November 18, 2025 • 50 mins
Cecily Mak joins us to reveal how dimming behaviors—like overworking, numbing, or self-soothing—quiet our inner truth. As she unpacks her own journey, she shows how facing what we avoid grants clarity, emotional depth, and renewed choice. This is your invitation to learn about reclaiming presence, agency, and the vibrant edges of being fully alive.
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Working on Purpose is broadcast live Tuesdays at 6PM ET and Music on W4CY Radio (www.w4cy.com) part of Talk 4 Radio (www.talk4radio.com) on the Talk 4 Media Network (www.talk4media.com). Working on Purpose is viewed on Talk 4 TV (www.talk4tv.com).
Working on Purpose Podcast is also available on Talk 4 Media (www.talk4media.com), Talk 4 Podcasting (www.talk4podcasting.com), iHeartRadio, Amazon Music, Pandora, Spotify, Audible, and over 100 other podcast outlets.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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(00:21):
W FOURCY Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
What's working on Purpose? Anyway? Each week we ponder the
answer to this question. People ache for meaning and purpose
at work, to contribute their talents passionately and know their
lives really matter. They crave being part of an organization
that inspires them and helps them grow into realizing their
highest potential. Business can be such a force for good
in the world, elevating humanity. In our program, we provide
(00:51):
guidance and inspiration to help usher in this world we
all want Working on Purpose. Now, here's your host, doctor
Elise cortez Us.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
Welcome back to the Working on Purpose program, which has
been brought to you with passion and price since February
of twenty fifteen. Thanks for tuning in this week. Great
to have you. I'm your host doctor at Lease Cortes.
If we've not met before and you don't know me,
I'm a workforce advisor, organizational psychologist, management consultant, logo therapist,
speaker and author. My team and I at gusta Now
help companies unleash their own gusto to enliven and fortify
(01:26):
their operations by stoking the passion, meaning, and purpose of
your team to align with your organizational aspirations. We do
this by helping companies build a high performance culture, inspirational leadership,
and nurturing managers who meaningfully connect with their team members
and coach them to develop more skills and contribute their
highest performance and commitment. You can learn more ab us
and now. We can work together at gustodashnow dot com
(01:48):
at my personal site at lascortes dot com. Getting in
today's program we have with us Cecily mac She's a
founding general partner at Wisdom Ventures, a purpose driven investment
fund backing companies at the intersection of technology and human
flourishing right up our alley. She's the voice behind the
clear Life Movement, the host of the Undimmed podcast and
the author of Undimmed, The Eight Awarenesses for Freedom from
(02:11):
Unwonted Habits. We'll be talking about eight powerful awarenesses from
her book that support individuals and shifting unwanted habits, whether
it's alcohol, overworking, perfectionism, or everyday digital distraction. She joined
today from Novella, California. Cecily A Harty, Welcome to Working
on Purpose.
Speaker 4 (02:28):
Oh fantastic. Thank you so much for having me. It's
great to be here.
Speaker 3 (02:31):
It is great to have you on And as I mentioned,
I learned about you from the Purpose Reset authors, so
that's where I got you from. And let's go ahead
and celebrate this new thing that's about to come into
the world. And I'm reading a little bit early Undimmed
here it.
Speaker 4 (02:44):
Is awsor Jez. It's great to see it live in
the wild. Thank you for being one of my earliest
readers I get.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
I'm so honored. I'm so honored. And as I said
to you before we got on air, Cecily, I just
think the writing is beautiful, Your storytelling is beautiful. The
way you bring us really into your world in a
very upfront and personal way is really compelling and very commendable.
Speaker 4 (03:08):
Thank you, Thank you so much.
Speaker 3 (03:09):
You're very welcome. So I, as you probably know from
what we said before and in our exchanges, and maybe
even by looking at anything I do websites or LinkedIn,
you know that I stand for helping individuals and organizations
realize their highest potential and step into their shine. So
it occurs to me that your book is about living
life full court drinking and all its wonder and so
(03:32):
if you could share with us, why were you so
compelled to write it?
Speaker 4 (03:36):
Yeah, you know, I have one of those rare stories
where I actually didn't set out to be an author.
I had environment career was on accident. Yeah, I was
a little bit of an accent. Of course, there's certain
moments where you have to really commit and follow through
with the intention, because it is an enormous amount of
primarily solitary work to birth a book into the world.
But I really used writing as a way for me
(03:57):
to metabolize and process and learn around my own experiences
of an unexpected decision to pause alcohol in my life.
And when I made that break and I realized how
little community and resource was available for people who weren't
necessarily in the recovery committing to sobriety camp, but also
(04:19):
wanted to maybe reframe their relationship with alcohol or any
other dimmers I refer to them. I realized that, you know,
I had some work to do in this space and
in processing my own experience and understanding my journey. I
wrote about it, and first it was essays, and then
I worked with an editor, and then I worked with
the second editor, and over time I really kind of
(04:42):
defined my approach and way of relating to things that
take me away from presence. And as I came to
bring that book into the world, we actually ended up
shopping what was my second plan book, not the first,
which is this framework of the aid awarenesses, and it
really hit a chord. We had incredible response when my
(05:04):
agent and I took it out to the big publishers,
and we knew that there was something here that could
be helpful to other people, and my own process of
learning could actually be supportive of other folks as well.
Speaker 3 (05:16):
A couple of things cucinly. So, first, I love that
idea of metabolizing your experience into a learning journey. I
just think that's really really yummy as a lifelong learner.
And secondly, I really want to commend you for how
what a compelling way you opened your book. You open
your book with a story about choosing to step back
into the house really quick and take a shot of
vodka to get you through the day. That's compelling for
(05:38):
a number of reasons. First that it helps us all
smack ourselves into a state of awareness of what are
we doing That might also be deeming ourselves. But I
think it's just really powerful the way that you talk
about this idea of what brought you into this learning
journey to step you onto this path.
Speaker 4 (05:55):
Yeah, yeah, no, And thank you for mentioning that that
was a It was a tough mo in life. It
was a tough moment to write about, and it was
also a tough one to agree to reveal to the world.
I'm still I run a venture fund. I run in
very kind of polished circles, and that is a very
raw and uncomfortable and awkward story. But I wanted to
(06:18):
serve that interest and intrigue in people who are trying
to find a way to relate to what I'm talking
about here, and in being my most human self possible
in inviting a reader to spend time on this and
their own precious minutes learning about what I'm offering in
the book undimmed. It felt really appropriate, and you know
(06:40):
that hook also leads into some of the other offerings
within the book, which are really an invitation for all
of us to look at what are we doing to
survive difficulty? What are we for to soften the tough
edges of life? And that moment for me, I was
sitting for the readers who are or listeners who aren't
familiar with the story, I was sitting in the passenger
(07:03):
seat of our family car at ten in the morning
on a weekend day, with my then husband in the
driver's seat, engine running, kids strapped in the back, ready
to go to the beach, and I was so wickedly
uncomfortable in my own skin and in my marriage, and
in my career and in my body. Everything was just
awkward and wrong feeling. But I felt like I just
(07:23):
had to keep going. That unconsciously walking back into the house,
taking a shot of vodka and then walking back into
the car made me feel at that moment like I
could then do what I needed to keep doing and
not doing that in allowing ourselves to feel discomfort and
(07:44):
work through. What arises in those moments is actually some
of the best intelligence that we can call on to
make shifts in our lives. And so it was an
eye opening moment in retrospect for sure.
Speaker 3 (07:56):
Well, and also there's a couple of things that I
would say about your brave your braveness and your courage
to do that and that to show that kind of
vulnerability and it is absolutely leadership. Is you are so
much more credible as the author of that book by
sharing that, Right, It's not like you're talking about this
from an academic vantage point. You've researched this. You know
what this is because you have the latest and greatest
(08:17):
on it. No, no, no, no, you're on literally the
front seat. Yes, So I think it's I just really
want to commend you on that. It's really powerful.
Speaker 4 (08:24):
Thank you, Lise. I appreciate that.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
So welcome. So let's help our listeners and viewers who
haven't yet rid of the book, as I have, really
better understand what you mean by a demmer. So alcohol
is one of them. What do you mean by a demo.
Speaker 4 (08:37):
Yeah, it's really anything that we do or consume or
use in some way to soften difficulty, and there are
unhealthy dimmers, and there are healthy dimmers, and we all
have our own personal experience and story with these. There's
no one right answer to that. Unhealthy dimmers tend to
be in the drugs, alcohol, gambling, sex addiction category where
(09:02):
the use has gotten to a place where there's a
problem where we're not engaging with life in a very
healthy way because of our tendencies with these escapist tools
or things that we can take into our systems. And
then there are really healthy dimmers that can be used
in unhealthy ways work, food, exercise. I actually name one
(09:25):
as a personal experience when I'm working through now toxic generosity.
So it's something that we do in an unhealthy way,
meaning we're reaching for it to escape or dim out.
Social media is another great example. How many of us
are awkwardly standing in the elevator with strangers, or receive
an uncomfortable bit of news, or have an awkward conversation
(09:48):
with a family member, and we grab our phone and
we start scrolling through whatever is available for that quick
little dopamine hit that will relieve us for a moment
of that difficulty. Those are all dimmers, And when I
was doing my own work and my own discovery journey
around how I was using alcohol. I realized it wasn't
the alcohol, actually, it was I was reaching for something
(10:10):
that made difficult moments more tolerable for me. And when
I got beneath the layering of that and could actually
encounter those difficulties and use them as guidance, my life
completely changed for the better. So that's the invitation of
this work.
Speaker 3 (10:27):
And I want to celebrate that because I want to
get a little bit more deeper into that. But you
brought up something for me, Cecily, and that is that
idea of those awkward moments in the elevator or whatever,
when you kind of reach for your digital diversion or
whatever it is. Some of my most delightful moments have
happened as I'm walking through the parking lot of my
gym to get elevator to get to the seventh floor
(10:48):
up to the gym. And just this week I had
one of those occasions where this young man was walking
along and you could always do that really quiet heads
down thing and you get in the elevator and get
on your phone kind of thing. But I chose to
say some thing about this patent Matt thing that he
was carrying, and it opened this amazing conversation that within
just a few seconds. I won't go into the story
because if we wanted more have more time. But literally,
(11:10):
within well last seconds, a couple of minutes, literally, he
had shared something profound about his life and I got
moved to tears by how beautiful it was, and I said,
can I hug you? He said yes. Now, if I
would have just stayed with you know, the usual thing,
I would have missed that whole opportunity. Man's name is David.
