June 1, 2025 • 15 mins
It's time to address the age-old question: Do children make us happy? Backed by powerful research and personal stories, Kylie and Justin explore the paradox of parenting—how our kids can simultaneously be our greatest joy and our biggest challenge. Featuring insights from happiness researchers like Daniel Kahneman, Paul Bloom, and Roy Baumeister, the conversation moves from exhaustion and conflict to purpose, meaning, and unconditional love.
KEY POINTS:
- Research shows that parenting often decreases happiness and marital satisfaction, especially in the early years.
- Daniel Kahneman's study revealed mothers find time with kids less enjoyable than activities like watching TV or shopping—particularly during stressful mornings and evenings.
- Despite the challenges, most parents say they don't regret having children—why?
- Cultural and policy differences influence parental happiness across countries.
- Parenting isn’t primarily about happiness—it's about purpose, meaning, and deep emotional connection.
- The hardest parts of parenting often give rise to the most profound moments of growth and joy.
QUOTE OF THE EPISODE:
"If the loss of a child would be total annihilation, then having a child—healthy, happy, and sound—must be annihilation’s opposite, which sounds pretty terrific." – Paul Bloom
RESOURCES MENTIONED:
- The Parenting Revolution by Dr. Justin Coulson
- All Joy and No Fun by Jennifer Senior
- The Sweet Spot by Paul Bloom
- Meanings of Life by Roy Baumeister
- Daniel Kahneman’s research on parental enjoyment
- Columbia University studies by Sara McLanahan
ACTION STEPS FOR PARENTS:
- Redefine Happiness: Shift your focus from momentary happiness to long-term meaning and connection.
- Embrace the Mess: Recognise that hard days are part of the growth—yours and your child’s.
- Prioritise Connection: In the chaos, seek small moments of intimacy and presence.
- Protect Your Partnership: Align as a couple around shared parenting values; the child isn’t the problem—misalignment often is.
- Find Support: Advocate for better policy and community support—or build your village where you can.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
Do children make you happy or do they make you miserable?
Maybe the answer is a bit of both, depending on
the day, depending on what time of the day it is.
We talk about this question a lot on the Happy
Families podcast because the National Children's Commissioner Ann Holland's is
on the record as saying that there is no such
thing as a happy family, like, well, not long term anyway.
(00:27):
Today we unpack what makes a family happy and whether
or not parents can truly be happy when they're raising
their children. Today this is the Happy Family's podcast, Real
Parenting Solutions every Day on Australia's most downloaded parenting podcast,
where Justin and Kylie Colson Kylie out of ten, how
happy have our children made you today? Yes, specifically today.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
Let's make it a two.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Has been a pretty rugged day, hasn't it?
Speaker 2 (00:55):
It has been.
Speaker 1 (00:55):
In fact, it's been such a rugged day. I'm not
into threats, I'm not I'm not that guy. But in
my efforts to preserve your sanity, I did tell Emily,
our eleven year old, that if this keeps up, there's
no more homeschool. We're just going to send it back
to school. Here's the research. My favorite study on This
is Daniel Carneman. He surveyed just over eight hundred Texas
(01:19):
women or working mums and what that research showed, and
it's been I've written about it in my own books,
has been written about all over the place. Women said
that being with their children was quote less enjoyable than
many other activities such as watching TV, shopping, or preparing food.
That is, I would I would rather prepare a meal
than play with my children.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
I don't know who these women are, but I would
pick the kids over having to do dinner another night
every single time.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Let me do the ironing, leave me alone. I don't
know now. I wrote about this in The Pairing Revolution.
There's something that's very very important in this study that
gets overlooked in every single article that I've ever read
about it, and people go for the headline mums would
rather do anything than play with the kids. But the
mums were all working mums, and they were filling in
(02:08):
these questionnaires in the morning and in the evening. I
don't know about you, but it's typically challenging to do
anything with children in the morning or the evening, like
they're the hardest times, as when you're tired, when you're
under time pressure.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
So it's called witching hour for a reason.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
It's really difficult. So here's what we've known since the
nineteen seventies, Sarah mclanahan's famous Columbia studies, where she found
that having children. Once children are born, parents' experience a
decrease in happiness, a drop in marital satisfaction, and that
only recovers once the kids leave home.
