The Week That Was – 19th July 2024

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
It's time for the week. That was Where shall we
go first? Murray Claire Boothby with the CLP.

Speaker 2 (00:05):
Good morning to you, Murray.

Speaker 3 (00:06):
Claire, Morning Katie and to your listeners.

Speaker 2 (00:08):
Great to have you in the studio. Matt Cunningham from
Sky News.

Speaker 1 (00:11):
Good to see your maskkat looking a bit.

Speaker 4 (00:14):
Cold there, bluddy freezing.

Speaker 2 (00:16):
I forgot your jump up. Gezy Appurric, Good morning to
your not eighteen.

Speaker 3 (00:20):
It was ten point eight at seven o'clock. It's a
shampoo would come out of my bottless frozen.

Speaker 2 (00:29):
Really wash my hair. It doesn't draw well.

Speaker 5 (00:34):
Ere they to spend the winter in Melbourne.

Speaker 6 (00:39):
When you get up in the morning and you have
to chip the ice off your windscreen'll.

Speaker 2 (00:44):
Put their hairs on your chest.

Speaker 1 (00:46):
And then, of course Joel Bowden for the Labor Party,
Good morning to you, John.

Speaker 5 (00:50):
Good morning, and I do have my single it on
and my scarf, my Matilda's scarf around Thank you for lending.

Speaker 7 (00:56):
It to me.

Speaker 2 (00:56):
No worries.

Speaker 1 (00:57):
There's always warm clothes on my chair out in the office.
If anybody needs a business jacket, not sure.

Speaker 2 (01:02):
If all right, let's get into it.

Speaker 1 (01:10):
There is so much to discuss this morning, and we
might kick off with the fact that yesterday was the
first leader's debate ahead of the election, moderated by Matt Cunningham.

Speaker 2 (01:21):
Mash how did he go?

Speaker 4 (01:24):
Look, it was interesting, It was interesting there.

Speaker 6 (01:28):
It was interesting that, like you would think that that
the incumbent Chief Minister would be the one trying to
play the straight bat and the opposition leader would be
the one trying to attack, but it sort of happened
the other way around. So I think, you know, Leah
was very much on message, you know, and I think
trying to keep things up beaten positive, and Eva was

(01:49):
certainly trying to dig a few holes into the CLP.
So yeah, it was I mean, it was a great day.
There were sort of three hundred people there at at
Mindle Beach for the NT News Futures event, and you know,
it was a pretty short debate. It only went for
twenty five minutes, but you know, both sides were trying
to lay out their vision for the economic future, pretty

(02:13):
similar on most areas these days now that sort of
labors all in on the oil and gas industry.

Speaker 4 (02:17):
So, you know, but I think it was a good day.
I don't know who the winner was.

Speaker 6 (02:22):
I suppose that's for others to decide, well, that's exactly right.
It was an interesting debate, good way to kick it off.

Speaker 1 (02:26):
I think it was somebody an observer had said to
me that, yes, they also found it interesting that they
thought that the Chief Minister had sort of gone negative
early or gone you know, sort of gotten. I don't
know whether it was sort of I don't think it
was angry, but more sort of major pointing homes at
the seal pit. And you do expect that, You certainly
do expect that with any debate, but yeah, when it

(02:47):
comes to the economy, I suppose it's an interesting one.
I did note and certainly heard on nine News last
night the grab where where I think Evil Lula had said,
you know, we've got a lot of you know, a
lot in the pipeline and a lot of of major
works in the pipeline, and Leof and Occhio had sort
of said, you know, eleven billion dollars in debt and
then you've only delivered a shade structure and.

Speaker 3 (03:09):
That doesn't show well.

Speaker 1 (03:10):
Yeah, and this is I think the problem the Labor
Party has got at the moment as we lead into
the election. And I could be I'm happy to be corrected.
But you know, when it comes to that track record
on a lot of things, there's not a huge number
of sort of of wealth generating projects it can shine
a light on.

Speaker 3 (03:29):
I mean, museum and art garriers are all very nice
and add to the mix of a community. But the
wealth creation comes from the resource industry, in the pastoral industry,
the fishing industry, but particularly the resources industry. And that's
where you know it's will. They will grow and develop
despite governments, not because of governments, but if government is
there to support and expedite approval processes without cutting corners,

(03:51):
of course, then more the better. And if Leofanocchia and
the COLP say they're going to streamline approval processes better
or more efficient, more effectively, well that can only benefit
the industry or industries plural. Because we still our biggest
competitor is Western Australia. We've got to entice people here
for either mining or oil and gas and for them
to set up a base here. That's one of the

(04:12):
biggest things that's lacking at the moment is getting these
people to set up their offices here and stay here.
Don't just come in for five minutes for and then
go back to Perth and kuse you.

Speaker 5 (04:21):
This is something that Catherine Hillmouth articulated yesterday about exploration
and that there's a lot of exploration going on. And
I will just say that ten or eleven billion dollars
investment from the territory government over the last eight years
is a significant amount. And I went to the Day
On Major Business Group presentation. They had an economist and

(04:42):
we had the futurists yesterday, and what the Day On
Major Business Group said fundamentally was that private investment hadn't
kicked in in the Northern Territory and that the government
was doing the heavy lifting.

Speaker 7 (04:52):
Now that's their report, but I agree with it.

Speaker 5 (04:55):
Eleven to twelve billion, sorry, eleven to twelve billion dollars
of investment across the Northern Territory and we see it
all the time, and it's actually creating jobs with people,
and then that money is in the economy. The private
investment just hasn't been there, and the cost of capital
over the last six to eight years has been a
bit of an impediment.

Speaker 7 (05:14):
But we saw the cost of capital at zero point
one percent during the pandemic.

Speaker 1 (05:19):
The question you've got to start asking and I'm sure
you know this is probably raised yesterday. If the government
is investing that kind of money, then why isn't why
aren't major projects getting off the ground. And you look
to things like the ship lift and you go, okay, well,
work seems to be happening now, but it has taken an.

Speaker 2 (05:35):
Awful long time.

Speaker 1 (05:36):
And then you look at some of the other projects
that were awarded major project status over the years that
haven't come to fruition, and so I think the big
question is, you know, why is that because we have
had impediments in place and we've made it hard for
people to do business in the Northern Territory or have
we just been unlucky. I really don't know the answer
to that.

