Today on Politics Wednesday National’s Mark Mitchell and Labour’s Ginny Andersen joined Mike Hosking to dig into some of the biggest political topics of the week thus far.
The Greens are set to debate whether to invoke the waka-jumping bill to expel Darleen Tana from Parliament, after she returned as an independent MP following her departure from the party.
The Government has also loosened requirements to join the police, in order to combat the number of officers leaving for Australia.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Time for politics Wednesday, Jenny Anderson along with Mark Mitchell
both with us. Good morning you too morning now that
Jenny take us through it. How was China?
Speaker 2 (00:10):
It was great? Yeah, so at first trip probably since
I've been MP, that wasn't work. And got to see
my brother and meet his new son who's about nine
months old, and my kids, who are ten and twelve,
got to meet their cousin for the first time in
China and great, yeah, really lovely. Where in China Sujo
(00:31):
which is about an hour and a half out of
genhai Wo, And how.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
Many million people live in that city that none of
us have ever heard?
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Twenty million? That's incredible. Four to five time sides of
New Gillen.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
My brother. My brother used to live in China, and
I can't even remember the name of the city he
lived in. But you landed in either Beijing or Shanghai.
Then you caught another plane to another place I've never
heard of. Then you got on a train to the
city he lived in and that was only six million people.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I was crazy. And my brother's mother
in law's moved in to look after the baby, and
so she didn't speak any English, but got to teach
my kids to make dumplings from scratch, and what happened
with no English language but yet being taught was a
pretty impressive procedure.
Speaker 1 (01:15):
If you've got if you've got children who can make dumplings,
you're pretty much set for life.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Yeah, I'm pretty happy with that outcompany.
Speaker 1 (01:22):
Good make Mark. I don't have any interesting travel questions
to ask you, so mate, maybe we'll stick with was
it good to have her back in the house yesterday?
When she drilled you with a few of those are
you holding up your end of the bargain questions?
Speaker 3 (01:37):
Oh?
Speaker 1 (01:38):
He's gone, don't tell me he's gone to he's in
why Row? Well he's in why Row again?
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Oh okay, that's no good. There we go.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
You're with us, Mark.
Speaker 3 (01:48):
I'm not sure what happily I could understand losing you, guys.
I was on my way to a potokey, but not
certain you're willing to.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
Maybe going all I thought you in the middle of
the coast again.
Speaker 3 (01:59):
Yeah, that's right, that's right. Yeah, So sorry, mister very
quickly for me asked me to head up to Dawn
Territory to see my daughter and a new grand daughter.
But of course we had the weather system come through
and did. It's hard on the on the East Coast
war in particular. So I stayed back that the nice
thing is we will go and see them on the
next recess.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
Good Darlene Taner, we haven't asked you. I don't think
about it, Jennyson, you've been away. So she was in
the back corner of Parliament yesterday. She's back doing the mark.
I understand. She set up a little desk in the
library looking good. What would your advice to her be?
Speaker 2 (02:32):
I think she needs to go. You know, she came
in on the vehicle of the Green Party, and the
Green Party have have sort of terminated that. And and
so I think it's New Zealanders. I think I kind
of think what would the average New Zealander be thinking?
And I don't think it's right that she should be
in there. Her party doesn't want her, and I think
it's going to be really tough for her, you know,
(02:54):
I think it's going to be hard she you know,
sits up the back and that lonely seat at the back.
You know, it's a very isolating place, even sometimes when
you're in a party, let alone when you don't have one.
So I think Lasa here is going to be pretty
tough in here.
Speaker 1 (03:06):
What would your advice be to Chloe given it's now
as far as I can ascertain, her problem, given Darling
it's not moving, does she need to? I mean, she
doesn't look like a leader to me, and she looks
like she just sort of moans a lot and doesn't
do anything about it.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
Well, she's got that button of the Waker Jumping Bill
she has spoken quite strongly about, so I think I
think the last thing I who she said was they've
got some big meeting this week end sort of a
GM or whatever, and they're going to talk about it then.
So I mean, for a group that talked really strongly
against the Waker Jumping Bill need to go and use it,
then they're not going to cough a bit of flat
(03:38):
for that if they do. So, I think that's the
decision before her now.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
The Walker Jumping Bill mark I for the life and
David Seymour argues against her. I can't work out what
the problem is is is she's elected by nobody, she
represents nobody, She doesn't do anything, and therefore you can
jettison her out of the place. Why would Seymour argue
that that's a bad thing given his argument is that
(04:02):
only the people who do the voting can get her out,
but the people doing the voting didn't get her in.
