October 7, 2025 • 45 mins
Retiring early is the ultimate dream... so when Brooke casually dropped that she’s on track to do it by 35 (without the Bank of Mum and Dad), you all screamed a collective “HOW?!”
So of course, Victoria had to get her back in the studio to spill everything... and more importantly, share what the rest of us can steal from her strategy without living on two-minute noodles. Turns out, it’s not magic, she started on a $50K salary and built it dollar by dollar with smart habits, steady investing, and a money plan that’s more about options than obsession. Think of this as your crash course in Financial Independence, Retire Early (FIRE) for people who still love a little bit of fun money. Because the real flex isn’t retiring early, it’s having the kind of financial independence that lets you choose what your dream life looks like.
Inside this ep:
📈 What a “FIRE number” actually is (and how to figure out yours)
📈 Why “Barista FIRE” could be the soft-life version of early retirement
📈 Super vs shares: how to choose the smarter move for your future
📈 Mindset shifts that totally changed the game for her
📈 The small money systems Brooke swears by (and how to copy them)
📈 Why even a 1% change in your savings rate can shift your whole future
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Acknowledgement of Country By Nartarsha Bamblett aka Queen Acknowledgements.
The advice shared on She's On The Money is general in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's On The Money exists purely for educational purposes and should not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision. If you do choose to buy a financial product, read the PDS, TMD and obtain appropriate financial advice tailored towards your needs. Victoria Devine and She's On The Money are authorised representatives of Money Sherpa PTY LTD ABN - 321649 27708, AFSL - 451289.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
My name is Tatasha Bamblet. I'm a proud First Nations
woman and I'm here to acknowledge country t glennyan Ganya, Niana,
Kaka yah Ya bin Ahaka Nian our gay in Nimbina,
yakarum jar Dominyama, Umagahawakaman, damon imlan Bimba ban Gadabomba in
and now in wakah ghana on yak rum jar Watnadaa. Hello,
(00:22):
beautiful friends, we gather on the lands of the Aboriginal people.
We thank acknowledge and respect the Aberiginal people's land that
we're gathering on today. Take pleasure in all the land
and respect all that you see. She's on the Money
podcast acknowledges culture, country, community and connections, bringing you the tools,
knowledge and resources for you to thrive.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
She's on the Money. She's on the Money.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
Hello and welcome to She's on the Money, the podcast
that's here to show you that investing isn't just for
the rich, it is for you too. When we add
She's on the Money team member Brooks Investing Diary. Something
she said basically broke the Internet or our DMS. At least,
she revealed that her investing strategy has her on track
to retire at the age of thirty five. Yes, thirty five.
(01:33):
She doesn't have that long until thirty five, you I have.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Heaps of time. What do you mean. I'm very I'm
twenty seven. That's recent, that's news. I know she was twenty,
So happy birthday. Happy birthday.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
She didn't win the lottery though, which is kind of
low key crazy given you're still Actually we don't.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Know yet because I bought a ticket for last night,
so we don't know right well, we COULDBC if she does.
Speaker 4 (01:55):
Will let you know. You didn't have a secret inheritance.
Speaker 3 (01:58):
You didn't grow up rich Sadly, Brook has built her
portfolio step by step, following really clear rules and making
smart money moves consistently over a long period of time.
There's been no massive investment, there's been no big lump
sum of money. It's been dollar for dollar. I'm Victoria Devine.
I'm a retired financial advisor who is wildly passionate about
(02:21):
getting more women just like you to start building wealth
through investing. And after the response we got from her
last episode, I thought it was only the right thing
to get Brooke back in the studio and back on
the show Brook Welcome back.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
Hello friends, Are you excited to do you back?
Speaker 5 (02:37):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (02:37):
It does feel a bit random. Usually I edit the
videos of this podcast, so it's weird to edit videos
of myself.
Speaker 4 (02:42):
I was about to say, do you enjoy editing the
videos in myself? It's gross.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
It's actually way more fun to edit you guys, because
I don't know what you're going to say, Whereas like
when I'm editing myself, I know what I said, and
I'm like, oh, did I sound stupid? So if I did,
just don't.
Speaker 4 (02:54):
Worry ignore it.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
I can't edit videos of myself. I can't really get
them back to the podcast because I'm like, ill, who
is that?
Speaker 2 (03:00):
I can actually like, do your voice in my head?
Speaker 4 (03:02):
Stop it. You don't want that. You don't want that.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
Look, we need to rewind to the moment in your
investing diary that I guess everyone was like, wait, what
the hell you said? Very casually, I might add, oh, yeah, like,
if I keep investing the way that I am, I'll
just be able to retire by the age of thirty five. Yep,
And like I already kind of knew that, so that
wasn't shocking to me. But like, God, that is kind
(03:25):
of shocking.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
And now for anyone who's maybe listening to this and
heard that in thought, sorry, what Brookie, you just like
manifesting this like you're just hoping to retire by thirty five? Like,
what's the actual investing strategy behind this? Can you tell
us a little bit more about why that number and
how that's actually going to work?
Speaker 2 (03:45):
Yep. So it's this concept called financial independence retire Earlier,
or the fire movement. And I probably discovered this twenty
seventeen and I found it on Reddit, and it's all
these people that are buying index ones and ETFs and
they're increasing their savings right, which is really important. We'll
touch on it later. But they're increasing their savings rate
to be well above the amount they're spending and investing
(04:08):
the rest. So they're trying to live on as little
money as possible, so they can invest pretty much all
of their income early on and then slowly as they
get older. Some people increase how much they spend, but
who cares. They can retire really early because they're living
expenses are low, and they've got an investment portfolio that's
going to produce more money than they're going to spend.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
I feel like this takes significant sacrifice, but I also
feel like you don't sacrifice your life that much. Do
you really resonate with that financial independence early, save every
single dollar or are you a little bit more lax
with it than most.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
Well, in the beginning, I did. I literally have this
fear that tomorrow I'll be homeless. I just never think
that I will have enough money to survive, and I
always worry about that. So when I first started investing,
I did try to save heaps and heaps and heaps
of money and definitely sacrifice a lot. And then now
as I've got older and I've got a second income,
(05:02):
I sacrificed less because I put my entire second income
into investing. So now I feel like I can spend
a little bit more and stress less, but I still
keep my savings right really really really high.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
I feel like you're also to give people a little
bit more context. I wouldn't say that you're an impulsive shopper. No,
Like that's not something. Is that something you've ever experienced?
Speaker 2 (05:25):
No, I like definitely like spend money, Like I'm not silly,
but like my goal for this year was to buy
one item, like one item of clothing or like beauty
or anything a month. So that was like I could
only buy one item twelve things for the year, and
I've kept on track, except I did buy I think
one or two extra things, but that were my birthday
gifts to myself, which is like.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
I feel like that's fine, it's fine, and like, you know,
you could reframe this and be like, well, I wasn't
more to go.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
I could have been I'm not buying them new Like
I'm a deep Hop addict. I spent every day on Deepop,
even for my little friend Georgia. I find Georgia Deepop
finds too, so it's like I'm not like I bought
this jumper off Deepop. This is my item for July
and originally one hundred and thirty dollars and I got
a brand new with tags for forty, so that is
a money win.
Speaker 3 (06:08):
I feel like I love talking about this side of
things because I think a lot of people just assume
that this type of lifestyle involves serious sacrifice and you
feel like you're missing out. But I think it's about
really reframing.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Like it's not missing outcause I'm helping future me.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
No, and we laugh a lot because it's kind of
like peak consumerism, Like we laugh about the la booboo,
like we think it's a like cost of living crisis indicator.
Speaker 4 (06:33):
Have you bought a la booboo?
Speaker 5 (06:35):
No?
Speaker 2 (06:35):
I do think about all the time. I wanted to
get a little boobo on the work card because I
couldn't just spart on my own gup.
Speaker 4 (06:39):
But she's just gonna put on my card.
Speaker 5 (06:40):
No.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
No, I was going to do it for a video
for the She's and the money TikTok. But they've not
become available. So unless we find a supplier, we won't
be getting a lat boobo. But I thought the would
want a latle boobo.
Speaker 3 (06:48):
We're not investing in la booboos. We are investing in ETF. Yes,
when you found this on Reddit, what made you go
far out? That's for me and I guess how did
it shift the way that you about money and investing?
Speaker 4 (07:01):
Like, what were you doing before you discovered fire?
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Well, I wasn't really investing, like that was part of
the beginning of my investing journey. The first time I
found out about investing was through someone at work, and
then I went home and googled a bunch of stuff
and then found the fire subreddit. And the reason it
stuck out to me was because there were very average people.
At this time, I was earning fifty thousand dollars a year,
so I wasn't earning good money, and I didn't think
I could work forever because no one does. And they
(07:25):
were all average people, investing most of their income and
then retiring at like an earlier age than normal. Some
people in their thirty some people in their forty, some
people in their fifties. And I thought, oh my god,
these are normal people doing this. Why can't I? And
a lot of them were American, and I could. And
the good thing is a lot of these people were
explaining how they did it, and I looked at that
and I thought, actually, that's a one off. And then
(07:47):
I read some more and it wasn't a one off,
and I was like.
Speaker 4 (07:49):
It's actually a legitimate strategy.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
It's a legitimate thing. And I thought, okay, well, if
the kind of idea that I found was you need
to increase your savings rate, so lower your fixedis spence
is right, and how much you're spending every week, and
increase savings rate as much as possible so that you
can be like investing more than your earning. So my
original goal was to get my savings right up to
thirty percent. And then once I did that, I was like, okay, well,
(08:12):
now what can I do? And I notoriously don't really drink.
I stopped drinking like five years ago, and I did
dorink for five years. So I saved so much money
than the average person because everyone's sending two to ThReD
dollars a week going out drinking and I wasn't so
that money I was investing. So then I was say, hey,
well my saving rate is going to go from thirty
percent to forty percent and then fifty percent and.
Speaker 4 (08:31):
So on to try what is your what do you reckon?
Your saving rate is?
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Now have exact figure. I did the maths for you
guys last night.
Speaker 3 (08:37):
I think I was going to ask you about this
a little bit later in the show, but like you're
corregation need to know now.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
So my savings right, well my essential spending, So like
my rent, my I give myself six years fun money.
I give myself money to go out for dinner with
my boyfriend and we love eating, so that's.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
That eating is like central, that's our sport. It's not
just like you guys, though. I feel like everybody in
the Shees on the Money team loves eatings and for Georgia, Yes,
in Georgia, who are just yeah, but like their chicken
nugget kids, and we kind of have we we love.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
Them because then we can go out for something enough,
no one's stealing our food. I'm getting the scallops and
I'm also getting scallops and everyone else is not. But
that's okay.
Speaker 4 (09:14):
We believe them. They love the bread.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
My essential expenses come to thirty one percent of my
income thirty one point eight eight and my savings right
at the moment, as of last night is sixty eight
point one two per day, and that's fully automated, so
none of the money I can touch. Like I get
paid monthly, so we get you're welcome. I get paid monthly,
but I pay myself weekly, so I'm one month ahead
in my judge at all times. So we get paid
(09:39):
on the fifteenth. But every Friday, I pay myself, so
I give I do Thursday. Why do you pick Friday
because we typically well, I give myself Friday so that
on the weekend I have money, because then I won't
give into my savings. So on Friday, it's my coffe day.
So my boyfriend, I take Jones. He on a Thursday
go to get a coffee. On a Friday, I get paid,
get up in the water and go get a coffee.
And then I have on Saturday and Sunday to spend
(09:59):
my money. And and really, if I spend all my
money on those days, I've got to suffer till Friday
because I cannot touch my savings.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
I try to see that's my mentality.
Speaker 3 (10:07):
But I think a lot of people are listening to
this and they're like, that feels really restrictive. For me,
it feels really freeing because I'm kind of like I
don't have to think about the big picture. I'm not
thinking about whether my bills are paid or whatever.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
It's aulated if I've.
