May 7, 2025 • 15 mins
Have you ever walked away from a conversation thinking you totally bombed it—only to find out later that the other person actually liked you? This “liking gap” is more common than you think, especially in kids. In this Doctor’s Desk episode, Justin and Kylie explore fascinating new research about why we often underestimate how much others enjoy our company. They share insights from a large study on self-esteem, anxiety, and likability, and unpack what it all means for our children and their friendships. Plus, a personal story about Kylie’s first meeting with Justin’s mum that perfectly illustrates how wrong our first impressions can be.
KEY POINTS:
-
The liking gap is the psychological tendency to believe others like us less than they actually do.
-
Low self-esteem and high social anxiety can amplify this gap, especially in children and teens.
-
Real-world data shows most people are more accepted and liked than they realise.
-
Kylie shares a vulnerable story about feeling disliked by Justin’s mum—which turned out to be the opposite of the truth.
-
Kids need to feel safe, heard, and valued in their interactions to close the liking gap.
-
Teaching children to focus on quality interaction over perceived popularity helps reduce relational anxiety.
QUOTE OF THE EPISODE:
“Your child walks away from interactions feeling like they’ve bombed—when in reality, they’ve probably scored and they don’t even know it.”
RESOURCES MENTIONED:
-
Study by Sugani, Sarah et al. at the University of Toronto on self-esteem, anxiety, and the liking gap
-
Misconnection by Dr. Justin Coulson – insights from teenage girls on friendships
-
Visit happyfamilies.com.au for additional resources
ACTION STEPS FOR PARENTS:
-
Normalise the Liking Gap: Help your child understand that it's common to underestimate how much others like us.
-
Boost Their Confidence: Support self-esteem by validating their feelings and encouraging their voice at home.
-
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
You know, when you meet somebody and you kind of
like them, you think they're really nice, but you're pretty
sure that you didn't leave the best impression ever. You
feel like maybe they don't really like you, and therefore
the relationship, the friendship is doomed, maybe even before it started.
Today we talk about your kids, their friends and how
(00:26):
they can feel more likable based on brand new research.
It's a doctor's Desk episode of the Happy Families podcast
Real Parenting Solutions every Day, Australia's most downloaded parenting podcasts.
We are Justin and Kylie Colson. Kylie, there's this thing
called the liking gap. Researchers have known for years about
this thing with kids as young as five as well
(00:47):
as adults. After meeting someone for the first time, we
often underestimate how much they like us. Have you ever
had that happen? You're laughing like, maybe, yes, it's I
have a great story, feel like an imposter that kind
of thing. What's your story?
Speaker 2 (01:05):
It involves your mum. The very very first time you
took me home to introduce me to your parents. Yes, yes,
you took me down into the backyard to meet your
dad who was watching your younger twin sisters.
Speaker 1 (01:21):
Yeah, I have two sets of twin sisters, I mean
whole and my youngest sets twin sisters, like fifteen years
younger than me.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
Yeah, I think they were about six at the time,
and they were playing on the swing set. And so
your dad kind of he looked over, he gave me
a smile, you know, kind of wasn't interested in engaging
in any conversation. Dad, your sisters were oblivious because you know,
they were too busy playing.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
And there was six.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
You then took me upstairs, and your mum was in
the kitchen kind of organizing dinner, and she was putting
plates together for you and I, And the next thing,
your sisters ran up the stairs and literally jumped on
my lap while I was sitting on the table and
couldn't get enough of me in that moment. I don't
remember any of this, but your mom, well, she obviously
(02:04):
acknowledged me and she said hello. But she sat down
next to us at the table and proceeded to have
a conversation with you that I would have felt was
a bit too personal for someone you've never met before.
And I didn't know where to be in the room.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
My head, my mum doesn't have filters. Let's be honest.
