Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Now. Last week on the show, we spoke more about
the cost of the long running inquest into the death
of kuman Jai Walker. It costs Northern Territory Police more
than five point five million dollars and the Department of
Attorney General and Justice one point nine million, totaling seven
point four million dollars. It is a stark increase on
the cost of an inquest into the domestic violence deaths
(00:23):
of four Aboriginal women, which costs just under five hundred
thousand dollars. The Chief Minister, Lea Finocchiaro joins me on
the line. Good morning to your Chief Minister. Let's try
that again. Hopefully we have got her on the line properly.
We're just having some issues with that phone. Good morning,
Chief Minister. Okay, let me just bear with me a moment.
(00:45):
Good morning, Chief Minister. Hopefully I've got you now, just
having some issues with the desk, Chief Minister. I was
just pointing out the cost of the coronial inquest into
the death of Kumanjai War five point five million dollars
for Northern Territory Police, the Department of Attorney General and
(01:07):
Justice one point nine million dollars, totaling seven point four
million dollars, Chief Minister, Do you think that that cost
is justified?
Speaker 2 (01:17):
No, Katie, it's an extraordinary amount of money. Extraordinary and
it's important that territorians understand what these types of activities cost. Now,
the coronial process is obviously a very important process. But
when a usual coronial inquest costs six thousand dollars and
one as complicated as the four domestic violence women costing
(01:37):
half a million, you can see how this one has
completely blown out. You can see how as a government
we are really concerned about how long the coroner is
taking to do these in quests and the amount of
money she's spending doing it. Because at the end of
the day, it's not her money, it's not my money,
it's your listener's money, Katie, and we have to be
making sure we're spending that on advancing the territory. And
(01:59):
so see, you've got to be getting that balance better.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
Who determines if that amount of money is appropriate in
these circumstances.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
Well, how it's currently structured? Is it the coroner? You know,
it has very wide ranging powers to be able to
run a coronial. How they know like the coronial to
go and then of course that then requires, depending on
what decisions are made, there wide ranging responses from organizations, individuals,
(02:28):
et cetera. So you can see that we've accrued significant
expense at a territory government level, you know, in the
order of around seven point four million. So it's a
huge amount of money, and you know, moving forward, we
like to see coronials done quicker, more efficiently and you know,
(02:49):
having good results.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
So what will you, as the Chief Minister do to
ensure that that is the case. Does it need to
be some changes to the Coroner's Act to rain in
some of these costs.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Yeah, I think that's something the Attorney General is looking
at as part of our broader justice reform package. I mean,
it's really important that our courts are working well and
all of our sort of statutory bodies that do these
types of work are working well as well. So there's
a lot of work to be done. I don't know
the exact details, and the Attorney General is much more
(03:22):
across that being her portfolio. But what I do know
is I think now that territories have heard the cost
they're sort of you know, I think everyone is glad
this has been put to bed. It's six years overdue.
It's it's you know, well, etching up to ten million
dollars in taxpayer money. It's done. Now.
Speaker 1 (03:39):
Look, I get that the Attorney General is more across this,
but for you, as the Chief Minister, do you think
there needs to be some changes to the Act and
are you going to ensure that you know that we
don't have another situation where a coronial costs this amount
of money.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Yeah, I guess I just don't know if it's in
the legislation that needs to be changed or whether there's
another mechanism't Katie. But I do know that we are
looking at this very closely. But what I will say
is I don't think colonials should cost this much ever,
so I think, you know, we can make that point
really clear.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Why do you think it costs so much this time?
Like what you know from the outside looking in, why
do you think it costs that much money?
Speaker 2 (04:21):
Oh, it's probably all of the travel that was required.
It would it would be all of the legal fee.
I mean probably a huge chunk of this is just
on legal fees, Katie. And you know, at the end
of the day, we need the community to benefit, not
the lawyers and of course there needs to be lawyers
involved in the process, but it's got to be a
(04:42):
coronial process has to look at what's happened and then
provide advice around how to how to get a better
outcome next time should that event happen again. And so
that's that's what it needs to do. And you know,
I think you know this kind of we do not
I want to see this kind of expense happening unless
it's absolutely necessary. And I think everyone felt that that
(05:05):
coronial went too long. It caused great distress to the family,
great distress to the police force and the community. And
ultimately it's now put to bed. We've got to go
through it and give our response. And much has already
changed just because it's more than half a decade old.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
Well just on that response, I mean, obviously the coroner
made a number of recommendations. What of those are the
government going to implement.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
Yep, So we haven't provided our formal response yet. A
lot have already been done. Some are very specific to
UENDUMU itself. They're across agency. So health has some components,
police has some components children and families, for example. So
we'll go through that now and work out what proposals
(05:51):
will take forward that haven't been done already, and we'll
also let people know which ones we have already worked on.
And of course we have to be really practical about that. Now,
you know, you can't gold plate things, and there's a
you know, to some extent, the recommendations have a wish
list that we won't be able to deliver on just
through sheer cost or logistics or just the ability to
(06:15):
deliver that goalplate aversion. But we've got to look to
it and there are lessons you can take from things.
