This week on Politics Friday, Labour’s Megan Woods and National’s Matt Doocey joined John to dig into some of the biggest political stories of the week.
On the agenda was the proposed road user charges system – will it work? Is it fair? Can National and Labour agree on an infrastructure plan to ensure things get finished? And is importing LNG a longterm solution? What does the former Energy Minister make of National’s plans?
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Canterbury Morning's Podcast with John McDonald
from News Talk ZB.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
You imagine going to a pub and you go into
the beer garden. It's a beautiful day day like it
is today, and you take your drink out there and
maybe maybe your burger and chips, and then some sod
sits down next to you and lights up a cigarette.
You can ruin the whole experience. When you say we
could ruin the whole experience, Megan Woods.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
I don't know that you can do that in New
Zealand anymore, can you?
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Well? Outside you can? I see? And in the UK
and the UK your friend Keir Starmer, he's trying to
ban that. He wants no smoking in outdoor areas of pubs.
He wants no smoking outside sports stadiums, outside restaurants and
outside hospitals. One now from now we're going to talk
about that and find out whether we should do the
same sort of thing here. I'm tempted to ask our
(00:56):
politicians what they think. I'm going to just off off
off the top of my head. Matt Doocy, morning to you.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
Good morning, John morning.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Megan.
Speaker 5 (01:04):
Hey, Look, come when you started saying about going to
a pub and a bear garden.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
It was a field trip this morning.
Speaker 4 (01:12):
John.
Speaker 5 (01:13):
I was like, man, I'll come twice a week if
that's on offer.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
I'll tell you what it's my kind of field trip.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
Or yeah, but it's not eleven o'clock yet, lads to
take o'clock somewhere.
Speaker 5 (01:24):
I was going to say, John, as New Zealand's first
Minister for Hospitality, Actually I think you pose a good question.
I'd say it's probably down to the business owner. Because
we have all got many years of experience of being
in pubs where people smoked. I don't think we thought
probably twice of it at the time, but you're quite
rightly raised. Now when someone smokes near you, you can
(01:46):
smell it more. I would say it's probably in the
pub owners to actually ensure that people don't smoke in
their beer garden, but ultimately up to them if they
want customers coming back.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
What do you say you would expect pub owners to
do that?
Speaker 5 (01:59):
No, I'd say probably Now, if I was sitting there
and someone was smoking, probably heavily next to me, I
would probably move or or go somewhere else.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
Right, So you think it's a good move what they're
doing in the UK or want to do in the UK.
Speaker 5 (02:10):
Yeah, it was always difficult when the government decides to intervene,
and I suppose people don't like being told what to do,
But I would actually say it's up to the pub
owner about what sort of environment they want in their
big garden.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
What do they mean?
Speaker 3 (02:23):
Well, I think probably the fact I thought that that
was the case anyway, I think shows that a lot
of pub owners here are making the decision not to
allow people to smoke, so that that's being decided anyway.
I haven't thought to deeply about it, John, It's just
something that you've sprung on.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
Oh yeah, I know that.
Speaker 4 (02:41):
Sorry.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
I think that's probably I mean ed a minimum, Probably
you'd want to have areas so that people could choose
whether or not they were going to be next to
someone who was smoking. But I think the fact that
I just assumed that was the case in New Zealand
just shows that most most bar owners and pub owners
are already making that decision.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
All right, we'll find out what people think. And we
talked about it after eleven or not about.
Speaker 5 (03:03):
Those days when you used to go on a plane
and there was a Zarba tree line between the Smocrat
section and the non and.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
Everyone just put up with it and and it Well.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
When I was at primary school, one of the jobs
we had when we were on staff room duty was
to empty the empty the s trays and one of
one of the teachers smoked in the classroom.
Speaker 2 (03:24):
Brilliant.
Speaker 4 (03:25):
What type of school did he go to?
Speaker 5 (03:27):
Megan?
Speaker 2 (03:27):
So europe very good school, European. All right, let's get
back to the topic at hand, which is the road
user charging regime that the government's talking about within three
years time time for petrol vehicles. Megan, it seems to
me that the opposition parties are struggling to criticize this.
Speaker 4 (03:45):
Well.
Speaker 3 (03:46):
I mean I think, I mean we talked about bringing
in road user charges for EV's as well. I drive
an EV and I quite happily pay my road user
charge because I use the roads. I think we are
the real rub and we're the questions are going to
be is what does that transition look like. I think
the people that have got really stung by the regime
the current government has bored and as people who drive
(04:07):
plug in hybrids, so they're paying both petrol tax and
road user charges, and I don't think that we've got
that right. The question I have though, is making sure
that we get our field deal down here in the
South Island. We've only got if we're going to use
this money to fund roads. In terms of the roads
of national significance, only two of them are in the
(04:28):
South Island, and we need to ensure that that money
is being spread equitably around the country. And we've had
the situation just like Brown Straight Upgrade for example, that's
been cut and that money has been reallocated to North
Island projects. So I want to the way no matter
how you collect the money, the concern for me is
that we're not getting left out.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
You don't worry about brom Street, because.
Speaker 5 (04:50):
I worry about I sometimes wonder how you can drive
straight after your last government cutting all the roads.
