August 4, 2019 • 23 mins
The vivid memories of the first police officers on the scene on the night of February 10, 1978. Why they'll never forget.
Credits:
Presenter / Investigative Crime Journalist - Paula Doneman
Producer / Writer - Sally Eeles
Sound Design - Marc Wright
TV reporter - Mackenzie Ravn
Graphics - Jason Blandford
With thanks to:
The team at 7 News Brisbane, Annette Caltabiano, Georgia Done, Letitia Wallace, Susan Bush, Alex Wright Media, The Daily Mercury and Mackay City Council Library.
Music Credits:
Theme: The Clock is Ticking by Dark Orb Music
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Music from https://filmmusic.io
"Heartbreaking" by Kevin MacLeod (https://incompetech.com)
License: CC BY (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/)
Music from https://filmmusic.io
"Truth in the Stones" by Kevin MacLeod (https://incompetech.com)
License: CC BY (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/)
RF Piano Solo #2 - Mattia Cupelli
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Post Rock - Mattia Cupelli
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
In nineteen seventy eight, a young mum dies violently in
a small Queensland town. Suicide or murder? What happened to
Margaret Kirstenfeld? Someone knows?
Speaker 2 (00:30):
This is Pendulum Episode three.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
I'm Paula Donovan Dale Payne. You'll never forget the night
of February tenth, nineteen seventy eight, writing his motorbike along
Serena Beach Road to check on his friend Margaret, only
(01:07):
to discover her bloodied, lifeless body crumpled in the grass
on the side of the road. My colleagues and I
have tried on a couple of occasions to get Dale
to speak about his recollections, but each time he's refused.
Dale was raised in Serena and still lives in the area.
(01:28):
He's now in his late fifties, a father, now a
truck driver after having been a stockman and paramedic. He
says Margaret's death and the rumors that circulated afterwards caused
so much distress and anguish for his family at the time,
he doesn't want to dredge it up and go through
it all over again.
Speaker 4 (01:50):
Hello them.
Speaker 3 (01:51):
But two people who are willing to revisit the event
are the men who were the second to arrive on
the scene that night, Peter Howard, Craig Robertson are now retired,
but in February nineteen seventy eight they were well known
local police constables.
Speaker 5 (02:07):
That's too long ago form to remember.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
Peter joined the police in nineteen seventy.
Speaker 5 (02:12):
Three seventy three.
Speaker 3 (02:14):
Within two years he was transferred to Serena. Back then
the station had just four officers.
Speaker 5 (02:22):
Yeah, we had petty crime around the place. We didn't
have particularly serious crime at that particular time.
Speaker 4 (02:29):
Right well. I commenced at the Police Academy of Docksley.
Speaker 3 (02:34):
Craig signed up to be a policeman in June nineteen
seventy five as.
Speaker 4 (02:38):
A result of a learning desire to do something good
for the people of Queensland. I think, oh yeah, I
thought myself was a bit of a white Knight.
Speaker 3 (02:49):
After a year of service in Northern Brisbane, Craig was
moved to Serena for the young single officer. It wasn't
his first choice, but he soon settled in.
Speaker 4 (03:00):
Was very hot because I think I went up there
in January or February of seventy seven very much a
country Queensland Cane Town.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
And the people.
Speaker 4 (03:13):
Yeah, hard working on the whole, good honest people.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
Despite the passing of forty years, both Craig and Peter
recall the night Margaret died well.
Speaker 5 (03:25):
I don't remember whether it was hot or cold, but
I do remember that it became quite foggy. There was
a fair bit of fiber around on beach ride at
that time.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
So how far how far would you have been able
to see in front of you?
Speaker 5 (03:40):
I we'll probably still see fifty or so. Wasn't a
paysuit filvo like that, but it was a bit of
murky Folbert.
Speaker 4 (03:49):
I can remember it being a very dark night, if
I remember correctly, a moonless night. On that side of
the trade. You had a single rail houses and then
you had cane fields at the back of them, so
there was very little ambient light.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
It had been a fairly regular Friday evening for the
police officers, nothing out of the ordinary.
Speaker 5 (04:14):
It was a fairly quiet ship. We were just generally
patrolling and I think in that particular era there reports
of prow as along Beatroy.