Sometimes you might not accept a recommendation in fool, but
you can glean from it the outcome that's intended, and
then you can do something else to try and achieve
that outcome. So that's just the complicated work we've got
to go through now. And of course, like all coronials,
will provide our response publicly to the community and people
(06:38):
will be able to transparently see that.
Speaker 1 (06:40):
Okay, well, I mean, when do you anticipate that you're
going to be doing that.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
It'll probably take a couple of months, Katie. Where the
domestic violence Coronial we're providing a response to next week.
So it does take time because of the implications on
service delivery and sometimes budget pressure, and that's just a
process we have to go through. So you know, it
took three years for the Corona, it'll be all right
(07:06):
if it takes off for a couple of months to
let people know which ones we've done, which ones we're doing,
and which ones we won't be doing.
Speaker 1 (07:12):
All right, one area where I know that people certainly
want to see some action pretty quickly, as in Catherine
at the moment, I know you were there on the weekend.
Residents say that they're hurting after one particular incident last
week which saw the women at the coffee club assaulted
when they were there opening. Did you go in and
see the women at the coffee club?
Speaker 2 (07:33):
Yeah, I did. I went and saw Nicki and the team,
and it was just horrific, absolutely unacceptable. I mean, the
level of the terror of that event was just unbelievable.
And you know, it was amazing to see Nicki, you know, reopen.
The staff were there, the staff that had been assaulted
were there, and they were just getting on with the job.
(07:54):
An unbelievable story of resilience, Katie, unbelievable. So obviously I
talked to Nicki about you know, is there is there
anything more we can do from a premises perspective, But
at the end of the day, you know, businesses can't
operate locked. I mean, this is a beautiful cafe with
lovely glass windows that you can look out onto the streetscape.
It welcomes people into Catherine. You know, there's only so
(08:17):
much physically you can do. The rest has to be
about people's behavior and making sure that we're stamping down
on that level of horrendous criminal behavior.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
Chief Minister, in terms of you know, this incident, it's
it's absolutely horrific. We're going to be catching up with
Nikki just before ten o'clock to find out a little
bit more about how they are coping. But we are
continuing to see some terrible issues of crime. You and
I speak about it all the time. I mean, the
ALP is claiming that, you know, the approach that you
(08:48):
have got when it comes to crime isn't working. What
additional measures could we see in Catherine first off, to
try and help the people there.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Well, I don't think I ever have any credibility on
crime for starters, and to be honest, Katy, I don't
really think people are turning to them for solutions on
this issue. We are looking at Catherine specifically and what
more we can do there. But and again I hesitate
to read out crime stats, but I think it's important
for people to understand the progress we are making. So
(09:19):
when you looked January to May this year, which is
under US, compare it with January to May last year
under Labor Territory wide, we've got robbery down twenty nine percent,
house break ins down thirty one percent, commercial break ins
down sixteen, and theft down fifteen. Now some bits of
assault are up, and I'm not sugarcoating that. And if
we looked at to Catherine as well, we've had commercial
(09:42):
break ins down thirty six percent, house breakings down fourteen,
and theft down seventeen.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
Like I did it, I get that obviously there's some changes,
But if you were the women at the coffee club
that were assaulted, it really means nothing.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
Ye. Yes, yes, I think when I'm just trying to
explain is that Labour's rhetoric is nonsense. We have put
in place strong laws, we've got more people in prison,
we continue to back our police and do all of
those root causes of crime issues and it is working.
So we're not job done. There's no yay, crimes fixed.
(10:17):
But what I'm saying is in just eleven months we've
reduced some crime categories by around the thirty percent mark.
Now that's huge cold comfort to victims. I get it,
and much more work to do. I'm not using these
as a way to say, oh look business, this amazing.
What I'm saying is stick with us. What we are
doing is working, and we've only just started. You know,
(10:38):
we've got Use Justice Act reform next week, Traffic Act
is coming, Bail Actor is coming, and our police Public
Safety Offices will be starting at the end of this year.
That's where we're bringing in housing, transit and auxiliaries into
a new streamline of police with strong powers and equipment
(10:58):
that they need. And we've also got oc Sprace starting
on one September. So there's plenty in the pipe.
Speaker 1 (11:04):
Chief Minister Mark from Darwin's just messaged in and said,
could you please ask the Chief Minister how many transport
and housing officers have said that they want to transition
to police. I've been told it's only between one and five.
Is that the case?
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Yeah, Look, I don't know that detail and obviously we're
doing all of the change management with our stuff. I
think part of the problem is there's a bit of
a misunderstanding about what all of that looks like. But
we're working for each of the agencies, are working with
the staff through that change management to make sure people
understand their options and what that role looks like and
all of those things. So there's a lot of time
(11:43):
to go where we're having those conversations to get ready
for that first recruit cours in November December.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
This year, Chief Minister, you have indeed had meetings as
well in Darwin last week as I understand it, with
the queens Side Minister for Police, do you plan to
look at some of the legislation that's been introduced in
Queensland and see if it might be fit for purpose here.
