August 11, 2025 • 10 mins
The Finance Minister says the latest One-News Verian poll shows the fight is on.
Chris Luxon's popularity has dropped to a two-year low, while National sit steady on 34 percent and Labour shoots up four to 33 percent.
Today's earlier Taxpayers' Union-Curia Poll predicted a hung Parliament.
Nicola Willis says it comes down to who people trust to steer the economy.
"The reality is, the economy is still recovering. And that means that we're not seeing instant overnight success - we never claimed that we would - but we are doing the right thing."
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Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
We're Business meets Insight eight the Business Hour with Heather
dupic Element and it mays for Trust at Home Insurance Solutions.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
News Talks b even in coming up in the next hour,
Shane Soley on what the market is expecting from the
RBA tomorrow, Destination Queenstown on that very high end resort
being built, and Gavin Gray will do the UK for us.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
Right, Let's get you across the one News Varian Pole
which has just landed.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
It.
Speaker 3 (00:25):
Reckons National is on thirty four percent no change, Labour
is on thirty three percent up four, the Greens are
on ten percent down two. New Zealand First on nine
up one, Act on eight no change, the Maori Party
on four. On these numbers, the Coalition government would have
the numbers to govern in the preferred Prime Minister Pol
Chris Luxeon's on twenty down three, Chippy's on three no change,
(00:45):
Winston Peters is up seven, oh is on seven up
one rather Chloes Warbricks on four down one. David Simon
was on four and Shane Jones is on one and
right now it is eight pas six and Finance Minister
Nichola Willis is with us Hannikoler.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Hello, Evan, where are you? I'm in London.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
What time is it.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
It's about seven o'clock in the morning here.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
Oh, you sound sick.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
It's just a frog in my throat. Don't worry about me.
I'm absolutely fine. I was just going to say, ask
you movies to our impression.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
Jeez, I'm so impressed and also very grateful that you're
getting up to chat to us. And if you were
doing that, you know, because you're on the other side
of the world. But if you're doing it's sick as well,
I would owe you big time. So thank you. Now,
what's going on with the polls? Why aren't you guys
doing better?
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Well, there's been a couple of polls. They both show
largely that there's a fight on between the coalition and
the opposition parties. And in my mind that fight's going
to be about who do you trust to strengthen and
secure economic growth over the next few years. And frankly,
the idea that Labor Greens and to Party Marty are
(01:50):
going to do it is wrong. Yeah, they would confiscate
wealthy text us. That put us into a lot more
debt and so our coalition needs to demonstrate that we
are doing the right things at pace and that these
will make a difference for New Zealanders. We've got to
keep working hard at that and the pulse will eventually
reward us as when we demonstrate it.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
Well, why aren't you demonstrating it already, You've had more
than eighteen months.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Well, we are demonstrating it with our actions. But the
reality is the economy is still recovering and that means
that we're not seeing instant, overnight success. We never claimed
that we would, but we are doing the right things
to ensure that more businesses if you're able to expand higher,
that we can get more investment into the country, that
we can grow our trade, that we can become a
(02:34):
wealthier place where people can better deal with the cost
of living. Those are the right things to be doing,
and I expect all of my forecasters tell me that
that will result in a higher growth rate, more income growth,
lower interest rates, and lower inflation over the next twelve months.
And that's when the election will be held. Okay, next year,
not tomorrow.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
What have you done apart from the tax boost in
the investment tax boosts that you gave in the budget,
what have you actually practically done that helps this economy.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
Well, we've brought in the fast tracked legislation, which means
that major projects the results of that, Well, the Auckland
Port expansion will take part place this year as a
result of that, and we're around a dozen other projects
that are due to good announcements in the next line,
which we expect will kick off before Christmas. We're replacing
the entire Resource Management Act. We've removed red tape from farmers. Well,
(03:26):
by the way are driving it now. We have reduced
red tape from farmers already in terms of the fresh
water rules are in terms of what's happening with forestry conversions,
we've done that work already. We've made sure that our
employment laws allow small businesses and large businesses to put
people on ninety day trials. We've reduced some of the
constraints and our health and safety regulation. We've ensured that
(03:50):
there is a proper investment going into infrastructure and that
projects are being delivered faster.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
This is all rats and mice. This is the problem,
right apart from the stuff. This is all rats and mice.