If she needs to say it, she needs to say it.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
She wanted to know what you were going to do
with the rest of your life. Like literally, this was
an urgent conversation that couldn't wait until I was not there.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
So did she not say anything like Hi, Kylie, tell
me about yourself.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
No, she did launch it. She launched into this conversation
with you, and I sat there the whole time thinking
she hates me, She absolutely hates me. It wasn't until
later that she shared with me that the reason she
had that conversation with you was she actually was pretty
confident that I was the one.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
Right, she didn't talk to you, You just walked into
the house, But you're the one.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
I'm the one. She felt really good about me, and
she just felt like she didn't have to put him
on any pretense, that she could just be her and
she didn't need to worry about me because I was
going to be a part of the family sooner or later.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Welcome to the family. So I'm hearing this story and
we've gone so far from where we're supposed to be
going with the doctor's desk research. But I don't know
much of this story, even though I apparently was. There
might be worth highlighting that within two weeks of that
conversation happening, I had proposed, like we only dated for
(03:31):
two and a half weeks and then we had like
an eleven month engagement while I was in mad Isa
and you were in Brisbane and we got married. It's
been twenty seven and a half, twenty eight years, Like,
how awesome is that? But the liking gap was there,
so you've walked out thinking.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
I honestly thought she makes me hated, sheeds me? How
was I just disliked? I actually thought she hated I
don't know how.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
I don't know this story. How long was it between
you having that interaction with my mom and you discovering
that she didn't hate you at all and that she
felt so comfortable that she felt like she could talk
to you about it.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
I don't think we had that conversation un till well
and truly after you and I were married. But obviously
I knew she didn't hate me one sure?
Speaker 1 (04:13):
Sure? I mean maybe she was writing history. Was she
even aware that you're in the room? Is what I'm thinking. Anyway,
let's talk about this clearly, you've experienced the liking gap.
You've had a first impression with somebody, think that they
don't like you very much, and they actually like you
quite a lot. Some researchers at the University of Toronto,
I've done this really cool study, HESSEGANI to Sarah and
colleagues found hints as to why some people experience bigger
(04:36):
liking gaps than others. And no surprise, it has to
do with your mental health. It has to do with
your self esteem, it has to do with your anxiety.
But basically here's what they found. They did three different groups,
three different studies, if you will. The first group, eight
hundred and sixty three strangers. They do this round robin
getting to know you session. Each chat lasts two or
three minutes, so it's kind of like speed dating, I guess,
(04:59):
but without the romantic overtures. And they had to also
fill in a scale that assessed their self esteem, their
social anxiety, their loneliness, their life satisfaction, their perceptions of
having positive relationships with other people, and their neuroticism. Second group,
three hundred and seventy eight university students. They've had conversations
(05:20):
with a series of conversation partners about anything they wanted
to talk about for twelve minutes, and those students were
just asked to report on their self esteem. That was
all they were measured on. Third group. I know there's
a lot of information, but it'll all make sense in
just a sick Third group, four hundred and sixty five
US based adults have some online digital chats for twenty
(05:42):
five minutes with a stranger, just one conversation, and they're
completing measures of neuroticism and loneliness after each conversation. Regardless
of which group, every participant had to rate how much
they liked their conversation partner and how much they thought
their conversation partner liked them. That way, they get to
(06:03):
the analysis gets to look at, well what was your perception,
what was theirs? And how much do they marry up?
Is there a liking gap? And they also had to
just say, well, this is how much I liked the meeting.
And what the research has found, consistent with previous data,
is that the overwhelming majority of participants felt as though
their conversation partners liked them much less than they actually did.
(06:28):
They had the liking gap that you've just described. When
it comes to came to that first conversation that you
had with my mum.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
It's interesting to me. I know we're talking about like
first time conversations.
Speaker 1 (06:37):
Correct.
Speaker 2 (06:38):
I look at even some of the close relationships I
have in my life, and I have been blown away
at times when they've actually expressed how deeply they feel
about me. I know that they're my friend, I know
that they love and appreciate me, but the times that
they've actually shared specifically how they feel has just it's
(06:59):
blown me away because I would never have assumed the
depth to their feelings.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
As you're saying that, you've just prompted something really big
for me. I think this is super important that I
hadn't planned on mentioning in this pod. But when I
write Misconnection, that book about teenage girls, I ask girls
what made their lives the best, and they said friends.
And then I said what makes your life the worst,
and they said friends. But have listened to some of
these quotes. I've just dragged it up as you were
sharing precisely that story. This is what some of the
(07:29):
girls said to me, and I quote word perfect quote,
none of my friends really like me. I worry that
people don't like me how my close friends actually see me.