Speaker 8 (05:56):
It was really interesting, Katie to see the Chief Minister
almost try and distance herself from the last eight years.
Like she was talking about how she's the new Chief
Minister and that things are different under her watch. But
then she also said, oh, but I've been all the
major ministers, like the Infrastructure Minister, the treasurer, the Education minister,
and like it just goes to show that we have

(06:18):
had eight years of labor. They're Chief Minister now, which
is the third Chief Minister has been at the table
in every one of those conversations. We haven't been able
to see that private investment flow. We don't have the
resource sector. I mean it's all there, it's all there
for the taking. We haven't been able to get it
out of the ground fast enough. And Keys is right.
Our fast track approvals process will actually mean that things

(06:40):
can get off the ground. Our Territory Coordinator policy where
we will have a statutory body that can have step
in rights to actually make decisions all of those things
absolute game changes for the territory and that's not what
we've seen over the last eight years.

Speaker 5 (06:53):
Maybe you can explain those step in rights a bit more.
What will the territory control a step in and do?

Speaker 8 (06:57):
It's a territory coordinator coordinator. Yeah, it's basically modeled off
a Queensland model. And we know how well Queensland is
doing with their.

Speaker 7 (07:05):
Distruction on circumvent Environmental Protection Agreement.

Speaker 8 (07:08):
Not at all.

Speaker 7 (07:09):
No, that is really the opposition said yesterday.

Speaker 8 (07:11):
No she did not say a step.

Speaker 5 (07:13):
And they'll give you a week to make a decision.
They'll take the file off your desk and make a decision.

Speaker 6 (07:18):
Haven't been going too far away. I mean, you look
at where we are now and we're say the Beterloo
like it's almost there, right, but we're two years behind
where we would have been because we had a moratorium,
we had theretorium, that's right, but we'd already had the
Hawk Review that had found exactly like the final you know,
the baseline finding was the same as the Hawk review

(07:40):
is finding, which was that if the right regulations are
in place, then the risk can be mitigated or eliminated.

Speaker 3 (07:47):
And there's risks with any major project. It doesn't matter
if it's resources or ship lifts or anything else. Something
of that size has risks associated with would be physical risk, infrastructure, capital, whatever,
social license to work, break all that sort of thing.
The trouble with the being two years behind with the
b to Loo is with the gas industry, there's windows
of opportunity and they shut pretty quickly. So we've probably

(08:09):
I mean, there is the opportunity still in the eastern
seawoods Tambo.

Speaker 4 (08:12):
It's a mile wide open at the moment. Yeah, I
think it's fair to say.

Speaker 3 (08:15):
That's why we've got to move quickly. And like the Barossa,
look at that. You know, the soundo's bringing baroscares. Sure
that's been dicked around, like I don't believe it. And
it's of course that company billions or not billions, hundreds
of millions. You know, when you've got scam bloody academics
from WA, you know, cajoling and pushing traditional owners and
you know, and then along the way, you know, some
government ag just react a particular way. So if the

(08:37):
Sealpie's got a policy to cut through all that shit
and just get it off the table, and so these people,
these industry people can get on with.

Speaker 1 (08:43):
And I don't think anybody's saying that they don't want
environmental approvals.

Speaker 2 (08:47):
Everybody still wants that to happen.

Speaker 1 (08:49):
It's absolutely part of business, and I don't feel as
though any business is trying to shy away from that.
I mean, that's something that they have to do in
every state, right. I meant, I would imagine that lots
of these issues were sort of raised yesterday, did they
you know, was there what was that?

Speaker 5 (09:05):
See?

Speaker 6 (09:06):
Joel mentioned Catherine Tilmouth who was up as part of
the panel discussion. Of course, she's the head of Minerals
Council and she was making the comparison as Joel was
saying with w A but saying, we have just seven
minds operating in the Northern Territory and there are so
I don't know what the number was in w A,
but you know, I think that and there is And

(09:28):
she wasn't hugely critical of the government, but there were
some impediments that are being put into place here that
don't exist and obviously we have land ten year issues
here that are different to w A. But also there
was some criticism of the changes to the royalties scheme,
which has been changed back again now and I think
just a sense that perhaps we could do more to

(09:50):
fostering and encourage this than we perhaps have been doing.
I actually think, I mean, if ever there was an
election you wanted to win, I think it's the one
we're going to have next month, because I think we're
I mean, we're always on the cast, but we're really
on the member as it comes on at the start
of next year. There's potential that be to Loo will
have first gas from next year, although there's still some

(10:12):
financial issues there and it needs to be raised. You know,
there are other things in the pipeline, a lot of
defence work that's about to come online. So I feel
like the territory is about to turn the corner, but
it's been a hard slot getting there.

Speaker 7 (10:24):
Well, Treasury, we have made that prediction.

Speaker 5 (10:26):
So the GSP is going to grow by about seven
percent over the next next couple of years and then
average out at about four What Catherin Tiomuth also said yesterday,
which is within my portfolio in the infrastructures of the
access is the roads. As we continue to build roads,
and that's what we have to do as a territory
because of that infrastructure deficit from nineteen seventy eight is
continue to seal roads so we can get to areas

(10:46):
of the northern territory.

Speaker 7 (10:47):
Talk about Gove, which I've visited recently in Rio Tintel.
Moving on.

Speaker 5 (10:51):
We are in desperate need of sealing that Central Land Road,
and that's what the people out there want because they
want people to come out there on a tourism been
but they're not going to take their caravan.

Speaker 2 (11:02):
Or that all that they can't get out there easily.

Speaker 5 (11:03):
That so we've already committed two hundred million or that
on that road and we have to seal it six
hundred and fifty kilometers.

Speaker 7 (11:10):
We have to seal that as soon as possible, but
that takes timeline.

Speaker 6 (11:13):
I mean, what is it Because I seriously I remember
doing a story five years ago during the twenty nineteen
federal election campaign where both Liberal and Labor were making
commitment to seal the Central Arnam Road and at the
time I think six hundred and fifty million dollars for
six hundred and fifty column.

Speaker 5 (11:30):
Unfortunately, the price has gone up, right, So the two
hundred it's two hundred and nine million we've got at
the moment for the first section isn't going to get
us two hundred and nine kilometers because of the flooding,
because of Colver's, because of the cause was.

Speaker 7 (11:42):
So the price has gone up.

