was like,
let's go get a sandwich. You don't look like you've
eat very much. And from then on we became best friends.
(30:40):
And that was so unexpected and not anything that I
was looking for or needed. But I was open to it,
and I was willing to create a new friend because
I was just always in this space that you can
never have enough friends, you can never have enough love
in your life. And so much of me being an
adult and creating the life that I've created in a
city that I didn't know a single soul is because
(31:02):
of those two things.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
Oh, this is just such a beautiful story, honestly, and
it's so true too.
Speaker 3 (31:10):
It's so true.
Speaker 1 (31:11):
You have to be open to finding friends. You can't
tell yourself it's hard. I'm never gonna find friends because
you're going into it from a place of loneliness. And
when your energy is in a place of loneliness, you're
not really going to find quality people.
Speaker 3 (31:27):
You're going to get.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
That type of energy back, and it's not a good
place to be.
Speaker 3 (31:34):
I think how to make new friends.
Speaker 1 (31:37):
Is like you said, you have to do things that
you would normally do for yourself hobbies. Like I met
a girl through Pilate's class, and it was stupid. All
I did was give her a towel. I was like,
she's like looking around. I was like, do you need
a towel, Yeah, okay, I'll grab you one. Grab her
a towel, give her a towel. Boom we started talking.
(31:59):
See it can be that simple. You just have to
show up, go to places that you want to go
to be consistent about it, because if you show up
only once every six months, the people that are regulars
aren't going to get to know you. Show up, be present,
do the things that you like to do and you enjoy,
and you'll find like minded people.
Speaker 2 (32:21):
And you'll also find this basis that maybe you don't
want to be in. You might go and try a
new place and be like, I've been doing this for
a while and I just really can't quite seem to
stick here. I feel like I should try something new,
and you should. If that's the way that it feels.
There's a reason for that, Yep, exactly.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
But that's also part of learning who you are.
Speaker 3 (32:42):
And what you like. And it's the same when it
comes to friends.
Speaker 1 (32:45):
You got to go out there, talk to a bunch
of people, learn what you're looking for in a friend.
Speaker 3 (32:51):
And it just because you don't they don't vibe with you.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
Or they're not your cup of tea, doesn't make them
a bad person, doesn't make you a horrible person.
Speaker 3 (32:59):
For choosing them.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
It's just you need to find your people.
Speaker 2 (33:05):
That's all it is. It is. And I wanted to
ask you because we did talk about hot takes a
little bit, but and I shared some of mine. I
made you share one of yours about low maintenance. Do
you have any other hot takes about friendship? Because I
feel like this is where it's fun and sometimes again
we just need a little tough love.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
I feel like the basic ones we've hit when it
comes to friends, ditching you for another romantic person.
Speaker 3 (33:34):
I don't think that's okay.
Speaker 1 (33:36):
I think also ghosting your friends, I don't think that's
good behavior. You should not have to disappear for months
at a time and then expect everything to be there
and convenient for you. Once you decide it's convenient for
you to show back up. Sometimes, just in friendships, just
(33:59):
like in relationship. You got to do the hard things.
If you're struggling, you need to communicate that your friends
are not mind readers. They don't know what's going on
in your head. And if you're really in a place
where you're struggling, communicate that and give them the opportunity
to support you, to help you through it so that
you're not alone. But I tend to see a lot
(34:21):
of it where people just ghost disappear, don't communicate. Their
friends are texting them like, hey, what's going on. You're
not answering like are you okay? They don't hear anything,
and then you pop back in and you expect everything
to be good and dandy, and then you're mad at
(34:43):
them for being mad at you for disappearing, and it's.
Speaker 3 (34:49):
A vicious cycle. And I don't think it's okay.
Speaker 1 (34:51):
And I think it's okay to hold your friends accountable
if they're going through those ghosting spells, And like, you
wouldn't let a man back into your life if he's
ghosted you for months, Why are you going to allow
that same treatment from your friends?
Speaker 2 (35:06):
It is Hey, ghosting is never a good thing. Honestly,
it's one of the worst things we can do to people.
And the only time I've ever approved of it is
if you've taken a lot of effort to really try
and put into something and it's just not being heard.
You just have to back away sometimes and let life happen.
And if you're supposed to have that conversation, then it'll
(35:28):
come to fruition. But that's truly the only time where
I'm like, it's okay if you need to disappear. Beyond that,
we're adults, we're supposed to have conversations, agreed.
Speaker 1 (35:38):
I think you can disappear, go no contact if you're
really in danger this person's not okay, do what you
need to do to protect yourself. Or you've attempted to
communicate on multiple occasions, You've attempted to set boundaries on
multiple occasions, the person just doesn't want to change, they
don't want to respect back to your boundaries, then it's
(36:01):
okay to just end it. But at the end of
the day, that's to me, is not ghosting, because ghosters
tend to always come back.
Speaker 2 (36:09):
They do. They're on this little rotation of the earth
cycle or something.
Speaker 1 (36:14):
To me, that's going no contact, that's the end of
a relationship. You're not going back to that person because
you've had enough.
Speaker 3 (36:20):
Is enough if you had enough.
Speaker 1 (36:22):
But ghosters tend to they get a high from disappearing
and coming back and just having people that they pluck
and having friendship on their terms.
Speaker 3 (36:32):
And I go back.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
To people using people like their toys. Oh, I'm bored
with this toy, Chuck, Let's use this truck.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
Apparently we're in toy story and who is the child
that they're out all the toys?
Speaker 3 (36:50):
I don't know the evil one.
Speaker 2 (36:53):
There was a few of them and they just kept
getting like discarded. So basically we're discarded Toy story toys.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
Horrible.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
I know it is, but you know what, the toy
story toys have great lives. So that means that we
can all also have good lives and make new friends.
That's exactly what that means.
Speaker 1 (37:11):
Yes, and the discarded toys always end up getting saved
and make great friendships.
Speaker 2 (37:18):
Yep, exactly, So life happens on the other side of it.
This is what we're paying attention to. Sabrina. I'm so
happy that you came on. I like to end the
podcast with whether it be a piece of advice, motivation, inspiration,
or just something that maybe we didn't even get to
an address and you just want to talk about it,
but the platform might serve over to you and say,
(37:40):
end us on something that you'd like to end us on.
Speaker 1 (37:43):
Okay, let's see drum roll please, Okay. I think that
each one of us should know that we are enough
and we're never asking for too much.
Speaker 3 (37:59):
We're women. We can do it all.
Speaker 1 (38:02):
Career, romantic relationships, family, we can do it all. Why
not friendships so we can have amazing friends in our life.
We can have the career that we dream of, we
can have the man that we dream of, or whatever
our preferences, and we can honestly have it all. So
don't think you're asking for too much, because you're not.
(38:25):
You're just building the whole package for your life. And
That's where I'm going to end it.
Speaker 2 (38:31):
I love it. See, this is why we turn it
over because it's always a fun little thing to end on.
So Sabrina, thank you for joining me, Thanks for sharing
your expertise and taking some time to hang out.
Speaker 3 (38:41):
Thank you for having me. I'm so excited.
Speaker 2 (38:45):
Tough love is important, and this episode feels like it
reminded us all what we deserve in every relationship in
our lives, but particularly with friendships. So go out today
and be a good friend. Call or send a tex
to that friend who means everything to you always. I'm
so happy you're here. I can't wait for y'all to
hear the Girl Chat in coming next week. Love you bye,
Host
Morgan Huelsman
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