December 13, 2024 • 8 mins
Kiwis seem to be getting lonelier.
Recent research from Age Concern revealed the extent of the loneliness and social isolation felt amongst older New Zealanders – with 59% of respondents feeling lonely or isolated recently, and a third feeling like this most of the time.
Main points:
- It’s rated as having a similar impact on our health as smoking and obesity
- Multiple causes for loneliness including the impact of pandemic, the ageing population, rising cost of living, increasing health concerns and unaffordability, and the trend for families to move overseas
- In the UK and Japan, they have established ministers for loneliness within the government to focus on this area – in NSW they launched a parliamentary inquiry into loneliness earlier in the year
What can help?
- Addressing underlying causes
- Community-based initiatives such as groups, volunteer programmes,
- Interestingly social media doesn’t help – 75% of those with social media access reported loneliness and were more likely to report than those without social media, which emphasises the importance of face-to-face connection
What can we do?
- Make it your Christmas gift to someone —look around in your family and neighbourhood— loneliness is silent so unlikely people will reach out for help, you need to reach in. If you can’t do it in person (e.g., because living in another part of the country) can you get someone else to connect with your older relatives while you do the same in your neighbourhood?
- Try and make it a long-term connection rather than a one-off
LISTEN ABOVE
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
You're listening to the Saturday Morning with Jack team podcast
from News Talks That'd be and.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
A fascinating call from Age Concern New Zealand last month
have called for them a new Ministry of Loneliness to
be established. And you might think this is a funny
time of year to be talking about loneliness, but of
course the Christmas season comes with all sorts of mixed
up emotions for lots of New Zealanders. Doogle Sutherland is
a kindicalsse psychologist with Umbrella well Being and he's with
(00:34):
us this morning. Kilder Dougal Cider Jack.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Nice to talk to you a little.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Yeah, nice to be speaking with you. So just talk
us through why Age Concern thinks that loneliness is such
a big issue in New Zealand and maybe why it's
a bit of an underrated problem.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
Yeah. Look, I think it's underrated because it's so hidden,
isn't it that if you're lonely by definition, you're not
really having contact with other people, so other people don't
know about it. And the Age Concern survey found that
amongst older people that they surveyed, almost sixty percent said
that they had felt lonely or isolated recently, and even
(01:10):
more sadly, a third of the people that they serve
they'd said that they felt like that most of the time.
And loneliness is estimated to have as much impact on
our physical health and our life as things like smoking
and obesity. So it's a real it's a real health problem.
It's not just something that oh, well, people get a
(01:31):
bit lonely sometimes, don't they. That actually has a massive
impact on people's lives.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
That's extraordinary, right, Like a similar impact on our health
is smoking in obesity. I mean that that really is.
It just goes to show we are pack animals. So
what do you think has contributed to those really high numbers,
those really high levels of loneliness. Is it the sort
of thing we can just put it on the pandemic
(01:57):
or has it been brewing for some time?
Speaker 1 (01:59):
Ah?
Speaker 3 (02:00):
Well, look, I think you know, there's a whole multitude
of things. Certainly that there's the impact of the pandemic
and losing contact with people during that time and maybe,
you know, maybe having difficulty re establishing those links. We've
got an aging population, of course, so as people get older,
(02:21):
you know that they do tend to become a bit
more that you know, naturally people lose their partners or
friends through passing away. There's other things though, too, like
you know, the cost of living and the cost of
health care at the moment makes it can make it
difficult for people to actually get out of the house
if they might not be able to afford to travel
(02:41):
or to go out, or their health problems might limit
their ability to actually get out and about in the community.
So there's there's a whole host of factors. And you know,
we've got this aging population and predicted this is only
going to get worse really unless we do something about it.
Speaker 2 (02:58):
It's interesting too, right, Some people might think it seems
like a bit extreme to have a Minister for loneliness
or a Ministry of loneliness, But in the UK and
Japan they've got minister's Loneliness. In Australia they're making some
steps too.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
Yeah, they had Australia's i think announced a Commission of
inquiry or parliamentary commission I think into looking at it.