Speaker 5 (11:43):
The six hundred and fifty kilometers is going to probably
take a billion dollars and it's going to take time
because the contractors do it in stages and programs. I
would hope to think it'd be done in the next
two or three years.

Speaker 2 (11:55):
Well, look, let's take a bit of a break.

Speaker 1 (11:56):
You are listening to mixdo four nine's three sixty It
is the that was. There's still plenty to discuss this hour.
You've just joined us in the studio. This morning, we've
got Joel Bowden, Kesier Puric, Matt Cunningham and Murray Claire Boothby. Now.
One of the other big topics that has been discussed
this week is the Aboriginal Peak organizations of the Northern
Territory Human Rights Law Center and Northern Territory Council of

(12:19):
Social Services. They penned an open letter to the Northern
Territory saying, well, an open letter, I should say, it's
not to the Northern Territory. It's just an open letter
saying that the Northern Territory is too reliant on incarceration
and its entrenching disadvantage. Now, this letter calls for reducing
the imprisonment of Aboriginal Territorians, addressing the drivers of crime,

(12:40):
raising the age of criminal responsibility to fourteen, needs based
funding for crime prevention and reduction programs. Amongst some of
these changes or some of what they would like to
see as a commitment to fully implementing the Aboriginal Justice Agreement,
reducing the number of young people in contact with out
of home care, police and custody, including implementing the raising

(13:03):
of the minimum age to fourteen, and programs not prisons.
Now Yesterday We did have the Chief Minister evil Ala
on the show and asked her if she would be signing.

Speaker 2 (13:14):
She said no, she would not be.

Speaker 1 (13:16):
My understanding is that the colp have said they will
not be signing it either, Murray Claire.

Speaker 2 (13:20):
Boothby, Is that right?

Speaker 8 (13:21):
Yeah, that's right. I mean, Katie, we know we talk
about this on the show all of the time and
your listeners will certainly be feeling this is that, you know,
crime and antisocial behavior and youth crime right across the
territory is just making people's lives absolutely miserable, and you know,
we absolutely need to address those root causes. You know,

(13:41):
we need to have the youth programs in place, working
with those Aboriginal leaders. We need to have the boot
camp so that they can actually go and learn a
skill when they are doing something wrong, because we don't
want them to continue on that cycle. We don't want
them to just go in and then come out worse.
We want to be able to have people to have
a life beyond crime. And raising the age of criminal

(14:03):
responsibility from ten to twelve, it hasn't worked, you know,
we've seen so many cases where kids under twelve are
just getting they're obviously out there offending and doing some
really harmful things. But then they're not being accountable for
their actions, and that's why we have to address those,
you know, put consequences in place immediately so we can
stop the community from suffering, but also work on the

(14:25):
root causes that are actually making these kids' lives more miserable.

Speaker 1 (14:30):
What I'm finding really interesting is, I think, you know,
a year ago, have we been having this discussion. I
don't know whether the Chief Minister of the day's answer
would have been, as you know, as sort of quick
and strong as what evil Lawlers was in the sense
that she was saying, no, I'm not signing it.

Speaker 2 (14:45):
And no matter how you look at this.

Speaker 1 (14:47):
I mean, the issue of crime is certainly going to
be one of, well, if not the biggest issue I
think that Territorians are going to be voting on, certainly
in some of the more urban areas of the Northern Territory.
I mean, even this week, we reported on Monday or Tuesday,
I believe it was about a terrible incident in Catherine
where ten yudes allegedly entered a home in Catherine with

(15:10):
an armed They were armed with an edged weapon. They
indecently assaulted two women, is what the police had said
in that statement earlier in the week. Now, as of Wednesday,
they were still at large. We also know then overnight
police are investigating an aggravated robbery and Tenant Creek. It
is alleged that five people broke into a home just
after eight pm and assaulted a seventy nine year old
man before stealing items and fleeing. A crime scene was

(15:33):
declared with investigations on going now. Fortunately the man only
sustained minor injuries. But I think the issue that we've
got here is not only the concerns around around crime
antisocial behavior, how we deal with people that are committing
those crimes, but when people no longer feel safe in
their homes, and in some cases they're not safe in
their homes, it crosses a line that I don't know

(15:58):
that we've really sort of crossed before or at previous elections.
I know that crime has certainly been a hot button topic,
and law and.

Speaker 3 (16:06):
Order is always an issue in the Turkey, and I
think it's probably a key issue everywhere when there's an election,
law and order, health education for example, and of course
the economy. But it's always law and order is up
front and center for lots of different reasons. But and
I mean the group that's done the open letter. I
don't have an issue with the groups doing that. I
mean all groups. Community groups have been writing to members

(16:26):
of US here and so forth. But the community doesn't
believe if someone has done something wrong there is an
expectation that there will be a consequence to that illegal activity,
wrongful activity, bad behavior, whatever. So to say, you know,
jail doesn't help people, well, mostly it doesn't help people,

(16:46):
but it's meant to. So we should be looking at
what's happening in our correctional system whilst we're looking at
other things. But it just the public will not accept
that the poor darlings shouldn't have any consequence and they
should go into a program. Well, I keep hearing this
word about programs and you know, oh, we've got all
these programs to help them. Well what exactly do they
do in these programs? You know? And I know it's

(17:07):
not a discussion for here and now, but it's very well,
it's all very well to say these things. You know,
we've got to sort of look after these poor darlings.
Because I've had a dysfunctional life, for example, but that's
just not washing it anymore in the community, so don't
I'm not surprised that Labor government and the seal P
we haven't agreed to sign the letter because I think
that there has to be a lot more discussion around
it and bearing in mind what the community expects from

(17:28):
our systems when someone breaks the law.

Speaker 6 (17:30):
I think I think the difficulty these groups will face
and the reason they're not getting traction from either side
of politics at the moment is that I think the
path that the government went down for the first certainly
until evil Law there's ascension to be Chief Minister, was
basically with the encouragement of these groups, these same groups,
and that was the road that they took. And granted

(17:52):
there was a Royal commission that gave recommendations to the
government to go down that path, But for your average
show public who lives in the street, they have seen
over that period their community become less safe, and so
they you know that. I think the general view of
a voter is that they are not They are less

(18:13):
safe now than they were seven years ago as a consequence,
and they can make the direct link between those changes
in government policy and the level of community safety now,
we all want young people to have a better future.
No one wants to see young kids, you know, locked
up and spending the rest of their life in prison.