Speaker 3 (10:22):
Blown all my money on a Sunday brunchf and it
means that I can't have, you know, a cheeky croissant
or something that I might go, oh, I deserve a
sweet treat. Sorry, you can't afford a sweet treat, Victoria
Like it's not in the budget. Yeah, And I think
a lot of people just go and please don't get
me wrong, I do clearly have a good income, but
the way that I manage my money is on such
(10:42):
a week to week basis that I've allocated that amount.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
You pay yourself first.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
Yeah, I'm kind of low key in my head. I'm like,
I can't afford that, Like, that's not in my budget.
Speaker 2 (10:50):
I try to do my grocery shopping on the Saturday
and Sunday, so then so that you can get the
good stuff. I've already got all of my grocery sorted,
and then Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday. I work from home, so.
Speaker 4 (11:00):
Yeah, that's a good deal for saving money too.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
I cooked dinner, and like I cooked dinner two nights
a week, my way from will cook dinner two nights
a week, and then we'll cook lunches, but we typically
won't go out those days. You might go out for
a lunch on a Friday, we'll go out for lunch
or a dinner on a Saturday or a Sunday. But
the midweek, I'm not really spending any money. I don't
pay for money to commute because I work from home.
And then I have I splurge a little bit with
my Poliities membership, but that is for the mental health.
(11:23):
But my savings rate is pretty high. But I don't
feel like that's going papers full as well.
Speaker 3 (11:28):
And I feel like, yeah, if you're sitting there and
you're listening to brook story and you're like, holy hell,
Like I own one hundred and fifty thousand dollars a
year and there's no way I could do that. I
think for Brook it works because you started from a
low base, and so I'm not saying I.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
Haven't changed my spending couch my first income.
Speaker 3 (11:46):
Yeah, And I think that that's for me because like
I think I've shared enough about my journey where I
got into a whole heap of personal debt and then
I had to get out of it and I had
to change my whole mindset around money and that was
a struggle.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
You've kind of gone debt.
Speaker 3 (11:57):
Yeah, you've gone from low income and like, I can
survive off this amount to every single time, like Brook
is in the perfect position. I would say, every single
time you've gotten a pay rise or a pay increase
that has not gone towards life style creep.
Speaker 2 (12:10):
No. Literally, I'm so jealous. I cannot do it to myself.
Like in my head, I tomorrow if I got knocked
back down to my first salary. My savings rate would differ,
but my living expenses and stuff wouldn't change. I'm not
change any of that. I don't have a new car.
I drive a twenty eleven High and thirty with custom
number plates. But custom number plates I do, they're pretty bougie.
(12:33):
I hate to brag, but I'm scared.
Speaker 3 (12:35):
Of custom number plates because I genuinely don't want people
to like spot my car and be like, Okay, she
can't drive.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
I know that I can't drive, but it's fine, But
like I don't. I don't have a new car. I
don't have a designer bag.
Speaker 4 (12:46):
Every new item a designer bag. You own a Chanelle.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
Oh no, that's my designer bag. It was a thousand dollars. Sorry,
that's a designer bag. Okay, to the record, you have
a Chanel bag, and I can guarantee carrier it's from
my caraer on. It's my carry on. Oh sorry, that
justifies it. Okay, No, this is making me sound out
of such. I saved that it was a vintage Carl Lagerfeld.
Let me tell you, But it's like, no, I don't
go out and buy anything.
Speaker 3 (13:12):
Everything I buy everything to do is thrifitted or art
throwing your under the bus for owning a bag, but like, sorry,
a girl's got to live as well.
Speaker 4 (13:20):
And if that has been on your leg wish list
and I.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
Saved for that, like that was my birthday present to
myself three years ago, and it's my carry on every
single time.
Speaker 4 (13:27):
Remember it was three years ago.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
It was three years ago. And because it's my laptop
bag as well, I could have claimed it on TASS.
I don't think I did, but I should have. I
kind of low key love it.
Speaker 3 (13:38):
All right, let's move back from Chanel bags over to
the fire concept. If you listen to our episode on
how much Super You Actually Need, you'll know that there's
like actually no magic number when it comes to creating
your perfect retirement because your lifestyle and your needs and
your values are completely unique. And you know, if Brooke
and I swapped lifestyles, we'd have to absolutely.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
Reach how to crease budget.
Speaker 3 (14:02):
Well, it's interesting as well because since becoming a mum,
I already shift well yeah, and I've decreased how many
days I'm present in the office, so I now have
Mondays off and I spend them with my son and
that is expensive. Not because we're going out heaps, but
like I end up going to lunch and I go, oh,
I'm stuck in the house.
Speaker 4 (14:20):
You know I've done I've killed it.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
As mental health moment.
Speaker 4 (14:24):
Yeah, and like, sorry, what do you mean? A kid's
toasted his twelve dollars? So most of the time I
pack his little.
Speaker 3 (14:30):
Lunch because he loves a lunch box at this age.
But I'm still going out going to you know what,
I've been at home. I've done all the stuff I'm
going to that's just self care activity. Yeah, And like
I've had to reshift my budget, not just in terms
of what I originally had budgeted for baby, because like
I've done all the maths, right, Like I'd worked out
on averages.
Speaker 4 (14:50):
Is what nappies are going to cost?
Speaker 2 (14:51):
This is what you call my God, it's so didn't
I make so many calculations because until you're in that situation,
you can't. Like my you would change too if I
was in that s.
Speaker 3 (15:01):
The lifestyle stuff, So like I find the budgeting for
the stuff that I can anticipate that's maybe not lifestyle.
So like I knew that every season he's going to
go up a size so like, you know, I did
so much research and so much talking to JGBT and
looking at like Reddit, just because I really wanted to know.
But essentially, your baby will outgrow their clothes every three months.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
That is crazy. Two years pass away at the thought
for the first two years.
Speaker 3 (15:25):
And so I worked out, Okay, well, if that's the case,
how many ones is do you think I'll need every season?
I was psychotic, how many? How many outfits? And like, yeah,
I've blown the budget on that a few times because
I'm like, oh sorry, like my husband, this is so lame.
Speaker 4 (15:40):
But we're going to a wedding in Bali soon and
my husband has this.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
At the Padma.
Speaker 4 (15:44):
Yeah, yeah, Bali at the Padma. Is this going out
after that?
Speaker 2 (15:47):
It'll be September.
Speaker 4 (15:48):
Great, I stayed at the Padma.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
That's a big contentious topic in our office. If you
want to know more, I'll make a TikTok for us.
Speaker 3 (15:55):
Actually, Brooke just straight out told me that that's Bali Bogan.
But guys, when you have a kid, the Padma as
a resort. Sorry, it has a petting zoo, it has
an ice cream cut. You're selling it to your close
to me, and you know what I'm not leaving that
resort with my nearly two year old anyway. With your
Padma review, when we were doing that, I was like, oh, sorry,
(16:15):
I do actually need my husband and son for the
recovery party of this wedding to have matching outfits.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
No, I think that that is an expense that I
would have to approve to. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (16:23):
Fine, but all of those things I think you can
kind of like sort of foresee. But it was like
the mental shift of like, hold on, like I've realized
that on the Monday that my son and I are
at home on our own all day, I actually do
want to go out for lunch. I do want to
go out and get it toasty, and like we're not
talking like super expensive, but like those budget shifts.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Are different a different friend stage or.
Speaker 3 (16:44):
At different life stages, so I think it's important to go, oh,
what's the perfect retirement. I'm well, it's going to look
different for me and different for you because we also
have different lifestyle goals and we live in different states.
Speaker 2 (16:55):
Like if Melbom's notoriously more expensive if you pay for tolls.
I found out the other day how much tolls were,
which is crazy scenes here, but like that's something that's
never going in my budget.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
No, no, And I think that that's where we go
back to this concept of financial independence. Retire early, like
your personal fire number isn't just about hitting like a
million dollars and being like, Okay, well I hit the goal,
or retiring by a certain age. It's about designing a
life that works for you and then building an investment
portfolio that can support that version of freedom. And whether
(17:25):
that's like, you know, really luxury or really minimalist or
like you're like semi retired or something or anything in between. Like,
it's going to look different and you have to work backwards.
So Brook, what version of fire are you currently working towards?
Like once you hit thirty five? Sorry, I need to
know the gritty details.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Why would your lifestyle look like? It depends because I
know that realistically, before the time I hit thirty five,
I'll probably have kids, get married, except I would never
do a big wedding, which why would you do that?
That's so crazy?
Speaker 4 (17:56):
I would never spend lots of there doesn't.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
All like aligned to my values. I'm a kind For
those of you who don't follow me on social media,
which is huge, a significant amount of money on over
right nothing. But to me, I could never justify that.
I would justify loping and spending twenty can a really
sick holiday for me and my part families. I would
just never have a big wedding. It's not mine.
Speaker 4 (18:18):
You like, can I come to the wedding?
Speaker 2 (18:19):
You can't. But that's okay, that's weird.
Speaker 4 (18:21):
Okay, let me.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
Set this boundary here. You won't be attending my single elopement.
This is bullshit. But for me, my fire mentality right
now is I would love to get to two million
by thirty five and then be able to have like
a full eighty thousand year income, which would be a
four percent draw down rate. But I'm realistic that I'm
not going to retire at thirty five because.
Speaker 4 (18:44):
I really will have a number that you want to
which is two millions.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
So that's a work optional then. But I would also
think about doing something called coast fire or barrista fire,
which is where your investing portfolio will give you like
a part time income, so would would be a barista file.
This is my favorite concept. Do georgially talk about this
all the time, which is like you kind of get
to a point where okay, well, I've experienced the corporate
(19:08):
highs and lows. I've enjoyed doing my career and growing that,
but now that doesn't serve me anymore. I want to
do passion projects. I want to do this.
Speaker 4 (19:15):
So you then get into CEO who then becomes yoga teacher.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
Exactly, and you can live on a lower income but
continue to have your lifestyle because your investment portfolio will
prop you up. So say my my Barista fire number
would be one million, one hundred and twenty five thousand dollars,
which would then get me forty five K year income.
Then say I have a fifty K year salary. That
means I'm still earning one hundred and five thousand dollars
a year. Okay, but I'm working a fun job that
(19:40):
I find like, I feel passionate about it. And then
if I wanted to take a little sabbatical and I
wanted to go overseas for a couple of years, I'm
still earning forty five K. So you can coast towards
your fire and now you're still increasing your savings rate
because of that forty five thousand, I still spend like
I spend less than that a year. I spend like
thirty grand a year or something, I would still be
(20:01):
contributing towards my investing fund. So my investments are still
growing as I'm getting closer to that main fire number.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
I love that, and I feel like just knowing your
fire number is only one piece of the puzzle. So
we're going to take a very quick break, and when
we get back, we're going to dive into a little
bit more of the juicy stuff, the strategy and the
things that you need to think about if you actually
want to retire early.
Speaker 4 (20:23):
So guys, don't go anywhere.
Speaker 3 (20:28):
All right, we are back, and it is time to
jump into the strategy that you have behind retiring early.
When most people start their plans for retiring early, say
around like I don't know, sixty five is what people
are like working towards On average, they often work out
a draw down rate of around five percent. You mentioned
that your draw down rate was four percent before, just
(20:50):
for context, and that's because their investment portfolio only needs
to last like twenty or thirty years for them.
Speaker 5 (20:57):
But when you're.
Speaker 3 (20:57):
Planning to retire much earlier, you're in investments actually have
to support you for longer, and that money has to
stretch further, and you need to be a bit more conservative. Yes, Brook,
you mentioned that your draw down rate was four percent
when you calculated your fire number. Why did that draw
down rate make the most sense for you?
Speaker 2 (21:16):
I just try to be as conservative as possible, because
then if I could actually draw down more, that is
a win. A win is a win. I will take that.
I'm always going to base my calculations on the lowest possible,
like obviously it's not the lowest possible, but the most
reasonable and lowest amount, so that then any extra it's
a bonus. Yeah, it's like a little this is your
(21:36):
annual bonus. Great. But if I factored my draw down
rate is like six percent and realistically I could only
draw down four percent, that I would be disappointed. So
if I am low and land.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
High money win. We want to set our expectations to
be exceeded. When I was a financial advisor, I always
did that because I'd always be like, I really want
to impress you, and I'd prefer you to be happy
with me. I'm the promises of a deliver exactly. Now.
