November 6, 2024 • 53 mins
Stewards of the land in Sicily since the 1600s (17 generations), the Planeta family's influence on the evolution of Sicilian wines is significant. Alessio Planeta, CEO, discusses his family’s history in Sicily, their role in focusing Sicily from bulk wine production to commercial bottling and the rediscovery and renaissance of Sicilian wines in the 21st century. Planeta has wine estates in five regions of Sicily: Menfi, Vittoria, Noto, Etna and Capo Milazzo and produces award-winning olive oils
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The Connected Table is broadcast live Wednesdays at 2PM ET and Music on W4CY Radio (www.w4cy.com) part of Talk 4 Radio (www.talk4radio.com) on the Talk 4 Media Network (www.talk4media.com).
The Connected Table Podcast is also available on Talk 4 Media (www.talk4media.com), Talk 4 Podcasting (www.talk4podcasting.com), iHeartRadio, Amazon Music, Pandora, Spotify, Audible, and over 100 other podcast outlets.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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(00:21):
W FOURCY Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
Welcome to the Connected Table Live. We're your hosts, Melanie
Young and David Ransom. You're insatiably curious culinary couple. We
love to travel the world to bring you the dynamic
people who are front and center and behind the scenes
in wine, food, spirits and hospitality. We love sharing their
stories with you. We hope that you will visit them,
try their wines and foods, visit the restaurants, and support
(01:03):
what we call our community, right David.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
Absolutely, Melanie, and we've been doing this for quite some time.
This is our eleventh year. Yeah, we've really interviewed a
lot of people over the years, and one of the
things that we love to do most is interview winemakers
from around the world, and we're doing that today with
one of our esteem guests, and.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
We're taking you somewhere that we love to visit. We
can't get there enough, and that's Sicily. If you've been
following us, you know that we spend some time in
Etna Dock in September twenty twenty four, and we spend
extra time after attending ETNA days the Consortio to d
Lavini to Etna doc hosted, we spend extra time to
(01:44):
explore on our own, which we are wont to do
because we love the regions we visit. Our guest today
is someone we have been wanting to have on for
so long. He's hard to nail down because he is
a busy man and boy has twenty twenty four been
his year and his winderies yer and his family. Here
we're talking about Alessio Planeta. He is Ceo at Planeta,
(02:06):
which is one of the great names of Sicilian wines.
They have multiple estates and a very long history in Sicily,
which we're going to dive into. He joins us today,
So welcome, Alessio.
Speaker 4 (02:19):
Thank you very much. I'm very happy to be here
with you today, very happy.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
Well, we're happy too, because you're hard to nail down,
as we said, and we of course visited your estate
in Edna, which precipitated this opportunity to talk to you.
We learned that your family has a very long history,
as we said in Sicily, but it is originally from Spain.
Tell us about this.
Speaker 4 (02:45):
Well, yes, we you know, Sicily being in the center
of miditer random area ad in his history more than
twenty defense civility dation, including Spanish civilization, that was in
Sicily from fifteen sixteen to seventy thirteen, if I remember so,
for a long time, not the more easy time for Sicily,
(03:07):
because it was a period full of for example, a
lot of eruptions on the Ata and arquakes in Sicily.
But this is not for the Spanish, but because the
natural is like this. And so my family arrives out
during that time in the southwest part of Sicily, between
Memphi and Sambucca. Since that time we were landowners in
(03:31):
this area. We were barons of that area, but the
kind of barons that like to do agriculture in a
very serious way with a lot of effort. Since many generations.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
You know, when you talk, I think about where we
live now in New Orleans. It's very similar with the
multicultural people coming over for various reasons, there's quite a connection.
How the you know, we all know that winery systems start.
There's a history of wine making in Sicily, but there's
not a history, a more recent history of bottling wines
(04:10):
for commercial sale. What was the process with your family
to go from making growing grapes, making wine and becoming
a commercial venture.
Speaker 4 (04:22):
You know, we had in Italy and wine writers, maybe
the first wine writers that was called Luijivoneli. And once
it said that Sicilian used to make silver wines with
golden grapes. It was a very kind way to say
that Sicia didn't do the best for doing great wine.
(04:44):
The story was that Sicily was completely isolated from the
rest of the world, was a very difficult country, far
from the market, with a very depressed economy, with a
great past, with a glorious past, but we are not
easy present. Sociciia used to make a lot of grapes,
a lot of wine also, but this wine was sold,
(05:06):
especially as a bulk wine. We used to sell wine.
Just to give you an example, to the vermut business,
to the distillation of wine, to the to the some
French markets of very very cheap wine, but not because
the wine was not good, because this was the only
way to approach the market. Even if Sicily had a
(05:30):
history in wine that go back to the at least
eighth ninth Central before Christ we have a Phoenician bringing
grapes on the west, Greeks and in the east, and
many many other signs of agriculture. We had one of
the most available biodiversity in our in our in our
(05:53):
land with twenty native grapes, fifty ancient grapes and all
the international and rest of Italy grapes. We have one
different that go from Ethna, as you can see in
the middle of the of the volcano in a spectacula
way to Panteleia to the south of Sicily with three
(06:16):
months of arrests. So there was a big, big it
was a big potential, but Sicilian stop of the first step,
you know, the first step was making bulk wine. Then
during the eighties, if you go back in history, there
was some some glorious time for Cicily. That was after
(06:37):
the Philosa, when Filoxa arrives in all Europe didn't arrive
in Cicily, and Sicily arrived twenty five years later, and
there was a window of time wars Citi and where
the only producers so literally covered city of grapes. Then
of course Philoxa arrives, but arrives also with some Sicilian
solution to this using the most important paragraphs in the
(07:02):
world were done in Sicily. And then back to the
to the recent time where in the revolution of wines
starting the eighties in Sicily, my family was there because
my uncle Diego was one of the pioneers of the
revolution of Sicilian wine.
Speaker 2 (07:21):
Talk to us about that, and it really there's a revolution,
and then there's what we call the renaissance, which is
really the two thousands, which we like to say the
revolution and the Renaissance. So Diego is a pioneer, how
do you define that and what did he do to
revolutionized Sicilian wines?
Speaker 4 (07:41):
Well, Diego, my uncle Diego was a special Sicilian because
first of all, it was a Sicilian. You know, living
in an island is a state of mind that you
usually don't travel a lot, except a few Sicilians like Diego.
There was really a great traveler. First only he had
a British wife. Then he used to speak French, Spanish
(08:08):
English exactly like is the perfect way traveling around the
world and understanding very early that was big changing in
the wine, in the wine in the one industry. He understood,
for example, the potential of planting some not sicilent reps
in Sicily because you know, today we all talk about
(08:30):
and we all beloved Sicilian grace. But in the eighties
was too early to talk about Cary Kant and Ela
masks in the market. Was much easier to talk about
shardon and to talk about Murlo, to talk about the
style of wine. And my uncle Diego first of all,
my grandfather Vito Planeta, in the fifties found a cooperative
(08:52):
in Mephicle with other people, of course, called set Solid.
Diego became immediately president of this cooperative, and this cooperative
from eight people became a comparative of two thousand members,
six thousand actors of vineyards, and really a miracle from
an area. Manfield was an area very difficult with a
terrible earthquake in sixty eight, but from the really from
(09:14):
the ash of the artquake, they built a miracle. Some
spectacular comparative After this, Diego in the middle of eighties
was nominated president of Research Institute Sicilian. It was the
kind of easitute that before him, and I'm sorry maybe
also after Im didn't work a lot, but Diego that
(09:38):
was like a kind of person that worked twenty hours
a day and loving is with energy and enthusiasma. He
transformed this institute in a really the engine of the
develop of Sicily, bringing in Sicily people like Jaco Montakis,
like Attillio Senza talking like the most important way Mechani
(10:00):
at the time, the more expecting viticulturists in the time,
and another person in marketing, color Jump, all of Abridge
that was the founder of the University of Milano. So
they were really the best, the best player in Italy
in Sicily for Sicilians. And we create a group of
(10:23):
people my age or older to me a little bit
younger that followed this project and make Sicily restart, as
you said, in in a way that was a step
by step. At the end, the potential was there, there
was only it was time to have more people in
Sicily to show what we do. Working better in the
(10:46):
ven years, not in the venyors. Because it's a great viticulturist.
We do viticulture like part of our life, but to
work better in the winery and the winery and also
in this time there was some consulta arriving here in
Sicily became master of my direction. And this was a
very beautiful moment of Sicy.
Speaker 3 (11:09):
You know, I've seen that, We've seen that over the
years happen all over Italy as well, Melanie. The transfer
from growing grapes and selling them off to creating wines
of your own, and then that quality revolution comes into
I think it's fascinating, and Sicily is really one of
the best examples of that because it really was a
bulk wine producer that just shipped stuff off to the
(11:31):
rest of Europe so that they could utilize those grapes
in however they felt they should. And then that time,
when all of a sudden the Sicilian said, wait a minute,
we have something here and this is important for us
to be able to make a name for ourselves with
our own wines.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
You know, as you talk, I think about Diego really
helped a lot of farmers become business people. And you
could be a good farmer, but you aren't necessarily a
good business person. And we know that is indicative and
many areas, and particularly with wine. You have a degree
(12:07):
in agricultural sciences and also in business. You worked, you know,
you're CEO of the company and you work with your family.