I know that they've got you know, adult crime, adult time.
Is that something that you're looking at.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
Yeah, it's something we've had a look at and it
was great to catch up with Minister Purty because it's
always good. You know, we have a lot of similar
issues around youth crime, repeater fending, obviously, regional remote footprints.
There's a lot of similarities between the Northern Territory and Queensland.
They were very very keen to see what we've done
with bail as well, because we've had such terrific results
(12:31):
with that. So there was a lot of things that
we could share. We're certainly willing to work cooperatively. I
don't think everyone has to reinvent the wheel, and so
we'll continue those conversations. Certainly, Minister Purty was saying that
their adult Crime Adult Time was having a great impact,
and we were sharing even just some of the positive
(12:52):
impact we're having with school attendance offices and getting kids
to school and just enforcing the laws that currently exist.
And so he had lot to take away and so
did I. And it's just the start of more collaboration
and conversation between the state.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
Okay, I want to talk about the watchhouse in Palmerston.
The police associations say that it has reached crisis point.
Nathan Finn was on the show last week and said
that one hundred detainees were recorded in custody as of
Wednesday morning. That included seventy six correctional prisoners. I know
that those numbers ebb and flow from day to day,
(13:25):
but he reckons the situation is putting police officers, prisoners
and the broader community at an unacceptable risk. What's going
to be done on urgency to try and deal with
this situation?
Speaker 2 (13:40):
Well, I think the Police Association of all people wouldn't
want these criminals out on the street.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
So that in some cases that you know, there may
be a situation where police actually aren't then taking people
that should be going to the watchhouse to the watchouse
because there's no space for them.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
Well, I certainly haven't heard that, Katie, and that you
can't have your taken eat it too. You can't complain
the watchhouse is full and then complain that police can't
drop them off there. So it's not ideal, Katie, And
we've been very upfront about that. But let's face it,
our watchhouses were at this level under labor and the
streets were crawling with prims. So we've put online more
(14:17):
than six we're probably up to seven hundred more prison beds,
let alone prisoners since we've come to government. And yes,
the watchhouse has crept back up to high levels which
we sort of saw around that December January point. And
they do ebb and flow. It depends on court dates
and all that kind of stuff, but it's all It
(14:37):
is certainly not at levels we've seen in the past,
and we continue with our Corrections master Plan to build
more infrastructure, and we're working on a number of projects
that see obviously greater support for our police, more police
coming online. We've graduated more than one hundred and thirty
five constables since coming to government, so all of that
works on going. It's not ideal, but it is what
(14:59):
it is, and off cramped in a watchhouse than on
the street destroying other people's life.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
Look, I guess the problem here is so now you know,
Nathan Finn reckons that the tough on crime rhetoric is
not being matched with adequate planning or infrastructure investment, and
that frontline officers are paying the price. He's sort of
questioning why are police transporting prisoners to court and looking
after prisoners in watchhouses instead of being out on the
(15:26):
frontline dealing with crime. And I do think that that
is a question that everyday territorians would agree with.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
Yeah. Look, there's also a lot of posturing because there's
an EBA on book, Katie, So I'll reserve my judgment
on the comments. But at the end of the day,
we've brought in G four X, which is a private
company that runs correction services.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Are transporting them from the watch house.
Speaker 2 (15:50):
They are doing some they are so they're increasing in
numbers over the next couple of months. So undoubtedly there
will be police still performing that role, but we've brought
in GFRS and they're expanding their services over the next
couple of months, so that should dwindle down, which means
we can have more police out on the street instead
(16:12):
of doing that role which they've always which is not
yet exactly This is not a role that we've created
for police. This is something they've been doing for an
extremely long time. What we're trying to do is phase
them out of that, and that's where our police public
safety offices are going to be really important as well,
because it's going to really give reprieve to our constables
(16:32):
to be out on the frontline really dealing with those
higher end levels of crime. So there's a lot of
moving parts to this. It's certainly not job done, but
we are very very mindful of using police for non
policing roles, which is why we've done the gfours contract,
which is why we're moving to the police Public safety offices.
(16:53):
It's why we're building more beds. I mean, we've got
Beerrima back online. There's hundreds of people in there. We're
working really hard to get a Catherine Lawe.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
There's still not enough room for them though. That's I
suppose the problem. I think a lot of people listening
to the show will agree, you know, they do not
want people that are committing serious crimes out on the streets. Certainly,
no one's saying that, but I guess the concern is
that as those numbers grow, making sure that we have
got enough space for them. I know you've pointed out
(17:22):
what the government is doing, but particularly in that watchhouse,
you know, making sure that then our police aren't tied
up doing the jobs of correctional officers or of those
contractors as you've just touched on, and are actually out
there catching crimps.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
Yeah, and that's exactly what we want. So, you know,
we inherited an incredibly broken system, Katie. We're eleven months
in and we've built six hundred beds. I mean, that
is that is no small task and we are absolutely
fiercely committed to this. We've just brought online a new
facility in Alice Springs, the young people. We've got the
boot camp down there nearly finished, and the remand sent
(17:59):
and nearly finished, so there's lots of It's not just
in Darwin. We've also brought online eight more beds in
Tenant Creek, so that there is a lot happening. It
can't happen overnight. Building and constructing is you know, obviously
takes time, but we are absolutely committed to this. And
you know, I think people know that it's just we
ebb and flow on these issues, but at the end
(18:20):
of the day, they're better off jammed in a watchhouse
than out on the street. And our police now corrections
offices are unbelievably amazing. They are just dealing with it
and getting through it.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
Chee if we've got a little bit to get through,
and I know we're both pressed for time. The Police
Association are really annoyed about the situation with the retention bonus.
