June 9, 2025 • 40 mins
Bestselling author and yoga therapist Jennie Lee shares her journey from personal challenges to discovering the true essence of yoga beyond physical postures and it’s ancient origins. Explore meditation, self-inquiry, and the power of love in personal transformation. A conversation about stillness, joy, and awakening to our highest self.
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Inspire Vision Podcast is also available on Talk 4 Podcasting (www.talk4podcasting.com), iHeartRadio, Amazon Music, Pandora, Spotify, Audible, and over 100 other podcast outlets.
Inspire Vision Podcast is broadcast on K4HD Radio (www.k4hd.com) part of Talk 4 Radio (www.talk4radio.com) on the Talk 4 Media Network (www.talk4media.com). Inspire Vision Podcast TV Show is viewed on Talk 4 TV (www.talk4tv.com).
Inspire Vision Podcast is also available on Talk 4 Podcasting (www.talk4podcasting.com), iHeartRadio, Amazon Music, Pandora, Spotify, Audible, and over 100 other podcast outlets.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
This program is designed to provide general information with regards
to the subject matters covered. This information is given with
the understanding that neither the hosts, guests, sponsors, or station
are engaged in rendering any specific and personal medical, financial,
legal counseling, professional service, or any advice.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
You should seek the services.
Speaker 1 (00:23):
Of competent professionals before applying or trying any suggested ideas.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
At the end of the day, it's not about what
you have or even what you've accomplished. It's about what
you've done with those accomplishments. It's about who you've lifted up,
who you've made better. It's about what you've given back.
Denzel Washington, welcome to Inspire Vision. Our sole purpose is
to elevate the lives of others and to inspire you
(00:51):
to do the same.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Jenny, Welcome to the show.
Speaker 4 (00:54):
Hey Doug, nice to be here.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Oh I'm excited. And you tell me that you're in
Hawaii right now. That is fantastic.
Speaker 4 (01:03):
I am. I'm based on the island of but wahoo.
I love it here. Feel really blessed to live on
the island.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
I'll bet that's amazing. I love Hawaii. When I've been
able to get over there. It's great. Anyway, what I'd
love for you to do is to share with the
audience your journey. You know, I know that there's well
I don't know, but you know, many people are doing
certain things then all of a sudden they kind of
have an Aha moment and they change directions, or maybe
(01:29):
they've just discovered it from the get go, which is
amazing if you have so share your journey with the
audience of how you got to this point in what
you're doing now.
Speaker 4 (01:40):
Sure, well, I'll guess I'll backtrack to about thirty years ago.
I was living in Los Angeles and working as an
actor and practicing yoga physical yoga at the time, and
I started going through some personal challenges in my marriage
and was really looking for some solace, and I discovered
(02:04):
the deeper teachings of yoga, the Yogic philosophies of life
and how they can bring us into equilibrium and inner peace,
and so started practicing meditation and more breath work and
really understanding the principles of what it takes to live
in an aligned way and through the Yogic perspective, which is,
(02:25):
you know, five thousand years old and over time sort
of fast forward ten years. I had gotten a divorce,
I had moved across country, I was recently needing to
re establish myself in the workforce after having a child,
and I a decided to open a yoga studio because
(02:48):
it was my love, it was my passion, and that
really started the trajectory of where I am today. So today,
I've been a yoga studio owner. I've been a yoga
therapist for many, many years, counseling people individually through the
many practices and philosophies of yoga. I've written three books
on the topics of yoga and meditation and spiritual living
(03:12):
and self evolution. And I really love what I have
been able to do for a career. I love all
the people that I've gotten to interact with over the years,
and you know, talking about aha moments, it's really one
of my greatest joys to see someone awaken to their
(03:34):
inner self, their their their beautiful, brilliant spiritual light and
their joy and what really makes them that particular soul
that they are and step closer towards that, towards embodying that,
and as a guide for that journey. I feel really
blessed to have met some extraordinary people over the years.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
Oh that's fantastic, you know, And and you you made point,
and I appreciate if you kind of expand on this,
because so many times when I think of yoga, and
I know most people think of yoga, it's I'm out
there trying to stretch and trying to do this, trying
to do that, which I can't do at this point
in time. But when you talk about the higher level
of yoga, and now you get into the whole philosophy
(04:19):
of yoga, that's an entirely different thing. Can you kind
of share with the audience what the difference is there?
Speaker 4 (04:24):
Sure? Well, one is part of the other, right, So
the physical postures are a part of what's called the
eight limb path of yoga, and they prepare our bodies
and our minds to be able to sit in stillness
and meditation, and so they make up a part of
the yogic path. But the yogic path really is so
(04:46):
much broader than just the postures that have become popular
in the West. And my first book, True Yoga, It's
called True Yoga was written because as a yoga teacher,
I was trying to impart this understanding to my students
in you know, hour long classes, and I just felt
like there needed to be a bigger explanation available to them,
(05:09):
but written in a way that was accessible and modern
and sort of pragmatic for daily life. Because the texts
that are the traditional yoga philosophy texts, the Bagavad Gita,
the Upas, the blanking on the other one right now anyway, utris,
(05:31):
the yoga sutris. How can I forget that? It's what
my book is based on. Well, brain faid, okay, yeah,
so are They are all written fairly esoterically. So for
the average student of yoga, the person who's going to
go to a Saturday morning physical yoga class, it's not
necessarily going to have time to absorb these teachings, these
(05:52):
esoteric teachings, and so as a teacher, I really wanted
to write a book that would boil them down in
a way and apply them to daily modern life, that
would make them useful for people, if you will. And
you know, there's so many I'll just take one little
example out of the yoga sutras. So there's the practice
(06:16):
of ahimsa, and ahimsa for all intents and purposes is intentional,
the intentional practice of peacefulness. So it's not enough to
just not be violent. We have to go out of
our way to bring peace into situations and into our
(06:36):
own hearts and minds and lives. And this isn't easy.
Right on the day to day we live in stressful
times and everyone that I talk to, their stress levels
are really really high. So when you're working with a
teaching like this and looking at what an ancient science
of spirituality, which is really what yoga philosophy is, it's
(07:00):
a spiritual science, it's the it's an inner science of
how to align ourselves with the harmony that can exist
within ourselves and within the universe when we're in right
action right And so one of those principles is intentional peacefulness.
And then we have to kind of break it down
(07:21):
and look at, well, how do we do that? And
so that how question is always what I'm working with
students or clients on in terms of how to, within
the context of their lives, really how to do that.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
Okay, and you've written, as you say, you've written a
few books. You've got your yoga one, and then there's
a couple of other books you're written. Just share with
the audience what they are and what they're Yeah.