And the UK had a Minister of Loneliness I think
they've had one for about five years or so, and
the same in Japan. And it's like having a minister
in itself doesn't necessarily change anything, but I think what
it does do is it sort of highlights the area
(03:34):
and focuses government, you know, government attention and finances into
those areas if you've got a bit like we've seen
with you know, the Minister of Mental Health here in
New Zealand. So I think it's certainly it's one of
those things that can really spotlight the issue and bring
it into the public awareness, which I think is really important,
especially at the moment, right especially around Christmas, and it's
(03:56):
around you know, catching up with family and that's all great,
but of course some people that might not be the
case for everybody. And I was thinking that what a
great Christmas gift that could be this year? Have actually
you stopped and took you know, we all stopped and
looked around in our community and who's nearby us? And
are they actually you know, is there some loneliness nearby
(04:18):
that we can help with and and and make that
maybe not just a one off Christmas present, but perhaps
a bit of a longer term commitment to And it
doesn't have to be much. We've got a we've got
an elderly neighbor that lives next door to us, and
her family lives nearby and they see her regularly, but
you know, it's just the occasional popping in and having
(04:40):
a conversation over the fence, or or bringing in her
paper or you know, anything like that, and I know that,
you know, I've spoken to her, and she's just she
really finds that just a really nice thing to and
feels part of the community and feels that like some
there's somebody near to her that that that is aware
of her and cares about her. That's a great thing
(05:00):
to do.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
Connected today. It's just such a such a vital kind
of human experience. It's funny too, right, because social media
is almost more of a problem with this than an aid,
in that people who are on social media actually feel
lonelier often than people who aren't.
Speaker 3 (05:19):
Yeah, it's a weird. It's sort of counterintuitive in a way,
and it's possibly related to that the age of the generation,
you know, where they are seeing what's going on in
everybody else's life and perhaps that enhances the sense of
this isn't happening in my own life, which is sad.
And yeah, I think I think it was something like
(05:39):
about seventy five percent of those people who of older
people who were surveyed and said that they did they
had good social media access and they connected with people online,
but actually they still reported see them lonely. So I
think you know that nothing can beat the face to
face really, So social media is great for keeping in touch,
but it can also perhaps highlight the differences and maybe
(06:03):
some of the areas that aren't going so well for you.
So nothing really to face to face or at least
even a phone call, you know, texting somebody is all good,
but actually having that phone call, having the face to
face if you can, is even better.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
And trying to make it a long term kind of
connection rather than just a one off quick hey, how
are you doing kind of thing?
Speaker 3 (06:22):
Right, Yeah, that's right. I think it's just yea. And
those long term relationships and connections are of course just
built up with small moments, you know, day after day,
week after week, and you're just saying gooday, and then
you stop for a bit longer and you have a
bit of a chat and then that you know, and
that sort of develops over time, so you don't have
to sort of rush in and spend the whole of
(06:44):
Christmas Day in boxing Day and New Year's Day with
them and you know, dominate their lives twenty four to seven.
Just build up those relationships slowly but surely, and and
you know, sow those seeds and eventually they'll spring a
bit of fruit hopefully.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
So obviously we're speaking at speaking about this from the
perspective of people who are you know, of younger generations
who are often really busy in that kind of thing.
This is a bit of a tricky question, but do
you think older people bear some responsibility and trying to
be really proactive about making connections, about joining clubs or
(07:20):
trying to be social like that. Is that something you
can try and foster and peoples like there's a place
for both obviously, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
I think so. I think it's important to address the
barriers that might prevent older people from getting out into
the community, Like if mobility or health is a concern,
or transport, then that's really difficult. But if communities can
come together and you know, address some of those concerns,
you know, have a pick up van or provide taxi
(07:53):
chips or whatever so that people can get out and about.