I totally agree that the tax boost was necessary, and yes,
maybe in the future. The fast track stuff will work.
In the port stuff will work. In the RMA, stuff
will work. But right now we're just dealing with tinkering.
We're in the biggest recession that we have been in
thirty years. Don't you think you guys should be doing
something fundamental.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
Well, we have done fundamental changes. We've introduced golden visas
with more than a billion dollars worth of investment.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
How much of that money would not other ways in
the comfort.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
Well, there's more than a billion dollars pledged and those
will be signed on coming for weeks and months.
Speaker 3 (04:31):
Why are you you, Nikola, You are the woman in
charge of finance, and why are you not doing a
better job.
Speaker 1 (04:38):
Well, I would put to you that we are doing
a good job because actually what we've done is ensured
that New Zealanders had tax reductions rather than tax increases,
which would have constrained the economy. We've ensured that inflation,
which was out of control for three years, has come down.
We've seen significant interest rate reductions which provide an impetus
for a revival and the construction undustry. And I'm glad
(05:00):
to see the conference.
Speaker 3 (05:01):
This is reserve bank stuff. You'll have the Reserve Bank.
The Reserve Bank did this, you have. I mean, your
biggest problem right now is you're not running any surpluses.
And the Treasury report that came out on Friday, so
you need to be running surpluses.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
Well, I'm going to rebut you there because I've seen
your commentary on that. The simple factors. Over two budgets,
we have reduced expenditure by forty four billion. That's how
many savings that we found, and we have given a
path that will ensure and you put into something else.
Portion of the economy comes down from the big high
of thirty four point four percent under Robertson, it comes
(05:37):
down to thirty point nine percent over the four year
forecast period. And we've achieved that by making big changes
in terms of key we save a subsidies in terms
of benefit, increase rates in terms of emergency housing, in
terms of welfare reform, in terms of pay equity, and
all of those something else.
Speaker 3 (05:54):
Nikler and Treasury said, five years on from the start
of the pandemic, core Crown expenditure as a share of
GDP is still near its twenty twenty level.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
So you actually and it is on track to come
down significantly, and we did not get a mandate for
slash and burn economics. Nor do I think that that
austerity path that Ruth Richardson and others have promoted would
be the right thing for New Zealand right now, because
we're because we have put money into our health system
(06:22):
so that New Zealanders don't need to wait so long
for an operation. We have put money into our education
system so that the next generation better educated. No, we
have absolutely focused money and to core areas health, education, infrastructure.
Those are things that are needed for our economy to
(06:43):
be strong.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
There's a lot of our stuff we're spending money on
the here do you know this? We don't have to
spend money, which.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
Is why we have reduced expenditure by forty four billion
dollars over areas that we believed were not delivering value
for money. And that's how you do it here.
Speaker 3 (06:58):
What about cutting the grocery Commission because he himself says
he does not have the tools to do what needs
to be done here. So he's ultimately I like the guy,
but he's a waste of space in that role. So
why don't we get rid of it?
Speaker 1 (07:09):
Well, you've got to get serious heither, because reducing the
amount of money that goes into the grocery commissioner is
a zero point zero zero zero percentage of our overall
government spending. I know that, and what his report is
well exactly so it's not a solution to this.
Speaker 3 (07:22):
But if you get enough of that stuff, Nicola, you
cut that. You cut the Women's Ministry, you cut the
Ministry for Pacific Peoples, you cut all those ministry for
the environment, think tanks, I get rid of them, and
you are.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
Saying none of them would be any but none of
them would be anywhere near as significant as changing the
pay equity, raging, stopping the indexation of welfare two incomes.