Speaker 4 (04:25):
Lovely So was proceeding Thank you thirty four. I think
we were on a sixty m to two am shift.
We completed a patrol down to Serena Beach and we're
traveling inbound on Beachrade, traveling back to Serena, when a
(04:46):
young male who we knew was paint waved us down
in the front of a old workers cottage on beach rad.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
They soon discovered something was very wrong.
Speaker 4 (05:01):
On pulling up, he was in a excided state and
we could see a female person lying in the front
yard of the house.
Speaker 5 (05:10):
I saw a young dull panels to side the road
and he was he waved us to still called out
to us. He told me that Margaret Christenhal was lying
in the front yard and indicated over to her. So
Craig and I got out of the car and went
over to the lady was lying there, and straight away
I could see there was something serious.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
Craig Robertson recalls the young woman was lying on her side.
Speaker 4 (05:39):
She was wearing a pajama top night dress which was
which was wrapped up. Peter went to the where her
head was. I went down towards the middle of the
(06:01):
body and reached in for arm and tried to.
Speaker 5 (06:08):
Uh have tinn of house.
Speaker 4 (06:13):
Unfortunately there wasn't any any house.
Speaker 3 (06:21):
This is how Peter Howard remembers that moment.
Speaker 5 (06:27):
She was lying a sort of on a side to
fight stwn. She had I think for recollection address on
but that was up uh part by O your body
exposing a lot of parts of the body from recollection.
(06:48):
I don't believe she had any under paincil and I
was looking around to see if there was anybody else
in the vicinity, and we're by standing out of the
top of Margaret's body and Craig was trying to get
a pulse, and it was then when I looked down
I saw the threat of being.
Speaker 4 (07:09):
Cut and as a result of that, we basically assumed
that she was dead.
Speaker 3 (07:40):
Constables Howard and Robertson radioed the Makhai Police station and
arranged for detectives from the Criminal Investigation branch to attend.
While they waited, they had to check whether anyone else
was there, more victims or a possible killer.
Speaker 5 (08:00):
The next thing that we did, I said, well, you
stayed with her, I'll have a quick look through the
house obviously in case there was a person there. Another person,
whether it be a witness or a person might have
caused the injuries. And I actually didn't have a gun
(08:24):
with me as the time and I took Craig's gun,
and I walked through the house checked her, and it
was dark and I can tell her and the incident happened.
And I went through the house and looking around, the
fog hanging down, and water had gone on. The hairs
were walking up and down on the back of my neck.
(08:44):
And of spaking to Craig Robertson about it, he said anything,
He said, you think you were worried? He said, what
do you think about me? He said, I didn't have
begun because I've given it to you.
Speaker 4 (09:00):
We didn't certainly see anyone else at that time. We
didn't see anyone loitering in the street or leaving the
premises at that time.
Speaker 3 (09:16):
And did Dale appear to you to be genuinely panicked?
Speaker 4 (09:20):
He was definitely upset, and the situation was certainly very confronting.
Speaker 3 (09:28):
Did he have any signs of any blood or anything
on him that you can recall.
Speaker 4 (09:33):
I can't recall anything about Dale that led me to
believe that he was involved with the inflicting of the
injuries on Margaret.
Speaker 3 (09:50):
Inside the house, Peter made an unexpected discovery.
Speaker 5 (09:54):
I was surprised to see a baby asleep on a
bed in front room, just inside the door.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
It must have been a surprised to find the baby
alive and well and possibly having slept through what had
happened to her mother.
Speaker 5 (10:13):
When I saw the baby lying there, I really dreaded
looking too closely in case the baby was alive as well.
But we were certainly a relief to see that the
child was breathing and Peter was leaping.
Speaker 3 (10:28):
Peacefully as he went through the house. Peter also found
copious amounts of blood and a number of knives.
Speaker 5 (10:40):
I saw a double bed in another room and that
was covered in the middle of the bed with blood.
I went from room to round checknique, and it seemed
didn't touch anything, and satisfied myself to nobody else in
the house. There was a knife on the bed, I
think if I recall where the blood, and there was
a lot of knife in the kitchen sink for the
(11:04):
puzzle as well.