You have mentioned that you want to retire at the
age of thirty five, which means that your superannuation actually
can't come into this conversation. Yes, but we will have
(22:10):
that when we turn sixty five and when we're a
little bit older. I want to know that combination because
at the moment your fire number you mentioned two million
dollars that would not be including any super because you
can't touch that. Just because you decided to retire does
not mean that.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
The government gunners. Oh yes you are retired. Yes, good job, Brooke, here,
I have it all early. You've done amazing. Unfortunately, that's
not it.
Speaker 3 (22:31):
And I think that that makes it a little bit
trickier than a traditional retirement because, as I've said time
and time again on the show before, I think superranuation.
Speaker 4 (22:40):
Is the sexiest tax vehicle in existence.
Speaker 3 (22:44):
Like, at the moment, you'd be paying a relatively high
marginal tax rate, but in subranuation you are paying fifteen percent.
That is hot girl shit for most of us, unless like,
and I don't want people coming at me and being like, well,
my cousin accessed his super early. You can in really
extreme circumstances of illness or injury or like.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
I think I'm eligible.
Speaker 4 (23:04):
Yeah no, no, you're just ill.
Speaker 3 (23:06):
But we can't access it until we sixty and then
we can actually draw down on it properly tax free
from sixty five. At this point, I do believe side
note that that retirement age is going to be reset
to probably seventy or seventy two. And the reason for
that is just we are working later and later, and
the government wants to push off retirement age.
Speaker 2 (23:26):
Business saves and money.
Speaker 3 (23:27):
Yeah, it would take significant pressure off the pension system
because they're basically forcing you to work longer. But anyway
back on track, if you're aiming to stop working in
your mid thirties or maybe even closer to forty, you
need a way to fund the next you know, years
between that.
Speaker 4 (23:46):
And this is where the idea of like bridging buckets
comes into it.
Speaker 3 (23:50):
And I think it's that part of the portfolio that's
invested outside of Super and that's designed to cover your
lifestyle until Super becomes available. But tell me, like, have
you actually factored Super into the plow? Are we talking
about that? Because like I do payroll every month and
I'm paying your supers?
Speaker 2 (24:06):
So are youreful for it?
Speaker 4 (24:08):
Yeah? But are you watching it? Are you caring about it?
Speaker 2 (24:10):
I do definitely watch it. It's definitely in my I
track my network every month just because I'm freaking insane.
Speaker 5 (24:15):
I love this.
Speaker 4 (24:15):
Also free network.
Speaker 2 (24:17):
It's not free, it's in the Vestry musk Strace. But
the network track that's in the investing musklass I made.
I was one that I use. Yeah, there we go.
Speaker 4 (24:24):
I was like, it's free hold on a bonus for
our investing muster class.
Speaker 2 (24:28):
I feel that network tracker out every single month because
I like to see it grow. But I do factor
my SUPER in there. But it is not factored into
my fire number at all because obviously the fire you
can't access it. No, and the fire movement started in
America they don't have super. So I've just always not
included it, and I considered that my superannuation is a bonus.
It's like when I reach sixty five, it's a thank you.
Speaker 5 (24:50):
Here you go.
Speaker 4 (24:51):
Do you know, like, what would your SUPER be sitting at?
Speaker 2 (24:54):
Like I'm not it would be in the millions by
the time I get that.
Speaker 3 (24:57):
It's like sitting at a good amount for your age. Yeah,
I'm assuming because you've always.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
Double it's more. Yeah, it's more than double what the
average is. Okay, But I don't conflict see here, No,
I just had I've always worked with. You don't make
additional contract. I don't make any additional contributions because I
really like to have control over my investments, and because
I want to be able to be work optional by
thirty five. I don't like I don't factor that into
my investing. Obviously, I feel grateful to have SUPER, and
(25:23):
if my SUPER was lower than the average, I would
definitely contribute to it. But right now it's not part
of my fire strategy. It's a nice to have when
I turned sixty five, and I hope that that money
will then just be things I could help with my family.
Speaker 3 (25:35):
Yeah, and that's kind of my strategy as well, just
to flip it, because I think people are always like,
well what do you do with your super?
Speaker 4 (25:41):
Victoria?
Speaker 3 (25:42):
And I too, Look, I think we've all heard that.
There's two phrases that come to mind. Here, do as
I say, not as I do? And then the other
one is the plumber always has the leaky tap, right,
And so I've never heard that.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
Have you never heard about the plumber? But no, I
do agree because people that do a job, they don't
necessarily do that for themselves.
Speaker 3 (26:01):
No, And I have always said if you're a small
business owner, like you need to be paying yourself superannuation
and I'm wildly passionate about that, but I also don't
live with the fairies.
Speaker 4 (26:11):
And like, when I first started my business, I'm.
Speaker 3 (26:14):
Sorry, I did keep track of it, Like I knew
what I should be paying myself in SUPER and sometimes.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
It's not realistic to worry.
Speaker 3 (26:20):
I didn't have any cash flow, and the decision, like
Jess we've talked about was my first employee in She's
on the money, completely separate from Zella. But I remember
being like, well, I can't afford to take SUPER if
I'm going to then be paying someone else's SUPER and
actually getting this support in my business. Yeah, and like
there were so many like, yes, you should be paying
super as a small business owner, but also was a
(26:43):
factors Let's be honest, No, I wasn't, but I did
keep track of what I should have been paying myself
in SUPER. And so when people are like, oh, do
you make extra contributions, I'm kind of like, Okay, this
is complicated, because yes, but the reason I do is
to get back up where I need to be and
what I quote in my head, oh myself, not because
I'm trying to bowlk up my super because I would
(27:03):
love for my husband Steve and I to be in
a position ideally by the age of forty. Mine's not
thirty five, because that's next year, by the age of forty,
where we have that financial freedom to go. Actually, let's
just a bashion prop.
Speaker 4 (27:16):
Yeah, and like the way that I have worked that
out is same as you. Like I've gone.
Speaker 3 (27:21):
Okay, our number is x and thankfully we have a
dual income household, so we're both contributing to this.
Speaker 4 (27:27):
No not dinks, double income.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
No kids, you're no kids. I'm not a dinkless with dinkless,
which is really sad.
Speaker 3 (27:34):
I graduated from being a dink what eighteen months a
great turn out of ten can recommend to the graduation,
but not for the financial benefits, because as such there
are none. I have a tiny free loader who basically
he doesn't even need yours, no chores, and all he
does is snack.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
Honestly, if I lived at your house, i'd also snack.
You've got an ice machine to It's fantastic.
Speaker 3 (27:55):
When when I did my baby budgeting, I didn't budget
for the amount of snacks this tiny gremlin demands.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
Yeah, I know that's like, what do you mean?
Speaker 3 (28:05):
And he's a money loss, he's a bottomless pit anyway,
So it's an interesting problem. But we've worked out okay, cool,
well this amount of money, we won't be debt free
at that point, but this amount of miss so we
have mortgages.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
I don't own a home, yeah, so for us, it
won't it look different.
Speaker 3 (28:22):
Yeah, we'll have a financial independent number, but built into
that islage picture of payments and like our living works. Yeah,
and I just I look at it and I go, well,
I don't know what life will look like. I don't
know if like podcasting is going to be successful forever.
Like honestly, that's why I have two separate businesses. I
feel like this is like my fun, shiny one that
hopefully will last for ages, and like, you know, I
(28:44):
love financial literacy, but you never know. And then I
have my more legitimate mortgage broking business, which basically every
piece of income that goes into that gets reinvested into.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
That is the long term business.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (28:55):
So we then have our like investing like or our
retirement number that we could retire at, but we won't
be debt free. And I think that's an important thing
to add because I think a lot of people think
that you'll have to get to your retirement number and
you'll have to be debt free.
Speaker 2 (29:10):
A mortgage by the time, Like obviously I'm looking to
buy a house in the next few years, and by
the time I would reach my fire number, I wouldn't
be using that money to pay down my mortgage. I
would be factoring those mortgage repayments in there. They're my costs,
there are my cost there are my living expenses.
Speaker 3 (29:26):
And I think that that's an important call out because
I think a lot of people, especially in the fire community,
they can be quite aggressive about this, like they want
to be at their retirement number, but also debt free.
Speaker 2 (29:36):
That's because in America housing is heaps cheaper. Like if
I used to go and move to Missouri right now,
I could buy a five bedroom match and for two
hundred thousand dollars and I could pay all cash, you know,
but you can't. It's not realistic. And I think that
that's why it's different market, and that's why it's really
hard with the fire subreddits because most of them are American.
Speaker 3 (29:52):
And that's why I was like, I really want to
point out that, like stiff. I'm also working towards this.
I think it would be a miss to not mention
that I'm actually going to be debt. I'm going to
still be in a lot of debt for our mortgage.
But I'm actually low key fine with that because like,
it's in your plan, it's in the plan. It's just
it's our housing cost. And even if we didn't have
a primary principal place of residence.
Speaker 4 (30:12):
Yeah, whatever we call it.
Speaker 3 (30:14):
So there are lots of different strategies, both internationally and
in Australia that people are using to reach their fire number.
I think some of them really focus on capital growth.
And if you've listened to other episodes with Brooke and I,
we both love Warren Buffett and like kind of subscribe
to his investing methodologies, but we also differ a little
bit in that my yeah, my priorities when picking my
(30:37):
investments are more dividend yield and like you know, balanced
with performance, whereas you're like, just shoot lights out, I
want more performance.
Speaker 4 (30:44):
I don't give you.
Speaker 3 (30:45):
Rats about your didend your dividends. So everybody has a
different strategy, which means building a portfolio looks in a
different way, and that's okay. But the idea is that
every single one of a building a portfolio that increases
in value over time so that we can eventually live
(31:07):
off either the dividends from our investments or for some
people start selling off our investments and living off.
Speaker 2 (31:13):
That without raw down right.
Speaker 5 (31:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (31:15):
And I think some other people, like as we're saying,
they really focus on income producing assets like me, But
I'm not an income producing assets early in the investment
property space, Like I think a lot of people go, oh,
I could buy a rental property. That's fine, that could
be part of your strategy, but that's actually not my
circus nor my monkeys. I don't want to be someone's landlord.
(31:38):
I don't think I've shared a lot about that, but like,
over time, I've just realized that's that journey. It's not
my journey. I just feel like that's not for me,
and that's okay, but it is for other people.
Speaker 2 (31:49):
Brook.
Speaker 3 (31:49):
I want to talk a little bit about when you're
building your portfolio with this fire methodology in mind, are you,
like we've talked about it a little bit in that
you're just after growth shares at this point in time,
but like, how does that strategy impact the ETF so
or the investments that you ultimately pick.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
I think because when I first started investing, I was
like really young, I was in my early twenties. And my,
when you read all of these things, and I have
read literally every investing book on the market.
Speaker 3 (32:20):
I literally just like backtrack. I literally paid her to
do that, to make Oh my god, we did so fun.
We did not miss a bloody beat in our investing
master class.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
Sorry, I spent like three months working on that.
Speaker 4 (32:32):
I was like, day in date, we can't have all
these other investor what if we miss something that.
Speaker 2 (32:37):
Yeah, it needed to be perfect. And I think I
learned a lot in that, and even in my early
twenties that I'm welcome.
Speaker 4 (32:43):
So I basically paid you to get a financial education.
Speaker 2 (32:45):
I know I would love to get a degree. So
if you want to pay for that, true, I'll just
draw like me. You'll get Georgian and make one and Adobe.
Speaker 1 (32:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
I learned that I have so much time for risk.
So my strategy when I first started investing was high growth,
high risk, because I have time for the market to
go up, I have time for the market to go down,
and I want to buy at every stage of that.
I want to buy it when I said it's highest,
I want to buy it when it's that it's lowest.
I want to be buying it every single week. So
my strategy from the beginning was to buy. I didn't
(33:15):
care about dividends, high growth investments, and ETFs that were
just high risk. I was happy with the risk. Everything
was diversified and risky, but I wanted to make sure
that I was getting at least ten percent return every year.
Obviously that's averaged out over ten years. But now I
look at my portfolio and I've been investing consistently since
twenty eighteen, twenty nineteen, and my strategy really hasn't changed.
(33:40):
Obviously I've added in more ETFs, in more index funds,
and some direct shares, but I really don't factor them in.
