Why do girls talk about their looks and boys talk about their abilities? Last night’s Parental Guidance episode tackled the big, emotional topic of body image — from what our kids see in the mirror to what they learn from us. In this Happy Families Podcast recap, Justin and Kylie unpack the powerful moments, the heated debates about Botox and social media, and what the research says about raising kids who feel good about their bodies.
KEY POINTS
- Introduction of four new parenting styles: Authoritative, Positivity, Hard Way, and Life School — and their views on body image.
- Kids’ mirror challenge revealed a clear gender split: boys focused on what their bodies do, girls on how their bodies look.
- Parents’ debate about Botox and cosmetic procedures highlighted tension between self-acceptance and role-modelling for kids.
- Social media and screen use increase body dissatisfaction — media literacy alone isn’t enough.
- WHO study: gender, not body size, predicts body image problems.
- The importance of parents modelling self-acceptance and healthy habits.
QUOTE OF THE EPISODE
"We focus on boys’ function, not form — and girls’ form, not function. That’s how society has conditioned us for centuries." — Dr Justin Coulson
RESOURCES MENTIONED
- The Happiness Hypothesis by Jonathan Haidt
- WHO study on gender and body image
- Book: Miss-connection: Why Your Teenage Daughter Hates You, Expects the World, and Needs to Talk by Justin Coulson
- Pixel Perfect [webinar]
- Happy Families resources at happyfamilies.com.au
ACTION STEPS FOR PARENTS
1. Reduce kids’ time on screens and social media to limit harmful comparisons.
2. Stop focusing on diets or external measures — promote health, not appearance.
3. Encourage kids to focus on what their bodies can do, not how they look.
4. Be mindful of how you talk about your own body — you’re modelling self-image.
5. Avoid assuming media literacy is enough — talk about values, not just filters.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
A really big episode about body image last night on
Parental Guidance. It was episode three of season three. If
you missed it, you can catch up on the nine
Now app. Really really compelling, really heavy, really important conversations.
We're going to unpack it all this week on the
Happy Families podcast. Hello, my name is doctor Justin Colson.
I'm here with my wife missus Happy Families, Kylie, Kylie,
(00:29):
we were introduced to four new focus families.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Let's run through our parenting styles, Elvy and Sean.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
We are authoritative parents.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
We have high expectations on our children. In the meantime,
we set strict rules and boundaries, say.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
Next month.
Speaker 4 (00:50):
As authoritative parents, we don't really give our children too
much choice. We want them to be academically successful, to
get into a good profession.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
So you're basically setting the goal high for them they
can work towards it.
Speaker 4 (01:08):
Yes, we set to rules, we have high expectations. However,
the most important thing in our view is their health
and happiness.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
Nick and Sophia where.
Speaker 5 (01:18):
The positivity parents. Where confidence is key highness. As positivity parents,
we build up our children's self esteem every single day
by doing positive affirmations.
Speaker 6 (01:33):
I can't hear.
Speaker 5 (01:33):
You got to tell her out I am stop before,
Yes you are, Yes you are.
Speaker 3 (01:39):
We've been blessed in the fact that Sophia is able
to work from home as a content creator and she's
incorporated our children within that sphere.
Speaker 6 (01:47):
One two high that.
Speaker 5 (01:51):
One.
Speaker 3 (01:53):
We do.
Speaker 5 (01:53):
Teach our children to have a healthy lifestyle, beautiful.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
They love being physical and Amanda and her son.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
We choose to parent the hard way. We don't take shortcuts.
It's hard on us. We're easy and fun for the
kids right as hardware parents. There's no easy way out.
We don't leave anyone behind. We all go do things together.
Speaker 7 (02:18):
Yes, but when it comes to food, we don't allow junk.
We try to make everything from scratch. We actually choose
to parent our children. We model good behavior. When it
comes to body image. You can put kids down really
quickly with your words. Where they feel that we're happy
(02:38):
and proud of them, they feel proud of themselves.
Speaker 8 (02:41):
Josh and Cassie, we are the life school parents and
we use real life experiences to educate our kids. As
a family of seven, we live in our truck and
caravan traveling around Australia.
Speaker 7 (02:58):
We'd be traveling for like three years. They haven't been
to school for four years.
Speaker 8 (03:02):
We just choose life schooling to a better way to learn.
Speaker 6 (03:04):
What we are doing is a variant of homeschooling, taking
it out of the classroom and into the real world.
Speaker 8 (03:12):
I think you got further than Spencer and are we
going against the norm?
Speaker 9 (03:16):
Are one hundred percent? We're going against that?
Speaker 8 (03:18):
Kids are healthy? Anyone could see that, well done, Jasper.
Speaker 1 (03:23):
So before we talk about the big topic of body image,
we do need to talk briefly about the introductions to
these families, Josh and Cassie, our life school parents.
