April 27, 2025 • 26 mins
We’ve been listening and after 5 whole seasons, we’re finally bringing you a topic that you’ve beeeen asking for!! SEX!
On this episode, we’re delving deeper into sex and are joined by Sexologist, Laura Miano, of Miano Clinical Sexology who delves deeper into why sex is so hard to talk about, the myths around sex, self-pleasure, and her sex concept store, Posmo.
Keep up with Laura and all she’s up to:
Personal Instagram: @lauramianosexology (https://www.instagram.com/lauramianosexology/?hl=en)
Posmo Instagram: @_posmo_ (https://www.instagram.com/_posmo_/?locale=de_DE&hl=en)
Website: Miano Clinical Sexology ( https://mianoclinicalsexology.com.au/ )
Posmo Store: https://posmo.com.au/
We had the pleasure of recording this season at Bittersweet Studios (@bittersweet.studios_)
The gorgeous set up for this season was done by the amazing Pink Lady Picnics: (@pinkladypicnics)
We'd love to hear from you!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Oh oh wow. I'm like, I have had to cut.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
I think a lot of people do struggle to talk
about sex because people.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Are worried that they're not normal.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
There is also, especially in porn, a big focus on
male pleasure.
Speaker 3 (00:12):
Yeah, she was like sketching a vagina and glitterist and
then she was just like, yeah, so this is what
you need to do. It makes it more pleasurable for
the partner, and I just froze up.
Speaker 4 (00:34):
I'm always always be careful those.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
Hi.
Speaker 5 (00:44):
I'm Amanda and I'm Rumby. Welcome to It's Layered podcast.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
We are under the Blackcast Network POWD by iHeart, and
we're recording in studio today in Melbourne.
Speaker 5 (00:54):
Yeah, it's aid Bittersweet Studios and our beautiful setup is
still going with our soft Girl era done by Pink
Lady Picnic. Yeah, today is a special episode, don't you
reckon RMB.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
I really think it's a long overdue episode. I mean
we're six seasons in right, and we have not talked
about this.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
We've heard you at all.
Speaker 5 (01:16):
We've heard you further requests, we heard that, and finally
today we're gonna delve deeper into six Let's talk about sex,
Baby let's talk about you and me. I had to
for our special guest, Laura Mianna if you don't know,
loves to go into song, so just roll with her
when she does. But Laura is an experienced sex therapist
(01:38):
and educator. She's passionate about breaking down sexual stigmas and
opening conversations that foster deeper learning of one's own sexuality
and desires. Her approach to sex therapy is empathetic, trauma informed,
and person entered.
Speaker 1 (01:53):
Dude.
Speaker 3 (01:54):
Laura founded Miano Clinical Sexology, but her work also spans
the sexual wellness space. She co founded Melbourne based sexual
wellness brand Posmo. Laura uses Posmo as a platform to
empower people to embrace a unique experience of sexuality.
Speaker 4 (02:11):
So we are so thrilled that you could be here
with us, Laura.
Speaker 3 (02:14):
I think for us it was really important to have
a sexual therapist so that we can have a really
meaningful conversation around it, have some fun, and learn a
little bit about your work so that we can destigmatize
the conversations around sex.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
So, yeah, thank you for having me. I was so excited.
Speaker 5 (02:35):
How would you describe the work that you do and
how you got into it?
Speaker 1 (02:39):
Well, how I got into it.
Speaker 2 (02:42):
I think from a young age, I always felt quite
comfortable talking about sex.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
My mom would always kind of make little.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
Cheeky jokes about sex, and it was something that behind
closed doors it was always safe to talk about.
Speaker 1 (02:56):
There was a safe space. But when I was in.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
High school, I really loved hip hop music and R
and B and a lot of it can be quite sexual.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
Yeah. Yeah, and Little Kim was actually.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
Do you remember, And I remember her music was all
about sexual empowerment, especially for women, and I really loved it.
I feel like she had a really great message, and yeah,
from a young age, just made me really inspired to
push a similar message that women can own their sexuality
(03:38):
and advocate for it and it's just as important as
everyone else's.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
Yes. Agree. And I think you mentioned something.
Speaker 3 (03:45):
Your mom was your safe space, and she created a
safe environment, and I think a lot of us we
didn't have that, at least I never had that growing up,
which then brings the question, and I guess I'm kind
of alluding to it, but I'd love to hear from
your perspective why you think sex is so often difficult
to talk about and it's a difficult topic for discussing
(04:08):
with friends or family in some households.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
Yeah, I mean I think firstly, we kind of tell
people it's not okay to talk about sex. You know,
when when one person tries to talk about sex, whether
it's at home or with friends or at school, people
are often met with a bit of a shutdown because
it makes the other person uncomfortable. So we're really just
never taught the skills to be able to talk about sex.
(04:33):
But it is interesting because what I've found in my
therapy sessions is because it becomes such a safe open
space to talk about sex, the moment you actually provide
that for people, they pick up on the skill really quickly.
Speaker 4 (04:46):
Yeah okay, wow.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Yeah, that safe space is never really offered in real life. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (04:54):
Yeah, it's crazy because I think like even amongst friends,
we like people don't know about Like I mean we
in my friendship group, you have this thing called Kusy's
Corner shout out to you, QUIZI, and he like loves
to ask people like what they're going through and a
lot of it ends up being sexual even just like
how often that people having sex in a week?
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Like what's the norm? I suppose?
Speaker 5 (05:14):
And you can tell even that we can share about
everything and anything else, but when it comes to that,
people kind of almost shut down or we need liquid
courage to go there.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
It's just so strange. Yeah, yeah, could.
Speaker 3 (05:26):
I ask if you could give us like an idea
of how to the skill or what kind of skill
is required, or how to talk about it better? You know,
we understand like a safe stacee of feeling comfortable as
you you know, in your friendship group, but like what
should we how do we go into it? You know,
as like bringing it up? Because I'm like, how even start?
