July 8, 2024 • 17 mins
It's a question parents ask time and time again: What is the right age for my kids to do [insert risk]?
Justin and Kylie look at a number of hot topics and discuss the appropriate/legal age for children to be allowed to do each of these.
- Staying at home alone
- The laws in QLD
- Putting in place contingency plans
- Mobile phones, school devices, burner phones
- Kids need smart parents, not smart phones
- Smart parents give their kids dumb phones (Unplug Childhood)
- Boyfriends & girlfriends
- #816 Tween Relationships: How Young is Too Young?
- Sleepovers
- Walking to school or the shops alone
- Ear piercing
(R) This episode originally aired 28/8/23.
.
Related links:
- Everyone Else Can Do It! Why Can’t I?
- Movies and Kids: When Is It Okay For Them To Watch That?
- Should our Young Children have Boyfriends or Girlfriends at School?
- When is it OK to Leave your Child Home Alone?
- Are Sleepovers OK?
.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
It's the Happy Families podcast. It's the podcast for the
time poor parent who just once answers.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Now, kids in primary school, they don't need a smartphone.
Don't give it to them. Just don't. And if you have,
you can actually take it back. It's okay. They'll have
a big dummy spit, they'll be so cranky, tolways out
of the kind of dummy spit, but you can take
it off them.
Speaker 1 (00:22):
And now here's the stars of our show, my mum
and dad.
Speaker 3 (00:26):
So I'm taking over the podcast today. I can tell
because recently I saw you on the Today Show and
you were talking about a topic that's pretty hot for
a lot of parents, and I thought that I'm going
to try.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
And do what they did. I love that you're taking over.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
So most parents want to know what the right age
is for their kids to do certain things. So I thought,
we're going to talk about it today. Okay, what's the
right age to leave our kids at home? I'llone yep,
to receive a mobile phone, huh. To have a sleepover yep,
or go to a sleepover probably is more important. Boyfriend
(00:59):
girlfriends status? How young is too young?
Speaker 2 (01:02):
Yep?
Speaker 3 (01:03):
And then there's notion of going to school on their
own and then lucky last, when are they old enough
to go to the shops on their own or maybe
even walk or ride their bike to school.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
So I don't know how we're going to do all
of this in one podcast. We're going to have to
be tight and I can't help but think that you're
going to have some strong opinions about some of the
things that I've got to say. Okay, because we go
we haven't always agreed on these things. Where do you
want to start? Which one?
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Well, let's staying at home.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
Staying at home? Okay, there's plenty of.
Speaker 3 (01:29):
Parents who both work full time. What happens when your
kid's sick and they're not sick enough that they need
a nurse to nurse them the whole way through the day,
but they're not well enough to be at school?
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Sure, or you just want to run down to the
chops and grab something. So there's actually legislation around this
in Queensland. If you leave a child who's under the
age of twelve years of age for an unreasonable amount
of time without supervision and care, you have a television
supervision No it's not. You have committed a criminal offense.
But legislation only in Queensland. Yeah, only in Queensland where
(02:03):
we've got that age stipulated underswell, but it's pretty loosey goosey.
I mean, how much time is unreasonable?
Speaker 3 (02:09):
Is it ten minutes?
Speaker 2 (02:10):
Yeah? It all depends on the circumstances. If you're dropping
in next door to borrow a cup of sugar from
the neighbor, then you're probably aren't going to be five minutes.
But even if you get caught up in one of
those wonderful nahborly conversations, you say it's going to be five,
it is. There for twenty minutes. You're within a screams
distance of the house, you'll hear if anything went wrong,
and you can usually get home. So if you've left
(02:32):
your four year old in the bath, if you're.
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Just at the neighbor's house, if you really left the kids.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
Alone, well, if you've left you four year old on
the bath, then absolutely have like that would be completely inappropriate.
So that's in Queensland. Else for in Australia, the legislation
is even more loose, and what it basically says is
that you're legally obliged to make sure that your child
is safe and that their needs are met, and you
can be charged if your child is left in a
dangerous situation or not fed or clothed or provided with accommodation.
(02:58):
But I think you'll probably agree with me on this,
and that is that if you're going to leave you
kids alone, you need to consider a whole lot of things.
Number one, how old is my child? And how long
am I going to be gone? And how far am
I going? And how safe is my neighborhood and what
time of day is it? And what's my child doing
while I'm gone?
Speaker 3 (03:15):
And what's the contingency plan if something went wrong?
Speaker 2 (03:18):
And this is actually my big one, and it's the
one that most parents don't think about. Let's say you
leaving two or three of the kids at home. You've
got a thirteen year old and a seven year old
and a four year old and they have a fight.