None of those things would get anywhere near the order
of magnitude. We're doing the big things that make structural savings,
which is actually what New Zealand needs. And on the
(07:54):
grocery commissioner, actually what he is doing is monitoring what's
happening in that sector to provide us accurate data before
we make what are significant policy changes. And actually I
think that it's important we are well informed about what's
actually happening with market share, with margins, that sort of thing.
His reports have led to far greater enforcement of pricing
(08:17):
and promotion practices, and the supermarkets have changed their turn
on that now now introducing refund policies. They're now being
much clearer about their pricing because they know who they're
being watched by the Commission. In a market where supermarkets
have market power, someone needs to be watching and calling
it out when it's not right.
Speaker 3 (08:34):
Are you meeting the Gen Taylors later this week?
Speaker 1 (08:38):
I won't be because I'll be in London and then
in New York.
Speaker 3 (08:41):
Who's meeting them?
Speaker 1 (08:43):
Well, look, the Energy Minister regularly meets Gen Taylor's.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
Are they going to be talking about the Frontier Report?
Speaker 1 (08:51):
Well, the Frontier Report has been received by the government.
Our key focus is making sure that our electricity market
is structured in a way that sure as we get
good investment and generation, and that our generators have access
to the fuel they need to generate electricity.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
Because quess what the important thing about the Frontier reporters
apparently that it recommends taking the generation aspect away from
the gent tailors and then bundling it together and the
government running it. Are you open to that?
Speaker 1 (09:21):
As a government? We're considering that report and I'm not
going to get ahead of Cabinet on it. Our key
focus is we need generation that works when the hydro
lakes aren't full, the sun's not shining and the wind
isn't blowing. Realistically, that is going to mean coal and
gas for some time. So how do we make sure
that we're getting enough investment both in power plants that
can generate electricity using those fuels and that we have
(09:44):
sufficient access to those fuels so that New Zealand doesn't
get massive energy spikes in the future that lead to
de industrialization and expensive electricity prices.
Speaker 3 (09:53):
For Keywis, Nicholas, thank you so much for taking the
time to talk to us from London. Best of luck
with everything you're doing there. That's Nichola Willis, the Finance Minister.
For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to
News Talk Set B from four p m.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
Weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
We're Business meets Insight eight the Business Hour with Heather
dupic Element and it mays for Trust at Home Insurance Solutions.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
News Talks b even in coming up in the next hour,
Shane Soley on what the market is expecting from the
RBA tomorrow, Destination Queenstown on that very high end resort
being built, and Gavin Gray will do the UK for us.
Speaker 3 (00:21):
Right, Let's get you across the one News Varian Pole
which has just landed.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
It.
Speaker 3 (00:25):
Reckons National is on thirty four percent no change, Labour
is on thirty three percent up four, the Greens are
on ten percent down two. New Zealand First on nine
up one, Act on eight no change, the Maori Party
on four. On these numbers, the Coalition government would have
the numbers to govern in the preferred Prime Minister Pol
Chris Luxeon's on twenty down three, Chippy's on three no change,
(00:45):
Winston Peters is up seven, oh is on seven up
one rather Chloes Warbricks on four down one. David Simon
was on four and Shane Jones is on one and
right now it is eight pas six and Finance Minister
Nichola Willis is with us Hannikoler.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Hello, Evan, where are you? I'm in London.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
What time is it.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
It's about seven o'clock in the morning here.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
Oh, you sound sick.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
It's just a frog in my throat. Don't worry about me.
I'm absolutely fine. I was just going to say, ask
you movies to our impression.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
Jeez, I'm so impressed and also very grateful that you're
getting up to chat to us. And if you were
doing that, you know, because you're on the other side
of the world. But if you're doing it's sick as well,
I would owe you big time. So thank you. Now,
what's going on with the polls? Why aren't you guys
doing better?
