October 22, 2024 • 39 mins
You’ve heard the buzz about Self-Managed Super Funds (SMSFs) and maybe thought, “Do I need one?” But here’s the twist — you probably don’t. In this episode, we’re cutting through the confusion and breaking down why an SMSF might sound like the ultimate power move, but often ends up being way more work (and cost!) than it’s worth. If you’re wondering how to grow your super and take control of your future without the admin headaches and DIY stress, we’ve got you covered. Tune in to discover smarter, easier ways to manage your super like a pro — no SMSF required.
Acknowledgement of Country By Natarsha Bamblett aka Queen Acknowledgements.
The advice shared on She's On The Money is general in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's On The Money exists purely for educational purposes and should not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision. If you do choose to buy a financial product, read the PDS, TMD and obtain appropriate financial advice tailored towards your needs. Victoria Devine and She's On The Money are authorised representatives of Money Sherpa PTY LTD ABN - 321649 27708, AFSL - 451289.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello, my name's Santasha Nabananga Bamblet. I'm a proud yor
the Order Kerni Whoalbury and a waddery woman. And before
we get started on She's on the Money podcast, I
would like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the land
of which this podcast is recorded on a wondery country,
acknowledging the elders, the ancestors and the next generation coming
(00:22):
through as this podcast is about connecting, empowering, knowledge sharing
and the storytelling of you to make a difference for
today and lasting impact for tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Let's get into it.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
She's on the Money, She's on the Money.
Speaker 4 (00:57):
Hello and welcome to She's on the Money. The podcast
is about the bank balance of future you as much
as today you do. You ever see the letters SMSF
and wonder what does that stand for? But you kind
of hear people talking about it and setting up their
own self managed super fun and have you ever thought like, am.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
I supposed to be doing that?
Speaker 1 (01:15):
Well?
Speaker 4 (01:15):
Honestly kind of same. I am excited and joining me
today our expert in all things finance and the woman
asking themselves turned to when they needed the lowdown on
millennials and their superannuation. Victoria Devine.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
That's such a flex, isn't it. I know that's actually
it was like probably my biggest career flex that is
really really cood. Oh well, as wanted my advice.
Speaker 4 (01:36):
So it's like Jesus coming to you and be like, hey,
what should I write in the Bible?
Speaker 2 (01:41):
No it's not, but I'm not gonna correct you. I
love that for us. I get asked about SMSF or
self managed super all the time. You know, when you
get super motivated and you're gonna do a really big
DIY project, but then halfway through, you're like me deep
in paint. You're standing there and you're like, why did
I decide to do this? I don't know what I'm doing.
I've messed so much up. I need to hire a pro,
(02:04):
and it might now cost me a bit more because
I've made all these mistakes that need unwinding. Well that's
kind of what an SMSF can feel like. Yeah, sure
you get to do it all yourself, beck absolutely, but
sometimes it's a lot more work than it's worth. So
today I decided it was time we're going to break
down why managing your own super fund It sounds great
(02:27):
in theory, but it can often turn more into a
DIY nightmare than a dream. And I think that that
is very poignant at the moment, because I've seen a
lot of people in our community asking should I have
an SMSF my friends set up one, or my parents
set up one, or most alarming to me, someone approached
me and said I could use the entire and mounting
(02:50):
my superannuation and buy a property with it. There are
red flags flying, Beck, they are flying, They're flying high.
Speaker 4 (02:57):
Yes, I used to think the same thing as well.
I wanted to start my own I'm like, if I
have full access to my super and no one's gonna
ask me questions, it's not the case.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
I realized it's.
Speaker 4 (03:05):
Very, very illegal.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
It's very scary. I mean, it's not illegal to have
access and invest on your own terms, absolutely.
Speaker 4 (03:10):
Not right, but to use it for your groceriason.
Speaker 2 (03:13):
Oh, no, we're not doing that, babe, Yes, absolutely not.