Is there going to be any possibility that you'll rethink
this retention bonus so that those that are maybe at
you know, eleven years still get the bonus, or those
that aren't quite on that milestone year but are obviously
(18:54):
very loyal to the force and have worked there for
a long time that they receive that bonus.
Speaker 2 (19:00):
Well, this is again just nonsense. Honestly, Katie, I don't
know how many times we can have this police retention
bonus conversation with the NTPA. We made an election commitment.
We have stuck to the election commitment, and then on
top of the election commitment, I've tipped in another nine
million dollars for retention bonuses. Now, the NTPA were very
(19:22):
critical about that. We've put it into the EBA. So
I've said, rather than a politician deciding how the bonus
should work, you, the NTPA, the people who represent police,
you work it out as part of the EBA. And
so that money has been tipped in and an offer
has gone out to our police, which is terrific. So
the retention bonus will be delivered as per the election commitment.
(19:45):
I've also added in several millions more dollars for retention
and the advice coming back from NTPA is that it's
better that all cops get more money rather than hitting milestones.
And so that's that's all been part of the EBA process.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
Katie, all right, Chief Finista, I'm going to move along
because there's plenty of people listening this morning who want
to know what the situation is with middle schools. We
know that they're set to be scrapped. How soon are
the middle school changes going to come into effect? I
know the Education Minister is out today with some updates.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
Yeah, it'll all be fully done by twenty twenty eight,
so it will require some staging. But we're really excited
to be delivering this reform. It's really important. We need
high quality schools for our kids, and certainly year seven
to twelve is going to give a much better continuity
and stability and access to career progression. So what we've
done is we are making sure that we have We
(20:40):
will have four seven to twelve schools in Dripstone, Nightcliff,
Sanderson and Darwam. They will be you know, so kids
can then do their entire high school at those schools.
We will then make sure that Casurina Senior College is
really focused on higher education for those kids who want
university pathways, will make sure Sanderson is focused on trades,
(21:00):
industry and technical for those kids who want those technical
pathways and trade pathways. In Palmerston, well Overdue Rosebury will
become a seven to twelve and Palmerston will become a
seven to twelve, so parents will have two choices here
in the Palmestan region and Alice Springs will have Centralian
Middle School as seven to nine and then again an
(21:22):
industry trade flexible education out at the Centralian College Senior
College site. So big changes, but it will be a
much better opportunity for kids to really target what they
want to do in life. And at the end of
the day, our kids need to understand the jobs of
the future, the jobs here in the territory, and so
our job as a government is to make sure that
(21:44):
they get that exposure in school, that we support them
with those pathways and hopefully they all finish year twelve
or whatever it is, whatever pathway they're on, and then
stay and become part of our workforce.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
Well, we will talk more about this this morning. I'll
give people a little further detail as well as the
morning Progressive Chief Minister. Before I let you go, I
just got a message from one of our listeners, So
good morning, Katie. Might be a bit late, but I'm
a road train operator and travel through Catherine and Tenant
Creek weekly during the night and get rocks thrown at
my truck often. Can you please bring this up with
(22:16):
the Chief Minister. Thank you, says that text, Chief Minister.
I guess it is just another example of the fact
that you know, there are, like there is still people
out on the streets doing whatever the hell they want
at the moment.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
Yeah, yeah, there is, and there absolutely is. And we've
had a decade where the government has turned a blind
eye and allowed people to engage in the most disgusting
of behavior. I mean, this is some of it we
can do quickly and we've seen some really good results,
and others is long term stuff. But at the end
of the day, it's unacceptable. The police will catch you,
(22:50):
we will put you in prison, and as a deputy
always says, we'll find a bed. But this is unacceptable
and we're doing everything we can in terms of stronger laws,
more per leeds, better opportunities for our police to engage
in the work that they need to be doing. And
then that root causes of crime stuff with getting kids
to school, the Circuit Breaker program through children and families.
(23:11):
We've got a Parental Responsibility Act coming through later this
year as well, and so it's about you know, all
of those other things to make sure people aren't turning
to a life of crime. But if you've turned to
a life of crime, the police will catch up with you.
Speaker 1 (23:25):
Chief Minister, we are going to have to leave it there.
Thank you, as always for your time this morning.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
Thank you take care of everything.
Speaker 1 (23:31):
Thank you.