Speaker 3 (04:07):
Well, I can't speak for David. I'm guessing probably that
the argument around it a lot when it was in
Parliament was well, does that mean that list MP's in
are under threat from the party and it quite literally
creature the party and that if they have a dissenting
view then they could have that held over their heads.
But I think when you look at the way our
Parliament's made up, the list, the MP is there by
the will of the party. That is why they're in there.
(04:31):
And I think that that's why, you know, the Green
Party have got a very difficult She was ahead of
them only because they have come out so vehemently against
this legislation, the Walker Jumping Bill, But they have got
a remedy for it, and it's the Walker Jumping Bill,
and it'll be interesting to see.
Speaker 1 (04:44):
What they do do either of you know, in your
time as police ministers, New Plymouth Sergeant Terry Johnson.
Speaker 3 (04:52):
No, no, no, I haven't come across Terry.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
He's retiring fifty years.
Speaker 3 (04:58):
Yes, I saw that that's.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Not bad as out how many Mark, how many Mark
would be in that ILK. How many people go into
the police and that's their job for life and retire
out at fifty years later.
Speaker 3 (05:12):
Oh, it's surprising. Like if I look at my recruit
wing that I went through with, there's probably still twenty
percent that are serving. I saw one of them up
and our rooms are offers each other at Police College.
He's still serving up in Kerry Carey up at Northland.
So yeah, No, there are a few that stay on.
And by the way, he's in a job role that
he loves and that is still in the community. And
(05:33):
I've got other friends that are at as SUU Fisher
level and have come through the ranks. I've got many.
There's quite a few dogounds out there that actually one
of them was on my sex where I first joined
with Presentual. So there are definitely police officers that joined
the job instead as a lifetime career, and I've got
the resilience and the passion for that public service and
they stick with it.
Speaker 1 (05:53):
Jenny, without making it too political, because I know you will,
especially giving you a question yesterday, is that now the
TV one we're trying to going on again about all
the police leaving the country going to Australia. They had
officially there were sixty nine who have gone to Queensland
right now if you look at the force and let's
not bog ourselves down, but there's over ten thousand cops
right so sixty nine of over ten thousand people leaving
(06:16):
to go to Australia's hardly an issue, is it when
you look at all the news has gone to Australia anyway.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
The number three hundred and twenty two, so there's goos,
we've got a total so that it's because you have
Queensland for total police.
Speaker 1 (06:27):
Off to Australia. Yeah, okay, so out of ten thousand
plus here.
Speaker 3 (06:34):
One might just can I just say that Jenny, it
is very misleading. It might be it could be around
two to three hundred that have applied to go through
a visiting process, but not that of actually physically.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Out of park, doesn't it.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
I mean you know, well that's that's a police association
that have come out with those numbers. So the place
associations your debts and numbers they've got by saying how
many are in the process of going, and they'll be
at various stages, but you should.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
It's allant.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
It's just like is that Police Association has been using
of those hold.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
On guys, Come on, Silda. What I'm trying to say
is if you've got a force of ten thousand anything,
factory of ten thousand, company of ten thousand, if you
lose s roundred and twenty two, that's just basic churn,
isn't it.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
It is an issue that we have though, is that
it's top TV on those who have served their whole lives.
And ye, there are lots of police officers who have
worked for forty plus years and have done an amazing
amount of service, but there's a lot retiring over the
next say, two to three years. And that's what means
that even if you're tuning out fifty eight per wing,
(07:39):
usually it's about a monty wing. But even it's eight
per wing, the amount leaving is not you're not getting
on top of that attrition number.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
But that's applicable. Can I not argue that's applicable to
pretty much every industry in this country At the moment.
Kiwi's are fleeing this country rightly or wrongly, but the
police are no different. So in other words, this whole
pleasent isn't the.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
Story police in two years? So don't that mean the
only reason we're pursuing this is that the government has
come out saying they're going to deliver five hundred places
in two years, and why we're pursuing that.
Speaker 3 (08:16):
We're very and we're very committed to do that. Look
like the reality is this is that is that there's
all the scared mungering god on. It almost feels like
people are trying to provoke our police officers to go overseas.
When I was in the police, Queensland Police were here recruiting.