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Yeah, how do you ask? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (05:51):
I guess I could start with you being open about
your own sex life.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
I'm kind of setting that standard.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
I think a lot of people do struggle to talk
about sex because people are worried that they're not normal.
But everyone is so varied and so different. So yeah,
just opening up about your experiences and also appreciating that
it is normal because everyone's experience is normal.
Speaker 1 (06:13):
Yeah, like what is normal? Yeah? Exactly exactly.
Speaker 5 (06:16):
If there's one misconception or one myth you want to
debunk today about sex, what is it and why?
Speaker 1 (06:24):
Oh what is it?
Speaker 2 (06:25):
And like okay, well I'd say one myth would be that.
I guess sex needs to follow like a kind of formula.
I think people don't outwardly say that, you know, people
don't outwardly say it needs to follow a formula formula,
but people internalize that a lot from cultural messages, from porn,
from movies, and yeah, there's this idea that it needs
(06:49):
to start with a certain amount of kissing, certain amount
of for play, penetration. Yeah yeah, yeah, and there's this myth.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
I guess that it needs to look like that, but
it's really so varied.
Speaker 5 (07:06):
You're so right, right, because even as I think about
how I approach it, it is like that like a bit
of full play and a bit of like penetratives, Like
it's always just that like order you've seen. Yeah, people
even knowing that, like penetrative sex is not the only sex.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
Yes, I think for women.
Speaker 5 (07:23):
We are always told like, oh, just make the guy
come and then.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
Yeah, that's your job done. Yeah yeah, because.
Speaker 5 (07:28):
There's so many different Like you know, even if you're
in your period or whatever, you don't feel like having
penetrated sex, you can still be intimate with your partner.
I think that's something that we're just not told enough.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (07:41):
Sure, I think For me, it's that sex was never
about me, if that makes sense. There was never like
a conversation around you're supposed to get pleasure from this,
you're also supposed to really enjoy it. It kind of
is just like, Okay, this is how you pleasure your husband.
So we have this conversation with Amanda how when I
(08:02):
was younger and I'm putting my people on blast where
my mom I think I was about to go to
university and then she just called me into her room
and she's like, roomby, bring me a paper and a pen.
So I gave her and then she was like sketching
a vagina and glitterist and then she was just like, yeah,
so this is what you need to do and then
it makes it more pleasurable for the partner. And I
(08:24):
just froze up because I was like, we have never to.
Speaker 5 (08:26):
Yeah, they've gotten such a loud left to one hundred,
and she was like, oh, yeah, let your sister know,
and I was just like, soa what now?
Speaker 4 (08:34):
But even in that, it wasn't so much about me.
Speaker 1 (08:38):
It was more about.
Speaker 4 (08:40):
How to make sure I'm pleasing something.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Yes, it's very male center feels, and I feel like
that's where we kind of go wrong because sex is
such a complimentary process.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
The more that you get turned on, the more it turns.
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Them on, And that's when it's a really, really connected experience.
But when it's more so about you just touching them
in the right way makes them feel good, and not
really focusing on what brings you pleasure, you're actually I
would say.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
It's not going to lead to the best kind of sex.
I agree.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
And if you feel good about yourself and are really
you feel sexy, you feel confident, I find that is
the best sex, Like when you feel so good and yeah.
Speaker 5 (09:20):
And relax, RelA, yeah, yeah. Why do you think it
is that way though? That it is male centered? Do
you think it is due to porn? Because sometimes I
feel like even like we might think, okay, you're being
a bit of a selfish lover, but even the guy thinks, oh,
this is the way. Like, I feel like the mis
education is on both ends. Even if your partner is
(09:41):
trying to be generous, they might not have the roadmap
on how to be But what are we missing there
to not get all those skills?
Speaker 2 (09:50):
Well, yeah, I think the sources of education for sex
are yeah, porn and movies, and they don't really go
into all of the details of it and the reality
of what it can look like, how it is so varied.
But there is also, especially in porn, a big focus
on male pleasure.
Speaker 1 (10:10):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
Yeah, and the way that someone would stimulate a woman
to get her to orgasm is usually not the reality.
You know, it happens really quickly, and yeah, there's just
this misinformation around what women's bodies need to reach climax.
Speaker 4 (10:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (10:29):
I remember, like even in biology or the boys would
be like, huh, like when the vagina is being shown
and they're like, even till this day, I think boys
still have trapped their heads around one of vagina actually
like looks like so then for them to be able
to pleasure it is like, but do you find us
women also might not know how to pleasure ourselves like masturbation.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
How does that? Yeah? Yeah, I think it's it is
on both ends.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
Both people are kind of misinformed and uneducated around female pleasure.
Speaker 1 (10:59):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
A lot of the times when I see clients, especially
when there's maybe mismatch desire in a relationship, when the
man wants it more than the woman, a lot of
times it will be that the woman isn't aware of
what she wants, or she might be kind of aware
of it and then maybe ask him for it, but
because it might not seem similar to the poem or
(11:21):
like the movie kind of secks, both of them will
actually disqualify it. The man and the woman, they'll both
kind of just not put too much focus on it
because she'll think, oh, maybe it's a bit of left center.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
And you're so right about asking for what you want.
And because I think again maybe male centric. Maybe also
as women, we are raised to put our needs in
the back burner in.
Speaker 4 (11:42):
A lot of ways, like in society.
Speaker 3 (11:44):
So then it's like, oh, if I ask for this,
but learning to articulate that actually I prefer it this
way or this is where my spot is, or you
know things like that. I would, if you don't mind,
would love for you to if you were to speak
to women, someone who's trying to get past all these
stigmas that we're in myths we're talking about, I'll say,
(12:07):
from a female perspective, for now, how do you think
we can start to really embrace our sexuality and kind
of get to learn ourselves better.