Speaker 4 (07:44):
Sure. My second book is called Breathing Love and it's
meditation in action is the subtitles. So the principle behind
that book is meditation for me on the cushions, seated
silent is a daily practice that is essential. And I
(08:04):
can't do that and then get up off the cushion
and go be a jerk in my life. Right, we
have to carry the quality of meditation, the deep piece
and equilibrium that we cultivate on the cushion. We have
to carry it out into the crazy world that we
live in and apply those. The same practices that we
(08:29):
utilize when we're sitting and focusing and going inward in
our stated meditation practice, we have to apply those in
day to day life. So again pragmatic look at how
to apply the principles of meditation into daily life. That's
what that book is about. And then my third book
is Spark Change and the subtitle is one hundred and
(08:50):
eight Provocative Questions for Spiritual Evolution. So this draws upon
the Yogic principle of self inquiry or swadyaya, and self
inquiry is to me the other side of the meditation
coin because we have to go inward to be still,
and then we also have to do a little bit
(09:11):
of digging in there. So part of it is quieting
the mind, but then part of it is engaging the
mind and looking at our patterns, looking at our belief systems,
looking at the obstacles that we hold within our own
beings to those to that journey towards alignment and peace
and inner harmony. And so that book is a compilation
(09:33):
of questions that I've used with clients over the years
to help them sort of navigate their inner.
Speaker 5 (09:39):
Landscape and to find ways to move through the obstacles
that they feel in their lives and to initiate change.
Speaker 4 (09:51):
At a very proactive level.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
Well, and I want to talk about all of those things.
You know, one of the interesting things that you talk
about is how long do you meditate each day? And
what do you recommend and what do you recommend people?
Number one? Number two, you talk about breathwork, but you
didn't really talk about that. Is there a specific type
of breath work? Because I've interviewed so many people with
(10:15):
different ideas about how the breath work should be. What
are your thoughts on that? Number one how long And
number two breathwork.
Speaker 4 (10:22):
Okay, so how long? For sure, half an hour in
the morning. If I'm being disciplined, I'll do half an
hour in the evening as well. I don't always do that,
but that's my ideal practice time. That's not what I
would recommend to a beginner, though, because you do have
to sort of work up to it, and I say
just start with five to ten minutes and develop that
(10:44):
habit of sitting down and getting quiet. Now, breath work
is part of the sutra that has to do the
yoga sutra that has to do with energy management. Fronta
Yamana is energy, Yama is control of energy, So we
can control our energy through the breath. And that's where
(11:07):
all these diverse practices of breath work that are getting
quite popular these days. It's sort of the next wave
of yoga that's coming through the West and getting really
popular because people are seeing that there's power in the
ability to control your breath. It will the breath naturally
reflects our emotional state. So if you get angry, or
(11:31):
if you have a sudden fright or something, your breath
is going to get really constricted. And if you're trying
to manage stress by doing breath work, Well, then you're
going to want to elongate the breath, you're going to
want to slow it down, You're going to want to
control it in waves that would be opposite of what
would happen if you had that anger or fright moment
(11:53):
where it gets really constricted. Now, I'm not going to
give a general I'm not gonna apply a general technique
on a podcast like this because breathwork is very personal
and it's very situational. And so when I'm working with
a client, we're talking about what it is that they're
experiencing in their lives in terms of stressors. I need
(12:17):
to know about their physiology and any medications that they
might be on. Do they suffer with anxiety, do they
have depression? Are they going through some particular grief right now?
All of these things play into what breath work I
might do with them, because however we manipulate the breath
has an effect. And so I don't want to give
(12:40):
some general practice and be counter into it, you know,
counter productive for somebody, counter indicated. Sorry, that's not I'm
losing my words today, counter indicated for someone who might have,
you know, hypertension, or anxiety or something like that. So
it is very specific to the person.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
Well, and you know what's fascinating to me, and you know,
as I'm here in Thailand, I found very fascinating to
learn a little bit more about Buddhism. And one of
the interesting things is going back to the original teachings
and then seeing what's happening now. It actually went from
the one teaching of Buddha. Now I think there's four
or five major differences that kind of oppose each other
(13:24):
at least teach different things. And it's kind of the
same thing with I would think with yoga, because you know,
as I look at meditation and I've gone to some
workshops and so forth with that, and I love meditating.
But what I've found is that there's a lot of
you know, focus for many on you know, if this
(13:46):
is what you want to be, then this is the
affirmation you want to think about or say while you're
meditating and so forth. And I'm not sure, I don't
know the answers I'm listening to this is that part
of the original yoga lots of of meditating and so
forth you talk about, which I really appreciate, you know,
finding that sense of peace and also be able to
(14:10):
ultimately identify and do that introspective work and find out
where things are happening that you don't want to be happening.
What are your thoughts on that, and what.
Speaker 4 (14:21):
Have you seen so on affirmation specifically, I feel that
they can be very powerful. I would not say they're
part of the original Yogic teachings. I'm trying just you know,
scanning through my mind and all the studies I've done
of the Yoga sutras, and I can't pull a passage
that would specifically indicate that affirmation per se were recommended.
(14:48):
That being said, I think how we hold ourselves, how
we speak to ourselves, the way we think about ourselves,
all of this is part of that inner work that
we approach when we get when we quiet the outer world.
And so I think you could extrapolate that it's it's
(15:10):
a natural progression, let's say, and maybe a more modern
tool that is effective and is helpful. I mean, I
do think that the yoga searchers talk about some scaras.
So the words some scara has to do with neurological
grooves and that come from repetitive thought. And there's also
(15:32):
a suture that says, if a thought is causing difficulty,
change it to its positive opposite. The practice is pratipak shababana.
And so you know, we think about modern psychology. That's
kind of a framework that we might find in modern
psychology as well. So in terms of affirmation, if we're
(15:54):
feeling low self worth, well we're going to do an
affirmation that has to do with building more self esteem
self confidence. But and it's for the point of changing
those neurological groups, because the more we think of thought,
the more it becomes kind of our reality and just
the default system of our minds, and so it behooves
(16:17):
us to choose positive thoughts certainly.
Speaker 2 (16:21):
Well, and you know, you just brought up an interesting thing.
You call them neurological groups. How how old is yoga?
How how how long ago did that philosophy come to be?
Speaker 4 (16:31):
The first the first kind of markers of yoga, which
were like hieroglyphic pictures of postures and meditation type imagery,
was is like five thousand years old. So this is
this is not new stuff. I was taking humanity so
(16:56):
long to know.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
What's amazing to me is here they're talking about those
neurological gurus and finally scientists have come up with the
understanding that the neural and we call the neural pathways nowadays,
but they can be changed and as you say, you know,
you can literally change that from negative to the positive.
(17:19):
And it just is amazing to me these philosophies that
are thousands and thousands of years old and how insightful
they were at the time and they still are, which
just amazes me. So anyway, that was one of the
questions I have. But also as we talk about meditation,
(17:41):
and you talked about how, you know, starting to discover
those inner issues that we need to deal with, and
I think that really has to do with curiosity, with
creativity being able to go in and analyze the fact.
I was watching the podcast the other day and it
was it was a theological one just happened to be there.
(18:05):
But the whole point was, you know, our behavior, we
don't behave in order to become, We behave and you
kind of alluded to this, we behave the way that
we are internally who we are spiritually, and I want
you to talk a little bit about that and talk
(18:26):
about how people who are experiencing things in their lives
oftentimes don't realize that, you know what, they can change that.
But in order to do that, they really need to
do that introspective work and change inside themselves.
