October 2, 2024 • 8 mins
The Government has continued its push to increase the use of remote building inspections to speed up the construction and consenting process.
Building and Construction Minister Chris Penk has voiced disapproval with the current process - and claimed that remote inspections will make the building process more efficient and affordable.
NZ Certified Builders CEO Malcolm Fleming says this process works well in remote parts of the country - or high-congestion areas like Auckland CBD.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Jack Team, and as part of its housing push, the
government has announced plans to make councils do building inspections remotely.
Minister for Building and Construction Chris Pinks is the building
process takes way too long and this will make things
easier and cheaper. Some councils already use remote inspections, but
uptake at the moment is low and practice is vary.
(00:21):
Malcolm Fleming is the CEO of New Zealand Certified Builders
and is with us this evening. Good a Malcolm good evening, Jack,
So talk to us a little bit about how a
remote inspection actually works.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
So remote inspection works like this, so a builder is
ready for their inspection and it could work just as
well in a very remote location and we've been trying
the McKenzie country, or could be work in a very
traffic congested place like Auckland. And so it would work
like this that the builder would have a video, have
(00:55):
the camera and be directed by a building a council
inspector back at their base and asking to show particular
parts of the building that they wanted to check.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
Right, okay, So and when you say a camera, is
it just their phone?
Speaker 2 (01:08):
The phone? Yes, the phone would do.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
Right, So you basically just do like a zoom call
or a FaceTime call, just a video call between the
inspector back in the office, the builder and the building.
And how many things would they be inspecting during one
of these digital inspections.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
What depends on what the building inspection was for. Some
of those building inspections are for specific items, for example,
some structural steel that's been put in place, some tanking
that's gone on going on underneath, some some tiling, some
specifics like that. Or it could be for a pre
(01:45):
line inspection which is quite a significant miles, or a
final inspection had been to the projects.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
Yeah, right, So say like for a typical house, what
would be the inspection that at the moment takes the
longest period of time.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
That would likely be pre line inspection. My sort of
view of NDCB that remote inspections wouldn't be for those
big milestone inspections. It would work very well in tandem
with some other tools that are available for some of
the smaller aspects, which can be quite time consuming and
(02:23):
builders are often waiting on site for building inspectors to
be able to arrive on site, and so the whole
projects that a standstill.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
Yeah, that kind of makes sense. So what when you
say there'd be small projects, what kind of inspections do
you mean?
Speaker 2 (02:41):
Well, sort of talking about so if you worked it
in tandem with other things like say producer statements for example,
which engedcvs are quite keen on. So what I'm talking
about there. So if we look at the tanking example previously,
if you allowed the applicator provide a producer statement, who
reflect that it's been applied in accordance with the manufacturer's requirements,
(03:05):
that creates a level of certainty it's a paper trail,
and then all what we required. Then rather than a
physical inspection, a video inspection, the remote inspection would be
the tick box required to give the confidence to the
building consent authority.
Speaker 1 (03:19):
That just seems incredibly sensible to me. What is the downside?
You know there must be some downsides to not having
inspectors there in person.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
Well, I've seen some of the commentary around and I
think it's accurate that there could be mis representation by
some builders in terms of their control on the camera.
Where it goes our view NZCB that this should only
be available to LBP builders and also LBP builders who
(03:48):
have got a proven track record with the council.
Speaker 1 (03:52):
Right, Okay, so councils that already have so builders that
already have a relationship with council but have also been
shown to produce high quality building that meet standards over
a period of time.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
That and also for building inspections, are well prepared and
that they don't have rework that needs a re inspection
because that takes takes time. Those builders who don't use
the council as a building a control system and a
(04:25):
review and sort of having to teach them what does
and what cannot happen. So I need if they restrict
it to lvps and those with track records, that will
provide the conference plow.