Speaker 9 (03:33):
They caused a bit of a ruckus in the room.
Speaker 8 (03:35):
Tests and school curriculums and.
Speaker 6 (03:36):
Not no, they're not important s outdated.
Speaker 7 (03:40):
But there is certain things they'll learn in the classroom
from someone that's been to university and done the curriculum
that you can't possibly teach them.
Speaker 6 (03:48):
We'll just push back a little bit on that, because
what can the educational system teach that we don't have
the tools to teach our children. You know, with technology
like YouTube and things, I have tools and resources I
can lean on. So I am fully confident that if
their pursuit and their desire was to become a doctor.
They're going to go pursue that.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
Kylie, Josh and Cassie are doing a they call it
a form of homeschooling. They call it life schooling. We're
homeschooling a couple of our kids, or we have at least,
and we're still homeschooling one of them at the moment.
What did you think about that conversation and this idea
that school is not for every child.
Speaker 10 (04:24):
I agree with that. I think for so long we
fought to keep our kids in school based on this
idea and notion that it's a societal expectation that our
kids will be there, and it was just hurting them.
Speaker 1 (04:45):
So I would say that our recent experience is over
the last two now we've only got one at home now,
but we had two. I would say that our experiences
with homeschooling continue to be overwhelmingly positive.
Speaker 10 (04:55):
Challenging, but positive.
Speaker 9 (04:57):
And what do you think.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
About the I mean, there are a couple of teachers
in the room, but there was certainly some pushback, mainly
from the hardway parents who are like, no, no, no, you
can only learn some things at school.
Speaker 10 (05:07):
So I don't believe that at all. But I also
don't believe that any parent can be everything to their child.
Speaker 9 (05:14):
Yeah, definitely, And so if.
Speaker 10 (05:17):
Homeschooling is your choice, then ensuring that your children are
supported with the right structures in place for them to
receive the necessary things of maths and English.
Speaker 9 (05:34):
Reading, writing, arithmetic, yep is imperative.
Speaker 1 (05:37):
So I know that I don't want to get bogged
too much into the life school parenting homeschool parenting situation,
because we're going to learn more about Josh and Cassie
as we go throughout the week. But I do just
want to highlight there was one question that was asked.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
How do your kids feel about not going to school? Like,
have they came and told you want to go to school?
How would you handle it?
Speaker 8 (05:55):
We check in with them really and we're like, do
you guys want to go to school?
Speaker 11 (05:58):
And they're like no.
Speaker 1 (06:00):
So, Carlie, I don't very often hear kids say Mum,
can I school? It's always the other I don't want
to go to school. And I wish Josh should pick
that up. I so badly wanted to say it in
the room, but obviously not my job to do that.
All right, let's fire up challenge number one. The first
challenge was to stand in front of the mirror mum
(06:20):
with kids and talk about their body image. That is,
how do kids see themselves?
Speaker 7 (06:26):
What do you like about your body? Lamits?
Speaker 3 (06:29):
I like my eyes in my head?
Speaker 7 (06:31):
What do you like about your body? My nurse you
knows why.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
Ellen.
Speaker 7 (06:37):
We live in a world where having fillers and botox
and plastic surgeries sorry the norm these days, and I
want our children to know that they don't have to
change the way they look to be beautiful.
Speaker 12 (06:48):
Are a few about your body image. I like my
hair and my teeth. I have bunions because I do ballet.
I have acne.
Speaker 4 (07:00):
Is kind of sad.
Speaker 6 (07:01):
I want to be colder.
Speaker 8 (07:03):
I honestly think you look pretty good for your age.
Speaker 11 (07:07):
Oh so I just rent note here about the boys.
They saw their abilities and what their bodies can do,
whereas girls see their physical features.
Speaker 3 (07:18):
I noticed that a bit.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
Yeah, Amanda, you talked there about girls and fellers and botox.
Speaker 7 (07:25):
I don't want them to feel pressure that they have
to fix up the way their face looks just because
you know other people are doing that.
Speaker 5 (07:34):
I get botox and I don't see a problem with it.
It's nothing that crazy, and I don't think there should
be like such a stigma around it. And by me
getting botox, I don't feel like it's teaching my daughters
that they need to get They don't know that I've
had it done.
Speaker 12 (07:52):
I've never done anything to my face or body, and
I don't dye my hair. I just believe that if
I want my children to believe that they are perfect
the way they are, which I believe they are, then
I need to reflect that in my behavior. If I
don't focus on my wrinkles, or my age or my weight,
then my kids won't either.
Speaker 10 (08:11):
I was actually really impressed as each of these kids
were able to stand in front of the mirror and
for the most part acknowledge that they loved their bodies.
Speaker 6 (08:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 9 (08:22):
Yeah, it wasn't that nice.