(11:32):
I made sure to say goodbye before before I left
that day. So what I see in your book, which
is in beautiful alignment with what I'm trying to do
with my life and my work, is you're asking us
to become more aware of our dimmers than to be
courageous in pursuing the life that we really want. That's
what I get out of your book.
Speaker 4 (11:48):
Yes, it's two things. It's it's getting enough signal to
have enough information to make changes that we might need
to make. You know, a great example that I that
I think about a lot is there's certain people in
context that we don't feel like we can handle unless
we have a thing so certain people we might be
invited to go to a dinner party with and we think,
(12:10):
I'm just not going to make it through the dinner
party without a couple of drinks. Well, maybe that signal
from our system around maybe spending less time with those people,
or I'm not going to be able to survive another
two days at this job without my nightly wine habit. Hmm,
maybe we should just investigate what is it about this
(12:31):
work that's so much of our time and energy and
life force that is so counter to our own state
of ease or sense of creativity or impact that we
want in the world, that maybe we should maybe we
should take a look at that. The second one, which
is such a gift, and it was the word that
just kept bouncing around in my life for that first
year I wasn't drinking anymore, is presence. Yeah, And that's
(12:52):
what you just spoke to. You're actually there for it.
You're in the moment with the person as opposed to
check out. And that is really the currency of life,
is being able to be in presence with somebody. It's
the greatest gift we can give a loved one. It's
the best way to feel fulfilled in our day to
day activities is to fully show up for those moments,
(13:15):
make the eye contact, invite the hug, let the tears
come out of your eyes. You remember that now, However,
many days later and you might months down the road
where you would never if you'd spent ninety seconds scrolling
Instagram on your way up to the seventh floor. And
so the heat way to that different way of orienting
to the world, which is the.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
Best And I'm in And yeah, the presence thing is
really a beautiful thing. Also, being untuned is another part
of it. Right, So thement piece what I want to
do next is and this is for listeners and viewers,
for you to one both get a a feel for
how beautiful Cecily's writing is. But two, this message is
passage here is just so powerful. So I'm going to
(13:52):
read this, Cecily, so you say. As my process unfolded,
it became increasingly clear that my journey had little to
do without. After all, the root of my habits was
an effort to dim out the difficulty and pain beneath
the surface. Like many I had been soothing, evading discomfort,
softening life's edges with what was not only available, but
(14:13):
socially and culturally encouraged. As I shed my dimming habits,
I felt everything intensely again, like a child, almost the
difficult and the beautiful parts. It was as if my
life aperture had widened, allowing in more of the extremes
of a spectrum of feelings. It wasn't easy, but it
wasn't bad either. It even began to feel good. Diming
(14:33):
keeps us in a safe middle. I was starting to
feel clear, with a newfound access to extremes that I
now can embrace as part of what makes being a
human such a gift. The key to freedom was getting
to the bottom of what I'd been trying to avoid
and making peace with that. Only then could I start
to live from a place of true agency and alignment
(14:55):
and finally reacquaint myself with both ends of the life
experienced spectrum again.
Speaker 4 (15:00):
Yeah, thank you, thank you for sharing that.
Speaker 3 (15:03):
It's so so beautiful, and I mean, that is so
much the invitation and promise of your book.
Speaker 4 (15:10):
Thank you. Yeah, it's such a visceral experience too, and
I really do see a pendulum when I think about
this and the experience. You know, we can stay in
the safe middle we can stay in the safe middle
for our whole lives, and when we open up our
access to the deeper ends of the spectrum, it can
be sadness and difficulty and challenge, but it can also
(15:30):
be abundant joy and experience and elation. And I speak
with people every week who are discovering the incredible impact
of being able to expand outside of that safe middle.
And it is both ways, but most of us end
up choosing that as a path.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
Well, it's really beautiful and I can't wait for it
to get into more hands and eyeballs of readers like me.
Let's grab our first break and let our listeners and
viewers and marinad and what we've been talking about so far,
your host, Doctor Release Cortes. We've been on air with
Cecily mac She's a founding general partner at Wisdom Ventures,
a purpose driven investment fund backing companies at the intersection
of technology and human flourishing. She's the voice behind the
(16:11):
Clear Life movement and the host of the Undimmed podcast.
We've been talking about where this book came from and
why it's message is critical for you in today's times.
After the break, we're going to start diving into the
eight Awarenesses from her book We'll be right back.
Speaker 2 (16:40):
Doctor Elise Cortez is a management consultant specializing in meaning
and purpose. An inspirational speaker and author. She helps companies
visioneer for a greater purpose among stakeholders and develop purpose
inspired leadership and meaning infused cultures that elevate fulfillment, performance,
and commitment within the workforce. To learn more, or to
invite at least to speak to your organization, please visit
(17:01):
her at eliscortes dot com. Let's talk about how to
get your employees working on purpose. This is working on
Purpose with doctor Elise Cortes. To reach our program today
or to open a conversation with Elise, send an email
to Alise a Lise at eliscortes dot com. Now back
(17:25):
to working on purpose.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
Thanks for stating with us, and welcome back to working
on Purpose. I'm your host, doctor Elise Cortes, as I
am dedicated to help them create a world where organizations
thrive because they're people thrive. They're led by inspirational leaders
that help them find and contribute their greatness, and we
do business that betters the world. I keep researching and
writing my own books. So one of my latest came out.
It's called The Great Revitalization, How activating meaning and purpose
(17:52):
can radically in life in your business. And I wrote
it to help leaders understand what today's discerning and diverse
workforce wants. What do they want you to give their
best and stay? And then I offered twenty two best
practices to equip you to provide that through your leadership
in your culture. You can find my books on Amazon
or my personal site at least Coortes dot com if
you are just now joining us. My guest is Cecily
(18:13):
mac She's the author of Undimmed, The Eight Awarenesses for
Freedom and Unwanted Habits from Unwanted Habits. So I think
it's fascinating that you adapted your system of eight Awarenesses
from the twelve step process. So let's talk a little
bit about ho where that came from, and how it
was that you decided to start there.
Speaker 4 (18:35):
Yeah, thank you. So I, as I mentioned earlier, I
took a thirty day experimental break from alcohol in twenty seventeen,
and that extended sixty days, ninety days and then a year.
And in that year twenty eighteen, I was grappling with
all the things when m I grapple with who are
my people? What do I do socially? Do I still
(18:57):
hang out in environments that are alcohol saturated? What about
the work colleague meal that depends on a few glasses
of wine? How do I handle that? And so, in
addition to doing my own inner work along the way,
I was seeking out resource and community and guidance and
tips on how to do this well. And multiple people
recommended that I go to an AA meeting or more,
(19:18):
and I was happy too, and I went to a
number And I had been in the AA system previously
as a child of an adult alcoholic, so I was
familiar with alan on in the process, and I just
couldn't embrace it as the path for me. And no judgment,
I know that AA has helped millions of people and
will help many millions more. But again, I didn't self
(19:41):
identify as an addict, and I didn't even self identify
as sober. So a lot of just the initial framework
didn't fit for me. And I kept thinking to myself,
I wish some of the similarities here, you know, with
my experience, could be adapted into something that suited me better.
And I talked to other people you know in a
similar place. They greed. So I literally took the twelve
(20:01):
Steps of AA. I copied it off of the website,
I pasted it into a word document, and I started editing,
and I changed the language over four years to suit
my experience in my needs, and at the end of it,
we have the eight awarenesses. The biggest difference between them
(20:22):
and the twelve Steps of AA are that the aid
Awarenesses is much more about agency, freedom, and choice, whereas
I found the A model was a bit more about surrender, diagnosis,
and in many cases stigma. So that's how the awarenessmans
came to be.
Speaker 3 (20:42):
Beautiful, beautiful explanation, a way to set up. So I
don't know how many up all we can get through this,
but we'll do our best to get through most of
the eight. And what I would love to do, Cecily
is just cue up a little bit about the awareness
so that people are aware of just what's available to
you in the book, because the book has ladies and
gentlemen so much more levels of richness to be able
(21:02):
to understand and get into the awareness. But let's start
with the first one. It's called you call it My
life is better clear.
Speaker 4 (21:10):
Yes, and this one is really about the invitation or
the provocation for us all to decide whether or not
we are better off without this dimmer. I spent years
trying to convince my late mother to pause and change
her drinking habits, and she never really wanted to, and
so all of those efforts were somewhat maddening and fruitless
(21:33):
for us. I found that in order to be on
this path of opting out of alcohol and staying committed
to a dimmer free life, that initial decision has to
come from me. I have to believe my life is
actually better clear. So it's a reminder to come back
to that anchor.
Speaker 3 (21:50):
I thought that it was interesting that you say the
best way to explore this first awareness is to pause
a dimmer of choice for a period and pay close attention. Yeah,
see how you might be better off without it. I
thought that was really powerful.
Speaker 4 (22:02):
Yes, and I want to invite people to realize it
could really be anything. It could be removing your social
media apps from your phone for a week and noticing
what shifts. It could be deciding that you're not going
to buy anything on Amazon all next month. It could
be opting out of whatever your other maybe something you're
ingesting sugar, alcohol, tobacco, marijuana, and just pay attention. You
(22:27):
don't have to have a bunch of you know, decision
or judgment around it, but just with a lot of
open heartedness and self grace, observe if the impact of
that absence is positive or negative, what you miss and
what you gain.
Speaker 3 (22:40):
You know, I noticed thanks to reading your book on Sunday,
I had a day of really great productivity and I'd
like the idea of just organizing for the things had
kind I've been on the road quite a bit and
things had gotten kind of messy and such, and I
didn't know where my inbox Moottom was or anything was.
And I went through this big, huge period and I
did all that, and then I had all this, I
realized I still had like several hours left in my
(23:02):
day or evening, and I felt this immediate like compulsion
to do something with them? What do I do with
that time? Like normally I would already have been through it,
and I, because of your book, I stopped and I went,
hang on a minute, what am I? Why am I
being compelled to do something with this time? Why? Amy?
What am I trying to fill it with? So thank you, Cecily.
(23:23):
Already it's already started to seep into my being, So
thank you.
Speaker 4 (23:26):
I love that. Yes, yes, business is a big one.
That's one I'm still battling with. And anyone who reads
my substack will see that it's one that pops up regularly.
I do the same thing that you just described, open time,
negative space. My reflex is to fill it, and there's
a beautiful invitation there to wonder why, and yes we
(23:47):
do less doing and more being and what might emerge
in that space?
Speaker 3 (23:51):
Well, and that's what I went into. I went into
that inquiry thanks to you.
Speaker 4 (23:55):
Oh, thank you.
Speaker 3 (23:56):
Yeah, you're welcome.
Speaker 4 (23:56):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (23:57):
So the second awareness is I choose what I consume.