Speaker 2 (02:39):
It's a pretty glib outlook.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
Is glib glamor a bit of both? Maybe is the thing.
It's kind of true. Research is really clear that marriages
take a massive hit when a baby comes on board.
On average, you see marriage and relationship satisfaction go down.
So too does the satisfaction around intimacy, and it kind
(03:01):
of stays down there for a pretty long time once
the kid's are teenagers. Most it's pretty obvious when I
go into schools and do my seminars. The parents that
have got the brightest eyes, the bushy's tales, the ones
who look the happiest, they're the ones that are raising
young children. And you know who doesn't even bother show
up parents of teens. We're nearly finished and we're kind
(03:22):
of over it, and he can't tell us anything. Now
it's too late. We're done. My favorite quote of all
time on this topic comes from Dan Gilbert. Daniel Gilbert
wrote he's written a couple books about happiness, and he
also is a Harvard psychologist, and he said, quote, the
only symptom of empty nest syndrome is non stop smiling.
(03:48):
So do we need to talk about why parenting can
be challenging?
Speaker 2 (03:52):
I don't think so. I think we've got that under out.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
If you're a parent, you know you know. Jennifersonia wrote
a book called All Join In Fun about parenting, and
this is what she said. She said, kids provoke quote
a couple's most frequent arguments more than money, more than work,
more than in laws. So it's not just that children
are tiring and expensive and course sleep deprivation and mess
(04:15):
up your work schedule and your exercise schedule and your
everything else that's important to your schedule. They actually create
more conflict. Like one of the most popular questions I
get is how do I get my husband to agree
with me about parenting? Literally, that's what mums always say,
How do I get my husband to agree with me?
Speaker 2 (04:33):
I kind of feel like the kids are getting a
hard wrap here. This isn't actually about kids at all.
If two partners can't work out a situation, how.
Speaker 1 (04:44):
Is it the kid's fault?
Speaker 2 (04:46):
Well, like being on the same page. That's a partner issue.
That's not a children's issue.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
Right, But it wouldn't be an issue if you didn't
have kids. That's the no.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
But if you didn't have kids, there'd be something else
that you clearly aren't aligned with either.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
Yeah, I don't know, like, don't shampoo the dog in
the laundry, do it outside. I just don't think that
the conflicts are going to be as big. It is
the most argued about thing in marriages. Money's close behind,
but yeah, the kids are right up there.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
We don't argue about the kids.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
No, we don't, because you're married to the guy that's
written all the books about parenting.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
Oh, you're hilarious.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
What do you mean?
Speaker 2 (05:20):
I believe you just said that.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
You do more parenting than me, and when it gets
too hard, I literally do say I'm handing this one
over to you. I'm out. We don't argue, We just
sort of we handball. It's just a hospital pass. Oh
I can't take Let's see what you've got you do
that to me as well.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
Let's be honest, all right, show me what you got.
Speaker 1 (05:45):
So we need to talk about a couple of things here.
First off, it is more complicated than it seems. Part
of the problem when it comes to all of this
conversation around kids and happiness is the way we measure happiness.
So having children makes you unhappy. Happiness impact varies. Older fathers,
for example, get a happiness boost, Kylie. And we know
(06:05):
a few older dads and they are super happy, like
they love being dads. The older mums not quite so much,
but the older dads are like, this is the best
thing we've ever done, so glad we did this. Young
parents and single parents suffer the most significant happiness losses.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
So the only reason that older men have a happiness
boost is because they actually treat their kids like their grandkids.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
So here's the other thing that I want to add.
Cultural and policy factors matter as well. So parents from
countries that have got really great childcare policies like Norway
and Hungary tend to be happier than childless couples. Families
from the US, Australia and the UK tend to be
less happy. Why because our child policies, our family supports,
and our general level of community. Just they're not as strong,
(06:53):
they're not as high. So after the break, we're going
to talk about what Paul Bloom, the author of a
wonderful book called The sweet Spot, says about this whole
happiness thing and having kids. We're going to talk about
whether parents will own up to regretting having children. And
then the one thing that is perhaps more important than
this conversation than anything if you want to find joy
(07:14):
in family life, Kylie. Paul Blum has written a book.