(18:33):
But at the same time, I think there is a
sense in the community that there is a lack of
consequences when people do the wrong thing, and that is
contributing to the increase that we've seen.

Speaker 2 (18:44):
In crime rates well, and you know even in Alice Springs.

Speaker 1 (18:47):
Now overnight we're seeing in Alice Springs, So we've certainly
just seen over the last twenty four hours that apparently
are people's choice. Credit Union is closing its stores in
Alice Springs. They're cited concerns to their staff safety. You know,
like this is where this issue is sort of having
a wider impact than what it should be.

Speaker 2 (19:07):
And we are all very much.

Speaker 1 (19:09):
Understanding as you've just said there, Matt, nobody wants to
throw children in jail and throw away the key. That
is definitely not what any of us are saying. But
what my expectation is, and I know that a lot
of the community feels the same, is that you do
expect there to be a consequence.

Speaker 2 (19:25):
You do expect there to be a correcting.

Speaker 1 (19:27):
Of behavior when someone does the wrong thing, no matter
where they come from, no matter what their background is.
You know, whether it's my child, whether it's somebody else's child,
whether it is an adult, whether it is you know,
a teenager. There is an expectation as well that people
should be able to feel safe in their homes. And
I think that that's a pretty fair expectation. We all

(19:48):
get that there's going to be crime, that you're never
going to stamp it out entirely, but surely we should
be able to feel safe in our own homes.

Speaker 7 (19:56):
Yeah, agreed, Kurty.

Speaker 5 (19:57):
And that's why there's been an increasing investment from evil Laura.
I think, as Matt was saying, when EVA took over
the Chief Ministership, there was a much more direct and
concise approach to things. It was a yes or no,
and in this case with the letter, it's a no,
we're not signing it. Previously, you know, there had been
interest groups, lobby groups who had come to the government,

(20:19):
you know, even Amnesty International who have got a position
on the age of criminal responsibility. But what you're seeing
with EVA is you're seeing, you know, some definitive action.
And Alice Springs, as you said, has had some huge
issues and there's been two curfews put in place there
to try and stem the tide. But the curfews, as
productive and well received as they were, doesn't change Alice

(20:41):
Springs as a whole, and we have to work continually
as a tourism minister. We've invested another eighteen million dollars
to try and keep our product improving, to keep Alice
Springs moving. We've got the discount schemes that we're going
to extend, like we're trying to get Alice moving again
and help with that commun The rand.

Speaker 1 (21:01):
Juggle we've got though, right is that you know, if
you spend all of that money into into tourism, as
we should be, like you can walk and chew gum
at the same time. But if the issue isn't corrected,
and if the issue isn't isn't sorted through, people are
going to go there and they're not going to be
pleasantly shocked you know that the behavior is better. They're
going to be absolutely mortified and frightened. And that's a

(21:21):
really big concern because if you go somewhere and I
you know, I think I said.

Speaker 2 (21:26):
This on the show last week.

Speaker 1 (21:27):
One of the things I do every time I go
on holidays, is you know, you go out for dinner,
you go for a walk along wherever you are, you
go for a walk around. You might go and have
a drink, or you take the kids for play on
the playground or whatever.

Speaker 2 (21:37):
If you don't feel.

Speaker 1 (21:38):
Safe doing that wherever you go to visit when you're
there as a tourist, that's like, that's a really that's
a really big concern.

Speaker 7 (21:46):
And that's why.

Speaker 5 (21:46):
It's as you said, OK, you can walk and chew
gum at the same time. We're investing in that space,
but we're also investing in the community. There are some
boot camps opening up, and one of the big programs
that we don't talk about enough is the Concert and
the Stars programming.

Speaker 7 (21:59):
Peter Drummer from.

Speaker 5 (22:00):
The Port yesterday spoke about that and he's had a
long involvement.

Speaker 7 (22:03):
I've had a long involvement with my family.

Speaker 5 (22:05):
My brother works with Contaft about developing young original woman.

Speaker 2 (22:09):
We've had the young fellows in here human that's right, and.

Speaker 5 (22:11):
We've got to keep doing those And that's I hate
to say program because it gets a bit of an
inverted commera around, but we need to continue to develop
the youth. But it also starts even back even further.

Speaker 6 (22:22):
Ye one hundred percent agree on the content. I mean,
I see it in action at my son's school. That's
an amazing program. I've heard Paul Henderson talk about the
best thing he ever did was investing Coontaft and now
starts and Stars and girls play footing now too, which
they didn't you know when Contact was started.

Speaker 7 (22:38):
And you know, I think that's great.

Speaker 6 (22:39):
But I do think there needs to be an assessment
we talked about this last week of what programs work.

Speaker 4 (22:44):
And you can guarantee your CONTAFT works.

Speaker 6 (22:46):
It's brilliant, but there are plenty of programs out there
as well that get plenty of funding from governments that
don't work. And I think that governments need to be
tougher saying no, sorry, you've had your twelve months, you've
had your two years.

Speaker 7 (22:58):
Your program doesn't work. We're not funny it anymore.

Speaker 6 (23:00):
The other the other issue, sorry, Mara clear, I know
you want to have the other issue. I think we
need to consider when we talk about this issue. And
cam Smith had an article in the paper yesterday and
that that showed that in the in the last quarter
of twenty twenty three, we had population decline in the
Northern Territory. And the big worry I have is that
people lead because of that issue. I mean, I'm as

(23:22):
invested in this place as anyone, but we have had
that conversation in the past six months that I never
thought we would have because of that issue. And you know,
I don't want to be talking about crime all the time.
I don't like talking about crime. But you know, when
you get to a point where you think, gee, you know,
can I leave my teenage kids at home? I don't
know whether I can, because not not because they're going

(23:44):
to set fire of the house, which might have happened
because someone might come in and try to steal the
car keys and steal my car.

Speaker 3 (23:52):
Yeah, that's when the people are so much. It's the
people who are Mad's age. Yeah, they're the people that
we want to keep in the church because they're working
adults both individually and their children are getting halfway useful.

Speaker 2 (24:08):
They're starting jobs and that kind of thing.

Speaker 7 (24:10):
Use them on the farm.

Speaker 3 (24:12):
We start them.

