Italian Prime Minister Giorgia Meloni has offered herself up to be a mediator between the EU and China, after her visit to Beijing.
The relationship between the EU and China have decayed recently, over electric vehicles being dumped into the EU, and investigations on both sides and other trade disputes.
Asia Business Correspondent Peter Lewis says Meloni is confident of mending ties, but her recent track record with China may say otherwise.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Peter Lewis joins US out of Hong Kong.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
Hello Peter, Hello Andrew. Right.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
We've got the EU and China talking about trade right now,
and we've got a very interesting mediator.
Speaker 3 (00:11):
Yes, Italian Prime Minister Georgia Maloney. She's been in Beijing
for four days. She met with President Hu Jinping. And
as you know, relations between China and the EU are
not great other moments. The EU is very concerned about
the rather large trade deficits it runs with China, and
it's concerned about particularly electric vehicles that it says are
(00:34):
being dumped on the European market at below cost, partly
because of all the subsidies these companies get from the
Chinese governments.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
So tensions are a bit frayed.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
There's been investigations by the EU into China, retaliatory investigations
by China and for things like wine and cheese and
so on. But this Maloney says that she could be
a mediator in all of this and she can help
mend relationships between the EU and China. Well, I don't
(01:05):
know how much China is going to see. Miss Maloney
is as a neutral interlocerateur in this because she doesn't
have a great track record in terms of being friendly
to China. She pulled Italy out of the Belton Rote initiative.
You remember, Italy was the only G seven country to
join the big infrastructure projects that president she set up
(01:30):
the Belton Vote initiative. She said that was a big mistake,
it was a waste of time, it brought no benefits
to Italy. When she became Prime Minister, she pulled Italy
out of that. She had also has been one of
these supporters putting tariffs on Chinese companies, particularly ev makers.
And then if you go back even further back in
(01:51):
two thousand and eight, she was actually a junior minister
in Sylvia Bernasconi's government and at the time of the
Beijing Olympics, she urged the boycott of the Olympics. So
a China's human rights record. So I don't know how
much China is going to see her as being someone
that that's that reliable when it comes to mediation.
Speaker 1 (02:11):
Please tell me if you can speak Mandarin.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
She can't, of course.
Speaker 1 (02:17):
Okay, you would have thought that you would have had
an independent mediator, perhaps from the Americas or whatever, because
she's got a dog in the game. But there we
go interesting. We'll watch that very very carefully. Now, TikTok
and in China, and of course America doesn't like it.
What's their problems?
Speaker 3 (02:34):
Well, it says that first of all, it spies on
American teenagers, collects loads of data about them, and then
sends it back to China, which Beijing can then use
to target the American audience through social media and in
particular young people in China, influence their their approach and
(02:55):
beliefs on China and even influence things like the elections. Now,
TikTok denies that. It says it doesn't send anything back
to China, and if it was asked by the Chinese government,
it would refuse to do so. Now that would be
rather difficult, I think for TikTok because the Chinese the
government does expect its companies to sort of be another
(03:16):
arm of the state, if you like. So the US
government has put a ban on TikTok. It's got to
either bite beside the divest itself of TikTok by January
or face a countrywide ban. TikTok is suing the US
government now in the latest briefing that the US government
(03:37):
has just filed. It says that by Dance and TikTok
have this secret sort of social media platform, internal media
platform called Lock, and it uses that to spy on
Americans and get their views about controversial subjects like abortion,
like gay rights and so on, and then feeds that
(04:00):
back to China through this system called Lock, So that
the US government says that this really the gates TikTok's arguments,
that it's got this this independence if you like service,
this data service that's been set up by Oracle, which
stores all of TikTok's data and can make sure that
(04:21):
none of that goes back to China. Well, the US
government says, of course, that's all violated by this this
Lark system and other things that TikTok does.