Speaker 4 (18:41):
Absolutely. There's a when I'm talking to young women about
and that's going to apply to young men as well,
about relationship. There's a kind of an expression, if someone
shows you who they are, believe them, meaning, don't if
someone is acting badly, don't think that they are something
(19:04):
different than that that they're showing you who they are
from because their behavior does reflect who they are, who
they are internally at that moment. Now that's not to
say that they can't change, but the change really has
to come from the individual. It cannot come from anyone
else outside of them. It has to come from I
(19:27):
think often pain getting uncomfortable enough in our situation that
we are in where maybe our behavior just keeps leading
us into suffering, into disappointment, into whatever it is, and
we and then we kind of get to the point
where we're tired of hitting our head against the wall,
(19:48):
and we and we start to ask those inner questions
of well, how can I how can I do something different?
Like I want a different result here? How can I
do something different, and it takes a tremendous amount of
willillingness to then do that hard inner introspection. And one
of the chapters in the third book that I wrote,
Spark Change, is about willingness because when we initiate change,
(20:13):
and this is something that is I think people don't realize.
People will say, oh, I really want to change X,
Y or Z in my life. I know I need
to change this, so they have the awareness that they
need to change, they have the desire to change, but
they don't have the willingness to actually do the work
of change because change is hard and it requires that
(20:35):
we pattern interdrop right, We interrupt the patterns of behavior
that we've been used to for so long. And unfortunately
it's again these neurological groups. We default to the familiar,
and even if the familiar is getting us nowhere or
getting us nothing but summering, we still default to it
a lot until we just get so tired of it.
(20:55):
And that's why I say I think Keane is often
our greatest teacher, because we have to get to that
point where we're so willing to do something different, no
matter how hard it is. The great news, though, is
that once you start coactively doing that inner work and
moving towards positive change, it's like a snowball effect. It
(21:19):
does actually get easier and it works. We are incredibly
powerful beings and we can change anything that we really
truly put our minds to.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
Well, and when you're working with someone and you know
they're willing and I'm writing a little bit about that,
and I call it bravery, but by I like the
word willingness too. When you when you're working with someone
and they go back and they identify some beliefs that
have been imprinted on them, and I use the word
imprinted because I don't think they really wanted that, how
(21:55):
do you how do you help them? Number one? I
guess I haven't number of questions, so I apologie as
I do this all the time. Number one, when you're meditating,
how do you consciously go in and start to identify
those imprints that are causing the behavior that you really
don't want? And then number two, how do you start
(22:18):
to change those?
Speaker 4 (22:20):
Okay, those are great questions, Doug, And I want to
be clear that I don't teach meditation as a time
for self inquiry. There are two separate practices. Okay, so meditation,
according to the Yoga sutras, is really the time to
quiet the mind. And so there are techniques that lead
(22:40):
us towards quiet mind, such as the breath work, such
as focusing on a mantra or a visualization of I
often use a visualization of the breath within the body.
And so with those tools we are focusing the mind
on a single point in order to quiet the rest
(23:02):
of the chatter. Self inquiry, the identification of those beliefs,
those imprints that many of which come from very very
early ages, precognitive kind of times, as we know, is different.
That's a different time. That's a more time when we
(23:22):
are conscious. We might be journaling, we might be in
dialogue with a coach or a therapist. We might be
reading a book like the one that I wrote, that
kind of working through a question and reflecting on it.
It's a more active time. So that's to me, either
a two sides of the coin of spiritual practice. So
the meditation time to be going into deep stillness and
(23:45):
really stilling the mind, and then the self inquiry time,
which is the time to kind of chew on things
and process it.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
Well. Then my question goes to this, if you're doing
it separately, and I totally agree that you have to
have that consciousness to be will go in and really
identify that. But are you able then, with meditation to
start to change those neuro pathways as you talked about,
by when those things come up, being able to verbally
(24:13):
affirm that, you know, I no longer do this, I
am this way, and as we affirm that time and
time again, and I happen to do that in my
walking meditation out loud, nobody hears me because I'm walking,
but I find that that helps. What are your thoughts
on that? Is that something that through meditation and affirmation
(24:35):
while you're meditating, that you're able to start to change
those pathways and as you say, originally reverse and change
those neurological grooves to a different groove.
Speaker 4 (24:48):
So let's think of it. Let's think of it in
two ways. So the like you're talking about a walking
practice where you're audibly affirming things that would be counteracting,
say these neurological groups that are maybe holding you in
a negative pattern, that would be one side of the
(25:08):
practice that's more of the active practice, like the self
increase the active practice in meditation. The way that the
neurological groups are getting smoothed out is not by affirmation,
not during meditation. It's by not allowing your thought to
(25:28):
go on the story train. It's about bringing it back
to your chosen point of attention, whether it's the breath
or the visualization, let's say, of light at the third eye,
or the feeling of the breath moving up and down
the spine, something that is more of the moment. Bringing
(25:50):
the thoughts that inevitably wander off to all the old
patterns or the days to do list or whatever distracts us,
bringing it back, bringing it back, bringing it back so
that the mind quiets down. It's kind of like redirecting
the child that wants to do this and wants to
do that, and you're trying to get them to sit
(26:11):
down and do their homework. So it's like, no, we're
going to do this right now. No, we're going to
do this right now. And so every time we correct
and come back to that single point of attention, we
are changing the grooves. But it's a different sort of practice.
So both are important, but I utilize them at different times.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
Okay, And so you know, like we're walking. Meditation is
promoted by a few well known individuals, and you mentioned that,
so I know who you're talking about as far as
up and down the spine. But the reality is that
if I'm doing walking meditation, then that's really not the
peaceful meditation that you're talking about. And quite honestly, I
(26:54):
also do quiet too, but I think that's I really
appreciate the distinguishment that you made with that that there
are two elements of that. So really what I'm doing
walking meditation and what many people are doing that they
call meditation is really really conscious introspection or conscious yes whatever,
(27:16):
rather than that peaceful meditation. So another question, because as
I say, I do that a lot when you talk
to people and teach them how to meditate, what are
your thoughts about using music binural beats or the selfedgio
beats type of thing, and you're shaking your head so
I can't wait to hear.
Speaker 4 (27:36):
So I think we need more vocabulary, right, So, like
you said, I love how you reframed the walking meditation
to conscious walking introspection or something. And that's great because
it is more accurate if we're looking at the traditional
definition of meditation from the Yoga sutras, and that's my
(27:59):
basis of practice. They talk about meditation being a state
of being, the state of being still. It's not a practice,
it's not something The practices lead us there. So there
are several practices prior to meditation, the focus and single
(28:20):
point of attention and the management of energy and the
postures and all these these are part of the aid
Limb path, and so all of these things lead us
to meditation, which is that state of being still. So
to answer your question about the music, and I get
this question all the time, well, can I do a
(28:41):
guided meditation on you know, the insight at time or
app or this about Yes, absolutely, I wouldn't call it meditation.
I would call it wonderful guided relaxation, A beautiful practice
to do at the end of a stressful day, doing
affirmations while you're walking, fantastic practice of introspection and repatterning
(29:03):
of the neural grooves, listening to the binural beats, another
wonderful way to relax the mind and the body. I
love that kind of music. To me, It's not meditation.