I think before we started talking and recording, I think
you mentioned like six to eight family members. First question
is how are you leading the company as we get
(12:27):
into one of the what we think are the golden
times of Sicilian wines. Really one of the glory times
of Sicilian wines starting in the two thousands became the Renaissance,
but also as a challenging time for wine at large
in the world.
Speaker 4 (12:44):
Yeah, you know, family company doesn't ever for me a rule,
but what we do is, for example, we have the
best new ideas when we are all together on the table,
eating and drinking. This is the best way to manage
(13:04):
a business family and not doing a board meeting, but
doing to be in meeting age twenty four because you know,
you go back home. I live in the middle of
the country or facing the sea in Memphi with my
brother close to me and my cousin. So we do
(13:26):
a meeting, we think about a new idea, we debrief,
what we do during the day. And this is a
way to manage a family company Sicilian. As you know,
I have a great sense of family. We are a
big family because my father they were seven brothers and sisters,
(13:46):
so they were the old style family. And you know,
we like to work together in this way. And we
have different roles in in the winery. And for example,
my uncle, my cousin Francesca, she's in charge of hospitality.
That became a very important business for for for Planeta
and also for wine because I think to promote wine
(14:10):
with tourism is very important. And she followed this and
it is beautiful because she can dedicate all the energy,
all the professionality to this. And you know my brother
is on sales and I am the lucky one because
I'm the waymaker. That is the more funny part of
the business. Also a bit of administration that is not
(14:31):
the best, but we have we find our our our space,
we find our our and it works. To be honest,
we had a master like Diego that was a very
open mind person and that helps us a lot. That
Diego was my uncle. So and we have a kind
(14:54):
of family where we are different skills. No genie, but
our worker. This is the way.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
Well, it's a divide and conquer approach to running a business,
as I like to say. So you managed production of
more than two point four million bottles a year. That's
a lot. And you have estates in wineries in Memphi, Victoria,
Noto Eetna and Capo Malazzo, which is really interesting. We've
(15:25):
only visited Etna, which is where we were able to
taste a number of the wines. Let's kind of take
our listeners through the evolution of how these different estates
came to be and what some of its signatures wines
or grapes are because they're so different and as you noted,
it's not just native varieties we're talking about. There are
(15:47):
international varieties, which is unique to Sicily.
Speaker 4 (15:51):
Yeah, our journey was a journal in the start, of
course from home. So we was born in Memphia and Sambuca,
southwest of Sicily. Beautiful area where today landscape is like
maybe it was two thousand years ago. You have withat vineyards, olives,
forest and people working in the vineyards. There is in
(16:13):
the country. So it's a beautiful place, a place in
the middle between the east and the west. And this
is important because the west part of Sicily was an
area is an area of the white grapes like catarato,
like grillow, like the bibo, like Marsala area. The east
part of Sicily was the area of the red grapes
(16:34):
like frapato, like Neldabola, and of course Ethna with the
Relevanca in Caricanta. And Memphil was a place of frontier
something in the middle, was in the middle between the
Greek area, was in the middle between the Greek area
and the Phoenician area. And this is why Memphil was
an area where in the eighties there was a lot
(16:55):
of spillimentation people like us or like don't we got
our neighbors in Contestintelena, we experiment a lot in It
is also because first of all we see that there
were not, if I can say, an interest in in
local grapes in eighties. And second because Memphi was not
(17:15):
the house home home of any variety, but was the
house of old varieties. So we're not specific the specialists
of Newdale because never for me in the southeast is
the best. We were not specialists of cataratos di bibo
that are on the west. And so this will give
(17:36):
us a little bit like in Tuscany, maybe in Bulgary
or this place that develop a lot using of other
grapes because the way no specialists of San jove as,
and they opened the door to these grapes and they
works well. And so in Memphi we play with both
cic and international grapes thanks to these experience of the
(17:56):
eighties and then lotso to the to the place, but
the you from Memphi. Of course, our journeys started from
where we was born. But when we started making wine,
was unthinkable to make wine outside over your place where
you are based since century. So will you you do
agriculture in Memphi? You make one in Memphi. But after this,
(18:17):
in the ninety seven, a lot of times ago we
start to understand to fill the future, to to to
to realize that there will be one day that now
is the time where people will be in love with
the variety, with not only variety. But I won't say
there were there were done by Victoria with the Chera
(18:39):
soolo means fata or not, with Moscato and Dabla, and
of course Ethna with all the story of the Etna.
And so in ninety seven we went to Vittoria. As
always thanks to our experience of agriculture, agriculturist, because we
(18:59):
don't new on Libinias. We are. We also do olive oil,
we do citrus with calco. We are really really we
know Cicily quite well. I do fifty thousand kilometers every
year driving in Sicily, so I can say it turned
around Cicily like like like like a stupid And so
(19:20):
we went to Victoria, always starting from scratch, so looking
for the best place, best of war and planting the
vineyards with it, a lily bit, making the wine, having
people there, a different organization, because I don't want to
make planet around Sicily. I want to make in any
place with different people, different style, different approach to really
(19:43):
lack the war talk. Not let my hands on my
maker talk. This was what I learned from my master.
That was Carlo Corino, was a wain maker of the past,
that was a specialist. Really let the.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
Grapes talk, you know. We I I'm personally a huge
fan of the Cheriswola, dibatoria and the frapato. They are
so distinct to Sicily and such an incredible I wish
more people taste it and drink those wines here. And
I think they're really great wines for where we are today,
(20:17):
where we're sometimes wanting a wine that's fresher and more lighter,
and we live in a very hot area like Sicily,
and we welcome those kinds of wines.
Speaker 4 (20:27):
Totally agree with you. Fao as a variety and as
a wine is an old wine, but it's a more
contemporary wine maybe we have at the moment because light
but intense, distinctive, and we for example, like to show
this wine with is the best wine for having. Also
(20:52):
with food like pizza for example, not a simple pizza,
but a great pizza with the great is a top
food experience. And but also of course with cheese or
whatever we do with fish that's a traditional there. I
mean with fish with two now is one fish or whatever?
(21:12):
It is a great red wine that we are very
happy to be there.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
Well, we we think this is the future. And just
to know for our listeners. What's also interesting is that
the Cherisrolla Divittoria is the only do OCG wine in Sicily. Important.
Speaker 4 (21:28):
Yes, now is the OCG from the they finished the system.
I don't know, maybe not this Vinta. The next Vinta would.
Speaker 3 (21:37):
Be the next five.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
Yeah, well, let's move on to let's move on to
where we had the pleasure.
Speaker 3 (21:44):
I just wanted to do a little footnote on the
Fado Alessio. When I first met you, which was many
many years ago in New York at a luncheon that
you hosted, the Pato just blew me away so much.
It was the first planet of wine that I ever
wrote about.
Speaker 4 (21:56):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And also Vittoria, it's part of our
family due first because my grandmother and so the mother
of my father used to have a beautiful property there
with the house on the sea is quality. And then
also because so we had in the house in the
family drinking cheraswollow as every day whine. And then when
(22:20):
I finished my study, I do some experience, first in
Burgundy and then in Victoria. I worked for two with
two harvested with the Gusto Kipinti of Cossops, so when
the coast was a really tiny wanity and we had
a lot of fun, and just was a person that
influenced me a lot, because it's really uh, it's a
(22:44):
volcanic chera swollow producers. If I can say, great, that's
a really good matters. I was in love in the
beginning about the chow style.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
You've had some very good members between Diego and Carlo
Karni and and and it's it's terrific to hear that.
Now we visited Etna, as we said, and we let's
talk about location, location, location, because this is the northern
slopes of Mount Etna, so we should underscore how this
is areas defined by its zones and the styles of wines.
(23:19):
But also the fact that you make some Terras Siciliana
wines because you're the vinedords are so high, you're outside
the borders.
Speaker 3 (23:27):
But also I'm curious as to why you felt you
wanted to invest in Etna, because it's it's a very
unique place as opposed to a lot of the other
regions that make wine in Sicily. And it's not it's
not a type of wine making from which you came,
so it was something new for you as well. So
tell us about that journey.
Speaker 4 (23:47):
You know, to be honest, I learned that any when
you move from your place, you have to start from
from zero. So also for example, in Vittoria, Vittoria is
comparing to Memphi, where you have these calcareous soils and
toil with this red sandy soils, low low quantity of
rain is a really extreme viticulture and you have to
(24:10):
rethink how you work there. And then in the one
day it's the same in Noto that is a white
calcareous soils. The soils are like really really a white
powder like calco, you know, and full of shells of
the sea. And another new place, Edna, of course, was
(24:33):
more and more far from my from my roots, because
also it is a viticulture of mountains in a fertile soil,
in an energetic place where the vineyards seems seems to
run faster. Is when you go from Notto of Vitoria
to like ying young so low energy, i energy, white
(24:57):
and black. You have to push the vignions down there,
you have to stop the vinions. But at the end,
at the end is a place where really naturally is magic.
And as a viticulturist, I can say sometimes it's much
more difficult to do viticulture in the south than Inna.
(25:17):
Edna is magic at now is uh. It is a
place where you have energy, you have fertility, you have rain,
you have two varieties super adapted to that that condition.
So the first years was only for me to understand
like like always when you start. So sometimes I try
(25:39):
to harvest too early because I was stressed about the rain.
Then understood the real is like you know, for example,
when when we eas Sicili and we have a little
bit of rain, people start to you know, to be worried.
And you see a person from England under the rain.