Speaker 3 (11:08):
In his statement to the coroner, Peter said he thoroughly
searched Margaret's house and the back door was closed. This
is what Craig Robertson remembers well.
Speaker 4 (11:20):
After an unknown length of time, Peter came back out
and told me that he had a baby in the
house and blood and knives. We remained on the perimeter
(11:41):
and near Margaret's body. A short time later, the ambulance
arrives and Peter entered the residence once again with the
ambulance driver. The child was handed over to the custody
of the handless driver, who removed the child from the scene.
Speaker 3 (12:06):
His immediate conclusion was that Margaret's death was the result
of foul play. Peter Howard agreed. In his statement to
the coroner. Peter said, Margaret appeared to have been bashed
and raped.
Speaker 5 (12:22):
I thought that she had been murdered.
Speaker 3 (12:25):
Did you think that the murder may have had a
sexual motive to it?
Speaker 5 (12:29):
Well, the fact that she didn't have underclothing on as
far as underpins on, and that you know, I believe
that they didn't change for proble dedication.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
Some time later, Inspector Breen, the officer in charge of
the Mackai Criminal Investigation Branch, Detective Milton Hassenham otherwise known
as Bill, and detectives Turner, Kirkpatrick, Pike and Loxton, along
with the police photographer arrived in Serena. They had had
to make the fifty kilometer trip from Mackay which is
(13:06):
about a forty minute drive. Constables Peter Howard and Craig
Robertson were required to secure the area. They also had
to wait for the undertaker. It was the first time
either of the young officers had been confronted with such
a disturbing scene.
Speaker 5 (13:25):
It's certainly an incident that's remained with me for the
full thirty eight years from my policing.
Speaker 3 (13:34):
So what of Dale Payne, the teenage motorcyclists who discovered
Margaret's body. As I've mentioned, he doesn't want to talk
to me about it. Like some other key figures in
this case, Margaret is a ghost of their past who
continues to haunt them. It's like if they open up
there will be a huge shift in the status quo
(13:55):
of the lives they have built in the forty years
since her death. They reluctant does not speak to their
innocence or guilt, but rather than not wanting to face
the enormity and reality of a life changing event. Some locals,
who spoke on the condition of anonymity, tell me that
Dale was never the same after discovering Margaret's body.
Speaker 6 (14:19):
I am a single man, eighteen years of age, and
I was that to my parents.
Speaker 3 (14:22):
However, I did obtain the signed statement Dale provided to detectives.
At five point fifty pm on February eleventh, nineteen seventy eight,
the then eighteen year old Stockman described his connection to Margaret.
Speaker 6 (14:37):
I knew her for a period of six weeks. I
first met her at a home with Serena Betrode. There
a man named who was going steady with her at
the time. During the six weeks, I visited her home
on a number of occasions. I knew that she was
living apart from her husband. He was at the residence
when I first started to go down to the house.
Speaker 3 (14:56):
So who's We'll discuss more about him in a later episode.
Back to Dale.
Speaker 6 (15:03):
During the times that they visited Kirstenfeldt at.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
According to his statement, he was known to visit Margaret
at her home occasionally they had drinks together, but he
denied ever having sexual relations with her. On the afternoon
of her death, he told police they went fishing about
one point thirty or two pm before he dropped her
at home around three point thirty. He then saw her
(15:28):
around seven pm at a little cafe known as the
Pie Cart, where Margaret worked behind the counter. He chatted
to her briefly before heading off again.
Speaker 6 (15:39):
I went to my girlfriend's place, Margaret Hollis. I stayed
at to about ten forty pm. I then mode my
Honda motorcycle to Beatroy Samana to check out on Kurstenfeldt
make sure that she was all right. She had Tommy
previously that she was worried about a prowler around her house.
I rode my motorcycle past Kirstenfeldt's house and I noticed
that the fund doors open and there was lights on.