I've got it here on my shelf in a bright
yellow cover. It's called The sweet Spot. Paul Bloom is
a world leading academic and he said this quote, there's
more life than happiness. Parenting provides something deeper, something having
(07:38):
to do with satisfaction, purpose and meaning. Another guy, Roy Baumeister,
who is one of the world's leading academics and has
probably published more papers than just about anyone on the planet.
He wrote a book called Meanings of Life, also just
here on my shelf, and he says the same thing.
Parenting is not actually about happiness. If you're having children
and wanting to be happy, prepare to be disappointed, but
(07:59):
happiness comes and go. What you get a really steady
supply of is meaning and purpose. You get a whole
lot of really good You get this significance, this sense
of importance and meaning. Parents, both mothers and fathers, tend
to say that their lives have more meaning than those
of non parents.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
I think the challenges when you're in the thick of it,
it's hard to see the meaning. Like you just you
get so bombarded with the heart.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
Don't tell me this is meaningful. I just want to break. Yeah,
I just want to smile again.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
I just want to sleep. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
Yeah, Well, if I sleep, I probably am more likely
to smile. So what I find really fascinating in this
conversation is some research, again by Paul Bloom, where parents
have actually been said do you regret having children? And
surprisingly to me, somewhere between sort of seven and fourteen
percent across different studies say yeah, I do, which means
(08:57):
that somewhere between eighty five and ninety three percent of
people say no, I could never regret having the kids,
and Paupbloom says these are really weirdly low numbers when
you consider how challenging parenting is you'd expect that it
would be higher. And therefore you've got this question, why
why do parents say that they don't regret it if
(09:18):
it has been shown so consistently for five decades now
to bring quote unquote happiness levels down. And there's a
couple of hypotheses. Number one, there's just the social pressure.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
But when you know how research is done and it's
usually anonymous, and I don't see social pressure as playing
a part in this kind of data.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
That's a really really important point. However, society does glamorize
the wonders of parenthood, and to buck that trend and
say actually, I hate it and I wish I hadn't
done it. It's one thing to say it's hard, and
mummy bloggers and TikTok is all over the place it's hard,
and there's all sorts of memes everywhere about how hard
it is. But to actually say I regret it, that's
a really really big call, and that to me still
(10:03):
contravenes a major social norm.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
I think about some of the other studies that we've
talked about, and people willing to hurt other people to
the point where they're not breathing and you're going to
tell me that social norms would suggest that I can't
say I regret being a parent.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
I don't know. It's a big call.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
I'm really pushing against this one.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
All right. Memory is another one. Think childbirth, so we
remember the peaks, we forget the ninety nine percent of
mundane awfulness of parenting.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
I wouldn't put childbirth in as a peak.
Speaker 1 (10:32):
No, you know what I mean though, Like, no, I'm
saying it's a trough. But just the other day, just
the other day, we were talking and you literally said
I could go back.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
No, what I'm saying you said, I'm talking about when
they hand me that baby. I'm not talking about con
thro all that pain again.
Speaker 1 (10:51):
No, no, but you said, if I could have that
feeling again, I'd go back yet.
Speaker 2 (10:56):
The after feeling. You're in the middle.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
Fielding even before before you get the after.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
But I don't want that.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
You said that. You said that, and that's what so
many people do. So there may be some justification behind
the memory effects there where people are saying child raising children,
being a parent makes me happy because they're thinking about
the snuggles and the tickles and the I mean, we
just had Indiana Sky here again, a couple of nights ago,
and that beautiful almost two year old voice as she's
(11:24):
figuring out all of her words and walking around.