Speaker 4 (03:16):
I thought it sounded really good, but then yes, I
realized I'm not allowed to do that. But I've always
wanted to know about it because it kind of sounds fancy,
and like, who doesn't want more control? Should we start
with what a self managed super fund actually is.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
I think it sounds really glamorous. Like when I used
to be a financial advisor, I'd have people come in
and they would say, I really want to have a
self managed super fund, and I feel like people thought
that was a flex. So I used to have people
come in and they would be like, well, I want
to have complete control. And I'd be thinking in the
back of my mind, like you do have complete control,
and they'd be like, I need this, this, this, and this.
(03:48):
And I used to have this friend they had a
self managed super fund, and they would always tell me
how silly I was for having managed funds, and I'd
be like, oh, okay, like you're talking to a legitimate
financial advice. So do you think I haven't thought about
this as an option and of all people to do
it as cheap as possible, it's me Because I owned
the practice. I could have had my own team set
(04:09):
that up for me for not that much, and I
still didn't do it. So I feel like that tells
you a fair bit about like how much work, how
much it goes into it, work goes into it. But
let's go back to basics. I suppose so a self
managed superfund. It allows people to manage their own superinvestments,
which is a lot deeper than having like a management
(04:31):
company or a superannuation company doing that for you. You
do have a lot more control today, So we'll get
into that a little bit later, but essentially members are
then responsible for managing their own funds, their own investment strategy,
their own compliance with regulations. That's on your shoulders and
any admin associated with it. And SMSF it's very different
(04:52):
from having a retail or a industry fund which are
managed by proper professional trustee s, which I like that.
So approximately four percent of Australians have smsfs, so they're
not that common, and they account actually for twenty eight
percent of Australia's total super assets.
Speaker 4 (05:12):
Wait a minute, that's like out of one hundred percent
of the funds that are available that are super.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
It actually makes a lot of sense. So smsfs are
often associated with high net wealth individuals because of their
complexity and the costs that's involved managing them. It's not
something that is completely preposterous, right, Like, I'm not here
saying smsfs are a terrible idea. When I was a
financial advisor, I did have clients that had very practical smsfs,
(05:43):
like they would have oodles and I'm talking like tens
of millions of dollars back of family money that was
being managed through an SMSF, like they would have massive
property portfolios. I had one client who had a vintage
car collection inside his SMSF. That was wild actually because
complete side note, when you sell cars, if you sell
(06:07):
them for a profit, you don't have to pay capital
gains tax. So there's like a little loophole that basically
only applies to the wealthy because you can't just go
buy a nice little credola and hope that this happens.
Speaker 4 (06:20):
Say, for example, like sold my really really ugly old
no window Toyota Echo downstairs for fifty bucks.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Toyota Echo is an elite car.
Speaker 4 (06:29):
It actually is an incredible car, and it's fuel.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
Efficient, and because it's a Toyota, she's good.
Speaker 4 (06:33):
For she's good for it. But if I sold it
for fifty bucks, I would have to pay.
Speaker 2 (06:38):
No, don't know whereas if you bought a house, for example,
and you paid fifty bucks for it and sold it
for one hundred, you would be up for capital gains tax.
And that's a whole other conversation. But on cars, you
don't pay that. So if you like super rich because
obviously the Corolla, the Echo, it's not going to do
it for us. But I have had clients who have
(06:59):
purchased luxury and vintage cars. They might like buy an
old Porsche nine to eleven and redo it and sell
it for a profit. That profit is their profit to keep.
They don't pay CGT on it, right, So like little tipbit,
but this client used to have vintage cars in his
SMSF and you know this is not earn investing one
oh one with Viba, Like it's interesting. The amount vintage
(07:22):
car's return in comparison to the Australian share market is astronomical.
You have to be good at it. But he used
to flip cars, and I remember thinking, oh my god,
Like I thought this was going to be an absolute
shit show because like I looked over archingly, he's an
SMSF looking, what's it made up? Off cars? Far out? Okay,
(07:44):
Like I'm going to work with his part, like what's
going on? And obviously did all my research and I
remember looking at it going what the hell? This guy's
a genius? Like he talked me through it, and he
was really good at it, like he ultimately because it
was so wealthy, he actually funded the setup of a
whole work shop that he hired staff for that did
it for everybody else, like it was a legit business.