(15:59):
Turned and went back and parked on the footpath outside
her house. I saw something on the lawn of the
house next door to Kerstenfeldts, and then I saw that
there was, in fact Margaret Kurstenfeldt.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
Dale says he knocked on the door of Margaret's neighbor's house,
but there was no one home. He then rode to
the Serena police station just eight hundred meters away, but
no one was there. He phoned police, but there was
no answer, so he phoned the ambulance instead. Dale then
(16:32):
returned to Margaret's body to wait for paramedics. When he
got there, a police car was passing, so he hailed
it down He remained at the scene until the body
was removed. I've tried to track down detectives involved in
this case. Some have spoken to me for the podcast,
some declined, and others have died. One of the key
(16:55):
investigators involved with this case passed away in twenty fourteen.
Detective Sergeant Hassenkham finished his investigation report for the coroner
on April eighteen, nineteen seventy eight. I managed to obtain
a copy of the report, which is based on witness
statements and interviews, scientific evidence from the crime scene, and
(17:17):
Margaret's autopsy.
Speaker 7 (17:26):
The body of the deceased was lying on the ground,
face down, with the head inclined to the right and
facing in a westerly direction. The right arm was completely
under the body, whilst the left arm was extended alongside
the body with the palm facing upwards. The legs were
straight and fairly close together. The buttocks and private parts
were exposed and visible because of the short mini dress
(17:49):
in which the body was clothed and the fact that
no panties were worn. In addition to the red colored frock,
the body was clothed in a bra. There was evidence
of a large insane wound to the front of the throat,
a wound under the chin. Almost the entire body and
clothing were heavily bloodstained. The grass was of reasonably long
(18:10):
buffalo cooch grass, and there were bloodstains on the grass,
and a trail of blood could be followed to the
front steps of the deceased residence, up the steps and
to the front door. Initially, it was agreed that the
death of the deceased was as a consequence of murder,
and immediate investigations were commenced with that thought in mind.
Speaker 3 (18:31):
Detective Sergeant Hassenkham's report details how measurements and photos were
taken of the body and area, and that an inspection
was carried out in the house.
Speaker 7 (18:43):
Limited access was given and nothing was touched or disturbed.
I gave instructions that security be maintained in order that
technical experts could make a thorough examination at a later stage.
Speaker 3 (18:56):
Detective Sergeant Hassencam then writes about items found inside my
Margaret's house and the blood.
Speaker 7 (19:03):
The blood trail, which led up the front stairs, extended
through the sleep out to the main bedroom, where it
was noted that the double bed therein was heavily bloodstained.
The two sheets which were on the bed were both
saturated with blood. More towards the head of the bed,
two pillows on the bed were heavily stained with blood.
It appeared that blood had penetrated both mattresses which were
(19:26):
on the bed. Blood stains were evident on the floor
on both sides of the bed, and on the wall
on the left side of the bed and on the
wall near the bedroom door, there was a large knife
with a serrated edge lying on a book near the
foot of the bed. The knife was blood stained, and
there was a blood stained tea towel or what appears
to be such, wrapped around the handle of the knife.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
His report suggests that there was no signs of a
struggle in the bedroom or the lounge or the kitchen
of Margaret's home. In the bedroom, on the the right
side of the bed were a pair of women's bikini
style underwear in an unusual rolled position, as if they
had been rolled down over Margaret's thighs. In the kitchen sink,
(20:12):
amongst the dirty dishes a large carving knife with a
serrated edge, which was heavily blood stained. A quantity of
fair to brown hair was stuck to the blade of
the knife. Detective Sergeant Hassenham also knighted on the sink
a pair of scissors seemingly blood stained, with the tip
of each blade broken off, but the detective was confused
(20:36):
about something he didn't find.
Speaker 7 (20:39):
I was surprised to find no blood between the main
bedroom and the kitchen. This gave me a further indication
that the deceased had probably been murdered. I kept the
fact there was no blood in the kitchen area firmly
in mind for some considerable time. I will point out
the significance of this fact later in this report.
Speaker 3 (21:00):
Detective Sergeant Hassenham was also the opinion that a cut
under Margaret's chin had not been made with either of
the bloodstained knives found in her home, that it was
a result of a fall or having been hit with
a blunt object. Next time a family left shattered, I
(21:27):
would say I would have been the main suspect. The
radio rumors abound and.
Speaker 1 (21:34):
It was talk of it down for weeks after everybody's
surmise and who might have done it?