It's not traditional yogic meditation, which is stillness. So anything external,
any external stimulus, is going to some degree be pulling
(29:28):
our consciousness outward versus The intent of meditation is to
turn our consciousness inward so that we have a sense
of self or awareness that is beyond the physical, external
self that we identify with on the day to day basis.
And that's why I would not recommend from a classical standpoint.
Speaker 2 (29:51):
So let's talk about the sense of self. And why
do you think that's so important that you've actually differentiated
all those different types of quote meditation to the original
yoga meditation where you're really just focusing on breath work,
which in effect is also focusing on something, but where
(30:11):
you're doing that and really finding that stillness and that self.
Let's identify, first of all, if you can, what is
the self? You know, you talk about the soul, you
talk about all of this, and obviously there's so many
different things. And what I find is many people who
are deeply quote religious, are a little bit worried about meditation.
(30:34):
They feel like it's pulling them away from their quote
religious concepts. And yet you know, you talk about stillness,
you talk about soul, what do you mean by that?
Speaker 4 (30:46):
Okay, So when we meet are born, we come into
these bodies, we begin to have experiences immediately in the
physical dimension, and we become extremely identified with our bodies,
with our personalities, with the story and the and of
(31:07):
what we're living, the people around us, the teachings that
we're being given. It's all part of our physical experience.
And we identify self as Doug, Jenny, you know, whoever,
and with all that makes us up from the human standpoint,
but from the yoga teachings we are, that is not
(31:30):
all of who we are. It is It's like when
we put on glasses to see something, and it would
be as if I started to say, I'm these glasses. Well, no,
I'm not the glasses. The glasses are just something that
I'm seeing through. So the body, the personality, this self
that is Jenny right now is just something that my
(31:53):
soul is seeing through. It's like the glasses that I've
put on that my soul has put on. The soul
is the essence that is indestructible and everlasting and goes
on and on and on in different forms, and this
form that I'm in right now is just temporary, and
(32:14):
so I don't have the more I can know myself
as more than this, I can still enjoy being Jenny
and I'm meant to express through the Jenny personality right now,
but to know myself as more than that gives me
great peace and freedom because when the difficulties of being
(32:37):
Jenny come up, I don't get completely lost in them.
I can, in meditation step outside just for the moment
in the stillness, and have an awareness of myself as
pure peace for love.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
And you know, you talk about peace, you talk about love,
that inner soul, and what fashion me about that is
that as I look at it, you know, we're here
on this earth, We've got this physical body, and as
you say, the soul is eternal. There's no question about
that in my mind at least, And yet so often
(33:14):
we tend to focus so much on this physical aspect
of it, not realizing that if we could just return
back to the qualities of the soul, the love, the kindness,
all of those type of things, and it goes back
to what I was talking about. As we become then
our behavior reflects that. And so you know, as you
(33:36):
talk about that, let's talk a little bit about love,
because I know that you know and some of the
talking points you shared with me. You know, one of
the questions is what is it to live love and
how do you how do you experience love as an individual,
and how do you take how do you allow the
mortal physical body to move away from prevention of that
(33:58):
so that your soul can try really experience that, which
then evolves into your physical ability to experience love too.
Speaker 4 (34:07):
Oh, Doug, that that was a very convoluted question there.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
I know, you know, my my assistance and my dental
practice would just go crazy because I would be talking
to them and I come up with the three or
four things that say, would you just stay with one?
Speaker 4 (34:25):
That's just I have I know where you were going though,
So there is it's a great question to bridge off
of the self question because there is personal love right
that I experience with my friend's family, son, husband, whatever, animals.
But then there's this universal energy of love. And so
(34:46):
one of the things I talk about in my second book,
which is called Breathing Love and which is very much
about the practice of living love, is how do we
tap into that universal energy of love more and more
and more so that we're not limited by that personal
sense of love because the personal sense of love, it
(35:06):
gets very colored by our history, the ways that we've
been hurt and disappointed the ways our desires, our particular
you know, things that we're looking for gratification around, or
that we have needs around, and so a lot of
what we call love really isn't pure love when it
(35:28):
comes to the personality side of things. That energy of love,
the universal energy of love, is really the Gananda Parmhanza
Yogananda calls it the harmonizing energy of the universe. And
so as we tap into that vibration, it's really an
energetic vibration. And I do this when I'm in the
(35:49):
stillness of meditation. That's what I'm That's why I'm there
because I want to tap that every day and I
want that to for through me and infuse me so
that when I feel limited in my capacity to show
up kindly or compassionately in a situation in my personal life,
(36:13):
I can say, all right, this is me talking to myself.
Deep breath, This isn't about me. Like God is love spirit,
the universal energy of love is there. Let me draw
on that, let me bring it through. I'm just the
vessel and that's how I sort of practice it. But
in order to be able to do that in the
(36:33):
day to day circumstances where I might feel challenged. I've
got to have that infusion every day in meditation. It
really is my time to connect to love.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
Yeah, I love that. And how do you experience that
lasting happiness, that real love that I think everybody wants.
Speaker 4 (36:52):
Well, I think you only experience it when you start
to have this sort of dual It's funny, I'm going
to use a dualistic expression, but it's really about non duality. Right.
So we hear the concept of nonduality, that we're all
one and there is no separation between the personal self
(37:14):
and that universal self. But when we start to have
the experience of both, and we can toggle our consciousness
between the egoic consciousness the human consciousness that we have
to kind of work through, and it's our operating system
for this world, so we have to use it. But
(37:36):
if we can toggle back to that soul consciousness more
and more and more, then we start to experience greater
and greater, more lasting happiness. And I really think that
all of the teachings of yoga have to do with that.
It's really going back to that higher self, that spiritual
self of which we're all apart of the one that
(38:01):
brings us to the lasting happiness.
Speaker 2 (38:03):
Can you imagine what the world would be like if
they were able to if every individual were able to
tap into them?
Speaker 4 (38:10):
Doug, Yes, I can. I can imagine it, and I
hope that more and more people start being able to
imagine it. I want to live in that world.
Speaker 2 (38:21):
As we close, here's my question for you. If if
you could share a thought with the audience, a final thought,
what would that be?
Speaker 4 (38:30):
You know, I've asked this question a lot of the
end of interviews, and my answer often has to do
with love. But today I'm gonna say something different. I
would tell people not to apologize for joy. Joy is
something that has gotten really squelched in the world today.
We are so focused on the challenges in the world
(38:53):
that we miss the glimmers of joy, and joy is
our true nature as much as love is. So embrace
and celebrate your joy.
Speaker 2 (39:02):
Oh, I love it so question? How do people find you?
Speaker 4 (39:06):
My website Jenny Leecoaching dot com easy to find Jenny
leecoaching dot com and happy to answer questions or connect
with anyone there.
Speaker 2 (39:16):
And are people able to work with you if they
don't live in Hawaii?