Speaker 4 (05:04):
I was just going to bypas.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
I'm just going to intervene here now. I'm going to
turn microphones off of your talk over each other because
it's very unpleasant because then I have to talk over
it and people think, what the hell is this? So
we're going to eliminate the circus right now, Is it
all right? Agreed?
Speaker 3 (05:18):
Agreed?
Speaker 2 (05:18):
John fantastic Principal McDonald. So don't worry about bram Street
because the government's going to make it a minute quicker
to get there from Roliston, So don't worry about that.
They've got they've got it in hand. It's under control.
Matt Doocy, what's going to happen with the tax because
that's the question. What's that reference to?
Speaker 5 (05:36):
Is that raising the speed limit to on the Southern Motorway?
How well has that been received by Cantabrian badly looking
forward to that being potentially in Northern Corridor. And how
about that new road the Wooden biopass set the last
way the government cut and then cynically reannounced just before
they went into an election.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
Megan's got a hand up.
Speaker 3 (05:54):
Good morning, Megan, Thank you, mister McDonald's. So yeah, I
think you're absolutely right. So you get to get to
bram Street a minute quicker and the traffic is all
piled up as you come off. This safety crossing from
Collins Street to Simeon Street is absolutely critical. Two thirds
of the kids who go to Eddington School live on
the other side of Brahm Street. We had put the
(06:16):
money in, the project had started in this government cut it.
But one of the other questions on my handstill up, John.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
You just need hold hand Upay it need to go there?
Speaker 3 (06:27):
Call it well, you can go man, I'll just carry on.
But of the one of the things I'm hearing a
lot is that the Wooden Bypass is going to be
a toll road. So one of the two roads that
we're getting in the South Island, I'm hearing a lot
of cheddar it's going to be a toll road. Can
you rule that out?
Speaker 5 (06:43):
Well, as you know, this current government is actually doing
what it said it would do and were still on
a policy that I n ZTA recommends that Ron's or
the roads of National Significance are a toll road, we
will accept that. And as you say, that might be
the new Belfast Pegasus Motorway including the wood End Bypass.
(07:05):
And since that was on the front page to the paper,
do you know how many people have approached me about
that my electorate, Megan, not one, all right, because most
people know that if that means it's going to happen
unlike under the last government, and it will be built
to a high quality on time, they're happy for that.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
Question is the fuel tax is that going to go
at the same time as the road. Who's a charge
comes in for petrol? Vehicles.
Speaker 5 (07:28):
Yeah, so you're going to see that being phased in
and what does that mean. Yeah, well the Transport Minister
said that he will be announcing detail, so I'm not
going to get ahead of him.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
There could be a time where you pay roads well, and.
Speaker 5 (07:41):
I'm going to leave it to Sammy and Brown to
make the announcement. And don't you start injecting your views
into the void there.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
John, as a hospital pass i've ever heard, but.
Speaker 4 (07:52):
We will announce the detail.
Speaker 5 (07:53):
But to your first question to Megan, there is a
level of consensus around this. So when Labor talked about
it in government, we were supportive of it. And I
think most people would say it is fear moving to
rucks ultimately e rut and that is a better level
playing field for motorists.
Speaker 2 (08:09):
And Megan Woods is laughing her face off because Matt said,
what's our topic next? And I said, bipartisan approach to
infrastructure planning. The fact that you just roared laughing, Megan,
does that say that you think it's a pipe dream?
Speaker 4 (08:22):
Now she's a disruptive student.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
No, no, No, What I thought is we could just
continue the agreement on everything and this session as well. John,
was my thought is.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
The government dreaming thinking, you guys are going to hold
hands over next thirty years for infrastructure planning.
Speaker 3 (08:39):
Don't have a problem with the idea. We've got to
do long term planning around infrastructure. And in fact, we'd
started setting up a National Infrastructure Agency so we could
do that. So have absolutely no problem with that. And
we have to do it as a country that we
can't make infrastructure decisions in three year cycles. It's too short.
The problem that we have with us is when someone
(09:00):
gets up and announces that there's a bipartisan approach to
infrastructure and they haven't talked to the opposition. It's like
booking the church before sending out.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
I saw you, I saw I saw Barbara Edmonds banging
on about that.
Speaker 3 (09:12):
Now, the far reasonship is actually about doing things in
a different way, and I think you really do have to.
It's not just you know, a six monthly meeting where
you get briefed on what's happening. It is actually about
bringing parties together from across the Parliament and actually finding
a way that you can agree on no matter who
the government is. But that can't just be one party
(09:35):
telling the others what it is.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
Now, do see a bit rich for you guys. Do
this so you know, after spend the last few months
ripping up a whole lot of things the last government
started and got on with, then say, oh, now we're
going to start again and we're all going to work together.
High expectations.
Speaker 5 (09:48):
No, I think we've been very clear there's classically going
to be things you're not going to agree on. I
think of the approach we've taken in mental health, taking
a bipartisan approach with the cross party group. What you
do is you come together and work out what you're
not going to agree on, and work out what your
areas of common now are and then focus on them first.
