Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
This program is designed to provide general information with regards
to the subject matters covered. This information is given with
the understanding that neither the hosts, guests, sponsors, or station
are engaged in rendering any specific and personal medical, financial,
legal counseling, professional service, or any advice.
Speaker 2 (00:22):
You should seek the services.
Speaker 1 (00:23):
Of competent professionals before applying or trying any suggested ideas.
Speaker 3 (00:29):
At the end of the day, it's not about what
you have or even what you've accomplished. It's about what
you've done with those accomplishments. It's about who you've lifted up,
who you've made better. It's about what you've given back.
Denzel Washington, welcome to Inspire Vision. Our sole purpose is
to elevate the lives of others and to inspire you
(00:51):
to do the same.
Speaker 4 (00:52):
Albert welcome to the show.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
Thank you, Thank you for having me. Really happy to
be here.
Speaker 4 (00:57):
Doctor Doug Well, I'm looking forward to looking forward to it.
I'd love for you to share. Number One, you've written
a book. Can you tell the outage what the book
is and what the name of it is.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
Sure it's called Rise Above the Script.
Speaker 5 (01:11):
Confronting Self Doubt and Mastering Self sabotage for performing artists.
It was published in twenty twenty four, and it was
based on my doctoral thesis why Actors self Sabotage? And
so just give you a backstory. I professionally I work
with actors. I am a Talian agent in New York.
So I represent actors professionally for film, TV, theater Broadway
(01:34):
off Broadway, and I've been doing this for you know,
over twenty years, since two thousand and four. But when
I first started, I was noticing a lot of actors
were self sabotage and which means that they were shooting
of themselves in a foot, denying themselves an opportunity to
get getting in their own way. And as a you know,
(01:55):
I was also starting to go for my PhD in
psychology and as a you know, doctor lital student, and
sort of like my scientific mind was like starting to
get curious, you know, why is this happening? And so
I decided to do different a dissertation, solve a problem
in a sense.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
So that's what you know, This is how the book
kind of came out. So it's been years, it's been
the progress for years.
Speaker 5 (02:18):
And while the book is geared towards actors and been
written you know, initially for actors. It's really there's a
lot of good insight in here that can really be
topical to anybody.
Speaker 4 (02:30):
Well, and that's true. You know, you talk about to actors,
and you know you mentioned the imposter syndrome, and I
know there's a specific psychological definition for that, but I've
I've come up with my own definition, or at least
an alternate definition, and that's people who are acting. They
are literally acting as though they think they should act
(02:52):
and behave rather than who they really are. And and
so it all in the case. We're all kinds of actors,
aren't we.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Yeah, I mean we're playing a role well every day,
you know, like.
Speaker 5 (03:04):
Whether you know, whether we're with our family, with in
our professional circles, you know, where our you know, see
when others were playing different roles when their parents where
their child.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
You know, children, if we have children, we're playing different roles.
Speaker 5 (03:18):
We're playing you know, Carl Young called it the persona,
you know, we're putting on a persona. So yeah, we
think about wolfs sort of actors. And I think even
your definition can you know, even fit into the traditional
definition to some level, because you know, if you're saying
it putting, if you're acting, maybe you're not acting, you know,
(03:38):
any authentic way.
Speaker 4 (03:40):
So true. And when you when you talk about rising
about the script, what what is the script? What's your
definition of the script? For people?
Speaker 2 (03:47):
The script?
Speaker 5 (03:48):
The script is different than you know, when people hear script,
they think of the you know, a paper or you know,
a play.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Or something they're reading.
Speaker 5 (03:55):
But here I'm talking with the script in your mind,
your especially your subconscious mind.
Speaker 4 (04:00):
Okay, yeah, right, so let's let's get into that. I mean,
as you've noticed the actors and you know, you mentioned
a little bit earlier before we came on that you
work with a number of students and so who are
not necessarily actors, right.
Speaker 5 (04:17):
Right, you know, but if you want to think on
a pure scheme of things or acting, they are actors
or students. But what I've noticed even with them is like,
you know, some of them are really are really bright
and really intelligent, but they they would stop coming to class,
they would stop doing the work, and I couldn't figure
out what's really happening here, you know, initially in the beginning,
(04:41):
or they would even like talk, you know, use negative
self talk, you know, or I'm not a good test
achor I'm not a good student, and they would actually
really verbatimly tell that, explicitly say that. So I've always
wondered what what's really going on here?
Speaker 4 (04:56):
Yeah, it's interesting how they they start to talk in
themselves and that becomes their reality when in fact, you know,
and this is a tough one because you talk about
reality and you know, from my understanding, reality is strictly
based on our perceptions, mainly subconscious, and that becomes reality.
