September 2, 2025 • 6 mins
Senator David Pocock joins Jonesy & Amanda for an interesting chat!
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Speaker 1 (00:10):
My Heart podcasts, hear more Gold one on one point
seven podcasts.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
Playlists and listen live on the free iHeart app.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Jersey and Amanda jam Nation. Well, we saw some confronting
scenes this week after tens of thousands of people took
to the streets in almost every capital city for the
March for Australia, calling for an end to mass immigration.
Independent Senator David Pocock says growing frustration stems from a
lack of clarity from the government, with no one really
(00:39):
offering a plan on how to deal with what we
perceived to be rising immigration. David Pocock, Hello, warning, goes
to Amada Workshire. I'm saying rising immigration. How is immigration
on the rise or is the perception of it that.
Speaker 3 (00:55):
If you look at the numbers after the catch up
after COVID, it really is about perception. And you know,
what we saw on the weekend was just so tragic
and deeply concerning to see neo Nazis marching in our
streets and to have sort of racism dressed up as
(01:17):
concern about immigration. I think we have to absolutely pull
that out and at the same time we have to
be able to have hard conversations I've been trying to
get the Senate and the Parliament to actually have a
discussion about immigration and population and talk about how big
(01:37):
do we want Australia to be, how do we balance
the skills that we need with ensuring that we have
enough housing and infrastructure, how do we reduce impacts on
the environment as cities grow, Like these are conversations that
aren't happening, and we don't actually have an overall plan.
And my concern is that when you don't have a plan,
it's very easy for people to scapegoat migrants who clearly
(02:01):
you aren't pausing our housing woes. That is far deeper.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
Than that, And there's Dick Smith has been saying for
a long time, Uh, the over population, we can't support that.
But then on the other hand, you hear people say
populate or perish? Which ones is it supposed to be?
Speaker 3 (02:19):
Well exactly? And I think these are the kind of
conversations that leaders should be having, actually hearing those views,
making the case to the Australian people. This is just
how valuable immigration has been. You know, As as a
migrant myself, I've loved the opportunity here. I feel like
(02:40):
I've contributed a lot, But clearly the marches on the
weekend weren't targeted at white migrants like me. There was
there were it was there were so many racist overtones
to it, and I think we have to we have
to call that out and at the same time say okay,
well let's let's talk about these things. Yes, there are
impacts on the environment. The State of the Environment report,
(03:01):
the government's own report has said that rising populations, growing
cities are having a huge impact on the environment. You
can't get away from that fact. So let's take that
into account and actually have this conversation and then have
a plan. So when people raise this, you can say, well, actually,
we've been through all of this and here is our plan.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
You've also said that it's a false narrative that immigration
is causing our housing crisis. There are things that government
can do about the housing crisis and they're not about immigration.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
Yeah, in a we've got a country where the major
parties seem it's they're allergic to talking about some of
the root causes of a housing system where we treat
it as an investment vehicle rather than as more of
a human rights something. We want to be accessible and
affordable and You just have to go down to any
auction on the weekend anywhere in Australia and see first
(03:54):
home buyers being outbid by property investors. Because those property
investors can negatively gear, they get a chunky capital gains
tax discount if they hold it for more than twelve months.
And we've tipped the scales in favor of investor, isn't
And I think it's time to change that, And the
vast majority of people I speak to want to see
sensible changes, like capping your ability to negatively gear. Investment
(04:18):
property is just down to one. You know, seventy per
cent of Australians only have one investment property. But we
have some small percentage of Australians who own a huge
chunk of our real estate and are doing very well.
Speaker 1 (04:30):
For me, I read a book called Doppelganger, which was
written in light of the COVID crisis and the aftermath.
And this is where this journalist, Naomi Wolf is her name,
said that where Naomi kleins sorry, and she spoke about
how she gets confused with Naomi Wolf and that's what
started the Doppelganger thing. But where America split as to
(04:51):
vax anti vax government, anti government, it's split down. It's
split because no one tackled what were real concerns in
the middle and that's where that we have that vacuum,
that's where these fringe groups arise. And I think that
what you're saying is that's what we'll we're in danger
of seeing here if we don't tackle the real issues
at the base of these fears.
Speaker 3 (05:13):
I think you're spot on there, And I mean, I've
got a lot of time for Naomi clients work and analysis,
and I think if you look at the US, some
very genuine concerns of Middle America, of even sort of
people who are struggling the battlers in America weren't taken
into account. And I'm concerned that here in Australia we
(05:33):
can't think that we're immune to that. We have to
be able to have these hard conversations. And you know,
over the last few days talking about this my office,
we've had angry calls from Nazis and racists, and we've
also had angry calls from people who say, to even
talk about immigration means that I'm a racist. And so
I think we need more people willing to actually say,
(05:57):
let's have a sensible conversation here. My experience so far
in the Parliament has been that people aren't up for that,
but it's so crucial if we're actually going to avoid
some of the what we've seen in the US.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
Well, David, thank you again for joining us. Look after yourself, mate,
have a good time in Canberra.
