Sir Lockwood Smith: Former Speaker of the House on the calls to revisit the rules of Parliament

There are calls for Parliament's Speaker to dish out harsher punishments for things like Te Pati Māori's haka in the House.  

Speaker Gerry Brownlee's confirmed he's received complaints.  

David Seymour and Shane Jones have both asked him to consider changes.  

Former Speaker Sir Lockwood Smith told Ryan Bridge that in recent years, in consultation with the Speaker, iwi present at Treaty Settlements have been able to perform a haka or waiata.  

He says there's no reason that can't happen, but it can't just be dumped on the House. 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
There are calls this morning for harsher punishments for MP's
misbehaving in the House and he's in first. Shane Jones
says the party Marti's routine last week was a step
too far. It was a disgrace, and he says Standing
Orders need a once over.

Speaker 2 (00:14):
We now need to reform, sharpen and bring standing Orders
into a world where it is a parent a host
of members no longer fear the consequences.

Speaker 1 (00:26):
So Lockwood Smith is a former Speaker of the Houses
with us this morning. Mortenna, good morning, morning, Ray, great
to have you on the show. Do we need tougher penalties?
Harsher penalties? Do they actually work?

Speaker 3 (00:39):
It's an interesting issue because obviously Parliament hass some real privileges.
I mean, as speaker at the start through parliament you
go to the Governor General, the head of Saint New
Zealand and seek the privileges of the Parliament from the
Governor General. And one of those privileges, of course, is
the privilege of free speech in the Parliament, which is

(01:02):
pretty special. You know what you can say. A member
can say almost anything in the House and not be
sued for it. So the privileges are very special and
to breach those privileges to is a serious issue. And okay,
the other day, I think the Speaker named a member
for interrupting the proceedings of the House, and the penalty

(01:27):
for that's only one day's exclusion. They lose a member
that's named, loses their pay for one day. They can't
be involved in the debate or committees or anything, they
can't vote for a day. If they do it again,
of course it's seven days. And if they do it
beyond that, it's even a bigger penalty again for a
third offense. But it's possible, you know that the issue

(01:49):
should be referred to the Standing Orders Committee, which is
a committee of senior members of Parliament that meets every
parliamentary term to upfate the Standing Orders and look at
that issue of this verity of that first breach, you know,
just being named and suspended from the House for one day,

(02:09):
and it was a Thursday.

Speaker 1 (02:11):
It was a Thursday too, so it wasn't much happening
on that in the House on a Friday.

Speaker 3 (02:14):
Anyway.

Speaker 1 (02:15):
Seymour reckons that because of social media, the electoral benefits
to people from from protesting and doing things like this
far outway at any punishment, you know, and with your
TikTok moment. So maybe there is a case to dock
more pay or something like that, something more severe. Or
on the other hand, do you allow time for a

(02:38):
hucker if there's going to be a controversial bill?

Speaker 3 (02:40):
You know, well, I think that's something that also the
Speaker can consider. I mean, over recent years when when
treaty settlements have been made, they are important occasions and
here we often attend in significant um. There's it's been
a tremendous development that in consultation with the Speaker, let's
agreed that the EWI present can perform a why to

(03:05):
cup a hacker event. And that's great, you know, it's
it's lovely to see it, it's lovely to hear it,
and it recognizes Maori Maori culture and traditions, and so
there's no reason why that couldn't be explored as well,
that where there's something that's really really held deeply by Maori,

(03:25):
that there could be allowance for some performance of a
cultural activity. And there's no reason why that couldn't happen.
But it needs to be. It can't be just jumped
on the house. You can't reach the surprise.

Speaker 1 (03:42):
The house is the surprise hacker. I think that there
was the problem with Sir lockwood Smith, former speaker. Appreciate
your time. For more fam Earlily Edition with Ryan Bridge,
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