Speaker 1 (12:15):
And like if you could.
Speaker 3 (12:17):
Say, like top three stake for that, because I think
it's like, where do you start? Right, If we're not
having these conversations, all we rely on is TV, maybe
porn maybe if we even have a conversation with a friend,
like where do we begin?
Speaker 4 (12:32):
So since you're here, we'd love to hear.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
Yeah. I guess how I would help a client with
that kind of thing is I would get them to observe,
just be an observer during sexual experiences for a little
while and just notice times during sex when they want
to do something but they don't do it, when they
do something but they don't really feel like doing it,
and just kind of observe how they're behaving versus how
(12:58):
they're feeling, how much their partner, you know, is intertwined
in that process as well, a sexual partner. And then
I would ask them, if you were to act on
some of these things that you want to do or
you don't want to do, what kind of thoughts come
up that make it more challenging to do that?
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Like it could be a body image thing.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
It could be that they think their sexual partner is
going to think they're being too much. It could be
that they don't want to be viewed as too sexual,
so everyone's experience with why they hold back will be
kind of different. So kind of pinpointing what barrier holds
you back from asserting what you need can be a
(13:39):
really good point, and then you can kind of pinpoint
that barrier and then work.
Speaker 1 (13:43):
On that barrier specifically.
Speaker 5 (13:45):
Oh wow, yeah, So I think for us a lot
of times city come from Zimbabwe, it's religion. So our
just to give you contexts, our background for generalizing most people,
it's very religious. And then the messaging is okay, you know,
And obviously that's because it's like, oh, you're meant to
be a virgin when you get married, and then thus
(14:06):
that means there is no sexual there's no talk on
sexual desire, there's no all saved for when you get married.
Speaker 1 (14:14):
Which you know, each to their own.
Speaker 5 (14:16):
But then the thing is, even after you get married,
we're not even provided with the tools.
Speaker 1 (14:20):
We have these things.
Speaker 5 (14:21):
I mean today we're having some high tea, but we
have these things called kitchen tea in Zimbabwe. And like
your aunts come and then all of a sudden, this
aunt you've never talked to you about anything sexual. It's
impacting all the sexual wisdom. Obviously, sometimes it's it is comical.
It's humor filled, but at the same time it's quite
sad that we save up all.
Speaker 1 (14:42):
This to then finally tell you.
Speaker 5 (14:44):
So it's a lot of information coming in at once
at the same time, like porn itself is illegal in Zimbabwe,
so it's like all these things are like cloak and
dagger and hidden, and it makes it so high because
I feel like sex is meant to be so open. Yeah,
but why do that disconnect between sex being such an
open thing and the where the world operates and makes
(15:05):
it such a closeted thing. Like why do you think
there's that disconnect there?
Speaker 1 (15:10):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (15:11):
I guess one could be like the history of religion,
which has kind of traditionally said to abstain and kind
of not really explore. Yeah, they've kind of promoted the
idea of not exploring sexuality until it's within a marriage.
But then yeah, when you're in that marriage, there want
much information.
Speaker 1 (15:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (15:32):
The wildest thing we just like, huh And for us,
I think you grew up being told no boys because
we're I was, and this is the thing of things
being kept under wraps in secret. You know, family members,
cousins who felt pregnant, teenage pregnancies, early pregnancies, but it
was like no one was telling us about like safe
(15:52):
sex truly and these things. So it's like the consequences
of just not talking about it. And then I remember
having a family meeting and my dad saying, this is
what happens when you have sex. Girls don't have sex,
boys wear a condom. I'll never forget that stage. And
I was like, huh, like make it make sense. Yeah,
that's normal.
Speaker 5 (16:12):
That was normal, and we were brought up so it's like
if you if you bring a pregnancy in this household,
it's a huge problem. But the guy can go and
make someone else pregnant, but that's someone else's daughter too.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
It's such a weird.
Speaker 2 (16:25):
Yeah, And if you're just told to abstain, then when
you get in that situation, you really have no information.
Speaker 5 (16:32):
And I'm sorry abstaining, especially in high school, and that's
when I met Rumby. You have all these sexual desires
Pubert starts and you're like, oh my gosh, my boobs
are growing and I touched my nipples. They're so sensitive. Yeah,
but it's like what do I do?
Speaker 3 (16:46):
And we were reading and you're romantic, like, oh my gosh, yeah,
I can't be feeling this way.
Speaker 1 (16:52):
Reading that was so right.
Speaker 5 (16:53):
Actually, in high school sometimes we would have one novel
and then we'll go around the whole, so we're all
getting like our education from whoever the author was shout
out and the author's out there, because it really was
just like our only gateway to finding out and knowing
about sex.
Speaker 3 (17:12):
Yeah exactly, yeah, yeah, but now I want us to
get a little bit more into you and Posmo. How
and why did you come up with your six concept
store and like what led to that, because like this
is so exciting for me us like bring the notepad,
like let us know. But yeah, how did that journey
(17:34):
come about? And why was it important for you to
start that and not just say okay, you can just
go to it whichever's store.
Speaker 1 (17:42):
So, yeah, can tell us a bit about that.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Yeah, it started when I was studying my master's to
become a psyxologist, and I was reading a lot on
this theory called postmodern sexuality, where it kind of talks
about how I mean, it's a bit of a radical theory,
but they say that they don't think people should have
sexual orientations because it categorizes people. Again, it's very radical,
(18:10):
So it's not that you know, it's can't really be
applied to everything. But I really like this the way
that they say that everyone's sexuality is so complex, so
to put it into a category is kind of simplifying it.
It also leads to like disadvantage as well, because you know,
people will make assumptions based on you know, who someone is,
(18:33):
based on the gender that.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
They're attracted to.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
So I really liked this theory, and I wanted to
create a store that was founded on that.
Speaker 1 (18:43):
I also have a history, like a.