Speaker 10 (08:23):
It really was. The standout to me, though, was the acknowledgment.
For boys, they focused on what their bodies could do.
The girls, however, focused on their looks.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
Yeah, there was a bit of crossover, but that was
the main message that I got as well. Yeah, social
conditioning plays a really big part in this, and we
really do focus on boys and what they can do
it we focus on function, not.
Speaker 9 (08:47):
Form, whereas with girls we focus on form, not function.
Speaker 1 (08:51):
That's what society does. That's how we've been for decades, centuries.
Speaker 9 (08:56):
Probably well, even.
Speaker 10 (08:57):
The positivity daughter like she talked about having a six pack,
for instance, Right.
Speaker 8 (09:01):
Tell mummy what you like about your body?
Speaker 5 (09:04):
That I'm healthy, Yeah, beautiful, yeah, long hair, six pack,
six pack, So.
Speaker 10 (09:14):
That would be generally something you'd hear from a boy.
But she still didn't focus on what that six pack
allowed her to do. I can to push up very much,
focus on her physicality.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
So generally speaking, it was a good news story. Most
of the kids were reasonably happy with how they look.
You'll note that they were a fairly young cohort. As
a general rule, we're not looking at older kids teenagers
as a general rule.
Speaker 10 (09:37):
And I was about to say that, just the acknowledgment.
When you're dealing with kids under about ten, generally speaking,
you're going to have that happy news story.
Speaker 1 (09:45):
All right, here's the challenging conversation. I don't know if
I want to go here or not, but we're going
to do it anyway. The discussion devolved. It went on
a tangent here.
Speaker 12 (09:56):
Mothers that want to get botox, I think they possibly
need a psychologist. To say it's in the danger zones
or healthy zones or whatever.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
So botox fillers. There were some pretty strong opinions in
the room. We've got our hard way of parents who
was just saying no way, no way, Jose, and our
traditional parents who are also saying I've got to be
okay with who I am and how I am and
how I'm aging and what I look like as a
middle aged mum as opposed to trying to maintain the
fountain of youth. And then you've got other parents who
are like, yeah, I'm actually pretty cool with it.
Speaker 10 (10:25):
There was definitely some divide, with Mark and Tammy having
very different viewpoints on what they thought was appropriate.
Speaker 11 (10:34):
I've had botox before. I don't think it's bad to
role model botox and villas as a.
Speaker 7 (10:39):
Parent, is it?
Speaker 12 (10:39):
Do you? Yeah?
Speaker 9 (10:43):
Crickets from Mark on that one, I think.
Speaker 10 (10:46):
You might have been feeling a bit like you. This
is not a debate.
Speaker 9 (10:48):
I want to weigh in on how do I answer
this question.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
So I'm not actually going to come in hard with
an opinion on this, but I want to share a
little bit of evidence and a general I guess recognition
of a challenge here. Let me start with the evidence. Now,
this is not an area that I've researched, So I'm
just quoting a book now that's probably ten or fifteen
years old. I'm quoting Jonathan Hate, who everyone knows today
(11:14):
is the author of The Anxious Generation, but quite some
time ago he wrote his first book was called The
Happiness Hypothesis. In my mind, probably one of the best,
if not the best book about well being ever written.
Speaker 9 (11:26):
I love that book. And in that book he highlights this.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
Participating in plastic surgery having enhancements quote unquote to your
appearance is not associated with increases in well being. There
is a relationship between plastic surgery and low levels of wellbeing, depression, anxiety,
and other difficulties, with one exception, and that's breast augmentation.
(11:53):
So I mean, you can come up with some hypotheses
as to why that might be the case. I'm not
going to jump in with anything you might want to.
Speaker 10 (12:01):
I would say that for the masses of women who
go through this process, the majority of them are actually
enhancing something that they feel they lack.
Speaker 9 (12:12):
And that's what he says in the book.
Speaker 1 (12:14):
I'm just again, I'm not sure that I want to
go there, but he basically says it's a self esteem
boost for women who feel like they don't feel feminine
based on their current situation, and so it's a self
esteem booster and it is associated with positive well being outcomes,
But all the other plastic surgeries his research indicate it's
a downer.
Speaker 9 (12:32):
It brings well being down.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
The main point that I want to draw out here, though,
is that there is a tension, and I think that
it was exemplified in the conversation in the episode last night.
The tension is we want to look and mums specifically
want to look their best and be healthy and feel
good about themselves. And the tension exists where if you're
(12:57):
going to use external or surgical processes to do that,
is that not hypocritical? Like where's the tension between trying
to look your best and actually still accepting that you
look the way that you do, that you're aging, or
that your body's changing.
Speaker 10 (13:14):
I think for me, I'm not hardcore either way either.
