October 23, 2024 • 51 mins
In 2000 Andrea Franchetti, purchased abandoned vineyards on the northern slopes of Mount Etna, an area marked by steep vineyards and vast lava fields. Franchetti focused on quality over quantity. He planted not only indigenous red Nerello Mascalese but also Chardonnay for his Passobianco and Petit Verdot and Cesanese d'Affile for his iconic Vini Franchetti red blend. Benjamin Franchetti took over leadership of Vini Franchetti and Passopisciaro SRL after his father's passing in 2022.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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(00:21):
W FOURCY Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Welcome to the Connected Table Live. We're your hosts, Melanie
Young and David Ransom. You're insatiably curious culinary couple. We
travel the world to bring you the stories and destinations,
the wine and the food, and the hotels and places
to visit stay that you love and want to visit
because you like us, enjoy good food, good wine, good
(01:06):
spirits and the good life. We are taking you today
to probably one of the most desirous destinations when we
talk to people when we travel. We're taking you to Sicily,
where we recently attended ETNA Days, which is a large
presentation to preview the new Vintage. We were honored to
(01:26):
be media guests. And after the Etna Day program ended,
which was presented by the Consortio Tutele DOC which was
established in nineteen sixty eight, David ad did a little
mini tour of our own and we decided to focus
on a very specific and fascinating area of Etna Doc
because it's a very large area. I mean, we're talking
(01:47):
about Mount Etna, the largest active volcano in Europe, right David, absolutely, Melanie,
and it is still active. So we chose to visit
something called Etna North North Etna and the quote Demilee,
which is one hundred meter road that goes east to
west in Etna North one thousand thousand.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
It's a road that basically is at one thousand meters,
so it's three thousand feet above sea level along the
side of Mount exactly.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
I stay corrected and joining us, joining us a well.
From one of the wineries that we visited is Benjamin
Franketti of Paso Peshado, which is also a contrada as
well as the company in Etna North, and we visited
his winery, his family's winery there, Vini Franketti, and it
was really fabulous and Benjamin is the son of Andrea Franketty,
(02:42):
who is considered one of the pioneers of ETNA DOC.
So we're going to talk about his father. We're going
to talk how Benjamin is carrying on the legacy and
the amazing wines we tasted. Benjamin frank Ketty, Welcome to
the Connected Table Live.
Speaker 4 (02:57):
Thank you, Thank you for invite me to have this
talk with you.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Well, we appreciate the hospitality we received when we visited.
So we love to start the story and interviews with
our esteem guest with family because this is about the
people who shape the industries that we love. Talk to
us about your father, who we did say is considered
a pioneer of the area. Tell us about his background
(03:27):
and growing up with him. And we understand you had
an American mother.
Speaker 4 (03:32):
So he had an American mother. My mother is actually
Sicilian from Palermo. So yeah, so my father grew up in.
Speaker 5 (03:46):
Rome from an Italian father.
Speaker 4 (03:52):
And our very American mother who came to Italy just
after the Second World War and and and met my
grandfather and they and they and she decided to stay
in Italy. So she has her origins. Are are you know,
(04:15):
very very you know, like sort of North northern east
side of the U s and the and then he
grew up in Rome and he decided he initially started
working in the wine industry as a distributor. In his thirties,
(04:37):
he moved to New York where he worked as a
distributor of Italian wines in the New York area before
deciding to return to Italy to start making wine, which
was his dream really was to make great wines. And
he started relatively late, so in his in his forties.
(05:00):
He initially started by buying an estate in Tuscany, which
at the time was actually it wasn't an estate. There
was nothing. It was just a plot of land in
the middle of nowhere in Tuscany, which he planted and
transformed it into what is to the n estate called
the Nuta Degren Autumn, which was his first project and
(05:25):
focused on Bordeaux wine varieties. Then, you know, he around
ten years later in two thousand, he was looking to
start a new project and he's almost i would say,
pretty much stumbled up among the Atna, which in the
(05:46):
early two thousand was a sort of abandoned almost abandoned
the place. You know, people had been making wine on
the Atna for for hundreds of years, and and when
he when he got there, the place was was was
(06:11):
pretty much pretty much abandoned. There where all these amazingly
cultivated hundred plus year year old divines, many of those
including the the the vineyards surrounding the the winery which
which he visited where we were not even being picked anymore,
(06:32):
and the and the in a he fell, you know,
he fell in love with with the place, with the energy,
and together with other you know, winemakers off of the
sort of at the same time, they they started what
became essentially revolution. So this is a bit of a
(06:54):
short history of how he got to the Ana.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
It's interesting when we visited, we were we found out
that not only were the vineyards abandoned, but they were
in complete and other disrepair. And there was really a
tremendous amount of restoration and reinvigoration of the vines that
had to take place before you could even start making wine.
Speaker 4 (07:16):
Yeah, I mean, this is something which it is quite
incredible to think about that, you know, these were vines
which were you know, well, first of all, on the
one hand, if you think that these vines were one
hundred are one hundred plus years old and even after
(07:37):
being you know, partially abandoned, they today are still growing,
are still you know, growing amazingly. And to for me,
this is sort of the it's a homage to the
amazing work of the of the farmers, the local farmers
that were really really great farmers, because ultimately the fact
(08:02):
that these vines today are still so healthy and even
after all they went through is a proof that this
this the people working the land, the farmers working the
land over over the multiple generations where we're really really
great farmers. First and foremost, what they were probably not
(08:28):
as good was at making what today we recognize as
being quality wine. So they really focused on making quantity
and and and that was the objective was to make
as many killers as possible and as many ecolets as
(08:51):
possible out of every plant. And the one one thing
that you know, my father always always said, like to
create too. You know, there's a perfectly imverse correlationship between
how many kilos a plant makes and the quality of
the wine that comes out of it.
Speaker 6 (09:11):
So what what he did really early on when he
arrived in this in this almost barren land was or
was that he started to speak with the farmers and
there's this interesting story I.
Speaker 7 (09:24):
Got problem from locals that he was one of the
first days he was there walking through this this these
vineyards with with a local farmer.
Speaker 4 (09:40):
He went to him and said, tell me, tell me
a vine and a grape you're particularly proud of. And
you know, he was walking there and he just went
and took the chunkiest and fastest and juiciest grape which
was hanging around and and my father went there and
(10:00):
cut it and said leave it on the ground. And
the farmer was like shocked. It was like, why would
I live on the ground, you know, my income? And
he said, because you don't make quality with quantity, and
the juiciest grapes are usually the ones which are probably
going to give you the least quality. So this was
really you know, it's a bit of a you know,
to show how something you know, relatively simple, but changing
(10:26):
the philosophy around while making and moving from you know,
doing pure agriculture to doing you know, bringing in the
the you know, bringing in the mind of the human
the mind of the brain of maybe of almost of
the artists into the into the agricultural process, and you
(10:46):
transform something which is just pure, you know, making as
many liters of great joe as possible, which was sent
to the north of Italy and the other regions of
Europe to to be to be mixed with other wines. Essentially,
that was the main purpose of the of the the
(11:08):
produce of Vitna into a very high quality programs. And
today Atna, it's since then, since purely two thousand, we've
seen this incredible revolution where where more, more and more
winemakers arrived. Interestingly, initially a lot from outside of Sicily,
(11:29):
including my father and other winemakers, and and and then
slowly even within Sicily it became, you know, a hotspot
for for for people to experiment making making great wines.
And this is probably what you you tasted. Only only
twenty years later there's this this this change in dramatic
(11:53):
change in quality.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
You know, given the centuries of old history of Italy
and Sicily, it really quite a renaissance to think that
this only really happened at the twenty first century, this
renaissance of Italian wines being made in Sicily. And as
I noted in the beginning, at the dock, which is
the specific area that we visited, was established in nineteen
(12:18):
sixty eight. Think about how long it took to evolve
to get to that revolution, as we call it. This
is an interesting area. First of all, you know, there
are challenges and we would love to discuss some of
them because you're dominated by an active volcano and the
land has been shaped by centuries of lava flow, which
(12:39):
is such an important aspect to these wines. Talk to
us about that.