(08:05):
But he did that so that it really brought down
the cost of him fixing up his cars. He had
somewhere to keep them, like anyway, whole different thing, but
just really quickly, Yes, if you have cars in an SMSF,
does that mean you just like the estimated value of
that is what's in your SMSF or yeah, I don't
forget to access an investment, it either has to provide
(08:26):
you with an income. A car is not going to
do that. He just had an asset, so in order
for it to provide him in income, he had to
sell the asset. So you'd have an average value of
what those cars were worth. But ultimately, a car or
a house is actually only worth what the market will
pay on the day that you sell it. So if
you go, oh, well it's worth three hundred grand, I'm
feeling safe, Well, it's only worth three hundred thousand dollars
(08:48):
if the market is willing to pay for that, Like
you'd have to find a buyer. Right, So there's a
lot more strategy And that's a side note. But back
to this, I feel like smsfs can be very costly.
They can be very fun. Like, don't get me wrong,
I don't want this entire episode to be the's warning us.
They can be fun, but in certain circumstances.
Speaker 4 (09:09):
Right, So it sounds like it is a lot of work,
but there are some benefits this, So what's the actual
catch with smsfs then why would everyone just jump on board?
If it's all about like kind of like being controlled.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
You put your echo in your SMSF.
Speaker 4 (09:23):
I would put my echo in my smsfal Mouthful.
Speaker 3 (09:26):
Isn't it.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
Yeah, it's like she sells seashells by the sea shop.
Speaker 4 (09:30):
That can also go on your SMSF.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
Ye can't haven't seen it, but happy to be corrected.
Managing an SMSF is a lot of work. It's basically
like running a tiny small business. So you're responsible for
meeting all the legal obligations. You're then responsible for making
sure that it is compliant with tax laws. You're responsible
for making sure that your fund gets audited every single year.
(09:54):
So like you need to pay someone an accountant to
audit your fund, and so many more. I won't say
hidden costs because they're not hidden, you just probably don't
know about them when you learn what an SMSF is.
And this isn't obviously my opinion, but our friends at
ASIK recommend that you have at least half a million
dollars in super before even considering setting up an SMSF
(10:14):
to justify the costs. Right, So if you don't have
more than that and you're considering it, I would wonder
why to be rude for a hot second. Is it
your ego? Do you want to be in control and
you're not willing to do the research into all of
the industry and super funds that you could work with
that are actually aligned to your values and allow you
to have a bit of a play around with the
(10:36):
amounts of different things. Or do you have somebody in
the back of your mind who's like, oh, we're a
company that sets up an SMSF, accesses your superannuation, helps
you invest it in property and wham maam, thank you, ma'am,
you're going to get an off the plan apartment. And
I think that we need to talk about these things
a little bit more because it could be all sunshine
(10:58):
and roses like I could sell it to you now,
and dodgy financial advisors, which, thankfully after the Royal Commission
can't exist anymore. Dodgy financial advisors used to set them
up and then work with a property developer that they'd
clipped the ticket on. Like if I said to you, Beck, oh, well,
actually that financial advisor who said set up an SMSF
(11:19):
actually is making five percent of your property purchase. Oh right, Okay,
that used to happen. Yeah, So there's a lot of
hesitancy in the market when it comes to talking about smsfs.
But there's also a lot of people just like me
who are or were financial advisors who've just wound up
more of them than we've ever set up, because we
(11:40):
just get new clients who maybe weren't happy with their advisor,
or they'd gotten a few years into their SMSF and
it was not working for them. And I would then
look at it and be like, who let you do
this in the first place? Oh, here's the advice I got,
And you'd read the advice and you'd just be like,
I knew in the back of my mind that there
was probably a referral going on, and someone was clipping
the ticket because otherwise it made no sense to give
(12:02):
that advice.
Speaker 4 (12:03):
Sneaky, sneaky snake.
Speaker 3 (12:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
So there's also the cost factor. Yeah, so back to
what Acik was saying, smsfs can be really expensive to
set up and they're maintain and the ATO says that
the average annual cost of running an SMSF is between
three and ten thousand dollars, depending on the complexity of it.