Speaker 4 (39:21):
Absolutely? I work with people all over the world and
all different time zones, and it's fantastic that we live
in the technological time that we can zoom and yeah yeah,
happy to work with anyone anywhere. And my books are
all on Amazon and all the major booksellers, so easy
to find those as well.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
Fantastic, Well, Jenny, thanks so much. This has been an
interesting conversation and I really appreciate your insights that you've
shared with the audience.
Speaker 4 (39:48):
So thank you, thank you, thank you doctor Doug.
Speaker 2 (39:52):
Folks, thanks for listening. I hope this is meaningful for
you and look forward to having you join us again soon.
So no mistay, the
Speaker 3 (40:02):
Count intend to continued n with year
This program is designed to provide general information with regards
to the subject matters covered. This information is given with
the understanding that neither the hosts, guests, sponsors, or station
are engaged in rendering any specific and personal medical, financial,
legal counseling, professional service, or any advice.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
You should seek the services.
Speaker 1 (00:23):
Of competent professionals before applying or trying any suggested ideas.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
At the end of the day, it's not about what
you have or even what you've accomplished. It's about what
you've done with those accomplishments. It's about who you've lifted up,
who you've made better. It's about what you've given back.
Denzel Washington, welcome to Inspire Vision. Our sole purpose is
to elevate the lives of others and to inspire you
(00:51):
to do the same.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Jenny, Welcome to the show.
Speaker 4 (00:54):
Hey Doug, nice to be here.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Oh I'm excited. And you tell me that you're in
Hawaii right now. That is fantastic.
Speaker 4 (01:03):
I am. I'm based on the island of but wahoo.
I love it here. Feel really blessed to live on
the island.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
I'll bet that's amazing. I love Hawaii. When I've been
able to get over there. It's great. Anyway, what I'd
love for you to do is to share with the
audience your journey. You know, I know that there's well
I don't know, but you know, many people are doing
certain things then all of a sudden they kind of
have an Aha moment and they change directions, or maybe
(01:29):
they've just discovered it from the get go, which is
amazing if you have so share your journey with the
audience of how you got to this point in what
you're doing now.
Speaker 4 (01:40):
Sure, well, I'll guess I'll backtrack to about thirty years ago.
I was living in Los Angeles and working as an
actor and practicing yoga physical yoga at the time, and
I started going through some personal challenges in my marriage
and was really looking for some solace, and I discovered
(02:04):
the deeper teachings of yoga, the Yogic philosophies of life
and how they can bring us into equilibrium and inner peace,
and so started practicing meditation and more breath work and
really understanding the principles of what it takes to live
in an aligned way and through the Yogic perspective, which is,
(02:25):
you know, five thousand years old and over time sort
of fast forward ten years. I had gotten a divorce,
I had moved across country, I was recently needing to
re establish myself in the workforce after having a child,
and I a decided to open a yoga studio because
(02:48):
it was my love, it was my passion, and that
really started the trajectory of where I am today. So today,
I've been a yoga studio owner. I've been a yoga
therapist for many, many years, counseling people individually through the
many practices and philosophies of yoga. I've written three books
on the topics of yoga and meditation and spiritual living
(03:12):
and self evolution. And I really love what I have
been able to do for a career. I love all
the people that I've gotten to interact with over the years,
and you know, talking about aha moments, it's really one
of my greatest joys to see someone awaken to their
(03:34):
inner self, their their their beautiful, brilliant spiritual light and
their joy and what really makes them that particular soul
that they are and step closer towards that, towards embodying that,
and as a guide for that journey. I feel really
blessed to have met some extraordinary people over the years.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
Oh that's fantastic, you know, And and you you made point,
and I appreciate if you kind of expand on this,
because so many times when I think of yoga, and
I know most people think of yoga, it's I'm out
there trying to stretch and trying to do this, trying
to do that, which I can't do at this point
in time. But when you talk about the higher level
of yoga, and now you get into the whole philosophy
(04:19):
of yoga, that's an entirely different thing. Can you kind
of share with the audience what the difference is there?
Speaker 4 (04:24):
Sure? Well, one is part of the other, right, So
the physical postures are a part of what's called the
eight limb path of yoga, and they prepare our bodies
and our minds to be able to sit in stillness
and meditation, and so they make up a part of
the yogic path. But the yogic path really is so
(04:46):
much broader than just the postures that have become popular
in the West. And my first book, True Yoga, It's
called True Yoga was written because as a yoga teacher,
I was trying to impart this understanding to my students
in you know, hour long classes, and I just felt
like there needed to be a bigger explanation available to them,
(05:09):
but written in a way that was accessible and modern
and sort of pragmatic for daily life. Because the texts
that are the traditional yoga philosophy texts, the Bagavad Gita,
the Upas, the blanking on the other one right now anyway, utris,
(05:31):
the yoga sutris. How can I forget that? It's what
my book is based on. Well, brain faid, okay, yeah,
so are They are all written fairly esoterically. So for
the average student of yoga, the person who's going to
go to a Saturday morning physical yoga class, it's not
necessarily going to have time to absorb these teachings, these
(05:52):
esoteric teachings, and so as a teacher, I really wanted
to write a book that would boil them down in
a way and apply them to daily modern life, that
would make them useful for people, if you will. And
you know, there's so many I'll just take one little
example out of the yoga sutras. So there's the practice
(06:16):
of ahimsa, and ahimsa for all intents and purposes is intentional,
the intentional practice of peacefulness. So it's not enough to
just not be violent. We have to go out of
our way to bring peace into situations and into our
(06:36):
own hearts and minds and lives. And this isn't easy.
Right on the day to day we live in stressful
times and everyone that I talk to, their stress levels
are really really high. So when you're working with a
teaching like this and looking at what an ancient science
of spirituality, which is really what yoga philosophy is, it's
(07:00):
a spiritual science, it's the it's an inner science of
how to align ourselves with the harmony that can exist
within ourselves and within the universe when we're in right
action right And so one of those principles is intentional peacefulness.
And then we have to kind of break it down
(07:21):
and look at, well, how do we do that? And
so that how question is always what I'm working with
students or clients on in terms of how to, within
the context of their lives, really how to do that.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
Okay, and you've written, as you say, you've written a
few books. You've got your yoga one, and then there's
a couple of other books you're written. Just share with
the audience what they are and what they're Yeah.
Speaker 4 (07:44):
Sure. My second book is called Breathing Love and it's
meditation in action is the subtitles. So the principle behind
that book is meditation for me on the cushions, seated
silent is a daily practice that is essential. And I
(08:04):
can't do that and then get up off the cushion
and go be a jerk in my life. Right, we
have to carry the quality of meditation, the deep piece
and equilibrium that we cultivate on the cushion. We have
to carry it out into the crazy world that we
live in and apply those. The same practices that we
(08:29):
utilize when we're sitting and focusing and going inward in
our stated meditation practice, we have to apply those in
day to day life. So again pragmatic look at how
to apply the principles of meditation into daily life. That's
what that book is about. And then my third book
is Spark Change and the subtitle is one hundred and
(08:50):
eight Provocative Questions for Spiritual Evolution. So this draws upon
the Yogic principle of self inquiry or swadyaya, and self
inquiry is to me the other side of the meditation
coin because we have to go inward to be still,
and then we also have to do a little bit
(09:11):
of digging in there. So part of it is quieting
the mind, but then part of it is engaging the
mind and looking at our patterns, looking at our belief systems,
looking at the obstacles that we hold within our own
beings to those to that journey towards alignment and peace
and inner harmony. And so that book is a compilation
(09:33):
of questions that I've used with clients over the years
to help them sort of navigate their inner.