Speaker 4 (12:46):
Yeah, I mean, so of course, the volcano is the
volcano is you know, it's like this big giant always
sitting behind you. Good giant, because you know it's it's
it's okay, know that the nature of its eruptions are
(13:07):
such that it's not you know, it's not risk, doesn't
pose a risk to the humans, but it's being so
active the the lava flows. Although human being can easily
walk away from the lava flows badly, a vine can't.
(13:30):
And so when you when.
Speaker 8 (13:31):
You probably visited the you you you you saw that
there is some occasional highways of recent volcanic eruptions, primarily
the nineteen eighty eruption that essentially went through the vineyards
and destroyed them.
Speaker 4 (13:49):
So this is obviously something that is always there. It
happens quite rarely, but but it can happen, but it's
also you know, I guess it's it's the two sides
of the coin. Because on the other hand, the fact
that this volcano digs from the center of the earth
(14:13):
constantly different different materials, different rocks, different substances, and takes
it out and throws it onto onto the the surface
of of the mountain. It's what a way makes makes
(14:38):
the acts so special because what to typically take millions
of years of geological evolution of the happens on the
course of hundreds or maybe max thousands of the years.
So you you find, you know, within within for example,
our state, the passively shadow state is divided. We have
(15:02):
we we we we cover five different contradas, and like
the highest contradas like Rampante and the contrad the Ola,
which are close to one thousand meters so around three
thousand feet, have a completely vastly different soil from the
(15:27):
contradas lower down at like five hundred meters or one thousand,
five hundred feet, such as contract the mansion where where
the soil is more and more and more continental, and
and this this huge different in soil variety and makes
it makes the end so interesting because it's very unusual
(15:52):
to be able to try maybe different contradas, which essentially
is the same concept of a crew, so different crews
from the same great variety which has such a vastly
different taste. And I think people really love love to
be able are very interested in seeing the difference the
(16:16):
effect that there are can have on the taste of
the wine, which is what makes wine so interesting really
to people.
Speaker 2 (16:25):
The days we had the opportunity to taste variety of
rines from different contratta and you can taste the difference.
And of course when we visited your winery, we were
taken to the different vineyards. But it's interesting is some
of them are very you know, the height is actually
exceeds what is allowed in production of at the dock wines.
(16:46):
Your father was a visionary and in addition to planting
the varieties that are native, he also planted other varieties
such a shortened a petit verdough. And what was his
thought behind that, given the fact that we're talking about
the specialness of the soil, what potential did he say?
Speaker 4 (17:09):
Yeah? So, I mean, well, so this really comes down
to his you know, you know, I would say that
picado as an state that's a project is you know,
it's you know, comes it's sort of the birth child
(17:31):
of his first project, which was Dinado. And you know,
one have to speak about DiNardo to understand. And my
father comes from a passion and a tradition of Bordeaux varieties.
So he for him the great you know, great wines
(17:55):
were were made in Bordeaux and the and the and
the and so he planned in Tuscany when in Trinodo
he planted the border varieties. But the interesting story was
that he you know, he he he always had a
(18:18):
particular interest in in in in in the great Petty
Petty Though it's a great he always really liked and
I don't think it ever really matured as he wanted
in Tuscany. So he planted it in Sicily on the
end and it came out really really amazingly. And and
then and he decided to blend it with a local
(18:41):
variety of the road region called and this was really
you know, almost like a gay you know. And so
for him, you know, my father wasn't one that really
followed rules in general. So when when I would say
he was definitely a big influence in the Etna, I
(19:04):
wouldn't say he was particularly an influence of the ETNA DOC.
I mean, I don't think he cared particularly much about
the d C. He cared about the the, the, the, the, the,
the the ana as as as a place more than
(19:26):
the the, than the than the than the than the
d C. So when he never really cared that much
that the wines he made had to be within the
d o C or not. All he wanted to do
was always to do great wines. And if he thought
that the great places to do great wines were outside
the d C, then he would plant there, as he did.
(19:48):
So half of our state is not within the d
o C. And and and this is not not really
never really been an issue for us.
Speaker 2 (19:58):
It's we noticed that a few states we visited, well,
I think stood out with yours is the Petit Pert.
I mean you make literally what we would call a
super what we would call a super the one the
Vienie Frank Ketty, which we tasted. We tasted a number
of the wines which we'll share with you, but kind
of the last one we tasted, I'm starting backwards, was
(20:19):
the Vienie Frank Kenny, which is seventy percent per do
thirty fili, which is a native grape you said, around Rome,
and it was very lovely and dark and concentrated and
very special to this area. I'm not sure if it's
available in the United States to your importer, which is
t Edwards. It's a terrific wine.
Speaker 4 (20:40):
Depends where you are in the US. We have a
different importer pretty much in every region. So in in
in the in Theandwards represents us in the march of
the East Coast, primarily focused on in the New York
carry on, but in California it's another importa. So no,
(21:04):
absolutely you can find and the wine is called Frank
kifty and you can find it in the US absolutely,
And yes, I mean it's it's a wine which is
so unique and that you know, there's really it's a unicuo.
(21:29):
There's no other wines like it. As you said, it's
a blend of pettilver. Don't is an accident. The blend
can vary hugely. So the one you tried this blend
but you know some years is you know fifty to
fifty some years is ninety two pretty one eight percent,
(21:50):
and so it really depends on the year. And then
and I mean the reason we decided that. Firstly, my father,
my heart, was never a person that'd liked to give
his name or surname to the States. In fact, to
the States are it's our family name anywhere except for
(22:14):
this wine. And the reason which decided it is because
this wine is though, is so you know, different, and
so in a way it's special, and that the only
way to call it was to give it our family name.
And also because it's it's in a way a bit
a metaphor of I think my father because you know
the fact that there is pivolso it it it brings
(22:40):
back to his Bordeaux heritage and his love for Bordeaux.
The fact that there is just ans is the fact
that you know, we are a family from Rome, so
just being a Roman grade, this blend made in a
in a unique place like amount Tetna. It's sort of
in a way, you know, it's a bit of like
(23:01):
a small summary of of of of of him as
a person. And you know, it's a very very rare
wine equally uh no, less than two thousand bottles a year.
So it's it's really you know, it's a it's a
it's an exercise and it's it's something that you know,
(23:22):
if you get your hands on a bottle, I would
love to know what you think about it. Whomever is
listening to this podcast.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
Well without lots of people. And it's also a big
departure though also for paschial peshadow, because most of your
wines are single varietal and we tasted several and what
we loved is they're all very simply named based on
the contrato, so they're very contrata specific. And uh so,
(23:54):
I want to say this area of Ana is very
well known for its red some why is produced and
we did taste two whites when we sat down at
the winery, but it's very red specific. Uh let's explain
why that is. Because in to the south and the
east you have you also produce wineries produced red wines,
(24:15):
but it tends to be more white specific, white dominant.
This area is very special and a lot of it's
because it's at the north and the altitude and the
great diurnal changes in the weather. What do you think
about You're an engineer, you have engineering training and you
look at this from an interesting perspective as well. You
have a PhD. Actually, Benjamin, what are your thoughts on this?
(24:38):
Area as a such an important red wine area and
in its positioned in great wed wines of the world.
Speaker 4 (24:49):
Well, I mean I think so, I think the north
of Fatna. Yeah, this is characteristic the fact that you
know it's it's north facing, so it's going to inevitably
get more of the variation in temperature between day and night.
(25:11):
So that definitely helps the h to make these reds
especially fresh. And then you know, I think it comes
down to the to the discussion.
Speaker 9 (25:24):
We're having before around the concraducts, the fact that you
know when this there is such you know, there's this
sort of matrix of two.
Speaker 4 (25:39):
Huge variables interplaying. On the one hand, you have that
there are which has discussed, we have some soils which
come from pure plastic eruptions, so this would be a
very sandy soil, and other eruptions in media from more
recent eruptions like the sixteen country eruption of Shatawama, which
(26:04):
inevitably will have a higher level of minerality. Or if
you're the lower side of the Edna.
