John MacDonald was joined this morning by Megan Woods and Vanessa Weenink, to delve into some of the biggest issues of the week.
It’s been a big week for Weenink, who holds the electorate seat for Banks Peninsula – she gave an update on the State of Emergency in the area, and her thoughts on the response.
Pay equity was the big topic of the week – it's been revealed National Party members were told about the plan last week – how did Weenink feel at the time?
And David Parker believes it’s time for MMP to go – does his stance hold merit?
LISTEN ABOVE
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Canterbury Mornings podcast with John McDonald
from News.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Talks, Politics, Friday Nationals, Vanessa Winning and Megan Woods. Who
got here by the skin of.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
The teeth I did Morning John, Morning Vanessa.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Traffic on Lincoln Ride was it?
Speaker 3 (00:24):
It was everyone wants to live in and they're part
of Christchurch.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
So you're a magnet.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
It's the best part of christ Church. Everyone.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Well, so it's the people that were that have been
I don't call it magnified, have been magnified by Vanessa.
They're getting pulled off in the direction on the way
to town by you, so that.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
I know it's the it's the good people of and Eddington.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Do you know what I was. I was talking to
someone who was stuck in traffic last night. They wound
down their window and it was on Durham Street. South
Man Alive. Just seems the whole cities that a standstill
at the moment.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
Yeah, Durham Street at Pekau if you're going if you're
attributing to South christ which does just get completely.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Clawed, absolutely crazy anyway, first world problems. At least we're
not sitting in somewhere that's been flooded last week, like
a lot of places in Backspinitula of Vanessa. What's been
your big the most compelling memory for you as the
local MP?
Speaker 4 (01:26):
For me, it's speaking some of the business owners that
have been deeply affected by their businesses being flooded. Some
of the farmers who have had their land and undated
and have lost dock and that's pretty really difficult for them,
and I know that people are still recovering from it.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Do you think the city has responded appropriately? Megan?
Speaker 3 (01:48):
I think in terms of Christich City, this was our
fourth wetest day, and actually I think a lot of
the particularly the Heathcuit retention basins, held up incredibly well.
When I looked at the amount of water sitting in
the sort of the horswell were grim Skies, those areas
and cook by Kurlitz Road, I mean just so much
(02:08):
water was being kept out of the rivers, which meant
it wasn't going into people's home. So I think we
can see that their infrastructure effect. Also, the flocked in
basin didn't flood. It wasn't that long ago that it
didn't have to be particularly heavy rain.
Speaker 2 (02:21):
It flocked in. It flocked in basin had flooded, that
there would be a global outcry because all the money
that was spent on the place there.
Speaker 3 (02:28):
Yeah, but I think what we can say is that
some of that work. I think that were people were
hit and Vnica's electorate outside of the city, I don't
think that held up as well.
Speaker 2 (02:39):
When you start, don't held up as well? You think
the response?
Speaker 3 (02:42):
No, No, I think that infrastructure didn't hold up as well.
I don't have a particular view on the response. I'm
not close enough to it, but what I can see,
you know, places in my electric where we've seen flooding
before didn't happen. There was a little bit in Honehey,
which has always flooded, but by and large a lot
of homes were saved by the thousands and thousands of
(03:03):
liters of water sitting in those retention bases.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
Do you think people in your electric that banks Banks Peninsula,
do you think they were underserved by the response?
Speaker 4 (03:13):
Well, first thing is I agree about because there's parts
of my electric that were protected by those water retention ponds.
And I agree the response out in Little River and
the timing of the opening of Lake Forsyth. I think
even the mayor has admitted that there's probably things that
could have been done better there and I would look
forward to the review of that and the community I
(03:34):
think are rightly asking questions.
Speaker 2 (03:38):
Do you think there were some people rightly asking questions
about Sam Broughton not being in Selwyn when he declared
the emergency and being in Wellington.
Speaker 4 (03:46):
It doesn't matter where he is. Doesn't know, No, it
doesn't matter where he is. He's a figurehead. And to
be honest, I was watching his social media and his
team were doing great updates during the day. It wasn't
until like when I saw him in the night that
I found out that he had been out of Wellington.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
I'm sorry, out of such ouda Selwyn. Yea right. Let's
move on to the big political story of the week,
the young pay equity suation. So, Vanessa, we found it
last night that national MP's were all told about this
on Sunday ahead of the announcement on Tuesday? Was that
the first you knew of it?
Speaker 4 (04:16):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (04:17):
And what was your immediate reaction?