Speaker 3 (21:41):
But was it murder? If you have information about the
(22:08):
Margaret Kirstenfeld case, please let us know. Email us at
Pendulum podcasts at gmail dot com or go to sevenews
dot com dot au. Forward Slash Pendulum presenter and executive
(22:31):
producer Paula Donovan, writer and producer Sally Eels, Sound design
Mark Wright, Graphics, Jason Blandford, Transcripts Susan Bush. Our theme
music is the Clock Is Ticking by dark Org Music.
(22:56):
See our show notes for full music credits. With thanks
to seven Years Brisbane
In nineteen seventy eight, a young mum dies violently in
a small Queensland town. Suicide or murder? What happened to
Margaret Kirstenfeld? Someone knows?
Speaker 2 (00:30):
This is Pendulum Episode three.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
I'm Paula Donovan Dale Payne. You'll never forget the night
of February tenth, nineteen seventy eight, writing his motorbike along
Serena Beach Road to check on his friend Margaret, only
(01:07):
to discover her bloodied, lifeless body crumpled in the grass
on the side of the road. My colleagues and I
have tried on a couple of occasions to get Dale
to speak about his recollections, but each time he's refused.
Dale was raised in Serena and still lives in the area.
(01:28):
He's now in his late fifties, a father, now a
truck driver after having been a stockman and paramedic. He
says Margaret's death and the rumors that circulated afterwards caused
so much distress and anguish for his family at the time,
he doesn't want to dredge it up and go through
it all over again.
Speaker 4 (01:50):
Hello them.
Speaker 3 (01:51):
But two people who are willing to revisit the event
are the men who were the second to arrive on
the scene that night, Peter Howard, Craig Robertson are now retired,
but in February nineteen seventy eight they were well known
local police constables.
Speaker 5 (02:07):
That's too long ago form to remember.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
Peter joined the police in nineteen seventy.
Speaker 5 (02:12):
Three seventy three.
Speaker 3 (02:14):
Within two years he was transferred to Serena. Back then
the station had just four officers.
Speaker 5 (02:22):
Yeah, we had petty crime around the place. We didn't
have particularly serious crime at that particular time.
Speaker 4 (02:29):
Right well. I commenced at the Police Academy of Docksley.
Speaker 3 (02:34):
Craig signed up to be a policeman in June nineteen
seventy five as.
Speaker 4 (02:38):
A result of a learning desire to do something good
for the people of Queensland. I think, oh yeah, I
thought myself was a bit of a white Knight.
Speaker 3 (02:49):
After a year of service in Northern Brisbane, Craig was
moved to Serena for the young single officer. It wasn't
his first choice, but he soon settled in.
Speaker 4 (03:00):
Was very hot because I think I went up there
in January or February of seventy seven very much a
country Queensland Cane Town.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
And the people.
Speaker 4 (03:13):
Yeah, hard working on the whole, good honest people.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
Despite the passing of forty years, both Craig and Peter
recall the night Margaret died well.
Speaker 5 (03:25):
I don't remember whether it was hot or cold, but
I do remember that it became quite foggy. There was
a fair bit of fiber around on beach ride at
that time.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
So how far how far would you have been able
to see in front of you?
Speaker 5 (03:40):
I we'll probably still see fifty or so. Wasn't a
paysuit filvo like that, but it was a bit of
murky Folbert.
Speaker 4 (03:49):
I can remember it being a very dark night, if
I remember correctly, a moonless night. On that side of
the trade. You had a single rail houses and then
you had cane fields at the back of them, so
there was very little ambient light.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
It had been a fairly regular Friday evening for the
police officers, nothing out of the ordinary.
Speaker 5 (04:14):
It was a fairly quiet ship. We were just generally
patrolling and I think in that particular era there reports
of prow as along Beatroy.
Speaker 4 (04:25):
Lovely So was proceeding Thank you thirty four. I think
we were on a sixty m to two am shift.
We completed a patrol down to Serena Beach and we're
traveling inbound on Beachrade, traveling back to Serena, when a
(04:46):
young male who we knew was paint waved us down
in the front of a old workers cottage on beach rad.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
They soon discovered something was very wrong.
Speaker 4 (05:01):
On pulling up, he was in a excided state and
we could see a female person lying in the front
yard of the house.