What happens when they have this big blow up and
somebody ends up getting hurt if there's no adult there
to supervise. That's really ugly, and kids do fight, or
what happens if they're not doing anything wrong at all,
(03:41):
but they decide that they're going to have a swim
Because you're only going to be ten minutes, but you
did get caught up, and you get home and they're
in the swimming pool, and let's hope that nothing goes wrong. Well,
what happens if they're just chopping up an orange or
an apple and they slice through their hand, or they
are goofing off and having fun with sheets and cushions
and pillows building a cubby house and one of them
accidentally falls down the stairwell and bangs their head and
(04:01):
ends up unconscious. I know that sounds terrifying, and it
might sound like it's completely overdone, as if but if
we haven't taught the kids what to do in case
something happens on parental guidance, someone bangs on the door
and says, hi, I'm here with a parcel. Do the
kids know what to do about making noise responding to
somebody at the front door. These are the kinds of
things that I think matter much more than some of
(04:22):
the other things. And of course, never leave your kids
in the bath, or never leave the stove on and
the kids at home alone, those kinds of things matter
as well.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
It was quite cute that the other day our thirteen
year old was at home and she heard the doorbell
ring right and went out and realized that it was
the mailman. Well, it was actually a delivery guy and
he was dropping off some of your books. And she
came back into the house. I must have been in
the bathroom, I think she came back out and she said, Mum,
(04:50):
it's okay, she said, I double checked. It was just
the delivery guy bringing dad's books, so I let him in.
If we hadn't watched parental guidance, it wouldn't have even
been a commonversation. But she'd done the observation. She checked
to make sure everything was safe and knew what was
what she was comfortable dealing with before she let him in.
And I just thought it's great because it's education, right.
(05:12):
It's helping her to recognize what are the parameters I'm
capable of working in before I need to involve somebody else.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
Okay, what's the second one?
Speaker 3 (05:20):
So how old should our kids be before we give
them a mobile phone?
Speaker 2 (05:24):
I hate this question.
Speaker 3 (05:25):
I knew you again.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
It's the question that I get all the time. All Right,
here's how I'm going to approach this. There are so
many options out there for kids to have the ability
to contact us if they need us without them having
a phone. So what we do is we say, all
the other kids have got one, and if my child
needs me, then they need a phone. So I'm just
going to go on and get them a phone, and
we tend to give them like a hand me down
iPhone or some other kind of smart device. Don't do it.
(05:50):
For as long as you can delay, delay, delay, delay,
Even if a kid is the most unpopular kid at school,
I'm going to say, don't do it. All the research
evidence that I've looked at shows that the younger they
are when they get a smart device, rate of the
risk that they are that they're out of experiencing mental
health challenges and all of the associated risks, explicit content,
the bullying, the fights over putting the phone away, going
(06:12):
to bed on time, being sneaky, just it's such a
headache once you let that genie out of the bottle,
once the horse has bolted. I can mix metaphors if
you want, But so I said this all the time.
Kids need smartphones, not smart parents. Sorry, let me say
that again. Kids need smart parents, not smart phones. I
can't believe that I got around the wrong way. Smart
(06:32):
parents give their kids dumb phones. I'm a big fan
of the Space Talk watch for kids in primary school.
They don't need a smartphone. Don't give it to them,
just don't. And if you have, you can actually take
it back. It's okay. They'll have a big dummy spit,
they'll be so cranky, toys out of the cot kind
of dummy spit, but you can take it off them.
The other thing that I would say is that once
they have one, you've really got to be clear on
(06:53):
the parameters. So our general guidance and advice has always been,
and what we've tried to do in our home with
reasonable success, is you don't get a smartphone till you
can pay for it yourself so you can go out
and buy it. We have loosened up a little bit
with our younger children, and I'm regretting it and trying
to find ways that we can work our way around it.
The great challenge, of course, is kids come home from
(07:14):
school with devices now as well. The school supplies the
computer or the iPad or the laptop or whatever is
going on, so there's a lay of complication around that.
But I still think minimizing their access to screens is
fantastic delayed as much as you can. When they can
pay for it, they can have one.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
I think for a lot of parents, giving their child
a mobile phone is actually a convenience for them. Yeah,
it's so much better to be able to contact your
child when you want them in the moment.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
But that's why I'm saying the space talk watch will
do the job.
Speaker 3 (07:40):
Then having to wait our thirteen year old, she doesn't
actually have a mobile phone, and I needed her to
go and get some groceries from the shop. Our shop's
only eight hundred meters down the road. She gets on
her little bike and she rides down.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
And she loves the independence of doing it, like she
really looks forward to it.
Speaker 3 (07:57):
But she'd only just left when I remembered I hadn't
put an extra thing on the way through this.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
Did you let her come home? And then you set
her back? I had to because I couldn't call her.