Speaker 4 (24:01):
This is perhaps the most empowering of them. And I
like to think of the awarenesses as kind of mini
mantras we can put in our pocket and pull out
when we need them. This awareness around choice I choose
what I consume really applies broadly and can define our
experience of life if we use it well. So my
(24:22):
insight around this originally came from realizing that if I
was going to drink, there were many steps between thought
and consumption. And I write about this in great detail
in the book. You know, you have to get somewhere
where there is alcohol. You have to usually procure it
in some way. Then there's a pouring and a lifting
and a sipping, you know, in ten or other steps
(24:44):
in between there. And when I realized how much choice
I had every step of that way, it made me
feel very empowered to make choices that were aligned with
my previous decisions instead of feeling like a surrender or
a victim orientation. And then once I kind of pass
the alcohol hurdle and I keep alcohol in my house,
(25:06):
we offer alcohol to guests. I choose to not drink
every day. I'm conscious of that choice. I realized there
are other areas of life where that same awareness can apply.
For example, what people do we spend time with, what
do we read or listen to or watch? This awareness
(25:27):
I choose what I consume applies to so many areas
of our lives. And if we can just reclaim a
bit of our own agency and decision making and notice
that it's actually most of the time up to us
what we let into our systems, we can really change
the nature of how we live for the better, whether
that's physical health, mental health, our social lives are professional endeavors,
(25:50):
and for a lot of us reaching mid age, in
some ways, that's learning how to say no, thank you.
We don't have to say yes to every single opportunity
and thing and invitation. We're bringing all of this in
to our systems and our calendars, So let's choose carefully
what we actually want to say yes to or not yes.
I think your question.
Speaker 3 (26:07):
Of as we're making that choice, that we ask ourselves, well,
this numby or nourish me is really powerful.
Speaker 4 (26:13):
That's a big one, and it's a question we can
ask about just about anything when we're post with limitation.
Speaker 3 (26:20):
Absolutely, I can think of, you know, friendships that I've
let go because they were no longer nourishing. Yeah, and
so that would being an example of what you mentioned
in the social front.
Speaker 4 (26:30):
And that's hard to do. Congratulations. I know that that
is not an easy thing to navigate exactly. Not everyone liked.
Speaker 3 (26:37):
It, yeah, no, no, no was it was a big
deal for everybody, so yes, but it was time. Okay.
So then speaking of that, maybe this will relate to
this third wordness that you have. My intuition defines my priorities. Yeah,
this is that, right, intuition is that right, yes, no,
this is right.
Speaker 4 (26:55):
This is a juicy one. One of the things that
happens when we remove a dimmer of any sort is
that we increase our access to our inner guidance, our intuition.
And often people find when they've removed a dimmer, they
realize they've actually been dimming to tune out their intuitive guidance.
(27:18):
Your intuition might be telling you it's time to get
out of this relationship, it's time to move out of
this home, it's time to shift my career in this
way that is going to be awkward and risky. And
so we dim to just not hear that voice because
it's naggy and it's annoying, and it's encouraging us to
do something that might be really awkward and uncomfortable or
(27:39):
costly in various ways. And so the intuition awareness is
really around, let's see what we can do to actually
increase our access to that voice. Let's learn to trust
our intuition as really important guidance and then in turn
rely on it to help us shape how we actually
want to spend our time and our life.
Speaker 3 (28:01):
That is juicy, very juicy, and I couldn't help notice
that it was you talk about you're about with breast
cancer in that chapter, on that particular awareness that intuition
is your define your priorities. I have known many people
now who have had that journey, and I know that
(28:23):
you're also you're championing people who are also now going
through that journey as well. So just I don't know
what you would like to share about that, but I
wanted to call it and celebrate your journey.
Speaker 4 (28:35):
Thank you. I mean, the reason it arises in the
chapter and why it's something I continue to reflect on
and leverage is that I had a really strong sense
that it was time for me to step away from
my last very intense COO role. And I had a
lot of people who I really trust and appreciate, who
I have gone to for advice before successfully try to
(28:57):
talk me out of it. And I stayed the course.
And it took me nine months to get out of
that job, but I eventually resigned and left the house
in order and great new team members and so on.
And it was six days after that final email to
the team that I received my breast cancer diagnosis. And
it's almost as if my intuitive guidance was step away
(29:20):
from this load of stress and responsibility and accountability so
that you have the space to treat and heal. And
it felt so validating to me when I did find
out I did actually very much so need that time
to space at that time, and space to treat and
rest and heal. So I think about that often as
(29:41):
a reminder, particularly to women, if you're having a gut
feeling about something that you need to shift in your life,
it's really important to listen to that. It's often right,
and in my case it was life impacting.
Speaker 3 (29:53):
Wow, that is so powerful. May lead us at least
to help inform the fourth awareness, which is my trauma
isn't my identity?
Speaker 4 (30:03):
Yeah, so this one is really about the unearthing that
inevitably happens when we pause a dimmer. We hear about
this a lot in addiction and recovery communities, where it's
easy to stop doing the addictive thing, then the work
starts because you have to actually start dealing with and
(30:24):
facing what it was you were trying to run away
from with that habit or tendency or later addiction. And
I've found in my own experience and working with people
in the community around the world that's connected with me
on this topic that one of the kind of traps
that you can fall into, and that process is over
(30:44):
identifying with the difficulty that you weathered for all of
those years and wearing a bit too much of a
victim hat in weathering or kind of defining your identity
as you survived it. So, for example, and this is
very awkward to admit, but it was as recent as
less than two years ago, I realized I had in
(31:07):
my professional bio daughter of a deceased alcoholic. And I
felt quite a bit of shame around that once I
noticed it, because I was doing exactly the opposite of
what the invitation of the fourth awareness is. I was
attaching this identity to myself in a way that kind
(31:29):
of nurtured righteousness and egos, opposed to just seeing that
experience as something that informed my life.
Speaker 3 (31:37):
You know.
Speaker 4 (31:38):
It's a delicate thing. Similarly, it goes with breast cancer.
I'm often referred to as a breast cancer survivor, and
I politely invite people to maybe say I treated breast
cancer successfully, not I am a breast cancer survivor, because
I don't want it to be an identity piece. One
of the learnings of writing this book is also having
a fair amount of understanding and appreciation for everybody being
(31:59):
on their own path on this and there are exceptions
to this. There are people who have suffered really severe
abuse at a meta or a singular scale, and it's
important for people to have connection with community that shares
in that suffering. That's a really kind of an emergent
important topic of discussion in the States. In fact, we're
(32:19):
seeing it in the government today. There are groups of
people who are really supported by a collective identity. So
I don't want to discount that entirely, but as far
as one's own relationship with a dimmer and how to
kind of manure and shift that, the awareness is around,
understand what it is, have self compassion and grace for
why you were dimming for the time that you were,
(32:42):
and then try to move forward.
Speaker 3 (32:45):
So powerful, Cecily, so happy that we've crossed passed, and
I've got to read your book and be informed by
and get to share with my listeners. Now let's grab
our last break. I'm your host, doctor Relice Cortez. We've
been on air with Cecily mac She's a founding general
partner at Wisdom Vinch, which is a purpose driven investment
fund back in companies that are at the intersection of
technology and human flourishing. She's a voice behind the Clear
(33:08):
Life movement and the host of the Undimmed podcast. We've
been talking about four of her awarenesses. After the rik,
we're going to see if we can cover off on
the last four. We'll be right back.
Speaker 2 (33:33):
Doctor Elise Cortez is a management consultant specializing in meaning
and purpose. An inspirational speaker and author, she helps companies'
visioneer for a greater purpose among stakeholders and develop purpose
inspired leadership and meaning infused cultures that elevate fulfillment, performance,
and commitment within the workforce. To learn more or to
invite a lease to speak to your organization, please visit
(33:54):
her at elisecortes dot com. Let's talk about how to
get your employees working on purpose. This This is working
on Purpose with doctor Elise Cortes. To reach our program
today or to open a conversation with Elise, send an
email to Alise A Lisee at elisecortes dot com. Now
(34:18):
back to working on Purpose. Thanks for staying with us,
and welcome back to working on Purpose. I'm your host,
Doctor Release Cortes. As you know by now, this program
is dedicated to empowering and inspiring you along your journey
to realize more of your potential. If you want to
learn more about how we can work together and learn
about the Gusto Now Academy for leaders and individuals on
(34:40):
various journeys alike, make your way to gustoshnow dot com
and then go to the learning tab and you can
find the academy there. We'd love to have you join
us if you are just the podcast today. My guest
is Cecily mac She's the author of Undimmed, The eight
Awarenesses for Freedom from unwanted habits. So moving on here
through through the list of the fifth awareness is forgiveness
(35:03):
and letting go are the path to liberation. That one
is definitely one that I could stand to use some
work on.
Speaker 4 (35:13):
Couldn't we all? I mean, it's actually the biggest emergent
awareness of my whole entire process. I carried a lot
of baggage and weight and bitterness and crankiness with two
particular people in my life for many years. And as
I made my way through this process and became a
little bit more clear and present with myself and faced
(35:35):
some of my own demons. I was able to put
some of that down, and I think it was following
those important steps of being clear about agency and choice
and tuning into my intuition and shedding a bit of
that victim orientation I had. The two people were my mother,
who I felt like really abandoned me and kind of
lost herself in her own difficult journey, and then also
(35:56):
my kid's dad. We had a difficult divorce years ago.
And I mean, we could do a whole episode on
this topic, but I'll just say there's something very empowering
and liberating about literally choosing to put some of this down.
And the one sentence I can leave people with is
can we assume that everyone is doing their best? And
(36:22):
when we realize that most of the time people are
not trying to hurt or disappoint us, it unclenches the
hand a bit, so to speak. So that's really what
that one's about.
Speaker 3 (36:32):
That's powerful, the very very powerful way to describe that,
to unclinch the hand a bit, that's got you by
the throat. Basically, yes, yes, okay, Now the sixth awareness
really really spoke to me for a number of reasons, Cecily,
and part because I think it's important as we do
this work that we don't become self righteous thinking that
we've got all the answers. But two, I just think
(36:52):
in our world at large, this next one is really
really powerful. So the sixth awareness is I do not
judge or impose my orientation upon others.
Speaker 4 (37:02):
Yeah, yeah, this one is an important one for anyone
on this path. It's going to be different for everybody
and in very different contexts and settings, and we will
all notice it in one way, shape or form, whether
we're self platforming or being condescending, or positioning others as
ever to make ourselves feel safe or good. In my
(37:23):
experience in pausing alcohol, I was extremely guilty for a
while of being very judgmental about people in my life
who were, I used to say, still drinking here. The
assumption right there, the judgment is that they will stop
someday and they'll join me in my path and my journey.