(10:08):
I think there's huge areas of commonality. But I think
you've heard from Megan and also Barbara already that they're
starting to push back with that approach. But the invite
is genuine, and I think from Chris Bishop, the Infrastructure Minister,
to get all the parties together and work out what
they can agree on, and I'd encourage that be the
first step, because as Meghan alluded to, we're a small country.
(10:31):
We can't have these three year cycles chopping and changing.
Of alluded to what happened in the wood and bypass.
We need some long term planning and we're going to
hopefully get that for thirty years, and the more parties
we can get on board, the better for New Zealand's productivity.
Speaker 2 (10:45):
You had any gags on the old Cabinet WhatsApp group
about Chris Bishop looking like Tony Robins at that announcement
the other day with a headset on. It looked like
it was a motivational speaker.
Speaker 5 (10:56):
I was going to ask who Tony Robbins was, but
he must be a motivational speaker.
Speaker 2 (11:01):
Yeah, he's made gazillion's motivational talks. Anyways, a big headset
like Sisip was wearing the other.
Speaker 5 (11:07):
Yeah, I'd probably call it a Bobby Brown's.
Speaker 3 (11:12):
Makeup, isn't it, Matt.
Speaker 5 (11:13):
Bobby Brown used to walk around with a headset on.
Speaker 2 (11:16):
He does kind of Yeah.
Speaker 5 (11:17):
I could see you singing along to Bobby Brown John.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Showing your age, Megan being a former energy minister yourself.
Is the government doing enough to try and get cheaper
power prices.
Speaker 5 (11:29):
No.
Speaker 3 (11:30):
One of the things that I'm really really disappointed about
is Simeon Brown has explicitly said he hasn't asked for
any advice other than aling imports. Now, aling is an
extraordinarily expensive way to generate electricity. You're talking about two
hundred somewhere between two hundred and three hundred dollars a
megawa hour to produce our electricity from importing look fi
(11:54):
natural gas. We have the potential in New Zealand, through solar,
through hydro, through wind, to produce some of the cheapest
electricity in the world. We've got to find a way
to affirm that. We've got to find a way to
renewably store it. We've got to do those things. But
New Zealanders are missing out if we think that we're
going to keep producing electricity from the most expensive sources,
(12:18):
which are fossil fuels, we are consigning ourselves to our
businesses facing costs they don't need to and households potentially
having higher power bills. I mean, solar is an untapped
resource in New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
So why didn't you do anything about it?
Speaker 3 (12:33):
We did, we did, John, Why.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
Didn't you make it compository for all new bills to
have solar panels?
Speaker 3 (12:38):
So Labor at the last election head a policy around
solar that that was the next thing that we were
rolling out and it was about helping households to get
more solar into them, so we were. But the thing is,
in order to unleash that potential, you've got to find
a way to store. Now we have the New Zealand
Battery project. This government canceled it. They said they didn't
want onslow. That's fine, but they threw the baby out
(12:59):
with the bath water. They threw away all the work
that was happening on storage and no new work has
been started. This is neglijunts on the part of the government.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
I was talking to someone last night. Granted it was
at the pub, but.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
He were you outside and where he's smoking?
Speaker 2 (13:15):
The conversation was smoking But I tell it, but he
but he's an academic and he was quoting another academic.
Who what do you mean by that? Well, I will
listen to what you have to say. John.
Speaker 5 (13:25):
Sometimes we're having I'm.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
Still getting excuses.
Speaker 4 (13:32):
I was waiting for the dog ate my homework.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
Here's the whole here's the headline.
Speaker 3 (13:36):
You haven't even done the homework.
Speaker 4 (13:40):
We're cleaning up the mess.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
Who left Megan, Cabinet minister, this is academics. There's the headline. Well, anyway,
he was telling me that an expert was telling him
that it is on hold on, and this other guy
told the academic, and the guy who was telling him
to a pub, he made a broadcaster exactly what happened.
And what happened he told me that actually burning coal
(14:03):
to generate electricity is more environmental but more are mentally
friendly than using looking finatural gas.
Speaker 4 (14:09):
Yeah. Look, I'm not going to compete.
Speaker 5 (14:11):
With academic who's been informed by an expert while talking
to a broadcaster at a pub. But what I can
say is LNG is probably a better option, I think,
especially when you look at the prices of electricity in
New Zealand at the moment after you know the mess
we're left by the last government.
Speaker 4 (14:29):
And the huge and dirty Indonesian hole.
Speaker 5 (14:33):
So look, we are where we are, and I think, well,
I thought we had to put our hand up in
this class.
Speaker 4 (14:40):
Favorite in the front of the class.
Speaker 5 (14:44):
Mean brought you on apple, right, But clearly we are in
a difficult situation in part of the ban of the
aill and gas.
Speaker 4 (14:53):
What it sent is a signal.
Speaker 5 (14:54):
Around the world that we weren't open to investment and
that's really impacted on our sovereign risk. And look, you
know we can come up with all the ideas now.
Speaker 4 (15:06):
But as you shoot it back to.
Speaker 5 (15:07):
The last government had six years and did very little
other than just banning something. We didn't have a clear plan.
That's what Simeon Brown has outlined our way forward.
Speaker 4 (15:19):
Now.
Speaker 5 (15:19):
It'll be a range of instruments and mechanisms. LG is
one of them. But I'll tell you what if the government.
