Willie Jackson: Labour's Māori Development spokesperson on David Seymour's Treaty Principles Bill

Changes have been revealed to the Treaty Principles Bill.  

The Bill's architect David Seymour confirmed that Cabinet discussed the Bill yesterday and agreed to its broad outline before it goes to Parliament's drafters.  

He says it'll now acknowledge the rights of hapu and iwi at the time of the Treaty. 

Labour's Māori Development spokesperson Willie Jackson told Ryan Bridge it's interesting he's made some type of concession.  

He says it's a backdown, because Seymour hasn't ever acknowledged the rights of hapu and iwi before.  

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
ACT Leader David Seymour has confirmed a change to the
Treaty Principal's Bill, which was discussed in cabinet yesterday. He
says the government agreed on its broader outline and the
bill will now go to Parliament's drafters. One of those
annoyed Willie Jackson, Labor Malori Development spokesperson Willie more than
a good morning, Martyn.

Speaker 2 (00:18):
Are Ryan good to talk with you, mate? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (00:20):
Good to have you on the show? Does that is
that music to your ears? Are you now on board
with all this?

Speaker 2 (00:25):
Will he cut of that? Right? I mean, the whole
thing is a joke. It's it's interesting though that he's
made some type of concession, you know, because of the
bloke is you know how Seamoul has been going. It's
all we are the world and everybody's got the same rights,

(00:45):
and there's been no concession whatsoever has there in terms
of indigenous or malory right. So you know, that is
a little bit of a background, I would say, because
you know, he's never ever said that was any sort
of rights in terms of hapui or whatever. So I
find that interesting. But that's certainly not going to convince

(01:07):
us of the merits of this this the drive with
us is to actually extinguish indigenous rights. That's that, that's
just the reality.

Speaker 1 (01:16):
But he's just specifically changed his bill to include them.

Speaker 2 (01:21):
Oh, it's just nonsense. The driver, the drive of the
bill is to make it very clear that Maori don't
have special rights. He hasn't he has not said that
he's going to acknowledge. You know, there's an acknowledgement there,
and that's and that's good. But but he's trying to

(01:44):
give everyone the same indigenous rights that especially allocated for Maudi,
particularly in an article two, in in article three, and
and and this is some sort of this is some
sort of strategy I think, to try and give him
an opportunity to see if he can get national across
the line. I don't think he's got any chance of

(02:06):
that at the moment. You never know.

Speaker 1 (02:09):
In your opposition to this, you you there's a lot
of talk from labor MPs saying, what my reading of
it is here, we aren't adult enough to debate in
an issue like this. Is that a bit condescending?

Speaker 2 (02:23):
Well, it's not just labor MPs who are saying that
they that there should be no debate. You just had
four hundred Christian readers who come out and said that
the whole bill is a total waste of time.

Speaker 1 (02:35):
So the public can't be trusted.

Speaker 2 (02:38):
Well, sorry, who's saying the public can't be trusted?

Speaker 1 (02:40):
Well you are. You're saying we're not adult enough to
have a.

Speaker 2 (02:45):
I'm saying no, No. What I'm saying, mate, is that
I think we've got a dishonest politician and dishonest party
who should know better. You know, the treaty has been
clearly entrenched in terms of New Zealand history. The articles
of the treaty have been recognized by the top judges
of this nation and the top leaders of this nation

(03:07):
on either side. And we should just continue along this
trek totally trying to upset the apple cart. And I
think it's disgraceful.

Speaker 1 (03:13):
But this spills about the principles, not the articles.

Speaker 2 (03:16):
Right, Well, it's about the principles, obvious, it's about the principles,
but they've been derived from from the articles. The principles
have been derived from the articles. The judges and New
Zealand politicians have recognized the principles or may have been
in true since nineteen eighty seven. Yes, that's correct. So

(03:38):
it's really important that we continue along this trek. He's
just trying to upset the apple cart, and he keeps
making out that Mary's are not anything special in our history,
has got nothing to do with what's happening today. The
reality is Mary have been tracking backwards for many, many years,
and recognizing the principles has given Mary opportunity in terms

(04:00):
of the treaty settlements process Ryan, in terms of Mali television,
Maori broadcasting, Malty radio. It's given Mary an opportunity to
get back in terms of equity, and governments have recognized that.

Speaker 1 (04:14):
Are you proud of your record? I mean, would we
be here today if you guys didn't misstep on co
governance as Chippy said you did.

Speaker 2 (04:21):
Are you disappointed?

Speaker 1 (04:23):
Are you disappointed in not in Seemoor, but in yourself?
Will you No?

Speaker 2 (04:27):
I'm actually disappointed in you because because we need broadcasters
like you, you know who who understand what we were
trying to do over six years, and we got more
change for Maudi than any other government in history. I
think you'd recognize that. Your mate who's following you, recognizers
that anything's we've got too much change almost the hostinings.

(04:48):
That's just that there's just a reality. But what what
Chippy does say is we could have taken the public
a bit better with us, and I say that that
might well be right. But I'm proud of a co governor.
So I'm proud of much a tiny I'm proud of
Mutoticky Day, the holiday that is for all New Zealanders,
and I think we just got so much change over

(05:10):
six years and a lot of key we should be
proud of that. This is about partnership. It's not about
Mary's wanting to do stuff on their own. I want
to partner up with you and Mike Costkins and enjoy
Maturichi Day. You know. I want to go out together.
Take there's an invitation to the ZB hey, so you go.

Speaker 1 (05:27):
Right, all right, I'll take you up on that, Willie.
I do enjoy being with you. Willie Jackson, who is
who's the Labor Party's Multi development spokesperson.

Speaker 2 (05:35):
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