My average return since twenty eighteen twenty nineteen, which was
like six or seven years, is I'm up thirteen point
seven nine per sex. Yes see, that's good, which is
really good. So like, my strategy is currently working for me,
and I'm still picking chairs and ETFs that a ligne
(34:03):
in that sort of space. But as I get older,
as I near closer to that fire number, obviously I
will probably change the way that I invest because I
don't want as risky options when I am actually beginning
to draw down, I only want I'm not caring as
much about the return.
Speaker 3 (34:18):
Yes, and like going back to my financial advisor career,
that was very true of all of our clients.
Speaker 4 (34:26):
So like the clients that I had that were your age,
they were very, very risky.
Speaker 3 (34:29):
And the older you get, the more capital stable you're
looking for because you just don't have the time ahead
of you. Like if you're like sixty and you're like Victoria,
I'm here, got my super I've got my investments. I'm
ready to start like gearing up to retire in five years.
I'm not looking at you know, high growth, high yield funds.
I'm looking at capital stable investments to really stabilize what
(34:50):
you have built and essentially lock it in, Like I
want to lock and load what you have got, because
I don't want you to feel those ebbs and flows
so much once you are retired, because once you're retired,
you want consistency. You want consistency and you want to
know that you can trust it. And I would prefer
you to at that stage switch not everything like this
(35:11):
is probably a little bit dramatic, but we're switching to going, okay, cool,
we've got our five percent or our four percent draw
down rate. I actually just want to be able to
lock that in for you so that every single year
you can go, no, I know, I will have an
income of eighty thousand dollars or fifty or whatever.
Speaker 2 (35:26):
It's less about growing that capital.
Speaker 3 (35:28):
Yeah, it's less about the capital increasing. It's more about
having a consistent income. Because right now, if your portfolio
is performing one year thirteen percent, the next year it
could do negative five. And that's okay because it doesn't
matterfy now. But imagine if you don't work. Imagine if
you were like, okay, cool, I'm banking on this eighty
grand coming in, and then the year after it's like, sorry, you're.
Speaker 2 (35:49):
Put down here twenty percent and you get nothing.
Speaker 4 (35:51):
You lost something. You also can't afford to draw down.
Speaker 2 (35:54):
On that, Like, then your life's soffix.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
Yeah, And I feel like we just want stability at
that point. So when you are a bit younger and
you can ride that risk ride, great, let's do that.
But it's never going to be And that's why I'm like, oh,
I'm not.
Speaker 2 (36:07):
What a strategy forever. It's not certain forget, it's you
need a free check.
Speaker 4 (36:10):
Like we can set and forget for twelve months, we
can get for twenty four months.
Speaker 2 (36:14):
But not for thirty years. I think that's not. One
thing that's really interesting that I found when I was
researching for the Investing Masterclass. Something that America does really well.
We don't really have it here, but I feel like
in the next few years we might have it is
target date funds. Yes, so target date funds. Basically, it
might be a fund that's called year twenty to fifty
and it's based on the year that you would like
to retire, and you invest in that and then as
(36:35):
you get closer to that age. So say the portfolio
right now for a target date fund for year fifty
might be seventy percent really high risk. But as you
age and you people do it, they do the stage
everything you forget a managed fund, they wind down your risk. Yeah,
they slowly change it and rebalance the portfolio to suit
where you're at in your life stage. I think that's
(36:56):
such an interesting way of investing, and like we don't
have access to that in Australia, but I think for
like Americans, that's so good because if you don't feel
educated enough to make all of those decisions about your risk,
well okay, what are they doing? What can I look
out and think, okay, well let's do that. So when
I was researching for the Messy Masks, I remember looking
at thing that's such an interesting way to invest and
(37:17):
I think in Australia we might see something.
Speaker 4 (37:18):
Like that in the future.
Speaker 3 (37:19):
Yeah, they're coming, They're absolutely coming. They're coming, and I'm
seeing a lot of people, like I'm still on all
of the edms for all of the financial advice houses
because like I haven't left them yet. They're definitely being
looked into if we pivot a little bit. I feel
like fire feels heavy, Like for me, I'm investing, but
(37:41):
I definitely wouldn't subscribe to saying that I am a
fire person. Like, yes, I want to retire early. Yes
I want to have financial freedom, but like I also
I probably love my lifestyle a little bit more than you.
Speaker 2 (37:54):
Like I'm happy to sacrifice eaves.
Speaker 4 (37:55):
Yeah, and like I'm kind of just in that.
Speaker 3 (37:58):
Like, honestly, before kids, Steve and I were very good
at being a little bit more frugal and getting stuff done,
and like I was very aggressive getting out of debt
and whatnot, and now we're kind of in the I
can't even breathe sometimes, Like life is really stressful, work
is really stressful, and like it's okay, that's definitely not
a complaint, Like what a bloody privilege to be stressed
by something I created.
Speaker 4 (38:18):
Like that's good, there's no complaints.
Speaker 3 (38:20):
But like that does mean I am a little bit
more convenient with my spending, Like I am probably spending
more on ub eats than I would like to. But
I'm telling you right now, like for me, in this
the heart of my life, I'm so.
Speaker 4 (38:34):
Happy to do that.
Speaker 3 (38:36):
But I want to know, is there like a specific
have it or an investing rule or something you've put
on yourself that has made getting closer to fight easier
without feeling like you're compromising your entire lifestyle.
Speaker 2 (38:47):
Well, because I pay myself weekly, my investments come out first.
So every Friday, I pay myself a spending money. I
have a spending account. Money goes into my investments come
out of my pay account, so I never see it,
I don't touch it, and I never change it. So
at a minimum, every single week, six hundred fift dollars
gets put in that account, and if I get paid
(39:08):
a bit more, or my side hustle pays off a
little bit more, I put a little bit extra in.
But I never invest less than six hundred fifty dollars
every week.
Speaker 4 (39:16):
And that's insane to me.
Speaker 2 (39:18):
It's crazy, I know, but I think it's because I
started just investing that little extra bit. So like when
I first started average investing, like I was investing twenty
five dollars a week, and then when I got a
better paying job, it was one hundred fifty dollars a week,
and then it was two hundred five dollars. But I
literally haven't changed my fixed expenses at all. And then
I was lucky for a period of time. When I
moved back to Perth, I wasn't paying rent, so I
(39:39):
had that rental income, that rental income that I had
thanks Steslie, I invested that rental income into the share market,
so I was investing in extra two hudred fifty dollars
a week. Now that I am paying rent again, obviously
i'm investing less because I have to pay rent, but
I had that little extra, So every time I can
give myself a little bit of a boost because compound
interest is and time in the market is going to
(39:59):
make more difference in how much I'm investing over the
long term. So the earlier I can get the money in,
the better. So if I can sacrifice a little bit
now in the future, I won't have to sacrifice as much.
Speaker 1 (40:09):
I like it.
Speaker 4 (40:09):
We're just girls. So on the flip side, what are
you not willing to sacrifice?
Speaker 2 (40:14):
Travel? If you know me, I've been to like over
forty countries. I think I'll get to like forty seven
this year because I'm going to Europe for three months.
God bless. But I always say for travel. Every week,
I save like two dollars a week for travel. And
it probably sounds like I save a lot of money
and then spend a lot on weird things. But my
value is travel. So people drink, I didn't drink, so
(40:34):
that money goes into travel funds. I will always have
money to travel and do fun things like that. But
that means if I want to travel, I need to
be savvy with it. So ipoints HAC. I just booked
flights literally yesterday with points to go to Takanana.
Speaker 4 (40:47):
I'm excited about it.
Speaker 2 (40:48):
You didn't tell me literally only literally. Yesterday we're in Tasmania.
We go to Hoba. But then Connor and I are
doing just getting shine see Harriet. We could we're doing
a road job. I've never been Tasy my state. I
have to visit. So I we're going to do a
road trip in like early late December.
Speaker 4 (41:05):
I am going to give you my laundry.
Speaker 2 (41:07):
But I want all the recommendation.
Speaker 3 (41:08):
I have all the good coffee spots, I have all
the good restaurants need I want to have all the
good hikes. There's a hike that I will specifically send
you to on the East coast. That is just it's
Wombat Central. That's just see the animals.
Speaker 2 (41:20):
I want a little square poop.
Speaker 5 (41:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (41:21):
So I won't ever sacrifice in trouble, but I'll just
be savvy with it. I'll be using shot back, I'll
be using like points. I'm making sure that I can
still do the things I want to do, but just
in a savvy way. I don't care about a faster hotel.
I've got no no rules about that. I'll just make
sure I can still live my life. But I'm not
spending money on you because I don't value you.
Speaker 3 (41:38):
I feel like a lot of people are listening to
this episode and they would absolutely love to retire early,
like they would love this, but they're like, this is
just not feasible for me. And that's fine because I
think some of us are too far down our financial
journeys and our financial commitments. Take step back, to take
a step back, and that step back would be you know,
(41:59):
someone might listen to this and be like, holy gulco Moly,
I am so inspired by this. I'm going to change
my entire mindset. But that's a lot to ask for,
because you're not just changing the way you think about money,
you're changing the way that you would act with it,
how you would live the like decisions self sacrifice.
Speaker 2 (42:14):
Yes exactly.
Speaker 3 (42:16):
But as I said earlier, like fire does seem relatively
extreme for a lot of people. What would be your
investing advice to somebody who's maybe gotten a little bit
further down that track of like, you know, let's pretend
I don't invest and I go well Brook, Actually that
sounds slay. I have a mortgage, I have a husband,
I have a kid, Like I actually have these financial commitments.
Speaker 4 (42:38):
What's your advice?
Speaker 2 (42:39):
Where can you cut corners that isn't going to make
a big difference. So, like you said, you like Uber eatsing,
I really don't Uber eads because I could just walk there,
or I could you know, or maybe I'm changing my
shopping from shopping at will Worse every day to shopping
at Aldi once a week, or just make those little
sacrifices so that I could slowly increase my savings rate.
What could you change your savings by one percent? Because
(43:01):
that one percent you're saving.
Speaker 4 (43:02):
Now now do not make me look at my budget.
Speaker 2 (43:04):
Literally, But if you could save that an extra one
percent or that extra five percent and invest that, that's
really going to pay off. Like those small amounts. If
you use a compound interest calculator and you change how
much you're investing by five dollars or twenty dollars, so
Sidney can massive term If you invest one hundred dollars
from the ages of twenty to thirty and then stop
investing at thirty and reach fifty, the person that starts
(43:25):
investing at thirty and invests consistently from thirty to fifty
will never catch up even though you stopped investing after
ten years. Yeah, like I'll make it's real for our
Instagram to explain that where this goes out, we will be.
Speaker 4 (43:35):
Like all of that stuff is already in our masterclass,
that it is hundred nine and you.
Speaker 2 (43:41):
Just have to make tiny little sacrifices to increase your
savings rate. What ways could you increase your savings rate?
Are you calling your phone provided to say, hey, I
currently pay ninety dollars a month for my phone? Could
you get it down to forty? Because I got my
phone deal down to thirty nine dollars a month, so
that extra bit? Okay, great, I'm investing it every little
cent that you can using roundups? What can yet, what
little changes could you make to increase that savings right?
(44:03):
Just a little bit. That's why I would tell.
Speaker 4 (44:04):
You agreed, Brooke, we have run out of time very quickly.
Speaker 3 (44:08):
Thank you so much for coming back on the show
and letting us be very pervy about your investing journey.
Speaker 2 (44:13):
You're welcome.
Speaker 4 (44:14):
I know this episode, I don't know.
Speaker 3 (44:16):
I feel like, yes, I can do so many educational episodes,
but the best thing is to learn from example and
see what other people are actually doing, so you can go, oh,
that would work or that wouldn't work.
Speaker 2 (44:25):
As theory is theory, and I think.
Speaker 3 (44:27):
That this will shift a lot of perspectives, not just
around fire, but more around what's actually possible when you
start investing with intention. So thank you for coming on
the show and very sorry we've run out of time. Okay, guys,
if you have loved this chat, please make sure you
hit subscribe so that you never missed an episode with us.
And if you've got a friend who's been maybe flirting
(44:48):
with the idea of investing or retiring early, please send.
Speaker 2 (44:52):
This their way.