One final point, John, the heartbreaking point now is we
are saying we are seeing businesses who are exercising their
right through private capital and deciding to close down their businesses,
(15:41):
which is going to mean a loss of jobs because
there is no surety of energy and moving their private
capital offshore. And that's why internationally private capital says we're
not going to invest in New Zealand because you've got
energy issues. And that is the legacy of the last
Labor government.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
So if the government, if the government believes that this
is the right thing to do, why isn't the government
putting any money into it? Well, why you're not investing
in it?
Speaker 5 (16:06):
Well, what we're creating the settings at the moment we've
reversed the oil and gas ban, We're empowering LNG to
be coming into the country. We're looking at the regulation
for the electricity sector as well. We are going to
pull all the levers open to us and we will
step through them.
Speaker 2 (16:25):
Job. But pulling levers is not having skin in the game.
It's the same as canning Brahm Street, not spending money
on Brahmstreet, but telling people that can drive ten cos
faster on the motorway. But John, it's easy to do.
Speaker 5 (16:35):
The problem with the proposition you have is it's all
about just putting money somewhere.
Speaker 4 (16:42):
It's not.
Speaker 5 (16:43):
The last government proved that it's coming up with the problem,
definition and the solution and then financially sustainably funding it,
not just saying let's throw money at it and see
if it sticks.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
It's a very good the last game to prove that
was wrong. That's a very good point, Megan.
Speaker 3 (16:58):
So I'm just going to pick the greatest things that
were wrong with what Matt said there. To say that
there has been no investment, yes I am, and it's
a d or it's actually an f Matt to say
there has been no investment in oil and gas is wrong,
and let's have this debate based on the facts. Over
(17:18):
a billion dollars has been invested in the exploration of
oil and guests since twenty eighteen in the existing purpose
the permits. The reality that New Zealanders have to face
is we do not have this eldorado of guests out there.
This government is living in fantasy land. It is looking
to the past and it is consigning our businesses and
our workers to an insecure future. They have scrapped all
(17:41):
the partnerships that we were doing with businesses to secure
those jobs. Look at what we did with New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (17:49):
It's trying to sound like election campaign.
Speaker 3 (17:52):
No, but John, you let met go for a very
long time there. To say they have a plan is
absolute is absolute nonsense. We have not heard one thing
from Simmy and Brown which is how New Zealand will
get on the right path with us. He's taking up backwards.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
Matt Douci. Isn't it ridiculous? And we're going to talk
about nonsense. Isn't it nonsensical? This last minute changed the
government's made to its anti gang legislation, which is going
to make it illegal for repeat crims to have gang
patches in their homes. I've got a question for you.
Would you rather that the police spent their time in
resources and energy looking for gang patches and someone's draw
(18:28):
or they hanky draw at home? Would rather they spend
time and resources on cracking down on the serious criminal
activity that gangs are involved in.
Speaker 5 (18:36):
Well, operationally, the police will make that decision and that
trade off. What is our role as government, Well, it's
to do not The question is rather I'm going to
answer it. The role of government is to deliver what
we said we would. We said we would give the
police every tool available to them to disrupt gang activity.
(18:59):
That's why we see what happened in christ Church in
the last forty eight hours. And how good are our
police now out and disrupting our police Now, if part
of the package of disrupting a gang is going in
to ensure they have no gang patches in their houses,
well let's give them the tools.
Speaker 4 (19:17):
To do that.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
Trem On dream On, Well.
Speaker 5 (19:21):
I think you'd probably be out of step with most
Contabrians with that comic. God want the police to have
every tool to disrupt gangs at every point of their
illegal activity.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
Oh, one hundred eighty ten is under call course right now.
We'll get to you as soon as we finish up
one at Politics Friday, do you think it's nuts that
the police are going to be searching for gang patches
and hanky draws? Megan, what do you think?
Speaker 3 (19:43):
I think that Met's just told us this is a
whole lot of virtue signaling. He said that operationally that's
over to the police to do, but they'll make the
laws because they said in their election manifesto they were
do we really want our cops going through someone's underwear
d're looking for a gang patch? Or do we want
to see what we saw happen here in Canterbury in
(20:03):
the last few days absol and that was the result
of work that we put in place in twenty twenty two.
You're stealing homework now, absolutely not bringing together the into agency.
If you are going to crack down on the gangs,
you've got to come at this from every angle. It's
not rummaging through their SoC or Undy drawer. It's about
(20:25):
looking at where the money's flowing. It's about looking at
all those things and bringing the agencies together. No one
can kid themselves at what the police and it was
remarkable and I want to commend the Canterbury Police for
what they did. No one can kid themselves that that's
the kind of operation that springs up in weeks or months,
that is years of hard work from the police.
Speaker 4 (20:45):
That gets to be expectation from the policeman to authorize
the police to do what they're there to do.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
I'm just going to do see see, I threatened, I threatened.
I said, I'll do it. I'll put the microphones back
on to say.