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Well, there's been a couple of polls. They both show
largely that there's a fight on between the coalition and
the opposition parties. And in my mind that fight's going
to be about who do you trust to strengthen and
secure economic growth over the next few years. And frankly,
the idea that Labor Greens and to Party Marty are
(01:50):
going to do it is wrong. Yeah, they would confiscate
wealthy text us. That put us into a lot more
debt and so our coalition needs to demonstrate that we
are doing the right things at pace and that these
will make a difference for New Zealanders. We've got to
keep working hard at that and the pulse will eventually
reward us as when we demonstrate it.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
Well, why aren't you demonstrating it already, You've had more
than eighteen months.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Well, we are demonstrating it with our actions. But the
reality is the economy is still recovering and that means
that we're not seeing instant, overnight success. We never claimed
that we would, but we are doing the right things
to ensure that more businesses if you're able to expand higher,
that we can get more investment into the country, that
we can grow our trade, that we can become a
(02:34):
wealthier place where people can better deal with the cost
of living. Those are the right things to be doing,
and I expect all of my forecasters tell me that
that will result in a higher growth rate, more income growth,
lower interest rates, and lower inflation over the next twelve months.
And that's when the election will be held. Okay, next year,
not tomorrow.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
What have you done apart from the tax boost in
the investment tax boosts that you gave in the budget,
what have you actually practically done that helps this economy.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
Well, we've brought in the fast tracked legislation, which means
that major projects the results of that, Well, the Auckland
Port expansion will take part place this year as a
result of that, and we're around a dozen other projects
that are due to good announcements in the next line,
which we expect will kick off before Christmas. We're replacing
the entire Resource Management Act. We've removed red tape from farmers. Well,
(03:26):
by the way are driving it now. We have reduced
red tape from farmers already in terms of the fresh
water rules are in terms of what's happening with forestry conversions,
we've done that work already. We've made sure that our
employment laws allow small businesses and large businesses to put
people on ninety day trials. We've reduced some of the
constraints and our health and safety regulation. We've ensured that
(03:50):
there is a proper investment going into infrastructure and that
projects are being delivered faster.
Speaker 3 (03:55):
This is all rats and mice. This is the problem,
right apart from the stuff. This is all rats and mice.
I totally agree that the tax boost was necessary, and yes,
maybe in the future. The fast track stuff will work.
In the port stuff will work. In the RMA, stuff
will work. But right now we're just dealing with tinkering.
We're in the biggest recession that we have been in
thirty years. Don't you think you guys should be doing
something fundamental.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
Well, we have done fundamental changes. We've introduced golden visas
with more than a billion dollars worth of investment.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
How much of that money would not other ways in
the comfort.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
Well, there's more than a billion dollars pledged and those
will be signed on coming for weeks and months.
Speaker 3 (04:31):
Why are you you, Nikola, You are the woman in
charge of finance, and why are you not doing a
better job.
Speaker 1 (04:38):
Well, I would put to you that we are doing
a good job because actually what we've done is ensured
that New Zealanders had tax reductions rather than tax increases,
which would have constrained the economy. We've ensured that inflation,
which was out of control for three years, has come down.
We've seen significant interest rate reductions which provide an impetus
for a revival and the construction undustry. And I'm glad
(05:00):
to see the conference.
Speaker 3 (05:01):
This is reserve bank stuff. You'll have the Reserve Bank.
The Reserve Bank did this, you have. I mean, your
biggest problem right now is you're not running any surpluses.
And the Treasury report that came out on Friday, so
you need to be running surpluses.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
Well, I'm going to rebut you there because I've seen
your commentary on that. The simple factors. Over two budgets,
we have reduced expenditure by forty four billion. That's how
many savings that we found, and we have given a
path that will ensure and you put into something else.
Portion of the economy comes down from the big high
of thirty four point four percent under Robertson, it comes
(05:37):
down to thirty point nine percent over the four year
forecast period. And we've achieved that by making big changes
in terms of key we save a subsidies in terms
of benefit, increase rates in terms of emergency housing, in
terms of welfare reform, in terms of pay equity, and
all of those something else.
Speaker 3 (05:54):
Nikler and Treasury said, five years on from the start
of the pandemic, core Crown expenditure as a share of
GDP is still near its twenty twenty level.