So she walked in the.
Speaker 3 (08:11):
Door and I said, I'm so grateful that you did that.
Guess what And she looked at me and she said,
you forgot something else, didn't you. And I'm like, yep,
And I can't cook dinner until you get it.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
See, I don't think that's a bad thing. I actually
don't think that's a bad thing, she said.
Speaker 3 (08:23):
For a moment, it was like, damn it. If she
had a mobile phone, i'd be you know, I could
have got her and she could have done it all
in one go. But she loves, like you said, loves
the independence. And at the end of the day, it
just meant dinner was an extra half an hour late.
It didn't make any difference. So I'm really grateful that,
in spite of the challenge from time to time that
(08:43):
we're trying really hard to kind of just hold her
back as long as we can.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
If only she didn't have a school computer. Okay, we're
running out of time. We've got a handful more that
you wanted to come out.
Speaker 3 (08:54):
Okay, Well, I want to know how young is too
young for a boyfriend girlfriend relationship?
Speaker 2 (08:58):
So we talked about this recent on the Happy Families podcast.
It was Tuesday, the first of August. It was episode
eight one six twin Relationships. How young is Too Young?
We went into a lot of detail on this one,
but it is one of those things that comes up
all the time. The first thing I'm going to say
is it's a pet peeve of mine. I know that
other people won't feel as strongly about this as I do,
but I don't think that it's in anybody's best interest
(09:20):
for us to be making doing the match making, pairing
kids up and being all romantic about it when they're
four and five and six. I just don't think that
that's in anyone's best interest. Just let the kids be kids.
They will start to show an interest though, or around
about grade three, grade four, grade five, and our job
then is to talk to them about what a healthy
relationship is and find out what they mean when they're
talking about boyfriend and girlfriend. I really, really, really don't
(09:43):
think that we should be encouraging those little romances at all,
and I would be doing everything that I could to
minimize that even when they get older, though. I mean,
we've actually said to our children, I'm opening up the
hidden cupboard here and letting you right under the hood.
Sorry mixed metaphor there, but you know what I mean.
We've actually said to our kids, don't have a boyfriend,
(10:04):
don't have a romantic interest until you finished high school.
And that's been really hard for them to get their
head around, and they've not liked what we've said. But
our thinking is there is going to be interest, but
don't get too serious. What happens is if there is
any harm done, you have to go to school every
single day and see that person. And in relationships with teenagers,
(10:26):
especially in our pornified culture today, there are many many men,
and with the expectation that things are going to escalate physically,
there will be harm done in many, many, many relationships,
and then you've got to somehow process that and show
up the next day at school and the next week
and the next month and function and concentrate and learn.
And it's not just that, it's also the reputational harm,
(10:47):
especially if there's any image based abuse or sharing that's
been going on. Everybody knows, everybody's seen, and just the.
Speaker 3 (10:54):
Social challenges that are associated with it. You know, when
you yeah, friendship groups, things break up all of a sudden, Oh,
I can't hang out with that group anymore. Or your
friends feel torn because they want to hang out with them,
but they want to be loyal to you, and.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
Yeah, I went pretty extreme. You've just talked about the
basic stuff it interfares, and for the younger years, that's
going to be the bigger issue. Right grade seven, grade eight,
grade nine. Then you get into the more senior years
and you encounter those big challenges. I would I think
a frank conversation with the kids about this stuff will
go a long way and discourage the relationships until they're
old enough to process them and manage them and navigate
(11:29):
them healthily. What about sleepovers, Oh gosh, most controversial topic
that we can talk about, and I don't think we've
got the time to do it properly. If I was
to put an age on it, I would say the
older the better, and I wouldn't encourage it. Be low
about the age of ten. No matter how well you
think you know, you just never do. You and I
both have heard so many stories from devastated parents whose
(11:52):
children have been harmed one way or another at a sleepover.
Sometimes it's just bullying and stupidity because kids don't know
how to handle themselves once they're tired and it's eleven
o'clock at nine or two o'clock in the morning. But
other times it's genuinely horrible harm. Okay, So if the
kids are going to have a sleep over, here's what
I would say. Know who's in the house. Know who's
(12:13):
in the house, because if they've got visitors, if they've
got an uncle who's staying, or a mate who's just
come into town and just staying for a couple of nights.
You just need to know who's there, and you want
to know the people absolutely, unquestionably, And I know that
I'm picking on men here, but unfortunately the research is
abundantly clear that men are the most likely ones to
(12:34):
hurt our kids. So is there a big brother and
how big and is that kid going to have any
access to where your kids are hanging out and doing
their thing?
Speaker 3 (12:43):
And maybe it's not physical harm.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
Maybe it's exposure to something explicit on the internet, conversations
that they're not supposed to be having, there's all those
kinds of things. You need to know the family well.