Speaker 3 (44:54):
We love a group glow up. So that is all
from us today, but we'll be back in your ears
on Friday. See than guys, spy.
Speaker 5 (45:06):
The advice shared on She's on the Money is general
in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's
on the Money exists purely for educational purposes and should
not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision.
If you do choose to buy a financial product, read
the PDS TMD and obtain appropriate financial advice tailored towards
(45:27):
your needs. Victoria Divine and She's on the Money are
authorized representatives of Money.
Speaker 2 (45:32):
Shepper Pty Ltd.
Speaker 5 (45:34):
ABN three two one six four nine two seven seven
zero eight AFSL four five one two eight nine
My name is Tatasha Bamblet. I'm a proud First Nations
woman and I'm here to acknowledge country t glennyan Ganya, Niana,
Kaka yah Ya bin Ahaka Nian our gay in Nimbina,
yakarum jar Dominyama, Umagahawakaman, damon imlan Bimba ban Gadabomba in
and now in wakah ghana on yak rum jar Watnadaa. Hello,
(00:22):
beautiful friends, we gather on the lands of the Aboriginal people.
We thank acknowledge and respect the Aberiginal people's land that
we're gathering on today. Take pleasure in all the land
and respect all that you see. She's on the Money
podcast acknowledges culture, country, community and connections, bringing you the tools,
knowledge and resources for you to thrive.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
She's on the Money. She's on the Money.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
Hello and welcome to She's on the Money, the podcast
that's here to show you that investing isn't just for
the rich, it is for you too. When we add
She's on the Money team member Brooks Investing Diary. Something
she said basically broke the Internet or our DMS. At least,
she revealed that her investing strategy has her on track
to retire at the age of thirty five. Yes, thirty five.
(01:33):
She doesn't have that long until thirty five, you I have.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Heaps of time. What do you mean. I'm very I'm
twenty seven. That's recent, that's news. I know she was twenty,
So happy birthday. Happy birthday.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
She didn't win the lottery though, which is kind of
low key crazy given you're still Actually we don't.
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Know yet because I bought a ticket for last night,
so we don't know right well, we COULDBC if she does.
Speaker 4 (01:55):
Will let you know. You didn't have a secret inheritance.
Speaker 3 (01:58):
You didn't grow up rich Sadly, Brook has built her
portfolio step by step, following really clear rules and making
smart money moves consistently over a long period of time.
There's been no massive investment, there's been no big lump
sum of money. It's been dollar for dollar. I'm Victoria Devine.
I'm a retired financial advisor who is wildly passionate about
(02:21):
getting more women just like you to start building wealth
through investing. And after the response we got from her
last episode, I thought it was only the right thing
to get Brooke back in the studio and back on
the show Brook Welcome back.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
Hello friends, Are you excited to do you back?
Speaker 5 (02:37):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (02:37):
It does feel a bit random. Usually I edit the
videos of this podcast, so it's weird to edit videos
of myself.
Speaker 4 (02:42):
I was about to say, do you enjoy editing the
videos in myself? It's gross.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
It's actually way more fun to edit you guys, because
I don't know what you're going to say, Whereas like
when I'm editing myself, I know what I said, and
I'm like, oh, did I sound stupid? So if I did,
just don't.
Speaker 4 (02:54):
Worry ignore it.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
I can't edit videos of myself. I can't really get
them back to the podcast because I'm like, ill, who
is that?
Speaker 2 (03:00):
I can actually like, do your voice in my head?
Speaker 4 (03:02):
Stop it. You don't want that. You don't want that.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
Look, we need to rewind to the moment in your
investing diary that I guess everyone was like, wait, what
the hell you said? Very casually, I might add, oh, yeah, like,
if I keep investing the way that I am, I'll
just be able to retire by the age of thirty five. Yep,
And like I already kind of knew that, so that
wasn't shocking to me. But like, God, that is kind
(03:25):
of shocking.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
And now for anyone who's maybe listening to this and
heard that in thought, sorry, what Brookie, you just like
manifesting this like you're just hoping to retire by thirty five? Like,
what's the actual investing strategy behind this? Can you tell
us a little bit more about why that number and
how that's actually going to work?
Speaker 2 (03:45):
Yep. So it's this concept called financial independence retire Earlier,
or the fire movement. And I probably discovered this twenty
seventeen and I found it on Reddit, and it's all
these people that are buying index ones and ETFs and
they're increasing their savings right, which is really important. We'll
touch on it later. But they're increasing their savings rate
to be well above the amount they're spending and investing
(04:08):
the rest. So they're trying to live on as little
money as possible, so they can invest pretty much all
of their income early on and then slowly as they
get older. Some people increase how much they spend, but
who cares. They can retire really early because they're living
expenses are low, and they've got an investment portfolio that's
going to produce more money than they're going to spend.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
I feel like this takes significant sacrifice, but I also
feel like you don't sacrifice your life that much. Do
you really resonate with that financial independence early, save every
single dollar or are you a little bit more lax
with it than most.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
Well, in the beginning, I did. I literally have this
fear that tomorrow I'll be homeless. I just never think
that I will have enough money to survive, and I
always worry about that. So when I first started investing,
I did try to save heaps and heaps and heaps
of money and definitely sacrifice a lot. And then now
as I've got older and I've got a second income,
(05:02):
I sacrificed less because I put my entire second income
into investing. So now I feel like I can spend
a little bit more and stress less, but I still
keep my savings right really really really high.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (05:14):
I feel like you're also to give people a little
bit more context. I wouldn't say that you're an impulsive shopper. No,
Like that's not something. Is that something you've ever experienced?
Speaker 2 (05:25):
No, I like definitely like spend money, Like I'm not silly,
but like my goal for this year was to buy
one item, like one item of clothing or like beauty
or anything a month. So that was like I could
only buy one item twelve things for the year, and
I've kept on track, except I did buy I think
one or two extra things, but that were my birthday
gifts to myself, which is like.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
I feel like that's fine, it's fine, and like, you know,
you could reframe this and be like, well, I wasn't
more to go.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
I could have been I'm not buying them new Like
I'm a deep Hop addict. I spent every day on Deepop,
even for my little friend Georgia. I find Georgia Deepop
finds too, so it's like I'm not like I bought
this jumper off Deepop. This is my item for July
and originally one hundred and thirty dollars and I got
a brand new with tags for forty, so that is
a money win.
Speaker 3 (06:08):
I feel like I love talking about this side of
things because I think a lot of people just assume
that this type of lifestyle involves serious sacrifice and you
feel like you're missing out. But I think it's about
really reframing.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Like it's not missing outcause I'm helping future me.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
No, and we laugh a lot because it's kind of
like peak consumerism, Like we laugh about the la booboo,
like we think it's a like cost of living crisis indicator.
Speaker 4 (06:33):
Have you bought a la booboo?
Speaker 5 (06:35):
No?
Speaker 2 (06:35):
I do think about all the time. I wanted to
get a little boobo on the work card because I
couldn't just spart on my own gup.
Speaker 4 (06:39):
But she's just gonna put on my card.
Speaker 5 (06:40):
No.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
No, I was going to do it for a video
for the She's and the money TikTok. But they've not
become available. So unless we find a supplier, we won't
be getting a lat boobo. But I thought the would
want a latle boobo.
Speaker 3 (06:48):
We're not investing in la booboos. We are investing in ETF. Yes,
when you found this on Reddit, what made you go
far out? That's for me and I guess how did
it shift the way that you about money and investing?
Speaker 4 (07:01):
Like, what were you doing before you discovered fire?
Speaker 2 (07:04):
Well, I wasn't really investing, like that was part of
the beginning of my investing journey. The first time I
found out about investing was through someone at work, and
then I went home and googled a bunch of stuff
and then found the fire subreddit. And the reason it
stuck out to me was because there were very average people.
At this time, I was earning fifty thousand dollars a year,
so I wasn't earning good money, and I didn't think
I could work forever because no one does. And they
(07:25):
were all average people, investing most of their income and
then retiring at like an earlier age than normal. Some
people in their thirty some people in their forty, some
people in their fifties. And I thought, oh my god,
these are normal people doing this. Why can't I? And
a lot of them were American, and I could. And
the good thing is a lot of these people were
explaining how they did it, and I looked at that
and I thought, actually, that's a one off. And then
(07:47):
I read some more and it wasn't a one off,
and I was like.
Speaker 4 (07:49):
It's actually a legitimate strategy.
Speaker 2 (07:51):
It's a legitimate thing. And I thought, okay, well, if
the kind of idea that I found was you need
to increase your savings rate, so lower your fixedis spence
is right, and how much you're spending every week, and
increase savings rate as much as possible so that you
can be like investing more than your earning. So my
original goal was to get my savings right up to
thirty percent. And then once I did that, I was like, okay, well,
(08:12):
now what can I do? And I notoriously don't really drink.
I stopped drinking like five years ago, and I did
dorink for five years. So I saved so much money
than the average person because everyone's sending two to ThReD
dollars a week going out drinking and I wasn't so
that money I was investing. So then I was say, hey,
well my saving rate is going to go from thirty
percent to forty percent and then fifty percent and.
Speaker 4 (08:31):
So on to try what is your what do you reckon?
Your saving rate is?
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Now have exact figure. I did the maths for you
guys last night.
Speaker 3 (08:37):
I think I was going to ask you about this
a little bit later in the show, but like you're
corregation need to know now.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
So my savings right, well my essential spending, So like
my rent, my I give myself six years fun money.
I give myself money to go out for dinner with
my boyfriend and we love eating, so that's.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
That eating is like central, that's our sport. It's not
just like you guys, though. I feel like everybody in
the Shees on the Money team loves eatings and for Georgia, Yes,
in Georgia, who are just yeah, but like their chicken
nugget kids, and we kind of have we we love.
Speaker 2 (09:05):
Them because then we can go out for something enough,
no one's stealing our food. I'm getting the scallops and
I'm also getting scallops and everyone else is not. But
that's okay.
Speaker 4 (09:14):
We believe them. They love the bread.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
My essential expenses come to thirty one percent of my
income thirty one point eight eight and my savings right
at the moment, as of last night is sixty eight
point one two per day, and that's fully automated, so
none of the money I can touch. Like I get
paid monthly, so we get you're welcome. I get paid monthly,
but I pay myself weekly, so I'm one month ahead
in my judge at all times. So we get paid
(09:39):
on the fifteenth. But every Friday, I pay myself, so
I give I do Thursday. Why do you pick Friday
because we typically well, I give myself Friday so that
on the weekend I have money, because then I won't
give into my savings. So on Friday, it's my coffe day.
So my boyfriend, I take Jones. He on a Thursday
go to get a coffee. On a Friday, I get paid,
get up in the water and go get a coffee.
And then I have on Saturday and Sunday to spend
(09:59):
my money. And and really, if I spend all my
money on those days, I've got to suffer till Friday
because I cannot touch my savings.
Speaker 4 (10:04):
I try to see that's my mentality.
Speaker 3 (10:07):
But I think a lot of people are listening to
this and they're like, that feels really restrictive. For me,
it feels really freeing because I'm kind of like I
don't have to think about the big picture. I'm not
thinking about whether my bills are paid or whatever.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
It's aulated if I've.
Speaker 3 (10:22):
Blown all my money on a Sunday brunchf and it
means that I can't have, you know, a cheeky croissant
or something that I might go, oh, I deserve a
sweet treat. Sorry, you can't afford a sweet treat, Victoria
Like it's not in the budget. Yeah, And I think
a lot of people just go and please don't get
me wrong, I do clearly have a good income, but
the way that I manage my money is on such
(10:42):
a week to week basis that I've allocated that amount.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
You pay yourself first.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
Yeah, I'm kind of low key in my head. I'm like,
I can't afford that, Like, that's not in my budget.
Speaker 2 (10:50):
I try to do my grocery shopping on the Saturday
and Sunday, so then so that you can get the
good stuff. I've already got all of my grocery sorted,
and then Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday. I work from home, so.
Speaker 4 (11:00):
Yeah, that's a good deal for saving money too.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
I cooked dinner, and like I cooked dinner two nights
a week, my way from will cook dinner two nights
a week, and then we'll cook lunches, but we typically
won't go out those days. You might go out for
a lunch on a Friday, we'll go out for lunch
or a dinner on a Saturday or a Sunday. But
the midweek, I'm not really spending any money. I don't
pay for money to commute because I work from home.