But when I look at the damage that social media
specifically is doing, we think about all of the filters
that are in place for our teenage girls specifically so
that they feel comfortable in being able to post a
photo of themselves, and then they're watching mum who's forty,
(13:40):
and then she's fifty and she's getting older, but she's
not displaying the usual signs of age. Are we not
then emphasizing that, in order to be accepted as beautiful
and feminine and ideal, that we can't with grace. I've
(14:02):
thought about all the things many times, and we've actually
even had conversations around it. But ultimately it comes down
to the fact that I actually love my body. I
love what allows me to do, and I want my
children to recognize and know that while ever they focus
on their external to the extent that they're willing to
(14:24):
modify it in any way, shape or form. I think
we lose a part of ourselves. We literally give away
so much of who we are in an effort for what.
Speaker 9 (14:39):
It's a tricky one.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
There's certainly some tension in the room and this idea
of making sure that we can feel good about ourselves,
but where do we draw the line is a vexed one.
Another big topic that we've got to talk about just
body image. Generally, we're going to cover off what to
say to your kids about having a healthy body image
after the break. So, Kylie, this might be a little
(15:07):
bit ego driven, but I'm going to play audio of
me here because I think I said something really important
on the TV show that we need.
Speaker 9 (15:13):
To listen to.
Speaker 1 (15:14):
A World Health Organization study found that what predicted who
was going to have body image issues was not body size,
but gender. Plastic surgery gop one drugs. The people who
take advantage of them, more than eighty percent of them
are female. We have a different conversation around bodies for
(15:34):
men and boys compared to girls and women. Okay, so
this kind of extends on the discussion we had around
botox and goop one drugs and that kind of stuff
in the first part of the podcast. There is definitely
a challenge here when it comes to how we feel
about our bodies, and it is primarily a female issue,
not a male issue, although it's increasingly becoming male because
I think social media has amplified and exacerbated it. What
(15:56):
I'd like to do is we wrap up today's podcast
share five ideas that can help parents who are trying
to manage these conversations with their kids. And I know
that you've got stuff to say about these things because
we talk about them all the time in our home
and our family. My first way to reduce body image
(16:17):
challenges ties directly in with what you said a few
minutes ago, and that is we've got to reduce screens.
The more kids are involved with screens, the more they're
going to be exposed to stuff that just makes them
feel lousy. We shared it in the show last night,
some headlines from different articles and different research papers showing
the more time people spend online, particularly on social media,
(16:39):
the more time they spend looking at ideal bodies, the
worst they feel about their own bodies. Reducing time on
social media has got to be an element of this.
Speaker 10 (16:50):
A little bit of a side note, but I think
it fits in beautifully. I used to love taking photos,
right and once I started engaging.
Speaker 9 (16:58):
Jim in a view or just photos, no, just.
Speaker 10 (17:00):
Photos generally, and once I started engaging on social media,
I followed a handful of friends and family who were
actually photographers by trade, and all of their posts were
picture perfect, and it actually stopped me from wanting to
post and wanting to actually even take photos, because every
(17:25):
time I would take a photo, I would look at
it and I would look at it through the lens
of it doesn't look anything like that, or it doesn't
do this moment justice. And if I'm doing that just
purely on a photograph, think about our girls, specifically, who
are watching other people post these picture perfect moments in
(17:48):
time of themselves, which are probably all filtered up, and
then judging their appearance based on a fictitious model.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
So there's things that I need to pick up on here.
Number One, you said picture perfect. I called the chapter
in my book Misconnection. I called that pixel perfect. Yeah,
because that's what the goal is. And that ties in
directly with the second point that I want to make,
and that is that we need to forget about teaching
our kids about media literacy. What do I mean by that?
You can talk to your kids about filters. You can
(18:19):
talk to them about.
Speaker 10 (18:20):
Well, they know it, they're living atally what it looks like.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
They know exactly how it works, and it doesn't stop
them being aspiring.
Speaker 9 (18:28):
For that look.
Speaker 1 (18:30):
And so what our conversations need to be more about
is rather than being all about being pixel perfect and
the hair and the makeup and the lighting and the
filters and all those kinds of things, the conversations need
to be about the three final points that I want
to emphasize number one, Folcus on what you can do,
not how you look. Number two, avoid diets and other
things that are designed to be all about externalities, like
(18:53):
have good health habits, but don't go on some diet
so that you can lose x number of kilos in
such and such an amount of time that only amplifies
and exacerbates the focus on appearance. And number three with
parents have got to be models. We've got to be
good examples of how we approach our physical appearance and
(19:14):
our attitude towards it, which probably goes back to our
conversation in the first part of the podcast, what are
we modeling and what does that say about how we
feel about ourselves and how we look.
Speaker 10 (19:23):
Can we just take a minute to talk about Sophia's
experience in front of the mirror with her daughter, I
so bad.