But I'm going to say this controversially and provocatively, don't
trust your guart because that's what pedophies rely on. They
build relationships to make you trust them. You think, oh,
they're fine. Don't actually trust your guard I think that
(13:07):
you've got to ask some hard questions when you drop
the kids off, like especially the first time. Like once
you've developed a relationship, maybe you can ease off on this,
but you need to ask what supervision is there going
to be? Are there any visitors, are there any odder siblings?
Is alcohol going to be available? Now? Obviously with young kids,
that's not going to be an issue for the kids,
but are any of the parents going to be drinking?
(13:29):
Because you need to know that there's at least one
sober parent. If the kids are all having a whole
lot of fun and the parents think that they're going
to have a few as well, if the child gets injured,
who's going to take them to the hospital? Like what
can we do to make sure that the kids are safe?
That's my whole thing. And the last thing I'll say
on this is you've got to teach your child what
to do if a situation feels lousy, if they're feeling
threat and if they're feeling uncomfortable, if they're feeling unsure,
(13:51):
can they leave the room when the computer screen comes out?
Do they know how to say no, that's not cool
when somebody's being picked on or if there's any sense
of threat, do they know how to go to the
bathroom and send you a quick text message even if
they're using a space talk watch, Like, do they know
how to do that? And then you've got to make
sure that you're available to respond.
Speaker 3 (14:09):
There's only been a handful of times where our kids
have actually reached out to us while they've been with
other people and have felt like they needed to come home.
They didn't feel comfortable, not necessarily unsafe, just not comfortable
with what was going on. But they also didn't want
to be seen to be ringing mummy to come and
pick them up. And so we have always acknowledged to
them that we're happy to be the bad guy. And
(14:31):
so in those instances, the kids have literally just sent
us an emoji that has helped us to recognize that
we need to call them and ask them to come home.
And so we've made a phone call and said, look,
it's really late and I need some help. First thing
in the morning, can you you know, I know you
were hoping to spend time with your friends, but can
you come home? And they've been like, yes, that's fine,
(14:53):
and then say to their friends, Oh, this is so bad.
I can't believe my parents are doing this, but I
have to go home.
Speaker 2 (14:57):
Yeah, blame the parents.
Speaker 3 (14:58):
And so we've been really happy to play that role
for them to enable them to save face with their friends.
But also help them to feel comfortable knowing that they
can come to us. Just is so important? Yeah, yeah,
it's so important.
Speaker 2 (15:14):
Now we're almost at we are out of time? Are
there anymore? Have we covered it all off?
Speaker 3 (15:17):
When do you let your kids walk to school or
go to the shops.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
As early as possible? As early as possible, As early
as possible, But but you do need to take the
circumstances into account, like how many big roads are there,
how far is the distance, what time of the day
is it. Have they done it before? Can they go
with an older sibling or a friend. You want to
make sure that you're keeping them safe. But I just
think as early as possible. I like the idea of
(15:40):
them being able to do it with a friend or
with a sibling from about the age of nine, eight
or nine, depending again on how far it is and
what time of day it is and all those questions.
And I like the idea of them being able to
do it on their own from about eleven or twelve.
I just think we ask so much of our children
emotionally in an unfair way, little of them physically that
(16:01):
they're capable of. And that's what I would love to
see do you want to push back? Are you mad
at me for saying that? Have I gone too young? No?
Speaker 3 (16:07):
I think we need to know our kids. And like
you said, there's so many variables around it. But if
you feel like you're in a safe environment, you've got
a great neighborhood, and your kids are going to listen
to each other, that's the big thing.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
They go for it. Yeah, yeah, okay, I've got one.
We don't have time for it, but I've got one
for you. But you did not know is coming. How
old do the kids need to before they can get
their ears pierced?
Speaker 3 (16:31):
I'll see in my I'm going to say in my house.
In our house, the rule has always been that I
would wait until they asked. Yeah, so it's been different
for each of them. Okay, number one she decided it's
seven she wanted to, and our last one she was
like really really excited about doing it at about seven,
(16:53):
and then I told her it was going to hurt,
and I just explained to her what it would be like.
She said, yeah, actually, no, I don't feel like doing that.
So she waited until she was nine. So for me,
it really I don't care what age. I don't have
a problem with it at all, but I'm not going
to inflict paying on my child unnecessarily. They will make
the decision, and they will understand and know how it's
(17:13):
going to go, what it's going to feel like, and
then they can make their own mind up.
Speaker 2 (17:16):
The Happy Family's podcast is produced by Justin Rowlin from
Bridge Media. Craig Bruce is our executive producer. Hey, we
really hope that we've given you some food for thought.