And then I have I splurge a little bit with
my Poliities membership, but that is for the mental health.
(11:23):
But my savings rate is pretty high. But I don't
feel like that's going papers full as well.
Speaker 3 (11:28):
And I feel like, yeah, if you're sitting there and
you're listening to brook story and you're like, holy hell,
Like I own one hundred and fifty thousand dollars a
year and there's no way I could do that. I
think for Brook it works because you started from a
low base, and so I'm not saying I.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
Haven't changed my spending couch my first income.
Speaker 3 (11:46):
Yeah, And I think that that's for me because like
I think I've shared enough about my journey where I
got into a whole heap of personal debt and then
I had to get out of it and I had
to change my whole mindset around money and that was
a struggle.
Speaker 2 (11:56):
You've kind of gone debt.
Speaker 3 (11:57):
Yeah, you've gone from low income and like, I can
survive off this amount to every single time, like Brook
is in the perfect position. I would say, every single
time you've gotten a pay rise or a pay increase
that has not gone towards life style creep.
Speaker 2 (12:10):
No. Literally, I'm so jealous. I cannot do it to myself.
Like in my head, I tomorrow if I got knocked
back down to my first salary. My savings rate would differ,
but my living expenses and stuff wouldn't change. I'm not
change any of that. I don't have a new car.
I drive a twenty eleven High and thirty with custom
number plates. But custom number plates I do, they're pretty bougie.
(12:33):
I hate to brag, but I'm scared.
Speaker 3 (12:35):
Of custom number plates because I genuinely don't want people
to like spot my car and be like, Okay, she
can't drive.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
I know that I can't drive, but it's fine, But
like I don't. I don't have a new car. I
don't have a designer bag.
Speaker 4 (12:46):
Every new item a designer bag. You own a Chanelle.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
Oh no, that's my designer bag. It was a thousand dollars. Sorry,
that's a designer bag. Okay, to the record, you have
a Chanel bag, and I can guarantee carrier it's from
my caraer on. It's my carry on. Oh sorry, that
justifies it. Okay, No, this is making me sound out
of such. I saved that it was a vintage Carl Lagerfeld.
Let me tell you, But it's like, no, I don't
go out and buy anything.
Speaker 3 (13:12):
Everything I buy everything to do is thrifitted or art
throwing your under the bus for owning a bag, but like, sorry,
a girl's got to live as well.
Speaker 4 (13:20):
And if that has been on your leg wish list
and I.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
Saved for that, like that was my birthday present to
myself three years ago, and it's my carry on every
single time.
Speaker 4 (13:27):
Remember it was three years ago.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
It was three years ago. And because it's my laptop
bag as well, I could have claimed it on TASS.
I don't think I did, but I should have. I
kind of low key love it.
Speaker 3 (13:38):
All right, let's move back from Chanel bags over to
the fire concept. If you listen to our episode on
how much Super You Actually Need, you'll know that there's
like actually no magic number when it comes to creating
your perfect retirement because your lifestyle and your needs and
your values are completely unique. And you know, if Brooke
and I swapped lifestyles, we'd have to absolutely.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
Reach how to crease budget.
Speaker 3 (14:02):
Well, it's interesting as well because since becoming a mum,
I already shift well yeah, and I've decreased how many
days I'm present in the office, so I now have
Mondays off and I spend them with my son and
that is expensive. Not because we're going out heaps, but
like I end up going to lunch and I go, oh,
I'm stuck in the house.
Speaker 4 (14:20):
You know I've done I've killed it.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
As mental health moment.
Speaker 4 (14:24):
Yeah, and like, sorry, what do you mean? A kid's
toasted his twelve dollars? So most of the time I
pack his little.
Speaker 3 (14:30):
Lunch because he loves a lunch box at this age.
But I'm still going out going to you know what,
I've been at home. I've done all the stuff I'm
going to that's just self care activity. Yeah, And like
I've had to reshift my budget, not just in terms
of what I originally had budgeted for baby, because like
I've done all the maths, right, Like I'd worked out
on averages.
Speaker 4 (14:50):
Is what nappies are going to cost?
Speaker 2 (14:51):
This is what you call my God, it's so didn't
I make so many calculations because until you're in that situation,
you can't. Like my you would change too if I
was in that s.
Speaker 3 (15:01):
The lifestyle stuff, So like I find the budgeting for
the stuff that I can anticipate that's maybe not lifestyle.
So like I knew that every season he's going to
go up a size so like, you know, I did
so much research and so much talking to JGBT and
looking at like Reddit, just because I really wanted to know.
But essentially, your baby will outgrow their clothes every three months.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
That is crazy. Two years pass away at the thought
for the first two years.
Speaker 3 (15:25):
And so I worked out, Okay, well, if that's the case,
how many ones is do you think I'll need every season?
I was psychotic, how many? How many outfits? And like, yeah,
I've blown the budget on that a few times because
I'm like, oh sorry, like my husband, this is so lame.
Speaker 4 (15:40):
But we're going to a wedding in Bali soon and
my husband has this.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
At the Padma.
Speaker 4 (15:44):
Yeah, yeah, Bali at the Padma. Is this going out
after that?
Speaker 2 (15:47):
It'll be September.
Speaker 4 (15:48):
Great, I stayed at the Padma.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
That's a big contentious topic in our office. If you
want to know more, I'll make a TikTok for us.
Speaker 3 (15:55):
Actually, Brooke just straight out told me that that's Bali Bogan.
But guys, when you have a kid, the Padma as
a resort. Sorry, it has a petting zoo, it has
an ice cream cut. You're selling it to your close
to me, and you know what I'm not leaving that
resort with my nearly two year old anyway. With your
Padma review, when we were doing that, I was like, oh, sorry,
(16:15):
I do actually need my husband and son for the
recovery party of this wedding to have matching outfits.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
No, I think that that is an expense that I
would have to approve to. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (16:23):
Fine, but all of those things I think you can
kind of like sort of foresee. But it was like
the mental shift of like, hold on, like I've realized
that on the Monday that my son and I are
at home on our own all day, I actually do
want to go out for lunch. I do want to
go out and get it toasty, and like we're not
talking like super expensive, but like those budget shifts.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Are different a different friend stage or.
Speaker 3 (16:44):
At different life stages, so I think it's important to go, oh,
what's the perfect retirement. I'm well, it's going to look
different for me and different for you because we also
have different lifestyle goals and we live in different states.
Speaker 2 (16:55):
Like if Melbom's notoriously more expensive if you pay for tolls.
I found out the other day how much tolls were,
which is crazy scenes here, but like that's something that's
never going in my budget.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
No, no, And I think that that's where we go
back to this concept of financial independence. Retire early, like
your personal fire number isn't just about hitting like a
million dollars and being like, Okay, well I hit the goal,
or retiring by a certain age. It's about designing a
life that works for you and then building an investment
portfolio that can support that version of freedom. And whether
(17:25):
that's like, you know, really luxury or really minimalist or
like you're like semi retired or something or anything in between. Like,
it's going to look different and you have to work backwards.
So Brook, what version of fire are you currently working towards?
Like once you hit thirty five? Sorry, I need to
know the gritty details.
Speaker 2 (17:44):
Why would your lifestyle look like? It depends because I
know that realistically, before the time I hit thirty five,
I'll probably have kids, get married, except I would never
do a big wedding, which why would you do that?
That's so crazy?
Speaker 4 (17:56):
I would never spend lots of there doesn't.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
All like aligned to my values. I'm a kind For
those of you who don't follow me on social media,
which is huge, a significant amount of money on over
right nothing. But to me, I could never justify that.
I would justify loping and spending twenty can a really
sick holiday for me and my part families. I would
just never have a big wedding. It's not mine.
Speaker 4 (18:18):
You like, can I come to the wedding?
Speaker 2 (18:19):
You can't. But that's okay, that's weird.
Speaker 4 (18:21):
Okay, let me.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
Set this boundary here. You won't be attending my single elopement.
This is bullshit. But for me, my fire mentality right
now is I would love to get to two million
by thirty five and then be able to have like
a full eighty thousand year income, which would be a
four percent draw down rate. But I'm realistic that I'm
not going to retire at thirty five because.
Speaker 4 (18:44):
I really will have a number that you want to
which is two millions.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
So that's a work optional then. But I would also
think about doing something called coast fire or barrista fire,
which is where your investing portfolio will give you like
a part time income, so would would be a barista file.
This is my favorite concept. Do georgially talk about this
all the time, which is like you kind of get
to a point where okay, well, I've experienced the corporate
(19:08):
highs and lows. I've enjoyed doing my career and growing that,
but now that doesn't serve me anymore. I want to
do passion projects. I want to do this.
Speaker 4 (19:15):
So you then get into CEO who then becomes yoga teacher.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
Exactly, and you can live on a lower income but
continue to have your lifestyle because your investment portfolio will
prop you up. So say my my Barista fire number
would be one million, one hundred and twenty five thousand dollars,
which would then get me forty five K year income.
Then say I have a fifty K year salary. That
means I'm still earning one hundred and five thousand dollars
a year. Okay, but I'm working a fun job that
(19:40):
I find like, I feel passionate about it. And then
if I wanted to take a little sabbatical and I
wanted to go overseas for a couple of years, I'm
still earning forty five K. So you can coast towards
your fire and now you're still increasing your savings rate
because of that forty five thousand, I still spend like
I spend less than that a year. I spend like
thirty grand a year or something, I would still be
(20:01):
contributing towards my investing fund. So my investments are still
growing as I'm getting closer to that main fire number.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
I love that, and I feel like just knowing your
fire number is only one piece of the puzzle. So
we're going to take a very quick break, and when
we get back, we're going to dive into a little
bit more of the juicy stuff, the strategy and the
things that you need to think about if you actually
want to retire early.
Speaker 4 (20:23):
So guys, don't go anywhere.
Speaker 3 (20:28):
All right, we are back, and it is time to
jump into the strategy that you have behind retiring early.
When most people start their plans for retiring early, say
around like I don't know, sixty five is what people
are like working towards On average, they often work out
a draw down rate of around five percent. You mentioned
that your draw down rate was four percent before, just
(20:50):
for context, and that's because their investment portfolio only needs
to last like twenty or thirty years for them.
Speaker 5 (20:57):
But when you're.
Speaker 3 (20:57):
Planning to retire much earlier, you're in investments actually have
to support you for longer, and that money has to
stretch further, and you need to be a bit more conservative. Yes, Brook,
you mentioned that your draw down rate was four percent
when you calculated your fire number. Why did that draw
down rate make the most sense for you?
Speaker 2 (21:16):
I just try to be as conservative as possible, because
then if I could actually draw down more, that is
a win. A win is a win. I will take that.
I'm always going to base my calculations on the lowest possible,
like obviously it's not the lowest possible, but the most
reasonable and lowest amount, so that then any extra it's
a bonus. Yeah, it's like a little this is your
(21:36):
annual bonus. Great. But if I factored my draw down
rate is like six percent and realistically I could only
draw down four percent, that I would be disappointed. So
if I am low and land.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
High money win. We want to set our expectations to
be exceeded. When I was a financial advisor, I always
did that because I'd always be like, I really want
to impress you, and I'd prefer you to be happy
with me. I'm the promises of a deliver exactly. Now.
You have mentioned that you want to retire at the
age of thirty five, which means that your superannuation actually
can't come into this conversation. Yes, but we will have
(22:10):
that when we turn sixty five and when we're a
little bit older. I want to know that combination because
at the moment your fire number you mentioned two million
dollars that would not be including any super because you
can't touch that. Just because you decided to retire does
not mean that.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
The government gunners. Oh yes you are retired. Yes, good job, Brooke, here,
I have it all early. You've done amazing. Unfortunately, that's
not it.
Speaker 3 (22:31):
And I think that that makes it a little bit
trickier than a traditional retirement because, as I've said time
and time again on the show before, I think superranuation.
Speaker 4 (22:40):
Is the sexiest tax vehicle in existence.
Speaker 3 (22:44):
Like, at the moment, you'd be paying a relatively high
marginal tax rate, but in subranuation you are paying fifteen percent.