Speaker 4 (12:20):
Okay, so that's not small change, that's for sure. Because
here I am thinking, if you're doing it yourself, no fees,
no anything.
Speaker 2 (12:28):
No, so there's still fees, right, there's not no fees,
And they think that that's where we need to talk
about it, because even though beck Acik has said, oh well,
you'd have to have a minimum of five hundred thousand
dollars to consider setting one up, that's where people, I
think start thinking deeply about it. Right. So, like, on average,
(12:48):
the cost of managing funds in Australia is give or
take one percent. So like, if you've got a balance
of five hundred thousand dollars in your superannuation, which must
be nice, you you're probably paying at least five thousand
dollars in fees already, right, and when your superstatement comes in,
you're going to look at that and be like, five
(13:10):
grand in fees for what And the answer is administration management,
ongoing portfolio management. Probably some insurance is built into that.
So it's very easy to just see the bottom line
and go, well, I'm spending five grand on this, why
wouldn't I go spend three to ten thousand dollars on
just having my own I could sell it to you
if I wanted to, but I'm not going to.
Speaker 4 (13:31):
So it's not really something that the average person maybe
like I was gonna say you or I, but actually
just I who just wants to kind of invest smarter, Like,
it's probably not something that they should do. I know
you can't really give personal as advice, but.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
No, of course not. But you're exactly right, Like, if
you don't have a huge balance, or you're not investing
in really complex assets like property, there are much more
simple ways for you to manage your superannuation very cost
effectively and also structure effectively. Most now traditional super funds
(14:03):
actually allow you to pick your investment strategy, which we
know because I talk about that all the time, and
then they tailor it to your risk level, so you
still have a lot more control than you think you
do without all the admin stress. Like Beck, it is
twenty twenty four right now, and even if you're listening
to this in twenty twenty five, you have so much
power in superannuation. And I'll use Australian Super as an example,
(14:27):
not as a recommendation, but as an example. Because they're
a top performing fund. I feel like everyone's heard of them.
They are very trusted in our industry, and I think
that because of that, you automatically assume that they must
be a little bit fuddy duddy. But the reality is
inside Australian Super, yes, you can pick your investment strategy
and you can pick it and tailor it to your
(14:49):
risk profile, which if you haven't is a reminder to
please log in and make sure you know what those
things are. But they also allow you to take some
of the money inside your superannuation and pick an ETF
that you like, so you can actually have so much
control and allow that portfolio to reflect your values. And
if you don't know that, you don't know, and you
might think that the only way to have ultimate control
(15:11):
is to take it all out and have it in
your own fund. But the reality is you can control
so much. And if Australian super is not for you,
maybe you want an all women super fund or you
want to invest in something completely different, like there's a
super fund for everyone nowadays. Yeah, definitely find a company
that aligns with your values if that's what you're looking
(15:32):
for before you jump into Well, I have to have
ultimate control and it must be all on my shoulders, right, Yeah,
that's so true.
Speaker 4 (15:38):
Actually I did jump into mind and I kind of
like move my investments around or like mine, this feels
like I'm fully you go in and check it and
it's like I feel in control of this. So it
does sound like a much simpler option for most of us.
And I love that you can still like kind of
take charge that needing to be a super fun manager yourself.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
And I mean, would you call a super fun manager
to fix your taps if they were broken? Beck, No,
I'd call a plumber. Like I want somebody who is
an expert running the show. And given it's so affordable
to do, so, why aren't you just getting the expert involved?
Speaker 1 (16:13):
Right?
Speaker 2 (16:13):
They know what they're doing, they know what they're doing,
and like it's the plumber that has a leaky tap.
So like I knew that if I ever set up
an SMSF myself, I'd probably let it go by the wayside,
not do the right thing by it, not check everything
because I'm so busy getting in everybody else's business. Don't
they say the plumber always has a leaky tap, Like
I don't know?
Speaker 4 (16:30):
So true.