They don't they see that, they don't steal the rain
(25:59):
over on the head. This is like nell rain is
not a problem. So at the beginning you do these
kind of mistakes that you do when you try to
compare a wine area to another whine. You have to
compare because every area is different, different weather, soilce conditioned
style of wine. And I was lucky to find Patricia
(26:22):
because Patterricia, that is you know, we in our organization,
I am like a sheef winemaker. But every winery is
own wine maker. And I say I'm a chief wy maker,
but I'm not. They do what they want. I only
try to, you know, to sometimes to provocate them, to
provocate some changing or of course two exchange experience and
(26:48):
Patricia have done a great job. She is Hungarian, so
maybe she was born with four mint and and and
tokay and and and this kind of variety. So of
course working in Ethna was with Karri Kanta was a
bit easier than me that I have experience in the
in nero develop and we find our style, especially on
(27:12):
the white time, very very happy. On the red we
are still in a for me in a moment where
you understand and you every year you understand more.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
Patricia Todd is who you're referring to, your executive wine maker,
who we had dinner with in Randazzo and enjoyed. And
yes she is Hungarian. She is, like you, moves around
a lot. And how would you describe your working relationship
because it is tense, particularly around harvest where we were.
(27:44):
We were there, so she was graciously gave us some time.
Speaker 4 (27:48):
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, first of all, every
every every wine and we have his own style. But
I like to to We have some viticulturists in Planeta
and the way maker, and I like to stay in
the middle between them because viticultures want to harvest too
(28:09):
early because they don't want to have the responsibility. They
want to clean the vineyards very early. Why maker, They
never want to to harvest because they are always waiting
something better. Sometimes not, so I try to stay in
the middle between this this system, and I like very
much that as a wine maker, there is a moment
(28:31):
where you have to stay in the to check the vineyards.
Then you have a moment where you have to stop
to stay the vineyards because sometimes you have too much
influence in the in the in the do you want
to do? You have to stay in the winery. And
this is what we do with Paisia, to stay in
the winery at the certain moments of the harvest following
really try to part par sialized, so to you know,
(28:54):
to vinify of course, not any contract, but any terras
in a different way. And of course she's with us
since in nothing since ten harvest something like this or
ten or eleven, so twenty eleven start to be in
because our our our job is a job where five
(29:14):
years is nothing, because we have to also do mistakes,
different weather, the vineyards became older. So ten years is
the time that you start to have an experience that
in a data base in your in your mind that
is good. So this is why we were working this way.
She likes to be of course, we have the philosophy
(29:39):
of of course let the vineyards talk so zero and
in the minutes we work to in the in the
one d we we are in organic plants, in organic,
proudly in organic. We are the I think the biggest
organic in Sicily. We work hard for Arabic and is
now we are organized in three years uh and we
(30:00):
are very happy, you know. And in the winery we
start to have zero zero ends in the wine to
work hardly, especially in the facilities, so a lot of
and you know, sorting tables, double sorting table, right press,
right tanks, right materials, adapting this to the to each wine.
(30:24):
This is where we try to do quality and this
and for this Particha is perfect.
Speaker 2 (30:32):
It's a huge commitment to go organic. And the so
stained program in Sicily is a very big one to
underscore the importance sustainability a time where it's more important
than ever in the wake of climate change and pollution.
So we wouldn't want to mention that because it's very
important to Sicily right now.
Speaker 4 (30:54):
Yeah. Absolutely, going back to a little bit for a
second to why making. I started went making with a
person called Carlo Corino. Carlokorea was a man born in
the forties, you know, in Italy. This generation of people
born in the forties were really the founder of Italian y.
(31:14):
I'm talking about people like Sharito and you know guy. Yeah,
this is the generation Firscobaldi, my uncle Diego. They are
born around end of the thirties, beginning of forties. Corino
was at that time it was one school, the School
of Alba, and Corino was the son of the shift
(31:34):
of the school, so it was the first student because
they have to study every day, because they're an this
kind of serious people, these people in Pymonte. He was
the best student of the school. It was in the
same school of Andlo Gaya and Charretto cousin. So this
was and he had a very special career because it
(31:55):
worked for one year in Piedmont. Immediately he moved. Corino
moved first in Ethiopia where Sicily and Italian used to
make wine in Ethiopia, and then from the seventies to
end of nineties to eighty nine he went to Australia
when Australia was the lab of the Australia and California
for the lab of wine and Diego that was a
(32:20):
visionary I don't know how in all the story about
this man in Australia and it literally take a flight
go to Australia and we used to say make Colino
an offer he can refuse. And it moved back to
Sicily because it was started to stay there and a
new project. And Kolina was perfect because it was the
(32:40):
open mind of a person that since twenty years in Australia,
but the great respect of truar that Peent people have,
and this was perfect for us. We tried to do
and then when Colina, unfortunately two seven died and for
five years ago alone, then I feel that to have
(33:00):
something to like a sparring partner. And from twenty eleven
I work with the young younger than me French Ye
Mecker calls for round Dumont. That is we see each
other five six times a year, me and all the
team and say, you know the kind of person that
work all around the world, give you some because sometimes
(33:21):
when you taste your wine alone, you need someone that
we say an Italian paniers or break the eggs in
the make everythink about everything. And so this is our
team is done in this way, in a way that
we try to we never every year we do want
to do the best, a little bit better next year,
(33:42):
doing experimentation, doing some you know, more and more. This
is what we try to do.
Speaker 2 (33:49):
That's interesting. Your mentors are so important, so our advisors,
and it is like it's like if you're looking in
the mirror yourself all the time, you don't really see
what other people see. So that's kind of how you
explain it. And it makes a lot of sense, particularly
when it comes to tasting wine, because everybody tastes wine differently,
and many tastes different things.
Speaker 4 (34:07):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely absolutely, And you have a person
with with that open is experience and really some times,
for example, whenever a new project, when this would be
when maybe younger, but whenever a new project, you are
in love with the project and you lose completely the
You are not objective, you are only like like like
(34:30):
a young person, and so you need to it's good
and also it's very professional. I need to. We have
a consulted in viticulture that helps us to to become
organic and to because these people working in all in
all the worlds and they bring you experience, They bring
you I tried this a new tractor with the electric engine,
(34:53):
and why don't you try it? Or I don't know,
some insects or some some something like this. And this
is is stefan Udini as an and I professionally work
with Gaya. You work with the best winery in Italy,
and so in viticulture is a special person.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
What's exciting you now you mentioned as you talked about
the tractor and working with a French winemaker. What's exciting
you now about wine and the production of wine and
the future of winetal.
Speaker 4 (35:22):
For Sicily, yeah, I think that we all of us
have to work to create a real new concept of
sustainable viticulture that is not a world It's not something
that we have to use to sell some wine. So
to make our consumers more confident with what you do.
(35:43):
It's something that people have to see when they visit
your place. This is a contract that I really like
and I'm studying in this last time and it is biophilia.
So is the love of the of the landscape and
way of you make. So whenever we're going, we are
we are. We are not only organic and sustained. We are,
(36:10):
but also we stop, for example, to be only bticulturists,
because I don't believe in to having only one culture.
We have we have today all mon Into. We have
olive trees in Memphi, we have wheat, we have cows,
we have bees. So we are back to do a
(36:30):
fun because we want to recreate and now we have
done it. So you can see in our place we
create like a farm like it was fifty years ago.
So I don't believe in place where you only see viniars,
viniars and viniars. That doesn't work. It doesn't work the
(36:51):
organic system because we only have one culture and this
is something that we are. And when people visit our place,
and you know, more and more people visit the wine
is whatever. They have to understand your philosophy, not because
you do testing or you have or you have something
in your levels. Because they visit the plate, the city, atmosphere,
(37:12):
they smell the flavors of the place and you understand
what we do, like it's Etna when you go to
Sharonova or you say, okay, this is a place. This
is a place where where you know I would like
to stay and wat to eat some food from here
and drink some wine from here. This is what this
is our philosophy. More and more and for example, how
(37:33):
we do architecture and we restore our place we build
our wine. We always things to try to be in balance,
in harmony with the place where we are. People had
to see our place better than was before we arrived,
or especially like there was before when country was the
(37:55):
best place in the world to the country landscape in
not or at now California or whatever. It was a
place where you go there and you come down and
you relax.
Speaker 3 (38:07):
Well, let's yeah, I think this is a great way
to segue into a project that I was happy enough
to visit last year when I was there for Cecily
on premiere Your new project, and it's a multi family project.
You do not own it alone, but you've started it
from scratch and it's with the Odo family from France.
Who's Who's a family that makes wine in Bordeaux, and
you created Sarah Ferdinanda, And I think that's this project
(38:30):
that you're talking about right here. Why don't you tell
us about it?
Speaker 4 (38:33):
Yeah? This is a you know, I see we mentioned
before we started Menphield and we have done a Victoria
and so Cicily is almost finished. So what's next next
for me was to do something that was a dream
for Cicily. And I'm I'm my family is in a
lot with Cicily, as you can understand. So the dream
(38:54):
was to find some people that believe in CiCi like
we do, from other other part of the world. At
the beginning to Bearnest, I was looking for some people
from California. My dream was to have like I don't
know why American producers want to invest in it. Then
while I was looking for this, I met this lovely
family from France called Otto. They are people that are
(39:18):
in finance, but also some years, many years ago, they
started to work in wine, one in sanser In province
in South Africa and one with us in Sicily. And
we create these new projects so separate from Planeta different places.