They came to me. They said, we'll give you a
full bedroom home with an inground pool, with a lot
more money if you come and be a police officer
(08:36):
in Sunshine Coast, Queensland. And I was a young police
officer in Gisbone, raised a young family, and I looked
at it and I decided, no, I want to stay
in my country and keep serving here. I've got no
criticism of people that choose to go. They'll make what's
the best decision for them and their families. They've already
given great public service. But I can tell you back then,
some police officers went most stayed. So you know, all
(08:59):
we're doing is we folks seeing on our five hundred.
We're going to keep with pretty Nose's points.
Speaker 1 (09:03):
Fair, isn't Because I read that that police news article
the other day suggesting you're having a little bit of
trouble at the moment. Will you get the five hundred.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
Well, we're on track for the five hundred.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
We make the mists, no one track for the five hundred.
Speaker 3 (09:15):
One.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
Get down down there.
Speaker 3 (09:18):
You've got absolutely down the absolutely mate, Absolutely we are.
Absolutely we are, Jinny. And look, I've spent all week
around the country and meeting at the police stations and
reinforcing for me that we have an incredibly dedicated and
motivated professional police service that's out there doing the best
that they can.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
Okay, quick question, But they're not paid enough. They're not
paid enough, and the payover the no one's paid enough.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
You're paid enough. No one's paid enough. I know.
Speaker 2 (09:45):
But we met last police officers were really hoping for
a whole lot more. That's the honestly.
Speaker 1 (09:52):
I thought the arbitrator thing was a good idea, Jinny.
I mean, it saved a year's worth of just make
a decision, get on with it.
Speaker 3 (09:58):
That's right, that's right. And you never go and paid overtime, Jenny,
You never awful. They're awful, not enough.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
That's what they see.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
Let me be really clear, Genny, us is an incoming
government having to fix up your mess. Gave from the
quart of a billion dollars more in the payoffer. We
went to paid overtime, which I felt very strongly about.
I would have loved to have paid that when I
was working in the police. And actually I think that
on reflection, once we get through this, I'm hoping that
when everyone considers what a bad space space we are
in a country in terms of what we had to
(10:32):
and Europe, it was actually a fear offer.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Okay, got a mode of you guys. We'll see you
next Wednesday. Appreciate it. Mark Mitchell, Ginny Anderson.
Speaker 3 (10:38):
For more from the Mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to
news talks. It'd be from six am weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio
Time for politics Wednesday, Jenny Anderson along with Mark Mitchell
both with us. Good morning you too morning now that
Jenny take us through it. How was China?
Speaker 2 (00:10):
It was great? Yeah, so at first trip probably since
I've been MP, that wasn't work. And got to see
my brother and meet his new son who's about nine
months old, and my kids, who are ten and twelve,
got to meet their cousin for the first time in
China and great, yeah, really lovely. Where in China Sujo
(00:31):
which is about an hour and a half out of
genhai Wo, And how.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
Many million people live in that city that none of
us have ever heard?
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Twenty million? That's incredible. Four to five time sides of
New Gillen.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
My brother. My brother used to live in China, and
I can't even remember the name of the city he
lived in. But you landed in either Beijing or Shanghai.
Then you caught another plane to another place I've never
heard of. Then you got on a train to the
city he lived in and that was only six million people.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I was crazy. And my brother's mother
in law's moved in to look after the baby, and
so she didn't speak any English, but got to teach
my kids to make dumplings from scratch, and what happened
with no English language but yet being taught was a
pretty impressive procedure.
Speaker 1 (01:15):
If you've got if you've got children who can make dumplings,
you're pretty much set for life.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Yeah, I'm pretty happy with that outcompany.
Speaker 1 (01:22):
Good make Mark. I don't have any interesting travel questions
to ask you, so mate, maybe we'll stick with was
it good to have her back in the house yesterday?
When she drilled you with a few of those are
you holding up your end of the bargain questions?
Speaker 3 (01:37):
Oh?
Speaker 1 (01:38):
He's gone, don't tell me he's gone to he's in
why Row? Well he's in why Row again?
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Oh okay, that's no good. There we go.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
You're with us, Mark.
Speaker 3 (01:48):
I'm not sure what happily I could understand losing you, guys.
I was on my way to a potokey, but not
certain you're willing to.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
Maybe going all I thought you in the middle of
the coast again.