(05:16):
And your reality is going to be so different than
my reality.
Speaker 5 (05:20):
Of course, and that's our reality subjective. There's really no
objective reality.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
Yeah, yeah, like and you know, even on a.
Speaker 5 (05:27):
Pure you know, if you you know, for the listeners
out there, think about you go to see a movie
with a friend. You know, you could have thought it
was the greatest movie ever in your friend could have
thought it was, you know, a terrible movie. Yeah, And
the question is who's who's right, who's correct?
Speaker 2 (05:40):
And you both are, you know.
Speaker 5 (05:42):
In a sense, because it's your perception.
Speaker 4 (05:46):
Yeah, that's so true. So we've mentioned imposter syndrome. Can you,
as a psychologist, could you share with the audience the
actual definition of the imposter syndrome is the idea.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
Of imposter syndrome. The word imposter means for yes, you know.
Speaker 5 (06:01):
So what happens very often is, you know, we start
to doubt ourselves and we start to feel like we're frauds,
like you know, I know there's also a fear of
we're going to be found out two that we're frauds,
you know, like for me, you know, it could be like, uh, well,
you know, whether like if I'm debating.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
I want to write a book or not.
Speaker 5 (06:22):
You know, no one's gonna take I'm gonna get bad reviews,
no one's gonna like my book. So what will happen
is I'll we'll do it period. I won't put myself
out there or if they think that someone's gonna find out,
I really don't know everything. And therefore the best way
to steal myself from that is I won't apply myself.
I won't put myself out there. It'll be safe when
(06:42):
we play it safe. And so it's it's really a
self imposed limitation too.
Speaker 4 (06:48):
And and is it usually based on what fear or
what is it?
Speaker 5 (06:53):
Multiple factors, but fear, I would say it would be
the primary motivated, primary focus would be fear, uh, fear
of failure, and even fear of success too.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Success can be scary.
Speaker 4 (07:06):
Well, and you know that's interesting. You hear so many
different levels of intellect saying, you know, do not fear,
thou shalt not fear, on and on and on, and
yet there seems to be one of the major experiences
that we all have to some degree. Yeah, level, how
do you work with how do you work with your students?
(07:26):
How do you work with people who are exhibiting a
great deal of fear and how do you observe what
their behavior is? How do you pick up the fact
that in working with someone that, okay, one of their
major challenges is fear.
Speaker 5 (07:43):
Well, it would be looking for the signs like they
don't want to try anything new.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
They want to say in their routine, their comfort zone
and that's the biggest, you know thing, One of the
biggest tell tale signs is.
Speaker 5 (07:54):
Someone unwilling to step outside their comfort zone and try
anything new or you know, take any risks. You know, again,
playing it safe is probably the biggest indicator. If they're
playing it safe by not doing, you know, things that
would make them slightly uncomfortable. Again, it could be you know,
putting your resume out there could be you know, going
(08:15):
on stage to make a resentation.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
You know, that could be scary.
Speaker 5 (08:19):
So one of the best ways to the only way
you're going to really overcome fear is by.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Facing it, you know, by facing your fears. So that
would mean.
Speaker 5 (08:28):
Putting yourself out there, you know, by you know, whether
it's even if it's speaking. You know, if you have
a fear of public speaking, go speak in a small stage.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
You know five ten people.
Speaker 5 (08:40):
Do even do something on zoom, you know that where
it's safe from your own home, at least in the beginning,
and then gradually build from there. So the only way
you're going to face that fear or really get over
that fear, overcome that fear is by facing it head
on and by confronting it so you know, again you
know that fear is going to work against an actor
(09:02):
because as an actor or performer, you really have to
put yourself out there if you want to have a
working liver or any momentum of success, so that the
fear of additioning or the fear of putting yourself out
there has to be overcome.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
And you know, a lot of times we're in denial.
Speaker 5 (09:21):
We might we don't even realize a lot of times
we have these fears, you know, consciously.
Speaker 4 (09:26):
Yeah, And you know, it's interesting as I've interviewed a
number of lovely ladies who have gone through some horrendous
experiences in their life and found themselves in that those
codependent relationships with people with men who are abusers, right,
and they can't get out of it, and ultimately they do.
But as we've talked about that, one of the biggest
(09:48):
things that comes up is the fear of change. In
other words, they're more fearful of change than they are
of the present environment and experience. So as you talk
about fear, we've got fear of change, We've got fear
that I'm not good enough. What are some of the
other fears that come about that are really imprints in
(10:09):
people's subconscious minds, That is, they had no control over
that initially.