We buy land in a place that was untouched. When
(39:42):
I say untouched, I means that before us there were
some shepherd. There's some sign of shepherd buildings that could
be I think all the center your millennium. So the
very then forest, very clean, very untouched, very spoiled place,
and so is under the actors with fifty acts of
(40:07):
forest and then many other things. And so with them
we create this product in biodynamic within approject by dynamic
and that is in the last years and I started
to see in the last fifteen years some spectaclar products
in bio dynamic and I had I had a dream
that my dream was to make a place that was
(40:29):
done in a biodynamic way. Certified the matter will be
certified the matter in the next three months. That is,
you know, the serious certification. Serious, I want to say completely,
not easy con certification. But the wine are must be perfect.
(40:50):
I would say, this is something that I have to
explain it a bit better, so we don't play the
music of wine that you know must be like a
natural wine. So i'm you know, you know what I mean.
I want. I want to try to make a wine
where you have to have the perfect viticulture, the perfect
(41:13):
agriculture and also a very simple clean way making that
shows had to show you variety there were and this
place and it works. We're done two harvests last year,
that was kind of harvest this year, and now that
kind of art is con be different perfect by dynamic
(41:36):
in this site work perfectly. We use preparati, we use herbs,
and the grapes are spectacular and so this project is
red and now we have his own winery, his own house,
his own vineyards, his own people. Is really a place
(41:57):
that for me is also where you learn something when
you you exercise something that more and more I bring
in Planta that is organic and start to use some
some some of these ideas and it's a beautiful place.
It's a place that inside being a small project compared
to Planeta because Planta is much bigger. Also, it was
(42:20):
a place where I can do something that was a
dream that became true in this project. It's a spectacular
place that is now is open now in next we
will we will we will host some meetings of law
line people just to show them how can it's like
(42:43):
the perfect farm, you know, the perfect farm like like
you or us was dreaming to do and we have
done well.
Speaker 3 (42:52):
It's an interesting project and a beautiful place. And Melanie
is remote and wild.
Speaker 2 (42:57):
I'm looking at the website right now.
Speaker 3 (42:59):
It's on top of the hills and through the valleys
and you literally carved it out from nothing to plant
vineyards and plant crops and raised bees and you have
cows and other livestock on there for the biodiversity, et cetera.
It's an amazing place and that you could create this
from scratch in a short amount of time that you've done.
Speaker 2 (43:18):
It's a real testing and you grow in you grow
indigenous and international varieties and blends. I remember tasting these wines.
You pointed them out to me and we were at
the taste and.
Speaker 3 (43:28):
It actually brought a bottle home with us.
Speaker 4 (43:29):
From It's back for you. Yes, Rilla, we play on
this to this. They were French, were they are friends.
We are Sicilian. We do Sauvignon and Grillo as a
white when your black and double red. Also because there's
(43:50):
a lit bit of a two variety that are a bit,
you know, because Sognon and Grilla both on the aromatic
side of the grapes. No Double and Cira are you know.
The tachis used to say that maybe Syra came from Syracuse.
Of course French immediately say no, it's not true. Syra
came from from the south of France, across between twovariety.
(44:14):
By the way, there is something you know, statistically between
Syra and nor Double that sometimes they work together very
very well. And so this is why we choose this,
and of course you know it's a project that is
still the young. But there was our spins and Flora
Dormo is injured and in viticulture, we have a consultant,
(44:37):
especially in biodynamic Zago that is the person behind the
most important biodynamic project it in Italy, including fact or
the people that because I studied by the amagine a
lot of time, then to and I'll be I don't
like the magic part. I like very much when I
(44:57):
see the place. When I see the place, they works
very well. Well you understand something that it works, it
works well. And so after they visited Sharetto Ferradori and
we know each other since a lot of times I
feel how much they were happy. A much story about
more alive wine. This is something that people say and
(45:20):
that when you make the wine you understand that it
is true in a way.
Speaker 2 (45:24):
That let's take you as to another remote area where
we did taste some of the wines, Kapo Malatzo, which
is way off to the northeast in the peninsula.
Speaker 3 (45:36):
And again this is a this is a property that
you actually don't own. You actually rent and farm the
property and owned by somebody else. So but it's a
very unique project. So let us let's talk about that
for a couple of minutes.
Speaker 4 (45:47):
Well, this wine, for this project, I was I was
following only an aesthetic per principle, because the place is
a place with a lot of history, because Mamertino, that
is the dioce. There where people living there in Mamertine.
(46:08):
They were warriors. Where the warriors that help first Greece
against Cartagenesi, then Romans and against Greek So they were
a mix of Sicilian and Calabresi. So not the more
easy person in the world as you can image, and
great warriors Mamertini. This went from Mars, lord of war.
(46:29):
So this Mamertini helped ju and so Romance. When Jul
conquest Spain and Gallia, he used to drink to the
party to celebrate, sorry drinking Valerno and Mamertino. So this
one was very very old. And another another important story
(46:50):
is the place. Because the place is unique is a couple.
Miraso is like a promontory surrounded by the seventh Earli
island with the Ethna on the back floating over the sea.
Is like a dream. On our website, there is a
video there that is works much better than my bad English.
(47:12):
But while I wrapped there, I was touched by these
two things. But the beauty of the place and for
me there is not a scientific story. But in a
beautiful place you make a beautiful wine because it's something
that influenced sometimes you as when you work there. And
also the place and the second day his story and
(47:33):
another story about this place is the ter war that
is unique because it's a volcanic ter war. But you
know why not because it's behind the volcano, because it's
down a mountain, but only because the promontory attract the
ash from Stromboli that is in front of the eye
and Ethna. So there is like one meter of black
(47:55):
soils powder soils similar to Etna, and then you have
meters of alluvial soils that are the destruction from the
mountains over there. Because this is under the Neghboody and
plan very high mountains down surrounded. It's a special place.
We went there. It's not our property because it's a
it's a religious foundation. So we pay rent a big
(48:20):
one and also any bottles we give money to. This
money got to help children of the of the of
the area. And they have a beautiful they say, the
fatica farm where where the children can learn how to
you know animals. They were orchard is a beautiful it's
(48:42):
a paradise on earth and the vineyards. This is another
funny story. They are surrounded by an area Marina Protecta,
so is a place where around the sea they cannot
They cannot also fish there, so it's spectaclar is a
spectacular place.
Speaker 2 (49:00):
It looks fantastic. One of the wines we tasted, it
was the first for me and you, David, was the
new cheraero a dark. It's a dark black grape only
grown in certain areas, including.
Speaker 4 (49:14):
Between Pharo that is from Mesago now and Mamartino from
mesag In to the direction of Palermo and so is.
There are a few actors in old Sicily and they
love Livaratti with this blue grapes, blue skin no er
the name it came from ane so means nuts. So
it's what a big variety, but with the silky tannins
(49:38):
and very silky flavors and really the smell of the sea,
because if it's not this a sea and one from
the city and no wine from the sea, because it's
Italy is surrounded by the sea.
Speaker 2 (49:49):
I think what was exciting when we visited, and we
hope to revisit and go to some of your other properties. Alessio,
is we were able to taste. We tasted Sicily and
the ter Sicily and each of the wines. It was
really terrific. We don't have the time to go into
each of them in detail, but we will on our website.
We do want to congratulate you. This has been before
(50:11):
we close the show. Twenty twenty four has been the
year of Planeta, you know, wine maker of the year.
You think you're the fourth Italian winemaker to be named
winemaker of the year by wine enthusiasts. Gambo Rosso honored
your family and managers has honored your family this year,
just this year, So you know, congratulations for as we
(50:35):
always like to say with many winny people in the business,
it's about you don't own the winery. You pass it
from generation to generation to generation, and that's really what
you're doing, Alessio.
Speaker 4 (50:46):
So congratulations exactly. Also because agriculture really is a long
term job, long term because you really need the twenty
years to see our results and so do things in
terms of generations. Twenty four was a great year because
(51:07):
you know, you work hardly and for your team. When
this awards arrives is not a matter of business, a
matter really of your personality. Of your family or people
that are not more with us, that work to make
it happens. And so after a very difficult twenty three
because we lost some people of the family, twenty four
(51:28):
was like the great year for all of us. And
you know, we have a word in Italy, in Germany
and of course in the States, and so maybe we
work around as Planeta. We like to. We always talk
about Sicily first and Sicily then Planeta since many years,
and we have done step by step ready b you know,
(51:53):
changing the perception of what was a beautiful story story
of Cicily one is a beautiful story.
Speaker 3 (51:59):
You dedication to Sicily really speaks for itself, I think,
doesn't it, Melie.
Speaker 2 (52:03):
Yes, And really the story of Sicily mirrors the story
of Planeta, so it's really great. We look forward to
see where you're heading next, and we hope to be
heading back to Sicily to visit more of your properties
someday for our listeners. You can see some beautiful videos
and photographs, really incredible videos at Planeta dot it. There
(52:27):
is an English version and we encourage everybody to visit Sicily,
try the wines, ask for the wines, and open your eyes,
your mind and your palette to experiencing some of the
most exciting wines we feel are coming out of it
only today.
Speaker 4 (52:44):
If I can, I want to invite all of you
to two different journey in Sicy. The first one will
be going on the east doing Siracusa, Ortica and the
Noo area. The second will be going in the west
doing Memphi and then you to Saggesta and Say, where
you have all thethnological site. You will enjoy vineyards and
(53:05):
antiquity and one of the more wild sea in all Sicily.