Speaker 5 (09:39):
Landscape and to find ways to move through the obstacles
that they feel in their lives and to initiate change.
Speaker 4 (09:51):
At a very proactive level.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
Well, and I want to talk about all of those things.
You know, one of the interesting things that you talk
about is how long do you meditate each day? And
what do you recommend and what do you recommend people?
Number one? Number two, you talk about breathwork, but you
didn't really talk about that. Is there a specific type
of breath work? Because I've interviewed so many people with
(10:15):
different ideas about how the breath work should be. What
are your thoughts on that? Number one how long And
number two breathwork.
Speaker 4 (10:22):
Okay, so how long? For sure, half an hour in
the morning. If I'm being disciplined, I'll do half an
hour in the evening as well. I don't always do that,
but that's my ideal practice time. That's not what I
would recommend to a beginner, though, because you do have
to sort of work up to it, and I say
just start with five to ten minutes and develop that
(10:44):
habit of sitting down and getting quiet. Now, breath work
is part of the sutra that has to do the
yoga sutra that has to do with energy management. Fronta
Yamana is energy, Yama is control of energy, So we
can control our energy through the breath. And that's where
(11:07):
all these diverse practices of breath work that are getting
quite popular these days. It's sort of the next wave
of yoga that's coming through the West and getting really
popular because people are seeing that there's power in the
ability to control your breath. It will the breath naturally
reflects our emotional state. So if you get angry, or
(11:31):
if you have a sudden fright or something, your breath
is going to get really constricted. And if you're trying
to manage stress by doing breath work, Well, then you're
going to want to elongate the breath, you're going to
want to slow it down, You're going to want to
control it in waves that would be opposite of what
would happen if you had that anger or fright moment
(11:53):
where it gets really constricted. Now, I'm not going to
give a general I'm not gonna apply a general technique
on a podcast like this because breathwork is very personal
and it's very situational. And so when I'm working with
a client, we're talking about what it is that they're
experiencing in their lives in terms of stressors. I need
(12:17):
to know about their physiology and any medications that they
might be on. Do they suffer with anxiety, do they
have depression? Are they going through some particular grief right now?
All of these things play into what breath work I
might do with them, because however we manipulate the breath
has an effect. And so I don't want to give
(12:40):
some general practice and be counter into it, you know,
counter productive for somebody, counter indicated. Sorry, that's not I'm
losing my words today, counter indicated for someone who might have,
you know, hypertension, or anxiety or something like that. So
it is very specific to the person.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
Well, and you know what's fascinating to me, and you know,
as I'm here in Thailand, I found very fascinating to
learn a little bit more about Buddhism. And one of
the interesting things is going back to the original teachings
and then seeing what's happening now. It actually went from
the one teaching of Buddha. Now I think there's four
or five major differences that kind of oppose each other
(13:24):
at least teach different things. And it's kind of the
same thing with I would think with yoga, because you know,
as I look at meditation and I've gone to some
workshops and so forth with that, and I love meditating.
But what I've found is that there's a lot of
you know, focus for many on you know, if this
(13:46):
is what you want to be, then this is the
affirmation you want to think about or say while you're
meditating and so forth. And I'm not sure, I don't
know the answers I'm listening to this is that part
of the original yoga lots of of meditating and so
forth you talk about, which I really appreciate, you know,
finding that sense of peace and also be able to
(14:10):
ultimately identify and do that introspective work and find out
where things are happening that you don't want to be happening.
What are your thoughts on that, and what.
Speaker 4 (14:21):
Have you seen so on affirmation specifically, I feel that
they can be very powerful. I would not say they're
part of the original Yogic teachings. I'm trying just you know,
scanning through my mind and all the studies I've done
of the Yoga sutras, and I can't pull a passage
that would specifically indicate that affirmation per se were recommended.
(14:48):
That being said, I think how we hold ourselves, how
we speak to ourselves, the way we think about ourselves,
all of this is part of that inner work that
we approach when we get when we quiet the outer world.
And so I think you could extrapolate that it's it's
(15:10):
a natural progression, let's say, and maybe a more modern
tool that is effective and is helpful. I mean, I
do think that the yoga searchers talk about some scaras.
So the words some scara has to do with neurological
grooves and that come from repetitive thought. And there's also
(15:32):
a suture that says, if a thought is causing difficulty,
change it to its positive opposite. The practice is pratipak shababana.
And so you know, we think about modern psychology. That's
kind of a framework that we might find in modern
psychology as well. So in terms of affirmation, if we're
(15:54):
feeling low self worth, well we're going to do an
affirmation that has to do with building more self esteem
self confidence. But and it's for the point of changing
those neurological groups, because the more we think of thought,
the more it becomes kind of our reality and just
the default system of our minds, and so it behooves
(16:17):
us to choose positive thoughts certainly.
Speaker 2 (16:21):
Well, and you know, you just brought up an interesting thing.
You call them neurological groups. How how old is yoga?
How how how long ago did that philosophy come to be?
Speaker 4 (16:31):
The first the first kind of markers of yoga, which
were like hieroglyphic pictures of postures and meditation type imagery,
was is like five thousand years old. So this is
this is not new stuff. I was taking humanity so
(16:56):
long to know.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
What's amazing to me is here they're talking about those
neurological gurus and finally scientists have come up with the
understanding that the neural and we call the neural pathways nowadays,
but they can be changed and as you say, you know,
you can literally change that from negative to the positive.
(17:19):
And it just is amazing to me these philosophies that
are thousands and thousands of years old and how insightful
they were at the time and they still are, which
just amazes me. So anyway, that was one of the
questions I have. But also as we talk about meditation,
(17:41):
and you talked about how, you know, starting to discover
those inner issues that we need to deal with, and
I think that really has to do with curiosity, with
creativity being able to go in and analyze the fact.
I was watching the podcast the other day and it
was it was a theological one just happened to be there.
(18:05):
But the whole point was, you know, our behavior, we
don't behave in order to become, We behave and you
kind of alluded to this, we behave the way that
we are internally who we are spiritually, and I want
you to talk a little bit about that and talk
(18:26):
about how people who are experiencing things in their lives
oftentimes don't realize that, you know what, they can change that.
But in order to do that, they really need to
do that introspective work and change inside themselves.
Speaker 4 (18:41):
Absolutely. There's a when I'm talking to young women about
and that's going to apply to young men as well,
about relationship. There's a kind of an expression, if someone
shows you who they are, believe them, meaning, don't if
someone is acting badly, don't think that they are something
(19:04):
different than that that they're showing you who they are
from because their behavior does reflect who they are, who
they are internally at that moment. Now that's not to
say that they can't change, but the change really has
to come from the individual. It cannot come from anyone
else outside of them. It has to come from I
(19:27):
think often pain getting uncomfortable enough in our situation that
we are in where maybe our behavior just keeps leading
us into suffering, into disappointment, into whatever it is, and
we and then we kind of get to the point
where we're tired of hitting our head against the wall,
(19:48):
and we and we start to ask those inner questions
of well, how can I how can I do something different?