Speaker 10 (26:11):
As discussed, you get closer to the to the river
and the and there you start to lose the volcanic
soil and you start to get a more continental soil,
and you have this huge variety in soil, which you know,
(26:31):
it's very rare to find in other regions it's such
a small surface.
Speaker 4 (26:36):
On the other hand, the other major variable is if
the climate. And you know, it's a volcano, as we said,
a volcano in Sicily, so it's a mountain. So even
though people typically assossociate Sicily with heat and sun and sea,
(27:00):
I'm here you to sort of forget a bit all
about this because you're in a tall, tall volcano, so
the climat is almost mountainous, it gets very cold in
the winter, and in addition to that being a volcano,
the slope it's very you know, you have a very high,
(27:24):
big slope. So you go from one thousand meters which
is our highest vineyards to where today I will be
there with a jumper and in the winter you'll typically
find snow and in a fifteen minutes drive you will
be at five hundred meters, which is a huge difference
(27:48):
in altitude, and all of a sudden you'll be in
a t shirt. And so these two sort of varicles,
which is the soil and the climate, are really you know,
mixing together in vastly different ways, and and so this
(28:08):
is in my opinion, really reflects a lot on the
on on on the Nea Mascalisi, which is the local variety.
And this is why, in my opinion, it's so interesting
to try the different contradas of the Atna and the
and which are the the for me, the heart of
(28:30):
the of the region is really to say, okay, what
what does what does the climate and enter ard do
on this great variety.
Speaker 3 (28:39):
And that was one of the things, Benjamin, that we
found as we were tasting through the different contratas that
you present, was how different they actually were as you
went from a lower elevation to a higher elevation, even
though they're the same grapes. The the lower elevation was
was full, more full body, richer, rounder, and the higher
(29:01):
elevation wines from places like Ramponte were much more elegant
and austere in their presentation. Fascinating, fascinating dichotomy of flavors
and tastes and presentation that came out.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
I agree with you, David. I was taken with and
just to visualize for our listeners the wines that we tasted,
they're literally labeled by contrata. So an example, we tasted
Contratta C, which is the lowest contratta. That's how they
literally identified that carefully with the sense of place. So
(29:40):
we did Contrata Sea is the lowest vineyard in the group,
and my notes said is more limestone, soil and ash,
and it was from the nineteen love this is nineteen
eleven lava flow. And then we went up to as
David reference, contrata are the Ramponti the highest contrata one
thousand meters which is over thirty two hundred feet. And
(30:02):
I don't not sure what the lava flow was or
was that a I don't have a date with the
lava flow, but they're all dated by lava flow as well.
And then we also like the Sharonova. Sharon Nova means
lava flow, actually.
Speaker 4 (30:14):
Means sharing new, lava flow means new, that means a
lava flow, and that was this should be a sixteenth
sixteen hundred lava flow, so relatively new, relatively new, but
it's considered it's considered new for injeolological terms, of course, Yeah, sixteen.
Speaker 2 (30:36):
The largest lava flow we saw was nineteen eighty one
and it was huge.
Speaker 4 (30:41):
Yeah, so that that that is, Yeah, that is very
recognizable and you yeah, but of course you cannot grow
on such a new lava flow. I mean some do,
but I don't advise you to fry the wines.
Speaker 3 (30:56):
Promise take some time for the lava to become plantable.
Speaker 4 (31:00):
Yeah, yeah, that's exactly. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (31:03):
I think one of the there were a couple of
wineries around there that had the sixteen hundred level flow
that they were producing wine from it. It was just
it was a beautiful wine.
Speaker 4 (31:10):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, Sharon Wava has this incredible characteristics.
Speaker 11 (31:16):
I tend to find that a very a very it's
probably out of all of.
Speaker 4 (31:27):
Them, the one that I find most round in a sense,
like more more complete. It's very elegant, but it has
also the right amount of structure, you know. Some some
would say it's then more maybe considered the elegant of
the of the of the of the shot of the
(31:48):
of the contraras interesting.
Speaker 2 (31:51):
I like the wrong Pantake quite a bit when we
tasted it the other day, as we tasted it through
and we did it by contrata, that was a beautif
wines as well.
Speaker 4 (32:01):
Very contea ivan Pante has this very it's very edgy.
It's a bit rougher, maybe a bit slightly rougher around
the edges, but that is sort of expected for the altitude.
Often you can feel the time it's a bit more,
but you know, at the end of the day. The
great thing for me about this contrados is that it's
you know, it's there's not really a batter or worse one.
(32:23):
It's about what do you prefer as a drinker? And
I find that very interesting.
Speaker 3 (32:32):
One of the questions I have for you. And one
of the things we found out was that when the
DOC was created in nineteen sixty eight, they delineated what
was within within it and what was outside of it,
and some of the contratas actually have land outside the
DOC delineation, so they can't be labeled as ETNA dock wines.
(32:53):
As EDNA has evolved, Benjamin and and expanded in wine making,
do you know if there any lands to expand the
DC delineation to include those higher elevation wines.
Speaker 4 (33:06):
I am really not the right person, no, but I'm
saying just because I mean, these are you know, I say,
out of these discussions they are not based on on
Usually they're not based on rational for reasons, but based
(33:28):
on politics mostly yes, And so I mean as I
said before, when you said, you know you started by
saying that my father did a lot for the ETNA, doc,
I would say my father did a lot for the
ETNA and remove the dock from the sentence because he
never cared. Of course, you know, it's important. It's very important,
(33:52):
I think to have a dog. I think it's very
important to have rules. It's very important to to you know,
to to create a contradas, very very clear contradas that
represent a different, different kind of there wars. But you know,
(34:12):
it's as you said, it's based on the nineteen sixties,
and in the nineteen sixties, you know, EDNA was a
very different place from today. So you know, the reason
why our contradas today are are not you don't find
the full word, but you'll find the Contrada CHI, contrada
G Contradas instead of Jape machine is purely based on
(34:39):
the fact that some of the contradas are inside the
dog and some are outside, and if you're outside, you
cannot give it the full name. And so we decided
that for the time being, we would rather not give
the name to anyone rather than to some.
Speaker 2 (34:56):
Well, that's interesting. I thought it was just for pronunciation reasons.
There you go.
Speaker 4 (35:01):
No, I think it's I think it adds confusion. I
would I would rather, you know, I think it's easier
to remember, you know, like like if you're in a
in a inschol, you you you have the paras for Ayana,
you don't have the bars for And I think over
(35:22):
time people start to recognize the specific area of the
within the area, and and that that's what then starts
to create a lot of interest around around the different crews. Otherwise,
(35:42):
you know, it's always gonna you know, it's never going
to be that easy with just a letter, in my opinion,
So Benjamin, you.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
Have been leading the company since your father's passing, and
we're sorry. Your father passed away the same year my
mother did it, so I know it's very recent. So
we're really I know, that's hard. How have you stepped
in and where are you going with his vision? And
are you going to be developing anything new in the future.
Speaker 4 (36:17):
I mean, so my my my goal first and for
most was to make sure that to estates because in
this case I have to inevitably speak about the Tuscan states.
You know also that the two states possibly shot could
(36:37):
you know where would be able to move from states
which are you know, for very good reasons associated a
lot with their founder to the next phase of their life,
which are estates which you know, are from a family,
from a family, from a family, you know, from a
(37:02):
descend over generations from a family. So I like to
think of myself as being the first the first first generation,
not being the founder. You know, I don't know if
that makes any tense, and and and like you know,
my my my goal is to you know, just put
(37:23):
put these estates in a in a in a on
a path for for for the future generations to come.
I have two daughters, and they're still very young, but
you know I can already can start to think about
maybe one day day one of them or both of
them will want to work in these states. And so
(37:44):
this is really how I'm I'm looking at it. It's
really as a as a as a bridge from the
founder generation to from the founder to the new generation.
So my my first goal is really to not to
not do too much to to you know, change the
the the soul of this estate. So having said this,
(38:10):
of course, I also there are some some things that
that I brought to the picture. As you said, I'm
I am, I have I'm an engineer at heart. I
I I still practice engineering on on other activities, and
so this, you know, this inevitably brings some more maybe
(38:34):
a more precise approach to to wine making, uh to
production in general. And so I try to to to
to be very very bring more of this part to
the into the day to day operations of of of
(38:57):
of two wine two wineries, which ultimately, you know, one
needs also remember that their businesses first and foremost they're
not you know, just passion projects as sometimes they can
be seen there are first and for most businesses they
high day to day. We hire around sixty people between
the two states, and they need to be economically functioning.
