Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Now we know a new industry Skills and Employment initiatives
being launched that's going to see Northern Territory prisoners undertake
training and education during incarceration in an effort to become
ready to enter the workforce. Now it aims to reduce recidivism,
to drive down prisoner numbers and also help employers will
fill critical skills gaps. The Northern Territories spending a total
(00:23):
of two million dollars on prisoner training for men, women
and youth. But joining us in the studio to talk
more about the situation for men and women is the
Deputy Corrections Commissioner Kim McKay. Good morning to you, Good morning,
thanks for having me, Thanks so much for your time,
Deputy Commissioner. How will the industry's Skills and Employment initiative
work exactly?
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Yeah, thanks Coatie. At the election, the government committed to
two major changes of work. One was sentenced to a
skill and the other was a revised work around sentence
to a job, So we're calling it sentence to a
job two point zero and sentenced to a skill. Primarily
is a modernization of our education system with a really
(01:06):
big focus on aligning vocational training and education whilst in custody,
towards what the demands of the community are as in
our growing employment sector across the whole of the Northern Territory.
Speaker 1 (01:17):
So what kind of jobs or what kind of industries
might they be able to enter into.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Yeah, there's a significant drive around civil and construction and
that's a lot of our historical spaces. But we're really
starting to work more in the service industries as well,
and looking into what we can do around tourism and
land management and a larger consideration around the more diversity
in our community and where we can actually spread our
(01:43):
employment options out into these more remote and regional locations.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
Now, Deputy Commissioner, I know some people will be listening
right now and thinking, oh, what kind of you know,
like where are they going to go to work? Are
they going to be supervised? How exactly does this happen?
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Yeah, look, you know obviously the time frames to deliver
them model is a three year plan, but a lot
of our work it has been around the Sentence to
a Job piece over the last few months, and the
Sentence to a Job will deliver four stages of support.
The first stage is around the original prison employment program,
which sees people working prior to release in real jobs,
(02:20):
and that's our low security, our more safe element of
the community, getting them ready to go out earning money,
working on financial security, and building their skills. The second
part is an expansion of the community employment participation model.
So we'll be engaging with a service provider in January,
and we've gone out to deliver that process as fast
(02:43):
as possible to make sure we've got a case managed
employment pathway for prisoners pre and post release, and they'll
have supported pathways up to twelve months post release.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
Okay, So when you I mean you mentioned just a
moment ago that they'll be doing some of that work
prior to release. Does that mean they're sort of looking
in jobs within the prison or are they already out,
you know, doing some of these different jobs. And I
guess some of us might not even realize.
Speaker 2 (03:08):
Yeah, there's two elements to that. The first element is
we are a large business and we provide lots of
meals and lots of laundry and lots of cleaning and
lots of services inside the prison. So that's our starting
point with our entry level employment. But this model actually
is a continuation out into community and prior to release.
(03:28):
We want to see people going into real employment and
to support that, we're working on a partnership with NTOBN
who are setting up an employment pathways model for us
through the Indigenous Employment Network in the Northern Territory.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
Yeah. Look, I know for me, as I listen, I'm thinking, look,
I really think that there does need to be job
opportunities for those that are serving time in prison. And
you know, you want those recidivism rates reduced, and if
somebody is able to secure a job and if they
are able to have that purpose, then hopefully it helps
with the reduction of that recidivism. But then I also think,
(04:04):
all right, well, I want to make sure there's community safety.
So is there sort of oversight of the prisoners once
they are released into the workforce as that work does
get underway.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
There's mixed oversight Katie, So depending on where people are
in their sentence journey. But when people are discharged to freedom,
they are at freedom. So the important link for us
is to make sure they're engaged in real employment and
they're engaged with employers who want to work with them
to provide those supports and have a full understanding of
the needs of people coming out of custody, and that's
(04:35):
part of the reason why we've done a lot of
work with NTBN, because we really believe that, you know,
understanding the community and understanding the cohorts of people we
work with and making sure they link to employers is critical.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Now I understand that the initiative is also sort of
in partnership with Charles Dalen University. You touched on this,
how like, what's the unis involvement in the initiative? How
does that work?