Like I want a different result here? How can I
do something different, and it takes a tremendous amount of
willillingness to then do that hard inner introspection. And one
of the chapters in the third book that I wrote,
Spark Change, is about willingness because when we initiate change,
(20:13):
and this is something that is I think people don't realize.
People will say, oh, I really want to change X,
Y or Z in my life. I know I need
to change this, so they have the awareness that they
need to change, they have the desire to change, but
they don't have the willingness to actually do the work
of change because change is hard and it requires that
(20:35):
we pattern interdrop right, We interrupt the patterns of behavior
that we've been used to for so long. And unfortunately
it's again these neurological groups. We default to the familiar,
and even if the familiar is getting us nowhere or
getting us nothing but summering, we still default to it
a lot until we just get so tired of it.
(20:55):
And that's why I say I think Keane is often
our greatest teacher, because we have to get to that
point where we're so willing to do something different, no
matter how hard it is. The great news, though, is
that once you start coactively doing that inner work and
moving towards positive change, it's like a snowball effect. It
(21:19):
does actually get easier and it works. We are incredibly
powerful beings and we can change anything that we really
truly put our minds to.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
Well, and when you're working with someone and you know
they're willing and I'm writing a little bit about that,
and I call it bravery, but by I like the
word willingness too. When you when you're working with someone
and they go back and they identify some beliefs that
have been imprinted on them, and I use the word
imprinted because I don't think they really wanted that, how
(21:55):
do you how do you help them? Number one? I
guess I haven't number of questions, so I apologie as
I do this all the time. Number one, when you're meditating,
how do you consciously go in and start to identify
those imprints that are causing the behavior that you really
don't want? And then number two, how do you start
(22:18):
to change those?
Speaker 4 (22:20):
Okay, those are great questions, Doug, And I want to
be clear that I don't teach meditation as a time
for self inquiry. There are two separate practices. Okay, so meditation,
according to the Yoga sutras, is really the time to
quiet the mind. And so there are techniques that lead
(22:40):
us towards quiet mind, such as the breath work, such
as focusing on a mantra or a visualization of I
often use a visualization of the breath within the body.
And so with those tools we are focusing the mind
on a single point in order to quiet the rest
(23:02):
of the chatter. Self inquiry, the identification of those beliefs,
those imprints that many of which come from very very
early ages, precognitive kind of times, as we know, is different.
That's a different time. That's a more time when we
(23:22):
are conscious. We might be journaling, we might be in
dialogue with a coach or a therapist. We might be
reading a book like the one that I wrote, that
kind of working through a question and reflecting on it.
It's a more active time. So that's to me, either
a two sides of the coin of spiritual practice. So
the meditation time to be going into deep stillness and
(23:45):
really stilling the mind, and then the self inquiry time,
which is the time to kind of chew on things
and process it.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
Well. Then my question goes to this, if you're doing
it separately, and I totally agree that you have to
have that consciousness to be will go in and really
identify that. But are you able then, with meditation to
start to change those neuro pathways as you talked about,
by when those things come up, being able to verbally
(24:13):
affirm that, you know, I no longer do this, I
am this way, and as we affirm that time and
time again, and I happen to do that in my
walking meditation out loud, nobody hears me because I'm walking,
but I find that that helps. What are your thoughts
on that? Is that something that through meditation and affirmation
(24:35):
while you're meditating, that you're able to start to change
those pathways and as you say, originally reverse and change
those neurological grooves to a different groove.
Speaker 4 (24:48):
So let's think of it. Let's think of it in
two ways. So the like you're talking about a walking
practice where you're audibly affirming things that would be counteracting,
say these neurological groups that are maybe holding you in
a negative pattern, that would be one side of the
(25:08):
practice that's more of the active practice, like the self
increase the active practice in meditation. The way that the
neurological groups are getting smoothed out is not by affirmation,
not during meditation. It's by not allowing your thought to
(25:28):
go on the story train. It's about bringing it back
to your chosen point of attention, whether it's the breath
or the visualization, let's say, of light at the third eye,
or the feeling of the breath moving up and down
the spine, something that is more of the moment. Bringing
(25:50):
the thoughts that inevitably wander off to all the old
patterns or the days to do list or whatever distracts us,
bringing it back, bringing it back, bringing it back so
that the mind quiets down. It's kind of like redirecting
the child that wants to do this and wants to
do that, and you're trying to get them to sit
(26:11):
down and do their homework. So it's like, no, we're
going to do this right now. No, we're going to
do this right now. And so every time we correct
and come back to that single point of attention, we
are changing the grooves. But it's a different sort of practice.
So both are important, but I utilize them at different times.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
Okay, And so you know, like we're walking. Meditation is
promoted by a few well known individuals, and you mentioned that,
so I know who you're talking about as far as
up and down the spine. But the reality is that
if I'm doing walking meditation, then that's really not the
peaceful meditation that you're talking about. And quite honestly, I
(26:54):
also do quiet too, but I think that's I really
appreciate the distinguishment that you made with that that there
are two elements of that. So really what I'm doing
walking meditation and what many people are doing that they
call meditation is really really conscious introspection or conscious yes whatever,
(27:16):
rather than that peaceful meditation. So another question, because as
I say, I do that a lot when you talk
to people and teach them how to meditate, what are
your thoughts about using music binural beats or the selfedgio
beats type of thing, and you're shaking your head so
I can't wait to hear.
Speaker 4 (27:36):
So I think we need more vocabulary, right, So, like
you said, I love how you reframed the walking meditation
to conscious walking introspection or something. And that's great because
it is more accurate if we're looking at the traditional
definition of meditation from the Yoga sutras, and that's my
(27:59):
basis of practice. They talk about meditation being a state
of being, the state of being still. It's not a practice,
it's not something The practices lead us there. So there
are several practices prior to meditation, the focus and single
(28:20):
point of attention and the management of energy and the
postures and all these these are part of the aid
Limb path, and so all of these things lead us
to meditation, which is that state of being still. So
to answer your question about the music, and I get
this question all the time, well, can I do a
(28:41):
guided meditation on you know, the insight at time or
app or this about Yes, absolutely, I wouldn't call it meditation.
I would call it wonderful guided relaxation, A beautiful practice
to do at the end of a stressful day, doing
affirmations while you're walking, fantastic practice of introspection and repatterning
(29:03):
of the neural grooves, listening to the binural beats, another
wonderful way to relax the mind and the body. I
love that kind of music. To me, It's not meditation.
It's not traditional yogic meditation, which is stillness. So anything external,
any external stimulus, is going to some degree be pulling
(29:28):
our consciousness outward versus The intent of meditation is to
turn our consciousness inward so that we have a sense
of self or awareness that is beyond the physical, external
self that we identify with on the day to day basis.
And that's why I would not recommend from a classical standpoint.