I have, with great awkwardness, come to realize that's actually
(37:45):
none of my business, and what people do and what
they choose and how they live their lives might be
great for them. My path. My awareness is I know
what works for me, and I can follow that. And
I'm still learning. I'm making mistakes all the time. But
it's not my role to sit somewhere and impose my
judgment and expectations on others.
Speaker 2 (38:05):
M h.
Speaker 3 (38:07):
Yes, And I thought it was so powerful what you
shared with your interaction with someone named Trey in the book.
And I want to situate this as not just you know,
you for your own dimmer, but for any of our
demors and how we choose to pause them. But you're
writing your book, he says to you, your choice to
not drink is like a meditation bell. It makes others
(38:29):
around you pause, reflect for a moment and on their
own habits. And I think that's really powerful. And what
I got from that is since we all have dimmers,
and we all choose to take a pause on those demmers,
we too can be that meditation bell. And I think
that that I thought was really powerful.
Speaker 4 (38:47):
Yes. I think our daily actions are choices, how we behave,
what we do, what we don't do. It might not
be the most important thing in the room, but people
do notice, and sometimes that results in curiosity or a
shift or a pause, which can be transformative for people
I think about that a lot as a mother. I
have two teenage sons, and the way they see me
(39:08):
interact with the guy and the ticket taker in the
parking lot who can't find the right thing to help
me close my transaction is going to have a ripple
effect on them. Right, So maybe my own way of
behaving in that moment can help us all just take
a pause and take a breath and be something we
don't want to see in the world ourselves.
Speaker 3 (39:30):
Definitely, And I thought that in this particular chapter on
this Dimmer, that this insight here was really really powerful.
You say that great judgment serves as a guide. So
and when we catch ourselves comparing or feeling better than
someone else, it is an opportunity to notice an unhealed
part of ourselves. Yeah, really powerful.
Speaker 4 (39:52):
We only see the ickiness and other people that we
know exists within us, and so it's always it's always
an invitation to say, Wow, that feature or that quality,
that person that's driving me nuts, It must exist in me.
I would not have such intense emotion around it. And
that talk about humbling and awkward, that's that's one of
(40:12):
my favorites.
Speaker 3 (40:13):
Yes, yes, who this thing being human is rough, isn't
it something that's beautiful? But it's also so right. There's
so much to learn, and we're never done learning. And
then and to be open to that and humbled by it,
I think is really beautiful and the opportunity. So I
have become so aware of this as the decades continued
(40:36):
to unfold. Your seventh awareness is time is our most
precious currency.
Speaker 4 (40:41):
Yeah, this one, this one hits home and it's a
It's an emotional one in some ways to especially having
had a cancer experience in recent years. I came to
this one because after I had been not drinking for
a year, I realized I had all this time.
Speaker 3 (41:00):
Yeah, you talk about how much time you were spending
on that cover, and then I, it's crazy you don't.
Speaker 4 (41:06):
I didn't really think about it. But you know, there's
an hour two having a drink or two, and then
there's that hour two you're not doing anything else other
than maybe watching something or I don't know what you're doing.
And then the next day isn't really all engines firing
until an hour or two after waking up. And I
did the math. It's about three hours every twenty four
hour cycle. If you've got a light casual drinking habit,
which adds up to over a thousand hours a year,
(41:28):
and I realized, like, yeah, actually I do have more time,
and I'll put as a footnote there, and more money.
It's another kind of unexpected side effect of pausing a
lot of dimmers. But I think, you know, going back
to the third awareness, which is linked to this one
in some ways around intuition, it's really wonderful to arrive
in a place where we realize we can be a
(41:49):
little bit more intentional with our time and really be
thoughtful about how we want to spend it and with
whom or not. And I think you know, our phone
use is another great example here. Social media can eat
our lives. You know, I have all this wonderful data
that I share with my kids now around you know,
what is four hours on your phone translate to over
(42:10):
ten years? What did you miss out on? How do
we kind of reframe our respect relationship with this most
precious resource we have. We have no idea how much
we have left. We cannot buy or swindle anymore, no
matter what, And it's this kind of opportunity to have
(42:31):
reverence for something that we all have and it's really
up to us and how we want to use it
and spend it, particularly discretionary time. We all have to
work and take care of ourselves and each other and
all that, but it's the discretionary time that I really
try to myself be more thoughtful on how I spend
it and encourage that in my family as well.
Speaker 3 (42:50):
Yes, so much opportunity there. So the last one I
really thought was beautiful on how you situated and you
do situate it as ripples of grace, the awarenesses I
seek ways to support others.
Speaker 4 (43:04):
Yeah, I mean this one was one that required the
least translation out of the twelve steps. This is a
really natural final stepping stone on a journey like this
before maybe you start the cycle again. What can we
do to support other human beings? Figuring it out, especially
when we are in a place of I use the
(43:26):
word abundance. That could be abundance of time, It could
be abundance of money, could be abundance of talent. How
do we, you know, put back into the system what
we have benefited from. And anyone who's on a clear
life journey or you know, navigating with the aiight awarenesses,
there are tough parts and we need help and we
ask for support along the way, and that is part
(43:48):
of the you know, kind of core of this experience is,
you know, it's an inner journey. But we also can't
do these difficult things alone either. How do we pay
that forward a little bit? How can we show up
for somebody, even in just small way. For me, it's
often coffee with somebody, you know, a mom in my
community who says, Hey, I just hit perimenopause and this
white wine thing isn't working for me anymore. I know
(44:10):
you don't drink. Can we talk? Yes, I would love
to spend an hour with you. Let's go sit down
on a park bench somewhere compare notes. I mean, I
think that those are just wonderful gestures. And it's easy
in our lives today to get siloed into our me
orientation and all the things we have to do, and
it's just a it's a reminder to try to offer
up a little bit of what we've been so fortunate
(44:31):
to bring it into our own lives.
Speaker 3 (44:33):
And what I love about that is that really aligns
with my work and what's called logo therapy. Logos is
Greek for meaning, so it's really about vitalizing through meaning.
Is that it really speaks to that we are at
our best when we are serving and helping others. That
is when we are our most vivacious and vital.
Speaker 4 (44:50):
Yeah, and look what you're doing. This is amazing that
you're doing it. It's awesome. I love being a witness
to your work.
Speaker 3 (44:56):
Well, thank you well, And that brings me to my
next question. Really, you were talking about you being in
service to others, but here it is you've written a
book to help us live our bigger, better, best life
which we can immediately benefit from. But if I didn't
help situate that part of what you're also doing and
is to be able to bring forth and continue to
nurture your own mission. You're about raising awareness about and
(45:19):
taking a stand against alcohol that it is you. It
is a carcinogen. So if you could share a bit,
and we've been talking about there's lots of dimmers that
we all can opt into and use, but this particular
one has become something really important for you.
Speaker 4 (45:33):
Yeah, and just a gentle clarification, I wouldn't stand against
alcohol per se. What I am for is informed consent
with regard to alcohol. We are in the United States,
in particular, subject to a lot of lack of or
misinformation about the risks associated with alcohol because the big
(45:56):
alcohol industry and it's behemoth, a very predictable way, is
actually keeping science and research and helpful warning information out
of the public sphere for their own commercial self interests.
This infuriates me. I had been alcohol free for five
years when I had my breast cancer diagnosis, and it
was only in researching what may have contributed to my
(46:19):
cancer that I unearthed that alcohol is a Group one
carcinogen alongside tobacco and asbestos. At that point two years ago,
less than half of Americans knew that the percentage is
gradually increasing, in large part thank you to doctor Bevivec
Mertis US Surgeon General's report on the topic in January
of twenty five. But we have a long way to go,
(46:42):
and in my work with the United States Alcohol Policy Alliance,
which is a Washington, d c. Based nonprofit really working
to help increase awareness and understanding around the risks and
make alcohol less of a harmful feature of our culture,
I'd see a lot of room for us to improve
in this space. I thank you for bringing it up.
I do invite people to be informed. Do the research
(47:07):
be one of informed consent when you put things into
your body?
Speaker 3 (47:11):
Yeah? Back on the consumption, choice of consumption, I choose
what to consume. Yeah, so it goes by so fast, Cescily,
this has been amazing. We're regarding your aid awarenesses and
stepping into this fuller experience of life and expression of life.
What would you like to leave listeners with today?
Speaker 4 (47:28):
Such a good question. I think the one that I
come back to a lot in my community and myself
is listen to yourself. We all know when there's something
that needs to shift or change or evolve, and it's
really easy to find a way to kind of dim
out that guidance. And I just encourage us all to
tune in trust ourselves. We actually know what changes or
(47:50):
evolutions we want to make, and that guidance is really
really valuable wisdom that can help us kind of get
our life back onto an orientation that feels better.
Speaker 3 (48:01):
You know, I really I want to echo that, Cecily.
There is just so much information, data, wisdom available when
we learn how to really tap into it. And I
love that your messages for us. If we remove those
dimmers with much greater access to all of that. Yes, absolutely,
very grateful that when I reach out to you on
LinkedIn saying hey, I've got this podcast, I want you
(48:23):
to come on and talk about your book, that you
didn't just ignore it, but you responded with a yes. Cecily,
thank you so much for writing your beautiful book sharing
it with the world. I get to be one of
the first readers and coming then working on a purpose
to talk about it. It's been an honor to have
you on.
Speaker 4 (48:37):
Oh the honor is mine and I'm so grateful for
the work that you're doing, an impact you're having, and
thank you for inviting me. Thank you for sending the note.
Maybe I'll just reach out to people we want to
connect with a little bit more.
Speaker 3 (48:48):
Absolutely delighted. Yes, anybody that you think I should talk to,
And likewise, well I'll say that I want to talk
that you think I should talk to, just send them
my way made the introduction. I'm in. I trust your
judgment and your intuition. Awesome than listeners and viewers, you
are going to want to learn more about Cecily mac
the work she does at Wisdom Ventures, and her new
book Ondemmable. You can start by visiting her website at
(49:09):
cecilymac dot com and let me spell that for you.
It's cecil Y mak cecilymac dot com. Next week, we'll
be on the air with Lamel mc morris talking about
his new book, The Power to Persist, Eight simple habits
to build lifelong resilience. See you then, and together, let's
lean in and learn how to create destination workplaces where
(49:30):
people thrive grow into their higher potential, all while doing
business that betters the world. Let's work on Purpose.