Speaker 7 (24:13):
Young and.

Speaker 3 (24:19):
Talk to the c RP. But I've had it in
in my area, young young families, and it is they're
the contributors to the economy amongst other people. But it's
it's because of the concern about their family unit with
coach children. That's the people we need to keep. This
is the other part of it.

Speaker 1 (24:38):
And and you know, and.

Speaker 8 (24:47):
I just want to make the point about about Evil
Laula being the new Chief Minister and how she seems
to be doing things differently. Yesterday during the debate with
the leaders, Leah Finocchio spoke about the ice cream sh
John John's, and I know, Katie, you've had him on
the show many times, and how he is closing down
in a couple of weeks. And as soon as she
started to talk about that, which which of course it's

(25:09):
bigger than just one business. I mean that business closing
down because of all the crime and social behavior that
has been occurring is one part of this. But when
you can't even take your kids to an ice cream
shop in the city, then we know that we have
a real problem. Now. When Leah said that at this debate,
Eva Laula scoffed and laughed at her, and that just
tells you everything that there is to know about the

(25:31):
Chief Minister. She might say all of these words that
sound like she's going to be different compared to the
labor of the last eight years. But when you laugh
and scoff at a business closing down and our people
in the territory who can't even go and take their
kids for an ice cream, that says a lot.

Speaker 5 (25:47):
Well, I think we've seen that Eva Laula over the
last six or seven months has been decisive. She has
made courageous decisions, and she has put the territory on
a trajectory that is going to lead to economic growth
and social cohesion.

Speaker 1 (26:05):
And look, I think we're all being very polite about this,
but you, like all of yours, have been part of
the team for a long time. Right, So she's been
the infrastructure minister, she's been the treasurer, she's been on
the like, she's been part of the ministerial.

Speaker 7 (26:22):
Cabinet.

Speaker 1 (26:24):
Like, so, how so how come her voice wasn't being
heard earlier? How come these common sense happens, the common
sense decisions weren't being made before, because like, the basic
makeup of the cabinet has only changed.

Speaker 2 (26:38):
By a couple of people. So this is you know,
this is where I.

Speaker 1 (26:41):
Kind of think to myself, I get it right, I
can see myself that that evil Lawla is making good
common sense decisions. But what happens if she doesn't win
a seat? Who steps in? You know, you would think
that the deputy does step in into that role, that
that's the next common sense choice, and that's chancey Paike.

Speaker 2 (26:56):
Now I know some people, well it.

Speaker 1 (26:58):
Doesn't always happen, but you go actually, and same goes.

Speaker 2 (27:02):
With the colp Like you've got to look at the.

Speaker 1 (27:04):
Whole team and you go, if common sense decisions are
being made now under evil Laula, Well, first off, why
weren't they previously when she was still part of the team.
But secondly, what happens if she's not there? Does it
turn into a rabble again?

Speaker 5 (27:19):
Well, the Chief Minister is the chief of ministers and
exercises are casting vote in the cabinet. That's why the
Chief Minisal has has more say than others and is
empowered by the Cabinet and the caucus.

Speaker 4 (27:30):
He's in the.

Speaker 1 (27:30):
Situation here where she's making Captain's decisions.

Speaker 2 (27:33):
Do the rest of you sort of agree with them?

Speaker 5 (27:35):
Well, there's elements of that, yes, and we've seen that recently.
And that's what the caucus and the cabinet does. It
empowers the Chief minister. Now she's also empowered a number
of other ministers, including myself, to go and make decisions.
So I am able to make a call and let's
just say the Central Island road of what the package is.

Speaker 7 (27:51):
And what we're going to find. I meet with Catherine King.

Speaker 5 (27:53):
We have the conversation, we organized, you know, the five
hundred million dollars, and we go and do it. Because
if you actually sendalized something like that, you are going
to be delayed. And that's why decisions won't we make
with it. She's done a fabulous in such a short time.
And I take your point. There has been previous chief
who haven't been as decisive, not one who is.

Speaker 1 (28:13):
It's more than I kind of look at it and
I think there's only a couple of people on the
team that have changed. So I get that the government
is very much trying to push the barrow, that you know,
that it's all common sense and that it's like new leadership.
But the thing that I think other Territorians are also
thinking to themselves is well, hang on a second. You know,

(28:34):
a lot of a lot of the team members are
still the same team. You might change to captain, you know,
for your state of origin side based on whether you
won the last game or not, but you haven't dynamically
changed the whole makeup of that side.

Speaker 3 (28:48):
It was a team that was in trouble. I mean,
we know in this job there's lots of rhetoric, and
I think Eva's doing the best she can with the
team that she's got because she's got the job as
chief Minister, so she's back with it. So she's got
to do the best she can with the group that
she's got.

Speaker 2 (29:09):
I didn't give you the last question, okay.

Speaker 3 (29:11):
I mean the general public is a wise up to
the commentary that goes on in the political circles and
what comes out through the media about politicians, and they
will make their decision in a month's time on election day,
and I think they listen, and you're quite correct. Eve
has been part of that cabinet since this lot got in,
you know, and you can't just say, oh, now I'm
going to do things differently, and I'm just and she's

(29:32):
I don't. I have no doubt that she's decisive, but
it's it's still see that she was all along and
she's not a shrinking violet. She would have been quite
forthright in her views about anything or anything in particular.
So to now say, look, our things are different, it's
not going to wash.

Speaker 1 (29:48):
Well. Look, one of the other issues that we spoke
about yesterday with the Chief Minister is that of the
North Australian Aboriginal Justice Agency losing it's fifth chief executive
in eighteen months.

Speaker 2 (29:58):
Is the upper.

Speaker 1 (29:58):
Management of the besieged organization continues to be gripped by chaos.
So Phil Brown stepped down in what was a shock
departure from his position. Is what was reported as the
acting CEO.

Speaker 3 (30:10):
I think we're over these shocks.

Speaker 2 (30:11):
Well, look what.

Speaker 1 (30:12):
I think what we do know is that we're in
a situation where there doesn't seem to be any real
letterup when it comes to NUDGE and now I asked
the Chief Minister yesterday what's it sort of going to
take for NAJA to look.

Speaker 2 (30:23):
I don't think there is no doubt.