Speaker 9 (19:28):
We want to do that. We need to do it tomorrow.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
We're out of time, and I think that it deserves,
it deserves a real conversation. It ties in so well
with all the things we're talking about right now. We'll
hit that tomorrow on the podcast, as well as a
conversation about the second challenge in last night's episode. We
really hope that you're enjoying our recaps of the Parental
Guidance Season three episodes tomorrow more on Body Image. Can't
(19:54):
wait to share it with you. Thanks to spending your
time with us, We really hope that you're getting a
lot out of it. If you are, can you sh
the podcast with your friends? A couple of buttons you
can click them and flick it through. I reckon if
it makes your family happier, it will make their families
happier as well.
Speaker 9 (20:08):
The Happy Families podcast is produced by Justin Rouland from
Bridge Media.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
Craig Bruce is our executive producer. Mim Hammonds provides research
and other support, more information and more resources to make
your family happier. You can find a Happy Families dot
com dot au
A really big episode about body image last night on
Parental Guidance. It was episode three of season three. If
you missed it, you can catch up on the nine
Now app. Really really compelling, really heavy, really important conversations.
We're going to unpack it all this week on the
Happy Families podcast. Hello, my name is doctor Justin Colson.
I'm here with my wife missus Happy Families, Kylie, Kylie,
(00:29):
we were introduced to four new focus families.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Let's run through our parenting styles, Elvy and Sean.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
We are authoritative parents.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
We have high expectations on our children. In the meantime,
we set strict rules and boundaries, say.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
Next month.
Speaker 4 (00:50):
As authoritative parents, we don't really give our children too
much choice. We want them to be academically successful, to
get into a good profession.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
So you're basically setting the goal high for them they
can work towards it.
Speaker 4 (01:08):
Yes, we set to rules, we have high expectations. However,
the most important thing in our view is their health
and happiness.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
Nick and Sophia where.
Speaker 5 (01:18):
The positivity parents. Where confidence is key highness. As positivity parents,
we build up our children's self esteem every single day
by doing positive affirmations.
Speaker 6 (01:33):
I can't hear.
Speaker 5 (01:33):
You got to tell her out I am stop before,
Yes you are, Yes you are.
Speaker 3 (01:39):
We've been blessed in the fact that Sophia is able
to work from home as a content creator and she's
incorporated our children within that sphere.
Speaker 6 (01:47):
One two high that.
Speaker 5 (01:51):
One.
Speaker 3 (01:53):
We do.
Speaker 5 (01:53):
Teach our children to have a healthy lifestyle, beautiful.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
They love being physical and Amanda and her son.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
We choose to parent the hard way. We don't take shortcuts.
It's hard on us. We're easy and fun for the
kids right as hardware parents. There's no easy way out.
We don't leave anyone behind. We all go do things together.
Speaker 7 (02:18):
Yes, but when it comes to food, we don't allow junk.
We try to make everything from scratch. We actually choose
to parent our children. We model good behavior. When it
comes to body image. You can put kids down really
quickly with your words. Where they feel that we're happy
(02:38):
and proud of them, they feel proud of themselves.
Speaker 8 (02:41):
Josh and Cassie, we are the life school parents and
we use real life experiences to educate our kids. As
a family of seven, we live in our truck and
caravan traveling around Australia.
Speaker 7 (02:58):
We'd be traveling for like three years. They haven't been
to school for four years.
Speaker 8 (03:02):
We just choose life schooling to a better way to learn.
Speaker 6 (03:04):
What we are doing is a variant of homeschooling, taking
it out of the classroom and into the real world.
Speaker 8 (03:12):
I think you got further than Spencer and are we
going against the norm?
Speaker 9 (03:16):
Are one hundred percent? We're going against that?
Speaker 8 (03:18):
Kids are healthy? Anyone could see that, well done, Jasper.
Speaker 1 (03:23):
So before we talk about the big topic of body image,
we do need to talk briefly about the introductions to
these families, Josh and Cassie, our life school parents.
Speaker 9 (03:33):
They caused a bit of a ruckus in the room.
Speaker 8 (03:35):
Tests and school curriculums and.
Speaker 6 (03:36):
Not no, they're not important s outdated.
Speaker 7 (03:40):
But there is certain things they'll learn in the classroom
from someone that's been to university and done the curriculum
that you can't possibly teach them.
Speaker 6 (03:48):
We'll just push back a little bit on that, because
what can the educational system teach that we don't have
the tools to teach our children. You know, with technology
like YouTube and things, I have tools and resources I
can lean on. So I am fully confident that if
their pursuit and their desire was to become a doctor.
They're going to go pursue that.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
Kylie, Josh and Cassie are doing a they call it
a form of homeschooling. They call it life schooling. We're
homeschooling a couple of our kids, or we have at least,
and we're still homeschooling one of them at the moment.
What did you think about that conversation and this idea
that school is not for every child.