(39:21):
And so this is you know, this is something where I,
you know, maybe it's not as romantic, but it's it's true,
and I try to bring some of my abilities there.
And also I have some tastes. I am maybe not
always looking at the same level of structure and complexity
(39:43):
in all the wines as my father did. I think
some wines, like the fact the wine some contrad as
absolutely need to have the right level of structure and complexity.
But other wines like the Aso Bianco, which I think
you try to based. I think that wine is is
a wonderful wine to.
Speaker 12 (40:04):
Enjoy without too much you know, not you know, you
don't need to have you don't need to necessarily be
thinking of bergen what you drink, but you can just
think of a great short on the act now with
its vibrancy.
Speaker 4 (40:21):
It's it's uh sability, it's drinkability.
Speaker 5 (40:26):
And and this.
Speaker 4 (40:28):
Is something that me, together with the wine makers, we've
been speaking a lot about and we've been thinking like, hey, guys,
let's just make a white wine. We really want to
drink with a great fast and this is I think
something that over the years, over the last couple of
years has changed. So yeah, I like that when we take.
Speaker 2 (40:50):
The two lines. We tasted the Passible, which is a
shortened A and it was really beautiful wine, very different
from the Cara count is that we've been drinking a
lot of so it's kind of a nice welcoming pressure.
We love Caratanti as well. And then we trace it
controta PC two I believe, which I don't know. I
(41:16):
don't have here what the grape is.
Speaker 4 (41:19):
On that though it's so essentially it's the idea there
is really that we have the main wineco and then
over the years we identify some small.
Speaker 13 (41:35):
Parcels which we're outperforming the quality. And for those parcels,
we said, okay, let's try to give it a bit
more maybe.
Speaker 4 (41:48):
You know, let's try to separate them. Let's try to
add a little bit of complexity, a bit of structure.
And this is done primarily by leaving fewer grapes on
the vine, easy job, and then a slight vinification process.
The benification process is slightly different, it's more and more.
(42:10):
For the pass of Bianco, we use only concrete. And
this again goes back to the idea of like, just
as you said, you use the word freshness, and we
want to create freshness with has to be the PC
has to be uh, you know, maybe a bit a
bit more complex. We put it in a large oak,
(42:34):
large oak barrels, and and and then we we do
a split, a little bit of moseration. We keep it
a year extra and the bottle, you know, all the
all the little things you can do to make the
wine a little bit more complex and a little bit
more structure.
Speaker 2 (42:54):
That's interesting how the size and the type of oak really,
particularly in a white can really change and make at
the complexity. It was a beautiful wine. And this is
from a smaller vineyard. Uh. And then in my notes
it was very terraced and we think we.
Speaker 4 (43:09):
Have it's from a couple of paces. It's really from
a few piss Yeah.
Speaker 3 (43:14):
We actually did visit it.
Speaker 2 (43:15):
Yeah, yeah, because we went. I think we visited like
four four or five different areas and from Hindle it was.
It was fascinating and I think for our listeners, I
think it really underscores the diversity. When you do drive
around this area, which we did. We rented a car
and then Ladicia, who worked works with you, took us around.
(43:36):
You really understand the elevations and also the slope, the
how the slopes are impacted and the terraces. Some are
very steep, some are broad. You can see where there's
fresh lava flows fresh air because they're still old, where
nothing is growing yet. And you can see where the
(43:56):
older lava flows where vines have been developed. This and
you think about it takes so much time for all
this to happen. It's it's pretty it's pretty remarkable. When
you think about this over time and what it was
like when your father first decided to take the leap
(44:18):
and invest in this area, and he writes about how
gloomy it was and gloomy, but he saw brightness in
the future.
Speaker 4 (44:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 14 (44:28):
Something he really liked to say was that what he
for him was so incredible was like, I mean, I
arrived here and it was like, you know, almost how
you can imagine, you know, some of the towns in
the south of.
Speaker 4 (44:44):
Italy, the sleepy towns where nothing happened, it's just you know, slowly,
slowly proceeding towards the inevitable, you know, decay. And twenty
years later, there's like young people sitting in every you know,
(45:06):
at the at the on the steps of the churches,
drinking wines, and the comparing ideas, and the mission star
restaurants opening not only fun funky wine bars in the
in all this sleepita, which were just just you know,
(45:27):
they were just it would have been unimaginable fifteen years earlier.
And so I think this is just you know, I
think this gave him really a lot of joy when
he saw it, uh, you know, bringing you know, injecting
life into a into a into a into an area.
Speaker 2 (45:50):
And in the presentation he says, Edna has enormous poetry.
There isn't mother Nature here. You're conducting your viticulture on
the stuff that comes from the term of a below
because it comes from, you know, something that was you know,
lava flows and eruptions can be something terrible, but they
can also create something quite beautiful and something that you know,
(46:12):
like they is a phoenix arising from the ashes and
these beautiful wines. And your father was a poet and
and and an artist in the way he envisioned the
potential of the area.
Speaker 14 (46:25):
Yes, absolutely, I mean I was having a conversation with
a friend yesterday and and she she's.
Speaker 4 (46:34):
An artist, and and she she gave me as a
present a.
Speaker 5 (46:40):
Painting of of of of Bacchus and the and the
andy discussing like the way she she liked to think
of Bacchus was of this being, which is you know,
uh has this wild side, this the wild side of
media of nature.
Speaker 4 (46:58):
And you know, if you even nature.
Speaker 15 (47:01):
Alone, if you live, if the like you know, as
a game with with my daughter, I we planted a
vine outside our house.
Speaker 4 (47:13):
And and I forgot about it and then like I
was walking through it like one year two years later,
and the vine was all over the place. I mean
it was, it had taken over the trees around. It's
just this the wildness of a line. If you leave
(47:34):
it alone, it would just you know, go everywhere. And
and then at the same time it's really you and
away this bacus is it's domesticates the wildness of nature
and brings in maybe the it's it's it's the complexity
(47:55):
of the human mind and and and and which ultimately
is creating art out of something so wild. And this
is why I find wine making so interesting, because at
the end of the day, it's really, in a way,
a domesticating nature to create something so great as a
bottle of wine. And this is why, in my opinion
(48:19):
and my father in the first place, and we need
to remember that wine making its first and for most
human and the viewer. And that's why you know, we
need sometimes I feel that, especially today, there's a bit
an obsession for going back to not saying, you know,
(48:40):
traditional way of making wine natural wines, but wines are
not you know, making wine is an artistic, enterview person
and foremost, and there's a human that we should not
take away the human element from wine making.
Speaker 2 (48:55):
Well, we could agree with you more. Even though technology
and science and engineering important, at the end of the day,
we like to underscore that it's a human element and
it's learning how to tame the wild vines and turn
them into something very, very beautiful. Benjamin Friend Kenny, We've
really enjoyed speaking with you today about passion, Peshadow, the wines,
(49:17):
your father. You're taking over control and one day handing
it to your daughters to carry on the legacy. Thank
you so much for joining us.
Speaker 4 (49:29):
Thank you, thank you very much, and we want.
Speaker 2 (49:31):
To thank your team who was so hospitable, particularly Letitia
Latane who drove us around and we sat down and
you know, we just called out of the blue. It
was a great experience. And you know, to our listeners,
take the time when you go to this area. This
is specifically ETNA North in Sicily. Too many go and
(49:54):
they try to check off a lot of things on
their Sicily bucket list. But it's a very big as
they say, continent versus island, and we highly suggest savoring
it piece by piece to really enjoy the feeling of
it and the expression of what Trulie is ETNA.
Speaker 4 (50:14):
Right, absolutely, I mean Cicily is absolutely a continent. So yeah,
you're not going to be able to see it all
in a week.