If you agree with this, that's great. If you don't,
we want to hear from you. Podcasts at Happy families
dot com dot you A quick reminder as well. The
Smells Like Teen Spirit Summit tickets are on sale now.
The early bird special doesn't last for long, so make
(17:37):
sure you get in incredible lineup. It's going to be phenomenal.
All the details at doctor Justin Coulson's Happy Families on
Facebook and Instagram, or at Happy Families dot com dot
a u
It's the Happy Families podcast. It's the podcast for the
time poor parent who just once answers.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Now, kids in primary school, they don't need a smartphone.
Don't give it to them. Just don't. And if you have,
you can actually take it back. It's okay. They'll have
a big dummy spit, they'll be so cranky, tolways out
of the kind of dummy spit, but you can take
it off them.
Speaker 1 (00:22):
And now here's the stars of our show, my mum
and dad.
Speaker 3 (00:26):
So I'm taking over the podcast today. I can tell
because recently I saw you on the Today Show and
you were talking about a topic that's pretty hot for
a lot of parents, and I thought that I'm going
to try.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
And do what they did. I love that you're taking over.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
So most parents want to know what the right age
is for their kids to do certain things. So I thought,
we're going to talk about it today. Okay, what's the
right age to leave our kids at home? I'llone yep,
to receive a mobile phone, huh. To have a sleepover yep,
or go to a sleepover probably is more important. Boyfriend
(00:59):
girlfriends status? How young is too young?
Speaker 2 (01:02):
Yep?
Speaker 3 (01:03):
And then there's notion of going to school on their
own and then lucky last, when are they old enough
to go to the shops on their own or maybe
even walk or ride their bike to school.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
So I don't know how we're going to do all
of this in one podcast. We're going to have to
be tight and I can't help but think that you're
going to have some strong opinions about some of the
things that I've got to say. Okay, because we go
we haven't always agreed on these things. Where do you
want to start? Which one?
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Well, let's staying at home.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
Staying at home? Okay, there's plenty of.
Speaker 3 (01:29):
Parents who both work full time. What happens when your
kid's sick and they're not sick enough that they need
a nurse to nurse them the whole way through the day,
but they're not well enough to be at school?
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Sure, or you just want to run down to the
chops and grab something. So there's actually legislation around this
in Queensland. If you leave a child who's under the
age of twelve years of age for an unreasonable amount
of time without supervision and care, you have a television
supervision No it's not. You have committed a criminal offense.
But legislation only in Queensland. Yeah, only in Queensland where
(02:03):
we've got that age stipulated underswell, but it's pretty loosey goosey.
I mean, how much time is unreasonable?
Speaker 3 (02:09):
Is it ten minutes?
Speaker 2 (02:10):
Yeah? It all depends on the circumstances. If you're dropping
in next door to borrow a cup of sugar from
the neighbor, then you're probably aren't going to be five minutes.
But even if you get caught up in one of
those wonderful nahborly conversations, you say it's going to be five,
it is. There for twenty minutes. You're within a screams
distance of the house, you'll hear if anything went wrong,
and you can usually get home. So if you've left
(02:32):
your four year old in the bath, if you're.
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Just at the neighbor's house, if you really left the kids.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
Alone, well, if you've left you four year old on
the bath, then absolutely have like that would be completely inappropriate.
So that's in Queensland. Else for in Australia, the legislation
is even more loose, and what it basically says is
that you're legally obliged to make sure that your child
is safe and that their needs are met, and you
can be charged if your child is left in a
dangerous situation or not fed or clothed or provided with accommodation.
(02:58):
But I think you'll probably agree with me on this,
and that is that if you're going to leave you
kids alone, you need to consider a whole lot of things.
Number one, how old is my child? And how long
am I going to be gone? And how far am
I going? And how safe is my neighborhood and what
time of day is it? And what's my child doing
while I'm gone?
Speaker 3 (03:15):
And what's the contingency plan if something went wrong?
Speaker 2 (03:18):
And this is actually my big one, and it's the
one that most parents don't think about. Let's say you
leaving two or three of the kids at home. You've
got a thirteen year old and a seven year old
and a four year old and they have a fight.