Speaker 3 (01:59):
Yeah, that's right, that's right. Yeah, So sorry, mister very
quickly for me asked me to head up to Dawn
Territory to see my daughter and a new grand daughter.
But of course we had the weather system come through
and did. It's hard on the on the East Coast
war in particular. So I stayed back that the nice
thing is we will go and see them on the
next recess.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
Good Darlene Taner, we haven't asked you. I don't think
about it, Jennyson, you've been away. So she was in
the back corner of Parliament yesterday. She's back doing the mark.
I understand. She set up a little desk in the
library looking good. What would your advice to her be?
Speaker 2 (02:32):
I think she needs to go. You know, she came
in on the vehicle of the Green Party, and the
Green Party have have sort of terminated that. And and
so I think it's New Zealanders. I think I kind
of think what would the average New Zealander be thinking?
And I don't think it's right that she should be
in there. Her party doesn't want her, and I think
it's going to be really tough for her, you know,
(02:54):
I think it's going to be hard she you know,
sits up the back and that lonely seat at the back.
You know, it's a very isolating place, even sometimes when
you're in a party, let alone when you don't have one.
So I think Lasa here is going to be pretty
tough in here.
Speaker 1 (03:06):
What would your advice be to Chloe given it's now
as far as I can ascertain, her problem, given Darling
it's not moving, does she need to? I mean, she
doesn't look like a leader to me, and she looks
like she just sort of moans a lot and doesn't
do anything about it.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
Well, she's got that button of the Waker Jumping Bill
she has spoken quite strongly about, so I think I
think the last thing I who she said was they've
got some big meeting this week end sort of a
GM or whatever, and they're going to talk about it then.
So I mean, for a group that talked really strongly
against the Waker Jumping Bill need to go and use it,
then they're not going to cough a bit of flat
(03:38):
for that if they do. So, I think that's the
decision before her now.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
The Walker Jumping Bill mark I for the life and
David Seymour argues against her. I can't work out what
the problem is is is she's elected by nobody, she
represents nobody, She doesn't do anything, and therefore you can
jettison her out of the place. Why would Seymour argue
that that's a bad thing given his argument is that
(04:02):
only the people who do the voting can get her out,
but the people doing the voting didn't get her in.
Speaker 3 (04:07):
Well, I can't speak for David. I'm guessing probably that
the argument around it a lot when it was in
Parliament was well, does that mean that list MP's in
are under threat from the party and it quite literally
creature the party and that if they have a dissenting
view then they could have that held over their heads.
But I think when you look at the way our
Parliament's made up, the list, the MP is there by
the will of the party. That is why they're in there.
(04:31):
And I think that that's why, you know, the Green
Party have got a very difficult She was ahead of
them only because they have come out so vehemently against
this legislation, the Walker Jumping Bill, But they have got
a remedy for it, and it's the Walker Jumping Bill,
and it'll be interesting to see.
Speaker 1 (04:44):
What they do do either of you know, in your
time as police ministers, New Plymouth Sergeant Terry Johnson.
Speaker 3 (04:52):
No, no, no, I haven't come across Terry.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
He's retiring fifty years.
Speaker 3 (04:58):
Yes, I saw that that's.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
Not bad as out how many Mark, how many Mark
would be in that ILK. How many people go into
the police and that's their job for life and retire
out at fifty years later.
Speaker 3 (05:12):
Oh, it's surprising. Like if I look at my recruit
wing that I went through with, there's probably still twenty
percent that are serving. I saw one of them up
and our rooms are offers each other at Police College.
He's still serving up in Kerry Carey up at Northland.
So yeah, No, there are a few that stay on.
And by the way, he's in a job role that
he loves and that is still in the community. And
(05:33):
I've got other friends that are at as SUU Fisher
level and have come through the ranks. I've got many.
There's quite a few dogounds out there that actually one
of them was on my sex where I first joined
with Presentual. So there are definitely police officers that joined
the job instead as a lifetime career, and I've got
the resilience and the passion for that public service and
they stick with it.
Speaker 1 (05:53):
Jenny, without making it too political, because I know you will,
especially giving you a question yesterday, is that now the
TV one we're trying to going on again about all
the police leaving the country going to Australia. They had
officially there were sixty nine who have gone to Queensland
right now if you look at the force and let's
not bog ourselves down, but there's over ten thousand cops
right so sixty nine of over ten thousand people leaving
(06:16):
to go to Australia's hardly an issue, is it when
you look at all the news has gone to Australia anyway.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
The number three hundred and twenty two, so there's goos,
we've got a total so that it's because you have
Queensland for total police.
