September 1, 2025 • 10 mins
Former New Zealand Prime Ministers John Key and Helen Clark will attend a large Chinese military parade marking the 80th anniversary of the Chinese victory against Japan in World War Two.
The ceremony in Tiananmen Square on Wednesday will also feature leaders like Vladimir Putin and Kim Jong Un.
National Minister Chris Bishop says he thinks the invitation reflects the historical circumstances of their Governments.
"Helen Clark and John Key - their Governments had good relations, we did the free trade deal under the Clark Government, which continued on."
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Right now we have christ Bishop the Associate Finance Minister,
and for Nikola Willis the Finance Minister.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Hey bish, good eight, how are I? Yum?
Speaker 1 (00:06):
Well, thank you. Did you read about the judge giving
the gang patch back to the old member last week?
Speaker 2 (00:11):
I've seen the story. Yeah, what do we do about this? Well,
ultimately we don't interfere in the courts. The gang patch
ban is working really well. I think most New Zealanders
around the country will have noticed a decline in the
number of gang members wearing patches around the traps, which
is a good thing. Means less intimidation for people, and
you know it's having an effect, so it's working really well. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
The problem here, apparently is that the law. You guys
were told to write the law so that if the
gang patch was confiscated, it would be destroyed, so it
cannot be handed back. Would you would you consider amending
the law to do that.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
I'm sure Paul Goldsmith and Mark Mature are having a
reader of the judgment and I'm sure they'll be taking
advice on it. I'm not across it, but I'm sure
they'll be having a look at it.
Speaker 1 (00:52):
Okay, I hope. So is it true that government departments
are going to merge in a big way.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
The Public Service Commission, Sir Brian Roche and his team
there are having a look at a range of changes.
Some of it's become public around housing and ministry for
the Environment and transport and things like that, and they
are looking at a wider range of changes. I think
most people agree that we you know, we can streamline
things a bit more and reduce the bureaucracy. You know,
we've got a huge number of ministers and a huge
(01:18):
number of government departments, and you know we're having a
look at that. This is all about making sure public
services are delivered for New Zealanders in a more effective
and cost effective way.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
Would you support going like a drastic reduction like forty
down to twenty.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
Well, let's wait and see where things get to. I
know Sir Brian and his team are having a look
at those things.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
That's huge that Bush. Would you be like, oh, no way,
would you ever think about that? Maybe?
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Well, I'm in favor of smaller government. I want to
get government. I want to reduce the size of government,
and I want the government that we have to be
more effective at what it does. So anything that meets
those tests, you know, we'll have a good look at
and that's not just my position, it's the view of
the government as well. So we'll have a look at
all of those things. But you've also got to weigh
it up against the cost of change. You know, there's
(02:06):
there are a lot of public service working for the
government right now, and we have a lot of government departments.
Every time you e merge them together or reduce them
or bring them into things. You know, I'm thinking of
mb for example, which happened under the last National government,
there's a cost change, right There's you know, people have
got to reapply for jobs, you've got to hire new managers,
you've got rebranding, you've got logos, you know, all that
(02:28):
sort of stuff. So you've got to weigh up or
doing all those things, you know, because that's that's all
part of its.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
Well, how long is it going to take before we
get an answer as to what's going to happen here?
Speaker 2 (02:36):
I would I would say in the next few months.
It's this is not a it's like not like a
next week type thing, but this is I know, so
Brian and the team, you're having a look at it,
but it's not something that's going to happen probably the
side of Christmas, I'd say.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
West Winston so weird about talking about foreign buyers.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
Oh, you'll have to put that to him. I think
you see how weird it is. I've seen a herold
story in which he or it might be a dom
poster actually, which he gets. You know, he's a little
bit fired up at about the issue. But I can
understand where he's coming from because what we're doing on
the on the foreign investment thing that's been announced today
(03:12):
is it doesn't affect the foreign buyer ban at all.
I mean, over ninety nine percent of homes are not affected.
So what we're saying is if you turn up here
and you want to invest five million bucks or more
because you're part of the Golden Visa, the Active Investor
plus visa, which has been extraordinarily successful. By the way,
I had over a one point five billion dollars worth
of investment. So if you want to invest here in
New Zealand and put money into the country and you know,
(03:34):
hire people and everything, we're just saying you should be
able to buy a house. And we're not saying you
can buy any house. You can only buy one five
million dollars or more.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
We've been talking about this for the last two hours.
We're across the detail. But you know, I mean, you're right,
I need to talk to Winston about where he's so
weird about it. I don't want to make you defend him.