Speaker 2 (49:39):
We hope you've enjoyed this week's program. Be sure to
tune into Working on Purpose featuring your host, doctor Elise Cortes,
each week on W four C Why Together, we'll create
a world where business operates conscientiously, Leadership inspires and passion performance,
and employees are fulfilled in work that provides the meaning
and purpose they crave. See you there, Let's work on Purpose.
The topics and opinions expressed in the following show are
solely those of the hosts and their guests, and not
those of W FOURCY Radio. It's employees are affiliates. We
make no recommendations or endorsements for radio show programs, services,
or products mentioned on air or on our web. No
liability explicitor implies shall be extended to W FOURCY Radio
or its employees are affiliates. Any questions or comments should
be directed to those show hosts. Thank you for choosing
(00:21):
W FOURCY Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
What's working on Purpose? Anyway? Each week we ponder the
answer to this question. People ache for meaning and purpose
at work, to contribute their talents passionately and know their
lives really matter. They crave being part of an organization
that inspires them and helps them grow into realizing their
highest potential. Business can be such a force for good
in the world, elevating humanity. In our program, we provide
(00:51):
guidance and inspiration to help usher in this world we
all want Working on Purpose. Now, here's your host, doctor
Elise cortez Us.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
Welcome back to the Working on Purpose program, which has
been brought to you with passion and price since February
of twenty fifteen. Thanks for tuning in this week. Great
to have you. I'm your host doctor at Lease Cortes.
If we've not met before and you don't know me,
I'm a workforce advisor, organizational psychologist, management consultant, logo therapist,
speaker and author. My team and I at gusta Now
help companies unleash their own gusto to enliven and fortify
(01:26):
their operations by stoking the passion, meaning, and purpose of
your team to align with your organizational aspirations. We do
this by helping companies build a high performance culture, inspirational leadership,
and nurturing managers who meaningfully connect with their team members
and coach them to develop more skills and contribute their
highest performance and commitment. You can learn more ab us
and now. We can work together at gustodashnow dot com
(01:48):
at my personal site at lascortes dot com. Getting in
today's program we have with us Cecily mac She's a
founding general partner at Wisdom Ventures, a purpose driven investment
fund backing companies at the intersection of technology and human
flourishing right up our alley. She's the voice behind the
clear Life Movement, the host of the Undimmed podcast and
the author of Undimmed, The Eight Awarenesses for Freedom from
(02:11):
Unwonted Habits. We'll be talking about eight powerful awarenesses from
her book that support individuals and shifting unwanted habits, whether
it's alcohol, overworking, perfectionism, or everyday digital distraction. She joined
today from Novella, California. Cecily A Harty, Welcome to Working
on Purpose.
Speaker 4 (02:28):
Oh fantastic. Thank you so much for having me. It's
great to be here.
Speaker 3 (02:31):
It is great to have you on And as I mentioned,
I learned about you from the Purpose Reset authors, so
that's where I got you from. And let's go ahead
and celebrate this new thing that's about to come into
the world. And I'm reading a little bit early Undimmed
here it.
Speaker 4 (02:44):
Is awsor Jez. It's great to see it live in
the wild. Thank you for being one of my earliest
readers I get.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
I'm so honored. I'm so honored. And as I said
to you before we got on air, Cecily, I just
think the writing is beautiful, Your storytelling is beautiful. The
way you bring us really into your world in a
very upfront and personal way is really compelling and very commendable.
Speaker 4 (03:08):
Thank you, Thank you so much.
Speaker 3 (03:09):
You're very welcome. So I, as you probably know from
what we said before and in our exchanges, and maybe
even by looking at anything I do websites or LinkedIn,
you know that I stand for helping individuals and organizations
realize their highest potential and step into their shine. So
it occurs to me that your book is about living
life full court drinking and all its wonder and so
(03:32):
if you could share with us, why were you so
compelled to write it?
Speaker 4 (03:36):
Yeah, you know, I have one of those rare stories
where I actually didn't set out to be an author.
I had environment career was on accident. Yeah, I was
a little bit of an accent. Of course, there's certain
moments where you have to really commit and follow through
with the intention, because it is an enormous amount of
primarily solitary work to birth a book into the world.
But I really used writing as a way for me
(03:57):
to metabolize and process and learn around my own experiences
of an unexpected decision to pause alcohol in my life.
And when I made that break and I realized how
little community and resource was available for people who weren't
necessarily in the recovery committing to sobriety camp, but also
(04:19):
wanted to maybe reframe their relationship with alcohol or any
other dimmers I refer to them. I realized that, you know,
I had some work to do in this space and
in processing my own experience and understanding my journey. I
wrote about it, and first it was essays, and then
I worked with an editor, and then I worked with
the second editor, and over time I really kind of
(04:42):
defined my approach and way of relating to things that
take me away from presence. And as I came to
bring that book into the world, we actually ended up
shopping what was my second plan book, not the first,
which is this framework of the aid awarenesses, and it
really hit a chord. We had incredible response when my
(05:04):
agent and I took it out to the big publishers,
and we knew that there was something here that could
be helpful to other people, and my own process of
learning could actually be supportive of other folks as well.
Speaker 3 (05:16):
A couple of things cucinly. So, first, I love that
idea of metabolizing your experience into a learning journey. I
just think that's really really yummy as a lifelong learner.
And secondly, I really want to commend you for how
what a compelling way you opened your book. You open
your book with a story about choosing to step back
into the house really quick and take a shot of
vodka to get you through the day. That's compelling for
(05:38):
a number of reasons. First that it helps us all
smack ourselves into a state of awareness of what are
we doing That might also be deeming ourselves. But I
think it's just really powerful the way that you talk
about this idea of what brought you into this learning
journey to step you onto this path.
Speaker 4 (05:55):
Yeah, yeah, no, And thank you for mentioning that that
was a It was a tough mo in life. It
was a tough moment to write about, and it was
also a tough one to agree to reveal to the world.
I'm still I run a venture fund. I run in
very kind of polished circles, and that is a very
raw and uncomfortable and awkward story. But I wanted to
(06:18):
serve that interest and intrigue in people who are trying
to find a way to relate to what I'm talking
about here, and in being my most human self possible
in inviting a reader to spend time on this and
their own precious minutes learning about what I'm offering in
the book undimmed. It felt really appropriate, and you know
(06:40):
that hook also leads into some of the other offerings
within the book, which are really an invitation for all
of us to look at what are we doing to
survive difficulty? What are we for to soften the tough
edges of life? And that moment for me, I was
sitting for the readers who are or listeners who aren't
familiar with the story, I was sitting in the passenger
(07:03):
seat of our family car at ten in the morning
on a weekend day, with my then husband in the
driver's seat, engine running, kids strapped in the back, ready
to go to the beach, and I was so wickedly
uncomfortable in my own skin and in my marriage, and
in my career and in my body. Everything was just
awkward and wrong feeling. But I felt like I just
(07:23):
had to keep going. That unconsciously walking back into the house,
taking a shot of vodka and then walking back into
the car made me feel at that moment like I
could then do what I needed to keep doing and
not doing that in allowing ourselves to feel discomfort and
(07:44):
work through. What arises in those moments is actually some
of the best intelligence that we can call on to
make shifts in our lives. And so it was an
eye opening moment in retrospect for sure.
Speaker 3 (07:56):
Well, and also there's a couple of things that I
would say about your brave your braveness and your courage
to do that and that to show that kind of
vulnerability and it is absolutely leadership. Is you are so
much more credible as the author of that book by
sharing that, Right, It's not like you're talking about this
from an academic vantage point. You've researched this. You know
what this is because you have the latest and greatest
(08:17):
on it. No, no, no, no, you're on literally the
front seat. Yes, So I think it's I just really
want to commend you on that. It's really powerful.
Speaker 4 (08:24):
Thank you, Lise. I appreciate that.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
So welcome. So let's help our listeners and viewers who
haven't yet rid of the book, as I have, really
better understand what you mean by a demmer. So alcohol
is one of them. What do you mean by a demo.
Speaker 4 (08:37):
Yeah, it's really anything that we do or consume or
use in some way to soften difficulty, and there are
unhealthy dimmers, and there are healthy dimmers, and we all
have our own personal experience and story with these. There's
no one right answer to that. Unhealthy dimmers tend to
be in the drugs, alcohol, gambling, sex addiction category where
(09:02):
the use has gotten to a place where there's a
problem where we're not engaging with life in a very
healthy way because of our tendencies with these escapist tools
or things that we can take into our systems. And
then there are really healthy dimmers that can be used
in unhealthy ways work, food, exercise. I actually name one
(09:25):
as a personal experience when I'm working through now toxic generosity.
So it's something that we do in an unhealthy way,
meaning we're reaching for it to escape or dim out.
Social media is another great example. How many of us
are awkwardly standing in the elevator with strangers, or receive
an uncomfortable bit of news, or have an awkward conversation
(09:48):
with a family member, and we grab our phone and
we start scrolling through whatever is available for that quick
little dopamine hit that will relieve us for a moment
of that difficulty. Those are all dimmers, And when I
was doing my own work and my own discovery journey
around how I was using alcohol. I realized it wasn't
the alcohol, actually, it was I was reaching for something
(10:10):
that made difficult moments more tolerable for me. And when
I got beneath the layering of that and could actually
encounter those difficulties and use them as guidance, my life
completely changed for the better. So that's the invitation of
this work.
Speaker 3 (10:27):
And I want to celebrate that because I want to
get a little bit more deeper into that. But you
brought up something for me, Cecily, and that is that
idea of those awkward moments in the elevator or whatever,
when you kind of reach for your digital diversion or
whatever it is. Some of my most delightful moments have
happened as I'm walking through the parking lot of my
gym to get elevator to get to the seventh floor
(10:48):
up to the gym. And just this week I had
one of those occasions where this young man was walking
along and you could always do that really quiet heads
down thing and you get in the elevator and get
on your phone kind of thing. But I chose to
say some thing about this patent Matt thing that he
was carrying, and it opened this amazing conversation that within
just a few seconds. I won't go into the story
because if we wanted more have more time. But literally,
(11:10):
within well last seconds, a couple of minutes, literally, he
had shared something profound about his life and I got
moved to tears by how beautiful it was, and I said,
can I hug you? He said yes. Now, if I
would have just stayed with you know, the usual thing,
I would have missed that whole opportunity. Man's name is David.
(11:32):
I made sure to say goodbye before before I left
that day. So what I see in your book, which
is in beautiful alignment with what I'm trying to do
with my life and my work, is you're asking us
to become more aware of our dimmers than to be
courageous in pursuing the life that we really want. That's
what I get out of your book.