Speaker 10 (04:24):
I agree with that. I think for so long we
fought to keep our kids in school based on this
idea and notion that it's a societal expectation that our
kids will be there, and it was just hurting them.
Speaker 1 (04:45):
So I would say that our recent experience is over
the last two now we've only got one at home now,
but we had two. I would say that our experiences
with homeschooling continue to be overwhelmingly positive.
Speaker 10 (04:55):
Challenging, but positive.
Speaker 9 (04:57):
And what do you think.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
About the I mean, there are a couple of teachers
in the room, but there was certainly some pushback, mainly
from the hardway parents who are like, no, no, no, you
can only learn some things at school.
Speaker 10 (05:07):
So I don't believe that at all. But I also
don't believe that any parent can be everything to their child.
Speaker 9 (05:14):
Yeah, definitely, And so if.
Speaker 10 (05:17):
Homeschooling is your choice, then ensuring that your children are
supported with the right structures in place for them to
receive the necessary things of maths and English.
Speaker 9 (05:34):
Reading, writing, arithmetic, yep is imperative.
Speaker 1 (05:37):
So I know that I don't want to get bogged
too much into the life school parenting homeschool parenting situation,
because we're going to learn more about Josh and Cassie
as we go throughout the week. But I do just
want to highlight there was one question that was asked.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
How do your kids feel about not going to school? Like,
have they came and told you want to go to school?
How would you handle it?
Speaker 8 (05:55):
We check in with them really and we're like, do
you guys want to go to school?
Speaker 11 (05:58):
And they're like no.
Speaker 1 (06:00):
So, Carlie, I don't very often hear kids say Mum,
can I school? It's always the other I don't want
to go to school. And I wish Josh should pick
that up. I so badly wanted to say it in
the room, but obviously not my job to do that.
All right, let's fire up challenge number one. The first
challenge was to stand in front of the mirror mum
(06:20):
with kids and talk about their body image. That is,
how do kids see themselves?
Speaker 7 (06:26):
What do you like about your body? Lamits?
Speaker 3 (06:29):
I like my eyes in my head?
Speaker 7 (06:31):
What do you like about your body? My nurse you
knows why.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
Ellen.
Speaker 7 (06:37):
We live in a world where having fillers and botox
and plastic surgeries sorry the norm these days, and I
want our children to know that they don't have to
change the way they look to be beautiful.
Speaker 12 (06:48):
Are a few about your body image. I like my
hair and my teeth. I have bunions because I do ballet.
I have acne.
Speaker 4 (07:00):
Is kind of sad.
Speaker 6 (07:01):
I want to be colder.
Speaker 8 (07:03):
I honestly think you look pretty good for your age.
Speaker 11 (07:07):
Oh so I just rent note here about the boys.
They saw their abilities and what their bodies can do,
whereas girls see their physical features.
Speaker 3 (07:18):
I noticed that a bit.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
Yeah, Amanda, you talked there about girls and fellers and botox.
Speaker 7 (07:25):
I don't want them to feel pressure that they have
to fix up the way their face looks just because
you know other people are doing that.
Speaker 5 (07:34):
I get botox and I don't see a problem with it.
It's nothing that crazy, and I don't think there should
be like such a stigma around it. And by me
getting botox, I don't feel like it's teaching my daughters
that they need to get They don't know that I've
had it done.
Speaker 12 (07:52):
I've never done anything to my face or body, and
I don't dye my hair. I just believe that if
I want my children to believe that they are perfect
the way they are, which I believe they are, then
I need to reflect that in my behavior. If I
don't focus on my wrinkles, or my age or my weight,
then my kids won't either.
Speaker 10 (08:11):
I was actually really impressed as each of these kids
were able to stand in front of the mirror and
for the most part acknowledge that they loved their bodies.
Speaker 6 (08:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 9 (08:22):
Yeah, it wasn't that nice.
Speaker 10 (08:23):
It really was. The standout to me, though, was the acknowledgment.
For boys, they focused on what their bodies could do.
The girls, however, focused on their looks.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
Yeah, there was a bit of crossover, but that was
the main message that I got as well. Yeah, social
conditioning plays a really big part in this, and we
really do focus on boys and what they can do
it we focus on function, not.
Speaker 9 (08:47):
Form, whereas with girls we focus on form, not function.
Speaker 1 (08:51):
That's what society does. That's how we've been for decades, centuries.
Speaker 9 (08:56):
Probably well, even.
Speaker 10 (08:57):
The positivity daughter like she talked about having a six pack,
for instance, Right.
Speaker 8 (09:01):
Tell mummy what you like about your body?
Speaker 5 (09:04):
That I'm healthy, Yeah, beautiful, yeah, long hair, six pack,
six pack, So.
Speaker 10 (09:14):
That would be generally something you'd hear from a boy.