Speaker 3 (06:17):
Thanks very much. It's good to David Pocock
My Heart podcasts, hear more Gold one on one point
seven podcasts.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
Playlists and listen live on the free iHeart app.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Jersey and Amanda jam Nation. Well, we saw some confronting
scenes this week after tens of thousands of people took
to the streets in almost every capital city for the
March for Australia, calling for an end to mass immigration.
Independent Senator David Pocock says growing frustration stems from a
lack of clarity from the government, with no one really
(00:39):
offering a plan on how to deal with what we
perceived to be rising immigration. David Pocock, Hello, warning, goes
to Amada Workshire. I'm saying rising immigration. How is immigration
on the rise or is the perception of it that.
Speaker 3 (00:55):
If you look at the numbers after the catch up
after COVID, it really is about perception. And you know,
what we saw on the weekend was just so tragic
and deeply concerning to see neo Nazis marching in our
streets and to have sort of racism dressed up as
(01:17):
concern about immigration. I think we have to absolutely pull
that out and at the same time we have to
be able to have hard conversations I've been trying to
get the Senate and the Parliament to actually have a
discussion about immigration and population and talk about how big
(01:37):
do we want Australia to be, how do we balance
the skills that we need with ensuring that we have
enough housing and infrastructure, how do we reduce impacts on
the environment as cities grow, Like these are conversations that
aren't happening, and we don't actually have an overall plan.
And my concern is that when you don't have a plan,
it's very easy for people to scapegoat migrants who clearly
(02:01):
you aren't pausing our housing woes. That is far deeper.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
Than that, And there's Dick Smith has been saying for
a long time, Uh, the over population, we can't support that.
But then on the other hand, you hear people say
populate or perish? Which ones is it supposed to be?
Speaker 3 (02:19):
Well exactly? And I think these are the kind of
conversations that leaders should be having, actually hearing those views,
making the case to the Australian people. This is just
how valuable immigration has been. You know, As as a
migrant myself, I've loved the opportunity here. I feel like
(02:40):
I've contributed a lot, But clearly the marches on the
weekend weren't targeted at white migrants like me. There was
there were it was there were so many racist overtones
to it, and I think we have to we have
to call that out and at the same time say okay,
well let's let's talk about these things. Yes, there are
impacts on the environment. The State of the Environment report,
(03:01):
the government's own report has said that rising populations, growing
cities are having a huge impact on the environment. You
can't get away from that fact. So let's take that
into account and actually have this conversation and then have
a plan. So when people raise this, you can say, well, actually,
we've been through all of this and here is our plan.
Speaker 1 (03:21):
You've also said that it's a false narrative that immigration
is causing our housing crisis. There are things that government
can do about the housing crisis and they're not about immigration.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
Yeah, in a we've got a country where the major
parties seem it's they're allergic to talking about some of
the root causes of a housing system where we treat
it as an investment vehicle rather than as more of
a human rights something. We want to be accessible and
affordable and You just have to go down to any
auction on the weekend anywhere in Australia and see first
(03:54):
home buyers being outbid by property investors. Because those property
investors can negatively gear, they get a chunky capital gains
tax discount if they hold it for more than twelve months.
And we've tipped the scales in favor of investor, isn't
And I think it's time to change that, And the
vast majority of people I speak to want to see
sensible changes, like capping your ability to negatively gear. Investment
(04:18):
property is just down to one. You know, seventy per
cent of Australians only have one investment property. But we
have some small percentage of Australians who own a huge
chunk of our real estate and are doing very well.
Speaker 1 (04:30):
For me, I read a book called Doppelganger, which was
written in light of the COVID crisis and the aftermath.
And this is where this journalist, Naomi Wolf is her name,
said that where Naomi kleins sorry, and she spoke about
how she gets confused with Naomi Wolf and that's what
started the Doppelganger thing. But where America split as to
(04:51):
vax anti vax government, anti government, it's split down. It's
split because no one tackled what were real concerns in
the middle and that's where that we have that vacuum,
that's where these fringe groups arise. And I think that
what you're saying is that's what we'll we're in danger
of seeing here if we don't tackle the real issues
at the base of these fears.
Speaker 3 (05:13):
I think you're spot on there, And I mean, I've
got a lot of time for Naomi clients work and analysis,
and I think if you look at the US, some
very genuine concerns of Middle America, of even sort of
people who are struggling the battlers in America weren't taken
into account. And I'm concerned that here in Australia we
(05:33):
can't think that we're immune to that. We have to
be able to have these hard conversations. And you know,
over the last few days talking about this my office,
we've had angry calls from Nazis and racists, and we've
also had angry calls from people who say, to even
talk about immigration means that I'm a racist. And so
I think we need more people willing to actually say,
(05:57):
let's have a sensible conversation here. My experience so far
in the Parliament has been that people aren't up for that,
but it's so crucial if we're actually going to avoid
some of the what we've seen in the US.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
Well, David, thank you again for joining us. Look after yourself, mate,
have a good time in Canberra.
Speaker 3 (06:17):
Thanks very much. It's good to David Pocock
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