Speaker 1 (04:38):
Yeah, right, So I'm just just trying to play things
out in my mind here. If there were a scenario
whereby a builder was having a remote inspection, the inspector
wasn't totally happy with something and needed to inspect it
in person, that would require not only the digital inspection, right,
but also an on site visit in order to sort
(04:58):
out exactly what was wrong.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
What you're describing, I think would require a physical inspection
to follow up. And we're sort of advocating that physical
inspections should not be done away from entirely for the
milestone one that we talked about earlier, they should still
be in place.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
Yeah, in the final I just wonder how it's kind
quite hard to know given we only have limited use
of remote inspections at the moment, but from the councils
that are using them in the moment at the moment,
do you have any idea how often a building inspector
would end up doing both the video inspection and then
having to go out on site as well.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
That's a good question. I don't have an answer to that,
but what it suggest that right now there is not
buildings because of the lower volume of building consents. They're
well down all with that work. Yeah, right, eighteen months ago, Jack,
this is a really great opportunity to start sort of
rolling some of these initiatives out. And if I said
(05:57):
on its own, I don't think it's a fantasy, but
in use with conjunction with other tools that are available
to the building content authorities, I think together they could
create some efficiencies. It's not going to reduce the material
cost to build, but it will help reduce time and
project time is money, yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
Right, Yeah, so how much time could they say? What
are the potential upsides if this new system works well.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Well in a busy building content environment. So we were
eighteen months ago waiting around for projects for building inspections
that could add weeks to a project. If you're thinking
about the finance holding costs to the property owner associated
with that, each week that goes by is a is
(06:48):
a cost, and it's also additional days and weeks that
contractors are on site. Yeah, right, okay, it comes to
the cost.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
Yeah. I mean the thing that I'm sure many of
our listeners will immediately think about it as something like
the leaky homes saga and worry that any relaxation of
oversight in the building and construction sector will ultimately lead
to a degradation and quality and we could find ourselves
with the FIASCA that we have in the past. What
would be your message to those people?
Speaker 2 (07:18):
So my message to those people is to mitigate risk,
and you can do that by ensuring that you're building
a trade qualified and aligned with the trade association. That
in combination with those suggestions that remote inspections not be
available to everybody as a discretion of the Council, LBPS
(07:40):
and those with a good track record that should mitigate
risk for the homeowner.
Speaker 1 (07:44):
And Malcolm, as you mentioned, construction consents are well down
on where they were even just twelve months ago. So
how long will it take before this is standardized across
the country do you think?
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Well, the government is going at pace with the whole
range of building consenting changes and proposals. This is the
second one this week, for example, So they've certainly got
the bit between the teeth and I ad them their
(08:15):
main driver is to reduce the cost of building in
this country and there'd be no argument from Promistry that
we do have high building costs or anything that can
do lead towards reducing that is to be apport So
they're on the right track. They've got to start getting
(08:37):
coordinated with some of these ideas and bring start bringing
them together and work with industry on them. Well.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
See, thanks Malcolm, appreciate your time. That is Malcolm Fleming,
the CEO of New Zealand Certified Builders. For more from
Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to news talks it'd
be from four pm weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
Jack Team, and as part of its housing push, the
government has announced plans to make councils do building inspections remotely.
Minister for Building and Construction Chris Pinks is the building
process takes way too long and this will make things
easier and cheaper. Some councils already use remote inspections, but
uptake at the moment is low and practice is vary.
(00:21):
Malcolm Fleming is the CEO of New Zealand Certified Builders
and is with us this evening. Good a Malcolm good evening, Jack,
So talk to us a little bit about how a
remote inspection actually works.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
So remote inspection works like this, so a builder is
ready for their inspection and it could work just as
well in a very remote location and we've been trying
the McKenzie country, or could be work in a very
traffic congested place like Auckland. And so it would work
like this that the builder would have a video, have
(00:55):
the camera and be directed by a building a council
inspector back at their base and asking to show particular
parts of the building that they wanted to check.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
Right, okay, So and when you say a camera, is
it just their phone?
Speaker 2 (01:08):
The phone? Yes, the phone would do.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
Right, So you basically just do like a zoom call
or a FaceTime call, just a video call between the
inspector back in the office, the builder and the building.
And how many things would they be inspecting during one
of these digital inspections.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
What depends on what the building inspection was for. Some
of those building inspections are for specific items, for example,
some structural steel that's been put in place, some tanking
that's gone on going on underneath, some some tiling, some
specifics like that. Or it could be for a pre
(01:45):
line inspection which is quite a significant miles, or a
final inspection had been to the projects.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
Yeah, right, So say like for a typical house, what
would be the inspection that at the moment takes the
longest period of time.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
That would likely be pre line inspection. My sort of
view of NDCB that remote inspections wouldn't be for those
big milestone inspections. It would work very well in tandem
with some other tools that are available for some of
the smaller aspects, which can be quite time consuming and
(02:23):
builders are often waiting on site for building inspectors to
be able to arrive on site, and so the whole
projects that a standstill.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
Yeah, that kind of makes sense. So what when you
say there'd be small projects, what kind of inspections do
you mean?