Speaker 2 (11:26):
She they's not even saying words, but she's having a
conversation with you, and it's just aw this little ju
and she knows exactly what she's saying to you.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
So the big one, the one that I buy into most,
is that most parents love their children, and it seems
terrible to admit that the world would be better if
someone you love didn't exist. Like, you don't regret having children,
even though you admit that your life could be better
without them, but you still don't regret it because you
love them. Look Like to me, this is the key insight.
(11:56):
We say that having children makes us happy because it does,
actually does, because the love that we have towards them.
It means that our choice to have them has so
much value above and beyond whatever effect they're having on
a happiness and meaning that we just say yes. It
is one of the most transcendent, one of the most purposeful,
one and the most meaningful and one of the most
joy giving experiences of my life, perhaps precisely because of
(12:20):
the sacrifice that's involved.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Well, I think that's the key. The things that we
are willing to sacrifice the most for are the things
that generally speaking, have the most meaning, and because we
wouldn't be willing to sacrifice without.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
That correct And when you think of the most tragic stories,
as people talk about the hardship and trauma they have
in their lives, whatever reason they're going through hardship, usually
there's a lack of love somewhere. There's parents who just
didn't give them that love.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
When we understand how significant connection is to our well
being as parents, we have this opportunity to build these
connections with people we actually made. We actually made.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
I'm going to say exactly that these people, like our children,
are these wonderful people who we just grow to love
in such profound ways. And the more you give, the
more you get out of parenting. Like there's just something
beautiful about it.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
I love the full circle moments about family life because
in essence, we have literally grown this human being from
the tiniest, tiniest little cell, and then we have the
opportunity to actually grow them into people, and from a
(13:45):
child into a teenager, and then from a teenager into
an adult. But the crazy thing is I think in
so many ways, my kids have taught me more than
I'll ever teach them, Like, honestly, the person I am
today because those six girls has been shaped because of
what they have taught me.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
Not always comfortably. No, there's we need to wrap it up.
How time's done. Parenting and happiness. Does it make you happy?
I used to actually, and sometimes when I'm teaching my seminars,
I still laugh and say no, not really, but it does.
It does in the most profound and transcendent ways. Paul Bloom,
let's wrap this up with his quote. He said, if
the loss of a child, and we've seen this happen
(14:26):
in my family, if the loss of a child would
be total annihilation, then having a child healthy and happy
and sound must be annihilation's opposite, which sounds pretty terrific.
Boom actually bloom, Paul Bloom. Do you like that one?
Boom bloom?
Speaker 2 (14:46):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
That Happy Families podcast is produced by Justin Rule on
form Bridge Media. Hey, thanks Jr. For the great work
you do. If you'd like more information about making your
family happier, I've written incredible book. Well I am I'm
calling an incredible I spoke to somebody the other day
who told me it was incredible, so I'm just quoting them.
It's called the Parenting Revolution. Get it wherever you buy
your books. It will make your family happier and it
(15:07):
will talk about this paradox of kids, happiness meaning purpose, satisfaction,
all that stuff. The Pairing Revolution available everywhere you get
good books. It's published by ABC Books and you can
get more info about general happiness and your family at
happy families dot com dot au
Do children make you happy or do they make you miserable?
Maybe the answer is a bit of both, depending on
the day, depending on what time of the day it is.
We talk about this question a lot on the Happy
Families podcast because the National Children's Commissioner Ann Holland's is
on the record as saying that there is no such
thing as a happy family, like, well, not long term anyway.
(00:27):
Today we unpack what makes a family happy and whether
or not parents can truly be happy when they're raising
their children. Today this is the Happy Family's podcast, Real
Parenting Solutions every Day on Australia's most downloaded parenting podcast,
where Justin and Kylie Colson Kylie out of ten, how
happy have our children made you today? Yes, specifically today.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
Let's make it a two.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Has been a pretty rugged day, hasn't it?
Speaker 2 (00:55):
It has been.
Speaker 1 (00:55):
In fact, it's been such a rugged day. I'm not
into threats, I'm not I'm not that guy. But in
my efforts to preserve your sanity, I did tell Emily,
our eleven year old, that if this keeps up, there's
no more homeschool. We're just going to send it back
to school. Here's the research. My favorite study on This
is Daniel Carneman. He surveyed just over eight hundred Texas
(01:19):
women or working mums and what that research showed, and
it's been I've written about it in my own books,
has been written about all over the place. Women said
that being with their children was quote less enjoyable than
many other activities such as watching TV, shopping, or preparing food.
