John MacDonald: Spend up large on defence, we have no choice

Spend up large. That’s my message to the Government. Go large, spend up big and drag our military into the 21st century.

That’s not me having a go at the military, by the way. Anyone reading this at Burnham Camp, for example, might feel like I’m having a go at them. But I’m not.

But, what I am saying, is that we need to be spending more on defence - and I’m not saying that just because of what’s going on out in the Tasman, with those three warships from China.

A situation that went next level on Friday and over the weekend, with the live firing exercises.

I say next level - but we also need to remember that China isn't breaking any laws. It’s fully entitled to have those ships there because they’re in international waters.

My view last week was that we needed to calm the farm about the ships being out there. It wasn’t time for us to start banging on the table and getting on the blower to Beijing and giving China’s president what-for.

And I’m not saying this just because of what’s been happening over the weekend - but I agree with Defence Minister Judith Collins when she says we have no choice but to to invest heavily in our defence forces.

And she says it won’t just  be a one-off investment, either. 

Over  time, it will be billions of dollars. As she pointed out on Newstalk ZB today, successive government over the last 30 years have underinvested in the military. 

And Judith Collins says defence personnel are up for it. But are you up for it?

Because it’s very easy to say ‘oh yeah, buy more planes, buy more ships etc", but when you ask people where the money's going to come from, they don’t have an easy answer to that question.

Reason being: there isn’t an easy answer.

What do you spend less on So more money can go into the army, navy and air force?

Finance minister Nicola Willis will give us a bit of an answer to that when she delivers this year’s Budget in a few months. 

But, right now, the bigger question is whether we support the idea of the government pouring a truckload more money into our military. I do.

There will be people who don’t. But, according to one defence expert, what happened on Friday and over the weekend might actually it an easier sell for the Government.

This is Professor David Capie from the Centre for Strategic Studies at Victoria University.

He’s saying that the live firing exercises forcing commercial airlines to divert to avoid the area makes the situation much more significant than it was last week.

And he’s going as far as saying that the warships are “a gift from Beijing” to our government, to help it convince us of the need to spend more on defence.

I’m convinced already. But what about you?

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Canterbury Mornings podcast with John McDonald
from News Talk ZB.

Speaker 2 (00:13):
Spend up large, Judith, spend up large. That's my message
to the Defense Minister this morning. Go large, spin up big,
spend up big, and drag military into the twenty first century.
That's not me having to go at the military. By
the way, anyone listening to this at Burnham Camp, for example,

(00:34):
you might feel like I'm having to go at you,
but I'm not. What I am saying, though, is that
we need to be spending way more on defense. And
I'm not saying that just because of what's going on
in the Tasman at the moment with the three warships
from China, which was being reported last week. The situation
went next level on Friday and over the weekend with

(00:54):
the live firing exercises. Now I say, I say next level,
but we also need to remember that China isn't breaking
any laws here. It's fully entitled to have those ships
out there because it's international waters. But when one of
the kids saw flashed across the news on Friday night
and showed it to me, this is the news about

(01:15):
the flight heading to christ Church having to divert. Well,
that's when I realized that it was more provocative than
perhaps I thought. My view last week was that we
needed to calm farm about the ships being out there.
You know, it's not the time to be banging on
the table, not the time to be getting on the
blome of Beijing and giving China as president what for.

(01:39):
And I'm not saying that we need to invest more
in our military just because of what's been happening over
the weekend. But I agree with Judith Collins when she
says we have no choice, no choice but to invest
heavily in our defense horses. And she says it won't
but it won't just be a one off investment either.
Here's a bit of what she told Mike about it
earlier this morning.

Speaker 3 (02:00):
It's a sustained effort, as what I can tell you,
and it is a lot of money. It's a money,
but it will also we also know that the world
is changing, and we also need to be to look
at that again and say do we need to do
more again?

Speaker 2 (02:16):
And of course I might try to find out how
much money the government is likely to be allocating to
defense and this year's budget she gave it. She had
a little clue have listened.

Speaker 3 (02:25):
Everything in defense is expensive, and clearly there are billions involved.
It is simply not credible for us to expect defense
to keep on going after they've had, you know, is
centrally thirty five years of every government hoping that everything's
just going to be fine and they wouldn't need to
do anything. It is an enormous task to rebuild and

(02:48):
our people are doing that.

Speaker 2 (02:50):
So billions of dollars, no surprises there, really, and as
she says, it won't all be in one lump sum,
but this will be a lot of money, probably over
a long time because, as she pointed out to my
successive governments over the last thirty years or so have
under invest in the military here in New Zealand, and
Judith Collins says, our defense personnel are up for it,

(03:14):
but are you up for it? Because it's very easy
to say, oh yeah, yeah, yeah, buy more planes, buy
more ships, et cetera, cetera. Easy to say that, but
when you when you ask people where the money is
going to come from, they don't have an easy answer
to that question, do they reason? Being there isn't an
easy answer, you know, what do you spend less on
or what do you spend nothing on so you can

(03:35):
spend more money and turn to defense. Spend more money
into the put more money into the army, maybe in
the air Force. Now, Finance Minister Nichola Willis will give
us a bit of an answer to that when she
delivers this. She has budget in a few months. But
right now, the bigger question right now is whether we
support the idea of the government pouring a truckload more
money into our military. I do. I do support it.

(03:58):
There'll be people who don't. But according to one defense expert,
what happened on Friday and over the weekend might actually
make it an easier sell for the government. This is
Professor David Cape from the Center for Strategic Studies at
Victoria University, and now he's saying today that the live
firing exercises for forcing the planes to divert all that
trauma makes the situation much more significant than it was

(04:22):
last week. And he's going as far as saying today
that the warships are quote a gift from Beijing. They're
a gift from Beijing to our government to help it
convince us of the need to spend more on defense. Well,
I'll tell you what I'm convinced already.

Speaker 1 (04:40):
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