Speaker 2 (50:25):
Well, we look forward to returning. So we want to
thank you again Benjamin and Kenny, and you can find
the wines in the United States. We want to thank
all our listeners. Encourage you to step out of your
comfort zone, explore and take time to savor the place
and what you're eating and drinking, because we always like
(50:45):
to say at the end of every show, stay insatiably curious.
Speaker 4 (51:00):
No
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(00:21):
W FOURCY Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
Welcome to the Connected Table Live. We're your hosts, Melanie
Young and David Ransom. You're insatiably curious culinary couple. We
travel the world to bring you the stories and destinations,
the wine and the food, and the hotels and places
to visit stay that you love and want to visit
because you like us, enjoy good food, good wine, good
(01:06):
spirits and the good life. We are taking you today
to probably one of the most desirous destinations when we
talk to people when we travel. We're taking you to Sicily,
where we recently attended ETNA Days, which is a large
presentation to preview the new Vintage. We were honored to
(01:26):
be media guests. And after the Etna Day program ended,
which was presented by the Consortio Tutele DOC which was
established in nineteen sixty eight, David ad did a little
mini tour of our own and we decided to focus
on a very specific and fascinating area of Etna Doc
because it's a very large area. I mean, we're talking
(01:47):
about Mount Etna, the largest active volcano in Europe, right David, absolutely, Melanie,
and it is still active. So we chose to visit
something called Etna North North Etna and the quote Demilee,
which is one hundred meter road that goes east to
west in Etna North one thousand thousand.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
It's a road that basically is at one thousand meters,
so it's three thousand feet above sea level along the
side of Mount exactly.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
I stay corrected and joining us, joining us a well.
From one of the wineries that we visited is Benjamin
Franketti of Paso Peshado, which is also a contrada as
well as the company in Etna North, and we visited
his winery, his family's winery there, Vini Franketti, and it
was really fabulous and Benjamin is the son of Andrea Franketty,
(02:42):
who is considered one of the pioneers of ETNA DOC.
So we're going to talk about his father. We're going
to talk how Benjamin is carrying on the legacy and
the amazing wines we tasted. Benjamin frank Ketty, Welcome to
the Connected Table Live.
Speaker 4 (02:57):
Thank you, Thank you for invite me to have this
talk with you.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Well, we appreciate the hospitality we received when we visited.
So we love to start the story and interviews with
our esteem guest with family because this is about the
people who shape the industries that we love. Talk to
us about your father, who we did say is considered
a pioneer of the area. Tell us about his background
(03:27):
and growing up with him. And we understand you had
an American mother.
Speaker 4 (03:32):
So he had an American mother. My mother is actually
Sicilian from Palermo. So yeah, so my father grew up in.
Speaker 5 (03:46):
Rome from an Italian father.
Speaker 4 (03:52):
And our very American mother who came to Italy just
after the Second World War and and and met my
grandfather and they and they and she decided to stay
in Italy. So she has her origins. Are are you know,
(04:15):
very very you know, like sort of North northern east
side of the U s and the and then he
grew up in Rome and he decided he initially started
working in the wine industry as a distributor. In his thirties,
(04:37):
he moved to New York where he worked as a
distributor of Italian wines in the New York area before
deciding to return to Italy to start making wine, which
was his dream really was to make great wines. And
he started relatively late, so in his in his forties.
(05:00):
He initially started by buying an estate in Tuscany, which
at the time was actually it wasn't an estate. There
was nothing. It was just a plot of land in
the middle of nowhere in Tuscany, which he planted and
transformed it into what is to the n estate called
the Nuta Degren Autumn, which was his first project and
(05:25):
focused on Bordeaux wine varieties. Then, you know, he around
ten years later in two thousand, he was looking to
start a new project and he's almost i would say,
pretty much stumbled up among the Atna, which in the
(05:46):
early two thousand was a sort of abandoned almost abandoned
the place. You know, people had been making wine on
the Atna for for hundreds of years, and and when
he when he got there, the place was was was
(06:11):
pretty much pretty much abandoned. There where all these amazingly
cultivated hundred plus year year old divines, many of those
including the the the vineyards surrounding the the winery which
which he visited where we were not even being picked anymore,
(06:32):
and the and the in a he fell, you know,
he fell in love with with the place, with the energy,
and together with other you know, winemakers off of the
sort of at the same time, they they started what
became essentially revolution. So this is a bit of a
(06:54):
short history of how he got to the Ana.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
It's interesting when we visited, we were we found out
that not only were the vineyards abandoned, but they were
in complete and other disrepair. And there was really a
tremendous amount of restoration and reinvigoration of the vines that
had to take place before you could even start making wine.
Speaker 4 (07:16):
Yeah, I mean, this is something which it is quite
incredible to think about that, you know, these were vines
which were you know, well, first of all, on the
one hand, if you think that these vines were one
hundred are one hundred plus years old and even after
(07:37):
being you know, partially abandoned, they today are still growing,
are still you know, growing amazingly. And to for me,
this is sort of the it's a homage to the
amazing work of the of the farmers, the local farmers
that were really really great farmers, because ultimately the fact
(08:02):
that these vines today are still so healthy and even
after all they went through is a proof that this
this the people working the land, the farmers working the
land over over the multiple generations where we're really really
great farmers. First and foremost, what they were probably not
(08:28):
as good was at making what today we recognize as
being quality wine. So they really focused on making quantity
and and and that was the objective was to make
as many killers as possible and as many ecolets as
(08:51):
possible out of every plant. And the one one thing
that you know, my father always always said, like to
create too. You know, there's a perfectly imverse correlationship between
how many kilos a plant makes and the quality of
the wine that comes out of it.
Speaker 6 (09:11):
So what what he did really early on when he
arrived in this in this almost barren land was or
was that he started to speak with the farmers and
there's this interesting story I.
Speaker 7 (09:24):
Got problem from locals that he was one of the
first days he was there walking through this this these
vineyards with with a local farmer.
Speaker 4 (09:40):
He went to him and said, tell me, tell me
a vine and a grape you're particularly proud of. And
you know, he was walking there and he just went
and took the chunkiest and fastest and juiciest grape which
was hanging around and and my father went there and
(10:00):
cut it and said leave it on the ground. And
the farmer was like shocked. It was like, why would
I live on the ground, you know, my income? And
he said, because you don't make quality with quantity, and
the juiciest grapes are usually the ones which are probably
going to give you the least quality. So this was
really you know, it's a bit of a you know,
to show how something you know, relatively simple, but changing
(10:26):
the philosophy around while making and moving from you know,
doing pure agriculture to doing you know, bringing in the
the you know, bringing in the mind of the human
the mind of the brain of maybe of almost of
the artists into the into the agricultural process, and you
(10:46):
transform something which is just pure, you know, making as
many liters of great joe as possible, which was sent
to the north of Italy and the other regions of
Europe to to be to be mixed with other wines. Essentially,
that was the main purpose of the of the the
(11:08):
produce of Vitna into a very high quality programs. And
today Atna, it's since then, since purely two thousand, we've
seen this incredible revolution where where more, more and more
winemakers arrived. Interestingly, initially a lot from outside of Sicily,
(11:29):
including my father and other winemakers, and and and then
slowly even within Sicily it became, you know, a hotspot
for for for people to experiment making making great wines.
And this is probably what you you tasted. Only only
twenty years later there's this this this change in dramatic
(11:53):
change in quality.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
You know, given the centuries of old history of Italy
and Sicily, it really quite a renaissance to think that
this only really happened at the twenty first century, this
renaissance of Italian wines being made in Sicily. And as
I noted in the beginning, at the dock, which is
the specific area that we visited, was established in nineteen
(12:18):
sixty eight. Think about how long it took to evolve
to get to that revolution, as we call it. This
is an interesting area. First of all, you know, there
are challenges and we would love to discuss some of
them because you're dominated by an active volcano and the
land has been shaped by centuries of lava flow, which
(12:39):
is such an important aspect to these wines. Talk to
us about that.
Speaker 4 (12:46):
Yeah, I mean, so of course, the volcano is the
volcano is you know, it's like this big giant always
sitting behind you. Good giant, because you know it's it's
it's okay, know that the nature of its eruptions are
(13:07):
such that it's not you know, it's not risk, doesn't
pose a risk to the humans, but it's being so
active the the lava flows. Although human being can easily
walk away from the lava flows badly, a vine can't.