Now. Last week on the show, we spoke more about
the cost of the long running inquest into the death
of kuman Jai Walker. It costs Northern Territory Police more
than five point five million dollars and the Department of
Attorney General and Justice one point nine million, totaling seven
point four million dollars. It is a stark increase on
the cost of an inquest into the domestic violence deaths
(00:23):
of four Aboriginal women, which costs just under five hundred
thousand dollars. The Chief Minister, Lea Finocchiaro joins me on
the line. Good morning to your Chief Minister. Let's try
that again. Hopefully we have got her on the line properly.
We're just having some issues with that phone. Good morning,
Chief Minister. Okay, let me just bear with me a moment.
(00:45):
Good morning, Chief Minister. Hopefully I've got you now, just
having some issues with the desk, Chief Minister. I was
just pointing out the cost of the coronial inquest into
the death of Kumanjai War five point five million dollars
for Northern Territory Police, the Department of Attorney General and
(01:07):
Justice one point nine million dollars, totaling seven point four
million dollars, Chief Minister, Do you think that that cost
is justified?
Speaker 2 (01:17):
No, Katie, it's an extraordinary amount of money. Extraordinary and
it's important that territorians understand what these types of activities cost. Now,
the coronial process is obviously a very important process. But
when a usual coronial inquest costs six thousand dollars and
one as complicated as the four domestic violence women costing
(01:37):
half a million, you can see how this one has
completely blown out. You can see how as a government
we are really concerned about how long the coroner is
taking to do these in quests and the amount of
money she's spending doing it. Because at the end of
the day, it's not her money, it's not my money,
it's your listener's money, Katie, and we have to be
making sure we're spending that on advancing the territory. And
(01:59):
so see, you've got to be getting that balance better.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
Who determines if that amount of money is appropriate in
these circumstances.
Speaker 2 (02:07):
Well, how it's currently structured? Is it the coroner? You know,
it has very wide ranging powers to be able to
run a coronial. How they know like the coronial to
go and then of course that then requires, depending on
what decisions are made, there wide ranging responses from organizations, individuals,
(02:28):
et cetera. So you can see that we've accrued significant
expense at a territory government level, you know, in the
order of around seven point four million. So it's a
huge amount of money, and you know, moving forward, we
like to see coronials done quicker, more efficiently and you know,
(02:49):
having good results.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
So what will you, as the Chief Minister do to
ensure that that is the case. Does it need to
be some changes to the Coroner's Act to rain in
some of these costs.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Yeah, I think that's something the Attorney General is looking
at as part of our broader justice reform package. I mean,
it's really important that our courts are working well and
all of our sort of statutory bodies that do these
types of work are working well as well. So there's
a lot of work to be done. I don't know
the exact details, and the Attorney General is much more
(03:22):
across that being her portfolio. But what I do know
is I think now that territories have heard the cost
they're sort of you know, I think everyone is glad
this has been put to bed. It's six years overdue.
It's it's you know, well, etching up to ten million
dollars in taxpayer money. It's done. Now.
Speaker 1 (03:39):
Look, I get that the Attorney General is more across this,
but for you, as the Chief Minister, do you think
there needs to be some changes to the Act and
are you going to ensure that you know that we
don't have another situation where a coronial costs this amount
of money.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Yeah, I guess I just don't know if it's in
the legislation that needs to be changed or whether there's
another mechanism't Katie. But I do know that we are
looking at this very closely. But what I will say
is I don't think colonials should cost this much ever,
so I think, you know, we can make that point
really clear.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
Why do you think it costs so much this time?
Like what you know from the outside looking in, why
do you think it costs that much money?
Speaker 2 (04:21):
Oh, it's probably all of the travel that was required.
It would it would be all of the legal fee.
I mean probably a huge chunk of this is just
on legal fees, Katie. And you know, at the end
of the day, we need the community to benefit, not
the lawyers and of course there needs to be lawyers
involved in the process, but it's got to be a
(04:42):
coronial process has to look at what's happened and then
provide advice around how to how to get a better
outcome next time should that event happen again. And so
that's that's what it needs to do. And you know,
I think you know this kind of we do not
I want to see this kind of expense happening unless
it's absolutely necessary. And I think everyone felt that that
(05:05):
coronial went too long. It caused great distress to the family,
great distress to the police force and the community. And
ultimately it's now put to bed. We've got to go
through it and give our response. And much has already
changed just because it's more than half a decade old.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
Well just on that response, I mean, obviously the coroner
made a number of recommendations. What of those are the
government going to implement.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
Yep, So we haven't provided our formal response yet. A
lot have already been done. Some are very specific to
UENDUMU itself. They're across agency. So health has some components,
police has some components children and families, for example. So
we'll go through that now and work out what proposals
(05:51):
will take forward that haven't been done already, and we'll
also let people know which ones we have already worked on.
And of course we have to be really practical about that. Now,
you know, you can't gold plate things, and there's a
you know, to some extent, the recommendations have a wish
list that we won't be able to deliver on just
through sheer cost or logistics or just the ability to
(06:15):
deliver that goalplate aversion. But we've got to look to
it and there are lessons you can take from things.