Speaker 4 (04:20):
So immediate reaction was an emotional response. But I always
questioned my emotional responses and think, right, well, is this
something that you know? What is the reasoning behind this,
what is the underlying stuff? And so I went and
read it, and I went and read all of the
accompanying information that I could, and I saw, well, yeah,
this is not something that's going to be easy. This
is a hard decision to make, but we're making it
(04:42):
for the right reasons.
Speaker 2 (04:44):
What was that emotional response you talk about, Well.
Speaker 4 (04:46):
The emotional response was was basically an oh, hit, this
is going to be big. And that's exactly what is it.
I mean, you see the reaction and that's the same
reaction that everyone is happening.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
Did your emotional reaction was that, Oh, this is going
to be big or oh this is wrong.
Speaker 4 (05:04):
No, this is going to be big. This is going
to cause a reaction.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
Because Tracy Martin has written a piece online in the
last twenty four hours saying that people spent hours and
hundreds of hours and thousands of dollars on their claims
when the whole time the government in the background was
working on this.
Speaker 4 (05:24):
I can't deny that there are going to be a
lot of people disappointed. This is something that people have
been working on, and pay equity is still an option
for people, and still claims will still progress is that
the parameters have changed and some of the comparatives have changed,
and yes, things will have to start again, and I
know that's really hard for people.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
Did you feel about left out? Only becoming aware of
it on Sunday when it seems from a timeline I
was reading last night the government had been well. Certain
people in the government have been working on it for months.
Speaker 4 (05:55):
That's the way it works, that's the way of government.
And I accept that there are people within the cabinet
who have to make the decisions and those of us
in the background, in the backbenches are told later.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
So as a woman, you're not embarrassed. You don't think
the government in some ways doing the wrong thing for women.
Speaker 4 (06:17):
I'm proud of the government for making hard decisions and
for getting our economy where it needs to be. We've
had to deal with a heck of a mess that
was left by the profligate spending of the last government,
and so we're doing what we need to do. And
we wouldn't do this if we didn't have to.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Actually, as it saved the budget with it, is that true?
Speaker 4 (06:35):
I don't know enough about the budget.
Speaker 2 (06:37):
How much will it save?
Speaker 4 (06:38):
I don't know, because that's budget sensitive information.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
Megan Woods, how well do you think people understand what
this is all about? Because Chris Hopkins was making some
well some people say smart out at comments, you know,
robbing Paul and to pay Paul. But we well, you
guys just fanning the fire or taking advantage of We
do not really knowing what this is about.
Speaker 3 (06:56):
Absolutely not that many many, many people understand this because
they've been really involved in their own pay equity claims
that there are. So there's thirty three claims, but that
represents about one hundred and fifty thousand workers, so there's
a lot of people and look, to be perfectly frank
with you, John, a lot of this this cuts to
(07:17):
the call why a lot of us in our caucus
are in politics, so we understand it very well. It's
about people being paid fairly. And for Vanessa to say
she went away and looked at the reasons, well that
just doesn't stack up because Okay, if you think there's
a problem with the comparator, you think there's something that
can be fixed, then fix it, but leave the money
in place. What is I think the most egregious part
(07:41):
of this that this was actually about. I've seen one
estimate one estimate of taking three point eight billion dollars
that we'd set aside for settling pay equity claims and
putting it back into the pot to balance the budget.
So this is to pay for other things, things that
were put in place last budget. So these are choices
that are being made, and actually a caucus does have
(08:03):
a discussion and bank benches should have the right to
how they feel about things. That's certainly how our government worked.
So everybody has to take responsibility. You're not there in
the background. You're an elected representative for people in many
of those people are people that now will not get
money that was coming to them because the government.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Okay, okay, So I'm just going to hold you back
because you're one. Look, I said it on the week.
I thought I thought it was a cockup by the government.
All right, So I'm not having I'm not giving you
a hard time, but I also want to check that
you are not misleading people and what this is all about,
or what it was all about, or what the settlements
so far have been all about.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
No, not at all.
Speaker 2 (08:43):
So that this how come we've got people saying, oh,
you got nurses or you got teachers, think they should
be paid the same as pilots.
Speaker 3 (08:48):
Well, that's not the point of pay equity is actually
to say, right, there's some some professions, in some jobs
that people have that traditionally have been women's work, and
they are underpaid that they're not paid at the same
rate of equivalent work that is traditional be seen as
men's work. So I think the first thing to be
(09:09):
really clear on is there's both men and women working
in these undervalued professions now, because and that's why we
have the thresholds around the amount of workers. It's about saying, right,
if we were going to find a job that's an equivalent,
that we should So it's not about people being paid
the same for the same jobs.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
Just finding the equivalent job, finding the equivalent.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
And it's not easy that this is actually about, sometimes,
you know, putting right centuries of undervaluation of caring work
in particular. No one ever thought it was going to
be easy, and that is why we put in the
provision for back pain. All right, Okay, so you have
to work through this, but that was scraped as well, John.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
All right, Vanessa, I got it. We're going to move on.