(13:30):
And so when you when.
Speaker 8 (13:31):
You probably visited the you you you you saw that
there is some occasional highways of recent volcanic eruptions, primarily
the nineteen eighty eruption that essentially went through the vineyards
and destroyed them.
Speaker 4 (13:49):
So this is obviously something that is always there. It
happens quite rarely, but but it can happen, but it's
also you know, I guess it's it's the two sides
of the coin. Because on the other hand, the fact
that this volcano digs from the center of the earth
(14:13):
constantly different different materials, different rocks, different substances, and takes
it out and throws it onto onto the the surface
of of the mountain. It's what a way makes makes
(14:38):
the acts so special because what to typically take millions
of years of geological evolution of the happens on the
course of hundreds or maybe max thousands of the years.
So you you find, you know, within within for example,
our state, the passively shadow state is divided. We have
(15:02):
we we we we cover five different contradas, and like
the highest contradas like Rampante and the contrad the Ola,
which are close to one thousand meters so around three
thousand feet, have a completely vastly different soil from the
(15:27):
contradas lower down at like five hundred meters or one thousand,
five hundred feet, such as contract the mansion where where
the soil is more and more and more continental, and
and this this huge different in soil variety and makes
it makes the end so interesting because it's very unusual
(15:52):
to be able to try maybe different contradas, which essentially
is the same concept of a crew, so different crews
from the same great variety which has such a vastly
different taste. And I think people really love love to
be able are very interested in seeing the difference the
(16:16):
effect that there are can have on the taste of
the wine, which is what makes wine so interesting really
to people.
Speaker 2 (16:25):
The days we had the opportunity to taste variety of
rines from different contratta and you can taste the difference.
And of course when we visited your winery, we were
taken to the different vineyards. But it's interesting is some
of them are very you know, the height is actually
exceeds what is allowed in production of at the dock wines.
(16:46):
Your father was a visionary and in addition to planting
the varieties that are native, he also planted other varieties
such a shortened a petit verdough. And what was his
thought behind that, given the fact that we're talking about
the specialness of the soil, what potential did he say?
Speaker 4 (17:09):
Yeah? So, I mean, well, so this really comes down
to his you know, you know, I would say that
picado as an state that's a project is you know,
it's you know, comes it's sort of the birth child
(17:31):
of his first project, which was Dinado. And you know,
one have to speak about DiNardo to understand. And my
father comes from a passion and a tradition of Bordeaux varieties.
So he for him the great you know, great wines
(17:55):
were were made in Bordeaux and the and the and
the and so he planned in Tuscany when in Trinodo
he planted the border varieties. But the interesting story was
that he you know, he he he always had a
(18:18):
particular interest in in in in in the great Petty
Petty Though it's a great he always really liked and
I don't think it ever really matured as he wanted
in Tuscany. So he planted it in Sicily on the
end and it came out really really amazingly. And and
then and he decided to blend it with a local
(18:41):
variety of the road region called and this was really
you know, almost like a gay you know. And so
for him, you know, my father wasn't one that really
followed rules in general. So when when I would say
he was definitely a big influence in the Etna, I
(19:04):
wouldn't say he was particularly an influence of the ETNA DOC.
I mean, I don't think he cared particularly much about
the d C. He cared about the the, the, the, the, the,
the the ana as as as a place more than
(19:26):
the the, than the than the than the than the
d C. So when he never really cared that much
that the wines he made had to be within the
d o C or not. All he wanted to do
was always to do great wines. And if he thought
that the great places to do great wines were outside
the d C, then he would plant there, as he did.
(19:48):
So half of our state is not within the d
o C. And and and this is not not really
never really been an issue for us.
Speaker 2 (19:58):
It's we noticed that a few states we visited, well,
I think stood out with yours is the Petit Pert.
I mean you make literally what we would call a
super what we would call a super the one the
Vienie Frank Ketty, which we tasted. We tasted a number
of the wines which we'll share with you, but kind
of the last one we tasted, I'm starting backwards, was
(20:19):
the Vienie Frank Kenny, which is seventy percent per do
thirty fili, which is a native grape you said, around Rome,
and it was very lovely and dark and concentrated and
very special to this area. I'm not sure if it's
available in the United States to your importer, which is
t Edwards. It's a terrific wine.
Speaker 4 (20:40):
Depends where you are in the US. We have a
different importer pretty much in every region. So in in
in the in Theandwards represents us in the march of
the East Coast, primarily focused on in the New York
carry on, but in California it's another importa. So no,
(21:04):
absolutely you can find and the wine is called Frank
kifty and you can find it in the US absolutely,
And yes, I mean it's it's a wine which is
so unique and that you know, there's really it's a unicuo.
(21:29):
There's no other wines like it. As you said, it's
a blend of pettilver. Don't is an accident. The blend
can vary hugely. So the one you tried this blend
but you know some years is you know fifty to
fifty some years is ninety two pretty one eight percent,
(21:50):
and so it really depends on the year. And then
and I mean the reason we decided that. Firstly, my father,
my heart, was never a person that'd liked to give
his name or surname to the States. In fact, to
the States are it's our family name anywhere except for
(22:14):
this wine. And the reason which decided it is because
this wine is though, is so you know, different, and
so in a way it's special, and that the only
way to call it was to give it our family name.
And also because it's it's in a way a bit
a metaphor of I think my father because you know
the fact that there is pivolso it it it brings
(22:40):
back to his Bordeaux heritage and his love for Bordeaux.
The fact that there is just ans is the fact
that you know, we are a family from Rome, so
just being a Roman grade, this blend made in a
in a unique place like amount Tetna. It's sort of
in a way, you know, it's a bit of like
(23:01):
a small summary of of of of of him as
a person. And you know, it's a very very rare
wine equally uh no, less than two thousand bottles a year.
So it's it's really you know, it's a it's a
it's an exercise and it's it's something that you know,
(23:22):
if you get your hands on a bottle, I would
love to know what you think about it. Whomever is
listening to this podcast.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
Well without lots of people. And it's also a big
departure though also for paschial peshadow, because most of your
wines are single varietal and we tasted several and what
we loved is they're all very simply named based on
the contrato, so they're very contrata specific. And uh so,
(23:54):
I want to say this area of Ana is very
well known for its red some why is produced and
we did taste two whites when we sat down at
the winery, but it's very red specific. Uh let's explain
why that is. Because in to the south and the
east you have you also produce wineries produced red wines,
(24:15):
but it tends to be more white specific, white dominant.
This area is very special and a lot of it's
because it's at the north and the altitude and the
great diurnal changes in the weather. What do you think
about You're an engineer, you have engineering training and you
look at this from an interesting perspective as well. You
have a PhD. Actually, Benjamin, what are your thoughts on this?
(24:38):
Area as a such an important red wine area and
in its positioned in great wed wines of the world.
Speaker 4 (24:49):
Well, I mean I think so, I think the north
of Fatna. Yeah, this is characteristic the fact that you
know it's it's north facing, so it's going to inevitably
get more of the variation in temperature between day and night.
(25:11):
So that definitely helps the h to make these reds
especially fresh. And then you know, I think it comes
down to the to the discussion.
Speaker 9 (25:24):
We're having before around the concraducts, the fact that you
know when this there is such you know, there's this
sort of matrix of two.
Speaker 4 (25:39):
Huge variables interplaying. On the one hand, you have that
there are which has discussed, we have some soils which
come from pure plastic eruptions, so this would be a
very sandy soil, and other eruptions in media from more
recent eruptions like the sixteen country eruption of Shatawama, which
(26:04):
inevitably will have a higher level of minerality. Or if
you're the lower side of the Edna.
Speaker 10 (26:11):
As discussed, you get closer to the to the river
and the and there you start to lose the volcanic
soil and you start to get a more continental soil,
and you have this huge variety in soil, which you know,
(26:31):
it's very rare to find in other regions it's such
a small surface.
