Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Can I start this conversation by saying that, please? I
am so respectful and if I get the pronouns wrong,
it's not with intent, yes, because I find sometimes I
slip back into old habits and I don't want to
offend anyone. So let me just start this conversation by
saying that. Okay, Because last month Ben Affleck and Jennifer
(00:22):
Ghana were celebrating Ghana's father's memorial and their kids were there,
and one of their children, who was born Sara Fina,
got up and did a little sort of reading from
the Bible because now they are identifying.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
As Finn as Finn.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Okay, listen, this is it. Hello.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
My name is Fan Affleck. I'm reading verse eight Proverbs,
Chapter sixteen, Verse eight. Better is a little with righteousness
than large income within justice? How old is finn?
Speaker 1 (00:55):
Fifteen fifteen? Now this comes just today, and I think
it was yesterday, maybe it was the before. Naomi Watts
went to a fashion parade in New York with her
child who was born Samuel and now identifies as Kia
Kia okay, and was like just looked exactly like Naomi.
What's to be? Really?
Speaker 2 (01:16):
Absolutely and same age like around no.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
Older, I think, in sort of the mid twenties. So
I thought, that's unusual that we now got these two
very famous people and both of them. You know, in
the world of online is about transgender and non binary kids.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Did you mention Jennifer Lopez as well. She's with Ben Affleck.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
Yes, so she has twins born, Max and Emmy, and
now Emmy is non binary. And actually I'm not sure
what name Emy goes under now, But so I went
on a bit of a search, and there are a
lot of people, there are a lot of celebrities kids
are either transitioning or class themselves as non binary. So
Challes Theron's right, Yeah, adopted son Jackson goes under them.
(02:01):
Jamie Lee Curtis sur Sur's that was like, that's been decade,
long time ago, in a long time, Sigourney Weaver Andette
Benning and Warren Baby.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
This seems disproportionate to the rest of society. It feels
like there's a lot more actors, entertainers kids, doesn't it.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
I don't know, because when I was thinking about it,
I mean, maybe it's just now more socially acceptable, so
people don't feel like they have to hide this sort
of stuff. But I know. In fact, I had a
conversation yesterday with a girlfriend who I went to school with,
whose niece has now said that she wants to transition.
First said it at the age of fourteen and is
(02:41):
now twenty okay, And you know, as families, they all
freaked out and said, can we wait, can we wait?
Can we wait? I also know of a child in
a daycare where the child's four or five and categorically
born a girl, but refuses point blank to be anything
other than referred to as boy.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Yeah, RAFFI, My little boy's got a friend who is
a boy and dresses and looks completely like a girl.
And it's interesting because I I mistakenly said, oh, who's
that girl, and he said, no, that's a boy. He
just looks like a girl.
Speaker 1 (03:16):
Yeah, because kids and very literal in take. And I mean,
you know, society is going that way. But I it
does make me think about just when we were growing up,
maybe there were so many people who were conflicted and
just never had the opportunity because could you imagine, I
mean seriously, could you imagine in you know, when we're
at school. You know, now now schools have policies, now,
(03:38):
now kids are being able to kind of navigate their
way through life however they wanted.
Speaker 2 (03:43):
It was when I was at school, it was hard enough.
I think there's a couple of guys that were that
were clearly gay, and I think it was hard enough
for them, let alone trans like that's that's now. I
think that's next level. The funny, the interesting thing in
my life. I know two two women, ones that teenager,
one is now in their twenties, who wanted to transition.
(04:05):
The teenager, like your friends, family said can you please wait?
Can you please just wait? And they waited a year
and actually went, well, I did not want to transition,
Like they completely changed their mind. So they dressed like
a boy for quite a long time and then went
and now is just a regular woman walking around and
did not transition and sort of looks back and goes,
(04:28):
I don't know what I was thinking. The other is
a person in their twenties who went through a number
of steps towards the surgery and then got to a
certain level and went, actually, no, I'm going.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
Back, And could they go back?
