October 6, 2025 • 4 mins
A researcher says all she can do is laugh about the Government ordering more vapes for those wanting to quit smoking.
Health New Zealand's been providing vape kits to smokers for almost a year as part of a pilot programme, initially ordering three thousand kits.
Newstalk ZB has revealed it's ordering more, including flavours like cinnamon and blueberry.
Auckland University researcher Kelly Burrowes told Mike Hosking the Government seems to be promoting and supporting vaping as a healthier product.
She says there's many studies coming out showing there are negative short and medium-term impacts.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
The vape battle rolls on. Health New Zealand is currently
in a procurement process. They want regulated partners to supply
vape kits to people looking to quit. So the government's
going to pay for your vaping now. The pods would
range from zero to twenty eight point five megs of nicotine.
It would come yes, that's right, in three flavors, menthol cinnamon,
and blueberry. Health Health News Health New Zealand won't tell
(00:22):
us whether this is a continuation of its earlier pilot
program or not. Anyway, Doctor Kelly Burrows is the lead
researcher're in vaping for the Auckland University Bioengineering Institute and
is with us. Kelly morning, good morning.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
I'm glad that you are laughing about it as well.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
Well what else can we do?
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Mean?
Speaker 1 (00:38):
What else?
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Exactly?
Speaker 1 (00:40):
For goodness sake? So what's the state of vaping as
you understand it in this country? Is are we winning
or not?
Speaker 2 (00:47):
I do not think we are winning. So in New
Zealand we've got some of the highest vaping rates in
the world and it's very much because the government and
now Health New Zealand are really promoting vaping and supporting it.
As you know, a kind of healthier product. I mean
it it hopefully is healthier than smoking, but that's not
a very high benchmark because smoking is one of the
(01:08):
worst things in the world for you. But the fact
is that we don't know what the long term health
effects are of vaping. But there are many, many studies
coming out every day that are showing that there are
there are negative health effects in the short term and
even in the medium term. Now, so I think, I mean,
I think just by supporting these products, it's really I mean,
up something that's really uncertain. I mean around the world.
(01:29):
The World Health Organization, a similar organization in the US
and the UK. You know, they don't support vaporing for
smoking station programs, other recommended you know, there are approved
methods that are safe to help people get off smoking.
So yeah, I think Health New Zealand's really sending the wrong,
wrong message by supporting these products and now paying for them.
(01:50):
But I also think the flavorings you know that.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
You laughed at that that's the same.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Actually, cinnamon is one of the you know, one of
the flavoring added that's been found to be quite toxic
to cells and sort of seale based studies. I mean
around the world, a lot of countries are starting to
ban all flavors apart from tobacco flavor inges, and you know,
I think that that's the approach we should go. And
I think also, I mean in Australia, they've sort of
got a pharmaceutical vape right, so that's a very regulated,
(02:18):
well understood vape product that is sort of registered as
medical device. I mean, I think if Houth New Zealand
wants to take this approach, we need to. We can't
just be buying them from vape companies not really knowing
what's in them and needs copper.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
I don't know how politically whether this is your wheelhouse
or not, but Casey Costello, who's sort of in charge
of all of this, has been under fire for the
last couple of years with her general approach to this.
Is that part of the problem or is that completely separate?
Do you think?
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Yeah? I don't know. I do think there's some suspicious
stuff going on those, you know, the heat not burn
products that she was supporting. There's no evidence that those
are healthier than smoking, so there's not really much health
research on those products. Yeah, So I don't know, it
does things to seem weird. I mean, if the government
was really focused on the smoke free vision, you know,
(03:11):
why did they repeal those smoke free laws which were
really world leading and you know people were kind of
in are of them. So and we've got rid of those,
and yet we're supporting vaping. And I mean vaping rates
are really high. You know, as many as one and
four people are vaping daily.
Speaker 1 (03:27):
Yeah, the Australian pharmacy approach, are they doing something a
little bit better than us?
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Yes, they are. So they've sort of got a prescription
only vaps. Yeah, and it's very regulated, it's very controlled.
They've done all the toxicology, you know, they know it's
got one flavor, it's got a controlled dose. It's sort
of in a boring packaged device, you know. So it's
very much promoted as a smoking cessation pharmaceutical device. I mean,
(03:53):
I know that in Australia you can still buy vakes
and you know, pretty easily. But I think at least
the government and the health health sector over there are
sending out the right message that it's vaping is for
smoking tosation, it's not a recreational product. And we don't
know what the long term health effects will be but
there is going to be some negative health implications for sure,
no question.
