Mark Robinson: NZ Rugby chief executive on NZ Rugby posting its third consecutive deficit

New Zealand Rugby has posted a loss of $19.5 million for 2024, despite also bringing in record income.

The result was announced during today's AGM in Wellington - and is New Zealand Rugby's third consecutive deficit following a $8.9 million loss in 2023 and a $47 million loss in 2022.

The national body recorded income of $285 million, in what it describes as being a 'near break-even result', highlighted by growth in commercial revenue.

NZ Rugby chief executive Mark Robinson says there's been significant investment in all levels of the game.

"The investment has gone into record levels of investment into the women and girls' game, to the work we're doing in content and digital strategy and game development - we've never had higher levels of investment in the community game."

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
New Zealand Rugby has posted a new nineteen point five
million dollar loss for twenty twenty four. This is the
third loss in a row and it's despite Rugby bringing
in record income of two hundred and eighty five million
dollars was up seven percent.

Speaker 2 (00:12):
Now.

Speaker 1 (00:12):
The boss of New Zealand Rugby is Mark Robinson. Hey Mark, afternoon, Heather,
So what are you spending this money on?

Speaker 2 (00:19):
Well, we're investing in all levels of the game. We've
also also said that we've got an investment model that
has been in place for a long time that we
are working in the second half of this year to
step back and have a really good look at and
we spend a lot of time this afternoon with our
stakeholders talking about the sheared vision for the game and

(00:40):
the opportunity we have to reset that model. So you know,
we're really looking forward to that, to that opportunity. But
the investment has gone into record levels investment in the
Women and Girls game, to the work we're doing in
content and digital strategy game development. You know, we've never
had higher levels of investment in the community game. But

(01:00):
there's also some things with the model that we need
to spend some time working with everyone in the game
to try and improve.

Speaker 1 (01:06):
Okay, so are you spare are you getting any returns
from this investment in the women's game, like, is it
washing its space or not yet?

Speaker 2 (01:15):
Well, when we say the women's game, it's a whole
game strategy, isn't it. Well, over twenty million dollars per
year now into women and girls and when we see
the increase in participation we've had, you know, over fourteen
percent of participation at all levels of the game. That
is an incredibly positive return on investment. But we had

(01:37):
been very open that it will take time in terms
of the pure standalone commercial model to work for the
women's game, but we're happy to take that long term
view and continue to invest in it. If you look
at what we did last year at the Twickenham game,
you know, almost fifty thousand people turned up to watch
that game of Black Frians versus England. There's never been
more tickets being sold. As we go into Rugby World
Cup twenty twenty five in England, so look, it's going

(01:58):
to take some time, but if the trends around the
world as it relates to women's professional sport, we think
we'll get there in time mark.

Speaker 1 (02:05):
I mean, I think it's admirable that you guys are
investing in, you know, areas that you see potential growth,
like the women's game, like even your endsed our plus
channel and all that kind of stuff. But at some
point you can't keep doing this right, You are going
to have to cut the fat. When is that point?

Speaker 2 (02:21):
Well, if you step back and look at the last
four years, we've raised over a billion dollars in revenue,
and if you put aside those big investments that we've made,
they were always planned. You know, about forty million dollars
into stakeholders in twenty twenty two to recapitalize the game
and kickstart some really key initiatives with our stakeholders. And

(02:43):
then I think it's just over twenty million dollars. As
it relates to content and digital ended our Plus, they
are by far the you know, the biggest representative of
the losses you refer to. If you put those aside,
the actual operational losses for the business has been around
it's been just under six million dollars for that so
as a business in terms of the way we're running.

Speaker 1 (03:03):
But even then, I mean business, I take your point right,
You're putting a litle this investment in so you can't
you know that that might bear fruit at some point,
but you have just recorded the largest income that you've
ever had and you still can't break even. Even if
you take that story, well, well, that goes to.

Speaker 2 (03:19):
A combination of things, the choices we made. You know,
if you look at the loss, if you put aside
the investment in digital and content and basically commercial growth
and then in an effects issue which are raised immerge.
At the back end of last year, we were basically
had a break even for this year, so and we've

(03:40):
been able to invest in all of those areas which
are starting to show. If you look at the signing
an announcement of Toyota this week, they're definitely signaling that
that improved and growing digital reach that we have in
the ability to connect with fans and understand them more
right across New Zealand and the world for that matter,
is a big part of their involvement with us. So
we do think that we're starting to see real green

(04:04):
shoots in a few of these areas. We have had
second year of consecutive growth in the community game. But
as you say, you know, the combination of the ambition
we have to invest in future growth at a number
of levels, combined with the I guess the historic model
we have in terms of our funding and funding an
investment framework means that we were struggling to meet that

(04:26):
break even year on year and this is why the
opportunity for the next six months is so exciting.

Speaker 1 (04:30):
Hey, it's good to talk to you, Marke. I really
appreciate it. Mark Robinson, chief executive at New Zealand Rugby.
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