Speaker 4 (11:48):
Yes, it's two things. It's it's getting enough signal to
have enough information to make changes that we might need
to make. You know, a great example that I that
I think about a lot is there's certain people in
context that we don't feel like we can handle unless
we have a thing so certain people we might be
invited to go to a dinner party with and we think,
(12:10):
I'm just not going to make it through the dinner
party without a couple of drinks. Well, maybe that signal
from our system around maybe spending less time with those people,
or I'm not going to be able to survive another
two days at this job without my nightly wine habit. Hmm,
maybe we should just investigate what is it about this
(12:31):
work that's so much of our time and energy and
life force that is so counter to our own state
of ease or sense of creativity or impact that we
want in the world, that maybe we should maybe we
should take a look at that. The second one, which
is such a gift, and it was the word that
just kept bouncing around in my life for that first
year I wasn't drinking anymore, is presence. Yeah, And that's
(12:52):
what you just spoke to. You're actually there for it.
You're in the moment with the person as opposed to
check out. And that is really the currency of life,
is being able to be in presence with somebody. It's
the greatest gift we can give a loved one. It's
the best way to feel fulfilled in our day to
day activities is to fully show up for those moments,
(13:15):
make the eye contact, invite the hug, let the tears
come out of your eyes. You remember that now, However,
many days later and you might months down the road
where you would never if you'd spent ninety seconds scrolling
Instagram on your way up to the seventh floor. And
so the heat way to that different way of orienting
to the world, which is the.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
Best And I'm in And yeah, the presence thing is
really a beautiful thing. Also, being untuned is another part
of it. Right, So thement piece what I want to
do next is and this is for listeners and viewers,
for you to one both get a a feel for
how beautiful Cecily's writing is. But two, this message is
passage here is just so powerful. So I'm going to
(13:52):
read this, Cecily, so you say. As my process unfolded,
it became increasingly clear that my journey had little to
do without. After all, the root of my habits was
an effort to dim out the difficulty and pain beneath
the surface. Like many I had been soothing, evading discomfort,
softening life's edges with what was not only available, but
(14:13):
socially and culturally encouraged. As I shed my dimming habits,
I felt everything intensely again, like a child, almost the
difficult and the beautiful parts. It was as if my
life aperture had widened, allowing in more of the extremes
of a spectrum of feelings. It wasn't easy, but it
wasn't bad either. It even began to feel good. Diming
(14:33):
keeps us in a safe middle. I was starting to
feel clear, with a newfound access to extremes that I
now can embrace as part of what makes being a
human such a gift. The key to freedom was getting
to the bottom of what I'd been trying to avoid
and making peace with that. Only then could I start
to live from a place of true agency and alignment
(14:55):
and finally reacquaint myself with both ends of the life
experienced spectrum again.
Speaker 4 (15:00):
Yeah, thank you, thank you for sharing that.
Speaker 3 (15:03):
It's so so beautiful, and I mean, that is so
much the invitation and promise of your book.
Speaker 4 (15:10):
Thank you. Yeah, it's such a visceral experience too, and
I really do see a pendulum when I think about
this and the experience. You know, we can stay in
the safe middle we can stay in the safe middle
for our whole lives, and when we open up our
access to the deeper ends of the spectrum, it can
be sadness and difficulty and challenge, but it can also
(15:30):
be abundant joy and experience and elation. And I speak
with people every week who are discovering the incredible impact
of being able to expand outside of that safe middle.
And it is both ways, but most of us end
up choosing that as a path.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
Well, it's really beautiful and I can't wait for it
to get into more hands and eyeballs of readers like me.
Let's grab our first break and let our listeners and
viewers and marinad and what we've been talking about so far,
your host, Doctor Release Cortes. We've been on air with
Cecily mac She's a founding general partner at Wisdom Ventures,
a purpose driven investment fund backing companies at the intersection
of technology and human flourishing. She's the voice behind the
(16:11):
Clear Life movement and the host of the Undimmed podcast.
We've been talking about where this book came from and
why it's message is critical for you in today's times.
After the break, we're going to start diving into the
eight Awarenesses from her book We'll be right back.
Speaker 2 (16:40):
Doctor Elise Cortez is a management consultant specializing in meaning
and purpose. An inspirational speaker and author. She helps companies
visioneer for a greater purpose among stakeholders and develop purpose
inspired leadership and meaning infused cultures that elevate fulfillment, performance,
and commitment within the workforce. To learn more, or to
invite at least to speak to your organization, please visit
(17:01):
her at eliscortes dot com. Let's talk about how to
get your employees working on purpose. This is working on
Purpose with doctor Elise Cortes. To reach our program today
or to open a conversation with Elise, send an email
to Alise a Lise at eliscortes dot com. Now back
(17:25):
to working on purpose.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
Thanks for stating with us, and welcome back to working
on Purpose. I'm your host, doctor Elise Cortes, as I
am dedicated to help them create a world where organizations
thrive because they're people thrive. They're led by inspirational leaders
that help them find and contribute their greatness, and we
do business that betters the world. I keep researching and
writing my own books. So one of my latest came out.
It's called The Great Revitalization, How activating meaning and purpose
(17:52):
can radically in life in your business. And I wrote
it to help leaders understand what today's discerning and diverse
workforce wants. What do they want you to give their
best and stay? And then I offered twenty two best
practices to equip you to provide that through your leadership
in your culture. You can find my books on Amazon
or my personal site at least Coortes dot com if
you are just now joining us. My guest is Cecily
(18:13):
mac She's the author of Undimmed, The Eight Awarenesses for
Freedom and Unwanted Habits from Unwanted Habits. So I think
it's fascinating that you adapted your system of eight Awarenesses
from the twelve step process. So let's talk a little
bit about ho where that came from, and how it
was that you decided to start there.
Speaker 4 (18:35):
Yeah, thank you. So I, as I mentioned earlier, I
took a thirty day experimental break from alcohol in twenty seventeen,
and that extended sixty days, ninety days and then a year.
And in that year twenty eighteen, I was grappling with
all the things when m I grapple with who are
my people? What do I do socially? Do I still
(18:57):
hang out in environments that are alcohol saturated? What about
the work colleague meal that depends on a few glasses
of wine? How do I handle that? And so, in
addition to doing my own inner work along the way,
I was seeking out resource and community and guidance and
tips on how to do this well. And multiple people
recommended that I go to an AA meeting or more,
(19:18):
and I was happy too, and I went to a
number And I had been in the AA system previously
as a child of an adult alcoholic, so I was
familiar with alan on in the process, and I just
couldn't embrace it as the path for me. And no judgment,
I know that AA has helped millions of people and
will help many millions more. But again, I didn't self
(19:41):
identify as an addict, and I didn't even self identify
as sober. So a lot of just the initial framework
didn't fit for me. And I kept thinking to myself,
I wish some of the similarities here, you know, with
my experience, could be adapted into something that suited me better.
And I talked to other people you know in a
similar place. They greed. So I literally took the twelve
(20:01):
Steps of AA. I copied it off of the website,
I pasted it into a word document, and I started editing,
and I changed the language over four years to suit
my experience in my needs, and at the end of it,
we have the eight awarenesses. The biggest difference between them
(20:22):
and the twelve Steps of AA are that the aid
Awarenesses is much more about agency, freedom, and choice, whereas
I found the A model was a bit more about surrender, diagnosis,
and in many cases stigma. So that's how the awarenessmans
came to be.
Speaker 3 (20:42):
Beautiful, beautiful explanation, a way to set up. So I
don't know how many up all we can get through this,
but we'll do our best to get through most of
the eight. And what I would love to do, Cecily
is just cue up a little bit about the awareness
so that people are aware of just what's available to
you in the book, because the book has ladies and
gentlemen so much more levels of richness to be able
(21:02):
to understand and get into the awareness. But let's start
with the first one. It's called you call it My
life is better clear.
Speaker 4 (21:10):
Yes, and this one is really about the invitation or
the provocation for us all to decide whether or not
we are better off without this dimmer. I spent years
trying to convince my late mother to pause and change
her drinking habits, and she never really wanted to, and
so all of those efforts were somewhat maddening and fruitless
(21:33):
for us. I found that in order to be on
this path of opting out of alcohol and staying committed
to a dimmer free life, that initial decision has to
come from me. I have to believe my life is
actually better clear. So it's a reminder to come back
to that anchor.
Speaker 3 (21:50):
I thought that it was interesting that you say the
best way to explore this first awareness is to pause
a dimmer of choice for a period and pay close attention. Yeah,
see how you might be better off without it. I
thought that was really powerful.
Speaker 4 (22:02):
Yes, and I want to invite people to realize it
could really be anything. It could be removing your social
media apps from your phone for a week and noticing
what shifts. It could be deciding that you're not going
to buy anything on Amazon all next month. It could
be opting out of whatever your other maybe something you're
ingesting sugar, alcohol, tobacco, marijuana, and just pay attention. You
(22:27):
don't have to have a bunch of you know, decision
or judgment around it, but just with a lot of
open heartedness and self grace, observe if the impact of
that absence is positive or negative, what you miss and
what you gain.
Speaker 3 (22:40):
You know, I noticed thanks to reading your book on Sunday,
I had a day of really great productivity and I'd
like the idea of just organizing for the things had
kind I've been on the road quite a bit and
things had gotten kind of messy and such, and I
didn't know where my inbox Moottom was or anything was.
And I went through this big, huge period and I
did all that, and then I had all this, I
realized I still had like several hours left in my
(23:02):
day or evening, and I felt this immediate like compulsion
to do something with them? What do I do with
that time? Like normally I would already have been through it,
and I, because of your book, I stopped and I went,
hang on a minute, what am I? Why am I
being compelled to do something with this time? Why? Amy?
What am I trying to fill it with? So thank you, Cecily.
(23:23):
Already it's already started to seep into my being, So
thank you.
Speaker 4 (23:26):
I love that. Yes, yes, business is a big one.
That's one I'm still battling with. And anyone who reads
my substack will see that it's one that pops up regularly.
I do the same thing that you just described, open time,
negative space. My reflex is to fill it, and there's
a beautiful invitation there to wonder why, and yes we
(23:47):
do less doing and more being and what might emerge
in that space?
Speaker 3 (23:51):
Well, and that's what I went into. I went into
that inquiry thanks to you.
Speaker 4 (23:55):
Oh, thank you.
Speaker 3 (23:56):
Yeah, you're welcome.
Speaker 4 (23:56):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (23:57):
So the second awareness is I choose what I consume.