Speaker 1 (04:31):
I really feel for some poor Chinese person who has
to sit there and see the mountain of TikTok produced
by American teenagers and try to ascertain some sort of
sense to it all.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
You know, American American teenagers.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
If you answer, they say, we don't care, and we psactly,
They say, I'm not that interesting.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Even why does the government want all this information on me?
Speaker 1 (04:55):
They say whatever? And I don't vote anyway, and by
the way, have you seen the lads from Surta And
this is how we dance. I know, I get this,
So there we go. All right, give me with the
smart stuff Apple. Apple has dropped out of the top
five smart phone sellers in China, I would presume because
the Chinese phones just get bitter and bitter from more
(05:17):
the technology they've stolen.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
That's what the US government will say.
Speaker 3 (05:24):
In fact, it's noticed the board that now all top
five manufacturers in China are domestic manufacturers.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
So the number one is Railway.
Speaker 3 (05:33):
Which has faced a lot of sanctions from the US
but nevertheless has been able to develop chips to power
it's iPhones. And then also you've got ferns like Vivo
and Opper up there shall Be, which also has been
developing electric cars, is up there. The top five Apples
dropped down to number six, although Apple says it's still
(05:56):
got a very strong business in China. But if you
look at Apple's results which came out yesterday, in fact,
it did report that its sales in Greater China area,
which includes Mainlanchai, the Taiwan, and Hong Kong, declined six percent,
So it is coming under a lot of pressure from
these local rivals that introduce competing products. Someone did say
(06:20):
to we are they going to go the same way
as BlackBerry did? I don't think so, because Apple has
got a whole ecosystem around it. It doesn't just depend
upon the iPhone. It's got particularly its services like iTunes
and its cloud business. So it has got a very
big ecosystem that can offset the decline in sales in China.
(06:42):
In fact, we saw that in Apple's results yesterday they
still managed I think a five percent gain in revenues.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
Yeah, Well interesting as I've always been confused that why
BlackBerry did not work, and maybe it was just a
product before its time, because the encryption that was available
on BlackBerry's will go down. And just to treat these
days with all their with all the sort of stuff
that's happening right now, Peter, I like to thank you
very much, enjoy your weekend, enjoy the Olympics, and we'll
talk again later.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive listen live to
news talks.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
It'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio.
Peter Lewis joins US out of Hong Kong.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
Hello Peter, Hello Andrew. Right.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
We've got the EU and China talking about trade right now,
and we've got a very interesting mediator.
Speaker 3 (00:11):
Yes, Italian Prime Minister Georgia Maloney. She's been in Beijing
for four days. She met with President Hu Jinping. And
as you know, relations between China and the EU are
not great other moments. The EU is very concerned about
the rather large trade deficits it runs with China, and
it's concerned about particularly electric vehicles that it says are
(00:34):
being dumped on the European market at below cost, partly
because of all the subsidies these companies get from the
Chinese governments.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
So tensions are a bit frayed.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
There's been investigations by the EU into China, retaliatory investigations
by China and for things like wine and cheese and
so on. But this Maloney says that she could be
a mediator in all of this and she can help
mend relationships between the EU and China. Well, I don't
(01:05):
know how much China is going to see. Miss Maloney
is as a neutral interlocerateur in this because she doesn't
have a great track record in terms of being friendly
to China. She pulled Italy out of the Belton Rote initiative.
You remember, Italy was the only G seven country to
join the big infrastructure projects that president she set up
(01:30):
the Belton Vote initiative. She said that was a big mistake,
it was a waste of time, it brought no benefits
to Italy. When she became Prime Minister, she pulled Italy
out of that. She had also has been one of
these supporters putting tariffs on Chinese companies, particularly ev makers.
And then if you go back even further back in
(01:51):
two thousand and eight, she was actually a junior minister
in Sylvia Bernasconi's government and at the time of the
Beijing Olympics, she urged the boycott of the Olympics. So
a China's human rights record. So I don't know how
much China is going to see her as being someone
that that's that reliable when it comes to mediation.
Speaker 1 (02:11):
Please tell me if you can speak Mandarin.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
She can't, of course.