What happens when they have this big blow up and
somebody ends up getting hurt if there's no adult there
to supervise. That's really ugly, and kids do fight, or
what happens if they're not doing anything wrong at all,
(03:41):
but they decide that they're going to have a swim
Because you're only going to be ten minutes, but you
did get caught up, and you get home and they're
in the swimming pool, and let's hope that nothing goes wrong. Well,
what happens if they're just chopping up an orange or
an apple and they slice through their hand, or they
are goofing off and having fun with sheets and cushions
and pillows building a cubby house and one of them
accidentally falls down the stairwell and bangs their head and
(04:01):
ends up unconscious. I know that sounds terrifying, and it
might sound like it's completely overdone, as if but if
we haven't taught the kids what to do in case
something happens on parental guidance, someone bangs on the door
and says, hi, I'm here with a parcel. Do the
kids know what to do about making noise responding to
somebody at the front door. These are the kinds of
things that I think matter much more than some of
(04:22):
the other things. And of course, never leave your kids
in the bath, or never leave the stove on and
the kids at home alone, those kinds of things matter
as well.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
It was quite cute that the other day our thirteen
year old was at home and she heard the doorbell
ring right and went out and realized that it was
the mailman. Well, it was actually a delivery guy and
he was dropping off some of your books. And she
came back into the house. I must have been in
the bathroom, I think she came back out and she said, Mum,
(04:50):
it's okay, she said, I double checked. It was just
the delivery guy bringing dad's books, so I let him in.
If we hadn't watched parental guidance, it wouldn't have even
been a commonversation. But she'd done the observation. She checked
to make sure everything was safe and knew what was
what she was comfortable dealing with before she let him in.
And I just thought it's great because it's education, right.
(05:12):
It's helping her to recognize what are the parameters I'm
capable of working in before I need to involve somebody else.
Speaker 2 (05:19):
Okay, what's the second one?
Speaker 3 (05:20):
So how old should our kids be before we give
them a mobile phone?
Speaker 2 (05:24):
I hate this question.
Speaker 3 (05:25):
I knew you again.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
It's the question that I get all the time. All Right,
here's how I'm going to approach this. There are so
many options out there for kids to have the ability
to contact us if they need us without them having
a phone. So what we do is we say, all
the other kids have got one, and if my child
needs me, then they need a phone. So I'm just
going to go on and get them a phone, and
we tend to give them like a hand me down
iPhone or some other kind of smart device. Don't do it.
(05:50):
For as long as you can delay, delay, delay, delay,
Even if a kid is the most unpopular kid at school,
I'm going to say, don't do it. All the research
evidence that I've looked at shows that the younger they
are when they get a smart device, rate of the
risk that they are that they're out of experiencing mental
health challenges and all of the associated risks, explicit content,
the bullying, the fights over putting the phone away, going
(06:12):
to bed on time, being sneaky, just it's such a
headache once you let that genie out of the bottle,
once the horse has bolted. I can mix metaphors if
you want, But so I said this all the time.
Kids need smartphones, not smart parents. Sorry, let me say
that again. Kids need smart parents, not smart phones. I
can't believe that I got around the wrong way. Smart
(06:32):
parents give their kids dumb phones. I'm a big fan
of the Space Talk watch for kids in primary school.
They don't need a smartphone. Don't give it to them,
just don't. And if you have, you can actually take
it back. It's okay. They'll have a big dummy spit,
they'll be so cranky, toys out of the cot kind
of dummy spit, but you can take it off them.
The other thing that I would say is that once
they have one, you've really got to be clear on
(06:53):
the parameters. So our general guidance and advice has always been,
and what we've tried to do in our home with
reasonable success, is you don't get a smartphone till you
can pay for it yourself so you can go out
and buy it. We have loosened up a little bit
with our younger children, and I'm regretting it and trying
to find ways that we can work our way around it.
The great challenge, of course, is kids come home from
(07:14):
school with devices now as well. The school supplies the
computer or the iPad or the laptop or whatever is
going on, so there's a lay of complication around that.
But I still think minimizing their access to screens is
fantastic delayed as much as you can. When they can
pay for it, they can have one.
Speaker 3 (07:28):
I think for a lot of parents, giving their child
a mobile phone is actually a convenience for them. Yeah,
it's so much better to be able to contact your
child when you want them in the moment.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
But that's why I'm saying the space talk watch will
do the job.
Speaker 3 (07:40):
Then having to wait our thirteen year old, she doesn't
actually have a mobile phone, and I needed her to
go and get some groceries from the shop. Our shop's
only eight hundred meters down the road. She gets on
her little bike and she rides down.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
And she loves the independence of doing it, like she
really looks forward to it.
Speaker 3 (07:57):
But she'd only just left when I remembered I hadn't
put an extra thing on the way through this.
Speaker 2 (08:05):
Did you let her come home? And then you set
her back? I had to because I couldn't call her.
So she walked in the.
Speaker 3 (08:11):
Door and I said, I'm so grateful that you did that.
Guess what And she looked at me and she said,
you forgot something else, didn't you. And I'm like, yep,
And I can't cook dinner until you get it.
Speaker 2 (08:18):
See, I don't think that's a bad thing. I actually
don't think that's a bad thing, she said.