That is, I would I would rather prepare a meal
than play with my children.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
I don't know who these women are, but I would
pick the kids over having to do dinner another night
every single time.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Let me do the ironing, leave me alone. I don't
know now. I wrote about this in The Pairing Revolution.
There's something that's very very important in this study that
gets overlooked in every single article that I've ever read
about it, and people go for the headline mums would
rather do anything than play with the kids. But the
mums were all working mums, and they were filling in
(02:08):
these questionnaires in the morning and in the evening. I
don't know about you, but it's typically challenging to do
anything with children in the morning or the evening, like
they're the hardest times, as when you're tired, when you're
under time pressure.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
So it's called witching hour for a reason.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
It's really difficult. So here's what we've known since the
nineteen seventies, Sarah mclanahan's famous Columbia studies, where she found
that having children. Once children are born, parents' experience a
decrease in happiness, a drop in marital satisfaction, and that
only recovers once the kids leave home.
Speaker 2 (02:39):
It's a pretty glib outlook.
Speaker 1 (02:41):
Is glib glamor a bit of both? Maybe is the thing.
It's kind of true. Research is really clear that marriages
take a massive hit when a baby comes on board.
On average, you see marriage and relationship satisfaction go down.
So too does the satisfaction around intimacy, and it kind
(03:01):
of stays down there for a pretty long time once
the kid's are teenagers. Most it's pretty obvious when I
go into schools and do my seminars. The parents that
have got the brightest eyes, the bushy's tales, the ones
who look the happiest, they're the ones that are raising
young children. And you know who doesn't even bother show
up parents of teens. We're nearly finished and we're kind
(03:22):
of over it, and he can't tell us anything. Now
it's too late. We're done. My favorite quote of all
time on this topic comes from Dan Gilbert. Daniel Gilbert
wrote he's written a couple books about happiness, and he
also is a Harvard psychologist, and he said, quote, the
only symptom of empty nest syndrome is non stop smiling.
(03:48):
So do we need to talk about why parenting can
be challenging?
Speaker 2 (03:52):
I don't think so. I think we've got that under out.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
If you're a parent, you know you know. Jennifersonia wrote
a book called All Join In Fun about parenting, and
this is what she said. She said, kids provoke quote
a couple's most frequent arguments more than money, more than work,
more than in laws. So it's not just that children
are tiring and expensive and course sleep deprivation and mess
(04:15):
up your work schedule and your exercise schedule and your
everything else that's important to your schedule. They actually create
more conflict. Like one of the most popular questions I
get is how do I get my husband to agree
with me about parenting? Literally, that's what mums always say,
How do I get my husband to agree with me?
Speaker 2 (04:33):
I kind of feel like the kids are getting a
hard wrap here. This isn't actually about kids at all.
If two partners can't work out a situation, how.
Speaker 1 (04:44):
Is it the kid's fault?
Speaker 2 (04:46):
Well, like being on the same page. That's a partner issue.
That's not a children's issue.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
Right, But it wouldn't be an issue if you didn't
have kids. That's the no.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
But if you didn't have kids, there'd be something else
that you clearly aren't aligned with either.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
Yeah, I don't know, like, don't shampoo the dog in
the laundry, do it outside. I just don't think that
the conflicts are going to be as big. It is
the most argued about thing in marriages. Money's close behind,
but yeah, the kids are right up there.
Speaker 2 (05:10):
We don't argue about the kids.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
No, we don't, because you're married to the guy that's
written all the books about parenting.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
Oh, you're hilarious.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
What do you mean?
Speaker 2 (05:20):
I believe you just said that.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
You do more parenting than me, and when it gets
too hard, I literally do say I'm handing this one
over to you. I'm out. We don't argue, We just
sort of we handball. It's just a hospital pass. Oh
I can't take Let's see what you've got you do
that to me as well.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
Let's be honest, all right, show me what you got.