But she still didn't focus on what that six pack
allowed her to do. I can to push up very much,
focus on her physicality.
Speaker 1 (09:25):
So generally speaking, it was a good news story. Most
of the kids were reasonably happy with how they look.
You'll note that they were a fairly young cohort. As
a general rule, we're not looking at older kids teenagers
as a general rule.
Speaker 10 (09:37):
And I was about to say that, just the acknowledgment.
When you're dealing with kids under about ten, generally speaking,
you're going to have that happy news story.
Speaker 1 (09:45):
All right, here's the challenging conversation. I don't know if
I want to go here or not, but we're going
to do it anyway. The discussion devolved. It went on
a tangent here.
Speaker 12 (09:56):
Mothers that want to get botox, I think they possibly
need a psychologist. To say it's in the danger zones
or healthy zones or whatever.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
So botox fillers. There were some pretty strong opinions in
the room. We've got our hard way of parents who
was just saying no way, no way, Jose, and our
traditional parents who are also saying I've got to be
okay with who I am and how I am and
how I'm aging and what I look like as a
middle aged mum as opposed to trying to maintain the
fountain of youth. And then you've got other parents who
are like, yeah, I'm actually pretty cool with it.
Speaker 10 (10:25):
There was definitely some divide, with Mark and Tammy having
very different viewpoints on what they thought was appropriate.
Speaker 11 (10:34):
I've had botox before. I don't think it's bad to
role model botox and villas as a.
Speaker 7 (10:39):
Parent, is it?
Speaker 12 (10:39):
Do you? Yeah?
Speaker 9 (10:43):
Crickets from Mark on that one, I think.
Speaker 10 (10:46):
You might have been feeling a bit like you. This
is not a debate.
Speaker 9 (10:48):
I want to weigh in on how do I answer
this question.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
So I'm not actually going to come in hard with
an opinion on this, but I want to share a
little bit of evidence and a general I guess recognition
of a challenge here. Let me start with the evidence. Now,
this is not an area that I've researched, So I'm
just quoting a book now that's probably ten or fifteen
years old. I'm quoting Jonathan Hate, who everyone knows today
(11:14):
is the author of The Anxious Generation, but quite some
time ago he wrote his first book was called The
Happiness Hypothesis. In my mind, probably one of the best,
if not the best book about well being ever written.
Speaker 9 (11:26):
I love that book. And in that book he highlights this.
Speaker 1 (11:30):
Participating in plastic surgery having enhancements quote unquote to your
appearance is not associated with increases in well being. There
is a relationship between plastic surgery and low levels of wellbeing, depression, anxiety,
and other difficulties, with one exception, and that's breast augmentation.
(11:53):
So I mean, you can come up with some hypotheses
as to why that might be the case. I'm not
going to jump in with anything you might want to.
Speaker 10 (12:01):
I would say that for the masses of women who
go through this process, the majority of them are actually
enhancing something that they feel they lack.
Speaker 9 (12:12):
And that's what he says in the book.
Speaker 1 (12:14):
I'm just again, I'm not sure that I want to
go there, but he basically says it's a self esteem
boost for women who feel like they don't feel feminine
based on their current situation, and so it's a self
esteem booster and it is associated with positive well being outcomes,
But all the other plastic surgeries his research indicate it's
a downer.
Speaker 9 (12:32):
It brings well being down.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
The main point that I want to draw out here, though,
is that there is a tension, and I think that
it was exemplified in the conversation in the episode last night.
The tension is we want to look and mums specifically
want to look their best and be healthy and feel
good about themselves. And the tension exists where if you're
(12:57):
going to use external or surgical processes to do that,
is that not hypocritical? Like where's the tension between trying
to look your best and actually still accepting that you
look the way that you do, that you're aging, or
that your body's changing.
Speaker 10 (13:14):
I think for me, I'm not hardcore either way either.
But when I look at the damage that social media
specifically is doing, we think about all of the filters
that are in place for our teenage girls specifically so
that they feel comfortable in being able to post a
photo of themselves, and then they're watching mum who's forty,
(13:40):
and then she's fifty and she's getting older, but she's
not displaying the usual signs of age. Are we not
then emphasizing that, in order to be accepted as beautiful
and feminine and ideal, that we can't with grace. I've
(14:02):
thought about all the things many times, and we've actually
even had conversations around it. But ultimately it comes down
to the fact that I actually love my body. I
love what allows me to do, and I want my
children to recognize and know that while ever they focus
on their external to the extent that they're willing to
(14:24):
modify it in any way, shape or form. I think
we lose a part of ourselves. We literally give away
so much of who we are in an effort for what.
Speaker 9 (14:39):
It's a tricky one.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
There's certainly some tension in the room and this idea
of making sure that we can feel good about ourselves,
but where do we draw the line is a vexed one.