I have a massive fear that everyone around me is
just putting up with me until I leave them alone.
This one said, the thing I worry about most is
that by the end of high school, people are still
going to think of me as a nerd with no
boyfriend and no social life. This worries me because what
(07:51):
if it's true? And so what you can hear is
this desperation like do In fact, one girl said, here's
another quote fitting in. I really love my current group
of friends, but sometimes I feel like I just generally
don't fit in. In other words, while this study and
most research on the liking gap refers to initial introduction relationships,
(08:15):
this is ongoing, right. I mean, even as an adult,
do you I know I do. Sometimes I think I
wonder if my friends actually like me as much as
I like them, because I'm so grateful for my friends,
but I'm the one that often makes the calls. They're
not calling me, Does that mean that they don't like
me as much? Yeah, there's this liking gap. So after
the break, because we've talked way too long, because I
got carried away with what the girls are saying. After
(08:36):
the break, we're going to talk about two, three, maybe
four things that you can do as a parent if
your kids are feeling insecure about their relationships and feel
like they're not necessarily well liked, whether it's meaning new
people or in their current friendship group, to make the
relationship feel safer and stronger. Olie the liking gap. The
(09:01):
data is there, the results are in. We feel like
people don't like us as much as we hope that
they like us, and not as much as we like them.
And it seems that it's mostly not true, like most
people like us more than we think, not less. Most
people accept us more than we think, not less. Obviously
for being bullied, you're hanging around with the wrong people.
There's need to change things up. But this matters when
(09:24):
you listen to the details of that study. Does anything
stand out to you, like, what would you say to
parents based on what this liking gap research seems to indicate.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
I think back to that first meeting with your mum
and the things that we've already discussed.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
I'm sorry, this sounds like this was so pivotal in
your life and I don't even remember it. I feel
so bad. Anyway, back to the.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
Wainy, but you were getting a hammering from her probably,
And you've acknowledged the importance of self esteem and confidence.
And I think back to who I was back then.
I'd grown up with that generation where kids were supposed
to be seen, not heard, and so I never really
felt like I had a voice. Had I have been
(10:06):
someone who was confident in myself and knowing your mum
as well as I do now, she would have relished
and absolutely she would have literally drawn every last breath
out of me when it came to what my opinion
was based on your conversation with you.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
Is that person.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
She would have wanted it. But I didn't have the
confidence or the self esteem to believe that I had
anything worthwhile to share.
Speaker 1 (10:32):
And there it is again, there's the self esteem issue,
the anxiety issue, The liking gap exists because of what's
going on in our heads. It's like imposter syndrome in relationships,
that's right.
Speaker 2 (10:41):
And so for me in that moment, I just wanted
to dig a big hole and bury myself in it, like,
just get me away from this. And so when I
think about what this study is sharing, what it's gifting
us is if parents, if we can give our kids
are voice. This is really tricky, right, This is really
(11:03):
tricky because we really love it when the kids just
do what we ask and they don't question us, and
they don't you know, talk back to us. But they
need to know that their voice matters. They need to
know that they actually have amazing things to contribute to
the world, and when they feel comfortable to share that,
this is less of a problem.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
Okay, I've got a quick comment to make about what
you've just said, and then I've got three quick takeout
messages from the study, from my mind, from the Doctor's Mind.
You don't like Doctor's Desk episodes. You get frustrated when
we have to talk about research science, and look at
you go. You are all in I'm just so excited
about this. You say, yeah, all right, here are my
(11:45):
three takeovers. Oh you've got more. Sorry, Well, you have
a voice, so use it.
Speaker 2 (11:52):
I think. The other one that's really really important is
to assume positive.
Speaker 1 (11:55):
Intent, right right right.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
We are constant assuming the negative when we think about
other people. I mustn't like me. I I was so silly.
I can't believe I said that.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
We get so in our heads and it's all about us. Essentially,
we are the center of our own universe.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
Yes, about us, but if we would give positive intent
to other people and give them the benefit of the doubt,
that would make such a difference to our interactions on
a day to day basis.