Speaker 1 (05:45):
So we need to talk about a couple of things here.
First off, it is more complicated than it seems. Part
of the problem when it comes to all of this
conversation around kids and happiness is the way we measure happiness.
So having children makes you unhappy. Happiness impact varies. Older fathers,
for example, get a happiness boost, Kylie. And we know
(06:05):
a few older dads and they are super happy, like
they love being dads. The older mums not quite so much,
but the older dads are like, this is the best
thing we've ever done, so glad we did this. Young
parents and single parents suffer the most significant happiness losses.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
So the only reason that older men have a happiness
boost is because they actually treat their kids like their grandkids.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
So here's the other thing that I want to add.
Cultural and policy factors matter as well. So parents from
countries that have got really great childcare policies like Norway
and Hungary tend to be happier than childless couples. Families
from the US, Australia and the UK tend to be
less happy. Why because our child policies, our family supports,
and our general level of community. Just they're not as strong,
(06:53):
they're not as high. So after the break, we're going
to talk about what Paul Bloom, the author of a
wonderful book called The sweet Spot, says about this whole
happiness thing and having kids. We're going to talk about
whether parents will own up to regretting having children. And
then the one thing that is perhaps more important than
this conversation than anything if you want to find joy
(07:14):
in family life, Kylie. Paul Blum has written a book.
I've got it here on my shelf in a bright
yellow cover. It's called The sweet Spot. Paul Bloom is
a world leading academic and he said this quote, there's
more life than happiness. Parenting provides something deeper, something having
(07:38):
to do with satisfaction, purpose and meaning. Another guy, Roy Baumeister,
who is one of the world's leading academics and has
probably published more papers than just about anyone on the planet.
He wrote a book called Meanings of Life, also just
here on my shelf, and he says the same thing.
Parenting is not actually about happiness. If you're having children
and wanting to be happy, prepare to be disappointed, but
(07:59):
happiness comes and go. What you get a really steady
supply of is meaning and purpose. You get a whole
lot of really good You get this significance, this sense
of importance and meaning. Parents, both mothers and fathers, tend
to say that their lives have more meaning than those
of non parents.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
I think the challenges when you're in the thick of it,
it's hard to see the meaning. Like you just you
get so bombarded with the heart.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
Don't tell me this is meaningful. I just want to break. Yeah,
I just want to smile again.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
I just want to sleep. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
Yeah, Well, if I sleep, I probably am more likely
to smile. So what I find really fascinating in this
conversation is some research, again by Paul Bloom, where parents
have actually been said do you regret having children? And
surprisingly to me, somewhere between sort of seven and fourteen
percent across different studies say yeah, I do, which means
(08:57):
that somewhere between eighty five and ninety three percent of
people say no, I could never regret having the kids,
and Paupbloom says these are really weirdly low numbers when
you consider how challenging parenting is you'd expect that it
would be higher. And therefore you've got this question, why
why do parents say that they don't regret it if
(09:18):
it has been shown so consistently for five decades now
to bring quote unquote happiness levels down. And there's a
couple of hypotheses. Number one, there's just the social pressure.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
But when you know how research is done and it's
usually anonymous, and I don't see social pressure as playing
a part in this kind of data.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
That's a really really important point. However, society does glamorize
the wonders of parenthood, and to buck that trend and
say actually, I hate it and I wish I hadn't
done it. It's one thing to say it's hard, and
mummy bloggers and TikTok is all over the place it's hard,
and there's all sorts of memes everywhere about how hard
it is. But to actually say I regret it, that's
a really really big call, and that to me still
(10:03):
contravenes a major social norm.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
I think about some of the other studies that we've
talked about, and people willing to hurt other people to
the point where they're not breathing and you're going to
tell me that social norms would suggest that I can't
say I regret being a parent.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
I don't know. It's a big call.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
I'm really pushing against this one.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
All right. Memory is another one. Think childbirth, so we
remember the peaks, we forget the ninety nine percent of
mundane awfulness of parenting.
Speaker 2 (10:30):
I wouldn't put childbirth in as a peak.