Speaker 4 (20:59):
Put her in detention, teacher.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
Have a fantastic weekend. Have a fantastic weekend. Hegan Politics Friday,
back the same time next week.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
For more from Category Mornings with John McDonald, listen live
to news Talks It'd be Christchurch from nine am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Canterbury Morning's Podcast with John McDonald
from News Talk ZB.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
You imagine going to a pub and you go into
the beer garden. It's a beautiful day day like it
is today, and you take your drink out there and
maybe maybe your burger and chips, and then some sod
sits down next to you and lights up a cigarette.
You can ruin the whole experience. When you say we
could ruin the whole experience, Megan Woods.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
I don't know that you can do that in New
Zealand anymore, can you?
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Well? Outside you can? I see? And in the UK
and the UK your friend Keir Starmer, he's trying to
ban that. He wants no smoking in outdoor areas of pubs.
He wants no smoking outside sports stadiums, outside restaurants and
outside hospitals. One now from now we're going to talk
about that and find out whether we should do the
same sort of thing here. I'm tempted to ask our
(00:56):
politicians what they think. I'm going to just off off
off the top of my head. Matt Doocy, morning to you.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
Good morning, John morning.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
Megan.
Speaker 5 (01:04):
Hey, Look, come when you started saying about going to
a pub and a bear garden.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
It was a field trip this morning.
Speaker 4 (01:12):
John.
Speaker 5 (01:13):
I was like, man, I'll come twice a week if
that's on offer.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
I'll tell you what it's my kind of field trip.
Speaker 3 (01:19):
Or yeah, but it's not eleven o'clock yet, lads to
take o'clock somewhere.
Speaker 5 (01:24):
I was going to say, John, as New Zealand's first
Minister for Hospitality, Actually I think you pose a good question.
I'd say it's probably down to the business owner. Because
we have all got many years of experience of being
in pubs where people smoked. I don't think we thought
probably twice of it at the time, but you're quite
rightly raised. Now when someone smokes near you, you can
(01:46):
smell it more. I would say it's probably in the
pub owners to actually ensure that people don't smoke in
their beer garden, but ultimately up to them if they
want customers coming back.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
What do you say you would expect pub owners to
do that?
Speaker 5 (01:59):
No, I'd say probably Now, if I was sitting there
and someone was smoking, probably heavily next to me, I
would probably move or or go somewhere else.
Speaker 2 (02:06):
Right, So you think it's a good move what they're
doing in the UK or want to do in the UK.
Speaker 5 (02:10):
Yeah, it was always difficult when the government decides to intervene,
and I suppose people don't like being told what to do,
But I would actually say it's up to the pub
owner about what sort of environment they want in their
big garden.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
What do they mean?
Speaker 3 (02:23):
Well, I think probably the fact I thought that that
was the case anyway, I think shows that a lot
of pub owners here are making the decision not to
allow people to smoke, so that that's being decided anyway.
I haven't thought to deeply about it, John, It's just
something that you've sprung on.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
Oh yeah, I know that.
Speaker 4 (02:41):
Sorry.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
I think that's probably I mean ed a minimum, Probably
you'd want to have areas so that people could choose
whether or not they were going to be next to
someone who was smoking. But I think the fact that
I just assumed that was the case in New Zealand
just shows that most most bar owners and pub owners
are already making that decision.
Speaker 2 (02:59):
All right, we'll find out what people think. And we
talked about it after eleven or not about.
Speaker 5 (03:03):
Those days when you used to go on a plane
and there was a Zarba tree line between the Smocrat
section and the non and.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
Everyone just put up with it and and it Well.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
When I was at primary school, one of the jobs
we had when we were on staff room duty was
to empty the empty the s trays and one of
one of the teachers smoked in the classroom.
Speaker 2 (03:24):
Brilliant.
Speaker 4 (03:25):
What type of school did he go to?
Speaker 5 (03:27):
Megan?
Speaker 2 (03:27):
So europe very good school, European. All right, let's get
back to the topic at hand, which is the road
user charging regime that the government's talking about within three
years time time for petrol vehicles. Megan, it seems to
me that the opposition parties are struggling to criticize this.
Speaker 4 (03:45):
Well.
Speaker 3 (03:46):
I mean I think, I mean we talked about bringing
in road user charges for EV's as well. I drive
an EV and I quite happily pay my road user
charge because I use the roads. I think we are
the real rub and we're the questions are going to
be is what does that transition look like. I think
the people that have got really stung by the regime
the current government has bored and as people who drive
(04:07):
plug in hybrids, so they're paying both petrol tax and
road user charges, and I don't think that we've got
that right. The question I have though, is making sure
that we get our field deal down here in the
South Island. We've only got if we're going to use
this money to fund roads. In terms of the roads
of national significance, only two of them are in the
(04:28):
South Island, and we need to ensure that that money
is being spread equitably around the country. And we've had
the situation just like Brown Straight Upgrade for example, that's
been cut and that money has been reallocated to North
Island projects. So I want to the way no matter
how you collect the money, the concern for me is
that we're not getting left out.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
You don't worry about brom Street, because.
Speaker 5 (04:50):
I worry about I sometimes wonder how you can drive
straight after your last government cutting all the roads.
Speaker 4 (05:04):
I was just going to bypas.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
I'm just going to intervene here now. I'm going to
turn microphones off of your talk over each other because
it's very unpleasant because then I have to talk over
it and people think, what the hell is this? So
we're going to eliminate the circus right now, Is it
all right? Agreed?