Speaker 5 (05:10):
I saw a young dull panels to side the road
and he was he waved us to still called out
to us. He told me that Margaret Christenhal was lying
in the front yard and indicated over to her. So
Craig and I got out of the car and went
over to the lady was lying there, and straight away
I could see there was something serious.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
Craig Robertson recalls the young woman was lying on her side.
Speaker 4 (05:39):
She was wearing a pajama top night dress which was
which was wrapped up. Peter went to the where her
head was. I went down towards the middle of the
(06:01):
body and reached in for arm and tried to.
Speaker 5 (06:08):
Uh have tinn of house.
Speaker 4 (06:13):
Unfortunately there wasn't any any house.
Speaker 3 (06:21):
This is how Peter Howard remembers that moment.
Speaker 5 (06:27):
She was lying a sort of on a side to
fight stwn. She had I think for recollection address on
but that was up uh part by O your body
exposing a lot of parts of the body from recollection.
(06:48):
I don't believe she had any under paincil and I
was looking around to see if there was anybody else
in the vicinity, and we're by standing out of the
top of Margaret's body and Craig was trying to get
a pulse, and it was then when I looked down
I saw the threat of being.
Speaker 4 (07:09):
Cut and as a result of that, we basically assumed
that she was dead.
Speaker 3 (07:40):
Constables Howard and Robertson radioed the Makhai Police station and
arranged for detectives from the Criminal Investigation branch to attend.
While they waited, they had to check whether anyone else
was there, more victims or a possible killer.
Speaker 5 (08:00):
The next thing that we did, I said, well, you
stayed with her, I'll have a quick look through the
house obviously in case there was a person there. Another person,
whether it be a witness or a person might have
caused the injuries. And I actually didn't have a gun
(08:24):
with me as the time and I took Craig's gun,
and I walked through the house checked her, and it
was dark and I can tell her and the incident happened.
And I went through the house and looking around, the
fog hanging down, and water had gone on. The hairs
were walking up and down on the back of my neck.
(08:44):
And of spaking to Craig Robertson about it, he said anything,
He said, you think you were worried? He said, what
do you think about me? He said, I didn't have
begun because I've given it to you.
Speaker 4 (09:00):
We didn't certainly see anyone else at that time. We
didn't see anyone loitering in the street or leaving the
premises at that time.
Speaker 3 (09:16):
And did Dale appear to you to be genuinely panicked?
Speaker 4 (09:20):
He was definitely upset, and the situation was certainly very confronting.
Speaker 3 (09:28):
Did he have any signs of any blood or anything
on him that you can recall.
Speaker 4 (09:33):
I can't recall anything about Dale that led me to
believe that he was involved with the inflicting of the
injuries on Margaret.
Speaker 3 (09:50):
Inside the house, Peter made an unexpected discovery.
Speaker 5 (09:54):
I was surprised to see a baby asleep on a
bed in front room, just inside the door.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
It must have been a surprised to find the baby
alive and well and possibly having slept through what had
happened to her mother.
Speaker 5 (10:13):
When I saw the baby lying there, I really dreaded
looking too closely in case the baby was alive as well.
But we were certainly a relief to see that the
child was breathing and Peter was leaping.
Speaker 3 (10:28):
Peacefully as he went through the house. Peter also found
copious amounts of blood and a number of knives.
Speaker 5 (10:40):
I saw a double bed in another room and that
was covered in the middle of the bed with blood.
I went from room to round checknique, and it seemed
didn't touch anything, and satisfied myself to nobody else in
the house. There was a knife on the bed, I
think if I recall where the blood, and there was
a lot of knife in the kitchen sink for the
(11:04):
puzzle as well.
Speaker 3 (11:08):
In his statement to the coroner, Peter said he thoroughly
searched Margaret's house and the back door was closed. This
is what Craig Robertson remembers well.
Speaker 4 (11:20):
After an unknown length of time, Peter came back out
and told me that he had a baby in the
house and blood and knives. We remained on the perimeter
(11:41):
and near Margaret's body. A short time later, the ambulance
arrives and Peter entered the residence once again with the
ambulance driver. The child was handed over to the custody
of the handless driver, who removed the child from the scene.