Speaker 1 (10:32):
No, you know what I mean though, Like, no, I'm
saying it's a trough. But just the other day, just
the other day, we were talking and you literally said
I could go back.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
No, what I'm saying you said, I'm talking about when
they hand me that baby. I'm not talking about con
thro all that pain again.
Speaker 1 (10:51):
No, no, but you said, if I could have that
feeling again, I'd go back yet.
Speaker 2 (10:56):
The after feeling. You're in the middle.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
Fielding even before before you get the after.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
But I don't want that.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
You said that. You said that, and that's what so
many people do. So there may be some justification behind
the memory effects there where people are saying child raising children,
being a parent makes me happy because they're thinking about
the snuggles and the tickles and the I mean, we
just had Indiana Sky here again, a couple of nights ago,
and that beautiful almost two year old voice as she's
(11:24):
figuring out all of her words and walking around.
Speaker 2 (11:26):
She they's not even saying words, but she's having a
conversation with you, and it's just aw this little ju
and she knows exactly what she's saying to you.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
So the big one, the one that I buy into most,
is that most parents love their children, and it seems
terrible to admit that the world would be better if
someone you love didn't exist. Like, you don't regret having children,
even though you admit that your life could be better
without them, but you still don't regret it because you
love them. Look Like to me, this is the key insight.
(11:56):
We say that having children makes us happy because it does,
actually does, because the love that we have towards them.
It means that our choice to have them has so
much value above and beyond whatever effect they're having on
a happiness and meaning that we just say yes. It
is one of the most transcendent, one of the most purposeful,
one and the most meaningful and one of the most
joy giving experiences of my life, perhaps precisely because of
(12:20):
the sacrifice that's involved.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Well, I think that's the key. The things that we
are willing to sacrifice the most for are the things
that generally speaking, have the most meaning, and because we
wouldn't be willing to sacrifice without.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
That correct And when you think of the most tragic stories,
as people talk about the hardship and trauma they have
in their lives, whatever reason they're going through hardship, usually
there's a lack of love somewhere. There's parents who just
didn't give them that love.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
When we understand how significant connection is to our well
being as parents, we have this opportunity to build these
connections with people we actually made. We actually made.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
I'm going to say exactly that these people, like our children,
are these wonderful people who we just grow to love
in such profound ways. And the more you give, the
more you get out of parenting. Like there's just something
beautiful about it.
Speaker 2 (13:25):
I love the full circle moments about family life because
in essence, we have literally grown this human being from
the tiniest, tiniest little cell, and then we have the
opportunity to actually grow them into people, and from a
(13:45):
child into a teenager, and then from a teenager into
an adult. But the crazy thing is I think in
so many ways, my kids have taught me more than
I'll ever teach them, Like, honestly, the person I am
today because those six girls has been shaped because of
what they have taught me.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
Not always comfortably. No, there's we need to wrap it up.
How time's done. Parenting and happiness. Does it make you happy?
I used to actually, and sometimes when I'm teaching my seminars,
I still laugh and say no, not really, but it does.
It does in the most profound and transcendent ways. Paul Bloom,
let's wrap this up with his quote. He said, if
the loss of a child, and we've seen this happen
(14:26):
in my family, if the loss of a child would
be total annihilation, then having a child healthy and happy
and sound must be annihilation's opposite, which sounds pretty terrific.
Boom actually bloom, Paul Bloom. Do you like that one?
Boom bloom?
Speaker 2 (14:46):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
That Happy Families podcast is produced by Justin Rule on
form Bridge Media. Hey, thanks Jr. For the great work
you do. If you'd like more information about making your
family happier, I've written incredible book. Well I am I'm
calling an incredible I spoke to somebody the other day
who told me it was incredible, so I'm just quoting them.
It's called the Parenting Revolution. Get it wherever you buy
your books. It will make your family happier and it
(15:07):
will talk about this paradox of kids, happiness meaning purpose, satisfaction,
all that stuff. The Pairing Revolution available everywhere you get
good books. It's published by ABC Books and you can
get more info about general happiness and your family at
happy families dot com dot au
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