But one final thing. There's talk of protests outside MP's officers,
if there's a protest outside your office, what will you
say to the people.
Speaker 4 (09:55):
Well, I'm actually not going to be there. I'm out
and about and I've got appointments and various things throughout
the electrical data. I'm not going to be there. My
staff are not going to be there either, because today
just happened to be a day that they were having
a work from home Friday Pie day.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
Coincidence, coincidence. So David Parker gave his valedictory speech the
other night and he made it very clear he doesn't
think MP has done us long term, has done us
any favors that he put the spotlight on on list MPs.
You're both electorate MPs. Meganwood's first, first of all, you
what value does a list MP bring? Oh?
Speaker 3 (10:30):
Look, I think that having a parliament that represents what
the vote was at the electorate at the.
Speaker 2 (10:35):
Amount of the question what is the value of a
listing P?
Speaker 3 (10:40):
So the value of a list ing P is it
brings the proportion in line with the vote that was cast.
Because we know.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
Through okay, let's go past it.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
We know know that you bring you bring a greater
variety of people in you have, and I think that
m MP does serve us.
Speaker 2 (10:56):
Well, but what does what does a list MP deliver
as opposed to what you guys deliver.
Speaker 3 (11:01):
So we have what we call geographic communities of interest
or electorates, so that the other people we represent. What
we can have through listing pays is we can have
people that serve communities of interest that might not necessarily
all live in one place, in one geographic location, so
different communities. It's how we've got more ethnicities represented in
(11:24):
our parliament. Often it's been through listing pays. All right,
and that's important.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
I'll try Vanessa. I think you're being a bit too
diplomatic there.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
Well, I mean, I don't know what you want me to.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
Say, John, I want you to say that list MP's
are a waste of time.
Speaker 3 (11:36):
Well I knew that's what you wanted me to say,
and it's not what I believe. So I'm not going
to say what you want because I think they're actually
having a parliament that looks like New Zealand is incredibly important.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
All right, come on, Vanessa, you're going to deliver for me.
Speaker 4 (11:49):
I'm not going to say exactly what you want, John,
but I do think that there would be an opportunity
to look at the number. Potentially, the proportion pretended at
the moment is around fifty to fifty and I wonder
if it would be better if we had a few
more constituent MPs. I'm not an expert in these things,
but I think that the size of the constituent electorates
(12:11):
have got bigger and bigger over time, and you know,
maybe it's time that we rethink that.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
So would you like a bit of a tag team
thing going on, so you get a list MP to
tag around with you?
Speaker 3 (12:22):
No, I think that actually that it's much better that
you can cover far more ground and here have different
kind of groups that get to speak directly to their
elected representatives. But the one thing I would say is,
I think we need to look at the number of
seats as South Island has. That the legislation says that
the South Island only has sixteen MPs and that's what
sets the size of electrics everywhere. That's what the original
(12:45):
legislation said. So I'm always I've always been of the
view that we probably need en I mean, this is
my very personal view. It's not the Labor Party's position,
but that we do need to look at whether or
not sixteen seats for the South Island is still fit
for purpose, because I suspect we're getting some absurdly large
geographic areas to get seventy five thousand people into some
(13:07):
of those rural South Island seats.
Speaker 2 (13:09):
So we could just trim the number of listing pays
and have more electric MPs.
Speaker 3 (13:14):
Well, I mean the question would be whether or not
you change the proportion, so you do change that balance
between constituent endlisting pays or you add to the size
of Parliament, and that would all be questions that would
have to be answered.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
Final thing to tick off with Vanessa Winnick and Meghan
Woods is the Australian election people talk about or what
lessons are there for our political parties. Let me run
this one past to you, Meghan. There's a headline in
the Australian today because the Greens. It wasn't just the
Liberals that were had hard but the Greens as well,
and the Australian is saying today the Greens have a
(13:45):
chance to grow up or disappear. I suspect that headline
might also apply similarly to the Greens Green Party here,
wouldn't you think.