And thank you really very much for listening my terrible
English that became more and more difficult the more we worry.
Speaker 2 (53:19):
You are fabulous and we want to thank you for
taking the time from your busy schedule. Alessia Planetta, you've
been listening to the Connected Table with Melanie Young and
David Ransom. We hope you've enjoyed this. We hope you're
excited about drinking Sicilian wines and visiting Sicily because we
want you to always stay insatiably curious. Thank you
The topics and opinions expressed in the following show are
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(00:21):
W FOURCY Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
Welcome to the Connected Table Live. We're your hosts, Melanie
Young and David Ransom. You're insatiably curious culinary couple. We
love to travel the world to bring you the dynamic
people who are front and center and behind the scenes
in wine, food, spirits and hospitality. We love sharing their
stories with you. We hope that you will visit them,
try their wines and foods, visit the restaurants, and support
(01:03):
what we call our community, right David.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
Absolutely, Melanie, and we've been doing this for quite some time.
This is our eleventh year. Yeah, we've really interviewed a
lot of people over the years, and one of the
things that we love to do most is interview winemakers
from around the world, and we're doing that today with
one of our esteem guests, and.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
We're taking you somewhere that we love to visit. We
can't get there enough, and that's Sicily. If you've been
following us, you know that we spend some time in
Etna Dock in September twenty twenty four, and we spend
extra time after attending ETNA days the Consortio to d
Lavini to Etna doc hosted, we spend extra time to
(01:44):
explore on our own, which we are wont to do
because we love the regions we visit. Our guest today
is someone we have been wanting to have on for
so long. He's hard to nail down because he is
a busy man and boy has twenty twenty four been
his year and his winderies yer and his family. Here
we're talking about Alessio Planeta. He is Ceo at Planeta,
(02:06):
which is one of the great names of Sicilian wines.
They have multiple estates and a very long history in Sicily,
which we're going to dive into. He joins us today,
So welcome, Alessio.
Speaker 4 (02:19):
Thank you very much. I'm very happy to be here
with you today, very happy.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
Well, we're happy too, because you're hard to nail down,
as we said, and we of course visited your estate
in Edna, which precipitated this opportunity to talk to you.
We learned that your family has a very long history,
as we said in Sicily, but it is originally from Spain.
Tell us about this.
Speaker 4 (02:45):
Well, yes, we you know, Sicily being in the center
of miditer random area ad in his history more than
twenty defense civility dation, including Spanish civilization, that was in
Sicily from fifteen sixteen to seventy thirteen, if I remember so,
for a long time, not the more easy time for Sicily,
(03:07):
because it was a period full of for example, a
lot of eruptions on the Ata and arquakes in Sicily.
But this is not for the Spanish, but because the
natural is like this. And so my family arrives out
during that time in the southwest part of Sicily, between
Memphi and Sambucca. Since that time we were landowners in
(03:31):
this area. We were barons of that area, but the
kind of barons that like to do agriculture in a
very serious way with a lot of effort. Since many generations.
Speaker 2 (03:48):
You know, when you talk, I think about where we
live now in New Orleans. It's very similar with the
multicultural people coming over for various reasons, there's quite a connection.
How the you know, we all know that winery systems start.
There's a history of wine making in Sicily, but there's
not a history, a more recent history of bottling wines
(04:10):
for commercial sale. What was the process with your family
to go from making growing grapes, making wine and becoming
a commercial venture.
Speaker 4 (04:22):
You know, we had in Italy and wine writers, maybe
the first wine writers that was called Luijivoneli. And once
it said that Sicilian used to make silver wines with
golden grapes. It was a very kind way to say
that Sicia didn't do the best for doing great wine.
(04:44):
The story was that Sicily was completely isolated from the
rest of the world, was a very difficult country, far
from the market, with a very depressed economy, with a
great past, with a glorious past, but we are not
easy present. Sociciia used to make a lot of grapes,
a lot of wine also, but this wine was sold,
(05:06):
especially as a bulk wine. We used to sell wine.
Just to give you an example, to the vermut business,
to the distillation of wine, to the to the some
French markets of very very cheap wine, but not because
the wine was not good, because this was the only
way to approach the market. Even if Sicily had a
(05:30):
history in wine that go back to the at least
eighth ninth Central before Christ we have a Phoenician bringing
grapes on the west, Greeks and in the east, and
many many other signs of agriculture. We had one of
the most available biodiversity in our in our in our
(05:53):
land with twenty native grapes, fifty ancient grapes and all
the international and rest of Italy grapes. We have one
different that go from Ethna, as you can see in
the middle of the of the volcano in a spectacula
way to Panteleia to the south of Sicily with three
(06:16):
months of arrests. So there was a big, big it
was a big potential, but Sicilian stop of the first step,
you know, the first step was making bulk wine. Then
during the eighties, if you go back in history, there
was some some glorious time for Cicily. That was after
(06:37):
the Philosa, when Filoxa arrives in all Europe didn't arrive
in Cicily, and Sicily arrived twenty five years later, and
there was a window of time wars Citi and where
the only producers so literally covered city of grapes. Then
of course Philoxa arrives, but arrives also with some Sicilian
solution to this using the most important paragraphs in the
(07:02):
world were done in Sicily. And then back to the
to the recent time where in the revolution of wines
starting the eighties in Sicily, my family was there because
my uncle Diego was one of the pioneers of the
revolution of Sicilian wine.
Speaker 2 (07:21):
Talk to us about that, and it really there's a revolution,
and then there's what we call the renaissance, which is
really the two thousands, which we like to say the
revolution and the Renaissance. So Diego is a pioneer, how
do you define that and what did he do to
revolutionized Sicilian wines?
Speaker 4 (07:41):
Well, Diego, my uncle Diego was a special Sicilian because
first of all, it was a Sicilian. You know, living
in an island is a state of mind that you
usually don't travel a lot, except a few Sicilians like Diego.
There was really a great traveler. First only he had
a British wife. Then he used to speak French, Spanish
(08:08):
English exactly like is the perfect way traveling around the
world and understanding very early that was big changing in
the wine, in the wine in the one industry. He understood,
for example, the potential of planting some not sicilent reps
in Sicily because you know, today we all talk about
(08:30):
and we all beloved Sicilian grace. But in the eighties
was too early to talk about Cary Kant and Ela
masks in the market. Was much easier to talk about
shardon and to talk about Murlo, to talk about the
style of wine. And my uncle Diego first of all,
my grandfather Vito Planeta, in the fifties found a cooperative
(08:52):
in Mephicle with other people, of course, called set Solid.
Diego became immediately president of this cooperative, and this cooperative
from eight people became a comparative of two thousand members,
six thousand actors of vineyards, and really a miracle from
an area. Manfield was an area very difficult with a
terrible earthquake in sixty eight, but from the really from
(09:14):
the ash of the artquake, they built a miracle. Some
spectacular comparative After this, Diego in the middle of eighties
was nominated president of Research Institute Sicilian. It was the
kind of easitute that before him, and I'm sorry maybe
also after Im didn't work a lot, but Diego that
(09:38):
was like a kind of person that worked twenty hours
a day and loving is with energy and enthusiasma. He
transformed this institute in a really the engine of the
develop of Sicily, bringing in Sicily people like Jaco Montakis,
like Attillio Senza talking like the most important way Mechani
(10:00):
at the time, the more expecting viticulturists in the time,
and another person in marketing, color Jump, all of Abridge
that was the founder of the University of Milano. So
they were really the best, the best player in Italy
in Sicily for Sicilians. And we create a group of
(10:23):
people my age or older to me a little bit
younger that followed this project and make Sicily restart, as
you said, in in a way that was a step
by step. At the end, the potential was there, there
was only it was time to have more people in
Sicily to show what we do. Working better in the
(10:46):
ven years, not in the venyors. Because it's a great viticulturist.
We do viticulture like part of our life, but to
work better in the winery and the winery and also
in this time there was some consulta arriving here in
Sicily became master of my direction. And this was a
very beautiful moment of Sicy.
Speaker 3 (11:09):
You know, I've seen that, We've seen that over the
years happen all over Italy as well, Melanie. The transfer
from growing grapes and selling them off to creating wines
of your own, and then that quality revolution comes into
I think it's fascinating, and Sicily is really one of
the best examples of that because it really was a
bulk wine producer that just shipped stuff off to the
(11:31):
rest of Europe so that they could utilize those grapes
in however they felt they should. And then that time,
when all of a sudden the Sicilian said, wait a minute,
we have something here and this is important for us
to be able to make a name for ourselves with
our own wines.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
You know, as you talk, I think about Diego really
helped a lot of farmers become business people. And you
could be a good farmer, but you aren't necessarily a
good business person. And we know that is indicative and
many areas, and particularly with wine. You have a degree
(12:07):
in agricultural sciences and also in business. You worked, you know,
you're CEO of the company and you work with your family.
I think before we started talking and recording, I think
you mentioned like six to eight family members. First question
is how are you leading the company as we get
(12:27):
into one of the what we think are the golden
times of Sicilian wines. Really one of the glory times
of Sicilian wines starting in the two thousands became the Renaissance,
but also as a challenging time for wine at large
in the world.