Speaker 3 (08:23):
For a moment, it was like, damn it. If she
had a mobile phone, i'd be you know, I could
have got her and she could have done it all
in one go. But she loves, like you said, loves
the independence. And at the end of the day, it
just meant dinner was an extra half an hour late.
It didn't make any difference. So I'm really grateful that,
in spite of the challenge from time to time that
(08:43):
we're trying really hard to kind of just hold her
back as long as we can.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
If only she didn't have a school computer. Okay, we're
running out of time. We've got a handful more that
you wanted to come out.
Speaker 3 (08:54):
Okay, Well, I want to know how young is too
young for a boyfriend girlfriend relationship?
Speaker 2 (08:58):
So we talked about this recent on the Happy Families podcast.
It was Tuesday, the first of August. It was episode
eight one six twin Relationships. How young is Too Young?
We went into a lot of detail on this one,
but it is one of those things that comes up
all the time. The first thing I'm going to say
is it's a pet peeve of mine. I know that
other people won't feel as strongly about this as I do,
but I don't think that it's in anybody's best interest
(09:20):
for us to be making doing the match making, pairing
kids up and being all romantic about it when they're
four and five and six. I just don't think that
that's in anyone's best interest. Just let the kids be kids.
They will start to show an interest though, or around
about grade three, grade four, grade five, and our job
then is to talk to them about what a healthy
relationship is and find out what they mean when they're
talking about boyfriend and girlfriend. I really, really, really don't
(09:43):
think that we should be encouraging those little romances at all,
and I would be doing everything that I could to
minimize that even when they get older, though. I mean,
we've actually said to our children, I'm opening up the
hidden cupboard here and letting you right under the hood.
Sorry mixed metaphor there, but you know what I mean.
We've actually said to our kids, don't have a boyfriend,
(10:04):
don't have a romantic interest until you finished high school.
And that's been really hard for them to get their
head around, and they've not liked what we've said. But
our thinking is there is going to be interest, but
don't get too serious. What happens is if there is
any harm done, you have to go to school every
single day and see that person. And in relationships with teenagers,
(10:26):
especially in our pornified culture today, there are many many men,
and with the expectation that things are going to escalate physically,
there will be harm done in many, many, many relationships,
and then you've got to somehow process that and show
up the next day at school and the next week
and the next month and function and concentrate and learn.
And it's not just that, it's also the reputational harm,
(10:47):
especially if there's any image based abuse or sharing that's
been going on. Everybody knows, everybody's seen, and just the.
Speaker 3 (10:54):
Social challenges that are associated with it. You know, when
you yeah, friendship groups, things break up all of a sudden, Oh,
I can't hang out with that group anymore. Or your
friends feel torn because they want to hang out with them,
but they want to be loyal to you, and.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
Yeah, I went pretty extreme. You've just talked about the
basic stuff it interfares, and for the younger years, that's
going to be the bigger issue. Right grade seven, grade eight,
grade nine. Then you get into the more senior years
and you encounter those big challenges. I would I think
a frank conversation with the kids about this stuff will
go a long way and discourage the relationships until they're
old enough to process them and manage them and navigate
(11:29):
them healthily. What about sleepovers, Oh gosh, most controversial topic
that we can talk about, and I don't think we've
got the time to do it properly. If I was
to put an age on it, I would say the
older the better, and I wouldn't encourage it. Be low
about the age of ten. No matter how well you
think you know, you just never do. You and I
both have heard so many stories from devastated parents whose
(11:52):
children have been harmed one way or another at a sleepover.
Sometimes it's just bullying and stupidity because kids don't know
how to handle themselves once they're tired and it's eleven
o'clock at nine or two o'clock in the morning. But
other times it's genuinely horrible harm. Okay, So if the
kids are going to have a sleep over, here's what
I would say. Know who's in the house. Know who's
(12:13):
in the house, because if they've got visitors, if they've
got an uncle who's staying, or a mate who's just
come into town and just staying for a couple of nights.
You just need to know who's there, and you want
to know the people absolutely, unquestionably, And I know that
I'm picking on men here, but unfortunately the research is
abundantly clear that men are the most likely ones to
(12:34):
hurt our kids. So is there a big brother and
how big and is that kid going to have any
access to where your kids are hanging out and doing
their thing?
Speaker 3 (12:43):
And maybe it's not physical harm.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
Maybe it's exposure to something explicit on the internet, conversations
that they're not supposed to be having, there's all those
kinds of things. You need to know the family well.
But I'm going to say this controversially and provocatively, don't
trust your guart because that's what pedophies rely on. They
build relationships to make you trust them. You think, oh,
they're fine. Don't actually trust your guard I think that
(13:07):
you've got to ask some hard questions when you drop
the kids off, like especially the first time. Like once
you've developed a relationship, maybe you can ease off on this,
but you need to ask what supervision is there going
to be? Are there any visitors, are there any odder siblings?