Speaker 2 (05:00):
We have a service level agreement with Charles Darwin University
to deliver all of our training. They work with us
right at that front end stage to deliver language, literacy
and numeracy training, so entry level supports right through into
that vocational sector. And they've been working with us to
map out training to make sure we can get people certified,
(05:22):
to get people tickets and align those tickets to what
industry needs in the territory.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
Are Deputy Commissioner in terms of the commencement of the program.
I know from what you've told us some of that
work sort of already happens. But with the new aspects
of this, when's it all going to get underway?
Speaker 2 (05:41):
Yeah, So obviously we're our training and education and employment
piece is a longstanding piece of work that we have
in corrections, but the model itself officially launched last Thursday
on the second. We launched it out at Darwin Correctional
Center with our Minister and three key partners being NTBN
in TRACK, which is a large Aboriginal employer in the
(06:02):
territory working in civil mining and in community services, and
also with child Starwin University, and we're hoping to get
some more media out after this morning's conversation with you.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
How do you hope that it will sort of help
to see a reduction in that recidivism as well and
ultimately a reduction in crime.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Yeah. I think one of the big things is financial independence, Katie,
and we know that financial independence is one of those
critical steps. The other aspect is about trust and opportunity
and one of the challenges that we've had in the
territory is to develop out that trust and opportunity with
the community and this is a big step forward for us.
And ten years ago this program was delivering about one
(06:46):
hundred permanent employees into the community and we're looking to
really drive that ahead and we've had a lot of
interest in this model, and we'll be really pushing it
over the next coming months.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
Hey, before I let you go, how have things been
out at the prison? And I'm in across corrections right
across the board. How those numbers looking. We were catching
up with yourself and also Matthew Valley on a much
more regular basis because those numbers were huge. How are
they going at the moments?
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Yeah, Currently we've got a capacity of three thousand and
eighty two beds in our system, so we're still continuing
to transition from short term beds into that long term,
permanent space. But when we spoke to you last time,
you know, in around August, we were sitting around two
thousand and eight hundred and eighty five prisoners. Today we're
at two eight hundred and forty six, which is a
(07:39):
positive step forward, which means people are out in the community,
they're staying in the community, which is a good outcome.
Watchhouses are a bit of a challenge still in that.
Currently today we've got twenty one in the watchhouse. But
when I say a challenge, we were talking around hundreds
last time. So by the end of the week we'll
have those eight eighteen of those males decanted out of
(08:02):
there and we'll be back into low numbers. And I
think we're starting to see those normal fluctuations in and
out of watchouses after normal police business.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
Yeah. Look, that is good to hear, and it's good
to see those numbers dropping slightly. I hope that that
ultimately means that it's less people committing crimes. So you know,
hopefully we continue to see those numbers drop and the
rates of crime drop as well. With the watch housers.
So twenty one that was in Darwin, wasn't it. How
(08:30):
are we still utilizing our correction, still utilizing some of
the other watchousers and how they gone?
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Yeah, so today it was actually nineteen in Alice Springs,
so eighteen males and one female, so we'll be decanning
them out over this week. There was only one male
and Catherine one male in Palmerston today.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
Right, Those numbers have significantly changed, haven't they. Is that
also I mean, I know you've touched on those numbers dropping,
but is that also really quite helpful that you've got
the additional beads.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Yeahditional beds, and I think what we're starting to see
is our programs and services starting to kick in. You know,
the more we can unlock, the more services we can
provide to people, The more staff we bring on, the
better the service provision we can provide, and our focus
on rehabilitation really starts to be at the forefront of
what we're trying to deliver.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
Well, Deputy Corrections Commissioner Kim McKay, thanks so much for
your time this morning. Really appreciate you having a chat
with us.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
Thank you very much.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
Thank you
Now we know a new industry Skills and Employment initiatives
being launched that's going to see Northern Territory prisoners undertake
training and education during incarceration in an effort to become
ready to enter the workforce. Now it aims to reduce recidivism,
to drive down prisoner numbers and also help employers will
fill critical skills gaps. The Northern Territories spending a total
(00:23):
of two million dollars on prisoner training for men, women
and youth. But joining us in the studio to talk
more about the situation for men and women is the
Deputy Corrections Commissioner Kim McKay. Good morning to you, Good morning,
thanks for having me, Thanks so much for your time,
Deputy Commissioner. How will the industry's Skills and Employment initiative
work exactly?