Speaker 3 (13:55):
No, And I think one of the things that you see,
the relationship between parties, whether it's on the left or
the right of the political spectrum in Australia is entirely
different because they do have first past the post, so
it's a far more competitive environment between.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
Yeah, but what the but what the headline is getting
at is that the Greens in Australia have kind of
gone of course, and I think you'd have to agree
with the Greens in New Zealand have gone off course
as well.
Speaker 3 (14:21):
No. Look, I mean the questions for what the Green
Party are concentrating on are questions for the Green Party
and that's that's where it always come because I mean,
my my sole focus is what is it that labors
out there talking to its constituents about. What are we
talking to people about? And it's the things that matter,
and it is about their jobs, it is about homes,
(14:41):
it is about health, It's those kind of things and
that's our responsibility. And I've never really taken an option
of talking about the priorities of our coalition partners. That's
that's for them to discuss.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
Vanessa Wennig, it seems that the tough talk of Dutton
didn't go down well with voters. What's the lesson from
that for National because you're you're the tough talking party
at the moment.
Speaker 4 (15:04):
I think it is to stick to the the things
that bother the electric to the things that are important,
and that is the cost of living, incomes, making sure
that people have got a decent education system and good
healthcare and that they feel safe in their own homes.
Speaker 2 (15:22):
Do you think getting what was it fifty three seconds
off your travel time between Rolliston and christ Church do
you think that's one of the things that people are
crying out for.
Speaker 4 (15:31):
I think people love it now driving out to Rolliston,
I personally love it. It's great. Really, yeah, it's fabulous because
have you done it? Have you driven out there and
just not gone? This is wonderful.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Adik all the way was on the way to Needin.
Speaker 4 (15:47):
Adik all the way?
Speaker 2 (15:48):
What is loved it? Loved it? That's me life in
the slow lane. Try it out. It's very good.
Speaker 4 (15:57):
Yeah, well I preferred be able to drive it a
sensible sensible.
Speaker 3 (16:01):
But I think you made a really good point John,
that what we've seen in both Australia and is the
election of governments that are seeking to unite and to
bring people together and not concentrate on the issues that
are dividing, and we are seeing that come into New
Zealand politics. We are seeing across the government coalition a
lot of areaching about division and that has been rejected
(16:25):
among Canada. In Australia, you.
Speaker 2 (16:26):
Can say that, but some would say that that the
and again I know you're going to say, I'm not
speaking on behalf of the Greens, but I'm going to
ask you about the Greens is some people probably see
them as divisive as well.
Speaker 3 (16:36):
Yeah, what I'm saying is that what we saw an
Australian Labor Party led by Anthony Albanese that went now
very much about bringing Australia together and that is very
much that the values we share it as well as
the New Zealand Labor Party in terms of bringing people together,
we saw it. I think the result in Canada was
(16:57):
extraordinary and the way in which that Mark Carney and
his party stood up for Canadians their campaign elbows up for.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
As you're talking here about first past the post systems.
Whereas David Parker the other night when he was talking
about MP, he was saying that MP has been extremely divisive.
Speaker 3 (17:16):
So what he was saying is and I think it's
very much in response. And I mean, let's always bear
in mind that people's valedictory speeches are that that time
where you get to muse and to give you to
give you a kind of your reckons on things, and
that's the very nature think that's everyone's valedictory speech. But
I think really what he was talking about is an
(17:36):
environment that we're seeing, particularly with this government, where we're
minor parties are really calling the chune and seem to
be running the show. And I think New Zealanders are
getting increasingly dissatisfied with a prime minister that doesn't seem
to be showing leadership.
Speaker 2 (17:51):
So that wouldn't happen under a Labor Greens to party Manori.
Speaker 3 (17:55):
I think what we've shown that when we've been in
government that we did have a coalition and confidence and
supply agreement in our first team with New Zealand First
and the Greens. I think what we all there was
incredibly good leadership in management of their coalition from Jasinder.
When you compare that next year's not running, Jonathan Bright
(18:17):
is not running. But I think people are comparing the
way in which Christopher Latson seems to have rings run
around them by both David Seymour and Winston Peters, and
there just isn't that leadership. And it does seem like
the small parties are calling the check.
Speaker 2 (18:30):
I'm not going to ask Vanessa for her comments. You
see sitting a rolling her eyes once you know that,
you know what Vinessa thinks. Nice to see Vanessa, Good
to see you. Thank you, Megan, Nice.
Speaker 3 (18:38):
To see you always. Nice glad I got here all.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
So waye Yah Politics Friday.
Speaker 1 (18:43):
Back next Friday for more from Category Mornings with John McDonald.