Speaker 4 (12:44):
Yeah, you know, family company doesn't ever for me a rule,
but what we do is, for example, we have the
best new ideas when we are all together on the table,
eating and drinking. This is the best way to manage
(13:04):
a business family and not doing a board meeting, but
doing to be in meeting age twenty four because you know,
you go back home. I live in the middle of
the country or facing the sea in Memphi with my
brother close to me and my cousin. So we do
(13:26):
a meeting, we think about a new idea, we debrief,
what we do during the day. And this is a
way to manage a family company Sicilian. As you know,
I have a great sense of family. We are a
big family because my father they were seven brothers and sisters,
(13:46):
so they were the old style family. And you know,
we like to work together in this way. And we
have different roles in in the winery. And for example,
my uncle, my cousin Francesca, she's in charge of hospitality.
That became a very important business for for for Planeta
and also for wine because I think to promote wine
(14:10):
with tourism is very important. And she followed this and
it is beautiful because she can dedicate all the energy,
all the professionality to this. And you know my brother
is on sales and I am the lucky one because
I'm the waymaker. That is the more funny part of
the business. Also a bit of administration that is not
(14:31):
the best, but we have we find our our our space,
we find our our and it works. To be honest,
we had a master like Diego that was a very
open mind person and that helps us a lot. That
Diego was my uncle. So and we have a kind
(14:54):
of family where we are different skills. No genie, but
our worker. This is the way.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
Well, it's a divide and conquer approach to running a business,
as I like to say. So you managed production of
more than two point four million bottles a year. That's
a lot. And you have estates in wineries in Memphi, Victoria,
Noto Eetna and Capo Malazzo, which is really interesting. We've
(15:25):
only visited Etna, which is where we were able to
taste a number of the wines. Let's kind of take
our listeners through the evolution of how these different estates
came to be and what some of its signatures wines
or grapes are because they're so different and as you noted,
it's not just native varieties we're talking about. There are
(15:47):
international varieties, which is unique to Sicily.
Speaker 4 (15:51):
Yeah, our journey was a journal in the start, of
course from home. So we was born in Memphia and Sambuca,
southwest of Sicily. Beautiful area where today landscape is like
maybe it was two thousand years ago. You have withat vineyards, olives,
forest and people working in the vineyards. There is in
(16:13):
the country. So it's a beautiful place, a place in
the middle between the east and the west. And this
is important because the west part of Sicily was an
area is an area of the white grapes like catarato,
like grillow, like the bibo, like Marsala area. The east
part of Sicily was the area of the red grapes
(16:34):
like frapato, like Neldabola, and of course Ethna with the
Relevanca in Caricanta. And Memphil was a place of frontier
something in the middle, was in the middle between the
Greek area, was in the middle between the Greek area
and the Phoenician area. And this is why Memphil was
an area where in the eighties there was a lot
(16:55):
of spillimentation people like us or like don't we got
our neighbors in Contestintelena, we experiment a lot in It
is also because first of all we see that there
were not, if I can say, an interest in in
local grapes in eighties. And second because Memphi was not
(17:15):
the house home home of any variety, but was the
house of old varieties. So we're not specific the specialists
of Newdale because never for me in the southeast is
the best. We were not specialists of cataratos di bibo
that are on the west. And so this will give
(17:36):
us a little bit like in Tuscany, maybe in Bulgary
or this place that develop a lot using of other
grapes because the way no specialists of San jove as,
and they opened the door to these grapes and they
works well. And so in Memphi we play with both
cic and international grapes thanks to these experience of the
(17:56):
eighties and then lotso to the to the place, but
the you from Memphi. Of course, our journeys started from
where we was born. But when we started making wine,
was unthinkable to make wine outside over your place where
you are based since century. So will you you do
agriculture in Memphi? You make one in Memphi. But after this,
(18:17):
in the ninety seven, a lot of times ago we
start to understand to fill the future, to to to
to realize that there will be one day that now
is the time where people will be in love with
the variety, with not only variety. But I won't say
there were there were done by Victoria with the Chera
(18:39):
soolo means fata or not, with Moscato and Dabla, and
of course Ethna with all the story of the Etna.
And so in ninety seven we went to Vittoria. As
always thanks to our experience of agriculture, agriculturist, because we
(18:59):
don't new on Libinias. We are. We also do olive oil,
we do citrus with calco. We are really really we
know Cicily quite well. I do fifty thousand kilometers every
year driving in Sicily, so I can say it turned
around Cicily like like like like a stupid And so
(19:20):
we went to Victoria, always starting from scratch, so looking
for the best place, best of war and planting the
vineyards with it, a lily bit, making the wine, having
people there, a different organization, because I don't want to
make planet around Sicily. I want to make in any
place with different people, different style, different approach to really
(19:43):
lack the war talk. Not let my hands on my
maker talk. This was what I learned from my master.
That was Carlo Corino, was a wain maker of the past,
that was a specialist. Really let the.
Speaker 2 (19:56):
Grapes talk, you know. We I I'm personally a huge
fan of the Cheriswola, dibatoria and the frapato. They are
so distinct to Sicily and such an incredible I wish
more people taste it and drink those wines here. And
I think they're really great wines for where we are today,
(20:17):
where we're sometimes wanting a wine that's fresher and more lighter,
and we live in a very hot area like Sicily,
and we welcome those kinds of wines.
Speaker 4 (20:27):
Totally agree with you. Fao as a variety and as
a wine is an old wine, but it's a more
contemporary wine maybe we have at the moment because light
but intense, distinctive, and we for example, like to show
this wine with is the best wine for having. Also
(20:52):
with food like pizza for example, not a simple pizza,
but a great pizza with the great is a top
food experience. And but also of course with cheese or
whatever we do with fish that's a traditional there. I
mean with fish with two now is one fish or whatever?
(21:12):
It is a great red wine that we are very
happy to be there.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
Well, we we think this is the future. And just
to know for our listeners. What's also interesting is that
the Cherisrolla Divittoria is the only do OCG wine in Sicily. Important.
Speaker 4 (21:28):
Yes, now is the OCG from the they finished the system.
I don't know, maybe not this Vinta. The next Vinta would.
Speaker 3 (21:37):
Be the next five.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
Yeah, well, let's move on to let's move on to
where we had the pleasure.
Speaker 3 (21:44):
I just wanted to do a little footnote on the
Fado Alessio. When I first met you, which was many
many years ago in New York at a luncheon that
you hosted, the Pato just blew me away so much.
It was the first planet of wine that I ever
wrote about.
Speaker 4 (21:56):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And also Vittoria, it's part of our
family due first because my grandmother and so the mother
of my father used to have a beautiful property there
with the house on the sea is quality. And then
also because so we had in the house in the
family drinking cheraswollow as every day whine. And then when
(22:20):
I finished my study, I do some experience, first in
Burgundy and then in Victoria. I worked for two with
two harvested with the Gusto Kipinti of Cossops, so when
the coast was a really tiny wanity and we had
a lot of fun, and just was a person that
influenced me a lot, because it's really uh, it's a
(22:44):
volcanic chera swollow producers. If I can say, great, that's
a really good matters. I was in love in the
beginning about the chow style.
Speaker 2 (22:54):
You've had some very good members between Diego and Carlo
Karni and and and it's it's terrific to hear that.
Now we visited Etna, as we said, and we let's
talk about location, location, location, because this is the northern
slopes of Mount Etna, so we should underscore how this
is areas defined by its zones and the styles of wines.
(23:19):
But also the fact that you make some Terras Siciliana
wines because you're the vinedords are so high, you're outside
the borders.
Speaker 3 (23:27):
But also I'm curious as to why you felt you
wanted to invest in Etna, because it's it's a very
unique place as opposed to a lot of the other
regions that make wine in Sicily. And it's not it's
not a type of wine making from which you came,
so it was something new for you as well. So
tell us about that journey.
Speaker 4 (23:47):
You know, to be honest, I learned that any when
you move from your place, you have to start from
from zero. So also for example, in Vittoria, Vittoria is
comparing to Memphi, where you have these calcareous soils and
toil with this red sandy soils, low low quantity of
rain is a really extreme viticulture and you have to
(24:10):
rethink how you work there. And then in the one
day it's the same in Noto that is a white
calcareous soils. The soils are like really really a white
powder like calco, you know, and full of shells of
the sea. And another new place, Edna, of course, was
(24:33):
more and more far from my from my roots, because
also it is a viticulture of mountains in a fertile soil,
in an energetic place where the vineyards seems seems to
run faster. Is when you go from Notto of Vitoria
to like ying young so low energy, i energy, white
(24:57):
and black. You have to push the vignions down there,
you have to stop the vinions. But at the end,
at the end is a place where really naturally is magic.
And as a viticulturist, I can say sometimes it's much
more difficult to do viticulture in the south than Inna.
(25:17):
Edna is magic at now is uh. It is a
place where you have energy, you have fertility, you have rain,
you have two varieties super adapted to that that condition.
So the first years was only for me to understand
like like always when you start. So sometimes I try
(25:39):
to harvest too early because I was stressed about the rain.
Then understood the real is like you know, for example,
when when we eas Sicili and we have a little
bit of rain, people start to you know, to be worried.
And you see a person from England under the rain.