Sometimes you might not accept a recommendation in fool, but
you can glean from it the outcome that's intended, and
then you can do something else to try and achieve
that outcome. So that's just the complicated work we've got
to go through now. And of course, like all coronials,
will provide our response publicly to the community and people
(06:38):
will be able to transparently see that.
Speaker 1 (06:40):
Okay, well, I mean, when do you anticipate that you're
going to be doing that.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
It'll probably take a couple of months, Katie. Where the
domestic violence Coronial we're providing a response to next week.
So it does take time because of the implications on
service delivery and sometimes budget pressure, and that's just a
process we have to go through. So you know, it
took three years for the Corona, it'll be all right
(07:06):
if it takes off for a couple of months to
let people know which ones we've done, which ones we're doing,
and which ones we won't be doing.
Speaker 1 (07:12):
All right, one area where I know that people certainly
want to see some action pretty quickly, as in Catherine
at the moment, I know you were there on the weekend.
Residents say that they're hurting after one particular incident last
week which saw the women at the coffee club assaulted
when they were there opening. Did you go in and
see the women at the coffee club?
Speaker 2 (07:33):
Yeah, I did. I went and saw Nicki and the team,
and it was just horrific, absolutely unacceptable. I mean, the
level of the terror of that event was just unbelievable.
And you know, it was amazing to see Nicki, you know, reopen.
The staff were there, the staff that had been assaulted
were there, and they were just getting on with the job.
(07:54):
An unbelievable story of resilience, Katie, unbelievable. So obviously I
talked to Nicki about you know, is there is there
anything more we can do from a premises perspective, But
at the end of the day, you know, businesses can't
operate locked. I mean, this is a beautiful cafe with
lovely glass windows that you can look out onto the streetscape.
It welcomes people into Catherine. You know, there's only so
(08:17):
much physically you can do. The rest has to be
about people's behavior and making sure that we're stamping down
on that level of horrendous criminal behavior.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
Chief Minister, in terms of you know, this incident, it's
it's absolutely horrific. We're going to be catching up with
Nikki just before ten o'clock to find out a little
bit more about how they are coping. But we are
continuing to see some terrible issues of crime. You and
I speak about it all the time. I mean, the
ALP is claiming that, you know, the approach that you
(08:48):
have got when it comes to crime isn't working. What
additional measures could we see in Catherine first off, to
try and help the people there.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Well, I don't think I ever have any credibility on
crime for starters, and to be honest, Katy, I don't
really think people are turning to them for solutions on
this issue. We are looking at Catherine specifically and what
more we can do there. But and again I hesitate
to read out crime stats, but I think it's important
for people to understand the progress we are making. So
(09:19):
when you looked January to May this year, which is
under US, compare it with January to May last year
under Labor Territory wide, we've got robbery down twenty nine percent,
house break ins down thirty one percent, commercial break ins
down sixteen, and theft down fifteen. Now some bits of
assault are up, and I'm not sugarcoating that. And if
we looked at to Catherine as well, we've had commercial
(09:42):
break ins down thirty six percent, house breakings down fourteen,
and theft down seventeen.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
Like I did it, I get that obviously there's some changes,
But if you were the women at the coffee club
that were assaulted, it really means nothing.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
Ye. Yes, yes, I think when I'm just trying to
explain is that Labour's rhetoric is nonsense. We have put
in place strong laws, we've got more people in prison,
we continue to back our police and do all of
those root causes of crime issues and it is working.
So we're not job done. There's no yay, crimes fixed.
(10:17):
But what I'm saying is in just eleven months we've
reduced some crime categories by around the thirty percent mark.
Now that's huge cold comfort to victims. I get it,
and much more work to do. I'm not using these
as a way to say, oh look business, this amazing.
What I'm saying is stick with us. What we are
doing is working, and we've only just started. You know,
(10:38):
we've got Use Justice Act reform next week, Traffic Act
is coming, Bail Actor is coming, and our police Public
Safety Offices will be starting at the end of this year.
That's where we're bringing in housing, transit and auxiliaries into
a new streamline of police with strong powers and equipment
(10:58):
that they need. And we've also got oc Sprace starting
on one September. So there's plenty in the pipe.
Speaker 1 (11:04):
Chief Minister Mark from Darwin's just messaged in and said,
could you please ask the Chief Minister how many transport
and housing officers have said that they want to transition
to police. I've been told it's only between one and five.
Is that the case?
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Yeah, Look, I don't know that detail and obviously we're
doing all of the change management with our stuff. I
think part of the problem is there's a bit of
a misunderstanding about what all of that looks like. But
we're working for each of the agencies, are working with
the staff through that change management to make sure people
understand their options and what that role looks like and
all of those things. So there's a lot of time
(11:43):
to go where we're having those conversations to get ready
for that first recruit cours in November December.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
This year, Chief Minister, you have indeed had meetings as
well in Darwin last week as I understand it, with
the queens Side Minister for Police, do you plan to
look at some of the legislation that's been introduced in
Queensland and see if it might be fit for purpose here.