Speaker 1 (06:27):
Off to Australia. Yeah, okay, so out of ten thousand
plus here.
Speaker 3 (06:34):
One might just can I just say that Jenny, it
is very misleading. It might be it could be around
two to three hundred that have applied to go through
a visiting process, but not that of actually physically.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Out of park, doesn't it.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
I mean you know, well that's that's a police association
that have come out with those numbers. So the place
associations your debts and numbers they've got by saying how
many are in the process of going, and they'll be
at various stages, but you should.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
It's allant.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
It's just like is that Police Association has been using
of those hold.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
On guys, Come on, Silda. What I'm trying to say
is if you've got a force of ten thousand anything,
factory of ten thousand, company of ten thousand, if you
lose s roundred and twenty two, that's just basic churn,
isn't it.
Speaker 2 (07:17):
It is an issue that we have though, is that
it's top TV on those who have served their whole lives.
And ye, there are lots of police officers who have
worked for forty plus years and have done an amazing
amount of service, but there's a lot retiring over the
next say, two to three years. And that's what means
that even if you're tuning out fifty eight per wing,
(07:39):
usually it's about a monty wing. But even it's eight
per wing, the amount leaving is not you're not getting
on top of that attrition number.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
But that's applicable. Can I not argue that's applicable to
pretty much every industry in this country At the moment.
Kiwi's are fleeing this country rightly or wrongly, but the
police are no different. So in other words, this whole
pleasent isn't the.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
Story police in two years? So don't that mean the
only reason we're pursuing this is that the government has
come out saying they're going to deliver five hundred places
in two years, and why we're pursuing that.
Speaker 3 (08:16):
We're very and we're very committed to do that. Look
like the reality is this is that is that there's
all the scared mungering god on. It almost feels like
people are trying to provoke our police officers to go overseas.
When I was in the police, Queensland Police were here recruiting.
They came to me. They said, we'll give you a
full bedroom home with an inground pool, with a lot
more money if you come and be a police officer
(08:36):
in Sunshine Coast, Queensland. And I was a young police
officer in Gisbone, raised a young family, and I looked
at it and I decided, no, I want to stay
in my country and keep serving here. I've got no
criticism of people that choose to go. They'll make what's
the best decision for them and their families. They've already
given great public service. But I can tell you back then,
some police officers went most stayed. So you know, all
(08:59):
we're doing is we folks seeing on our five hundred.
We're going to keep with pretty Nose's points.
Speaker 1 (09:03):
Fair, isn't Because I read that that police news article
the other day suggesting you're having a little bit of
trouble at the moment. Will you get the five hundred.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
Well, we're on track for the five hundred.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
We make the mists, no one track for the five hundred.
Speaker 3 (09:15):
One.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
Get down down there.
Speaker 3 (09:18):
You've got absolutely down the absolutely mate, Absolutely we are.
Absolutely we are, Jinny. And look, I've spent all week
around the country and meeting at the police stations and
reinforcing for me that we have an incredibly dedicated and
motivated professional police service that's out there doing the best
that they can.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
Okay, quick question, But they're not paid enough. They're not
paid enough, and the payover the no one's paid enough.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
You're paid enough. No one's paid enough. I know.
Speaker 2 (09:45):
But we met last police officers were really hoping for
a whole lot more. That's the honestly.
Speaker 1 (09:52):
I thought the arbitrator thing was a good idea, Jinny.
I mean, it saved a year's worth of just make
a decision, get on with it.
Speaker 3 (09:58):
That's right, that's right. And you never go and paid overtime, Jenny,
You never awful. They're awful, not enough.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
That's what they see.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
Let me be really clear, Genny, us is an incoming
government having to fix up your mess. Gave from the
quart of a billion dollars more in the payoffer. We
went to paid overtime, which I felt very strongly about.
I would have loved to have paid that when I
was working in the police. And actually I think that
on reflection, once we get through this, I'm hoping that
when everyone considers what a bad space space we are
in a country in terms of what we had to
(10:32):
and Europe, it was actually a fear offer.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Okay, got a mode of you guys. We'll see you
next Wednesday. Appreciate it. Mark Mitchell, Ginny Anderson.
Speaker 3 (10:38):
For more from the Mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to
news talks. It'd be from six am weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio
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If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.