Listen live to news Talks It'd be christ Church from
nine am weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
You're listening to the Canterbury Mornings podcast with John McDonald
from News.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Talks, Politics, Friday Nationals, Vanessa Winning and Megan Woods. Who
got here by the skin of.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
The teeth I did Morning John, Morning Vanessa.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Traffic on Lincoln Ride was it?
Speaker 3 (00:24):
It was everyone wants to live in and they're part
of Christchurch.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
So you're a magnet.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
It's the best part of christ Church. Everyone.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Well, so it's the people that were that have been
I don't call it magnified, have been magnified by Vanessa.
They're getting pulled off in the direction on the way
to town by you, so that.
Speaker 3 (00:47):
I know it's the it's the good people of and Eddington.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
Do you know what I was. I was talking to
someone who was stuck in traffic last night. They wound
down their window and it was on Durham Street. South
Man Alive. Just seems the whole cities that a standstill
at the moment.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
Yeah, Durham Street at Pekau if you're going if you're
attributing to South christ which does just get completely.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
Clawed, absolutely crazy anyway, first world problems. At least we're
not sitting in somewhere that's been flooded last week, like
a lot of places in Backspinitula of Vanessa. What's been
your big the most compelling memory for you as the
local MP?
Speaker 4 (01:26):
For me, it's speaking some of the business owners that
have been deeply affected by their businesses being flooded. Some
of the farmers who have had their land and undated
and have lost dock and that's pretty really difficult for them,
and I know that people are still recovering from it.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Do you think the city has responded appropriately? Megan?
Speaker 3 (01:48):
I think in terms of Christich City, this was our
fourth wetest day, and actually I think a lot of
the particularly the Heathcuit retention basins, held up incredibly well.
When I looked at the amount of water sitting in
the sort of the horswell were grim Skies, those areas
and cook by Kurlitz Road, I mean just so much
(02:08):
water was being kept out of the rivers, which meant
it wasn't going into people's home. So I think we
can see that their infrastructure effect. Also, the flocked in
basin didn't flood. It wasn't that long ago that it
didn't have to be particularly heavy rain.
Speaker 2 (02:21):
It flocked in. It flocked in basin had flooded, that
there would be a global outcry because all the money
that was spent on the place there.
Speaker 3 (02:28):
Yeah, but I think what we can say is that
some of that work. I think that were people were
hit and Vnica's electorate outside of the city, I don't
think that held up as well.
Speaker 2 (02:39):
When you start, don't held up as well? You think
the response?
Speaker 3 (02:42):
No, No, I think that infrastructure didn't hold up as well.
I don't have a particular view on the response. I'm
not close enough to it, but what I can see,
you know, places in my electric where we've seen flooding
before didn't happen. There was a little bit in Honehey,
which has always flooded, but by and large a lot
of homes were saved by the thousands and thousands of
(03:03):
liters of water sitting in those retention bases.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
Do you think people in your electric that banks Banks Peninsula,
do you think they were underserved by the response?
Speaker 4 (03:13):
Well, first thing is I agree about because there's parts
of my electric that were protected by those water retention ponds.
And I agree the response out in Little River and
the timing of the opening of Lake Forsyth. I think
even the mayor has admitted that there's probably things that
could have been done better there and I would look
forward to the review of that and the community I
(03:34):
think are rightly asking questions.
Speaker 2 (03:38):
Do you think there were some people rightly asking questions
about Sam Broughton not being in Selwyn when he declared
the emergency and being in Wellington.
Speaker 4 (03:46):
It doesn't matter where he is. Doesn't know, No, it
doesn't matter where he is. He's a figurehead. And to
be honest, I was watching his social media and his
team were doing great updates during the day. It wasn't
until like when I saw him in the night that
I found out that he had been out of Wellington.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
I'm sorry, out of such ouda Selwyn. Yea right. Let's
move on to the big political story of the week,
the young pay equity suation. So, Vanessa, we found it
last night that national MP's were all told about this
on Sunday ahead of the announcement on Tuesday? Was that
the first you knew of it?
Speaker 4 (04:16):
Yes?
Speaker 2 (04:17):
And what was your immediate reaction?
Speaker 4 (04:20):
So immediate reaction was an emotional response. But I always
questioned my emotional responses and think, right, well, is this
something that you know? What is the reasoning behind this,
what is the underlying stuff? And so I went and
read it, and I went and read all of the
accompanying information that I could, and I saw, well, yeah,
this is not something that's going to be easy. This
is a hard decision to make, but we're making it
(04:42):
for the right reasons.