Speaker 2 (29:51):
So let's talk about the sense of self. And why
do you think that's so important that you've actually differentiated
all those different types of quote meditation to the original
yoga meditation where you're really just focusing on breath work,
which in effect is also focusing on something, but where
(30:11):
you're doing that and really finding that stillness and that self.
Let's identify, first of all, if you can, what is
the self? You know, you talk about the soul, you
talk about all of this, and obviously there's so many
different things. And what I find is many people who
are deeply quote religious, are a little bit worried about meditation.
(30:34):
They feel like it's pulling them away from their quote
religious concepts. And yet you know, you talk about stillness,
you talk about soul, what do you mean by that?
Speaker 4 (30:46):
Okay, So when we meet are born, we come into
these bodies, we begin to have experiences immediately in the
physical dimension, and we become extremely identified with our bodies,
with our personalities, with the story and the and of
(31:07):
what we're living, the people around us, the teachings that
we're being given. It's all part of our physical experience.
And we identify self as Doug, Jenny, you know, whoever,
and with all that makes us up from the human standpoint,
but from the yoga teachings we are, that is not
(31:30):
all of who we are. It is It's like when
we put on glasses to see something, and it would
be as if I started to say, I'm these glasses. Well, no,
I'm not the glasses. The glasses are just something that
I'm seeing through. So the body, the personality, this self
that is Jenny right now is just something that my
(31:53):
soul is seeing through. It's like the glasses that I've
put on that my soul has put on. The soul
is the essence that is indestructible and everlasting and goes
on and on and on in different forms, and this
form that I'm in right now is just temporary, and
(32:14):
so I don't have the more I can know myself
as more than this, I can still enjoy being Jenny
and I'm meant to express through the Jenny personality right now,
but to know myself as more than that gives me
great peace and freedom because when the difficulties of being
(32:37):
Jenny come up, I don't get completely lost in them.
I can, in meditation step outside just for the moment
in the stillness, and have an awareness of myself as
pure peace for love.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
And you know, you talk about peace, you talk about love,
that inner soul, and what fashion me about that is
that as I look at it, you know, we're here
on this earth, We've got this physical body, and as
you say, the soul is eternal. There's no question about
that in my mind at least, And yet so often
(33:14):
we tend to focus so much on this physical aspect
of it, not realizing that if we could just return
back to the qualities of the soul, the love, the kindness,
all of those type of things, and it goes back
to what I was talking about. As we become then
our behavior reflects that. And so you know, as you
(33:36):
talk about that, let's talk a little bit about love,
because I know that you know and some of the
talking points you shared with me. You know, one of
the questions is what is it to live love and
how do you how do you experience love as an individual,
and how do you take how do you allow the
mortal physical body to move away from prevention of that
(33:58):
so that your soul can try really experience that, which
then evolves into your physical ability to experience love too.
Speaker 4 (34:07):
Oh, Doug, that that was a very convoluted question there.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
I know, you know, my my assistance and my dental
practice would just go crazy because I would be talking
to them and I come up with the three or
four things that say, would you just stay with one?
Speaker 4 (34:25):
That's just I have I know where you were going though,
So there is it's a great question to bridge off
of the self question because there is personal love right
that I experience with my friend's family, son, husband, whatever, animals.
But then there's this universal energy of love. And so
(34:46):
one of the things I talk about in my second book,
which is called Breathing Love and which is very much
about the practice of living love, is how do we
tap into that universal energy of love more and more
and more so that we're not limited by that personal
sense of love because the personal sense of love, it
(35:06):
gets very colored by our history, the ways that we've
been hurt and disappointed the ways our desires, our particular
you know, things that we're looking for gratification around, or
that we have needs around, and so a lot of
what we call love really isn't pure love when it
(35:28):
comes to the personality side of things. That energy of love,
the universal energy of love, is really the Gananda Parmhanza
Yogananda calls it the harmonizing energy of the universe. And
so as we tap into that vibration, it's really an
energetic vibration. And I do this when I'm in the
(35:49):
stillness of meditation. That's what I'm That's why I'm there
because I want to tap that every day and I
want that to for through me and infuse me so
that when I feel limited in my capacity to show
up kindly or compassionately in a situation in my personal life,
(36:13):
I can say, all right, this is me talking to myself.
Deep breath, This isn't about me. Like God is love spirit,
the universal energy of love is there. Let me draw
on that, let me bring it through. I'm just the
vessel and that's how I sort of practice it. But
in order to be able to do that in the
(36:33):
day to day circumstances where I might feel challenged. I've
got to have that infusion every day in meditation. It
really is my time to connect to love.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
Yeah, I love that. And how do you experience that
lasting happiness, that real love that I think everybody wants.
Speaker 4 (36:52):
Well, I think you only experience it when you start
to have this sort of dual It's funny, I'm going
to use a dualistic expression, but it's really about non duality. Right.
So we hear the concept of nonduality, that we're all
one and there is no separation between the personal self
(37:14):
and that universal self. But when we start to have
the experience of both, and we can toggle our consciousness
between the egoic consciousness the human consciousness that we have
to kind of work through, and it's our operating system
for this world, so we have to use it. But
(37:36):
if we can toggle back to that soul consciousness more
and more and more, then we start to experience greater
and greater, more lasting happiness. And I really think that
all of the teachings of yoga have to do with that.
It's really going back to that higher self, that spiritual
self of which we're all apart of the one that
(38:01):
brings us to the lasting happiness.
Speaker 2 (38:03):
Can you imagine what the world would be like if
they were able to if every individual were able to
tap into them?
Speaker 4 (38:10):
Doug, Yes, I can. I can imagine it, and I
hope that more and more people start being able to
imagine it. I want to live in that world.
Speaker 2 (38:21):
As we close, here's my question for you. If if
you could share a thought with the audience, a final thought,
what would that be?
Speaker 4 (38:30):
You know, I've asked this question a lot of the
end of interviews, and my answer often has to do
with love. But today I'm gonna say something different. I
would tell people not to apologize for joy. Joy is
something that has gotten really squelched in the world today.
We are so focused on the challenges in the world
(38:53):
that we miss the glimmers of joy, and joy is
our true nature as much as love is. So embrace
and celebrate your joy.
Speaker 2 (39:02):
Oh, I love it so question? How do people find you?
Speaker 4 (39:06):
My website Jenny Leecoaching dot com easy to find Jenny
leecoaching dot com and happy to answer questions or connect
with anyone there.
Speaker 2 (39:16):
And are people able to work with you if they
don't live in Hawaii?
Speaker 4 (39:21):
Absolutely? I work with people all over the world and
all different time zones, and it's fantastic that we live
in the technological time that we can zoom and yeah yeah,
happy to work with anyone anywhere. And my books are
all on Amazon and all the major booksellers, so easy
to find those as well.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
Fantastic, Well, Jenny, thanks so much. This has been an
interesting conversation and I really appreciate your insights that you've
shared with the audience.
Speaker 4 (39:48):
So thank you, thank you, thank you doctor Doug.
Speaker 2 (39:52):
Folks, thanks for listening. I hope this is meaningful for
you and look forward to having you join us again soon.
So no mistay, the
Speaker 3 (40:02):
Count intend to continued n with year
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