That would just be weird for you. Okay, what are
we going to do about the total apport extension? What
do we change in the law here to make this happen?
Speaker 2 (03:57):
We're going to fix it. So there's a bit of
a stuff up frankly through the process. Now there's a
long story behind it, which I won't bore you with.
We've had a judgment, we're going to act, and you know,
we've got legislation coming for the fast tracked supermarket regime,
and there's a whole bunch of residual, you know, kind
of remedial things we're going to do with the fast
tracked regime as part of that to improve it. And
(04:18):
so that's the sort of legislative vehicle. So we're going
to fix it, acknowledge the problem. It is a problem,
and we're going to fix it.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
And then when do they get their hearing again? Because
it was supposed to happen today.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
Yeah, I know, so that that's we're just going to
We're just working our way through that right now. It's
not an immediate fix. Like we know, Parliament's not even
sitting this week, for example, so we can't you know,
we can't fix it this week. We can't fix it
next week either. There's a bit of a process to
go through. So it is intensely frustrating. I'm as annoyed
by it as everybody else. You know, sixty percent of
exports by value go out of the Port of Toronto.
(04:50):
They have literally ships lining up to get in to
get it, get stuff out of our porch and our care,
we througe and everything else. So I'm as frustrated by
it as anybody else. And we are going to fix it.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Yes or no. Are you going to nationalize the thermal
generation in this country?
Speaker 2 (05:05):
No, thank god, we're having a lot. We're not doing that,
but we are having a look at the operation of
the eltricity market. As you know, it is not an
easy issue. I'll just say that it is. It is complicated,
and I can just reassure everybody listening that we are
it is one of our top priorities to deliver more
secure and affordable energy formum.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
Of So I'm glad you're not going to nationalize, because
that's some kooky stuff we don't need going on in
this country. But but what I'm also not keen on
is that we get into another situation like with the supermarkets,
where we're faffing around and it's just bitsy bitsy stuff
and it really doesn't make a big difference. Are you
actually going to do something here?
Speaker 2 (05:42):
We're working our way through that process. I'm not the
most so I can't but well, I can't speak for him,
but I can tell you that we are. We've had
the you know, we've had We've had a number of reports.
Actually there's been an energy Competition task Force and all
the rest of it. So we're working our way through
that process, and once Cabinet's come to a decision, you know,
it'll be announced. Cool.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
Hey, do you think it's that Kesey and Clark at
the China summit?
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Well, that's ultimately over to them. I mean, obviously Helen
Clark and John Key had you know, with their governments,
had had good relations. You know, we did the free
trade Deal under the Clark government, which continued on and
saw huge expension.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
You don't because you're not none of you.
Speaker 2 (06:22):
No, No, I'm not. I'm not saying that at all.
I'm just saying that I think it reflects the historical
circumstances of their But if.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
They got invited because they had good relations and none
of you got invited, that scuss because you haven't got
good relations.
Speaker 2 (06:34):
I wouldn't. I wouldn't read it into it like that ultimately,
that you know, that's another question for mister Peterson. But
are you a little bit I'm on the Foreign minister,
but come on.
Speaker 1 (06:44):
An you were just like a little bit bun that
you're not at the party that Kim johng on? Is
that because it might be your only chance to meet him.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
I don't think I'll ever get to meet Kim Jong.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Wouldn't it be good?
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Though? What about?
Speaker 1 (06:58):
I'd love it?
Speaker 2 (06:59):
All? Right?
Speaker 1 (06:59):
Listen, did you see what Auckland Transport's doing with the
sixty three million dollars on road cones and traffic management
that they think is fine?
Speaker 2 (07:07):
Yeah? All they've got their numbers coming down to be fair,
and it's about five percent of their capital costs. It's
bit's a bit higher than the ZTA we want them
to get it down. ZTA from memory is about three
point six percent. Now on.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
Tell you what I'm bummed out though by is the
fact that you've got the new rules right where they
don't have to use so many road cones and blah blah.
They're basically taking it right to the deadline of mid
twenty twenty seven. They're not even changing their contracts at
the moment.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
Yeah. Well, well they're in the process of doing that,
and i'd encourage them to get on with it sooner. Actually,
I've just actually I've just seen my notes. Two point
three percent for temporary traffic management for NZTA.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
Mate, got it down double that. That's outrageous.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
Yeah, well, they're on a journey. They're on a journey,
and i'd encourage them to speed it up.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
Yeah too, Right, are you going to go see the
Don McGlashan movie, because I know you guys are great mates,
just asking.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
Well, I mean, this is the hilarious thing here is
I am actually quite a fan of Don mcgleshon. He's
not a fan of me.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
Was that best song?