I know that they've got you know, adult crime, adult time.
Is that something that you're looking at.
Speaker 2 (12:08):
Yeah, it's something we've had a look at and it
was great to catch up with Minister Purty because it's
always good. You know, we have a lot of similar
issues around youth crime, repeater fending, obviously, regional remote footprints.
There's a lot of similarities between the Northern Territory and Queensland.
They were very very keen to see what we've done
with bail as well, because we've had such terrific results
(12:31):
with that. So there was a lot of things that
we could share. We're certainly willing to work cooperatively. I
don't think everyone has to reinvent the wheel, and so
we'll continue those conversations. Certainly, Minister Purty was saying that
their adult Crime Adult Time was having a great impact,
and we were sharing even just some of the positive
(12:52):
impact we're having with school attendance offices and getting kids
to school and just enforcing the laws that currently exist.
And so he had lot to take away and so
did I. And it's just the start of more collaboration
and conversation between the state.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
Okay, I want to talk about the watchhouse in Palmerston.
The police associations say that it has reached crisis point.
Nathan Finn was on the show last week and said
that one hundred detainees were recorded in custody as of
Wednesday morning. That included seventy six correctional prisoners. I know
that those numbers ebb and flow from day to day,
(13:25):
but he reckons the situation is putting police officers, prisoners
and the broader community at an unacceptable risk. What's going
to be done on urgency to try and deal with
this situation?
Speaker 2 (13:40):
Well, I think the Police Association of all people wouldn't
want these criminals out on the street.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
So that in some cases that you know, there may
be a situation where police actually aren't then taking people
that should be going to the watchhouse to the watchouse
because there's no space for them.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
Well, I certainly haven't heard that, Katie, and that you
can't have your taken eat it too. You can't complain
the watchhouse is full and then complain that police can't
drop them off there. So it's not ideal, Katie, And
we've been very upfront about that. But let's face it,
our watchhouses were at this level under labor and the
streets were crawling with prims. So we've put online more
(14:17):
than six we're probably up to seven hundred more prison beds,
let alone prisoners since we've come to government. And yes,
the watchhouse has crept back up to high levels which
we sort of saw around that December January point. And
they do ebb and flow. It depends on court dates
and all that kind of stuff, but it's all It
(14:37):
is certainly not at levels we've seen in the past,
and we continue with our Corrections master Plan to build
more infrastructure, and we're working on a number of projects
that see obviously greater support for our police, more police
coming online. We've graduated more than one hundred and thirty
five constables since coming to government, so all of that
works on going. It's not ideal, but it is what
(14:59):
it is, and off cramped in a watchhouse than on
the street destroying other people's life.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
Look, I guess the problem here is so now you know,
Nathan Finn reckons that the tough on crime rhetoric is
not being matched with adequate planning or infrastructure investment, and
that frontline officers are paying the price. He's sort of
questioning why are police transporting prisoners to court and looking
after prisoners in watchhouses instead of being out on the
(15:26):
frontline dealing with crime. And I do think that that
is a question that everyday territorians would agree with.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
Yeah. Look, there's also a lot of posturing because there's
an EBA on book, Katie, So I'll reserve my judgment
on the comments. But at the end of the day,
we've brought in G four X, which is a private
company that runs correction services.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Are transporting them from the watch house.
Speaker 2 (15:50):
They are doing some they are so they're increasing in
numbers over the next couple of months. So undoubtedly there
will be police still performing that role, but we've brought
in GFRS and they're expanding their services over the next
couple of months, so that should dwindle down, which means
we can have more police out on the street instead
(16:12):
of doing that role which they've always which is not
yet exactly This is not a role that we've created
for police. This is something they've been doing for an
extremely long time. What we're trying to do is phase
them out of that, and that's where our police public
safety offices are going to be really important as well,
because it's going to really give reprieve to our constables
(16:32):
to be out on the frontline really dealing with those
higher end levels of crime. So there's a lot of
moving parts to this. It's certainly not job done, but
we are very very mindful of using police for non
policing roles, which is why we've done the gfours contract,
which is why we're moving to the police Public safety offices.
(16:53):
It's why we're building more beds. I mean, we've got
Beerrima back online. There's hundreds of people in there. We're
working really hard to get a Catherine Lawe.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
There's still not enough room for them though. That's I
suppose the problem. I think a lot of people listening
to the show will agree, you know, they do not
want people that are committing serious crimes out on the streets. Certainly,
no one's saying that, but I guess the concern is
that as those numbers grow, making sure that we have
got enough space for them. I know you've pointed out
(17:22):
what the government is doing, but particularly in that watchhouse,
you know, making sure that then our police aren't tied
up doing the jobs of correctional officers or of those
contractors as you've just touched on, and are actually out
there catching crimps.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
Yeah, and that's exactly what we want. So, you know,
we inherited an incredibly broken system, Katie. We're eleven months
in and we've built six hundred beds. I mean, that
is that is no small task and we are absolutely
fiercely committed to this. We've just brought online a new
facility in Alice Springs, the young people. We've got the
boot camp down there nearly finished, and the remand sent
(17:59):
and nearly finished, so there's lots of It's not just
in Darwin. We've also brought online eight more beds in
Tenant Creek, so that there is a lot happening. It
can't happen overnight. Building and constructing is you know, obviously
takes time, but we are absolutely committed to this. And
you know, I think people know that it's just we
ebb and flow on these issues, but at the end
(18:20):
of the day, they're better off jammed in a watchhouse
than out on the street. And our police now corrections
offices are unbelievably amazing. They are just dealing with it
and getting through it.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
Chee if we've got a little bit to get through,
and I know we're both pressed for time. The Police
Association are really annoyed about the situation with the retention bonus.