Speaker 2 (02:41):
Well, sort of talking about so if you worked it
in tandem with other things like say producer statements for example,
which engedcvs are quite keen on. So what I'm talking
about there. So if we look at the tanking example previously,
if you allowed the applicator provide a producer statement, who
reflect that it's been applied in accordance with the manufacturer's requirements,
(03:05):
that creates a level of certainty it's a paper trail,
and then all what we required. Then rather than a
physical inspection, a video inspection, the remote inspection would be
the tick box required to give the confidence to the
building consent authority.
Speaker 1 (03:19):
That just seems incredibly sensible to me. What is the downside?
You know there must be some downsides to not having
inspectors there in person.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
Well, I've seen some of the commentary around and I
think it's accurate that there could be mis representation by
some builders in terms of their control on the camera.
Where it goes our view NZCB that this should only
be available to LBP builders and also LBP builders who
(03:48):
have got a proven track record with the council.
Speaker 1 (03:52):
Right, Okay, so councils that already have so builders that
already have a relationship with council but have also been
shown to produce high quality building that meet standards over
a period of time.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
That and also for building inspections, are well prepared and
that they don't have rework that needs a re inspection
because that takes takes time. Those builders who don't use
the council as a building a control system and a
(04:25):
review and sort of having to teach them what does
and what cannot happen. So I need if they restrict
it to lvps and those with track records, that will
provide the conference plow.
Speaker 1 (04:38):
Yeah, right, So I'm just just trying to play things
out in my mind here. If there were a scenario
whereby a builder was having a remote inspection, the inspector
wasn't totally happy with something and needed to inspect it
in person, that would require not only the digital inspection, right,
but also an on site visit in order to sort
(04:58):
out exactly what was wrong.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
What you're describing, I think would require a physical inspection
to follow up. And we're sort of advocating that physical
inspections should not be done away from entirely for the
milestone one that we talked about earlier, they should still
be in place.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
Yeah, in the final I just wonder how it's kind
quite hard to know given we only have limited use
of remote inspections at the moment, but from the councils
that are using them in the moment at the moment,
do you have any idea how often a building inspector
would end up doing both the video inspection and then
having to go out on site as well.
Speaker 2 (05:37):
That's a good question. I don't have an answer to that,
but what it suggest that right now there is not
buildings because of the lower volume of building consents. They're
well down all with that work. Yeah, right, eighteen months ago, Jack,
this is a really great opportunity to start sort of
rolling some of these initiatives out. And if I said
(05:57):
on its own, I don't think it's a fantasy, but
in use with conjunction with other tools that are available
to the building content authorities, I think together they could
create some efficiencies. It's not going to reduce the material
cost to build, but it will help reduce time and
project time is money, yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
Right, Yeah, so how much time could they say? What
are the potential upsides if this new system works well.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Well in a busy building content environment. So we were
eighteen months ago waiting around for projects for building inspections
that could add weeks to a project. If you're thinking
about the finance holding costs to the property owner associated
with that, each week that goes by is a is
(06:48):
a cost, and it's also additional days and weeks that
contractors are on site. Yeah, right, okay, it comes to
the cost.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
Yeah. I mean the thing that I'm sure many of
our listeners will immediately think about it as something like
the leaky homes saga and worry that any relaxation of
oversight in the building and construction sector will ultimately lead
to a degradation and quality and we could find ourselves
with the FIASCA that we have in the past. What
would be your message to those people?
Speaker 2 (07:18):
So my message to those people is to mitigate risk,
and you can do that by ensuring that you're building
a trade qualified and aligned with the trade association. That
in combination with those suggestions that remote inspections not be
available to everybody as a discretion of the Council, LBPS
(07:40):
and those with a good track record that should mitigate
risk for the homeowner.
Speaker 1 (07:44):
And Malcolm, as you mentioned, construction consents are well down
on where they were even just twelve months ago. So
how long will it take before this is standardized across
the country do you think?
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Well, the government is going at pace with the whole
range of building consenting changes and proposals. This is the
second one this week, for example, So they've certainly got
the bit between the teeth and I ad them their
(08:15):
main driver is to reduce the cost of building in
this country and there'd be no argument from Promistry that
we do have high building costs or anything that can
do lead towards reducing that is to be apport So
they're on the right track. They've got to start getting
(08:37):
coordinated with some of these ideas and bring start bringing
them together and work with industry on them. Well.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
See, thanks Malcolm, appreciate your time. That is Malcolm Fleming,
the CEO of New Zealand Certified Builders. For more from
Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to news talks it'd
be from four pm weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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