So I think it's been you know, removing those barriers
that will prevent people from getting out and about and
allowing people to take up the opportunities. And I think
you know, there's a lot often lots of sort of
small community events that go on in your neighborhood that
people would go to if they only could or if
(08:13):
they knew about. Yeah, so it's a bit of both,
of course, but there are lots of often lots of
societal barriers towards people getting out and about even when
they want to.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Yeah, the mobility one's a big one. A Yeah, that's
a really that's a critical one. Yeah, that is such
good advice. Thank you so much. Google. Have a fantastic
Christmas one.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
You thanks Jack, Yes you too, thanks for your thanks
for your Christmas card. Always a highlights and yeah, we'll
speak to you next year.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
Yeah, I look forward to it. I have a great
break and we will catch you again very soon. Google
Southerland the clinical psychologist with Umbrella Well Being. It's seventeen
past to leaving you with Jack Tame. This is News Talks.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
'd be for more from Saturday Morning with Jack Tame.
Listen live to News Talks that'd be from nine am Saturday,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
You're listening to the Saturday Morning with Jack team podcast
from News Talks That'd be and.
Speaker 2 (00:13):
A fascinating call from Age Concern New Zealand last month
have called for them a new Ministry of Loneliness to
be established. And you might think this is a funny
time of year to be talking about loneliness, but of
course the Christmas season comes with all sorts of mixed
up emotions for lots of New Zealanders. Doogle Sutherland is
a kindicalsse psychologist with Umbrella well Being and he's with
(00:34):
us this morning. Kilder Dougal Cider Jack.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
Nice to talk to you a little.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Yeah, nice to be speaking with you. So just talk
us through why Age Concern thinks that loneliness is such
a big issue in New Zealand and maybe why it's
a bit of an underrated problem.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
Yeah. Look, I think it's underrated because it's so hidden,
isn't it that if you're lonely by definition, you're not
really having contact with other people, so other people don't
know about it. And the Age Concern survey found that
amongst older people that they surveyed, almost sixty percent said
that they had felt lonely or isolated recently, and even
(01:10):
more sadly, a third of the people that they serve
they'd said that they felt like that most of the time.
And loneliness is estimated to have as much impact on
our physical health and our life as things like smoking
and obesity. So it's a real it's a real health problem.
It's not just something that oh, well, people get a
(01:31):
bit lonely sometimes, don't they. That actually has a massive
impact on people's lives.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
That's extraordinary, right, Like a similar impact on our health
is smoking in obesity. I mean that that really is.
It just goes to show we are pack animals. So
what do you think has contributed to those really high numbers,
those really high levels of loneliness. Is it the sort
of thing we can just put it on the pandemic
(01:57):
or has it been brewing for some time?
Speaker 1 (01:59):
Ah?
Speaker 3 (02:00):
Well, look, I think you know, there's a whole multitude
of things. Certainly that there's the impact of the pandemic
and losing contact with people during that time and maybe,
you know, maybe having difficulty re establishing those links. We've
got an aging population, of course, so as people get older,
(02:21):
you know that they do tend to become a bit
more that you know, naturally people lose their partners or
friends through passing away. There's other things though, too, like
you know, the cost of living and the cost of
health care at the moment makes it can make it
difficult for people to actually get out of the house
if they might not be able to afford to travel
(02:41):
or to go out, or their health problems might limit
their ability to actually get out and about in the community.
So there's there's a whole host of factors. And you know,
we've got this aging population and predicted this is only
going to get worse really unless we do something about it.
Speaker 2 (02:58):
It's interesting too, right, Some people might think it seems
like a bit extreme to have a Minister for loneliness
or a Ministry of loneliness, But in the UK and
Japan they've got minister's Loneliness. In Australia they're making some
steps too.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
Yeah, they had Australia's i think announced a Commission of
inquiry or parliamentary commission I think into looking at it.