They don't they see that, they don't steal the rain
(25:59):
over on the head. This is like nell rain is
not a problem. So at the beginning you do these
kind of mistakes that you do when you try to
compare a wine area to another whine. You have to
compare because every area is different, different weather, soilce conditioned
style of wine. And I was lucky to find Patricia
(26:22):
because Patterricia, that is you know, we in our organization,
I am like a sheef winemaker. But every winery is
own wine maker. And I say I'm a chief wy maker,
but I'm not. They do what they want. I only
try to, you know, to sometimes to provocate them, to
provocate some changing or of course two exchange experience and
(26:48):
Patricia have done a great job. She is Hungarian, so
maybe she was born with four mint and and and
tokay and and and this kind of variety. So of
course working in Ethna was with Karri Kanta was a
bit easier than me that I have experience in the
in nero develop and we find our style, especially on
(27:12):
the white time, very very happy. On the red we
are still in a for me in a moment where
you understand and you every year you understand more.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
Patricia Todd is who you're referring to, your executive wine maker,
who we had dinner with in Randazzo and enjoyed. And
yes she is Hungarian. She is, like you, moves around
a lot. And how would you describe your working relationship
because it is tense, particularly around harvest where we were.
(27:44):
We were there, so she was graciously gave us some time.
Speaker 4 (27:48):
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, first of all, every
every every wine and we have his own style. But
I like to to We have some viticulturists in Planeta
and the way maker, and I like to stay in
the middle between them because viticultures want to harvest too
(28:09):
early because they don't want to have the responsibility. They
want to clean the vineyards very early. Why maker, They
never want to to harvest because they are always waiting
something better. Sometimes not, so I try to stay in
the middle between this this system, and I like very
much that as a wine maker, there is a moment
(28:31):
where you have to stay in the to check the vineyards.
Then you have a moment where you have to stop
to stay the vineyards because sometimes you have too much
influence in the in the in the do you want
to do? You have to stay in the winery. And
this is what we do with Paisia, to stay in
the winery at the certain moments of the harvest following
really try to part par sialized, so to you know,
(28:54):
to vinify of course, not any contract, but any terras
in a different way. And of course she's with us
since in nothing since ten harvest something like this or
ten or eleven, so twenty eleven start to be in
because our our our job is a job where five
(29:14):
years is nothing, because we have to also do mistakes,
different weather, the vineyards became older. So ten years is
the time that you start to have an experience that
in a data base in your in your mind that
is good. So this is why we were working this way.
She likes to be of course, we have the philosophy
(29:39):
of of course let the vineyards talk so zero and
in the minutes we work to in the in the
one d we we are in organic plants, in organic,
proudly in organic. We are the I think the biggest
organic in Sicily. We work hard for Arabic and is
now we are organized in three years uh and we
(30:00):
are very happy, you know. And in the winery we
start to have zero zero ends in the wine to
work hardly, especially in the facilities, so a lot of
and you know, sorting tables, double sorting table, right press,
right tanks, right materials, adapting this to the to each wine.
(30:24):
This is where we try to do quality and this
and for this Particha is perfect.
Speaker 2 (30:32):
It's a huge commitment to go organic. And the so
stained program in Sicily is a very big one to
underscore the importance sustainability a time where it's more important
than ever in the wake of climate change and pollution.
So we wouldn't want to mention that because it's very
important to Sicily right now.
Speaker 4 (30:54):
Yeah. Absolutely, going back to a little bit for a
second to why making. I started went making with a
person called Carlo Corino. Carlokorea was a man born in
the forties, you know, in Italy. This generation of people
born in the forties were really the founder of Italian y.
(31:14):
I'm talking about people like Sharito and you know guy. Yeah,
this is the generation Firscobaldi, my uncle Diego. They are
born around end of the thirties, beginning of forties. Corino
was at that time it was one school, the School
of Alba, and Corino was the son of the shift
(31:34):
of the school, so it was the first student because
they have to study every day, because they're an this
kind of serious people, these people in Pymonte. He was
the best student of the school. It was in the
same school of Andlo Gaya and Charretto cousin. So this
was and he had a very special career because it
(31:55):
worked for one year in Piedmont. Immediately he moved. Corino
moved first in Ethiopia where Sicily and Italian used to
make wine in Ethiopia, and then from the seventies to
end of nineties to eighty nine he went to Australia
when Australia was the lab of the Australia and California
for the lab of wine and Diego that was a
(32:20):
visionary I don't know how in all the story about
this man in Australia and it literally take a flight
go to Australia and we used to say make Colino
an offer he can refuse. And it moved back to
Sicily because it was started to stay there and a
new project. And Kolina was perfect because it was the
(32:40):
open mind of a person that since twenty years in Australia,
but the great respect of truar that Peent people have,
and this was perfect for us. We tried to do
and then when Colina, unfortunately two seven died and for
five years ago alone, then I feel that to have
(33:00):
something to like a sparring partner. And from twenty eleven
I work with the young younger than me French Ye
Mecker calls for round Dumont. That is we see each
other five six times a year, me and all the
team and say, you know the kind of person that
work all around the world, give you some because sometimes
(33:21):
when you taste your wine alone, you need someone that
we say an Italian paniers or break the eggs in
the make everythink about everything. And so this is our
team is done in this way, in a way that
we try to we never every year we do want
to do the best, a little bit better next year,
(33:42):
doing experimentation, doing some you know, more and more. This
is what we try to do.
Speaker 2 (33:49):
That's interesting. Your mentors are so important, so our advisors,
and it is like it's like if you're looking in
the mirror yourself all the time, you don't really see
what other people see. So that's kind of how you
explain it. And it makes a lot of sense, particularly
when it comes to tasting wine, because everybody tastes wine differently,
and many tastes different things.
Speaker 4 (34:07):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely absolutely, And you have a person
with with that open is experience and really some times,
for example, whenever a new project, when this would be
when maybe younger, but whenever a new project, you are
in love with the project and you lose completely the
You are not objective, you are only like like like
(34:30):
a young person, and so you need to it's good
and also it's very professional. I need to. We have
a consulted in viticulture that helps us to to become
organic and to because these people working in all in
all the worlds and they bring you experience, They bring
you I tried this a new tractor with the electric engine,
(34:53):
and why don't you try it? Or I don't know,
some insects or some some something like this. And this
is is stefan Udini as an and I professionally work
with Gaya. You work with the best winery in Italy,
and so in viticulture is a special person.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
What's exciting you now you mentioned as you talked about
the tractor and working with a French winemaker. What's exciting
you now about wine and the production of wine and
the future of winetal.
Speaker 4 (35:22):
For Sicily, yeah, I think that we all of us
have to work to create a real new concept of
sustainable viticulture that is not a world It's not something
that we have to use to sell some wine. So
to make our consumers more confident with what you do.
(35:43):
It's something that people have to see when they visit
your place. This is a contract that I really like
and I'm studying in this last time and it is biophilia.
So is the love of the of the landscape and
way of you make. So whenever we're going, we are
we are. We are not only organic and sustained. We are,
(36:10):
but also we stop, for example, to be only bticulturists,
because I don't believe in to having only one culture.
We have we have today all mon Into. We have
olive trees in Memphi, we have wheat, we have cows,
we have bees. So we are back to do a
(36:30):
fun because we want to recreate and now we have
done it. So you can see in our place we
create like a farm like it was fifty years ago.
So I don't believe in place where you only see viniars,
viniars and viniars. That doesn't work. It doesn't work the
(36:51):
organic system because we only have one culture and this
is something that we are. And when people visit our place,
and you know, more and more people visit the wine
is whatever. They have to understand your philosophy, not because
you do testing or you have or you have something
in your levels. Because they visit the plate, the city, atmosphere,
(37:12):
they smell the flavors of the place and you understand
what we do, like it's Etna when you go to
Sharonova or you say, okay, this is a place. This
is a place where where you know I would like
to stay and wat to eat some food from here
and drink some wine from here. This is what this
is our philosophy. More and more and for example, how
(37:33):
we do architecture and we restore our place we build
our wine. We always things to try to be in balance,
in harmony with the place where we are. People had
to see our place better than was before we arrived,
or especially like there was before when country was the
(37:55):
best place in the world to the country landscape in
not or at now California or whatever. It was a
place where you go there and you come down and
you relax.
Speaker 3 (38:07):
Well, let's yeah, I think this is a great way
to segue into a project that I was happy enough
to visit last year when I was there for Cecily
on premiere Your new project, and it's a multi family project.
You do not own it alone, but you've started it
from scratch and it's with the Odo family from France.
Who's Who's a family that makes wine in Bordeaux, and
you created Sarah Ferdinanda, And I think that's this project
(38:30):
that you're talking about right here. Why don't you tell
us about it?
Speaker 4 (38:33):
Yeah? This is a you know, I see we mentioned
before we started Menphield and we have done a Victoria
and so Cicily is almost finished. So what's next next
for me was to do something that was a dream
for Cicily. And I'm I'm my family is in a
lot with Cicily, as you can understand. So the dream
(38:54):
was to find some people that believe in CiCi like
we do, from other other part of the world. At
the beginning to Bearnest, I was looking for some people
from California. My dream was to have like I don't
know why American producers want to invest in it. Then
while I was looking for this, I met this lovely
family from France called Otto. They are people that are
(39:18):
in finance, but also some years, many years ago, they
started to work in wine, one in sanser In province
in South Africa and one with us in Sicily. And
we create these new projects so separate from Planeta different places.
We buy land in a place that was untouched. When
(39:42):
I say untouched, I means that before us there were
some shepherd. There's some sign of shepherd buildings that could
be I think all the center your millennium. So the
very then forest, very clean, very untouched, very spoiled place,
and so is under the actors with fifty acts of
(40:07):
forest and then many other things. And so with them
we create this product in biodynamic within approject by dynamic
and that is in the last years and I started
to see in the last fifteen years some spectaclar products
in bio dynamic and I had I had a dream
that my dream was to make a place that was
(40:29):
done in a biodynamic way. Certified the matter will be
certified the matter in the next three months. That is,
you know, the serious certification. Serious, I want to say completely,
not easy con certification. But the wine are must be perfect.