Speaker 1 (12:26):
We're ultrasocial. We're supposed to make friends, We're supposed to
connect with people. It's how we're built, it's how we're designed,
and I just love that. Okay, may I now share
my useful take homes from this study for parents if
their kids are struggling with friends, or if you've got
more go through it. Okay, here we go. I need
to do this quickly because we're almost out of time.
Thank you so much for taking over my doctor's desk episode.
(12:49):
Here's the bottom line from the study. From my perspective,
your child walks away from interactions feeling like they're bombed,
when in reality, they've probably scored and they don't even
know it. And if they have loads of esteem, or
if they have any sort of anxiety or anything like that,
that's only going to be amplified and exacerbated. So we
need to teach our kids one simple truth, and that
is that the person they've just met probably likes them
(13:10):
a lot more, not less than they imagine. And if
they're in a long term relationship with with a group
of friends like the girls that I read out from
my Misconnection book, then that is only more the case. Now,
is it true that there are sometimes ruffling of friendship feathers? Yeah,
of course, But that doesn't mean that they don't like you.
That just means that relationships can be tricky sometimes, and
(13:31):
we repair and then we rupture, and then we repair
and then we rupture, and that's the nature of relationships.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
But I think it's really important to highlight within that
that a lack of self confidence and self esteem play
a huge part in the ruffling of feathers more times
than not.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
Well, And that brings me to the second takeaway from
the study, and that is that your child's insecurity is
probably the problem rather than their actual likability. Your child
is likable, but their insecurity makes them feel like they
are not likable. It's the insecurity that makes them feel
like they're unlovable. The math doesn't lie here. When we
teach them that friendship anxiety is a software bug rather
(14:08):
than a hardware problem, what they then know is, oh okay,
so people can like me, people do like me. I'm
the one that's getting anxious about this. There's not really
a problem here at all, I think. I mean, what
a confidence booster. It's hard to argue with the voice
in your head that's saying the opposite, but the data
bears it out. Third one, I think that we need
(14:29):
to teach our kids to focus on the quality of
the interaction rather than obsessing over this invisible scoreboard in
their head. When they're fully present in conversations, when they're engaged,
when they're asking questions, when they're listening, when they're sharing ideas,
the anxiety inducing mental math becomes completely irrelevant. They can
make friends, they're likable, they're worthy, and that I think
(14:50):
this is a study that gives us great hope if
we can just help our children to understand that they're
in their heads too much. But if they can just
accept that because they're having an interaction with somebody and
because it's ended on a positive note, it's probably gone, well,
that should be enough. So that's my doctor's desk, that's
our doctor's desk. We will link to the study in
the show notes for those who are interested in the
(15:10):
social psychology of the likability gap. I think it's fascinating stuff.
Thanks so much for listening. The Happy Families podcast is
produced by Justin Ruland from Bridge Media. For more information
and more resources to make your family happy at visit
us at happy families dot com dot au
You know, when you meet somebody and you kind of
like them, you think they're really nice, but you're pretty
sure that you didn't leave the best impression ever. You
feel like maybe they don't really like you, and therefore
the relationship, the friendship is doomed, maybe even before it started.
Today we talk about your kids, their friends and how
(00:26):
they can feel more likable based on brand new research.
It's a doctor's Desk episode of the Happy Families podcast
Real Parenting Solutions every Day, Australia's most downloaded parenting podcasts.
We are Justin and Kylie Colson. Kylie, there's this thing
called the liking gap. Researchers have known for years about
this thing with kids as young as five as well
(00:47):
as adults. After meeting someone for the first time, we
often underestimate how much they like us. Have you ever
had that happen? You're laughing like, maybe, yes, it's I
have a great story, feel like an imposter that kind
of thing. What's your story?
Speaker 2 (01:05):
It involves your mum. The very very first time you
took me home to introduce me to your parents. Yes, yes,
you took me down into the backyard to meet your
dad who was watching your younger twin sisters.