Is there going to be any possibility that you'll rethink
this retention bonus so that those that are maybe at
you know, eleven years still get the bonus, or those
that aren't quite on that milestone year but are obviously
(18:54):
very loyal to the force and have worked there for
a long time that they receive that bonus.
Speaker 2 (19:00):
Well, this is again just nonsense. Honestly, Katie, I don't
know how many times we can have this police retention
bonus conversation with the NTPA. We made an election commitment.
We have stuck to the election commitment, and then on
top of the election commitment, I've tipped in another nine
million dollars for retention bonuses. Now, the NTPA were very
(19:22):
critical about that. We've put it into the EBA. So
I've said, rather than a politician deciding how the bonus
should work, you, the NTPA, the people who represent police,
you work it out as part of the EBA. And
so that money has been tipped in and an offer
has gone out to our police, which is terrific. So
the retention bonus will be delivered as per the election commitment.
(19:45):
I've also added in several millions more dollars for retention
and the advice coming back from NTPA is that it's
better that all cops get more money rather than hitting milestones.
And so that's that's all been part of the EBA process.
Speaker 1 (20:00):
Katie, all right, Chief Finista, I'm going to move along
because there's plenty of people listening this morning who want
to know what the situation is with middle schools. We
know that they're set to be scrapped. How soon are
the middle school changes going to come into effect? I
know the Education Minister is out today with some updates.
Speaker 2 (20:18):
Yeah, it'll all be fully done by twenty twenty eight,
so it will require some staging. But we're really excited
to be delivering this reform. It's really important. We need
high quality schools for our kids, and certainly year seven
to twelve is going to give a much better continuity
and stability and access to career progression. So what we've
done is we are making sure that we have We
(20:40):
will have four seven to twelve schools in Dripstone, Nightcliff,
Sanderson and Darwam. They will be you know, so kids
can then do their entire high school at those schools.
We will then make sure that Casurina Senior College is
really focused on higher education for those kids who want
university pathways, will make sure Sanderson is focused on trades,
(21:00):
industry and technical for those kids who want those technical
pathways and trade pathways. In Palmerston, well Overdue Rosebury will
become a seven to twelve and Palmerston will become a
seven to twelve, so parents will have two choices here
in the Palmestan region and Alice Springs will have Centralian
Middle School as seven to nine and then again an
(21:22):
industry trade flexible education out at the Centralian College Senior
College site. So big changes, but it will be a
much better opportunity for kids to really target what they
want to do in life. And at the end of
the day, our kids need to understand the jobs of
the future, the jobs here in the territory, and so
our job as a government is to make sure that
(21:44):
they get that exposure in school, that we support them
with those pathways and hopefully they all finish year twelve
or whatever it is, whatever pathway they're on, and then
stay and become part of our workforce.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
Well, we will talk more about this this morning. I'll
give people a little further detail as well as the
morning Progressive Chief Minister. Before I let you go, I
just got a message from one of our listeners, So
good morning, Katie. Might be a bit late, but I'm
a road train operator and travel through Catherine and Tenant
Creek weekly during the night and get rocks thrown at
my truck often. Can you please bring this up with
(22:16):
the Chief Minister. Thank you, says that text, Chief Minister.
I guess it is just another example of the fact
that you know, there are, like there is still people
out on the streets doing whatever the hell they want
at the moment.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
Yeah, yeah, there is, and there absolutely is. And we've
had a decade where the government has turned a blind
eye and allowed people to engage in the most disgusting
of behavior. I mean, this is some of it we
can do quickly and we've seen some really good results,
and others is long term stuff. But at the end
of the day, it's unacceptable. The police will catch you,
(22:50):
we will put you in prison, and as a deputy
always says, we'll find a bed. But this is unacceptable
and we're doing everything we can in terms of stronger laws,
more per leeds, better opportunities for our police to engage
in the work that they need to be doing. And
then that root causes of crime stuff with getting kids
to school, the Circuit Breaker program through children and families.
(23:11):
We've got a Parental Responsibility Act coming through later this
year as well, and so it's about you know, all
of those other things to make sure people aren't turning
to a life of crime. But if you've turned to
a life of crime, the police will catch up with you.
Speaker 1 (23:25):
Chief Minister, we are going to have to leave it there.
Thank you, as always for your time this morning.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
Thank you take care of everything.
Speaker 1 (23:31):
Thank you.
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