(40:50):
I would say, this is something that I have to
explain it a bit better, so we don't play the
music of wine that you know must be like a
natural wine. So i'm you know, you know what I mean.
I want. I want to try to make a wine
where you have to have the perfect viticulture, the perfect
(41:13):
agriculture and also a very simple clean way making that
shows had to show you variety there were and this
place and it works. We're done two harvests last year,
that was kind of harvest this year, and now that
kind of art is con be different perfect by dynamic
(41:36):
in this site work perfectly. We use preparati, we use herbs,
and the grapes are spectacular and so this project is
red and now we have his own winery, his own house,
his own vineyards, his own people. Is really a place
(41:57):
that for me is also where you learn something when
you you exercise something that more and more I bring
in Planta that is organic and start to use some
some some of these ideas and it's a beautiful place.
It's a place that inside being a small project compared
to Planeta because Planta is much bigger. Also, it was
(42:20):
a place where I can do something that was a
dream that became true in this project. It's a spectacular
place that is now is open now in next we
will we will we will host some meetings of law
line people just to show them how can it's like
(42:43):
the perfect farm, you know, the perfect farm like like
you or us was dreaming to do and we have
done well.
Speaker 3 (42:52):
It's an interesting project and a beautiful place. And Melanie
is remote and wild.
Speaker 2 (42:57):
I'm looking at the website right now.
Speaker 3 (42:59):
It's on top of the hills and through the valleys
and you literally carved it out from nothing to plant
vineyards and plant crops and raised bees and you have
cows and other livestock on there for the biodiversity, et cetera.
It's an amazing place and that you could create this
from scratch in a short amount of time that you've done.
Speaker 2 (43:18):
It's a real testing and you grow in you grow
indigenous and international varieties and blends. I remember tasting these wines.
You pointed them out to me and we were at
the taste and.
Speaker 3 (43:28):
It actually brought a bottle home with us.
Speaker 4 (43:29):
From It's back for you. Yes, Rilla, we play on
this to this. They were French, were they are friends.
We are Sicilian. We do Sauvignon and Grillo as a
white when your black and double red. Also because there's
(43:50):
a lit bit of a two variety that are a bit,
you know, because Sognon and Grilla both on the aromatic
side of the grapes. No Double and Cira are you know.
The tachis used to say that maybe Syra came from Syracuse.
Of course French immediately say no, it's not true. Syra
came from from the south of France, across between twovariety.
(44:14):
By the way, there is something you know, statistically between
Syra and nor Double that sometimes they work together very
very well. And so this is why we choose this,
and of course you know it's a project that is
still the young. But there was our spins and Flora
Dormo is injured and in viticulture, we have a consultant,
(44:37):
especially in biodynamic Zago that is the person behind the
most important biodynamic project it in Italy, including fact or
the people that because I studied by the amagine a
lot of time, then to and I'll be I don't
like the magic part. I like very much when I
(44:57):
see the place. When I see the place, they works
very well. Well you understand something that it works, it
works well. And so after they visited Sharetto Ferradori and
we know each other since a lot of times I
feel how much they were happy. A much story about
more alive wine. This is something that people say and
(45:20):
that when you make the wine you understand that it
is true in a way.
Speaker 2 (45:24):
That let's take you as to another remote area where
we did taste some of the wines, Kapo Malatzo, which
is way off to the northeast in the peninsula.
Speaker 3 (45:36):
And again this is a this is a property that
you actually don't own. You actually rent and farm the
property and owned by somebody else. So but it's a
very unique project. So let us let's talk about that
for a couple of minutes.
Speaker 4 (45:47):
Well, this wine, for this project, I was I was
following only an aesthetic per principle, because the place is
a place with a lot of history, because Mamertino, that
is the dioce. There where people living there in Mamertine.
(46:08):
They were warriors. Where the warriors that help first Greece
against Cartagenesi, then Romans and against Greek So they were
a mix of Sicilian and Calabresi. So not the more
easy person in the world as you can image, and
great warriors Mamertini. This went from Mars, lord of war.
(46:29):
So this Mamertini helped ju and so Romance. When Jul
conquest Spain and Gallia, he used to drink to the
party to celebrate, sorry drinking Valerno and Mamertino. So this
one was very very old. And another another important story
(46:50):
is the place. Because the place is unique is a couple.
Miraso is like a promontory surrounded by the seventh Earli
island with the Ethna on the back floating over the sea.
Is like a dream. On our website, there is a
video there that is works much better than my bad English.
(47:12):
But while I wrapped there, I was touched by these
two things. But the beauty of the place and for
me there is not a scientific story. But in a
beautiful place you make a beautiful wine because it's something
that influenced sometimes you as when you work there. And
also the place and the second day his story and
(47:33):
another story about this place is the ter war that
is unique because it's a volcanic ter war. But you
know why not because it's behind the volcano, because it's
down a mountain, but only because the promontory attract the
ash from Stromboli that is in front of the eye
and Ethna. So there is like one meter of black
(47:55):
soils powder soils similar to Etna, and then you have
meters of alluvial soils that are the destruction from the
mountains over there. Because this is under the Neghboody and
plan very high mountains down surrounded. It's a special place.
We went there. It's not our property because it's a
it's a religious foundation. So we pay rent a big
(48:20):
one and also any bottles we give money to. This
money got to help children of the of the of
the area. And they have a beautiful they say, the
fatica farm where where the children can learn how to
you know animals. They were orchard is a beautiful it's
(48:42):
a paradise on earth and the vineyards. This is another
funny story. They are surrounded by an area Marina Protecta,
so is a place where around the sea they cannot
They cannot also fish there, so it's spectaclar is a
spectacular place.
Speaker 2 (49:00):
It looks fantastic. One of the wines we tasted, it
was the first for me and you, David, was the
new cheraero a dark. It's a dark black grape only
grown in certain areas, including.
Speaker 4 (49:14):
Between Pharo that is from Mesago now and Mamartino from
mesag In to the direction of Palermo and so is.
There are a few actors in old Sicily and they
love Livaratti with this blue grapes, blue skin no er
the name it came from ane so means nuts. So
it's what a big variety, but with the silky tannins
(49:38):
and very silky flavors and really the smell of the sea,
because if it's not this a sea and one from
the city and no wine from the sea, because it's
Italy is surrounded by the sea.
Speaker 2 (49:49):
I think what was exciting when we visited, and we
hope to revisit and go to some of your other properties. Alessio,
is we were able to taste. We tasted Sicily and
the ter Sicily and each of the wines. It was
really terrific. We don't have the time to go into
each of them in detail, but we will on our website.
We do want to congratulate you. This has been before
(50:11):
we close the show. Twenty twenty four has been the
year of Planeta, you know, wine maker of the year.
You think you're the fourth Italian winemaker to be named
winemaker of the year by wine enthusiasts. Gambo Rosso honored
your family and managers has honored your family this year,
just this year, So you know, congratulations for as we
(50:35):
always like to say with many winny people in the business,
it's about you don't own the winery. You pass it
from generation to generation to generation, and that's really what
you're doing, Alessio.
Speaker 4 (50:46):
So congratulations exactly. Also because agriculture really is a long
term job, long term because you really need the twenty
years to see our results and so do things in
terms of generations. Twenty four was a great year because
(51:07):
you know, you work hardly and for your team. When
this awards arrives is not a matter of business, a
matter really of your personality. Of your family or people
that are not more with us, that work to make
it happens. And so after a very difficult twenty three
because we lost some people of the family, twenty four
(51:28):
was like the great year for all of us. And
you know, we have a word in Italy, in Germany
and of course in the States, and so maybe we
work around as Planeta. We like to. We always talk
about Sicily first and Sicily then Planeta since many years,
and we have done step by step ready b you know,
(51:53):
changing the perception of what was a beautiful story story
of Cicily one is a beautiful story.
Speaker 3 (51:59):
You dedication to Sicily really speaks for itself, I think,
doesn't it, Melie.
Speaker 2 (52:03):
Yes, And really the story of Sicily mirrors the story
of Planeta, so it's really great. We look forward to
see where you're heading next, and we hope to be
heading back to Sicily to visit more of your properties
someday for our listeners. You can see some beautiful videos
and photographs, really incredible videos at Planeta dot it. There
(52:27):
is an English version and we encourage everybody to visit Sicily,
try the wines, ask for the wines, and open your eyes,
your mind and your palette to experiencing some of the
most exciting wines we feel are coming out of it
only today.
Speaker 4 (52:44):
If I can, I want to invite all of you
to two different journey in Sicy. The first one will
be going on the east doing Siracusa, Ortica and the
Noo area. The second will be going in the west
doing Memphi and then you to Saggesta and Say, where
you have all thethnological site. You will enjoy vineyards and
(53:05):
antiquity and one of the more wild sea in all Sicily.
And thank you really very much for listening my terrible
English that became more and more difficult the more we worry.
Speaker 2 (53:19):
You are fabulous and we want to thank you for
taking the time from your busy schedule. Alessia Planetta, you've
been listening to the Connected Table with Melanie Young and
David Ransom. We hope you've enjoyed this. We hope you're
excited about drinking Sicilian wines and visiting Sicily because we
want you to always stay insatiably curious. Thank you
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