That is hot girl shit for most of us, unless like,
and I don't want people coming at me and being like, well,
my cousin accessed his super early. You can in really
extreme circumstances of illness or injury or like.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
I think I'm eligible.
Speaker 4 (23:04):
Yeah no, no, you're just ill.
Speaker 3 (23:06):
But we can't access it until we sixty and then
we can actually draw down on it properly tax free
from sixty five. At this point, I do believe side
note that that retirement age is going to be reset
to probably seventy or seventy two. And the reason for
that is just we are working later and later, and
the government wants to push off retirement age.
Speaker 2 (23:26):
Business saves and money.
Speaker 3 (23:27):
Yeah, it would take significant pressure off the pension system
because they're basically forcing you to work longer. But anyway
back on track, if you're aiming to stop working in
your mid thirties or maybe even closer to forty, you
need a way to fund the next you know, years
between that.
Speaker 4 (23:46):
And this is where the idea of like bridging buckets
comes into it.
Speaker 3 (23:50):
And I think it's that part of the portfolio that's
invested outside of Super and that's designed to cover your
lifestyle until Super becomes available. But tell me, like, have
you actually factored Super into the plow? Are we talking
about that? Because like I do payroll every month and
I'm paying your supers?
Speaker 2 (24:06):
So are youreful for it?
Speaker 4 (24:08):
Yeah? But are you watching it? Are you caring about it?
Speaker 2 (24:10):
I do definitely watch it. It's definitely in my I
track my network every month just because I'm freaking insane.
Speaker 5 (24:15):
I love this.
Speaker 4 (24:15):
Also free network.
Speaker 2 (24:17):
It's not free, it's in the Vestry musk Strace. But
the network track that's in the investing musklass I made.
I was one that I use. Yeah, there we go.
Speaker 4 (24:24):
I was like, it's free hold on a bonus for
our investing muster class.
Speaker 2 (24:28):
I feel that network tracker out every single month because
I like to see it grow. But I do factor
my SUPER in there. But it is not factored into
my fire number at all because obviously the fire you
can't access it. No, and the fire movement started in
America they don't have super. So I've just always not
included it, and I considered that my superannuation is a bonus.
It's like when I reach sixty five, it's a thank you.
Speaker 5 (24:50):
Here you go.
Speaker 4 (24:51):
Do you know, like, what would your SUPER be sitting at?
Speaker 2 (24:54):
Like I'm not it would be in the millions by
the time I get that.
Speaker 3 (24:57):
It's like sitting at a good amount for your age. Yeah,
I'm assuming because you've always.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
Double it's more. Yeah, it's more than double what the
average is. Okay, But I don't conflict see here, No,
I just had I've always worked with. You don't make
additional contract. I don't make any additional contributions because I
really like to have control over my investments, and because
I want to be able to be work optional by
thirty five. I don't like I don't factor that into
my investing. Obviously, I feel grateful to have SUPER, and
(25:23):
if my SUPER was lower than the average, I would
definitely contribute to it. But right now it's not part
of my fire strategy. It's a nice to have when
I turned sixty five, and I hope that that money
will then just be things I could help with my family.
Speaker 3 (25:35):
Yeah, and that's kind of my strategy as well, just
to flip it, because I think people are always like,
well what do you do with your super?
Speaker 4 (25:41):
Victoria?
Speaker 3 (25:42):
And I too, Look, I think we've all heard that.
There's two phrases that come to mind. Here, do as
I say, not as I do? And then the other
one is the plumber always has the leaky tap, right,
And so I've never heard that.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
Have you never heard about the plumber? But no, I
do agree because people that do a job, they don't
necessarily do that for themselves.
Speaker 3 (26:01):
No, And I have always said if you're a small
business owner, like you need to be paying yourself superannuation
and I'm wildly passionate about that, but I also don't
live with the fairies.
Speaker 4 (26:11):
And like, when I first started my business, I'm.
Speaker 3 (26:14):
Sorry, I did keep track of it, Like I knew
what I should be paying myself in SUPER and sometimes.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
It's not realistic to worry.
Speaker 3 (26:20):
I didn't have any cash flow, and the decision, like
Jess we've talked about was my first employee in She's
on the money, completely separate from Zella. But I remember
being like, well, I can't afford to take SUPER if
I'm going to then be paying someone else's SUPER and
actually getting this support in my business. Yeah, and like
there were so many like, yes, you should be paying
super as a small business owner, but also was a
(26:43):
factors Let's be honest, No, I wasn't, but I did
keep track of what I should have been paying myself
in SUPER. And so when people are like, oh, do
you make extra contributions, I'm kind of like, Okay, this
is complicated, because yes, but the reason I do is
to get back up where I need to be and
what I quote in my head, oh myself, not because
I'm trying to bowlk up my super because I would
(27:03):
love for my husband Steve and I to be in
a position ideally by the age of forty. Mine's not
thirty five, because that's next year, by the age of forty,
where we have that financial freedom to go. Actually, let's
just a bashion prop.
Speaker 4 (27:16):
Yeah, and like the way that I have worked that
out is same as you. Like I've gone.
Speaker 3 (27:21):
Okay, our number is x and thankfully we have a
dual income household, so we're both contributing to this.
Speaker 4 (27:27):
No not dinks, double income.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
No kids, you're no kids. I'm not a dinkless with dinkless,
which is really sad.
Speaker 3 (27:34):
I graduated from being a dink what eighteen months a
great turn out of ten can recommend to the graduation,
but not for the financial benefits, because as such there
are none. I have a tiny free loader who basically
he doesn't even need yours, no chores, and all he
does is snack.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
Honestly, if I lived at your house, i'd also snack.
You've got an ice machine to It's fantastic.
Speaker 3 (27:55):
When when I did my baby budgeting, I didn't budget
for the amount of snacks this tiny gremlin demands.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
Yeah, I know that's like, what do you mean?
Speaker 3 (28:05):
And he's a money loss, he's a bottomless pit anyway,
So it's an interesting problem. But we've worked out okay, cool,
well this amount of money, we won't be debt free
at that point, but this amount of miss so we
have mortgages.
Speaker 2 (28:18):
I don't own a home, yeah, so for us, it
won't it look different.
Speaker 3 (28:22):
Yeah, we'll have a financial independent number, but built into
that islage picture of payments and like our living works. Yeah,
and I just I look at it and I go, well,
I don't know what life will look like. I don't
know if like podcasting is going to be successful forever.
Like honestly, that's why I have two separate businesses. I
feel like this is like my fun, shiny one that
hopefully will last for ages, and like, you know, I
(28:44):
love financial literacy, but you never know. And then I
have my more legitimate mortgage broking business, which basically every
piece of income that goes into that gets reinvested into.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
That is the long term business.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (28:55):
So we then have our like investing like or our
retirement number that we could retire at, but we won't
be debt free. And I think that's an important thing
to add because I think a lot of people think
that you'll have to get to your retirement number and
you'll have to be debt free.
Speaker 2 (29:10):
A mortgage by the time, Like obviously I'm looking to
buy a house in the next few years, and by
the time I would reach my fire number, I wouldn't
be using that money to pay down my mortgage. I
would be factoring those mortgage repayments in there. They're my costs,
there are my cost there are my living expenses.
Speaker 3 (29:26):
And I think that that's an important call out because
I think a lot of people, especially in the fire community,
they can be quite aggressive about this, like they want
to be at their retirement number, but also debt free.
Speaker 2 (29:36):
That's because in America housing is heaps cheaper. Like if
I used to go and move to Missouri right now,
I could buy a five bedroom match and for two
hundred thousand dollars and I could pay all cash, you know,
but you can't. It's not realistic. And I think that
that's why it's different market, and that's why it's really
hard with the fire subreddits because most of them are American.
Speaker 3 (29:52):
And that's why I was like, I really want to
point out that, like stiff. I'm also working towards this.
I think it would be a miss to not mention
that I'm actually going to be debt. I'm going to
still be in a lot of debt for our mortgage.
But I'm actually low key fine with that because like,
it's in your plan, it's in the plan. It's just
it's our housing cost. And even if we didn't have
a primary principal place of residence.
Speaker 4 (30:12):
Yeah, whatever we call it.
Speaker 3 (30:14):
So there are lots of different strategies, both internationally and
in Australia that people are using to reach their fire number.
I think some of them really focus on capital growth.
And if you've listened to other episodes with Brooke and I,
we both love Warren Buffett and like kind of subscribe
to his investing methodologies, but we also differ a little
bit in that my yeah, my priorities when picking my
(30:37):
investments are more dividend yield and like you know, balanced
with performance, whereas you're like, just shoot lights out, I
want more performance.
Speaker 4 (30:44):
I don't give you.
Speaker 3 (30:45):
Rats about your didend your dividends. So everybody has a
different strategy, which means building a portfolio looks in a
different way, and that's okay. But the idea is that
every single one of a building a portfolio that increases
in value over time so that we can eventually live
(31:07):
off either the dividends from our investments or for some
people start selling off our investments and living off.
Speaker 2 (31:13):
That without raw down right.
Speaker 5 (31:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (31:15):
And I think some other people, like as we're saying,
they really focus on income producing assets like me, But
I'm not an income producing assets early in the investment
property space, Like I think a lot of people go, oh,
I could buy a rental property. That's fine, that could
be part of your strategy, but that's actually not my
circus nor my monkeys. I don't want to be someone's landlord.
(31:38):
I don't think I've shared a lot about that, but like,
over time, I've just realized that's that journey. It's not
my journey. I just feel like that's not for me,
and that's okay, but it is for other people.
Speaker 2 (31:49):
Brook.
Speaker 3 (31:49):
I want to talk a little bit about when you're
building your portfolio with this fire methodology in mind, are you,
like we've talked about it a little bit in that
you're just after growth shares at this point in time,
but like, how does that strategy impact the ETF so
or the investments that you ultimately pick.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
I think because when I first started investing, I was
like really young, I was in my early twenties. And my,
when you read all of these things, and I have
read literally every investing book on the market.
Speaker 3 (32:20):
I literally just like backtrack. I literally paid her to
do that, to make Oh my god, we did so fun.
We did not miss a bloody beat in our investing
master class.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
Sorry, I spent like three months working on that.
Speaker 4 (32:32):
I was like, day in date, we can't have all
these other investor what if we miss something that.
Speaker 2 (32:37):
Yeah, it needed to be perfect. And I think I
learned a lot in that, and even in my early
twenties that I'm welcome.
Speaker 4 (32:43):
So I basically paid you to get a financial education.
Speaker 2 (32:45):
I know I would love to get a degree. So
if you want to pay for that, true, I'll just
draw like me. You'll get Georgian and make one and Adobe.
Speaker 1 (32:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
I learned that I have so much time for risk.
So my strategy when I first started investing was high growth,
high risk, because I have time for the market to
go up, I have time for the market to go down,
and I want to buy at every stage of that.
I want to buy it when I said it's highest,
I want to buy it when it's that it's lowest.
I want to be buying it every single week. So
my strategy from the beginning was to buy. I didn't
(33:15):
care about dividends, high growth investments, and ETFs that were
just high risk. I was happy with the risk. Everything
was diversified and risky, but I wanted to make sure
that I was getting at least ten percent return every year.
Obviously that's averaged out over ten years. But now I
look at my portfolio and I've been investing consistently since
twenty eighteen, twenty nineteen, and my strategy really hasn't changed.
(33:40):
Obviously I've added in more ETFs, in more index funds,
and some direct shares, but I really don't factor them in.
My average return since twenty eighteen twenty nineteen, which was
like six or seven years, is I'm up thirteen point
seven nine per sex. Yes see, that's good, which is
really good. So like, my strategy is currently working for me,
and I'm still picking chairs and ETFs that a ligne
(34:03):
in that sort of space. But as I get older,
as I near closer to that fire number, obviously I
will probably change the way that I invest because I
don't want as risky options when I am actually beginning
to draw down, I only want I'm not caring as
much about the return.
Speaker 3 (34:18):
Yes, and like going back to my financial advisor career,
that was very true of all of our clients.
Speaker 4 (34:26):
So like the clients that I had that were your age,
they were very, very risky.