Speaker 2 (18:45):
Background in fashion, so yeah, I wanted to create a
sex toy store that applied similar kind of esthetic principles
to the sexual honor space and make it really pretty
and yeah, rather than.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
I love that, Yeah, And like what would be a starter,
Like if I walked in or contacted you and said,
I'm looking to get some toys.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (19:12):
Website, Yeah, what would your recommendation be? And I would
love for you to also talk about it in the
context of sometimes I think we feel if you are
in a committed partnership, you don't need any toys or
it's like the person is supposed to be your full
place enough, which I don't agree with. But like, yeah,
so like please talk us through that, Like what would
your recommendation be? Like when you walk in, Like what
(19:35):
are you looking for? I mean, obviously everyone's different, but
like out of start or peers?
Speaker 5 (19:40):
Can I just say how excited Ruby looks like.
Speaker 1 (19:45):
We've been waiting? That's all I say. Listening, But.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
Yeah, I guess I would ask what kind of stimulation
you like?
Speaker 1 (19:56):
Do you prefer internal? Do you prefer external?
Speaker 2 (19:59):
So vaginal literal LaBier, you know, like on the lips
of the volvera.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
Do you prefer double penetration?
Speaker 2 (20:07):
Sorry, not dual stimulation sorry, where it's internal and external,
there's also anal stimulation to full body stimulation. So I
would ask of those things what you prefer, and then
based on that, you know, do you like quite strong
stimulation or something more gentle, because that could vary with
(20:32):
the kinds of vibrations a toy can give. Some toys
don't vibrate at all. They their glass or metal toys.
We have a few that don't have any vibrations, but
they feel really nice with like a silicon lube. So yeah,
it's not as overpowering as a vibrator, but.
Speaker 1 (20:50):
It still is like this external tool to your hands.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
Yeah, I guess I'm liked to.
Speaker 3 (20:59):
Cut literally, and yeah, I think you know to that point,
if you can just elaborate on you know what, how
it can enhance sexual experiences with partners as well as
an individual pleasure yourself, if maybe you can just talk
on that, because I don't think we hear that enough.
Speaker 2 (21:21):
Yeah, yeah, well, I mean people, some partners will be
concerned that a vibrator or a sex toy will replace them.
But during sex, a person can touch you in lots
of different places that you're not expecting. They can kiss you,
they can look into your eyes. Yeah, they can moan
(21:41):
and you can hear that. You can touch their hair,
you can touch their skin, you can feel their skin
on your skin. They can do so many different things.
That's simply one toy. As much as I'm an advocate
for sex toys, sex toys.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
Just can't do that same have that same kind of experience. True,
So it's.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
Definitely an additional tool, but in no way can it
replace the human experience of another person. Yeah, and speaking
on human experience, and I know we're talking more from
a heterosexual lens, but I've noticed and I don't know
what you've noticed in your experience do you reckon our
sexuality changes as we I mean, we've seen some celebrities
(22:23):
we start maybe in a heterosexual union and they're now
maybe they're in not again. It's like oh, and I
feel like humans always try to box people, like it's like, oh,
you're straight, Oh you're a lesbian? Are your But what's
your idea in and around sexuality?
Speaker 1 (22:37):
And it's evolving?
Speaker 2 (22:39):
Yeah, that's very much what postponder sexuality also talks about
that it's very fluid and it will you know, it
can be representative of what's kind of happening in your life.
The broader contacts. There was some research done in the sixties.
I think it was where they found I can't remember
the exact stats, but they found that it's quite common
for people to have their real life sexual experiences not
(23:03):
match what their sexuality like. The gender that they identify
with in terms of sexuality not a line. They might
be straight but have gay experiences or same sex experiences.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
So yeah, that's why I really love this theory and
that's why I wanted to credit.
Speaker 2 (23:23):
Yeah, it brought everyone together rather than having something that's
just talking.
Speaker 5 (23:27):
People you just meet and the sexual energy is then
you're like, wait, hang on, like you know what I mean,
But it's like simple exude sexual like energy and you're like, yeah,
why am I to you right now?
Speaker 2 (23:40):
You know?
Speaker 5 (23:41):
But like you're not maybe typically you think that's not
quote unquote your type. Yeah, yeah, And I just find
that always so fascinating. So I think if we let
go of all the labels and all the boxes, I
really wonder how we would be sexual journeys.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, far less restrictions. Yeah yeah.
Speaker 5 (24:00):
Are there any other upcoming projects you have this year
or anything you want to share with us things we
should watch out because obviously we're going to share your socials,
be going to share pod people can find you. Is
there anything else you'd want us to keep an eye
out for.
Speaker 2 (24:15):
Yeah, well, I've just launched my practice, my sex therapy practice,
so I'm planning to yeah, push a lot of kind
of sexual education through there. I'll be releasing a course
this month but in January on sexual exploration through sensuality,
so like through the census wow sorry side sound all
(24:41):
of the five sensors. And then with POSMO, we are
planning to do Melbourne based events like dating events and.
Speaker 1 (24:51):
So good and things like that. Yeah, oh wow, wonderful.
Speaker 3 (24:55):
And could you tell us where we can find you
on the socials and your winsor where we can put
things in the cart or you know order. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
So, in terms of socials, my sexology account is Laura
Miano Sexology. You can follow posmot Underscore Posmo Underscore, but
to book in for a session, it's Mianoclinical Sexology dot
com dot a.
Speaker 1 (25:20):
Yeah, and to put things into the cart. This has
been such a treat.
Speaker 3 (25:29):
I was also like, I need to respect Laura's time.
It's so great to have you just like helping to
debunk a lot. And I know there's a lot we
need to work through as a people, as you know,
but I think you are doing the Lord's work and
I think joy and pleasure should be for everybody.