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Yeah, thanks Coatie. At the election, the government committed to
two major changes of work. One was sentenced to a
skill and the other was a revised work around sentence
to a job, So we're calling it sentence to a
job two point zero and sentenced to a skill. Primarily
is a modernization of our education system with a really
(01:06):
big focus on aligning vocational training and education whilst in custody,
towards what the demands of the community are as in
our growing employment sector across the whole of the Northern Territory.
Speaker 1 (01:17):
So what kind of jobs or what kind of industries
might they be able to enter into.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Yeah, there's a significant drive around civil and construction and
that's a lot of our historical spaces. But we're really
starting to work more in the service industries as well,
and looking into what we can do around tourism and
land management and a larger consideration around the more diversity
in our community and where we can actually spread our
(01:43):
employment options out into these more remote and regional locations.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
Now, Deputy Commissioner, I know some people will be listening
right now and thinking, oh, what kind of you know,
like where are they going to go to work? Are
they going to be supervised? How exactly does this happen?
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Yeah, look, you know obviously the time frames to deliver
them model is a three year plan, but a lot
of our work it has been around the Sentence to
a Job piece over the last few months, and the
Sentence to a Job will deliver four stages of support.
The first stage is around the original prison employment program,
which sees people working prior to release in real jobs,
(02:20):
and that's our low security, our more safe element of
the community, getting them ready to go out earning money,
working on financial security, and building their skills. The second
part is an expansion of the community employment participation model.
So we'll be engaging with a service provider in January,
and we've gone out to deliver that process as fast
(02:43):
as possible to make sure we've got a case managed
employment pathway for prisoners pre and post release, and they'll
have supported pathways up to twelve months post release.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
Okay, So when you I mean you mentioned just a
moment ago that they'll be doing some of that work
prior to release. Does that mean they're sort of looking
in jobs within the prison or are they already out,
you know, doing some of these different jobs. And I
guess some of us might not even realize.
Speaker 2 (03:08):
Yeah, there's two elements to that. The first element is
we are a large business and we provide lots of
meals and lots of laundry and lots of cleaning and
lots of services inside the prison. So that's our starting
point with our entry level employment. But this model actually
is a continuation out into community and prior to release.
(03:28):
We want to see people going into real employment and
to support that, we're working on a partnership with NTOBN
who are setting up an employment pathways model for us
through the Indigenous Employment Network in the Northern Territory.
Speaker 1 (03:42):
Yeah. Look, I know for me, as I listen, I'm thinking, look,
I really think that there does need to be job
opportunities for those that are serving time in prison. And
you know, you want those recidivism rates reduced, and if
somebody is able to secure a job and if they
are able to have that purpose, then hopefully it helps
with the reduction of that recidivism. But then I also think,
(04:04):
all right, well, I want to make sure there's community safety.
So is there sort of oversight of the prisoners once
they are released into the workforce as that work does
get underway.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
There's mixed oversight Katie, So depending on where people are
in their sentence journey. But when people are discharged to freedom,
they are at freedom. So the important link for us
is to make sure they're engaged in real employment and
they're engaged with employers who want to work with them
to provide those supports and have a full understanding of
the needs of people coming out of custody, and that's
(04:35):
part of the reason why we've done a lot of
work with NTBN, because we really believe that, you know,
understanding the community and understanding the cohorts of people we
work with and making sure they link to employers is critical.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Now I understand that the initiative is also sort of
in partnership with Charles Dalen University. You touched on this,
how like, what's the unis involvement in the initiative? How
does that work?