Speaker 1 (01:21):
Yeah, I have two sets of twin sisters, I mean
whole and my youngest sets twin sisters, like fifteen years
younger than me.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
Yeah, I think they were about six at the time,
and they were playing on the swing set. And so
your dad kind of he looked over, he gave me
a smile, you know, kind of wasn't interested in engaging
in any conversation. Dad, your sisters were oblivious because you know,
they were too busy playing.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
And there was six.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
You then took me upstairs, and your mum was in
the kitchen kind of organizing dinner, and she was putting
plates together for you and I, And the next thing,
your sisters ran up the stairs and literally jumped on
my lap while I was sitting on the table and
couldn't get enough of me in that moment. I don't
remember any of this, but your mom, well, she obviously
(02:04):
acknowledged me and she said hello. But she sat down
next to us at the table and proceeded to have
a conversation with you that I would have felt was
a bit too personal for someone you've never met before.
And I didn't know where to be in the room.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
My head, my mum doesn't have filters. Let's be honest.
If she needs to say it, she needs to say it.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
She wanted to know what you were going to do
with the rest of your life. Like literally, this was
an urgent conversation that couldn't wait until I was not there.
Speaker 1 (02:32):
So did she not say anything like Hi, Kylie, tell
me about yourself.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
No, she did launch it. She launched into this conversation
with you, and I sat there the whole time thinking
she hates me, She absolutely hates me. It wasn't until
later that she shared with me that the reason she
had that conversation with you was she actually was pretty
confident that I was the one.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
Right, she didn't talk to you, You just walked into
the house, But you're the one.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
I'm the one. She felt really good about me, and
she just felt like she didn't have to put him
on any pretense, that she could just be her and
she didn't need to worry about me because I was
going to be a part of the family sooner or later.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Welcome to the family. So I'm hearing this story and
we've gone so far from where we're supposed to be
going with the doctor's desk research. But I don't know
much of this story, even though I apparently was. There
might be worth highlighting that within two weeks of that
conversation happening, I had proposed, like we only dated for
(03:31):
two and a half weeks and then we had like
an eleven month engagement while I was in mad Isa
and you were in Brisbane and we got married. It's
been twenty seven and a half, twenty eight years, Like,
how awesome is that? But the liking gap was there,
so you've walked out thinking.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
I honestly thought she makes me hated, sheeds me? How
was I just disliked? I actually thought she hated I
don't know how.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
I don't know this story. How long was it between
you having that interaction with my mom and you discovering
that she didn't hate you at all and that she
felt so comfortable that she felt like she could talk
to you about it.
Speaker 2 (04:06):
I don't think we had that conversation un till well
and truly after you and I were married. But obviously
I knew she didn't hate me one sure?
Speaker 1 (04:13):
Sure? I mean maybe she was writing history. Was she
even aware that you're in the room? Is what I'm thinking. Anyway,
let's talk about this clearly, you've experienced the liking gap.
You've had a first impression with somebody, think that they
don't like you very much, and they actually like you
quite a lot. Some researchers at the University of Toronto,
I've done this really cool study, HESSEGANI to Sarah and
colleagues found hints as to why some people experience bigger
(04:36):
liking gaps than others. And no surprise, it has to
do with your mental health. It has to do with
your self esteem, it has to do with your anxiety.
But basically here's what they found. They did three different groups,
three different studies, if you will. The first group, eight
hundred and sixty three strangers. They do this round robin
getting to know you session. Each chat lasts two or
three minutes, so it's kind of like speed dating, I guess,
(04:59):
but without the romantic overtures. And they had to also
fill in a scale that assessed their self esteem, their
social anxiety, their loneliness, their life satisfaction, their perceptions of
having positive relationships with other people, and their neuroticism. Second group,
three hundred and seventy eight university students. They've had conversations
(05:20):
with a series of conversation partners about anything they wanted
to talk about for twelve minutes, and those students were
just asked to report on their self esteem. That was
all they were measured on. Third group. I know there's
a lot of information, but it'll all make sense in
just a sick Third group, four hundred and sixty five
US based adults have some online digital chats for twenty
(05:42):
five minutes with a stranger, just one conversation, and they're
completing measures of neuroticism and loneliness after each conversation. Regardless
of which group, every participant had to rate how much
they liked their conversation partner and how much they thought
their conversation partner liked them. That way, they get to
(06:03):
the analysis gets to look at, well what was your perception,
what was theirs? And how much do they marry up?