Speaker 5 (10:17):
Yeah, fear of disappointing others, letting other people down. And
I think that also ties in a whole codependency or
the people pleasing mindset. Is well, if I say no,
if I put my when I set a boundary, I'm
going to disappoint them. And maybe that could do with
the way we were raised too, because very often I
would I would even imagine that a lot of these
(10:38):
you know, codependent women and men, you know, because I
believe it's it's an equal yes.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
Thing grow up.
Speaker 5 (10:46):
I think even with parents that they had to jump
through hoops to get their parents' approval, whether again that
was reality their perception that they had to work really
hard to get their parents' approval, and maybe they didn't
get enough of that, so they substitute adult relationships to
their parents in this sense that goes out subconsciously, so
(11:07):
they're fear of letting other people down again, fear of success.
Fear of money is also a one that I kind
of discovered that I wrote a chapter Brothers in my book,
it's fear of money because a lot of times you
meet grow up in families where you're told money is
the root of all evil. I'm not an evil person,
you know, I don't want to be evil. And actually
(11:28):
that quote was taken out of context.
Speaker 4 (11:30):
Oh yeah, there's a lot of things that are taken
out of context that really have inundated people with a
feeling of guilt, of shame, of all of those types
of things. So how often how often is you're working
with people and you know, this gets to be a
very delicate subject. And I've had other people talk about
(11:51):
it a little bit, and definitely some psychologists talk about
the fact that you know, as you're starting to work
with people who are really self sabotaging, as you can
observe that you know they're in the imposter syndrome, they're
self sabotaging, they're not experiencing the life that they truly
deserve or could have, and they go off to therapy, okay,
(12:15):
and they go through talk therapy and nothing gets resolved.
And you know, having a PhD in psychology, this might
be a sensitive issue there. But I know, just based
on reading your bio and going to your website that
you use NLP you probably I don't know. I think
you use hypnosis. You're using all sorts of tools rather
(12:38):
than just talking. And can you talk a little bit
about that to the audience who are seeking some help.
What are some of the things that they need to
look for in an individual that can really be of
value to them as a mentor or whatever you want
to call them.
Speaker 5 (12:54):
What you know, obviously you want someone who's not personally
in you, someone who's you know, going to be objective.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
And also, you know, i'll slat out the reason why.
Speaker 5 (13:08):
I studied it, this is LP, was because I was
a little disillusioned with psychology. You know, I wasn't you
know when I was going to grad school. You know,
for some my master's and PhD, we have a lot
you know, some professors that were telling us about cases
that they were working with someone who was in their
office for years for therapy.
Speaker 2 (13:27):
And I kept outing adding up in my head.
Speaker 5 (13:29):
I'm thinking, if you're you know, going for eight or
nine years of therapy and the client is not getting better,
and something isn't adding up here, something is out working.
So I felt like, you know, the reason why I
d up. It's a little more rapid, you know, it's
a little more fast paid, and you know, sometimes it's
just getting out of your head and and you know,
(13:51):
reframing things and.
Speaker 4 (13:54):
Working with some Let's talk about NLP just a little bit,
because I think it's important for people to understand some
of these processes that are available that they should look
for in a professional and one of them, I know
is NLP. You talked about reframing, So when you're working
with someone and you use the NLP process, what are
(14:15):
you actually trying to accomplish with with your person.
Speaker 5 (14:20):
For you know, for a little bit of shift and
mentality or thought process, looking at things in a different way,
viewing things in a different light.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
So we're not denying the experience.
Speaker 5 (14:34):
What we're doing is like I said, changing it, turning
it around, and you know, looking at either the bright
side or the learning experience from that. So one of
the things of NLP is like, there's no such thing
as failure, only feedback. So reframing failure or mistakes as
learning opportunities because that's this way it empowers a person
(14:55):
to not beat themselves up.
Speaker 2 (14:57):
You know that, okay, this is learning opportunity.
Speaker 5 (15:00):
And when I work with actors, one of the things
another you know, NLP reframe my youth when it comes
through rejection, because I hear a lot of people say
about the word rejection, and I've always felt like, there's
no such thing as rejection. It's just simply that your
services are not needed right now or today. Because rejection
(15:21):
is personal, it means like you know, then it starts
ringing your subconscious when you keep your own rejection, it's like, well,
that means you're rejecting me at my core, you know,
and strictly from an acting perspective, all there's only one
person that get to hire for a role or for
any job, and there's gonna be hundreds of applicants sometimes
and only one person can get the job.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
So it's not personal, you know.
Speaker 5 (15:44):
And I think if you cause it freezes there, you know,
if you really adopt that, it's not personal. Okay, Well
you know, now what and what what can I learn
from that?
Speaker 4 (15:55):
Any Any stories of people you've worked with without using
their names obviously, but where you have where they have
been really experiencing you know, failure or whatever that happens
to be, and by using that approach of NLP, that
you've been able literally to help them reframe that experience
in that event and watch them come out of that
(16:17):
into a much more positive, successful situation. Any stories you
can share.