Speaker 2 (05:00):
We have a service level agreement with Charles Darwin University
to deliver all of our training. They work with us
right at that front end stage to deliver language, literacy
and numeracy training, so entry level supports right through into
that vocational sector. And they've been working with us to
map out training to make sure we can get people certified,
(05:22):
to get people tickets and align those tickets to what
industry needs in the territory.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
Are Deputy Commissioner in terms of the commencement of the program.
I know from what you've told us some of that
work sort of already happens. But with the new aspects
of this, when's it all going to get underway?
Speaker 2 (05:41):
Yeah, So obviously we're our training and education and employment
piece is a longstanding piece of work that we have
in corrections, but the model itself officially launched last Thursday
on the second. We launched it out at Darwin Correctional
Center with our Minister and three key partners being NTBN
in TRACK, which is a large Aboriginal employer in the
(06:02):
territory working in civil mining and in community services, and
also with child Starwin University, and we're hoping to get
some more media out after this morning's conversation with you.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
How do you hope that it will sort of help
to see a reduction in that recidivism as well and
ultimately a reduction in crime.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Yeah. I think one of the big things is financial independence, Katie,
and we know that financial independence is one of those
critical steps. The other aspect is about trust and opportunity
and one of the challenges that we've had in the
territory is to develop out that trust and opportunity with
the community and this is a big step forward for us.
And ten years ago this program was delivering about one
(06:46):
hundred permanent employees into the community and we're looking to
really drive that ahead and we've had a lot of
interest in this model, and we'll be really pushing it
over the next coming months.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
Hey, before I let you go, how have things been
out at the prison? And I'm in across corrections right
across the board. How those numbers looking. We were catching
up with yourself and also Matthew Valley on a much
more regular basis because those numbers were huge. How are
they going at the moments?
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Yeah, Currently we've got a capacity of three thousand and
eighty two beds in our system, so we're still continuing
to transition from short term beds into that long term,
permanent space. But when we spoke to you last time,
you know, in around August, we were sitting around two
thousand and eight hundred and eighty five prisoners. Today we're
at two eight hundred and forty six, which is a
(07:39):
positive step forward, which means people are out in the community,
they're staying in the community, which is a good outcome.
Watchhouses are a bit of a challenge still in that.
Currently today we've got twenty one in the watchhouse. But
when I say a challenge, we were talking around hundreds
last time. So by the end of the week we'll
have those eight eighteen of those males decanted out of
(08:02):
there and we'll be back into low numbers. And I
think we're starting to see those normal fluctuations in and
out of watchouses after normal police business.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
Yeah. Look, that is good to hear, and it's good
to see those numbers dropping slightly. I hope that that
ultimately means that it's less people committing crimes. So you know,
hopefully we continue to see those numbers drop and the
rates of crime drop as well. With the watch housers.
So twenty one that was in Darwin, wasn't it. How
(08:30):
are we still utilizing our correction, still utilizing some of
the other watchousers and how they gone?
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Yeah, so today it was actually nineteen in Alice Springs,
so eighteen males and one female, so we'll be decanning
them out over this week. There was only one male
and Catherine one male in Palmerston today.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
Right, Those numbers have significantly changed, haven't they. Is that
also I mean, I know you've touched on those numbers dropping,
but is that also really quite helpful that you've got
the additional beads.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Yeahditional beds, and I think what we're starting to see
is our programs and services starting to kick in. You know,
the more we can unlock, the more services we can
provide to people, The more staff we bring on, the
better the service provision we can provide, and our focus
on rehabilitation really starts to be at the forefront of
what we're trying to deliver.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
Well, Deputy Corrections Commissioner Kim McKay, thanks so much for
your time this morning. Really appreciate you having a chat
with us.
Speaker 2 (09:25):
Thank you very much.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
Thank you
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