Speaker 2 (04:44):
What was that emotional response you talk about, Well.
Speaker 4 (04:46):
The emotional response was was basically an oh, hit, this
is going to be big. And that's exactly what is it.
I mean, you see the reaction and that's the same
reaction that everyone is happening.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
Did your emotional reaction was that, Oh, this is going
to be big or oh this is wrong.
Speaker 4 (05:04):
No, this is going to be big. This is going
to cause a reaction.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
Because Tracy Martin has written a piece online in the
last twenty four hours saying that people spent hours and
hundreds of hours and thousands of dollars on their claims
when the whole time the government in the background was
working on this.
Speaker 4 (05:24):
I can't deny that there are going to be a
lot of people disappointed. This is something that people have
been working on, and pay equity is still an option
for people, and still claims will still progress is that
the parameters have changed and some of the comparatives have changed,
and yes, things will have to start again, and I
know that's really hard for people.
Speaker 2 (05:44):
Did you feel about left out? Only becoming aware of
it on Sunday when it seems from a timeline I
was reading last night the government had been well. Certain
people in the government have been working on it for months.
Speaker 4 (05:55):
That's the way it works, that's the way of government.
And I accept that there are people within the cabinet
who have to make the decisions and those of us
in the background, in the backbenches are told later.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
So as a woman, you're not embarrassed. You don't think
the government in some ways doing the wrong thing for women.
Speaker 4 (06:17):
I'm proud of the government for making hard decisions and
for getting our economy where it needs to be. We've
had to deal with a heck of a mess that
was left by the profligate spending of the last government,
and so we're doing what we need to do. And
we wouldn't do this if we didn't have to.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Actually, as it saved the budget with it, is that true?
Speaker 4 (06:35):
I don't know enough about the budget.
Speaker 2 (06:37):
How much will it save?
Speaker 4 (06:38):
I don't know, because that's budget sensitive information.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
Megan Woods, how well do you think people understand what
this is all about? Because Chris Hopkins was making some
well some people say smart out at comments, you know,
robbing Paul and to pay Paul. But we well, you
guys just fanning the fire or taking advantage of We
do not really knowing what this is about.
Speaker 3 (06:56):
Absolutely not that many many, many people understand this because
they've been really involved in their own pay equity claims
that there are. So there's thirty three claims, but that
represents about one hundred and fifty thousand workers, so there's
a lot of people and look, to be perfectly frank
with you, John, a lot of this this cuts to
(07:17):
the call why a lot of us in our caucus
are in politics, so we understand it very well. It's
about people being paid fairly. And for Vanessa to say
she went away and looked at the reasons, well that
just doesn't stack up because Okay, if you think there's
a problem with the comparator, you think there's something that
can be fixed, then fix it, but leave the money
in place. What is I think the most egregious part
(07:41):
of this that this was actually about. I've seen one
estimate one estimate of taking three point eight billion dollars
that we'd set aside for settling pay equity claims and
putting it back into the pot to balance the budget.
So this is to pay for other things, things that
were put in place last budget. So these are choices
that are being made, and actually a caucus does have
(08:03):
a discussion and bank benches should have the right to
how they feel about things. That's certainly how our government worked.
So everybody has to take responsibility. You're not there in
the background. You're an elected representative for people in many
of those people are people that now will not get
money that was coming to them because the government.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Okay, okay, So I'm just going to hold you back
because you're one. Look, I said it on the week.
I thought I thought it was a cockup by the government.
All right, So I'm not having I'm not giving you
a hard time, but I also want to check that
you are not misleading people and what this is all about,
or what it was all about, or what the settlements
so far have been all about.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
No, not at all.
Speaker 2 (08:43):
So that this how come we've got people saying, oh,
you got nurses or you got teachers, think they should
be paid the same as pilots.
Speaker 3 (08:48):
Well, that's not the point of pay equity is actually
to say, right, there's some some professions, in some jobs
that people have that traditionally have been women's work, and
they are underpaid that they're not paid at the same
rate of equivalent work that is traditional be seen as
men's work. So I think the first thing to be
(09:09):
really clear on is there's both men and women working
in these undervalued professions now, because and that's why we
have the thresholds around the amount of workers. It's about saying, right,
if we were going to find a job that's an equivalent,
that we should So it's not about people being paid
the same for the same jobs.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
Just finding the equivalent job, finding the equivalent.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
And it's not easy that this is actually about, sometimes,
you know, putting right centuries of undervaluation of caring work
in particular. No one ever thought it was going to
be easy, and that is why we put in the
provision for back pain. All right, Okay, so you have
to work through this, but that was scraped as well, John.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
All right, Vanessa, I got it. We're going to move on.