Speaker 1 (04:14):
Let's talk to you, Kelly appreciate doctor Kelly Burrow, who's
lead researcher and voping from the University of Auckland Bioengineering Institute.
Speaker 2 (04:21):
For more from the mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to
news talks.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
It'd be from six am weekdays, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio.
The vape battle rolls on. Health New Zealand is currently
in a procurement process. They want regulated partners to supply
vape kits to people looking to quit. So the government's
going to pay for your vaping now. The pods would
range from zero to twenty eight point five megs of nicotine.
It would come yes, that's right, in three flavors, menthol cinnamon,
and blueberry. Health Health News Health New Zealand won't tell
(00:22):
us whether this is a continuation of its earlier pilot
program or not. Anyway, Doctor Kelly Burrows is the lead
researcher're in vaping for the Auckland University Bioengineering Institute and
is with us. Kelly morning, good morning.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
I'm glad that you are laughing about it as well.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
Well what else can we do?
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Mean?
Speaker 1 (00:38):
What else?
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Exactly?
Speaker 1 (00:40):
For goodness sake? So what's the state of vaping as
you understand it in this country? Is are we winning
or not?
Speaker 2 (00:47):
I do not think we are winning. So in New
Zealand we've got some of the highest vaping rates in
the world and it's very much because the government and
now Health New Zealand are really promoting vaping and supporting it.
As you know, a kind of healthier product. I mean
it it hopefully is healthier than smoking, but that's not
a very high benchmark because smoking is one of the
(01:08):
worst things in the world for you. But the fact
is that we don't know what the long term health
effects are of vaping. But there are many, many studies
coming out every day that are showing that there are
there are negative health effects in the short term and
even in the medium term. Now, so I think, I mean,
I think just by supporting these products, it's really I mean,
up something that's really uncertain. I mean around the world.
(01:29):
The World Health Organization, a similar organization in the US
and the UK. You know, they don't support vaporing for
smoking station programs, other recommended you know, there are approved
methods that are safe to help people get off smoking.
So yeah, I think Health New Zealand's really sending the wrong,
wrong message by supporting these products and now paying for them.
(01:50):
But I also think the flavorings you know that.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
You laughed at that that's the same.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Actually, cinnamon is one of the you know, one of
the flavoring added that's been found to be quite toxic
to cells and sort of seale based studies. I mean
around the world, a lot of countries are starting to
ban all flavors apart from tobacco flavor inges, and you know,
I think that that's the approach we should go. And
I think also, I mean in Australia, they've sort of
got a pharmaceutical vape right, so that's a very regulated,
(02:18):
well understood vape product that is sort of registered as
medical device. I mean, I think if Houth New Zealand
wants to take this approach, we need to. We can't
just be buying them from vape companies not really knowing
what's in them and needs copper.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
I don't know how politically whether this is your wheelhouse
or not, but Casey Costello, who's sort of in charge
of all of this, has been under fire for the
last couple of years with her general approach to this.
Is that part of the problem or is that completely separate?
Do you think?
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Yeah? I don't know. I do think there's some suspicious
stuff going on those, you know, the heat not burn
products that she was supporting. There's no evidence that those
are healthier than smoking, so there's not really much health
research on those products. Yeah, So I don't know, it
does things to seem weird. I mean, if the government
was really focused on the smoke free vision, you know,
(03:11):
why did they repeal those smoke free laws which were
really world leading and you know people were kind of
in are of them. So and we've got rid of those,
and yet we're supporting vaping. And I mean vaping rates
are really high. You know, as many as one and
four people are vaping daily.
Speaker 1 (03:27):
Yeah, the Australian pharmacy approach, are they doing something a
little bit better than us?
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Yes, they are. So they've sort of got a prescription
only vaps. Yeah, and it's very regulated, it's very controlled.
They've done all the toxicology, you know, they know it's
got one flavor, it's got a controlled dose. It's sort
of in a boring packaged device, you know. So it's
very much promoted as a smoking cessation pharmaceutical device. I mean,
(03:53):
I know that in Australia you can still buy vakes
and you know, pretty easily. But I think at least
the government and the health health sector over there are
sending out the right message that it's vaping is for
smoking tosation, it's not a recreational product. And we don't
know what the long term health effects will be but
there is going to be some negative health implications for sure,
no question.
Speaker 1 (04:14):
Let's talk to you, Kelly appreciate doctor Kelly Burrow, who's
lead researcher and voping from the University of Auckland Bioengineering Institute.
Speaker 2 (04:21):
For more from the mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to
news talks.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
It'd be from six am weekdays, or follow the podcast
on iHeartRadio.
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