Is alcohol going to be available? Now? Obviously with young kids,
that's not going to be an issue for the kids,
but are any of the parents going to be drinking?
(13:29):
Because you need to know that there's at least one
sober parent. If the kids are all having a whole
lot of fun and the parents think that they're going
to have a few as well, if the child gets injured,
who's going to take them to the hospital? Like what
can we do to make sure that the kids are safe?
That's my whole thing. And the last thing I'll say
on this is you've got to teach your child what
to do if a situation feels lousy, if they're feeling
threat and if they're feeling uncomfortable, if they're feeling unsure,
(13:51):
can they leave the room when the computer screen comes out?
Do they know how to say no, that's not cool
when somebody's being picked on or if there's any sense
of threat, do they know how to go to the
bathroom and send you a quick text message even if
they're using a space talk watch, Like, do they know
how to do that? And then you've got to make
sure that you're available to respond.
Speaker 3 (14:09):
There's only been a handful of times where our kids
have actually reached out to us while they've been with
other people and have felt like they needed to come home.
They didn't feel comfortable, not necessarily unsafe, just not comfortable
with what was going on. But they also didn't want
to be seen to be ringing mummy to come and
pick them up. And so we have always acknowledged to
them that we're happy to be the bad guy. And
(14:31):
so in those instances, the kids have literally just sent
us an emoji that has helped us to recognize that
we need to call them and ask them to come home.
And so we've made a phone call and said, look,
it's really late and I need some help. First thing
in the morning, can you you know, I know you
were hoping to spend time with your friends, but can
you come home? And they've been like, yes, that's fine,
(14:53):
and then say to their friends, Oh, this is so bad.
I can't believe my parents are doing this, but I
have to go home.
Speaker 2 (14:57):
Yeah, blame the parents.
Speaker 3 (14:58):
And so we've been really happy to play that role
for them to enable them to save face with their friends.
But also help them to feel comfortable knowing that they
can come to us. Just is so important? Yeah, yeah,
it's so important.
Speaker 2 (15:14):
Now we're almost at we are out of time? Are
there anymore? Have we covered it all off?
Speaker 3 (15:17):
When do you let your kids walk to school or
go to the shops.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
As early as possible? As early as possible, As early
as possible, But but you do need to take the
circumstances into account, like how many big roads are there,
how far is the distance, what time of the day
is it. Have they done it before? Can they go
with an older sibling or a friend. You want to
make sure that you're keeping them safe. But I just
think as early as possible. I like the idea of
(15:40):
them being able to do it with a friend or
with a sibling from about the age of nine, eight
or nine, depending again on how far it is and
what time of day it is and all those questions.
And I like the idea of them being able to
do it on their own from about eleven or twelve.
I just think we ask so much of our children
emotionally in an unfair way, little of them physically that
(16:01):
they're capable of. And that's what I would love to
see do you want to push back? Are you mad
at me for saying that? Have I gone too young? No?
Speaker 3 (16:07):
I think we need to know our kids. And like
you said, there's so many variables around it. But if
you feel like you're in a safe environment, you've got
a great neighborhood, and your kids are going to listen
to each other, that's the big thing.
Speaker 2 (16:22):
They go for it. Yeah, yeah, okay, I've got one.
We don't have time for it, but I've got one
for you. But you did not know is coming. How
old do the kids need to before they can get
their ears pierced?
Speaker 3 (16:31):
I'll see in my I'm going to say in my house.
In our house, the rule has always been that I
would wait until they asked. Yeah, so it's been different
for each of them. Okay, number one she decided it's
seven she wanted to, and our last one she was
like really really excited about doing it at about seven,
(16:53):
and then I told her it was going to hurt,
and I just explained to her what it would be like.
She said, yeah, actually, no, I don't feel like doing that.
So she waited until she was nine. So for me,
it really I don't care what age. I don't have
a problem with it at all, but I'm not going
to inflict paying on my child unnecessarily. They will make
the decision, and they will understand and know how it's
(17:13):
going to go, what it's going to feel like, and
then they can make their own mind up.
Speaker 2 (17:16):
The Happy Family's podcast is produced by Justin Rowlin from
Bridge Media. Craig Bruce is our executive producer. Hey, we
really hope that we've given you some food for thought.
If you agree with this, that's great. If you don't,
we want to hear from you. Podcasts at Happy families
dot com dot you A quick reminder as well. The
Smells Like Teen Spirit Summit tickets are on sale now.
The early bird special doesn't last for long, so make
(17:37):
sure you get in incredible lineup. It's going to be phenomenal.
All the details at doctor Justin Coulson's Happy Families on
Facebook and Instagram, or at Happy Families dot com dot
a u
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