Speaker 5 (25:48):
Definitely, the way my eyebrows went up and said double penetration,
I was like, oh, yeah, I know, I need to
like yeah, yeah, why I react like that.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
Yeah, it's been really fun. Good.
Speaker 3 (26:04):
Thank you so much, and thank you so much for
listening to another episode of its late podcast and we
will see you on the next episode.
Speaker 1 (26:11):
Thanks guys.
Speaker 4 (26:15):
Free audio post production by ourphonic dot com
Oh oh wow. I'm like, I have had to cut.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
I think a lot of people do struggle to talk
about sex because people.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Are worried that they're not normal.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
There is also, especially in porn, a big focus on
male pleasure.
Speaker 3 (00:12):
Yeah, she was like sketching a vagina and glitterist and
then she was just like, yeah, so this is what
you need to do. It makes it more pleasurable for
the partner, and I just froze up.
Speaker 4 (00:34):
I'm always always be careful those.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
Hi.
Speaker 5 (00:44):
I'm Amanda and I'm Rumby. Welcome to It's Layered podcast.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
We are under the Blackcast Network POWD by iHeart, and
we're recording in studio today in Melbourne.
Speaker 5 (00:54):
Yeah, it's aid Bittersweet Studios and our beautiful setup is
still going with our soft Girl era done by Pink
Lady Picnic. Yeah, today is a special episode, don't you
reckon RMB.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
I really think it's a long overdue episode. I mean
we're six seasons in right, and we have not talked
about this.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
We've heard you at all.
Speaker 5 (01:16):
We've heard you further requests, we heard that, and finally
today we're gonna delve deeper into six Let's talk about sex,
Baby let's talk about you and me. I had to
for our special guest, Laura Mianna if you don't know,
loves to go into song, so just roll with her
when she does. But Laura is an experienced sex therapist
(01:38):
and educator. She's passionate about breaking down sexual stigmas and
opening conversations that foster deeper learning of one's own sexuality
and desires. Her approach to sex therapy is empathetic, trauma informed,
and person entered.
Speaker 1 (01:53):
Dude.
Speaker 3 (01:54):
Laura founded Miano Clinical Sexology, but her work also spans
the sexual wellness space. She co founded Melbourne based sexual
wellness brand Posmo. Laura uses Posmo as a platform to
empower people to embrace a unique experience of sexuality.
Speaker 4 (02:11):
So we are so thrilled that you could be here
with us, Laura.
Speaker 3 (02:14):
I think for us it was really important to have
a sexual therapist so that we can have a really
meaningful conversation around it, have some fun, and learn a
little bit about your work so that we can destigmatize
the conversations around sex.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
So, yeah, thank you for having me. I was so excited.
Speaker 5 (02:35):
How would you describe the work that you do and
how you got into it?
Speaker 1 (02:39):
Well, how I got into it.
Speaker 2 (02:42):
I think from a young age, I always felt quite
comfortable talking about sex.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
My mom would always kind of make little.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
Cheeky jokes about sex, and it was something that behind
closed doors it was always safe to talk about.
Speaker 1 (02:56):
There was a safe space. But when I was in.
Speaker 2 (03:01):
High school, I really loved hip hop music and R
and B and a lot of it can be quite sexual.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
Yeah. Yeah, and Little Kim was actually.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
Do you remember, And I remember her music was all
about sexual empowerment, especially for women, and I really loved it.
I feel like she had a really great message, and yeah,
from a young age, just made me really inspired to
push a similar message that women can own their sexuality
(03:38):
and advocate for it and it's just as important as
everyone else's.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
Yes. Agree. And I think you mentioned something.
Speaker 3 (03:45):
Your mom was your safe space, and she created a
safe environment, and I think a lot of us we
didn't have that, at least I never had that growing up,
which then brings the question, and I guess I'm kind
of alluding to it, but I'd love to hear from
your perspective why you think sex is so often difficult
to talk about and it's a difficult topic for discussing
(04:08):
with friends or family in some households.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
Yeah, I mean I think firstly, we kind of tell
people it's not okay to talk about sex. You know,
when when one person tries to talk about sex, whether
it's at home or with friends or at school, people
are often met with a bit of a shutdown because
it makes the other person uncomfortable. So we're really just
never taught the skills to be able to talk about sex.
(04:33):
But it is interesting because what I've found in my
therapy sessions is because it becomes such a safe open
space to talk about sex, the moment you actually provide
that for people, they pick up on the skill really quickly.
Speaker 4 (04:46):
Yeah okay, wow.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Yeah, that safe space is never really offered in real life. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (04:54):
Yeah, it's crazy because I think like even amongst friends,
we like people don't know about Like I mean we
in my friendship group, you have this thing called Kusy's
Corner shout out to you, QUIZI, and he like loves
to ask people like what they're going through and a
lot of it ends up being sexual even just like
how often that people having sex in a week?
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Like what's the norm? I suppose?
Speaker 5 (05:14):
And you can tell even that we can share about
everything and anything else, but when it comes to that,
people kind of almost shut down or we need liquid
courage to go there.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
It's just so strange. Yeah, yeah, could.
Speaker 3 (05:26):
I ask if you could give us like an idea
of how to the skill or what kind of skill
is required, or how to talk about it better? You know,
we understand like a safe stacee of feeling comfortable as
you you know, in your friendship group, but like what
should we how do we go into it? You know,
as like bringing it up? Because I'm like, how even start?
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Yeah, how do you ask? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (05:51):
I guess I could start with you being open about
your own sex life.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
I'm kind of setting that standard.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
I think a lot of people do struggle to talk
about sex because people are worried that they're not normal.
But everyone is so varied and so different. So yeah,
just opening up about your experiences and also appreciating that
it is normal because everyone's experience is normal.
Speaker 1 (06:13):
Yeah, like what is normal? Yeah? Exactly exactly.
Speaker 5 (06:16):
If there's one misconception or one myth you want to
debunk today about sex, what is it and why?