Speaker 4 (24:01):
This is perhaps the most empowering of them. And I
like to think of the awarenesses as kind of mini
mantras we can put in our pocket and pull out
when we need them. This awareness around choice I choose
what I consume really applies broadly and can define our
experience of life if we use it well. So my
(24:22):
insight around this originally came from realizing that if I
was going to drink, there were many steps between thought
and consumption. And I write about this in great detail
in the book. You know, you have to get somewhere
where there is alcohol. You have to usually procure it
in some way. Then there's a pouring and a lifting
and a sipping, you know, in ten or other steps
(24:44):
in between there. And when I realized how much choice
I had every step of that way, it made me
feel very empowered to make choices that were aligned with
my previous decisions instead of feeling like a surrender or
a victim orientation. And then once I kind of pass
the alcohol hurdle and I keep alcohol in my house,
(25:06):
we offer alcohol to guests. I choose to not drink
every day. I'm conscious of that choice. I realized there
are other areas of life where that same awareness can apply.
For example, what people do we spend time with, what
do we read or listen to or watch? This awareness
(25:27):
I choose what I consume applies to so many areas
of our lives. And if we can just reclaim a
bit of our own agency and decision making and notice
that it's actually most of the time up to us
what we let into our systems, we can really change
the nature of how we live for the better, whether
that's physical health, mental health, our social lives are professional endeavors,
(25:50):
and for a lot of us reaching mid age, in
some ways, that's learning how to say no, thank you.
We don't have to say yes to every single opportunity
and thing and invitation. We're bringing all of this in
to our systems and our calendars, So let's choose carefully
what we actually want to say yes to or not yes.
I think your question.
Speaker 3 (26:07):
Of as we're making that choice, that we ask ourselves, well,
this numby or nourish me is really powerful.
Speaker 4 (26:13):
That's a big one, and it's a question we can
ask about just about anything when we're post with limitation.
Speaker 3 (26:20):
Absolutely, I can think of, you know, friendships that I've
let go because they were no longer nourishing. Yeah, and
so that would being an example of what you mentioned
in the social front.
Speaker 4 (26:30):
And that's hard to do. Congratulations. I know that that
is not an easy thing to navigate exactly. Not everyone liked.
Speaker 3 (26:37):
It, yeah, no, no, no was it was a big
deal for everybody, so yes, but it was time. Okay.
So then speaking of that, maybe this will relate to
this third wordness that you have. My intuition defines my priorities. Yeah,
this is that, right, intuition is that right, yes, no,
this is right.
Speaker 4 (26:55):
This is a juicy one. One of the things that
happens when we remove a dimmer of any sort is
that we increase our access to our inner guidance, our intuition.
And often people find when they've removed a dimmer, they
realize they've actually been dimming to tune out their intuitive guidance.
(27:18):
Your intuition might be telling you it's time to get
out of this relationship, it's time to move out of
this home, it's time to shift my career in this
way that is going to be awkward and risky. And
so we dim to just not hear that voice because
it's naggy and it's annoying, and it's encouraging us to
do something that might be really awkward and uncomfortable or
(27:39):
costly in various ways. And so the intuition awareness is
really around, let's see what we can do to actually
increase our access to that voice. Let's learn to trust
our intuition as really important guidance and then in turn
rely on it to help us shape how we actually
want to spend our time and our life.
Speaker 3 (28:01):
That is juicy, very juicy, and I couldn't help notice
that it was you talk about you're about with breast
cancer in that chapter, on that particular awareness that intuition
is your define your priorities. I have known many people
now who have had that journey, and I know that
(28:23):
you're also you're championing people who are also now going
through that journey as well. So just I don't know
what you would like to share about that, but I
wanted to call it and celebrate your journey.
Speaker 4 (28:35):
Thank you. I mean, the reason it arises in the
chapter and why it's something I continue to reflect on
and leverage is that I had a really strong sense
that it was time for me to step away from
my last very intense COO role. And I had a
lot of people who I really trust and appreciate, who
I have gone to for advice before successfully try to
(28:57):
talk me out of it. And I stayed the course.
And it took me nine months to get out of
that job, but I eventually resigned and left the house
in order and great new team members and so on.
And it was six days after that final email to
the team that I received my breast cancer diagnosis. And
it's almost as if my intuitive guidance was step away
(29:20):
from this load of stress and responsibility and accountability so
that you have the space to treat and heal. And
it felt so validating to me when I did find
out I did actually very much so need that time
to space at that time, and space to treat and
rest and heal. So I think about that often as
(29:41):
a reminder, particularly to women, if you're having a gut
feeling about something that you need to shift in your life,
it's really important to listen to that. It's often right,
and in my case it was life impacting.
Speaker 3 (29:53):
Wow, that is so powerful. May lead us at least
to help inform the fourth awareness, which is my trauma
isn't my identity?
Speaker 4 (30:03):
Yeah, so this one is really about the unearthing that
inevitably happens when we pause a dimmer. We hear about
this a lot in addiction and recovery communities, where it's
easy to stop doing the addictive thing, then the work
starts because you have to actually start dealing with and
(30:24):
facing what it was you were trying to run away
from with that habit or tendency or later addiction. And
I've found in my own experience and working with people
in the community around the world that's connected with me
on this topic that one of the kind of traps
that you can fall into, and that process is over
(30:44):
identifying with the difficulty that you weathered for all of
those years and wearing a bit too much of a
victim hat in weathering or kind of defining your identity
as you survived it. So, for example, and this is
very awkward to admit, but it was as recent as
less than two years ago, I realized I had in
(31:07):
my professional bio daughter of a deceased alcoholic. And I
felt quite a bit of shame around that once I
noticed it, because I was doing exactly the opposite of
what the invitation of the fourth awareness is. I was
attaching this identity to myself in a way that kind
(31:29):
of nurtured righteousness and egos, opposed to just seeing that
experience as something that informed my life.
Speaker 3 (31:37):
You know.
Speaker 4 (31:38):
It's a delicate thing. Similarly, it goes with breast cancer.
I'm often referred to as a breast cancer survivor, and
I politely invite people to maybe say I treated breast
cancer successfully, not I am a breast cancer survivor, because
I don't want it to be an identity piece. One
of the learnings of writing this book is also having
a fair amount of understanding and appreciation for everybody being
(31:59):
on their own path on this and there are exceptions
to this. There are people who have suffered really severe
abuse at a meta or a singular scale, and it's
important for people to have connection with community that shares
in that suffering. That's a really kind of an emergent
important topic of discussion in the States. In fact, we're
(32:19):
seeing it in the government today. There are groups of
people who are really supported by a collective identity. So
I don't want to discount that entirely, but as far
as one's own relationship with a dimmer and how to
kind of manure and shift that, the awareness is around,
understand what it is, have self compassion and grace for
why you were dimming for the time that you were,
(32:42):
and then try to move forward.
Speaker 3 (32:45):
So powerful, Cecily, so happy that we've crossed passed, and
I've got to read your book and be informed by
and get to share with my listeners. Now let's grab
our last break. I'm your host, doctor Relice Cortez. We've
been on air with Cecily mac She's a founding general
partner at Wisdom Vinch, which is a purpose driven investment
fund back in companies that are at the intersection of
technology and human flourishing. She's a voice behind the Clear
(33:08):
Life movement and the host of the Undimmed podcast. We've
been talking about four of her awarenesses. After the rik,
we're going to see if we can cover off on
the last four. We'll be right back.
Speaker 2 (33:33):
Doctor Elise Cortez is a management consultant specializing in meaning
and purpose. An inspirational speaker and author, she helps companies'
visioneer for a greater purpose among stakeholders and develop purpose
inspired leadership and meaning infused cultures that elevate fulfillment, performance,
and commitment within the workforce. To learn more or to
invite a lease to speak to your organization, please visit
(33:54):
her at elisecortes dot com. Let's talk about how to
get your employees working on purpose. This This is working
on Purpose with doctor Elise Cortes. To reach our program
today or to open a conversation with Elise, send an
email to Alise A Lisee at elisecortes dot com. Now
(34:18):
back to working on Purpose. Thanks for staying with us,
and welcome back to working on Purpose. I'm your host,
Doctor Release Cortes. As you know by now, this program
is dedicated to empowering and inspiring you along your journey
to realize more of your potential. If you want to
learn more about how we can work together and learn
about the Gusto Now Academy for leaders and individuals on
(34:40):
various journeys alike, make your way to gustoshnow dot com
and then go to the learning tab and you can
find the academy there. We'd love to have you join
us if you are just the podcast today. My guest
is Cecily mac She's the author of Undimmed, The eight
Awarenesses for Freedom from unwanted habits. So moving on here
through through the list of the fifth awareness is forgiveness
(35:03):
and letting go are the path to liberation. That one
is definitely one that I could stand to use some
work on.
Speaker 4 (35:13):
Couldn't we all? I mean, it's actually the biggest emergent
awareness of my whole entire process. I carried a lot
of baggage and weight and bitterness and crankiness with two
particular people in my life for many years. And as
I made my way through this process and became a
little bit more clear and present with myself and faced
(35:35):
some of my own demons. I was able to put
some of that down, and I think it was following
those important steps of being clear about agency and choice
and tuning into my intuition and shedding a bit of
that victim orientation I had. The two people were my mother,
who I felt like really abandoned me and kind of
lost herself in her own difficult journey, and then also
(35:56):
my kid's dad. We had a difficult divorce years ago.
And I mean, we could do a whole episode on
this topic, but I'll just say there's something very empowering
and liberating about literally choosing to put some of this down.
And the one sentence I can leave people with is
can we assume that everyone is doing their best? And
(36:22):
when we realize that most of the time people are
not trying to hurt or disappoint us, it unclenches the
hand a bit, so to speak. So that's really what
that one's about.
Speaker 3 (36:32):
That's powerful, the very very powerful way to describe that,
to unclinch the hand a bit, that's got you by
the throat. Basically, yes, yes, okay, Now the sixth awareness
really really spoke to me for a number of reasons, Cecily,
and part because I think it's important as we do
this work that we don't become self righteous thinking that
we've got all the answers. But two, I just think
(36:52):
in our world at large, this next one is really
really powerful. So the sixth awareness is I do not
judge or impose my orientation upon others.
Speaker 4 (37:02):
Yeah, yeah, this one is an important one for anyone
on this path. It's going to be different for everybody
and in very different contexts and settings, and we will
all notice it in one way, shape or form, whether
we're self platforming or being condescending, or positioning others as
ever to make ourselves feel safe or good. In my
(37:23):
experience in pausing alcohol, I was extremely guilty for a
while of being very judgmental about people in my life
who were, I used to say, still drinking here. The
assumption right there, the judgment is that they will stop
someday and they'll join me in my path and my journey.