Speaker 2 (04:42):
They were able to because they got to a point
that yeah, so, but not without complications, Like it's been
a nightmare for them.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
But all of this is a nightmare. Can imagine. I
mean if Raffi, for example, that four and a half
is living conflicted, you wouldn't want that for your child.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
Yeah, I've got a lot of sympathy for parents that
are going through that. I do feel very blessed knowing
that Raffie is showing all signs of being a boy
and wanting very much to be a boy and that,
you know, I don't know if that makes me bad,
but I'm very relieved. I'm very relieved that's that he's
not confused at all.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
Yeah, but I think that relief is also about the
fact that we don't want our children to be in
pain regardless.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
Yes, do you know? And it would be the process
And actually the person in their twenties that stopped doing
it was actually one of the reasons stopping the process
was pain. Was like the actual physical pain of going
through that surgery and things like that, like it's it's
not just a decision. And then it's changing the way
you dress, like there's.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
Oh no, well, I mean, if you want to transition
from female to male, you've got to remove your breasts.
Like there's all kinds of surgeries that can happen.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
I know a plastic surgeon. I made of mind is
a plastic surgeon. And he he said, like, I've seen
him at the pub and he's gone, oh, I made
a penis today, Oh wow. And had a person who
went in as took the big muscle out of their forearm.
You know you've got a big sort of there's a
big sort of thick muscle in their forearm.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
Can we talk to this person?
Speaker 2 (06:10):
I reckon, yeah, yeah, and he turned that's the muscle
they turned into a penis.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
What happens to your forearm?
Speaker 2 (06:17):
Well, then that's the that's the flip side is. Then
your forearm looks nice and slender like a lady.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
What about the other forearm? You don't need two penises?
Speaker 2 (06:25):
Yes, well then you look like Popeye. You've got one one.
Bo I don't know what they do?
Speaker 1 (06:30):
Talk to it to your friend? Do you reckon?
Speaker 2 (06:31):
You will? I think so? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (06:33):
I find that absolutely fascinating. And you know how to anyway? Yeah,
I don't have one of those things, but let's find
out how to make a penis next.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Sure,
Can I start this conversation by saying that, please? I
am so respectful and if I get the pronouns wrong,
it's not with intent, yes, because I find sometimes I
slip back into old habits and I don't want to
offend anyone. So let me just start this conversation by
saying that. Okay, Because last month Ben Affleck and Jennifer
(00:22):
Ghana were celebrating Ghana's father's memorial and their kids were there,
and one of their children, who was born Sara Fina,
got up and did a little sort of reading from
the Bible because now they are identifying.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
As Finn as Finn.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
Okay, listen, this is it. Hello.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
My name is Fan Affleck. I'm reading verse eight Proverbs,
Chapter sixteen, Verse eight. Better is a little with righteousness
than large income within justice? How old is finn?
Speaker 1 (00:55):
Fifteen fifteen? Now this comes just today, and I think
it was yesterday, maybe it was the before. Naomi Watts
went to a fashion parade in New York with her
child who was born Samuel and now identifies as Kia
Kia okay, and was like just looked exactly like Naomi.
What's to be? Really?
Speaker 2 (01:16):
Absolutely and same age like around no.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
Older, I think, in sort of the mid twenties. So
I thought, that's unusual that we now got these two
very famous people and both of them. You know, in
the world of online is about transgender and non binary kids.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Did you mention Jennifer Lopez as well. She's with Ben Affleck.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
Yes, so she has twins born, Max and Emmy, and
now Emmy is non binary. And actually I'm not sure
what name Emy goes under now, But so I went
on a bit of a search, and there are a
lot of people, there are a lot of celebrities kids
are either transitioning or class themselves as non binary. So
Challes Theron's right, Yeah, adopted son Jackson goes under them.
(02:01):
Jamie Lee Curtis sur Sur's that was like, that's been decade,
long time ago, in a long time, Sigourney Weaver Andette
Benning and Warren Baby.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
This seems disproportionate to the rest of society. It feels
like there's a lot more actors, entertainers kids, doesn't it.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
I don't know, because when I was thinking about it,
I mean, maybe it's just now more socially acceptable, so
people don't feel like they have to hide this sort
of stuff. But I know. In fact, I had a
conversation yesterday with a girlfriend who I went to school with,
whose niece has now said that she wants to transition.