Speaker 1 (06:24):
Oh what is it?
Speaker 2 (06:25):
And like okay, well I'd say one myth would be that.
I guess sex needs to follow like a kind of formula.
I think people don't outwardly say that, you know, people
don't outwardly say it needs to follow a formula formula,
but people internalize that a lot from cultural messages, from porn,
from movies, and yeah, there's this idea that it needs
(06:49):
to start with a certain amount of kissing, certain amount
of for play, penetration. Yeah yeah, yeah, and there's this myth.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
I guess that it needs to look like that, but
it's really so varied.
Speaker 5 (07:06):
You're so right, right, because even as I think about
how I approach it, it is like that like a bit
of full play and a bit of like penetratives, Like
it's always just that like order you've seen. Yeah, people
even knowing that, like penetrative sex is not the only sex.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
Yes, I think for women.
Speaker 5 (07:23):
We are always told like, oh, just make the guy
come and then.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
Yeah, that's your job done. Yeah yeah, because.
Speaker 5 (07:28):
There's so many different Like you know, even if you're
in your period or whatever, you don't feel like having
penetrated sex, you can still be intimate with your partner.
I think that's something that we're just not told enough.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (07:41):
Sure, I think For me, it's that sex was never
about me, if that makes sense. There was never like
a conversation around you're supposed to get pleasure from this,
you're also supposed to really enjoy it. It kind of
is just like, Okay, this is how you pleasure your husband.
So we have this conversation with Amanda how when I
(08:02):
was younger and I'm putting my people on blast where
my mom I think I was about to go to
university and then she just called me into her room
and she's like, roomby, bring me a paper and a pen.
So I gave her and then she was like sketching
a vagina and glitterist and then she was just like, yeah,
so this is what you need to do and then
it makes it more pleasurable for the partner. And I
(08:24):
just froze up because I was like, we have never to.
Speaker 5 (08:26):
Yeah, they've gotten such a loud left to one hundred,
and she was like, oh, yeah, let your sister know,
and I was just like, soa what now?
Speaker 4 (08:34):
But even in that, it wasn't so much about me.
Speaker 1 (08:38):
It was more about.
Speaker 4 (08:40):
How to make sure I'm pleasing something.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Yes, it's very male center feels, and I feel like
that's where we kind of go wrong because sex is
such a complimentary process.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
The more that you get turned on, the more it turns.
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Them on, And that's when it's a really, really connected experience.
But when it's more so about you just touching them
in the right way makes them feel good, and not
really focusing on what brings you pleasure, you're actually I
would say.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
It's not going to lead to the best kind of sex.
I agree.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
And if you feel good about yourself and are really
you feel sexy, you feel confident, I find that is
the best sex, Like when you feel so good and yeah.
Speaker 5 (09:20):
And relax, RelA, yeah, yeah. Why do you think it
is that way though? That it is male centered? Do
you think it is due to porn? Because sometimes I
feel like even like we might think, okay, you're being
a bit of a selfish lover, but even the guy thinks, oh,
this is the way. Like, I feel like the mis
education is on both ends. Even if your partner is
(09:41):
trying to be generous, they might not have the roadmap
on how to be But what are we missing there
to not get all those skills?
Speaker 2 (09:50):
Well, yeah, I think the sources of education for sex
are yeah, porn and movies, and they don't really go
into all of the details of it and the reality
of what it can look like, how it is so varied.
But there is also, especially in porn, a big focus
on male pleasure.
Speaker 1 (10:10):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
Yeah, and the way that someone would stimulate a woman
to get her to orgasm is usually not the reality.
You know, it happens really quickly, and yeah, there's just
this misinformation around what women's bodies need to reach climax.
Speaker 4 (10:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (10:29):
I remember, like even in biology or the boys would
be like, huh, like when the vagina is being shown
and they're like, even till this day, I think boys
still have trapped their heads around one of vagina actually
like looks like so then for them to be able
to pleasure it is like, but do you find us
women also might not know how to pleasure ourselves like masturbation.
Speaker 1 (10:49):
How does that? Yeah? Yeah, I think it's it is
on both ends.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
Both people are kind of misinformed and uneducated around female pleasure.
Speaker 1 (10:59):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
A lot of the times when I see clients, especially
when there's maybe mismatch desire in a relationship, when the
man wants it more than the woman, a lot of
times it will be that the woman isn't aware of
what she wants, or she might be kind of aware
of it and then maybe ask him for it, but
because it might not seem similar to the poem or
(11:21):
like the movie kind of secks, both of them will
actually disqualify it. The man and the woman, they'll both
kind of just not put too much focus on it
because she'll think, oh, maybe it's a bit of left center.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
And you're so right about asking for what you want.
And because I think again maybe male centric. Maybe also
as women, we are raised to put our needs in
the back burner in.
Speaker 4 (11:42):
A lot of ways, like in society.
Speaker 3 (11:44):
So then it's like, oh, if I ask for this,
but learning to articulate that actually I prefer it this
way or this is where my spot is, or you
know things like that. I would, if you don't mind,
would love for you to if you were to speak
to women, someone who's trying to get past all these
stigmas that we're in myths we're talking about, I'll say,
(12:07):
from a female perspective, for now, how do you think
we can start to really embrace our sexuality and kind
of get to learn ourselves better.
Speaker 1 (12:15):
And like if you could.
Speaker 3 (12:17):
Say, like top three stake for that, because I think
it's like, where do you start? Right, If we're not
having these conversations, all we rely on is TV, maybe
porn maybe if we even have a conversation with a friend,
like where do we begin?
Speaker 4 (12:32):
So since you're here, we'd love to hear.