Speaker 2 (16:21):
Yeah, I mean even I'll tell so too.
Speaker 5 (16:24):
One was from an actress I kind of was working with.
I was used to be occasionally be guessed in an
acting class, given like my agent perspective on things, and
there was this one actors who were studying.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
For over ten years.
Speaker 5 (16:39):
I just wasn't booking work, and then I just kind
of would work together in Dahr in mind myself worked
with her to step into her power and step into
her you know sweet spot, which was like her type
was tough, powerful heart of gold, and so we really
had mentally reheard that tough, powerful heart of gold. How
(17:00):
would someone with a tough, powerful heart of gold order
a coffee from the brussa.
Speaker 2 (17:03):
I would someone with a.
Speaker 5 (17:04):
Tough, powerful heart of gold, you know, talk to a
customer and you know, just simple things like that that
reframe when she started getting.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
Into a power. It took me.
Speaker 5 (17:12):
Took her a few months before she booked a couple
of speaking.
Speaker 2 (17:16):
Roles in TV, you know, in network TV projects.
Speaker 5 (17:22):
Another time, this was you know, several years ago, you know,
as a college professor, I put class participation as part
of the great you know, not not a large percentage,
but just percentages are great, you know, at.
Speaker 2 (17:34):
The end of the semester.
Speaker 5 (17:36):
So I had one student at the end of the
second class send me an email saying like, I think,
I don't I don't appreciate that this is kind of you.
Speaker 2 (17:45):
Know, not fair that you're putting, you know, requiring her
class participation.
Speaker 5 (17:51):
So rather than getting myself getting defensive what you think
a out of purpose probably would have.
Speaker 2 (17:56):
I responded as if you know, no.
Speaker 5 (17:59):
You're helping me out your I want to hear your
perspective on things. You have such interesting things to say,
and so can we work on you know, you contributing
a little bit here, you know, I want to hear
what you have to say. And so it was a
class and when I refrained it is that by the
end of the semesters he was one of the most
(18:20):
vocal students in the class.
Speaker 4 (18:21):
Wow.
Speaker 5 (18:22):
So a lot of it is just simple reframing and
you know, whether again the mistakes, what did you learn
from that? What can you do the next time?
Speaker 4 (18:35):
Well, you're different about you're reframing and your you know,
at least in my mind right now, you're talking about
very surface re framing that people could learn to do
that as they start to experience things, they can say,
all right, they can step outside themselves and observe what's
going on and reframe that and help them to understand Okay,
this will be a little bit different when you go
(18:57):
a little bit deeper. I had someone I was working
with and we had gone through a number of personality
profiling lessons and so on and so forth. And about
a year later he called me up and he said, hey,
can we get together And I said, sure, yeah, I
come out over to the house. And so he came
over and we were talking. He says, I am just sabotaging.
(19:19):
I am just making such terrible decisions and I can't
figure out why. And he had gone through a lot
of stuff with me, and so I said, all right,
let's let's do this. Let's use an NLP process, and
I explained a little bit about what that is, and
let's see if we can get to the rt cause
of what's going on here. And so we went through
a very very specific ANALP process, and we got back
(19:42):
to his childhood and grade school where he remembers his
teacher saying you're stupid and put him in the back
of the classroom. And as we looked at that, and
as we talked about it and obviously reframed it, and
as he was able to consciously reframe that and realize,
(20:04):
you know, I had nothing to do with him, because
he was extremely bright. But the reality is that that teacher,
for some reason was expressing emotions in a way and
perhaps even being a bit of a bully or he
was doing something that was creating an emotion in her,
and so she just put him in the back of
the room. Once he got that reframed, all of a sudden,
(20:26):
I saw him change a position within his company and
he just became prolific. He started making more money than
it never made. It was just amazing what he did.
And so to me, that was so interesting to realize
that as you can help someone literally get back to
the real nitty gritty of childhood and some of those
(20:48):
type of imprints that reframing those experiences can make such
a difference. Do you get that deep sometimes with fire.
Speaker 5 (20:56):
Yeah, I mean what it sounds a bit is that
you're working with some of the cool cold timeline, you know,
where it's going back to an earlier imprinting.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
You know, something where.
Speaker 5 (21:06):
It's an imprint where you know, a remark even it
could be an innocent, casual remark that someone may you know,
not realizing what they said, but it really like become
embedded in a subconscious.
Speaker 2 (21:18):
Mind, so.