Speaker 3 (05:18):
Agreed?
Speaker 2 (05:18):
John fantastic Principal McDonald. So don't worry about bram Street
because the government's going to make it a minute quicker
to get there from Roliston, So don't worry about that.
They've got they've got it in hand. It's under control.
Matt Doocy, what's going to happen with the tax because
that's the question. What's that reference to?
Speaker 5 (05:36):
Is that raising the speed limit to on the Southern Motorway?
How well has that been received by Cantabrian badly looking
forward to that being potentially in Northern Corridor. And how
about that new road the Wooden biopass set the last
way the government cut and then cynically reannounced just before
they went into an election.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
Megan's got a hand up.
Speaker 3 (05:54):
Good morning, Megan, Thank you, mister McDonald's. So yeah, I
think you're absolutely right. So you get to get to
bram Street a minute quicker and the traffic is all
piled up as you come off. This safety crossing from
Collins Street to Simeon Street is absolutely critical. Two thirds
of the kids who go to Eddington School live on
the other side of Brahm Street. We had put the
(06:16):
money in, the project had started in this government cut it.
But one of the other questions on my handstill up, John.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
You just need hold hand Upay it need to go there?
Speaker 3 (06:27):
Call it well, you can go man, I'll just carry on.
But of the one of the things I'm hearing a
lot is that the Wooden Bypass is going to be
a toll road. So one of the two roads that
we're getting in the South Island, I'm hearing a lot
of cheddar it's going to be a toll road. Can
you rule that out?
Speaker 5 (06:43):
Well, as you know, this current government is actually doing
what it said it would do and were still on
a policy that I n ZTA recommends that Ron's or
the roads of National Significance are a toll road, we
will accept that. And as you say, that might be
the new Belfast Pegasus Motorway including the wood End Bypass.
(07:05):
And since that was on the front page to the paper,
do you know how many people have approached me about
that my electorate, Megan, not one, all right, because most
people know that if that means it's going to happen
unlike under the last government, and it will be built
to a high quality on time, they're happy for that.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
Question is the fuel tax is that going to go
at the same time as the road. Who's a charge
comes in for petrol? Vehicles.
Speaker 5 (07:28):
Yeah, so you're going to see that being phased in
and what does that mean. Yeah, well the Transport Minister
said that he will be announcing detail, so I'm not
going to get ahead of him.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
There could be a time where you pay roads well, and.
Speaker 5 (07:41):
I'm going to leave it to Sammy and Brown to
make the announcement. And don't you start injecting your views
into the void there.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
John, as a hospital pass i've ever heard, but.
Speaker 4 (07:52):
We will announce the detail.
Speaker 5 (07:53):
But to your first question to Megan, there is a
level of consensus around this. So when Labor talked about
it in government, we were supportive of it. And I
think most people would say it is fear moving to
rucks ultimately e rut and that is a better level
playing field for motorists.
Speaker 2 (08:09):
And Megan Woods is laughing her face off because Matt said,
what's our topic next? And I said, bipartisan approach to
infrastructure planning. The fact that you just roared laughing, Megan,
does that say that you think it's a pipe dream?
Speaker 4 (08:22):
Now she's a disruptive student.
Speaker 3 (08:25):
No, no, No, What I thought is we could just
continue the agreement on everything and this session as well. John,
was my thought is.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
The government dreaming thinking, you guys are going to hold
hands over next thirty years for infrastructure planning.
Speaker 3 (08:39):
Don't have a problem with the idea. We've got to
do long term planning around infrastructure. And in fact, we'd
started setting up a National Infrastructure Agency so we could
do that. So have absolutely no problem with that. And
we have to do it as a country that we
can't make infrastructure decisions in three year cycles. It's too short.
The problem that we have with us is when someone
(09:00):
gets up and announces that there's a bipartisan approach to
infrastructure and they haven't talked to the opposition. It's like
booking the church before sending out.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
I saw you, I saw I saw Barbara Edmonds banging
on about that.
Speaker 3 (09:12):
Now, the far reasonship is actually about doing things in
a different way, and I think you really do have to.
It's not just you know, a six monthly meeting where
you get briefed on what's happening. It is actually about
bringing parties together from across the Parliament and actually finding
a way that you can agree on no matter who
the government is. But that can't just be one party
(09:35):
telling the others what it is.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
Now, do see a bit rich for you guys. Do
this so you know, after spend the last few months
ripping up a whole lot of things the last government
started and got on with, then say, oh, now we're
going to start again and we're all going to work together.
High expectations.
Speaker 5 (09:48):
No, I think we've been very clear there's classically going
to be things you're not going to agree on. I
think of the approach we've taken in mental health, taking
a bipartisan approach with the cross party group. What you
do is you come together and work out what you're
not going to agree on, and work out what your
areas of common now are and then focus on them first.
(10:08):
I think there's huge areas of commonality. But I think
you've heard from Megan and also Barbara already that they're
starting to push back with that approach. But the invite
is genuine, and I think from Chris Bishop, the Infrastructure Minister,
to get all the parties together and work out what
they can agree on, and I'd encourage that be the
first step, because as Meghan alluded to, we're a small country.