I have, with great awkwardness, come to realize that's actually
(37:45):
none of my business, and what people do and what
they choose and how they live their lives might be
great for them. My path. My awareness is I know
what works for me, and I can follow that. And
I'm still learning. I'm making mistakes all the time. But
it's not my role to sit somewhere and impose my
judgment and expectations on others.
Speaker 2 (38:05):
M h.
Speaker 3 (38:07):
Yes, And I thought it was so powerful what you
shared with your interaction with someone named Trey in the book.
And I want to situate this as not just you know,
you for your own dimmer, but for any of our
demors and how we choose to pause them. But you're
writing your book, he says to you, your choice to
not drink is like a meditation bell. It makes others
(38:29):
around you pause, reflect for a moment and on their
own habits. And I think that's really powerful. And what
I got from that is since we all have dimmers,
and we all choose to take a pause on those demmers,
we too can be that meditation bell. And I think
that that I thought was really powerful.
Speaker 4 (38:47):
Yes. I think our daily actions are choices, how we behave,
what we do, what we don't do. It might not
be the most important thing in the room, but people
do notice, and sometimes that results in curiosity or a
shift or a pause, which can be transformative for people
I think about that a lot as a mother. I
have two teenage sons, and the way they see me
(39:08):
interact with the guy and the ticket taker in the
parking lot who can't find the right thing to help
me close my transaction is going to have a ripple
effect on them. Right, So maybe my own way of
behaving in that moment can help us all just take
a pause and take a breath and be something we
don't want to see in the world ourselves.
Speaker 3 (39:30):
Definitely, And I thought that in this particular chapter on
this Dimmer, that this insight here was really really powerful.
You say that great judgment serves as a guide. So
and when we catch ourselves comparing or feeling better than
someone else, it is an opportunity to notice an unhealed
part of ourselves. Yeah, really powerful.
Speaker 4 (39:52):
We only see the ickiness and other people that we
know exists within us, and so it's always it's always
an invitation to say, Wow, that feature or that quality,
that person that's driving me nuts, It must exist in me.
I would not have such intense emotion around it. And
that talk about humbling and awkward, that's that's one of
(40:12):
my favorites.
Speaker 3 (40:13):
Yes, yes, who this thing being human is rough, isn't
it something that's beautiful? But it's also so right. There's
so much to learn, and we're never done learning. And
then and to be open to that and humbled by it,
I think is really beautiful and the opportunity. So I
have become so aware of this as the decades continued
(40:36):
to unfold. Your seventh awareness is time is our most
precious currency.
Speaker 4 (40:41):
Yeah, this one, this one hits home and it's a
It's an emotional one in some ways to especially having
had a cancer experience in recent years. I came to
this one because after I had been not drinking for
a year, I realized I had all this time.
Speaker 3 (41:00):
Yeah, you talk about how much time you were spending
on that cover, and then I, it's crazy you don't.
Speaker 4 (41:06):
I didn't really think about it. But you know, there's
an hour two having a drink or two, and then
there's that hour two you're not doing anything else other
than maybe watching something or I don't know what you're doing.
And then the next day isn't really all engines firing
until an hour or two after waking up. And I
did the math. It's about three hours every twenty four
hour cycle. If you've got a light casual drinking habit,
which adds up to over a thousand hours a year,
(41:28):
and I realized, like, yeah, actually I do have more time,
and I'll put as a footnote there, and more money.
It's another kind of unexpected side effect of pausing a
lot of dimmers. But I think, you know, going back
to the third awareness, which is linked to this one
in some ways around intuition, it's really wonderful to arrive
in a place where we realize we can be a
(41:49):
little bit more intentional with our time and really be
thoughtful about how we want to spend it and with
whom or not. And I think you know, our phone
use is another great example here. Social media can eat
our lives. You know, I have all this wonderful data
that I share with my kids now around you know,
what is four hours on your phone translate to over
(42:10):
ten years? What did you miss out on? How do
we kind of reframe our respect relationship with this most
precious resource we have. We have no idea how much
we have left. We cannot buy or swindle anymore, no
matter what, And it's this kind of opportunity to have
(42:31):
reverence for something that we all have and it's really
up to us and how we want to use it
and spend it, particularly discretionary time. We all have to
work and take care of ourselves and each other and
all that, but it's the discretionary time that I really
try to myself be more thoughtful on how I spend
it and encourage that in my family as well.
Speaker 3 (42:50):
Yes, so much opportunity there. So the last one I
really thought was beautiful on how you situated and you
do situate it as ripples of grace, the awarenesses I
seek ways to support others.
Speaker 4 (43:04):
Yeah, I mean this one was one that required the
least translation out of the twelve steps. This is a
really natural final stepping stone on a journey like this
before maybe you start the cycle again. What can we
do to support other human beings? Figuring it out, especially
when we are in a place of I use the
(43:26):
word abundance. That could be abundance of time, It could
be abundance of money, could be abundance of talent. How
do we, you know, put back into the system what
we have benefited from. And anyone who's on a clear
life journey or you know, navigating with the aiight awarenesses,
there are tough parts and we need help and we
ask for support along the way, and that is part
(43:48):
of the you know, kind of core of this experience is,
you know, it's an inner journey. But we also can't
do these difficult things alone either. How do we pay
that forward a little bit? How can we show up
for somebody, even in just small way. For me, it's
often coffee with somebody, you know, a mom in my
community who says, Hey, I just hit perimenopause and this
white wine thing isn't working for me anymore. I know
(44:10):
you don't drink. Can we talk? Yes, I would love
to spend an hour with you. Let's go sit down
on a park bench somewhere compare notes. I mean, I
think that those are just wonderful gestures. And it's easy
in our lives today to get siloed into our me
orientation and all the things we have to do, and
it's just a it's a reminder to try to offer
up a little bit of what we've been so fortunate
(44:31):
to bring it into our own lives.
Speaker 3 (44:33):
And what I love about that is that really aligns
with my work and what's called logo therapy. Logos is
Greek for meaning, so it's really about vitalizing through meaning.
Is that it really speaks to that we are at
our best when we are serving and helping others. That
is when we are our most vivacious and vital.
Speaker 4 (44:50):
Yeah, and look what you're doing. This is amazing that
you're doing it. It's awesome. I love being a witness
to your work.
Speaker 3 (44:56):
Well, thank you well, And that brings me to my
next question. Really, you were talking about you being in
service to others, but here it is you've written a
book to help us live our bigger, better, best life
which we can immediately benefit from. But if I didn't
help situate that part of what you're also doing and
is to be able to bring forth and continue to
nurture your own mission. You're about raising awareness about and
(45:19):
taking a stand against alcohol that it is you. It
is a carcinogen. So if you could share a bit,
and we've been talking about there's lots of dimmers that
we all can opt into and use, but this particular
one has become something really important for you.
Speaker 4 (45:33):
Yeah, and just a gentle clarification, I wouldn't stand against
alcohol per se. What I am for is informed consent
with regard to alcohol. We are in the United States,
in particular, subject to a lot of lack of or
misinformation about the risks associated with alcohol because the big
(45:56):
alcohol industry and it's behemoth, a very predictable way, is
actually keeping science and research and helpful warning information out
of the public sphere for their own commercial self interests.
This infuriates me. I had been alcohol free for five
years when I had my breast cancer diagnosis, and it
was only in researching what may have contributed to my
(46:19):
cancer that I unearthed that alcohol is a Group one
carcinogen alongside tobacco and asbestos. At that point two years ago,
less than half of Americans knew that the percentage is
gradually increasing, in large part thank you to doctor Bevivec
Mertis US Surgeon General's report on the topic in January
of twenty five. But we have a long way to go,
(46:42):
and in my work with the United States Alcohol Policy Alliance,
which is a Washington, d c. Based nonprofit really working
to help increase awareness and understanding around the risks and
make alcohol less of a harmful feature of our culture,
I'd see a lot of room for us to improve
in this space. I thank you for bringing it up.
I do invite people to be informed. Do the research
(47:07):
be one of informed consent when you put things into
your body?
Speaker 3 (47:11):
Yeah? Back on the consumption, choice of consumption, I choose
what to consume. Yeah, so it goes by so fast, Cescily,
this has been amazing. We're regarding your aid awarenesses and
stepping into this fuller experience of life and expression of life.
What would you like to leave listeners with today?
Speaker 4 (47:28):
Such a good question. I think the one that I
come back to a lot in my community and myself
is listen to yourself. We all know when there's something
that needs to shift or change or evolve, and it's
really easy to find a way to kind of dim
out that guidance. And I just encourage us all to
tune in trust ourselves. We actually know what changes or
(47:50):
evolutions we want to make, and that guidance is really
really valuable wisdom that can help us kind of get
our life back onto an orientation that feels better.
Speaker 3 (48:01):
You know, I really I want to echo that, Cecily.
There is just so much information, data, wisdom available when
we learn how to really tap into it. And I
love that your messages for us. If we remove those
dimmers with much greater access to all of that. Yes, absolutely,
very grateful that when I reach out to you on
LinkedIn saying hey, I've got this podcast, I want you
(48:23):
to come on and talk about your book, that you
didn't just ignore it, but you responded with a yes. Cecily,
thank you so much for writing your beautiful book sharing
it with the world. I get to be one of
the first readers and coming then working on a purpose
to talk about it. It's been an honor to have
you on.
Speaker 4 (48:37):
Oh the honor is mine and I'm so grateful for
the work that you're doing, an impact you're having, and
thank you for inviting me. Thank you for sending the note.
Maybe I'll just reach out to people we want to
connect with a little bit more.
Speaker 3 (48:48):
Absolutely delighted. Yes, anybody that you think I should talk to,
And likewise, well I'll say that I want to talk
that you think I should talk to, just send them
my way made the introduction. I'm in. I trust your
judgment and your intuition. Awesome than listeners and viewers, you
are going to want to learn more about Cecily mac
the work she does at Wisdom Ventures, and her new
book Ondemmable. You can start by visiting her website at
(49:09):
cecilymac dot com and let me spell that for you.
It's cecil Y mak cecilymac dot com. Next week, we'll
be on the air with Lamel mc morris talking about
his new book, The Power to Persist, Eight simple habits
to build lifelong resilience. See you then, and together, let's
lean in and learn how to create destination workplaces where
(49:30):
people thrive grow into their higher potential, all while doing
business that betters the world. Let's work on Purpose.
Speaker 2 (49:39):
We hope you've enjoyed this week's program. Be sure to
tune into Working on Purpose featuring your host, doctor Elise Cortes,
each week on W four C Why Together, we'll create
a world where business operates conscientiously, Leadership inspires and passion performance,
and employees are fulfilled in work that provides the meaning
and purpose they crave. See you there, Let's work on Purpose.
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