Speaker 1 (02:17):
Okay, you would have thought that you would have had
an independent mediator, perhaps from the Americas or whatever, because
she's got a dog in the game. But there we
go interesting. We'll watch that very very carefully. Now, TikTok
and in China, and of course America doesn't like it.
What's their problems?
Speaker 3 (02:34):
Well, it says that first of all, it spies on
American teenagers, collects loads of data about them, and then
sends it back to China, which Beijing can then use
to target the American audience through social media and in
particular young people in China, influence their their approach and
(02:55):
beliefs on China and even influence things like the elections. Now,
TikTok denies that. It says it doesn't send anything back
to China, and if it was asked by the Chinese government,
it would refuse to do so. Now that would be
rather difficult, I think for TikTok because the Chinese the
government does expect its companies to sort of be another
(03:16):
arm of the state, if you like. So the US
government has put a ban on TikTok. It's got to
either bite beside the divest itself of TikTok by January
or face a countrywide ban. TikTok is suing the US
government now in the latest briefing that the US government
(03:37):
has just filed. It says that by Dance and TikTok
have this secret sort of social media platform, internal media
platform called Lock, and it uses that to spy on
Americans and get their views about controversial subjects like abortion,
like gay rights and so on, and then feeds that
(04:00):
back to China through this system called Lock, So that
the US government says that this really the gates TikTok's arguments,
that it's got this this independence if you like service,
this data service that's been set up by Oracle, which
stores all of TikTok's data and can make sure that
(04:21):
none of that goes back to China. Well, the US
government says, of course, that's all violated by this this
Lark system and other things that TikTok does.
Speaker 1 (04:31):
I really feel for some poor Chinese person who has
to sit there and see the mountain of TikTok produced
by American teenagers and try to ascertain some sort of
sense to it all.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
You know, American American teenagers.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
If you answer, they say, we don't care, and we psactly,
They say, I'm not that interesting.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Even why does the government want all this information on me?
Speaker 1 (04:55):
They say whatever? And I don't vote anyway, and by
the way, have you seen the lads from Surta And
this is how we dance. I know, I get this,
So there we go. All right, give me with the
smart stuff Apple. Apple has dropped out of the top
five smart phone sellers in China, I would presume because
the Chinese phones just get bitter and bitter from more
(05:17):
the technology they've stolen.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
That's what the US government will say.
Speaker 3 (05:24):
In fact, it's noticed the board that now all top
five manufacturers in China are domestic manufacturers.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
So the number one is Railway.
Speaker 3 (05:33):
Which has faced a lot of sanctions from the US
but nevertheless has been able to develop chips to power
it's iPhones. And then also you've got ferns like Vivo
and Opper up there shall Be, which also has been
developing electric cars, is up there. The top five Apples
dropped down to number six, although Apple says it's still
(05:56):
got a very strong business in China. But if you
look at Apple's results which came out yesterday, in fact,
it did report that its sales in Greater China area,
which includes Mainlanchai, the Taiwan, and Hong Kong, declined six percent,
So it is coming under a lot of pressure from
these local rivals that introduce competing products. Someone did say
(06:20):
to we are they going to go the same way
as BlackBerry did? I don't think so, because Apple has
got a whole ecosystem around it. It doesn't just depend
upon the iPhone. It's got particularly its services like iTunes
and its cloud business. So it has got a very
big ecosystem that can offset the decline in sales in China.
(06:42):
In fact, we saw that in Apple's results yesterday they
still managed I think a five percent gain in revenues.
Speaker 2 (06:49):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
Yeah, Well interesting as I've always been confused that why
BlackBerry did not work, and maybe it was just a
product before its time, because the encryption that was available
on BlackBerry's will go down. And just to treat these
days with all their with all the sort of stuff
that's happening right now, Peter, I like to thank you
very much, enjoy your weekend, enjoy the Olympics, and we'll
talk again later.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive listen live to
news talks.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
It'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio.
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