(10:31):
We can't have these three year cycles chopping and changing.
Of alluded to what happened in the wood and bypass.
We need some long term planning and we're going to
hopefully get that for thirty years, and the more parties
we can get on board, the better for New Zealand's productivity.
Speaker 2 (10:45):
You had any gags on the old Cabinet WhatsApp group
about Chris Bishop looking like Tony Robins at that announcement
the other day with a headset on. It looked like
it was a motivational speaker.
Speaker 5 (10:56):
I was going to ask who Tony Robbins was, but
he must be a motivational speaker.
Speaker 2 (11:01):
Yeah, he's made gazillion's motivational talks. Anyways, a big headset
like Sisip was wearing the other.
Speaker 5 (11:07):
Yeah, I'd probably call it a Bobby Brown's.
Speaker 3 (11:12):
Makeup, isn't it, Matt.
Speaker 5 (11:13):
Bobby Brown used to walk around with a headset on.
Speaker 2 (11:16):
He does kind of Yeah.
Speaker 5 (11:17):
I could see you singing along to Bobby Brown John.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
Showing your age, Megan being a former energy minister yourself.
Is the government doing enough to try and get cheaper
power prices.
Speaker 5 (11:29):
No.
Speaker 3 (11:30):
One of the things that I'm really really disappointed about
is Simeon Brown has explicitly said he hasn't asked for
any advice other than aling imports. Now, aling is an
extraordinarily expensive way to generate electricity. You're talking about two
hundred somewhere between two hundred and three hundred dollars a
megawa hour to produce our electricity from importing look fi
(11:54):
natural gas. We have the potential in New Zealand, through solar,
through hydro, through wind, to produce some of the cheapest
electricity in the world. We've got to find a way
to affirm that. We've got to find a way to
renewably store it. We've got to do those things. But
New Zealanders are missing out if we think that we're
going to keep producing electricity from the most expensive sources,
(12:18):
which are fossil fuels, we are consigning ourselves to our
businesses facing costs they don't need to and households potentially
having higher power bills. I mean, solar is an untapped
resource in New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (12:32):
So why didn't you do anything about it?
Speaker 3 (12:33):
We did, we did, John, Why.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
Didn't you make it compository for all new bills to
have solar panels?
Speaker 3 (12:38):
So Labor at the last election head a policy around
solar that that was the next thing that we were
rolling out and it was about helping households to get
more solar into them, so we were. But the thing is,
in order to unleash that potential, you've got to find
a way to store. Now we have the New Zealand
Battery project. This government canceled it. They said they didn't
want onslow. That's fine, but they threw the baby out
(12:59):
with the bath water. They threw away all the work
that was happening on storage and no new work has
been started. This is neglijunts on the part of the government.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
I was talking to someone last night. Granted it was
at the pub, but.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
He were you outside and where he's smoking?
Speaker 2 (13:15):
The conversation was smoking But I tell it, but he
but he's an academic and he was quoting another academic.
Who what do you mean by that? Well, I will
listen to what you have to say. John.
Speaker 5 (13:25):
Sometimes we're having I'm.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
Still getting excuses.
Speaker 4 (13:32):
I was waiting for the dog ate my homework.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
Here's the whole here's the headline.
Speaker 3 (13:36):
You haven't even done the homework.
Speaker 4 (13:40):
We're cleaning up the mess.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
Who left Megan, Cabinet minister, this is academics. There's the headline. Well, anyway,
he was telling me that an expert was telling him
that it is on hold on, and this other guy
told the academic, and the guy who was telling him
to a pub, he made a broadcaster exactly what happened.
And what happened he told me that actually burning coal
(14:03):
to generate electricity is more environmental but more are mentally
friendly than using looking finatural gas.
Speaker 4 (14:09):
Yeah. Look, I'm not going to compete.
Speaker 5 (14:11):
With academic who's been informed by an expert while talking
to a broadcaster at a pub. But what I can
say is LNG is probably a better option, I think,
especially when you look at the prices of electricity in
New Zealand at the moment after you know the mess
we're left by the last government.
Speaker 4 (14:29):
And the huge and dirty Indonesian hole.
Speaker 5 (14:33):
So look, we are where we are, and I think, well,
I thought we had to put our hand up in
this class.
Speaker 4 (14:40):
Favorite in the front of the class.
Speaker 5 (14:44):
Mean brought you on apple, right, But clearly we are in
a difficult situation in part of the ban of the
aill and gas.
Speaker 4 (14:53):
What it sent is a signal.
Speaker 5 (14:54):
Around the world that we weren't open to investment and
that's really impacted on our sovereign risk. And look, you
know we can come up with all the ideas now.
Speaker 4 (15:06):
But as you shoot it back to.
Speaker 5 (15:07):
The last government had six years and did very little
other than just banning something. We didn't have a clear plan.
That's what Simeon Brown has outlined our way forward.
Speaker 4 (15:19):
Now.
Speaker 5 (15:19):
It'll be a range of instruments and mechanisms. LG is
one of them. But I'll tell you what if the government.