Speaker 3 (34:29):
And the older you get, the more capital stable you're
looking for because you just don't have the time ahead
of you. Like if you're like sixty and you're like Victoria,
I'm here, got my super I've got my investments. I'm
ready to start like gearing up to retire in five years.
I'm not looking at you know, high growth, high yield funds.
I'm looking at capital stable investments to really stabilize what
(34:50):
you have built and essentially lock it in, Like I
want to lock and load what you have got, because
I don't want you to feel those ebbs and flows
so much once you are retired, because once you're retired,
you want consistency. You want consistency and you want to
know that you can trust it. And I would prefer
you to at that stage switch not everything like this
(35:11):
is probably a little bit dramatic, but we're switching to going, okay, cool,
we've got our five percent or our four percent draw
down rate. I actually just want to be able to
lock that in for you so that every single year
you can go, no, I know, I will have an
income of eighty thousand dollars or fifty or whatever.
Speaker 2 (35:26):
It's less about growing that capital.
Speaker 3 (35:28):
Yeah, it's less about the capital increasing. It's more about
having a consistent income. Because right now, if your portfolio
is performing one year thirteen percent, the next year it
could do negative five. And that's okay because it doesn't
matterfy now. But imagine if you don't work. Imagine if
you were like, okay, cool, I'm banking on this eighty
grand coming in, and then the year after it's like, sorry, you're.
Speaker 2 (35:49):
Put down here twenty percent and you get nothing.
Speaker 4 (35:51):
You lost something. You also can't afford to draw down.
Speaker 2 (35:54):
On that, Like, then your life's soffix.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
Yeah, And I feel like we just want stability at
that point. So when you are a bit younger and
you can ride that risk ride, great, let's do that.
But it's never going to be And that's why I'm like, oh,
I'm not.
Speaker 2 (36:07):
What a strategy forever. It's not certain forget, it's you
need a free check.
Speaker 4 (36:10):
Like we can set and forget for twelve months, we
can get for twenty four months.
Speaker 2 (36:14):
But not for thirty years. I think that's not. One
thing that's really interesting that I found when I was
researching for the Investing Masterclass. Something that America does really well.
We don't really have it here, but I feel like
in the next few years we might have it is
target date funds. Yes, so target date funds. Basically, it
might be a fund that's called year twenty to fifty
and it's based on the year that you would like
to retire, and you invest in that and then as
(36:35):
you get closer to that age. So say the portfolio
right now for a target date fund for year fifty
might be seventy percent really high risk. But as you
age and you people do it, they do the stage
everything you forget a managed fund, they wind down your risk. Yeah,
they slowly change it and rebalance the portfolio to suit
where you're at in your life stage. I think that's
(36:56):
such an interesting way of investing, and like we don't
have access to that in Australia, but I think for
like Americans, that's so good because if you don't feel
educated enough to make all of those decisions about your risk,
well okay, what are they doing? What can I look
out and think, okay, well let's do that. So when
I was researching for the Messy Masks, I remember looking
at thing that's such an interesting way to invest and
(37:17):
I think in Australia we might see something.
Speaker 4 (37:18):
Like that in the future.
Speaker 3 (37:19):
Yeah, they're coming, They're absolutely coming. They're coming, and I'm
seeing a lot of people, like I'm still on all
of the edms for all of the financial advice houses
because like I haven't left them yet. They're definitely being
looked into if we pivot a little bit. I feel
like fire feels heavy, Like for me, I'm investing, but
(37:41):
I definitely wouldn't subscribe to saying that I am a
fire person. Like, yes, I want to retire early. Yes
I want to have financial freedom, but like I also
I probably love my lifestyle a little bit more than you.
Speaker 2 (37:54):
Like I'm happy to sacrifice eaves.
Speaker 4 (37:55):
Yeah, and like I'm kind of just in that.
Speaker 3 (37:58):
Like, honestly, before kids, Steve and I were very good
at being a little bit more frugal and getting stuff done,
and like I was very aggressive getting out of debt
and whatnot, and now we're kind of in the I
can't even breathe sometimes, Like life is really stressful, work
is really stressful, and like it's okay, that's definitely not
a complaint, Like what a bloody privilege to be stressed
by something I created.
Speaker 4 (38:18):
Like that's good, there's no complaints.
Speaker 3 (38:20):
But like that does mean I am a little bit
more convenient with my spending, Like I am probably spending
more on ub eats than I would like to. But
I'm telling you right now, like for me, in this
the heart of my life, I'm so.
Speaker 4 (38:34):
Happy to do that.
Speaker 3 (38:36):
But I want to know, is there like a specific
have it or an investing rule or something you've put
on yourself that has made getting closer to fight easier
without feeling like you're compromising your entire lifestyle.
Speaker 2 (38:47):
Well, because I pay myself weekly, my investments come out first.
So every Friday, I pay myself a spending money. I
have a spending account. Money goes into my investments come
out of my pay account, so I never see it,
I don't touch it, and I never change it. So
at a minimum, every single week, six hundred fift dollars
gets put in that account, and if I get paid
(39:08):
a bit more, or my side hustle pays off a
little bit more, I put a little bit extra in.
But I never invest less than six hundred fifty dollars
every week.
Speaker 4 (39:16):
And that's insane to me.
Speaker 2 (39:18):
It's crazy, I know, but I think it's because I
started just investing that little extra bit. So like when
I first started average investing, like I was investing twenty
five dollars a week, and then when I got a
better paying job, it was one hundred fifty dollars a week,
and then it was two hundred five dollars. But I
literally haven't changed my fixed expenses at all. And then
I was lucky for a period of time. When I
moved back to Perth, I wasn't paying rent, so I
(39:39):
had that rental income, that rental income that I had
thanks Steslie, I invested that rental income into the share market,
so I was investing in extra two hudred fifty dollars
a week. Now that I am paying rent again, obviously
i'm investing less because I have to pay rent, but
I had that little extra, So every time I can
give myself a little bit of a boost because compound
interest is and time in the market is going to
(39:59):
make more difference in how much I'm investing over the
long term. So the earlier I can get the money in,
the better. So if I can sacrifice a little bit
now in the future, I won't have to sacrifice as much.
Speaker 1 (40:09):
I like it.
Speaker 4 (40:09):
We're just girls. So on the flip side, what are
you not willing to sacrifice?
Speaker 2 (40:14):
Travel? If you know me, I've been to like over
forty countries. I think I'll get to like forty seven
this year because I'm going to Europe for three months.
God bless. But I always say for travel. Every week,
I save like two dollars a week for travel. And
it probably sounds like I save a lot of money
and then spend a lot on weird things. But my
value is travel. So people drink, I didn't drink, so
(40:34):
that money goes into travel funds. I will always have
money to travel and do fun things like that. But
that means if I want to travel, I need to
be savvy with it. So ipoints HAC. I just booked
flights literally yesterday with points to go to Takanana.
Speaker 4 (40:47):
I'm excited about it.
Speaker 2 (40:48):
You didn't tell me literally only literally. Yesterday we're in Tasmania.
We go to Hoba. But then Connor and I are
doing just getting shine see Harriet. We could we're doing
a road job. I've never been Tasy my state. I
have to visit. So I we're going to do a
road trip in like early late December.
Speaker 4 (41:05):
I am going to give you my laundry.
Speaker 2 (41:07):
But I want all the recommendation.
Speaker 3 (41:08):
I have all the good coffee spots, I have all
the good restaurants need I want to have all the
good hikes. There's a hike that I will specifically send
you to on the East coast. That is just it's
Wombat Central. That's just see the animals.
Speaker 2 (41:20):
I want a little square poop.
Speaker 5 (41:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (41:21):
So I won't ever sacrifice in trouble, but I'll just
be savvy with it. I'll be using shot back, I'll
be using like points. I'm making sure that I can
still do the things I want to do, but just
in a savvy way. I don't care about a faster hotel.
I've got no no rules about that. I'll just make
sure I can still live my life. But I'm not
spending money on you because I don't value you.
Speaker 3 (41:38):
I feel like a lot of people are listening to
this episode and they would absolutely love to retire early,
like they would love this, but they're like, this is
just not feasible for me. And that's fine because I
think some of us are too far down our financial
journeys and our financial commitments. Take step back, to take
a step back, and that step back would be you know,
(41:59):
someone might listen to this and be like, holy gulco Moly,
I am so inspired by this. I'm going to change
my entire mindset. But that's a lot to ask for,
because you're not just changing the way you think about money,
you're changing the way that you would act with it,
how you would live the like decisions self sacrifice.
Speaker 2 (42:14):
Yes exactly.
Speaker 3 (42:16):
But as I said earlier, like fire does seem relatively
extreme for a lot of people. What would be your
investing advice to somebody who's maybe gotten a little bit
further down that track of like, you know, let's pretend
I don't invest and I go well Brook, Actually that
sounds slay. I have a mortgage, I have a husband,
I have a kid, Like I actually have these financial commitments.
Speaker 4 (42:38):
What's your advice?
Speaker 2 (42:39):
Where can you cut corners that isn't going to make
a big difference. So, like you said, you like Uber eatsing,
I really don't Uber eads because I could just walk there,
or I could you know, or maybe I'm changing my
shopping from shopping at will Worse every day to shopping
at Aldi once a week, or just make those little
sacrifices so that I could slowly increase my savings rate.
What could you change your savings by one percent? Because
(43:01):
that one percent you're saving.
Speaker 4 (43:02):
Now now do not make me look at my budget.
Speaker 2 (43:04):
Literally, But if you could save that an extra one
percent or that extra five percent and invest that, that's
really going to pay off. Like those small amounts. If
you use a compound interest calculator and you change how
much you're investing by five dollars or twenty dollars, so
Sidney can massive term If you invest one hundred dollars
from the ages of twenty to thirty and then stop
investing at thirty and reach fifty, the person that starts
(43:25):
investing at thirty and invests consistently from thirty to fifty
will never catch up even though you stopped investing after
ten years. Yeah, like I'll make it's real for our
Instagram to explain that where this goes out, we will be.
Speaker 4 (43:35):
Like all of that stuff is already in our masterclass,
that it is hundred nine and you.
Speaker 2 (43:41):
Just have to make tiny little sacrifices to increase your
savings rate. What ways could you increase your savings rate?
Are you calling your phone provided to say, hey, I
currently pay ninety dollars a month for my phone? Could
you get it down to forty? Because I got my
phone deal down to thirty nine dollars a month, so
that extra bit? Okay, great, I'm investing it every little
cent that you can using roundups? What can yet, what
little changes could you make to increase that savings right?
(44:03):
Just a little bit. That's why I would tell.
Speaker 4 (44:04):
You agreed, Brooke, we have run out of time very quickly.
Speaker 3 (44:08):
Thank you so much for coming back on the show
and letting us be very pervy about your investing journey.
Speaker 2 (44:13):
You're welcome.
Speaker 4 (44:14):
I know this episode, I don't know.
Speaker 3 (44:16):
I feel like, yes, I can do so many educational episodes,
but the best thing is to learn from example and
see what other people are actually doing, so you can go, oh,
that would work or that wouldn't work.
Speaker 2 (44:25):
As theory is theory, and I think.
Speaker 3 (44:27):
That this will shift a lot of perspectives, not just
around fire, but more around what's actually possible when you
start investing with intention. So thank you for coming on
the show and very sorry we've run out of time. Okay, guys,
if you have loved this chat, please make sure you
hit subscribe so that you never missed an episode with us.
And if you've got a friend who's been maybe flirting
(44:48):
with the idea of investing or retiring early, please send.
Speaker 2 (44:52):
This their way.
Speaker 3 (44:54):
We love a group glow up. So that is all
from us today, but we'll be back in your ears
on Friday. See than guys, spy.
Speaker 5 (45:06):
The advice shared on She's on the Money is general
in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's
on the Money exists purely for educational purposes and should
not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision.
If you do choose to buy a financial product, read
the PDS TMD and obtain appropriate financial advice tailored towards
(45:27):
your needs. Victoria Divine and She's on the Money are
authorized representatives of Money.
Speaker 2 (45:32):
Shepper Pty Ltd.
Speaker 5 (45:34):
ABN three two one six four nine two seven seven
zero eight AFSL four five one two eight nine
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