Speaker 2 (12:35):
Yeah. I guess how I would help a client with
that kind of thing is I would get them to observe,
just be an observer during sexual experiences for a little
while and just notice times during sex when they want
to do something but they don't do it, when they
do something but they don't really feel like doing it,
and just kind of observe how they're behaving versus how
(12:58):
they're feeling, how much their partner, you know, is intertwined
in that process as well, a sexual partner. And then
I would ask them, if you were to act on
some of these things that you want to do or
you don't want to do, what kind of thoughts come
up that make it more challenging to do that?
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Like it could be a body image thing.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
It could be that they think their sexual partner is
going to think they're being too much. It could be
that they don't want to be viewed as too sexual,
so everyone's experience with why they hold back will be
kind of different. So kind of pinpointing what barrier holds
you back from asserting what you need can be a
(13:39):
really good point, and then you can kind of pinpoint
that barrier and then work.
Speaker 1 (13:43):
On that barrier specifically.
Speaker 5 (13:45):
Oh wow, yeah, So I think for us a lot
of times city come from Zimbabwe, it's religion. So our
just to give you contexts, our background for generalizing most people,
it's very religious. And then the messaging is okay, you know,
And obviously that's because it's like, oh, you're meant to
be a virgin when you get married, and then thus
(14:06):
that means there is no sexual there's no talk on
sexual desire, there's no all saved for when you get married.
Speaker 1 (14:14):
Which you know, each to their own.
Speaker 5 (14:16):
But then the thing is, even after you get married,
we're not even provided with the tools.
Speaker 1 (14:20):
We have these things.
Speaker 5 (14:21):
I mean today we're having some high tea, but we
have these things called kitchen tea in Zimbabwe. And like
your aunts come and then all of a sudden, this
aunt you've never talked to you about anything sexual. It's
impacting all the sexual wisdom. Obviously, sometimes it's it is comical.
It's humor filled, but at the same time it's quite
sad that we save up all.
Speaker 1 (14:42):
This to then finally tell you.
Speaker 5 (14:44):
So it's a lot of information coming in at once
at the same time, like porn itself is illegal in Zimbabwe,
so it's like all these things are like cloak and
dagger and hidden, and it makes it so high because
I feel like sex is meant to be so open. Yeah,
but why do that disconnect between sex being such an
open thing and the where the world operates and makes
(15:05):
it such a closeted thing. Like why do you think
there's that disconnect there?
Speaker 1 (15:10):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (15:11):
I guess one could be like the history of religion,
which has kind of traditionally said to abstain and kind
of not really explore. Yeah, they've kind of promoted the
idea of not exploring sexuality until it's within a marriage.
But then yeah, when you're in that marriage, there want
much information.
Speaker 1 (15:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (15:32):
The wildest thing we just like, huh And for us,
I think you grew up being told no boys because
we're I was, and this is the thing of things
being kept under wraps in secret. You know, family members,
cousins who felt pregnant, teenage pregnancies, early pregnancies, but it
was like no one was telling us about like safe
(15:52):
sex truly and these things. So it's like the consequences
of just not talking about it. And then I remember
having a family meeting and my dad saying, this is
what happens when you have sex. Girls don't have sex,
boys wear a condom. I'll never forget that stage. And
I was like, huh, like make it make sense. Yeah,
that's normal.
Speaker 5 (16:12):
That was normal, and we were brought up so it's like
if you if you bring a pregnancy in this household,
it's a huge problem. But the guy can go and
make someone else pregnant, but that's someone else's daughter too.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
It's such a weird.
Speaker 2 (16:25):
Yeah, And if you're just told to abstain, then when
you get in that situation, you really have no information.
Speaker 5 (16:32):
And I'm sorry abstaining, especially in high school, and that's
when I met Rumby. You have all these sexual desires
Pubert starts and you're like, oh my gosh, my boobs
are growing and I touched my nipples. They're so sensitive. Yeah,
but it's like what do I do?
Speaker 3 (16:46):
And we were reading and you're romantic, like, oh my gosh, yeah,
I can't be feeling this way.
Speaker 1 (16:52):
Reading that was so right.
Speaker 5 (16:53):
Actually, in high school sometimes we would have one novel
and then we'll go around the whole, so we're all
getting like our education from whoever the author was shout
out and the author's out there, because it really was
just like our only gateway to finding out and knowing
about sex.
Speaker 3 (17:12):
Yeah exactly, yeah, yeah, but now I want us to
get a little bit more into you and Posmo. How
and why did you come up with your six concept
store and like what led to that, because like this
is so exciting for me us like bring the notepad,
like let us know. But yeah, how did that journey
(17:34):
come about? And why was it important for you to
start that and not just say okay, you can just
go to it whichever's store.
Speaker 1 (17:42):
So, yeah, can tell us a bit about that.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Yeah, it started when I was studying my master's to
become a psyxologist, and I was reading a lot on
this theory called postmodern sexuality, where it kind of talks
about how I mean, it's a bit of a radical theory,
but they say that they don't think people should have
sexual orientations because it categorizes people. Again, it's very radical,
(18:10):
So it's not that you know, it's can't really be
applied to everything. But I really like this the way
that they say that everyone's sexuality is so complex, so
to put it into a category is kind of simplifying it.
It also leads to like disadvantage as well, because you know,
people will make assumptions based on you know, who someone is,
(18:33):
based on the gender that.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
They're attracted to.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
So I really liked this theory, and I wanted to
create a store that was founded on that.
Speaker 1 (18:43):
I also have a history, like a.
Speaker 2 (18:45):
Background in fashion, so yeah, I wanted to create a
sex toy store that applied similar kind of esthetic principles
to the sexual honor space and make it really pretty
and yeah, rather than.
Speaker 3 (19:01):
I love that, Yeah, And like what would be a starter,
Like if I walked in or contacted you and said,
I'm looking to get some toys.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (19:12):
Website, Yeah, what would your recommendation be? And I would
love for you to also talk about it in the
context of sometimes I think we feel if you are
in a committed partnership, you don't need any toys or
it's like the person is supposed to be your full
place enough, which I don't agree with. But like, yeah,
so like please talk us through that, Like what would
your recommendation be? Like when you walk in, Like what
(19:35):
are you looking for? I mean, obviously everyone's different, but
like out of start or peers?