Speaker 3 (12:06):
His immediate conclusion was that Margaret's death was the result
of foul play. Peter Howard agreed. In his statement to
the coroner. Peter said, Margaret appeared to have been bashed
and raped.
Speaker 5 (12:22):
I thought that she had been murdered.
Speaker 3 (12:25):
Did you think that the murder may have had a
sexual motive to it?
Speaker 5 (12:29):
Well, the fact that she didn't have underclothing on as
far as underpins on, and that you know, I believe
that they didn't change for proble dedication.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
Some time later, Inspector Breen, the officer in charge of
the Mackai Criminal Investigation Branch, Detective Milton Hassenham otherwise known
as Bill, and detectives Turner, Kirkpatrick, Pike and Loxton, along
with the police photographer arrived in Serena. They had had
to make the fifty kilometer trip from Mackay which is
(13:06):
about a forty minute drive. Constables Peter Howard and Craig
Robertson were required to secure the area. They also had
to wait for the undertaker. It was the first time
either of the young officers had been confronted with such
a disturbing scene.
Speaker 5 (13:25):
It's certainly an incident that's remained with me for the
full thirty eight years from my policing.
Speaker 3 (13:34):
So what of Dale Payne, the teenage motorcyclists who discovered
Margaret's body. As I've mentioned, he doesn't want to talk
to me about it. Like some other key figures in
this case, Margaret is a ghost of their past who
continues to haunt them. It's like if they open up
there will be a huge shift in the status quo
(13:55):
of the lives they have built in the forty years
since her death. They reluctant does not speak to their
innocence or guilt, but rather than not wanting to face
the enormity and reality of a life changing event. Some locals,
who spoke on the condition of anonymity, tell me that
Dale was never the same after discovering Margaret's body.
Speaker 6 (14:19):
I am a single man, eighteen years of age, and
I was that to my parents.
Speaker 3 (14:22):
However, I did obtain the signed statement Dale provided to detectives.
At five point fifty pm on February eleventh, nineteen seventy eight,
the then eighteen year old Stockman described his connection to Margaret.
Speaker 6 (14:37):
I knew her for a period of six weeks. I
first met her at a home with Serena Betrode. There
a man named who was going steady with her at
the time. During the six weeks, I visited her home
on a number of occasions. I knew that she was
living apart from her husband. He was at the residence
when I first started to go down to the house.
Speaker 3 (14:56):
So who's We'll discuss more about him in a later episode.
Back to Dale.
Speaker 6 (15:03):
During the times that they visited Kirstenfeldt at.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
According to his statement, he was known to visit Margaret
at her home occasionally they had drinks together, but he
denied ever having sexual relations with her. On the afternoon
of her death, he told police they went fishing about
one point thirty or two pm before he dropped her
at home around three point thirty. He then saw her
(15:28):
around seven pm at a little cafe known as the
Pie Cart, where Margaret worked behind the counter. He chatted
to her briefly before heading off again.
Speaker 6 (15:39):
I went to my girlfriend's place, Margaret Hollis. I stayed
at to about ten forty pm. I then mode my
Honda motorcycle to Beatroy Samana to check out on Kurstenfeldt
make sure that she was all right. She had Tommy
previously that she was worried about a prowler around her house.
I rode my motorcycle past Kirstenfeldt's house and I noticed
that the fund doors open and there was lights on.
(15:59):
Turned and went back and parked on the footpath outside
her house. I saw something on the lawn of the
house next door to Kerstenfeldts, and then I saw that
there was, in fact Margaret Kurstenfeldt.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
Dale says he knocked on the door of Margaret's neighbor's house,
but there was no one home. He then rode to
the Serena police station just eight hundred meters away, but
no one was there. He phoned police, but there was
no answer, so he phoned the ambulance instead. Dale then
(16:32):
returned to Margaret's body to wait for paramedics. When he
got there, a police car was passing, so he hailed
it down He remained at the scene until the body
was removed. I've tried to track down detectives involved in
this case. Some have spoken to me for the podcast,
some declined, and others have died. One of the key
(16:55):
investigators involved with this case passed away in twenty fourteen.