Speaker 1 (30:26):
That we need need an organization such as this one.
We certainly need, you know, representations for some of our
most vulnerable in the community. But what's going on really
a lot of people questioning how is this organization able
to keep operating and how are they able to continue
to receive huge amounts of funding from both the federal

(30:47):
and I assume the Northern Territory government.

Speaker 3 (30:49):
Sounds like they're spending a lot on legal fees. I mean, Katie,
there's one thing that's constant in this whole story, and
that's the board. Yeah, man, would you say? Five chief
executives have come and gone for various reasons and for
various lengths of time, but the one from my thinking anyway,
there's obviously a serious governance issue with this organization across
the board, whether it be the governance of finances, governance

(31:10):
of the human resources, governance of the delivery of services.
And the one thing that I see that's coonsin is
the board.

Speaker 6 (31:16):
Well, and it shows in the seat because there are
some very respected Aboriginal leaguers who have held that acting
CEO position over the past eighteen months since Priscilla Atkins
was unlawfully removed from her position to CEO, including John
Patterson and Olga Havnan who ran Danilla Dilber for a
long time time, and they walked away.

Speaker 2 (31:39):
And I think that's very good opera, and I.

Speaker 6 (31:41):
Think that tells you quite a bit what I find
remarkable about this situation. This has been going on now
since November twenty twenty two and it's now July twenty
twenty four, and I find it remarkable over that period,
not just five CEOs. We've got a loss of staff,
domestic violence perpetrator appointed to the chair of the board.
We've had the previous chair who in a recent federal

(32:04):
in the recent federal court matter, was found to have
given dubious evidence under oath. We've had a mass exodus
of staff. We've had an inability to represent vulnerable Aboriginal clients.
And what is being done about it? And I can
tell you from experience when you ask either the officer
of the NT's Attorney General or the officer of the
Federal Attorney General, what are you doing about this?

Speaker 4 (32:26):
Will their funding be removed?

Speaker 6 (32:27):
Will you go on this merry go round where they
each blame one another and nothing gets done? You know,
you asked Chancey Paig's office and he says it's a
matter for the federal government. You ask Mark Drayfus's office
and he says, it's a matter for the Northern Territory government.
No one wants to take responsibility for what's going on
here and take ownership of it. And do something about it.
I can tell you how the funding works. There's a

(32:48):
it's called end LAP, the National Legal Assistance Partnership, and
every five years, the federal government gives the Northern Territory
government a bucket of money to fund an aboriginal legal service.
So at the moment it goes to NA, right, And
so that's why they're just pointing the finger back at
one another.

Speaker 3 (33:03):
We just got the money, you look after it.

Speaker 4 (33:05):
Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 6 (33:06):
They need to get together in a room and make
a decision now and say, listen, right, we've had enough,
like I mean, how many chances does an organization get,
especially one that serves such an important role in it.

Speaker 1 (33:19):
I think the way that you've just described that as well,
Matt does point to some of the issues and some
of the points that continue to be raised about different
organizations that are receiving funding across in Northern Territory. Well
at whichever one it might be, you know, whatever, and
good point, because we spoke about that last week. But
whatever organization it might be, if you are receiving funding,
a bucket of funding from the federal government and then

(33:40):
the Northern Territory government's administering that funding, well what processes
are in place to ensure that that funding is being
administered and that KPIs are being met, and if they're
not being met, well, either funding is withheld or there
you know, there is a period of time where you're
given an opportunity to get things sorted and if you don't,

(34:01):
well you're either I don't know, there's got to be
some extra steps taken. It's outside my pay bracket, but
you would think that it's certainly something that both tiers
of government would be looking at because it's tax payers money, right,
and they're there to deliver a job that, as I
pointed out right from the get go, is to actually
represent some of the most vulnerable in the community. We
know that we've got more prisoners on remand at the

(34:23):
moment then you know this is the thing. So I've
no doubt that there are still some great lawyers who
are representing those people. But if you do not have
enough of them, and you do not have things operating
in the way that you would expect, does it make
their jobs more difficult?

Speaker 2 (34:38):
I don't work there.

Speaker 6 (34:39):
It's interesting because NAGI is part of this group that's
putting out the statement saying, you know, we have to
have fewer people in prison, right They're the issues at
NARGER are contributing to that, because if there's not legal
representation for someone who's on remand when they come before
the court the matter where they go and then it
gets adjourned and adjourned and you end up wanting you
in prison.

Speaker 3 (34:59):
On remark, this is an organization that has a board
responsible for bossy policy. In direction of the organization. You've
got CEO, you've got staff YEP. If it was a
private company listed or unlisted, it would be for ASEIC
in a heartbeat. So no one is prepared clearly, either
our anti government, the Attorney General because me he's the response,
or the federal government is prepared to step in and

(35:20):
look after what is the most important thing and is
that as their clients.

Speaker 2 (35:24):
Look, we might take a really quick break.

Speaker 1 (35:26):
You are listening to mix Onellow four nine's three six
if you have just joined us this morning in the studio,
I can't.

Speaker 2 (35:31):
Even get them to be quiet during the hand breaks.

Speaker 1 (35:34):
Today we've got Joel Bounden, Keseyer, Puric, Matt Cunningham and
Mary Claire Boothby and well we are just weeks out
from the Northern Territory election, and all of a sudden,
Matt and I have got so much more to talk
about because there's election promises being thrown around.

Speaker 7 (35:49):
Like Center election commitment.

Speaker 2 (35:54):
Well, yeah, I'm going to do nothing. Look, it's going to.

Speaker 1 (35:59):
Retake she's going to be my political right hand woman,
ready to come and chat about things all throughout the
coming weeks.

Speaker 2 (36:08):
I'm sure now that's yeah.

Speaker 1 (36:11):
Well, look, free swimming lessons, the announcement by the colp
are re elected, Labor government's going to deliver increased preschool hours.

Speaker 2 (36:23):
You've got all sorts of things.

Speaker 3 (36:25):
Where all the kid's going to go because the kids
are half day each so if you have a kid
there all day, that means double.

Speaker 2 (36:30):
Well, this is the question I'd asked yesterday.

Speaker 3 (36:33):
Yes to do that. That's right, And.

Speaker 1 (36:35):
We didn't have enough teachers at the start of this year,
so it is definitely their questions.

Speaker 3 (36:43):
You haven't dealt with with history kids. They'll be less kids.

Speaker 2 (36:47):
Well they're not in pre school.