Speaker 5 (19:40):
Can I just say how excited Ruby looks like.
Speaker 1 (19:45):
We've been waiting? That's all I say. Listening, But.
Speaker 2 (19:51):
Yeah, I guess I would ask what kind of stimulation
you like?
Speaker 1 (19:56):
Do you prefer internal? Do you prefer external?
Speaker 2 (19:59):
So vaginal literal LaBier, you know, like on the lips
of the volvera.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
Do you prefer double penetration?
Speaker 2 (20:07):
Sorry, not dual stimulation sorry, where it's internal and external,
there's also anal stimulation to full body stimulation. So I
would ask of those things what you prefer, and then
based on that, you know, do you like quite strong
stimulation or something more gentle, because that could vary with
(20:32):
the kinds of vibrations a toy can give. Some toys
don't vibrate at all. They their glass or metal toys.
We have a few that don't have any vibrations, but
they feel really nice with like a silicon lube. So yeah,
it's not as overpowering as a vibrator, but.
Speaker 1 (20:50):
It still is like this external tool to your hands.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
Yeah, I guess I'm liked to.
Speaker 3 (20:59):
Cut literally, and yeah, I think you know to that point,
if you can just elaborate on you know what, how
it can enhance sexual experiences with partners as well as
an individual pleasure yourself, if maybe you can just talk
on that, because I don't think we hear that enough.
Speaker 2 (21:21):
Yeah, yeah, well, I mean people, some partners will be
concerned that a vibrator or a sex toy will replace them.
But during sex, a person can touch you in lots
of different places that you're not expecting. They can kiss you,
they can look into your eyes. Yeah, they can moan
(21:41):
and you can hear that. You can touch their hair,
you can touch their skin, you can feel their skin
on your skin. They can do so many different things.
That's simply one toy. As much as I'm an advocate
for sex toys, sex toys.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
Just can't do that same have that same kind of experience. True,
So it's.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
Definitely an additional tool, but in no way can it
replace the human experience of another person. Yeah, and speaking
on human experience, and I know we're talking more from
a heterosexual lens, but I've noticed and I don't know
what you've noticed in your experience do you reckon our
sexuality changes as we I mean, we've seen some celebrities
(22:23):
we start maybe in a heterosexual union and they're now
maybe they're in not again. It's like oh, and I
feel like humans always try to box people, like it's like, oh,
you're straight, Oh you're a lesbian? Are your But what's
your idea in and around sexuality?
Speaker 1 (22:37):
And it's evolving?
Speaker 2 (22:39):
Yeah, that's very much what postponder sexuality also talks about
that it's very fluid and it will you know, it
can be representative of what's kind of happening in your life.
The broader contacts. There was some research done in the sixties.
I think it was where they found I can't remember
the exact stats, but they found that it's quite common
for people to have their real life sexual experiences not
(23:03):
match what their sexuality like. The gender that they identify
with in terms of sexuality not a line. They might
be straight but have gay experiences or same sex experiences.
Speaker 1 (23:18):
So yeah, that's why I really love this theory and
that's why I wanted to credit.
Speaker 2 (23:23):
Yeah, it brought everyone together rather than having something that's
just talking.
Speaker 5 (23:27):
People you just meet and the sexual energy is then
you're like, wait, hang on, like you know what I mean,
But it's like simple exude sexual like energy and you're like, yeah,
why am I to you right now?
Speaker 2 (23:40):
You know?
Speaker 5 (23:41):
But like you're not maybe typically you think that's not
quote unquote your type. Yeah, yeah, And I just find
that always so fascinating. So I think if we let
go of all the labels and all the boxes, I
really wonder how we would be sexual journeys.
Speaker 1 (23:55):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, far less restrictions. Yeah yeah.
Speaker 5 (24:00):
Are there any other upcoming projects you have this year
or anything you want to share with us things we
should watch out because obviously we're going to share your socials,
be going to share pod people can find you. Is
there anything else you'd want us to keep an eye
out for.
Speaker 2 (24:15):
Yeah, well, I've just launched my practice, my sex therapy practice,
so I'm planning to yeah, push a lot of kind
of sexual education through there. I'll be releasing a course
this month but in January on sexual exploration through sensuality,
so like through the census wow sorry side sound all
(24:41):
of the five sensors. And then with POSMO, we are
planning to do Melbourne based events like dating events and.
Speaker 1 (24:51):
So good and things like that. Yeah, oh wow, wonderful.
Speaker 3 (24:55):
And could you tell us where we can find you
on the socials and your winsor where we can put
things in the cart or you know order. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:06):
So, in terms of socials, my sexology account is Laura
Miano Sexology. You can follow posmot Underscore Posmo Underscore, but
to book in for a session, it's Mianoclinical Sexology dot
com dot a.
Speaker 1 (25:20):
Yeah, and to put things into the cart. This has
been such a treat.
Speaker 3 (25:29):
I was also like, I need to respect Laura's time.
It's so great to have you just like helping to
debunk a lot. And I know there's a lot we
need to work through as a people, as you know,
but I think you are doing the Lord's work and
I think joy and pleasure should be for everybody.
Speaker 5 (25:48):
Definitely, the way my eyebrows went up and said double penetration,
I was like, oh, yeah, I know, I need to
like yeah, yeah, why I react like that.
Speaker 1 (26:01):
Yeah, it's been really fun. Good.
Speaker 3 (26:04):
Thank you so much, and thank you so much for
listening to another episode of its late podcast and we
will see you on the next episode.
Speaker 1 (26:11):
Thanks guys.
Speaker 4 (26:15):
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