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Best song? I am a fan of Niri from the
first album Good Choice. I'm also a fan of Jecky's song,
which is a deep cut from the Last Muffin. It's
about well exactly. It's a beautiful I'll hit you with her.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
Don't fight me, marsh don't fight it, Marsha. It's bigger
than the both of us.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Blam bam blam. Yeah, that's a classic, I mean, and
Andy is a classic. Obviously Andy sucks. You don't like
Andy so emotional?
Speaker 1 (08:36):
The one that goes she's been talking to my friends.
You know that one on in the of Angels the
album that's a banger.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Yes, that's that straight to my head. No, she's she's
been talking. I think there's a name of the song.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
You know what I reckon. You and I have to
go see it together and invite Don.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
Look, I am going to go see I'm also going
to go see the Shane Carter movie, which is which
was just one of big straight jackets, hilarious thing. Don.
Don's not a fan of me, but I love his music.
Probably it's not always.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
He probably hates me too, don't worry about it. And
I love the ground. The man walks on and wants
to know if you're going to Snoop Dog. On September
the twentieth seeing as you are.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
And I'm not a rapper. I'm not a rapping hip
hop fan. Sorry. Sorry for all the people out there
who like me and like hip hop, I'm not and
I'm not. I'm not. Just can't do it. What do
you reckon?
Speaker 1 (09:23):
The little? The little crossover is with people who love
Chris Bishop and love Snoop Dog.
Speaker 2 (09:28):
The ven diagram. I don't reckon the venn diagram. I
don't reckon the circles match. It's not it's not high.
But no, I'm not going. But I love guitars. I
just I just I just there's nothing like electric guitars.
I'm an old fashion guy. They're out of fashion these days,
but I love guitars.
Speaker 1 (09:45):
Now they're coming back. They're coming back.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
Drum based and guitars, bring them back. Baby that you're
not calling me babby.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
Just for the record, thank you so much, appreciate it.
Chris Bishop, Associate Finance Minister.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
He's funny.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
That's what do McGlashan says about him.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
He goes, oh that Chris Bishop past
Speaker 1 (10:00):
Fun For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live
to News Talks it B from four pm weekdays, or
follow the podcast on iHeartRadio
Right now we have christ Bishop the Associate Finance Minister,
and for Nikola Willis the Finance Minister.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Hey bish, good eight, how are I? Yum?
Speaker 1 (00:06):
Well, thank you. Did you read about the judge giving
the gang patch back to the old member last week?
Speaker 2 (00:11):
I've seen the story. Yeah, what do we do about this? Well,
ultimately we don't interfere in the courts. The gang patch
ban is working really well. I think most New Zealanders
around the country will have noticed a decline in the
number of gang members wearing patches around the traps, which
is a good thing. Means less intimidation for people, and
you know it's having an effect, so it's working really well. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
The problem here, apparently is that the law. You guys
were told to write the law so that if the
gang patch was confiscated, it would be destroyed, so it
cannot be handed back. Would you would you consider amending
the law to do that.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
I'm sure Paul Goldsmith and Mark Mature are having a
reader of the judgment and I'm sure they'll be taking
advice on it. I'm not across it, but I'm sure
they'll be having a look at it.
Speaker 1 (00:52):
Okay, I hope. So is it true that government departments
are going to merge in a big way.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
The Public Service Commission, Sir Brian Roche and his team
there are having a look at a range of changes.
Some of it's become public around housing and ministry for
the Environment and transport and things like that, and they
are looking at a wider range of changes. I think
most people agree that we you know, we can streamline
things a bit more and reduce the bureaucracy. You know,
we've got a huge number of ministers and a huge
(01:18):
number of government departments, and you know we're having a
look at that. This is all about making sure public
services are delivered for New Zealanders in a more effective
and cost effective way.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
Would you support going like a drastic reduction like forty
down to twenty.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
Well, let's wait and see where things get to. I
know Sir Brian and his team are having a look
at those things.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
That's huge that Bush. Would you be like, oh, no way,
would you ever think about that? Maybe?