Speaker 4 (26:36):
On the other hand, the other major variable is if
the climate. And you know, it's a volcano, as we said,
a volcano in Sicily, so it's a mountain. So even
though people typically assossociate Sicily with heat and sun and sea,
(27:00):
I'm here you to sort of forget a bit all
about this because you're in a tall, tall volcano, so
the climat is almost mountainous, it gets very cold in
the winter, and in addition to that being a volcano,
the slope it's very you know, you have a very high,
(27:24):
big slope. So you go from one thousand meters which
is our highest vineyards to where today I will be
there with a jumper and in the winter you'll typically
find snow and in a fifteen minutes drive you will
be at five hundred meters, which is a huge difference
(27:48):
in altitude, and all of a sudden you'll be in
a t shirt. And so these two sort of varicles,
which is the soil and the climate, are really you know,
mixing together in vastly different ways, and and so this
(28:08):
is in my opinion, really reflects a lot on the
on on on the Nea Mascalisi, which is the local variety.
And this is why, in my opinion, it's so interesting
to try the different contradas of the Atna and the
and which are the the for me, the heart of
(28:30):
the of the region is really to say, okay, what
what does what does the climate and enter ard do
on this great variety.
Speaker 3 (28:39):
And that was one of the things, Benjamin, that we
found as we were tasting through the different contratas that
you present, was how different they actually were as you
went from a lower elevation to a higher elevation, even
though they're the same grapes. The the lower elevation was
was full, more full body, richer, rounder, and the higher
(29:01):
elevation wines from places like Ramponte were much more elegant
and austere in their presentation. Fascinating, fascinating dichotomy of flavors
and tastes and presentation that came out.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
I agree with you, David. I was taken with and
just to visualize for our listeners the wines that we tasted,
they're literally labeled by contrata. So an example, we tasted
Contratta C, which is the lowest contratta. That's how they
literally identified that carefully with the sense of place. So
(29:40):
we did Contrata Sea is the lowest vineyard in the group,
and my notes said is more limestone, soil and ash,
and it was from the nineteen love this is nineteen
eleven lava flow. And then we went up to as
David reference, contrata are the Ramponti the highest contrata one
thousand meters which is over thirty two hundred feet. And
(30:02):
I don't not sure what the lava flow was or
was that a I don't have a date with the
lava flow, but they're all dated by lava flow as well.
And then we also like the Sharonova. Sharon Nova means
lava flow, actually.
Speaker 4 (30:14):
Means sharing new, lava flow means new, that means a
lava flow, and that was this should be a sixteenth
sixteen hundred lava flow, so relatively new, relatively new, but
it's considered it's considered new for injeolological terms, of course, Yeah, sixteen.
Speaker 2 (30:36):
The largest lava flow we saw was nineteen eighty one
and it was huge.
Speaker 4 (30:41):
Yeah, so that that that is, Yeah, that is very
recognizable and you yeah, but of course you cannot grow
on such a new lava flow. I mean some do,
but I don't advise you to fry the wines.
Speaker 3 (30:56):
Promise take some time for the lava to become plantable.
Speaker 4 (31:00):
Yeah, yeah, that's exactly. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (31:03):
I think one of the there were a couple of
wineries around there that had the sixteen hundred level flow
that they were producing wine from it. It was just
it was a beautiful wine.
Speaker 4 (31:10):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, Sharon Wava has this incredible characteristics.
Speaker 11 (31:16):
I tend to find that a very a very it's
probably out of all of.
Speaker 4 (31:27):
Them, the one that I find most round in a sense,
like more more complete. It's very elegant, but it has
also the right amount of structure, you know. Some some
would say it's then more maybe considered the elegant of
the of the of the of the shot of the
(31:48):
of the contraras interesting.
Speaker 2 (31:51):
I like the wrong Pantake quite a bit when we
tasted it the other day, as we tasted it through
and we did it by contrata, that was a beautif
wines as well.
Speaker 4 (32:01):
Very contea ivan Pante has this very it's very edgy.
It's a bit rougher, maybe a bit slightly rougher around
the edges, but that is sort of expected for the altitude.
Often you can feel the time it's a bit more,
but you know, at the end of the day. The
great thing for me about this contrados is that it's
you know, it's there's not really a batter or worse one.
(32:23):
It's about what do you prefer as a drinker? And
I find that very interesting.
Speaker 3 (32:32):
One of the questions I have for you. And one
of the things we found out was that when the
DOC was created in nineteen sixty eight, they delineated what
was within within it and what was outside of it,
and some of the contratas actually have land outside the
DOC delineation, so they can't be labeled as ETNA dock wines.
(32:53):
As EDNA has evolved, Benjamin and and expanded in wine making,
do you know if there any lands to expand the
DC delineation to include those higher elevation wines.
Speaker 4 (33:06):
I am really not the right person, no, but I'm
saying just because I mean, these are you know, I say,
out of these discussions they are not based on on
Usually they're not based on rational for reasons, but based
(33:28):
on politics mostly yes, And so I mean as I
said before, when you said, you know you started by
saying that my father did a lot for the ETNA, doc,
I would say my father did a lot for the
ETNA and remove the dock from the sentence because he
never cared. Of course, you know, it's important. It's very important,
(33:52):
I think to have a dog. I think it's very
important to have rules. It's very important to to you know,
to to create a contradas, very very clear contradas that
represent a different, different kind of there wars. But you know,
(34:12):
it's as you said, it's based on the nineteen sixties,
and in the nineteen sixties, you know, EDNA was a
very different place from today. So you know, the reason
why our contradas today are are not you don't find
the full word, but you'll find the Contrada CHI, contrada
G Contradas instead of Jape machine is purely based on
(34:39):
the fact that some of the contradas are inside the
dog and some are outside, and if you're outside, you
cannot give it the full name. And so we decided
that for the time being, we would rather not give
the name to anyone rather than to some.
Speaker 2 (34:56):
Well, that's interesting. I thought it was just for pronunciation reasons.
There you go.
Speaker 4 (35:01):
No, I think it's I think it adds confusion. I
would I would rather, you know, I think it's easier
to remember, you know, like like if you're in a
in a inschol, you you you have the paras for Ayana,
you don't have the bars for And I think over
(35:22):
time people start to recognize the specific area of the
within the area, and and that that's what then starts
to create a lot of interest around around the different crews. Otherwise,
(35:42):
you know, it's always gonna you know, it's never going
to be that easy with just a letter, in my opinion,
So Benjamin, you.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
Have been leading the company since your father's passing, and
we're sorry. Your father passed away the same year my
mother did it, so I know it's very recent. So
we're really I know, that's hard. How have you stepped
in and where are you going with his vision? And
are you going to be developing anything new in the future.
Speaker 4 (36:17):
I mean, so my my my goal first and for
most was to make sure that to estates because in
this case I have to inevitably speak about the Tuscan states.
You know also that the two states possibly shot could
(36:37):
you know where would be able to move from states
which are you know, for very good reasons associated a
lot with their founder to the next phase of their life,
which are estates which you know, are from a family,
from a family, from a family, you know, from a
(37:02):
descend over generations from a family. So I like to
think of myself as being the first the first first generation,
not being the founder. You know, I don't know if
that makes any tense, and and and like you know,
my my my goal is to you know, just put
(37:23):
put these estates in a in a in a on
a path for for for the future generations to come.
I have two daughters, and they're still very young, but
you know I can already can start to think about
maybe one day day one of them or both of
them will want to work in these states. And so
(37:44):
this is really how I'm I'm looking at it. It's
really as a as a as a bridge from the
founder generation to from the founder to the new generation.
So my my first goal is really to not to
not do too much to to you know, change the
the the soul of this estate. So having said this,
(38:10):
of course, I also there are some some things that
that I brought to the picture. As you said, I'm
I am, I have I'm an engineer at heart. I
I I still practice engineering on on other activities, and
so this, you know, this inevitably brings some more maybe
(38:34):
a more precise approach to to wine making, uh to
production in general. And so I try to to to
to be very very bring more of this part to
the into the day to day operations of of of
(38:57):
of two wine two wineries, which ultimately, you know, one
needs also remember that their businesses first and foremost they're
not you know, just passion projects as sometimes they can
be seen there are first and for most businesses they
high day to day. We hire around sixty people between
the two states, and they need to be economically functioning.