First said it at the age of fourteen and is
(02:41):
now twenty okay, And you know, as families, they all
freaked out and said, can we wait, can we wait?
Can we wait? I also know of a child in
a daycare where the child's four or five and categorically
born a girl, but refuses point blank to be anything
other than referred to as boy.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Yeah, RAFFI, My little boy's got a friend who is
a boy and dresses and looks completely like a girl.
And it's interesting because I I mistakenly said, oh, who's
that girl, and he said, no, that's a boy. He
just looks like a girl.
Speaker 1 (03:16):
Yeah, because kids and very literal in take. And I mean,
you know, society is going that way. But I it
does make me think about just when we were growing up,
maybe there were so many people who were conflicted and
just never had the opportunity because could you imagine, I
mean seriously, could you imagine in you know, when we're
at school. You know, now now schools have policies, now,
(03:38):
now kids are being able to kind of navigate their
way through life however they wanted.
Speaker 2 (03:43):
It was when I was at school, it was hard enough.
I think there's a couple of guys that were that
were clearly gay, and I think it was hard enough
for them, let alone trans like that's that's now. I
think that's next level. The funny, the interesting thing in
my life. I know two two women, ones that teenager,
one is now in their twenties, who wanted to transition.
(04:05):
The teenager, like your friends, family said can you please wait?
Can you please just wait? And they waited a year
and actually went, well, I did not want to transition,
Like they completely changed their mind. So they dressed like
a boy for quite a long time and then went
and now is just a regular woman walking around and
did not transition and sort of looks back and goes,
(04:28):
I don't know what I was thinking. The other is
a person in their twenties who went through a number
of steps towards the surgery and then got to a
certain level and went, actually, no, I'm going.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
Back, And could they go back?
Speaker 2 (04:42):
They were able to because they got to a point
that yeah, so, but not without complications, Like it's been
a nightmare for them.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
But all of this is a nightmare. Can imagine. I
mean if Raffi, for example, that four and a half
is living conflicted, you wouldn't want that for your child.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
Yeah, I've got a lot of sympathy for parents that
are going through that. I do feel very blessed knowing
that Raffie is showing all signs of being a boy
and wanting very much to be a boy and that,
you know, I don't know if that makes me bad,
but I'm very relieved. I'm very relieved that's that he's
not confused at all.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
Yeah, but I think that relief is also about the
fact that we don't want our children to be in
pain regardless.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
Yes, do you know? And it would be the process
And actually the person in their twenties that stopped doing
it was actually one of the reasons stopping the process
was pain. Was like the actual physical pain of going
through that surgery and things like that, like it's it's
not just a decision. And then it's changing the way
you dress, like there's.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
Oh no, well, I mean, if you want to transition
from female to male, you've got to remove your breasts.
Like there's all kinds of surgeries that can happen.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
I know a plastic surgeon. I made of mind is
a plastic surgeon. And he he said, like, I've seen
him at the pub and he's gone, oh, I made
a penis today, Oh wow. And had a person who
went in as took the big muscle out of their forearm.
You know you've got a big sort of there's a
big sort of thick muscle in their forearm.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
Can we talk to this person?
Speaker 2 (06:10):
I reckon, yeah, yeah, and he turned that's the muscle
they turned into a penis.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
What happens to your forearm?
Speaker 2 (06:17):
Well, then that's the that's the flip side is. Then
your forearm looks nice and slender like a lady.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
What about the other forearm? You don't need two penises?
Speaker 2 (06:25):
Yes, well then you look like Popeye. You've got one one.
Bo I don't know what they do?
Speaker 1 (06:30):
Talk to it to your friend? Do you reckon?
Speaker 2 (06:31):
You will? I think so? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (06:33):
I find that absolutely fascinating. And you know how to anyway? Yeah,
I don't have one of those things, but let's find
out how to make a penis next.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Sure,
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!