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Well, I'm in favor of smaller government. I want to
get government. I want to reduce the size of government,
and I want the government that we have to be
more effective at what it does. So anything that meets
those tests, you know, we'll have a good look at
and that's not just my position, it's the view of
the government as well. So we'll have a look at
all of those things. But you've also got to weigh
it up against the cost of change. You know, there's
(02:06):
there are a lot of public service working for the
government right now, and we have a lot of government departments.
Every time you e merge them together or reduce them
or bring them into things. You know, I'm thinking of
mb for example, which happened under the last National government,
there's a cost change, right There's you know, people have
got to reapply for jobs, you've got to hire new managers,
you've got rebranding, you've got logos, you know, all that
(02:28):
sort of stuff. So you've got to weigh up or
doing all those things, you know, because that's that's all
part of its.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
Well, how long is it going to take before we
get an answer as to what's going to happen here?
Speaker 2 (02:36):
I would I would say in the next few months.
It's this is not a it's like not like a
next week type thing, but this is I know, so
Brian and the team, you're having a look at it,
but it's not something that's going to happen probably the
side of Christmas, I'd say.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
West Winston so weird about talking about foreign buyers.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
Oh, you'll have to put that to him. I think
you see how weird it is. I've seen a herold
story in which he or it might be a dom
poster actually, which he gets. You know, he's a little
bit fired up at about the issue. But I can
understand where he's coming from because what we're doing on
the on the foreign investment thing that's been announced today
(03:12):
is it doesn't affect the foreign buyer ban at all.
I mean, over ninety nine percent of homes are not affected.
So what we're saying is if you turn up here
and you want to invest five million bucks or more
because you're part of the Golden Visa, the Active Investor
plus visa, which has been extraordinarily successful. By the way,
I had over a one point five billion dollars worth
of investment. So if you want to invest here in
New Zealand and put money into the country and you know,
(03:34):
hire people and everything, we're just saying you should be
able to buy a house. And we're not saying you
can buy any house. You can only buy one five
million dollars or more.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
We've been talking about this for the last two hours.
We're across the detail. But you know, I mean, you're right,
I need to talk to Winston about where he's so
weird about it. I don't want to make you defend him.
That would just be weird for you. Okay, what are
we going to do about the total apport extension? What
do we change in the law here to make this happen?
Speaker 2 (03:57):
We're going to fix it. So there's a bit of
a stuff up frankly through the process. Now there's a
long story behind it, which I won't bore you with.
We've had a judgment, we're going to act, and you know,
we've got legislation coming for the fast tracked supermarket regime,
and there's a whole bunch of residual, you know, kind
of remedial things we're going to do with the fast
tracked regime as part of that to improve it. And
(04:18):
so that's the sort of legislative vehicle. So we're going
to fix it, acknowledge the problem. It is a problem,
and we're going to fix it.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
And then when do they get their hearing again? Because
it was supposed to happen today.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
Yeah, I know, so that that's we're just going to
We're just working our way through that right now. It's
not an immediate fix. Like we know, Parliament's not even
sitting this week, for example, so we can't you know,
we can't fix it this week. We can't fix it
next week either. There's a bit of a process to
go through. So it is intensely frustrating. I'm as annoyed
by it as everybody else. You know, sixty percent of
exports by value go out of the Port of Toronto.
(04:50):
They have literally ships lining up to get in to
get it, get stuff out of our porch and our care,
we througe and everything else. So I'm as frustrated by
it as anybody else. And we are going to fix it.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Yes or no. Are you going to nationalize the thermal
generation in this country?
Speaker 2 (05:05):
No, thank god, we're having a lot. We're not doing that,
but we are having a look at the operation of
the eltricity market. As you know, it is not an
easy issue. I'll just say that it is. It is complicated,
and I can just reassure everybody listening that we are
it is one of our top priorities to deliver more
secure and affordable energy formum.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
Of So I'm glad you're not going to nationalize, because
that's some kooky stuff we don't need going on in
this country. But but what I'm also not keen on
is that we get into another situation like with the supermarkets,
where we're faffing around and it's just bitsy bitsy stuff
and it really doesn't make a big difference. Are you
actually going to do something here?
Speaker 2 (05:42):
We're working our way through that process. I'm not the
most so I can't but well, I can't speak for him,
but I can tell you that we are. We've had
the you know, we've had We've had a number of reports.
Actually there's been an energy Competition task Force and all
the rest of it. So we're working our way through
that process, and once Cabinet's come to a decision, you know,
it'll be announced. Cool.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
Hey, do you think it's that Kesey and Clark at
the China summit?