Speaker 1 (36:51):
But look in theory, it seems like a good announcement, right,
the preschool announcement. If you're able to, if you are
able to take a four year old there at eight
o'clock in the morning, and they're there too in the
wonderful You know, a long day for a litt It
is a long.

Speaker 2 (37:04):
Day for a little tacker. My daughter would have been
alright with it.

Speaker 1 (37:07):
My son would have had an absolute meltdown by after lunchtime.

Speaker 2 (37:10):
I reckon we'd have needed a little.

Speaker 3 (37:12):
Man in app So I don't know, the schooly stuff
in the morning, and then basically they'll become babysitters in
the afternoon when they will need a little well no.

Speaker 1 (37:19):
Because look, you know, I mean those preschool teachers, honestly,
they must I don't know where you breed wonderful preschool teachers,
but they have to have the patients of a saint
to be able to look after thirty preschool aged children
and to be able to teach them, educate them. But
you're right, Keisier. So most preschools, there'll be kids go

(37:39):
in the mornings and then there'll be a whole new
class in the afternoon. So my question is where are
the additional classrooms going to come from? Where are the
additional school teachers going to come from? It is a
phase in situation, But you know, there's no like there
is no doubt that it's going to cost a bucket load.
I think thirty five million dollars has been here mark

(38:00):
for it, if I recall correctly from the pressure those yesterday.
Then like I said, you know you've got free swimming
lessons being announced by the SEALP.

Speaker 2 (38:07):
I mean, what do we make of it all?

Speaker 5 (38:08):
Well, I just talk about the fifteen hours going to
thirty hours, so it's a doubling of the preschool hours.

Speaker 7 (38:13):
It's phased in, as you said, over time. One of
the really really.

Speaker 5 (38:16):
Big announcements that we've had over time has been this
full funding for education, and that's where a lot of
the funding comes from. And as we know, some of
the schools, and a number of the schools in the
elector of Johnson that I frequently visit have underutilized classrooms.
And so the preschool working with the schools is actually
in Milner. There's a preschool there that's not being utilized

(38:38):
at all at the moment. So we'll utilize more of
the school infrastructure existing infrastructure, and then we'll recruit more preschool.

Speaker 1 (38:45):
Call me a skeptic, angel, call me a skeptic, but
is it going to be an electorates?

Speaker 2 (38:51):
Better?

Speaker 1 (38:51):
You know, maybe a little bit tighter where labor's hoping
to win.

Speaker 5 (38:55):
Well, we haven't announced which electorates, so it's a phased
in approach over the next four years. The first year
there'll be ten, So we're not targeting electorates per se.
We're targeting the economy, we're targeting working parents, and we're
targeting kids getting that additional doubling the amount of time
that they're in preschool so that they can then transition
to school a bit better and learn and then come

(39:16):
into society and not have to go to keasi e puic.

Speaker 3 (39:19):
Rural broadcamp where they learn how to fence and part fails.

Speaker 4 (39:23):
And I think you're onto something.

Speaker 8 (39:28):
As long as it's compulsory. Keasy with my mother there
none of there's voluntary.

Speaker 5 (39:33):
And then the.

Speaker 3 (39:36):
Look if they're a little bit slacked, I'm just going
to push along with the track.

Speaker 2 (39:41):
God does me.

Speaker 3 (39:43):
Yes, I mean these announcements I want to be expected
in a political campaign. I mean, and it's to appeal
to the broader community. Nice things, you know, Swimming lessons
are good, preschool things are good, you know. But I
mean when you look at the announcements and where they're
going to be impacted upon which can you need armson?
By far is getting a fair share of stuff from
the Labor government. And I think the Chief Minister is

(40:05):
not the chief Minister for the Lord and Territory, she's
the chief Minister for Palmerston because everything is going to
Parmestan that I've seen except for the poor Moldon Primary
school Oval. Yeah, no one wants to own well look
I am to.

Speaker 6 (40:17):
Because if Labour loses the one and a half seats
at the way Mark Turner doesn't He's not Labor anymore.
But Labour loses those two seats, then they're.

Speaker 3 (40:26):
Trying to get the seats that everyone knows that you know,
but it's been very exactly where they're to get.

Speaker 1 (40:36):
I have just.

Speaker 2 (40:40):
Had word from the candidate for Blaine.

Speaker 1 (40:44):
He has message through Matt curl saying that just to
let you know, the sprinklers are running.

Speaker 2 (40:50):
A mold and over.

Speaker 3 (40:53):
Whoever made sprinklers work excellent?

Speaker 6 (40:56):
Clarify that the kiss and go situation at the bakewell times.

Speaker 4 (41:00):
Would you want me to explain would was.

Speaker 2 (41:04):
It funded under the Labor government.

Speaker 8 (41:06):
So basically what happened was when I was elected that
was talked about and talked about for years and years
and years, but of course nothing happened. So and these
two will remember that when I was in Parliament, even
when we were talking about something completely irrelevant, I would
bring up the Baykor car park because it was a
promise that was never delivered, right, I would talk about
it in media and Parliament basically lobby, lobby, lobby, and
then finally the federal government along with the Anti government,

(41:30):
was able to get implemented.

Speaker 4 (41:32):
So I'm very hopes about on the line.

Speaker 8 (41:37):
Anyway, he's been saying a lot of things, and that's okay.
You know the people in parties a.

Speaker 2 (41:41):
Candidate, yeah, we'll judge him and I.

Speaker 1 (41:46):
If you want to find out anything more about the
about the political candidates won the problem.

Speaker 2 (41:52):
Well, if you want to.

Speaker 1 (41:53):
Find anything out about the political candidates, we are indeed
doing the Meet the Candidates series for all of the
electorates across the end. But look, we're going to take
a We're going to get to Johnson, but we're going
to take a very quick break.

Speaker 2 (42:04):
When we come back, I want.

Speaker 1 (42:05):
To talk very briefly about these political donations that's coming
your way right here or mixed one oh four nine
three sixty's before we.

Speaker 2 (42:12):
Wrap up though well.

Speaker 1 (42:14):
According to a report by Tom Morgan, our mate at
the ABC, the Country Liberal Party has raised almost one
million dollars so far during the Northern Territory election period,
more than doubling the total donations made to the incumbent
Territory Labor Party. So we know that this is all
on the Northern Territory Electoral Commission website, but data released

(42:35):
has shown the CLP received nine hundred and fifty eight
thousand dollars in the twelve months to June thirty, compared
to four hundred and three thousand, five hundred and sixty
eight for the Territory Labor Party.