But one final thing. There's talk of protests outside MP's officers,
if there's a protest outside your office, what will you
say to the people.
Speaker 4 (09:55):
Well, I'm actually not going to be there. I'm out
and about and I've got appointments and various things throughout
the electrical data. I'm not going to be there. My
staff are not going to be there either, because today
just happened to be a day that they were having
a work from home Friday Pie day.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
Coincidence, coincidence. So David Parker gave his valedictory speech the
other night and he made it very clear he doesn't
think MP has done us long term, has done us
any favors that he put the spotlight on on list MPs.
You're both electorate MPs. Meganwood's first, first of all, you
what value does a list MP bring? Oh?
Speaker 3 (10:30):
Look, I think that having a parliament that represents what
the vote was at the electorate at the.
Speaker 2 (10:35):
Amount of the question what is the value of a
listing P?
Speaker 3 (10:40):
So the value of a list ing P is it
brings the proportion in line with the vote that was cast.
Because we know.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
Through okay, let's go past it.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
We know know that you bring you bring a greater
variety of people in you have, and I think that
m MP does serve us.
Speaker 2 (10:56):
Well, but what does what does a list MP deliver
as opposed to what you guys deliver.
Speaker 3 (11:01):
So we have what we call geographic communities of interest
or electorates, so that the other people we represent. What
we can have through listing pays is we can have
people that serve communities of interest that might not necessarily
all live in one place, in one geographic location, so
different communities. It's how we've got more ethnicities represented in
(11:24):
our parliament. Often it's been through listing pays. All right,
and that's important.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
I'll try Vanessa. I think you're being a bit too
diplomatic there.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
Well, I mean, I don't know what you want me to.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
Say, John, I want you to say that list MP's
are a waste of time.
Speaker 3 (11:36):
Well I knew that's what you wanted me to say,
and it's not what I believe. So I'm not going
to say what you want because I think they're actually
having a parliament that looks like New Zealand is incredibly important.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
All right, come on, Vanessa, you're going to deliver for me.
Speaker 4 (11:49):
I'm not going to say exactly what you want, John,
but I do think that there would be an opportunity
to look at the number. Potentially, the proportion pretended at
the moment is around fifty to fifty and I wonder
if it would be better if we had a few
more constituent MPs. I'm not an expert in these things,
but I think that the size of the constituent electorates
(12:11):
have got bigger and bigger over time, and you know,
maybe it's time that we rethink that.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
So would you like a bit of a tag team
thing going on, so you get a list MP to
tag around with you?
Speaker 3 (12:22):
No, I think that actually that it's much better that
you can cover far more ground and here have different
kind of groups that get to speak directly to their
elected representatives. But the one thing I would say is,
I think we need to look at the number of
seats as South Island has. That the legislation says that
the South Island only has sixteen MPs and that's what
sets the size of electrics everywhere. That's what the original
(12:45):
legislation said. So I'm always I've always been of the
view that we probably need en I mean, this is
my very personal view. It's not the Labor Party's position,
but that we do need to look at whether or
not sixteen seats for the South Island is still fit
for purpose, because I suspect we're getting some absurdly large
geographic areas to get seventy five thousand people into some
(13:07):
of those rural South Island seats.
Speaker 2 (13:09):
So we could just trim the number of listing pays
and have more electric MPs.
Speaker 3 (13:14):
Well, I mean the question would be whether or not
you change the proportion, so you do change that balance
between constituent endlisting pays or you add to the size
of Parliament, and that would all be questions that would
have to be answered.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
Final thing to tick off with Vanessa Winnick and Meghan
Woods is the Australian election people talk about or what
lessons are there for our political parties. Let me run
this one past to you, Meghan. There's a headline in
the Australian today because the Greens. It wasn't just the
Liberals that were had hard but the Greens as well,
and the Australian is saying today the Greens have a
(13:45):
chance to grow up or disappear. I suspect that headline
might also apply similarly to the Greens Green Party here,
wouldn't you think.
Speaker 3 (13:55):
No, And I think one of the things that you see,
the relationship between parties, whether it's on the left or
the right of the political spectrum in Australia is entirely
different because they do have first past the post, so
it's a far more competitive environment between.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
Yeah, but what the but what the headline is getting
at is that the Greens in Australia have kind of
gone of course, and I think you'd have to agree
with the Greens in New Zealand have gone off course
as well.