Speaker 1 (06:02):
So you actually and it is on track to come
down significantly, and we did not get a mandate for
slash and burn economics. Nor do I think that that
austerity path that Ruth Richardson and others have promoted would
be the right thing for New Zealand right now, because
we're because we have put money into our health system
(06:22):
so that New Zealanders don't need to wait so long
for an operation. We have put money into our education
system so that the next generation better educated. No, we
have absolutely focused money and to core areas health, education, infrastructure.
Those are things that are needed for our economy to
(06:43):
be strong.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
There's a lot of our stuff we're spending money on
the here do you know this? We don't have to
spend money, which.
Speaker 1 (06:48):
Is why we have reduced expenditure by forty four billion
dollars over areas that we believed were not delivering value
for money. And that's how you do it here.
Speaker 3 (06:58):
What about cutting the grocery Commission because he himself says
he does not have the tools to do what needs
to be done here. So he's ultimately I like the guy,
but he's a waste of space in that role. So
why don't we get rid of it?
Speaker 1 (07:09):
Well, you've got to get serious heither, because reducing the
amount of money that goes into the grocery commissioner is
a zero point zero zero zero percentage of our overall
government spending. I know that, and what his report is
well exactly so it's not a solution to this.
Speaker 3 (07:22):
But if you get enough of that stuff, Nicola, you
cut that. You cut the Women's Ministry, you cut the
Ministry for Pacific Peoples, you cut all those ministry for
the environment, think tanks, I get rid of them, and
you are.
Speaker 1 (07:31):
Saying none of them would be any but none of
them would be anywhere near as significant as changing the
pay equity, raging, stopping the indexation of welfare two incomes.
None of those things would get anywhere near the order
of magnitude. We're doing the big things that make structural savings,
which is actually what New Zealand needs. And on the
(07:54):
grocery commissioner, actually what he is doing is monitoring what's
happening in that sector to provide us accurate data before
we make what are significant policy changes. And actually I
think that it's important we are well informed about what's
actually happening with market share, with margins, that sort of thing.
His reports have led to far greater enforcement of pricing
(08:17):
and promotion practices, and the supermarkets have changed their turn
on that now now introducing refund policies. They're now being
much clearer about their pricing because they know who they're
being watched by the Commission. In a market where supermarkets
have market power, someone needs to be watching and calling
it out when it's not right.
Speaker 3 (08:34):
Are you meeting the Gen Taylors later this week?
Speaker 1 (08:38):
I won't be because I'll be in London and then
in New York.
Speaker 3 (08:41):
Who's meeting them?
Speaker 1 (08:43):
Well, look, the Energy Minister regularly meets Gen Taylor's.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
Are they going to be talking about the Frontier Report?
Speaker 1 (08:51):
Well, the Frontier Report has been received by the government.
Our key focus is making sure that our electricity market
is structured in a way that sure as we get
good investment and generation, and that our generators have access
to the fuel they need to generate electricity.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
Because quess what the important thing about the Frontier reporters
apparently that it recommends taking the generation aspect away from
the gent tailors and then bundling it together and the
government running it. Are you open to that?
Speaker 1 (09:21):
As a government? We're considering that report and I'm not
going to get ahead of Cabinet on it. Our key
focus is we need generation that works when the hydro
lakes aren't full, the sun's not shining and the wind
isn't blowing. Realistically, that is going to mean coal and
gas for some time. So how do we make sure
that we're getting enough investment both in power plants that
can generate electricity using those fuels and that we have
(09:44):
sufficient access to those fuels so that New Zealand doesn't
get massive energy spikes in the future that lead to
de industrialization and expensive electricity prices.
Speaker 3 (09:53):
For Keywis, Nicholas, thank you so much for taking the
time to talk to us from London. Best of luck
with everything you're doing there. That's Nichola Willis, the Finance Minister.
For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive, listen live to
News Talk Set B from four p m.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
Weekdays, or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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