Speaker 5 (21:20):
You know, and and that can sometimes be you know,
going back to childhood and change and reframing that there's
a technique, it's really it's kind of deeper work, but
that I've used this something called the inner child work,
or you know where we heal the inner child. So
all of us, you know, if you want to, if
you believe that we all have the inner a little
(21:42):
minime inside of us that still maintains our child like
innocence and wonder and sometimes if that child is wounded,
you know again or maybe you know remark with all
innocent remarks are not as the way is it, but
like small remarks that our parents are teacher to have said.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
Doesn't have to be a major trauma.
Speaker 5 (22:02):
Just gonna be like little things, a little you know,
day in the life traumas and the sense that just
add up. So sometimes what I might do, even in
a going stepping outside yourself, is like telling that going
back and down, that little child, that little boy or
that little girl, that everything's going to be okay, and
that you know you are smart, you are intelligent, and
(22:25):
that I found has been very profound.
Speaker 4 (22:28):
Well, and it's interesting, isn't it? As you say? You know,
as parents, we may make certain remarks to our children
which we think are very positive, but the thing that
we cannot control is their perception of what they just said,
and that perception as we you know, as we know,
becomes their reality and their belief which stays with them
(22:50):
until they can get back to the point where they
reframe that and become conscious about that. So how how
much do you get into this whole concept of not
only I identifying what those limiting self destructive behaviors are
and beliefs are, but how much you get into mindset,
into consciousness, uh, and recognizing that individual who can truly
(23:14):
become conscious and aware of those type of situations and
acknowledge them rather than allowing them to affect them. How
how are you able to get into that?
Speaker 5 (23:25):
Well, just by reframing and putting, you know, gently pointing
you know, kind of letting, you know, pointing things out
of you know, similarities here. Because I feel like once
you are able to consciously, you know, call out these
patterns in yourself, that's where change can begin, you know,
true change can begin the insight you know again you
(23:47):
kind of it's like, oh, that's saying you don't know
who you don't know? You know, in a sense it's
a double you know for mind there. But it's true.
And I think that a lot of it is just
becoming aware of it, because then you can develop what
we call growth mindset, which is, you know, one of
the most valuable skills have. There's a book that you know,
(24:09):
I loved, you know, growing when I was in grad
schools Mindset by Carol Dweck, And you know, she talked
about the importance of a growth mindset, uh, and how
that is really important for developing resiliency building buffers in
a sense. So, you know, having a growth mindset, you know,
(24:31):
extremely important being will learn, you know, learn from.
Speaker 2 (24:34):
Mistakes and learn from challenges and actually enjoy them.
Speaker 4 (24:37):
So as you talk about that, I know, one thing
you talk about in your book is techniques are raising
self esteem. And as we talk about self esteem as
a definition, really isn't that anyone who's experiencing these subconscious
beliefs that literally caused them to think about good enough,
blah blah blah, all these types of things. And because
(24:58):
you're talking about techniques to raise self esteem, what what
what are you talking about in your book? What are
some of those steps that you could share with the
audience who may be experiencing a lack of self esteem
or high esteem to help them to start to develop
a better sense of self esteem.
Speaker 5 (25:14):
Well, one of the techniques I took overall about is
creating what I call a happy file, which is a journal.
They are taking a journal of all the things that
you're you know, either grateful for or even all the
things that happened to you that was positive. You know,
someone gave you a good compliment, We've got a good
performance in review at work, or you know, you've got
(25:37):
good feedback from an audition, or you know, if you're
a performer, you got a good review, you know, feedback
from the audience or a review. Every little thing you
document and then when you're having those moments of self doubt,
pull out that to remind you, pull out your happy file.
Speaker 2 (25:52):
So that's one technique that I talk about.
Speaker 5 (25:55):
Also, the company you keep too, I mean a lot
of you know, help in the psychology. You know, experts
will tell you, you know, you're some of the company
you keep. Yes, So so it might mean changing the
company you're around too. You know, hang out with other
more successful people because they'll puld you up.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
Consequently, being a negative people will bring it down.
Speaker 4 (26:21):
Well, and that's so true, isn't it. And that can
be really tough sometimes sometimes as family members that are
literally in the negative influences on you. So how do
you help people to make that disconnect and have the
courage literally to make that disconnect and to realize that
that's part of what's affecting them in a negative way.
Speaker 5 (26:42):
Yeah, well pointing that out and also point you know,
really it's gonna take time, but I think the important
thing to understand it's not about you personally, even though
they may be, you know, saying negative remarks about you
or or shooting it on your accomplishments, a lot of
it has to do with their own their own fears
and insecurities. So and it's not about you, so kind
(27:06):
of reframing like that like they're doing, they're projecting their
own insecurities onto you.