Is there a liking gap? And they also had to
just say, well, this is how much I liked the meeting.
And what the research has found, consistent with previous data,
is that the overwhelming majority of participants felt as though
their conversation partners liked them much less than they actually did.
(06:28):
They had the liking gap that you've just described. When
it comes to came to that first conversation that you
had with my mum.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
It's interesting to me. I know we're talking about like
first time conversations.
Speaker 1 (06:37):
Correct.
Speaker 2 (06:38):
I look at even some of the close relationships I
have in my life, and I have been blown away
at times when they've actually expressed how deeply they feel
about me. I know that they're my friend, I know
that they love and appreciate me, but the times that
they've actually shared specifically how they feel has just it's
(06:59):
blown me away because I would never have assumed the
depth to their feelings.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
As you're saying that, you've just prompted something really big
for me. I think this is super important that I
hadn't planned on mentioning in this pod. But when I
write Misconnection, that book about teenage girls, I ask girls
what made their lives the best, and they said friends.
And then I said what makes your life the worst,
and they said friends. But have listened to some of
these quotes. I've just dragged it up as you were
sharing precisely that story. This is what some of the
(07:29):
girls said to me, and I quote word perfect quote,
none of my friends really like me. I worry that
people don't like me how my close friends actually see me.
I have a massive fear that everyone around me is
just putting up with me until I leave them alone.
This one said, the thing I worry about most is
that by the end of high school, people are still
going to think of me as a nerd with no
boyfriend and no social life. This worries me because what
(07:51):
if it's true? And so what you can hear is
this desperation like do In fact, one girl said, here's
another quote fitting in. I really love my current group
of friends, but sometimes I feel like I just generally
don't fit in. In other words, while this study and
most research on the liking gap refers to initial introduction relationships,
(08:15):
this is ongoing, right. I mean, even as an adult,
do you I know I do. Sometimes I think I
wonder if my friends actually like me as much as
I like them, because I'm so grateful for my friends,
but I'm the one that often makes the calls. They're
not calling me, Does that mean that they don't like
me as much? Yeah, there's this liking gap. So after
the break, because we've talked way too long, because I
got carried away with what the girls are saying. After
(08:36):
the break, we're going to talk about two, three, maybe
four things that you can do as a parent if
your kids are feeling insecure about their relationships and feel
like they're not necessarily well liked, whether it's meaning new
people or in their current friendship group, to make the
relationship feel safer and stronger. Olie the liking gap. The
(09:01):
data is there, the results are in. We feel like
people don't like us as much as we hope that
they like us, and not as much as we like them.
And it seems that it's mostly not true, like most
people like us more than we think, not less. Most
people accept us more than we think, not less. Obviously
for being bullied, you're hanging around with the wrong people.
There's need to change things up. But this matters when
(09:24):
you listen to the details of that study. Does anything
stand out to you, like, what would you say to
parents based on what this liking gap research seems to indicate.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
I think back to that first meeting with your mum
and the things that we've already discussed.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
I'm sorry, this sounds like this was so pivotal in
your life and I don't even remember it. I feel
so bad. Anyway, back to the.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
Wainy, but you were getting a hammering from her probably,
And you've acknowledged the importance of self esteem and confidence.
And I think back to who I was back then.
I'd grown up with that generation where kids were supposed
to be seen, not heard, and so I never really
felt like I had a voice. Had I have been
(10:06):
someone who was confident in myself and knowing your mum
as well as I do now, she would have relished
and absolutely she would have literally drawn every last breath
out of me when it came to what my opinion
was based on your conversation with you.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
Is that person.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
She would have wanted it. But I didn't have the
confidence or the self esteem to believe that I had
anything worthwhile to share.
Speaker 1 (10:32):
And there it is again, there's the self esteem issue,
the anxiety issue, The liking gap exists because of what's
going on in our heads. It's like imposter syndrome in relationships,
that's right.