Detective Sergeant Hassenkham finished his investigation report for the coroner
on April eighteen, nineteen seventy eight. I managed to obtain
a copy of the report, which is based on witness
statements and interviews, scientific evidence from the crime scene, and
(17:17):
Margaret's autopsy.
Speaker 7 (17:26):
The body of the deceased was lying on the ground,
face down, with the head inclined to the right and
facing in a westerly direction. The right arm was completely
under the body, whilst the left arm was extended alongside
the body with the palm facing upwards. The legs were
straight and fairly close together. The buttocks and private parts
were exposed and visible because of the short mini dress
(17:49):
in which the body was clothed and the fact that
no panties were worn. In addition to the red colored frock,
the body was clothed in a bra. There was evidence
of a large insane wound to the front of the throat,
a wound under the chin. Almost the entire body and
clothing were heavily bloodstained. The grass was of reasonably long
(18:10):
buffalo cooch grass, and there were bloodstains on the grass,
and a trail of blood could be followed to the
front steps of the deceased residence, up the steps and
to the front door. Initially, it was agreed that the
death of the deceased was as a consequence of murder,
and immediate investigations were commenced with that thought in mind.
Speaker 3 (18:31):
Detective Sergeant Hassenkham's report details how measurements and photos were
taken of the body and area, and that an inspection
was carried out in the house.
Speaker 7 (18:43):
Limited access was given and nothing was touched or disturbed.
I gave instructions that security be maintained in order that
technical experts could make a thorough examination at a later stage.
Speaker 3 (18:56):
Detective Sergeant Hassencam then writes about items found inside my
Margaret's house and the blood.
Speaker 7 (19:03):
The blood trail, which led up the front stairs, extended
through the sleep out to the main bedroom, where it
was noted that the double bed therein was heavily bloodstained.
The two sheets which were on the bed were both
saturated with blood. More towards the head of the bed,
two pillows on the bed were heavily stained with blood.
It appeared that blood had penetrated both mattresses which were
(19:26):
on the bed. Blood stains were evident on the floor
on both sides of the bed, and on the wall
on the left side of the bed and on the
wall near the bedroom door, there was a large knife
with a serrated edge lying on a book near the
foot of the bed. The knife was blood stained, and
there was a blood stained tea towel or what appears
to be such, wrapped around the handle of the knife.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
His report suggests that there was no signs of a
struggle in the bedroom or the lounge or the kitchen
of Margaret's home. In the bedroom, on the the right
side of the bed were a pair of women's bikini
style underwear in an unusual rolled position, as if they
had been rolled down over Margaret's thighs. In the kitchen sink,
(20:12):
amongst the dirty dishes a large carving knife with a
serrated edge, which was heavily blood stained. A quantity of
fair to brown hair was stuck to the blade of
the knife. Detective Sergeant Hassenham also knighted on the sink
a pair of scissors seemingly blood stained, with the tip
of each blade broken off, but the detective was confused
(20:36):
about something he didn't find.
Speaker 7 (20:39):
I was surprised to find no blood between the main
bedroom and the kitchen. This gave me a further indication
that the deceased had probably been murdered. I kept the
fact there was no blood in the kitchen area firmly
in mind for some considerable time. I will point out
the significance of this fact later in this report.
Speaker 3 (21:00):
Detective Sergeant Hassenham was also the opinion that a cut
under Margaret's chin had not been made with either of
the bloodstained knives found in her home, that it was
a result of a fall or having been hit with
a blunt object. Next time a family left shattered, I
(21:27):
would say I would have been the main suspect. The
radio rumors abound and.
Speaker 1 (21:34):
It was talk of it down for weeks after everybody's
surmise and who might have done it?
Speaker 3 (21:41):
But was it murder? If you have information about the
(22:08):
Margaret Kirstenfeld case, please let us know. Email us at
Pendulum podcasts at gmail dot com or go to sevenews
dot com dot au. Forward Slash Pendulum presenter and executive
(22:31):
producer Paula Donovan, writer and producer Sally Eels, Sound design
Mark Wright, Graphics, Jason Blandford, Transcripts Susan Bush. Our theme
music is the Clock Is Ticking by dark Org Music.
(22:56):
See our show notes for full music credits. With thanks
to seven Years Brisbane
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