One final point, John, the heartbreaking point now is we
are saying we are seeing businesses who are exercising their
right through private capital and deciding to close down their businesses,
(15:41):
which is going to mean a loss of jobs because
there is no surety of energy and moving their private
capital offshore. And that's why internationally private capital says we're
not going to invest in New Zealand because you've got
energy issues. And that is the legacy of the last
Labor government.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
So if the government, if the government believes that this
is the right thing to do, why isn't the government
putting any money into it? Well, why you're not investing
in it?
Speaker 5 (16:06):
Well, what we're creating the settings at the moment we've
reversed the oil and gas ban, We're empowering LNG to
be coming into the country. We're looking at the regulation
for the electricity sector as well. We are going to
pull all the levers open to us and we will
step through them.
Speaker 2 (16:25):
Job. But pulling levers is not having skin in the game.
It's the same as canning Brahm Street, not spending money
on Brahmstreet, but telling people that can drive ten cos
faster on the motorway. But John, it's easy to do.
Speaker 5 (16:35):
The problem with the proposition you have is it's all
about just putting money somewhere.
Speaker 4 (16:42):
It's not.
Speaker 5 (16:43):
The last government proved that it's coming up with the problem,
definition and the solution and then financially sustainably funding it,
not just saying let's throw money at it and see
if it sticks.
Speaker 2 (16:54):
It's a very good the last game to prove that
was wrong. That's a very good point, Megan.
Speaker 3 (16:58):
So I'm just going to pick the greatest things that
were wrong with what Matt said there. To say that
there has been no investment, yes I am, and it's
a d or it's actually an f Matt to say
there has been no investment in oil and gas is wrong,
and let's have this debate based on the facts. Over
(17:18):
a billion dollars has been invested in the exploration of
oil and guests since twenty eighteen in the existing purpose
the permits. The reality that New Zealanders have to face
is we do not have this eldorado of guests out there.
This government is living in fantasy land. It is looking
to the past and it is consigning our businesses and
our workers to an insecure future. They have scrapped all
(17:41):
the partnerships that we were doing with businesses to secure
those jobs. Look at what we did with New Zealand.
Speaker 2 (17:49):
It's trying to sound like election campaign.
Speaker 3 (17:52):
No, but John, you let met go for a very
long time there. To say they have a plan is
absolute is absolute nonsense. We have not heard one thing
from Simmy and Brown which is how New Zealand will
get on the right path with us. He's taking up backwards.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
Matt Douci. Isn't it ridiculous? And we're going to talk
about nonsense. Isn't it nonsensical? This last minute changed the
government's made to its anti gang legislation, which is going
to make it illegal for repeat crims to have gang
patches in their homes. I've got a question for you.
Would you rather that the police spent their time in
resources and energy looking for gang patches and someone's draw
(18:28):
or they hanky draw at home? Would rather they spend
time and resources on cracking down on the serious criminal
activity that gangs are involved in.
Speaker 5 (18:36):
Well, operationally, the police will make that decision and that
trade off. What is our role as government, Well, it's
to do not The question is rather I'm going to
answer it. The role of government is to deliver what
we said we would. We said we would give the
police every tool available to them to disrupt gang activity.
(18:59):
That's why we see what happened in christ Church in
the last forty eight hours. And how good are our
police now out and disrupting our police Now, if part
of the package of disrupting a gang is going in
to ensure they have no gang patches in their houses,
well let's give them the tools.
Speaker 4 (19:17):
To do that.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
Trem On dream On, Well.
Speaker 5 (19:21):
I think you'd probably be out of step with most
Contabrians with that comic. God want the police to have
every tool to disrupt gangs at every point of their
illegal activity.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
Oh, one hundred eighty ten is under call course right now.
We'll get to you as soon as we finish up
one at Politics Friday, do you think it's nuts that
the police are going to be searching for gang patches
and hanky draws? Megan, what do you think?
Speaker 3 (19:43):
I think that Met's just told us this is a
whole lot of virtue signaling. He said that operationally that's
over to the police to do, but they'll make the
laws because they said in their election manifesto they were
do we really want our cops going through someone's underwear
d're looking for a gang patch? Or do we want
to see what we saw happen here in Canterbury in
(20:03):
the last few days absol and that was the result
of work that we put in place in twenty twenty two.
You're stealing homework now, absolutely not bringing together the into agency.
If you are going to crack down on the gangs,
you've got to come at this from every angle. It's
not rummaging through their SoC or Undy drawer. It's about
(20:25):
looking at where the money's flowing. It's about looking at
all those things and bringing the agencies together. No one
can kid themselves at what the police and it was
remarkable and I want to commend the Canterbury Police for
what they did. No one can kid themselves that that's
the kind of operation that springs up in weeks or months,
that is years of hard work from the police.
Speaker 4 (20:45):
That gets to be expectation from the policeman to authorize
the police to do what they're there to do.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
I'm just going to do see see, I threatened, I threatened.
I said, I'll do it. I'll put the microphones back
on to say.
Speaker 4 (20:59):
Put her in detention, teacher.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
Have a fantastic weekend. Have a fantastic weekend. Hegan Politics Friday,
back the same time next week.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
For more from Category Mornings with John McDonald, listen live
to news Talks It'd be Christchurch from nine am weekdays,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
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