Speaker 4 (27:11):
Okay, And so so here comes my question that comes
to my mind. It is kind of an off the
question how much is social media, the news media and
all of that have become the people that we surround
ourselves with and are being totally affected by that? Because
(27:33):
we see such a dichotomy now and such anger coming
from all different sides.
Speaker 2 (27:39):
At this point, I.
Speaker 5 (27:41):
Would say this has become really more polarizing in the
past five years.
Speaker 2 (27:47):
You know, we all know what happened five years ago.
So I think that you know is part of that.
Speaker 5 (27:52):
I think, you know, the thing about social media, and
I've always said social media is like a double D swort,
meaning that there's some good things. You know, we can
be connected, you know, we're able to really expend our network,
our reach, but also at the same time, there's a
cost and what we say, you know, and a lot
of research is found, especially found that the more especially
(28:14):
routines and young adults that use social media, the more
mental health crisis are going to experience depression and anxiety
goes through the roof. Wow, because it's isolating if you
think about it, you know, even though we may appear
to be connected, we're actually isolating, you know, by spending
more time on you know, social media, and you see
people who put the best foot forward, and then you
(28:36):
have the whole phenomenal gresses green on the other side,
and you start to think, well, maybe my life is
not because everybody else seems to be doing so well
and here I am struggling.
Speaker 2 (28:46):
So that can add to fuel to the fire. And
then you have the anonymity which you know on social media,
which makes people.
Speaker 5 (28:53):
A lot braver online than they are face to faith,
and which means they could be more bullying and crueler sometimes.
Speaker 4 (29:00):
And it's interesting to me to see some friends of
mine that I've known for years that have suddenly taken
up a cause that is just really, from what I
can see, is based on anger frustration, and they're putting
now and their comments or just you know, where does
that come from? And I know, and you know, I'm
(29:23):
saying that to myself, what what happened here? And then
as we get into it a little bit more, I
realized that, you know, there's a lot of things that
went on in the past that have placed those imprints,
and you know, it's so interesting that we can no
longer be both and rather than either or you know, yeah,
(29:44):
and realize that you know what, Yeah, I have my
point of view, you have your point of view. I
would suspect if we got into a discussion about some
of those things, we probably are a little bit on
the opposing sides there. But the reality is is, if
you can respect my thoughts and I can respect your thoughts,
not necessarily agree, but respect the fact that there's some validity,
(30:06):
all of a sudden, that changes the whole dimension of
the communication, doesn't it.
Speaker 5 (30:10):
Yes, Yeah, And it's just trying to get the emotion,
you know, it's like trying to get the emotion out
of the argument. The argument is great, I want to
hear the argument, but you know, we need to temper up,
down the emotion a bit, you know, the the anger,
the thing and that. And sometimes I often feel when
I see people that are really enraged, and again I'm
not talking it's for other side. I'm often wondering if
(30:34):
that's really what's going on. It's really meant to make
something else is not happening, and they're just using that
as a target or displacing their rage onto another target.
Speaker 4 (30:45):
I suspect that's true in many cases. I remember, as
I was going through some certifications, one of one of
the comments that the tell that was doing one of them,
and we were talking about the imprints and so forth
and relationships. He said, you know what, and I've shared
this before. He says, this is something you never want
to do with your spouse or your significant other, but
(31:08):
it's something that you ought to do. And he says,
when you get into a situation where there's a disagreement
and strong feelings going on, the question you can ask
is what emotion just came up for you that is
causing this type of reaction. Well, if we ask ourselves
that with the proper mindset, all of a sudden, we're
(31:30):
realizing that, you know what, we're reacting because of emotion
and where did that should come from?
Speaker 5 (31:36):
You know, it could be something from our childhood, like
you know where you know, you may be thinking you're
fighting with someone on social media, go, and yet what
subconscious is going on.
Speaker 2 (31:44):
Maybe you're fighting back with.
Speaker 5 (31:45):
Your father at a you know, when you were five
or six, you know, and that's where that anger comes in,
or that energy, that that displeasure comes in. And you
may think consciously it's about the other person, about the issue,
but it's not.
Speaker 2 (32:01):
It's something deeper that needs to come in.
Speaker 5 (32:03):
And that's why I think we're seeing that, you know,
especially in the past you know, eight years, just the
amount of anger that we've been seeing on social media
on both sides, Yeah, has been you know, a bit
disturbing almost you know, let's see.
Speaker 4 (32:18):
It, it's major disturbing. But you know what, to me,
it's interesting that an individual, if they can could get
to the point where they can literally say themselves. Okay,
what's causing this emotion? You know, there's events or events.