Another big topic that we've got to talk about just
body image. Generally, we're going to cover off what to
say to your kids about having a healthy body image
after the break. So, Kylie, this might be a little
(15:07):
bit ego driven, but I'm going to play audio of
me here because I think I said something really important
on the TV show that we need.
Speaker 9 (15:13):
To listen to.
Speaker 1 (15:14):
A World Health Organization study found that what predicted who
was going to have body image issues was not body size,
but gender. Plastic surgery gop one drugs. The people who
take advantage of them, more than eighty percent of them
are female. We have a different conversation around bodies for
(15:34):
men and boys compared to girls and women. Okay, so
this kind of extends on the discussion we had around
botox and goop one drugs and that kind of stuff
in the first part of the podcast. There is definitely
a challenge here when it comes to how we feel
about our bodies, and it is primarily a female issue,
not a male issue, although it's increasingly becoming male because
I think social media has amplified and exacerbated it. What
(15:56):
I'd like to do is we wrap up today's podcast
share five ideas that can help parents who are trying
to manage these conversations with their kids. And I know
that you've got stuff to say about these things because
we talk about them all the time in our home
and our family. My first way to reduce body image
(16:17):
challenges ties directly in with what you said a few
minutes ago, and that is we've got to reduce screens.
The more kids are involved with screens, the more they're
going to be exposed to stuff that just makes them
feel lousy. We shared it in the show last night,
some headlines from different articles and different research papers showing
the more time people spend online, particularly on social media,
(16:39):
the more time they spend looking at ideal bodies, the
worst they feel about their own bodies. Reducing time on
social media has got to be an element of this.
Speaker 10 (16:50):
A little bit of a side note, but I think
it fits in beautifully. I used to love taking photos,
right and once I started engaging.
Speaker 9 (16:58):
Jim in a view or just photos, no, just.
Speaker 10 (17:00):
Photos generally, and once I started engaging on social media,
I followed a handful of friends and family who were
actually photographers by trade, and all of their posts were
picture perfect, and it actually stopped me from wanting to
post and wanting to actually even take photos, because every
(17:25):
time I would take a photo, I would look at
it and I would look at it through the lens
of it doesn't look anything like that, or it doesn't
do this moment justice. And if I'm doing that just
purely on a photograph, think about our girls, specifically, who
are watching other people post these picture perfect moments in
(17:48):
time of themselves, which are probably all filtered up, and
then judging their appearance based on a fictitious model.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
So there's things that I need to pick up on here.
Number One, you said picture perfect. I called the chapter
in my book Misconnection. I called that pixel perfect. Yeah,
because that's what the goal is. And that ties in
directly with the second point that I want to make,
and that is that we need to forget about teaching
our kids about media literacy. What do I mean by that?
You can talk to your kids about filters. You can
(18:19):
talk to them about.
Speaker 10 (18:20):
Well, they know it, they're living atally what it looks like.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
They know exactly how it works, and it doesn't stop
them being aspiring.
Speaker 9 (18:28):
For that look.
Speaker 1 (18:30):
And so what our conversations need to be more about
is rather than being all about being pixel perfect and
the hair and the makeup and the lighting and the
filters and all those kinds of things, the conversations need
to be about the three final points that I want
to emphasize number one, Folcus on what you can do,
not how you look. Number two, avoid diets and other
things that are designed to be all about externalities, like
(18:53):
have good health habits, but don't go on some diet
so that you can lose x number of kilos in
such and such an amount of time that only amplifies
and exacerbates the focus on appearance. And number three with
parents have got to be models. We've got to be
good examples of how we approach our physical appearance and
(19:14):
our attitude towards it, which probably goes back to our
conversation in the first part of the podcast, what are
we modeling and what does that say about how we
feel about ourselves and how we look.
Speaker 10 (19:23):
Can we just take a minute to talk about Sophia's
experience in front of the mirror with her daughter, I
so bad.
Speaker 9 (19:28):
We want to do that. We need to do it tomorrow.
Speaker 1 (19:30):
We're out of time, and I think that it deserves,
it deserves a real conversation. It ties in so well
with all the things we're talking about right now. We'll
hit that tomorrow on the podcast, as well as a
conversation about the second challenge in last night's episode. We
really hope that you're enjoying our recaps of the Parental
Guidance Season three episodes tomorrow more on Body Image. Can't
(19:54):
wait to share it with you. Thanks to spending your
time with us, We really hope that you're getting a
lot out of it. If you are, can you sh
the podcast with your friends? A couple of buttons you
can click them and flick it through. I reckon if
it makes your family happier, it will make their families
happier as well.
Speaker 9 (20:08):
The Happy Families podcast is produced by Justin Rouland from
Bridge Media.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
Craig Bruce is our executive producer. Mim Hammonds provides research
and other support, more information and more resources to make
your family happier. You can find a Happy Families dot
com dot au
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