Speaker 3 (14:21):
No. Look, I mean the questions for what the Green
Party are concentrating on are questions for the Green Party
and that's that's where it always come because I mean,
my my sole focus is what is it that labors
out there talking to its constituents about. What are we
talking to people about? And it's the things that matter,
and it is about their jobs, it is about homes,
(14:41):
it is about health, It's those kind of things and
that's our responsibility. And I've never really taken an option
of talking about the priorities of our coalition partners. That's
that's for them to discuss.
Speaker 2 (14:53):
Vanessa Wennig, it seems that the tough talk of Dutton
didn't go down well with voters. What's the lesson from
that for National because you're you're the tough talking party
at the moment.
Speaker 4 (15:04):
I think it is to stick to the the things
that bother the electric to the things that are important,
and that is the cost of living, incomes, making sure
that people have got a decent education system and good
healthcare and that they feel safe in their own homes.
Speaker 2 (15:22):
Do you think getting what was it fifty three seconds
off your travel time between Rolliston and christ Church do
you think that's one of the things that people are
crying out for.
Speaker 4 (15:31):
I think people love it now driving out to Rolliston,
I personally love it. It's great. Really, yeah, it's fabulous because
have you done it? Have you driven out there and
just not gone? This is wonderful.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Adik all the way was on the way to Needin.
Speaker 4 (15:47):
Adik all the way?
Speaker 2 (15:48):
What is loved it? Loved it? That's me life in
the slow lane. Try it out. It's very good.
Speaker 4 (15:57):
Yeah, well I preferred be able to drive it a
sensible sensible.
Speaker 3 (16:01):
But I think you made a really good point John,
that what we've seen in both Australia and is the
election of governments that are seeking to unite and to
bring people together and not concentrate on the issues that
are dividing, and we are seeing that come into New
Zealand politics. We are seeing across the government coalition a
lot of areaching about division and that has been rejected
(16:25):
among Canada. In Australia, you.
Speaker 2 (16:26):
Can say that, but some would say that that the
and again I know you're going to say, I'm not
speaking on behalf of the Greens, but I'm going to
ask you about the Greens is some people probably see
them as divisive as well.
Speaker 3 (16:36):
Yeah, what I'm saying is that what we saw an
Australian Labor Party led by Anthony Albanese that went now
very much about bringing Australia together and that is very
much that the values we share it as well as
the New Zealand Labor Party in terms of bringing people together,
we saw it. I think the result in Canada was
(16:57):
extraordinary and the way in which that Mark Carney and
his party stood up for Canadians their campaign elbows up for.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
As you're talking here about first past the post systems.
Whereas David Parker the other night when he was talking
about MP, he was saying that MP has been extremely divisive.
Speaker 3 (17:16):
So what he was saying is and I think it's
very much in response. And I mean, let's always bear
in mind that people's valedictory speeches are that that time
where you get to muse and to give you to
give you a kind of your reckons on things, and
that's the very nature think that's everyone's valedictory speech. But
I think really what he was talking about is an
(17:36):
environment that we're seeing, particularly with this government, where we're
minor parties are really calling the chune and seem to
be running the show. And I think New Zealanders are
getting increasingly dissatisfied with a prime minister that doesn't seem
to be showing leadership.
Speaker 2 (17:51):
So that wouldn't happen under a Labor Greens to party Manori.
Speaker 3 (17:55):
I think what we've shown that when we've been in
government that we did have a coalition and confidence and
supply agreement in our first team with New Zealand First
and the Greens. I think what we all there was
incredibly good leadership in management of their coalition from Jasinder.
When you compare that next year's not running, Jonathan Bright
(18:17):
is not running. But I think people are comparing the
way in which Christopher Latson seems to have rings run
around them by both David Seymour and Winston Peters, and
there just isn't that leadership. And it does seem like
the small parties are calling the check.
Speaker 2 (18:30):
I'm not going to ask Vanessa for her comments. You
see sitting a rolling her eyes once you know that,
you know what Vinessa thinks. Nice to see Vanessa, Good
to see you. Thank you, Megan, Nice.
Speaker 3 (18:38):
To see you always. Nice glad I got here all.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
So waye Yah Politics Friday.
Speaker 1 (18:43):
Back next Friday for more from Category Mornings with John McDonald.
Listen live to news Talks It'd be christ Church from
nine am weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Therapy Gecko
An unlicensed lizard psychologist travels the universe talking to strangers about absolutely nothing. TO CALL THE GECKO: follow me on https://www.twitch.tv/lyleforever to get a notification for when I am taking calls. I am usually live Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays but lately a lot of other times too. I am a gecko.