Events do not have emotion. Events are non emotion, but
we tie an emotion to an event based on our
(32:39):
perception or whatever that happens to be. And you know,
how people can get to the point where they can
understand that, I think takes a lot of curiosity, a
lot of personal work, and help from others. One of
the things that you talked about that I wanted to
get into a little bit was personality. And I don't
(33:01):
know if you do personality or behavioral evaluations. That's something
that I happen to be certified in and I found
it very interesting. But as you look at personalities, how
important is it for someone to begin to really understand
that from a perspective of living their life, choosing their
profession and those type of things. What's been your experience
(33:24):
with that?
Speaker 5 (33:25):
Well, you know, in my book, I have all unit
of personality because I focus on one of the most
you know, I guess popular models is a big five
five factor model, which is openness, conscience as in a extraversion, agreeable,
and sinneraroticism. Now all of us have you know, these
five traits of varying degrees. So I think what's important,
at least from my perspective, is to understand where you
(33:49):
fall into that into all you know, into these five
and then if there's ways to optimize it, you know
what to optimize these you know, these five. So I
work for you, you know, and in my research, because that's
what I did from a doctor's station when variables they
measured with some when I was measuring self sabotage was
I was looking at the big five and see what
the relationship was with the Big five and the self sabotage.
Speaker 2 (34:12):
And so what I found, and this is what I
did after I did my research.
Speaker 5 (34:17):
Was that if you are high high neuroticism which means
emotional reactivity, being easily stressed out, and low and conscientiousness,
if you combine those two together, that's going to be,
you know, be a greater predictor of self sabotaging behavior
because now you're only fear running, but you're not necessarily
(34:38):
disciplined as you should be. And you know, so I
have my you know, one of the projects I do
with my classes for my students is I haven't taken
a you know, an instrument, an inventory that measures a
big five factor model. I also have them do to
meyers breaks, which give them a bit of a personality profile,
(35:02):
and then I have them react to it. I don't
I don't do any diagno because that's not my job
there or to you know, but I just have them
reflect on it and then you know, so you know,
I think that just understanding your your own personality also
can be an impact, which I kind of seem missing a.
Speaker 2 (35:21):
Little bit in the clinical psychology beef. You know, work.
Speaker 5 (35:26):
Is really understanding that personality factors and how you can
optimize that, like how you can become more conscientious, how
you can become more you know, open minded, you know,
and even you know, work on your agreeableness, and then
when you work on those valuables, that's.
Speaker 2 (35:42):
When you could start to see some changes.
Speaker 4 (35:45):
Well, you know what something me and I've not used
a Big five and I don't use my bridge. I've
done that, and I you know, I don't understand that
I've got a brother that loves it. I've used something
different than I found was very very you know, valuable
for me to use with people with clients. And one
of the things that I realize is and I think
(36:05):
this is where understanding your personality traits is so important,
because every personality trait that we can observe or we
can begin to understand, is a very positive thing for us.
The challenge is if we overdo it, then suddenly that
becomes a problem. So for instance, you know, and I
(36:27):
think I work on the right brain, left brain external
you know type of thing. But you know, the left
brain or the right brain extrovert is that person that
just loves to be in a community, loves to chat,
so on and so forth, and it's wonderful. I love
to be around them because I tend to be an introvert.
So if I can be around people that just will
(36:49):
chat and so forth, that's great. But all of a sudden,
when it becomes yeh app and never stops, that strength
has now become a weakness because the not been able
to be in total control of it. Or like someone
who's who's left brain extravert, who's just really strong willed
and so forth. That's great, you know, and really is
(37:10):
motivation for success and all that type of stuff. But
as that becomes a little bit too much, now you
are overbearing, you're really using words and using you know,
body language that is a little bit overwhelming to people
who are receiving that communication. So I think it's so
interesting that we we can really look at those strengths
(37:33):
and understand that, you know, if I keep those strengths
in the proper value, that they really are great strength.
But I need to be aware that if they go
a little bit too far, then all of a sudden
they become a disadvantage.
Speaker 5 (37:48):
Yeah, well, I think it's relying on anything too much,
even as a crutch sometimes can be you know, be
a disadvantage, you know.
Speaker 2 (37:56):
And again it's it's what works for you. I mean,
I I I you know, reason I like the Big
five that I feel really.
Speaker 5 (38:03):
Fits into the work of self advertised very well, at
least for me, you know, and I always like to
purchase that for me. And I think that's also another
thing too, because it's our perception, you know, really, and
you know, I think also too much of anything is
you know, not not always optimally given for production or
its this time. We need to need time to you know,
(38:26):
decompress and recharge. Even for me, I like being around people,
but sometimes if I'm in a group, like a large
room with a a lot of people, I have to
step aside because I'm like, Okay, this is a little
too much for me right now. But you know, even
though I do like being around people a lot, it's
(38:46):
you know, I know my limits, you know.