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Well, that's ultimately over to them. I mean, obviously Helen
Clark and John Key had you know, with their governments,
had had good relations. You know, we did the free
trade Deal under the Clark government, which continued on and
saw huge expension.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
You don't because you're not none of you.
Speaker 2 (06:22):
No, No, I'm not. I'm not saying that at all.
I'm just saying that I think it reflects the historical
circumstances of their But if.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
They got invited because they had good relations and none
of you got invited, that scuss because you haven't got
good relations.
Speaker 2 (06:34):
I wouldn't. I wouldn't read it into it like that ultimately,
that you know, that's another question for mister Peterson. But
are you a little bit I'm on the Foreign minister,
but come on.
Speaker 1 (06:44):
An you were just like a little bit bun that
you're not at the party that Kim johng on? Is
that because it might be your only chance to meet him.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
I don't think I'll ever get to meet Kim Jong.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Wouldn't it be good?
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Though? What about?
Speaker 1 (06:58):
I'd love it?
Speaker 2 (06:59):
All? Right?
Speaker 1 (06:59):
Listen, did you see what Auckland Transport's doing with the
sixty three million dollars on road cones and traffic management
that they think is fine?
Speaker 2 (07:07):
Yeah? All they've got their numbers coming down to be fair,
and it's about five percent of their capital costs. It's
bit's a bit higher than the ZTA we want them
to get it down. ZTA from memory is about three
point six percent. Now on.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
Tell you what I'm bummed out though by is the
fact that you've got the new rules right where they
don't have to use so many road cones and blah blah.
They're basically taking it right to the deadline of mid
twenty twenty seven. They're not even changing their contracts at
the moment.
Speaker 2 (07:34):
Yeah. Well, well they're in the process of doing that,
and i'd encourage them to get on with it sooner. Actually,
I've just actually I've just seen my notes. Two point
three percent for temporary traffic management for NZTA.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
Mate, got it down double that. That's outrageous.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
Yeah, well, they're on a journey. They're on a journey,
and i'd encourage them to speed it up.
Speaker 1 (07:51):
Yeah too, Right, are you going to go see the
Don McGlashan movie, because I know you guys are great mates,
just asking.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
Well, I mean, this is the hilarious thing here is
I am actually quite a fan of Don mcgleshon. He's
not a fan of me.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
Was that best song?
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Best song? I am a fan of Niri from the
first album Good Choice. I'm also a fan of Jecky's song,
which is a deep cut from the Last Muffin. It's
about well exactly. It's a beautiful I'll hit you with her.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
Don't fight me, marsh don't fight it, Marsha. It's bigger
than the both of us.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Blam bam blam. Yeah, that's a classic, I mean, and
Andy is a classic. Obviously Andy sucks. You don't like
Andy so emotional?
Speaker 1 (08:36):
The one that goes she's been talking to my friends.
You know that one on in the of Angels the
album that's a banger.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Yes, that's that straight to my head. No, she's she's
been talking. I think there's a name of the song.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
You know what I reckon. You and I have to
go see it together and invite Don.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
Look, I am going to go see I'm also going
to go see the Shane Carter movie, which is which
was just one of big straight jackets, hilarious thing. Don.
Don's not a fan of me, but I love his music.
Probably it's not always.
Speaker 1 (09:04):
He probably hates me too, don't worry about it. And
I love the ground. The man walks on and wants
to know if you're going to Snoop Dog. On September
the twentieth seeing as you are.
Speaker 2 (09:12):
And I'm not a rapper. I'm not a rapping hip
hop fan. Sorry. Sorry for all the people out there
who like me and like hip hop, I'm not and
I'm not. I'm not. Just can't do it. What do
you reckon?
Speaker 1 (09:23):
The little? The little crossover is with people who love
Chris Bishop and love Snoop Dog.
Speaker 2 (09:28):
The ven diagram. I don't reckon the venn diagram. I
don't reckon the circles match. It's not it's not high.
But no, I'm not going. But I love guitars. I
just I just I just there's nothing like electric guitars.
I'm an old fashion guy. They're out of fashion these days,
but I love guitars.
Speaker 1 (09:45):
Now they're coming back. They're coming back.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
Drum based and guitars, bring them back. Baby that you're
not calling me babby.
Speaker 1 (09:50):
Just for the record, thank you so much, appreciate it.
Chris Bishop, Associate Finance Minister.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
He's funny.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
That's what do McGlashan says about him.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
He goes, oh that Chris Bishop past
Speaker 1 (10:00):
Fun For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live
to News Talks it B from four pm weekdays, or
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