And the UK had a Minister of Loneliness I think
they've had one for about five years or so, and
the same in Japan. And it's like having a minister
in itself doesn't necessarily change anything, but I think what
it does do is it sort of highlights the area
(03:34):
and focuses government, you know, government attention and finances into
those areas if you've got a bit like we've seen
with you know, the Minister of Mental Health here in
New Zealand. So I think it's certainly it's one of
those things that can really spotlight the issue and bring
it into the public awareness, which I think is really important,
especially at the moment, right especially around Christmas, and it's
(03:56):
around you know, catching up with family and that's all great,
but of course some people that might not be the
case for everybody. And I was thinking that what a
great Christmas gift that could be this year? Have actually
you stopped and took you know, we all stopped and
looked around in our community and who's nearby us? And
are they actually you know, is there some loneliness nearby
(04:18):
that we can help with and and and make that
maybe not just a one off Christmas present, but perhaps
a bit of a longer term commitment to And it
doesn't have to be much. We've got a we've got
an elderly neighbor that lives next door to us, and
her family lives nearby and they see her regularly, but
you know, it's just the occasional popping in and having
(04:40):
a conversation over the fence, or or bringing in her
paper or you know, anything like that, and I know that,
you know, I've spoken to her, and she's just she
really finds that just a really nice thing to and
feels part of the community and feels that like some
there's somebody near to her that that that is aware
of her and cares about her. That's a great thing
(05:00):
to do.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
Connected today. It's just such a such a vital kind
of human experience. It's funny too, right, because social media
is almost more of a problem with this than an aid,
in that people who are on social media actually feel
lonelier often than people who aren't.
Speaker 3 (05:19):
Yeah, it's a weird. It's sort of counterintuitive in a way,
and it's possibly related to that the age of the generation,
you know, where they are seeing what's going on in
everybody else's life and perhaps that enhances the sense of
this isn't happening in my own life, which is sad.
And yeah, I think I think it was something like
(05:39):
about seventy five percent of those people who of older
people who were surveyed and said that they did they
had good social media access and they connected with people online,
but actually they still reported see them lonely. So I
think you know that nothing can beat the face to
face really, So social media is great for keeping in touch,
but it can also perhaps highlight the differences and maybe
(06:03):
some of the areas that aren't going so well for you.
So nothing really to face to face or at least
even a phone call, you know, texting somebody is all good,
but actually having that phone call, having the face to
face if you can, is even better.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
And trying to make it a long term kind of
connection rather than just a one off quick hey, how
are you doing kind of thing?
Speaker 3 (06:22):
Right, Yeah, that's right. I think it's just yea. And
those long term relationships and connections are of course just
built up with small moments, you know, day after day,
week after week, and you're just saying gooday, and then
you stop for a bit longer and you have a
bit of a chat and then that you know, and
that sort of develops over time, so you don't have
to sort of rush in and spend the whole of
(06:44):
Christmas Day in boxing Day and New Year's Day with
them and you know, dominate their lives twenty four to seven.
Just build up those relationships slowly but surely, and and
you know, sow those seeds and eventually they'll spring a
bit of fruit hopefully.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
So obviously we're speaking at speaking about this from the
perspective of people who are you know, of younger generations
who are often really busy in that kind of thing.
This is a bit of a tricky question, but do
you think older people bear some responsibility and trying to
be really proactive about making connections, about joining clubs or
(07:20):
trying to be social like that. Is that something you
can try and foster and peoples like there's a place
for both obviously, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
I think so. I think it's important to address the
barriers that might prevent older people from getting out into
the community, Like if mobility or health is a concern,
or transport, then that's really difficult. But if communities can
come together and you know, address some of those concerns,
you know, have a pick up van or provide taxi
(07:53):
chips or whatever so that people can get out and about.
So I think it's been you know, removing those barriers
that will prevent people from getting out and about and
allowing people to take up the opportunities. And I think
you know, there's a lot often lots of sort of
small community events that go on in your neighborhood that
people would go to if they only could or if
(08:13):
they knew about. Yeah, so it's a bit of both,
of course, but there are lots of often lots of
societal barriers towards people getting out and about even when
they want to.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Yeah, the mobility one's a big one. A Yeah, that's
a really that's a critical one. Yeah, that is such
good advice. Thank you so much. Google. Have a fantastic
Christmas one.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
You thanks Jack, Yes you too, thanks for your thanks
for your Christmas card. Always a highlights and yeah, we'll
speak to you next year.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
Yeah, I look forward to it. I have a great
break and we will catch you again very soon. Google
Southerland the clinical psychologist with Umbrella Well Being. It's seventeen
past to leaving you with Jack Tame. This is News Talks.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
'd be for more from Saturday Morning with Jack Tame.
Listen live to News Talks that'd be from nine am Saturday,
or follow the podcast on iHeartRadio.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.