Speaker 2 (38:48):
Like, Okay, I'm not I'm not. I'm not a really
big fan of large crowds. That's me, you know.
Speaker 5 (38:56):
So I think just understanding yourself is a major. Again,
it doesn't really matter what personality model do you use.
I think, you know, I think just having that self understanding.
Speaker 4 (39:07):
Exactly and being able to understand that, you know what,
as you were talking about, there's balance. There needs to
be balance in our lives, yes, which I think becomes
so important to my daughter, who ended up getting a
master's degree in sociology but mainly research, and she was
going to move towards her PhD and called me one
(39:28):
day and she said, Dad, and she's major with the
personal I profile, she's major right brain extrovert. And she says,
I'm not sure as I observe the lives of the
PhDs at the university here, I'm not sure that's going
to give me the type of balance in life that
I'm looking for. And so she made the brave decision
(39:50):
because she was on a pathway to end it and
just get her master's degree and then basically get into
an entirely different area. But you said it education as
a background that has helped her to be very successful.
So I think it's so important that we really look
at balance in our lives and understand that. You know what,
(40:10):
if we can create a good balance, we can then
create a greater sense of happiness enjoy in our lives.
Speaker 2 (40:17):
One hundred percent.
Speaker 5 (40:18):
And you know, going back, they want to say before,
if we look at even the traits in the Big five,
you shouldn't. You don't want to be on too extremes
on other end, you know, too high or too low
because even like like one of the things I talked
about aboutcus being agreeable. Agreeableness is great, you know, to
be coachable and be open minded and being able to
(40:38):
follow directions, But at the same time, if they're too agreeable,
you can be taken advantage of.
Speaker 2 (40:43):
And there's times when.
Speaker 5 (40:44):
It comes if you're negotiating, you know, whether it's for
to buy a house or a salary or anything like that,
you have to stand your ground, which means being disagreeable
a little bit.
Speaker 4 (40:55):
Yeah, Well, wait, we can talk about all sorts of
things here as well as we're getting near the clothes.
What I'd love for you to do is share with
the audience how can they find you and what are
the same what other than your book, what are some
of the things that you offer two people.
Speaker 5 (41:13):
So I on my website Alberbramonti dot com. I have
a lot of hypnosis audios which has you know, which
have to do anything with mindset, athletic performance and you know,
working with fears and phobias, anxieties.
Speaker 2 (41:31):
And it helps.
Speaker 5 (41:32):
There there recordings that you can buy, and that's one
way we can help. You could also just you know,
I post a lot on my social media, my LinkedIn,
you know, so you can find me on LinkedIn. I
post a lot of content there. You know. I'm working
on sorry, a sub stack right now, which is to
(41:53):
be you know, articles on mindset and articles on that.
So be sharing that with the community so you can
follow me. You get on Instagram and LinkedIn for that
and you know, even reach out. Feel free to reach out.
I'm always open to conversations.
Speaker 4 (42:06):
And how do you find how do you find your book?
Speaker 5 (42:09):
Okay, so you're going it's available on Amazon Rise above
the script. You can get it as a paperback, kindle
or audiobook.
Speaker 2 (42:17):
I have it also an audiobook. Great.
Speaker 4 (42:19):
I love audiobooks.
Speaker 2 (42:21):
Yeah, so that they're great.
Speaker 4 (42:23):
Yeah, they're great. So as we close, what would be
kind of that final message that you'd like to share
with the audience.
Speaker 5 (42:30):
So the final message I would say is connect to
here why, Like really, you know, every day, reflect on
why you're doing what you're doing, what you're sending out
to do, and really stay committed to that. So know
your why, I would say previous much webe the biggest
message I'd want to say, because that'll keep you focused,
I'll keep you dedicated.
Speaker 2 (42:50):
You know, remember each day why you're doing what you're doing.
Speaker 4 (42:53):
Well, And I think that really gets to a purpose
and understanding your purpose and you say even asking why
why am I behaving this way? Why am I bringing
up this emotion? So I love that because it not
only gets into purpose, but it gets into a mindset
that helps you to really start to improve your life.
Speaker 2 (43:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (43:13):
So yeah, and the emotions and mindsets, even the ones
that may be working against us, I always say, have
a positive intention and that's protect us. So now what's
maybe work on it, reframing it so it could protect us,
still protect us, put it in a different way.
Speaker 4 (43:28):
Amen to that. Well, hey, Albert, thanks so much. This
has been great. Yeah, I appreciate you being on the show.
Speaker 2 (43:37):
I mean, thank you again for having met folks.
Speaker 4 (43:39):
Thanks for listening. Hope you've enjoyed it. Get to the website.
There's some good things there. I can promise you. I've
already been there and I observed that. So anyway, this
is doctor Doug saying no mistake.