Speaker 2 (10:41):
And so for me in that moment, I just wanted
to dig a big hole and bury myself in it, like,
just get me away from this. And so when I
think about what this study is sharing, what it's gifting
us is if parents, if we can give our kids
are voice. This is really tricky, right, This is really
(11:03):
tricky because we really love it when the kids just
do what we ask and they don't question us, and
they don't you know, talk back to us. But they
need to know that their voice matters. They need to
know that they actually have amazing things to contribute to
the world, and when they feel comfortable to share that,
this is less of a problem.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
Okay, I've got a quick comment to make about what
you've just said, and then I've got three quick takeout
messages from the study, from my mind, from the Doctor's Mind.
You don't like Doctor's Desk episodes. You get frustrated when
we have to talk about research science, and look at
you go. You are all in I'm just so excited
about this. You say, yeah, all right, here are my
(11:45):
three takeovers. Oh you've got more. Sorry, Well, you have
a voice, so use it.
Speaker 2 (11:52):
I think. The other one that's really really important is
to assume positive.
Speaker 1 (11:55):
Intent, right right right.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
We are constant assuming the negative when we think about
other people. I mustn't like me. I I was so silly.
I can't believe I said that.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
We get so in our heads and it's all about us. Essentially,
we are the center of our own universe.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
Yes, about us, but if we would give positive intent
to other people and give them the benefit of the doubt,
that would make such a difference to our interactions on
a day to day basis.
Speaker 1 (12:26):
We're ultrasocial. We're supposed to make friends, We're supposed to
connect with people. It's how we're built, it's how we're designed,
and I just love that. Okay, may I now share
my useful take homes from this study for parents if
their kids are struggling with friends, or if you've got
more go through it. Okay, here we go. I need
to do this quickly because we're almost out of time.
Thank you so much for taking over my doctor's desk episode.
(12:49):
Here's the bottom line from the study. From my perspective,
your child walks away from interactions feeling like they're bombed,
when in reality, they've probably scored and they don't even
know it. And if they have loads of esteem, or
if they have any sort of anxiety or anything like that,
that's only going to be amplified and exacerbated. So we
need to teach our kids one simple truth, and that
is that the person they've just met probably likes them
(13:10):
a lot more, not less than they imagine. And if
they're in a long term relationship with with a group
of friends like the girls that I read out from
my Misconnection book, then that is only more the case. Now,
is it true that there are sometimes ruffling of friendship feathers? Yeah,
of course, But that doesn't mean that they don't like you.
That just means that relationships can be tricky sometimes, and
(13:31):
we repair and then we rupture, and then we repair
and then we rupture, and that's the nature of relationships.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
But I think it's really important to highlight within that
that a lack of self confidence and self esteem play
a huge part in the ruffling of feathers more times
than not.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
Well, And that brings me to the second takeaway from
the study, and that is that your child's insecurity is
probably the problem rather than their actual likability. Your child
is likable, but their insecurity makes them feel like they
are not likable. It's the insecurity that makes them feel
like they're unlovable. The math doesn't lie here. When we
teach them that friendship anxiety is a software bug rather
(14:08):
than a hardware problem, what they then know is, oh okay,
so people can like me, people do like me. I'm
the one that's getting anxious about this. There's not really
a problem here at all, I think. I mean, what
a confidence booster. It's hard to argue with the voice
in your head that's saying the opposite, but the data
bears it out. Third one, I think that we need
(14:29):
to teach our kids to focus on the quality of
the interaction rather than obsessing over this invisible scoreboard in
their head. When they're fully present in conversations, when they're engaged,
when they're asking questions, when they're listening, when they're sharing ideas,
the anxiety inducing mental math becomes completely irrelevant. They can
make friends, they're likable, they're worthy, and that I think
(14:50):
this is a study that gives us great hope if
we can just help our children to understand that they're
in their heads too much. But if they can just
accept that because they're having an interaction with somebody and
because it's ended on a positive note, it's probably gone, well,
that should be enough. So that's my doctor's desk, that's
our doctor's desk. We will link to the study in
the show notes for those who are interested in the
(15:10):
social psychology of the likability gap. I think it's fascinating stuff.
Thanks so much for listening. The Happy Families podcast is
produced by Justin Ruland from Bridge Media. For more information
and more resources to make your family happy at visit
us at happy families dot com dot au
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