Speaker 3 (42:47):
Good on youw COLP, and thanks.

Speaker 7 (42:49):
To Ray Bail for putting in good on your rail dollars.

Speaker 1 (42:54):
Some large donations and some quite large individual donations money,
that's right, large political donations by individuals, and you can
certainly like the CRP seems to have quite the watches.

Speaker 7 (43:06):
I must have made a lot of promises and they are.

Speaker 2 (43:10):
What are you getting any from the CFM EU exactly?

Speaker 3 (43:13):
Friends of ours? They are no friends always be.

Speaker 4 (43:18):
CU investigators.

Speaker 3 (43:22):
They're no friends of mine. They're no friends of mine.

Speaker 2 (43:25):
In all seriousness. Is the Labor Party getting any money
from the CFM AU ahead of.

Speaker 8 (43:28):
The you know?

Speaker 5 (43:30):
And what I can say, Katie, is that in the
last three or four weeks there has been a number
of sizable donations to the Labor Party. They wouldn't be
in those numbers because of the reporting period, but there has.

Speaker 7 (43:41):
Been a large amount of money coming in to me,
to the party.

Speaker 5 (43:45):
To others, because those who are watching the politics and
watching it closely can see that this is a contest
and when we get to August the twelfth through the
twenty fourth, when voting ends on the twenty four, they
think it's going to be very, very tight, and there
has been a large amount of money coming into the
Labor Party recently.

Speaker 3 (44:02):
I think you are I think you're right.

Speaker 8 (44:03):
It is going to be very tight, and so people
need to make a really clear choice and they can
either accept the status quote or they can go for change.
And I know that over the last four years territories
certainly don't feel like there's been that change that they need.
Of course, of course, territorians and business owners right across
the spectrum have been backing the c LP, and I
think it's the same thing happens in my communicating. More

(44:25):
and more people are coming out saying, how can we help,
We need to get rid of this labor government, what
can we do to help? So I think it's a
sign that's exactly. I think it's a sign that people
are ready for change.

Speaker 7 (44:37):
Here or whoever, it's a sign that Ray Bail sold
his business recently.

Speaker 2 (44:43):
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (44:44):
Right, lovely, lovely, very generous.

Speaker 2 (44:52):
If you're listening this morning, feel free to give us
a call mate.

Speaker 1 (45:00):
Time. Take every individual's I in choice who they choose
to donate money too, if that's what they choose to
do ahead of an election.

Speaker 3 (45:06):
Support fundraisers, whether it be a dinner with a special
person in attendance, whatever. But you know, we've seen Mark
Turner with his fundraising activities, sort of like a GoFundMe.
But I'm not sure how it works, but I think
the last count he raised them, you know, six seven,
eight thousand dollars. So people are prepared to provide money.
It doesn't matter how big or how small. If you've
got the capacity to provide big dollars, you provide big dollars.
But some people you know used to you know, just

(45:28):
happy to help put up core flutes or whatever. That's
how they help if they haven't got the financial if
you know, and I think it's it's so open and
transparenty you know who's giving money to which party?

Speaker 1 (45:38):
Just very quickly, I haven't seen as many core flutes
on people's homes.

Speaker 8 (45:42):
You need to come out to Miami lately.

Speaker 2 (45:44):
Okay, is there a lot out there? Yeah? Because what
it actually made me think is for some candidates.

Speaker 1 (45:50):
Do they not actually have that support then from individuals
who are happy enough to have those posters on their homes.

Speaker 6 (45:57):
On day one of core flute carnage that I noticed
there was like compared to the last election and even
the one before, I noticed fewer labor core flutes. Now,
I don't know that whether that was they weren't organized
or they didn't have as much many volunteers they.

Speaker 5 (46:11):
Did as much money less money where that was it
was unavailable at Nightcliff, So well, it's covered now, but
it's mostly.

Speaker 6 (46:19):
In in CLP and independent ones from what I can see.
But anyway, I honestly don't know whether core flutes have
any correlation.

Speaker 5 (46:29):
Know their community better and they will have more on
houses and fences, whereas those who are trying to break in.

Speaker 7 (46:35):
Are going to have more staked core flutes out on
the side of this.

Speaker 3 (46:38):
You all need to come out to Parkston.

Speaker 2 (46:39):
We are going to have to wrap up for the morning.
Mary Claire Boothby, thank you as always for your time
for the CLP.

Speaker 8 (46:45):
Thank you Katie, and take care of everyone.

Speaker 1 (46:47):
Matt Cunningham from Sky News, thank you as always for
your time.

Speaker 8 (46:50):
Mate.

Speaker 1 (46:50):
Thanks Katie Kizier Puic the Independent House going independent member
for GOODDA, thank you for your time.

Speaker 3 (46:56):
Thanks Katie and rug up Bush people, and John's going
to be cold again.

Speaker 2 (47:00):
It's all about it before you go. What's going on?

Speaker 7 (47:03):
Well, I'm just about to head to the October Business
Month launch.

Speaker 5 (47:07):
We have our speakers to announce and I want to
just tell everyone in the Northern Territory to get ready
for a national treasure to be the keynote speaker at
October Business Month. This person is one of my absolute
favorites and she's so special in the words of Bruce mcaveaney,
that my brother, my reserve brother, many years ago, went.

Speaker 7 (47:28):
Up to her in a cafe in Melbourne and asked
her for her signature. That's how special this person is.
So watch out, watch out.

Speaker 2 (47:37):
Maybe she's a horse rider.

Speaker 7 (47:39):
She wears a suit but not a cape. I'll leave.

Speaker 1 (47:45):
It.

Speaker 2 (47:47):
Is it Kathy Freeman? Alright, Matilda's scarf on. I'm confused.

Speaker 4 (47:56):
If he wears a suit but not a cape, that's got.

Speaker 7 (47:58):
To be well.

Speaker 2 (47:59):
Kathy had the her She had the suit thing on
her head like she had the It wasn't her cake,
but it.

Speaker 3 (48:03):
Was like a little wind, the wind factor.

Speaker 2 (48:05):
Anyway, we better wrap up. Wonderful to have you all
in the studio this morning.