(39:21):
And so this is you know, this is something where I,
you know, maybe it's not as romantic, but it's it's true,
and I try to bring some of my abilities there.
And also I have some tastes. I am maybe not
always looking at the same level of structure and complexity
(39:43):
in all the wines as my father did. I think
some wines, like the fact the wine some contrad as
absolutely need to have the right level of structure and complexity.
But other wines like the Aso Bianco, which I think
you try to based. I think that wine is is
a wonderful wine to.
Speaker 12 (40:04):
Enjoy without too much you know, not you know, you
don't need to have you don't need to necessarily be
thinking of bergen what you drink, but you can just
think of a great short on the act now with
its vibrancy.
Speaker 4 (40:21):
It's it's uh sability, it's drinkability.
Speaker 5 (40:26):
And and this.
Speaker 4 (40:28):
Is something that me, together with the wine makers, we've
been speaking a lot about and we've been thinking like, hey, guys,
let's just make a white wine. We really want to
drink with a great fast and this is I think
something that over the years, over the last couple of
years has changed. So yeah, I like that when we take.
Speaker 2 (40:50):
The two lines. We tasted the Passible, which is a
shortened A and it was really beautiful wine, very different
from the Cara count is that we've been drinking a
lot of so it's kind of a nice welcoming pressure.
We love Caratanti as well. And then we trace it
controta PC two I believe, which I don't know. I
(41:16):
don't have here what the grape is.
Speaker 4 (41:19):
On that though it's so essentially it's the idea there
is really that we have the main wineco and then
over the years we identify some small.
Speaker 13 (41:35):
Parcels which we're outperforming the quality. And for those parcels,
we said, okay, let's try to give it a bit
more maybe.
Speaker 4 (41:48):
You know, let's try to separate them. Let's try to
add a little bit of complexity, a bit of structure.
And this is done primarily by leaving fewer grapes on
the vine, easy job, and then a slight vinification process.
The benification process is slightly different, it's more and more.
(42:10):
For the pass of Bianco, we use only concrete. And
this again goes back to the idea of like, just
as you said, you use the word freshness, and we
want to create freshness with has to be the PC
has to be uh, you know, maybe a bit a
bit more complex. We put it in a large oak,
(42:34):
large oak barrels, and and and then we we do
a split, a little bit of moseration. We keep it
a year extra and the bottle, you know, all the
all the little things you can do to make the
wine a little bit more complex and a little bit
more structure.
Speaker 2 (42:54):
That's interesting how the size and the type of oak really,
particularly in a white can really change and make at
the complexity. It was a beautiful wine. And this is
from a smaller vineyard. Uh. And then in my notes
it was very terraced and we think we.
Speaker 4 (43:09):
Have it's from a couple of paces. It's really from
a few piss Yeah.
Speaker 3 (43:14):
We actually did visit it.
Speaker 2 (43:15):
Yeah, yeah, because we went. I think we visited like
four four or five different areas and from Hindle it was.
It was fascinating and I think for our listeners, I
think it really underscores the diversity. When you do drive
around this area, which we did. We rented a car
and then Ladicia, who worked works with you, took us around.
(43:36):
You really understand the elevations and also the slope, the
how the slopes are impacted and the terraces. Some are
very steep, some are broad. You can see where there's
fresh lava flows fresh air because they're still old, where
nothing is growing yet. And you can see where the
(43:56):
older lava flows where vines have been developed. This and
you think about it takes so much time for all
this to happen. It's it's pretty it's pretty remarkable. When
you think about this over time and what it was
like when your father first decided to take the leap
(44:18):
and invest in this area, and he writes about how
gloomy it was and gloomy, but he saw brightness in
the future.
Speaker 4 (44:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 14 (44:28):
Something he really liked to say was that what he
for him was so incredible was like, I mean, I
arrived here and it was like, you know, almost how
you can imagine, you know, some of the towns in
the south of.
Speaker 4 (44:44):
Italy, the sleepy towns where nothing happened, it's just you know, slowly,
slowly proceeding towards the inevitable, you know, decay. And twenty
years later, there's like young people sitting in every you know,
(45:06):
at the at the on the steps of the churches,
drinking wines, and the comparing ideas, and the mission star
restaurants opening not only fun funky wine bars in the
in all this sleepita, which were just just you know,
(45:27):
they were just it would have been unimaginable fifteen years earlier.
And so I think this is just you know, I
think this gave him really a lot of joy when
he saw it, uh, you know, bringing you know, injecting
life into a into a into a into an area.
Speaker 2 (45:50):
And in the presentation he says, Edna has enormous poetry.
There isn't mother Nature here. You're conducting your viticulture on
the stuff that comes from the term of a below
because it comes from, you know, something that was you know,
lava flows and eruptions can be something terrible, but they
can also create something quite beautiful and something that you know,
(46:12):
like they is a phoenix arising from the ashes and
these beautiful wines. And your father was a poet and
and and an artist in the way he envisioned the
potential of the area.
Speaker 14 (46:25):
Yes, absolutely, I mean I was having a conversation with
a friend yesterday and and she she's.
Speaker 4 (46:34):
An artist, and and she she gave me as a
present a.
Speaker 5 (46:40):
Painting of of of of Bacchus and the and the
andy discussing like the way she she liked to think
of Bacchus was of this being, which is you know,
uh has this wild side, this the wild side of
media of nature.
Speaker 4 (46:58):
And you know, if you even nature.
Speaker 15 (47:01):
Alone, if you live, if the like you know, as
a game with with my daughter, I we planted a
vine outside our house.
Speaker 4 (47:13):
And and I forgot about it and then like I
was walking through it like one year two years later,
and the vine was all over the place. I mean
it was, it had taken over the trees around. It's
just this the wildness of a line. If you leave
(47:34):
it alone, it would just you know, go everywhere. And
and then at the same time it's really you and
away this bacus is it's domesticates the wildness of nature
and brings in maybe the it's it's it's the complexity
(47:55):
of the human mind and and and and which ultimately
is creating art out of something so wild. And this
is why I find wine making so interesting, because at
the end of the day, it's really, in a way,
a domesticating nature to create something so great as a
bottle of wine. And this is why, in my opinion
(48:19):
and my father in the first place, and we need
to remember that wine making its first and for most
human and the viewer. And that's why you know, we
need sometimes I feel that, especially today, there's a bit
an obsession for going back to not saying, you know,
(48:40):
traditional way of making wine natural wines, but wines are
not you know, making wine is an artistic, enterview person
and foremost, and there's a human that we should not
take away the human element from wine making.
Speaker 2 (48:55):
Well, we could agree with you more. Even though technology
and science and engineering important, at the end of the day,
we like to underscore that it's a human element and
it's learning how to tame the wild vines and turn
them into something very, very beautiful. Benjamin Friend Kenny, We've
really enjoyed speaking with you today about passion, Peshadow, the wines,
(49:17):
your father. You're taking over control and one day handing
it to your daughters to carry on the legacy. Thank
you so much for joining us.
Speaker 4 (49:29):
Thank you, thank you very much, and we want.
Speaker 2 (49:31):
To thank your team who was so hospitable, particularly Letitia
Latane who drove us around and we sat down and
you know, we just called out of the blue. It
was a great experience. And you know, to our listeners,
take the time when you go to this area. This
is specifically ETNA North in Sicily. Too many go and
(49:54):
they try to check off a lot of things on
their Sicily bucket list. But it's a very big as
they say, continent versus island, and we highly suggest savoring
it piece by piece to really enjoy the feeling of
it and the expression of what Trulie is ETNA.
Speaker 4 (50:14):
Right, absolutely, I mean Cicily is absolutely a continent. So yeah,
you're not going to be able to see it all
in a week.
Speaker 2 (50:25):
Well, we look forward to returning. So we want to
thank you again Benjamin and Kenny, and you can find
the wines in the United States. We want to thank
all our listeners. Encourage you to step out of your
comfort zone, explore and take time to savor the place
and what you're eating and drinking, because we always like
(50:45):
to say at the end of every show, stay insatiably curious.
Speaker 4 (51:00):
No
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