Speaker 2 (16:32):
We are all about actionable tips here at Cheese on
the Money, and we're going to take a really quick
break and when we come back, we're going to give
you the lowdown on how you can manage your super
within your super fund. So don't go anywhere.
Speaker 4 (16:47):
Welcome back everyone. So V what are the steps our
listeners can take to stay in control of their super
without getting sucked into the SMSF hype.
Speaker 2 (16:55):
So first things, Verse Beck, I don't think that you'll
be surprised. I want to talk about why it's important
firstly be in control of your super but secondly the
importance of being in control of your super, especially as
a woman. Here's the thing. On average, Australian women retire
with twenty eight percent less superanuation than their male counterparts,
(17:16):
and while that is not fair and a lot of
people could have some arguments about you know, oh my gosh,
like the gap doesn't exist. I will cut you, like,
I'm so done with that conversation because the gap exists
and I can prove it, and it's usually ignorance and
people being literally rude, Like if somebody puts their hand
(17:37):
up back and says I'm experiencing disadvantage, do you go no,
you not sit down? Yeah, like what why aren't we
getting behind it? Like I would much prefer to be like, oh, okay,
maybe this conversation isn't for me. I'm gonna dip out,
but let everybody else have a platform to share their thoughts, feelings, beliefs.
Speaker 4 (17:55):
And values absolutely because no one's experience is exact same
as yours. And if it was, and everyone will be
like you.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
Do you know what kills me the most? Beck complete
side note again and like this is me just calling
people in my DMS out. I cannot stand when a
woman of all people messages mean says well, I don't
think this gender gap is real. I've literally not experienced it.
That's not the same for everyone survivors bias.
Speaker 4 (18:19):
And yeah, and also like it might not be true.
They might not know that they could be being paid
more even though they're being paid.
Speaker 2 (18:25):
But like, even if they're like, oh, it's completely transparent,
Like I am on the same salary as all of
my male counterparts, and I have been since the day
I graduated complete TRANSPARENCYV. Your argument is flawed. Why do
you think that your experience means that everybody's experience is
reflective of that? It actually drives me insane to think
(18:46):
that you are so naive that you think because your
experience was yours must be the same for everybody else. Totally,
It's how dull would the world be if that were true?
Speaker 4 (18:55):
If that were true, and also, where did this conversation
come from?
Speaker 1 (18:59):
Then?
Speaker 4 (18:59):
If it doesn't exists, there are a.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
Lot better things to advocate for, yes than closing a gap.
Speaker 4 (19:04):
Yes, Like I.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Am saying here, I just want the same thing and
the same opportunities that are extended to my male colleagues.
I'm not saying I want more or better, like Beck.
If this didn't exist, there is a whole heap of
stuff I could be like, oh my gosh, women, we
need like three days off a week, Like I could
find some stuff to come up with and a pretty
convincing argument. But like closing a gap and asking for
(19:28):
equality bare minimum, the gap isn't because we're bad at
managing money. It's mostly due to things like career breaks
and having kids or unsurprisingly being paid less in the
first place. Beck. And basically we see it here at
Choose on the Money as the hidden tax that we
pay just for being women. What a privileged But we
(19:48):
don't have to let it stay that way, right, So
I've got a few steps of how we can take
back our power when it comes to our superannuation. And
the first is I want you to check your superbalance.
Do you know what is in your superannuation today? I think,
don't have to tell me the amount, sure, but do
you know I think so that is good And most
people in our community would be like, oh yes, maybe no, Like,
(20:13):
if you're erring on the side of caution, babe, it's
time to log into your superfund and just check. Just
check it. It will take five minutes and you will
be a lot more financially literate. There is research out
there that says when we know our numbers, we are
I think it's like eighty two percent more likely to
achieve financial security than when we don't know our numbers.
(20:34):
That's very true, and that is just you knowing, not
actually about doing anything or saving anything. We haven't even
got to the part where I make you take actual action.
Most of us don't check regularly, and I want this
to become part of your financial hygiene checklist. I want
you to do it at least every quarter. Knowing your
balance and how it's performing is going to put you
in the best possible position. Do you need to be
(20:56):
considering a different fund? The next is I want you
to review your funds, fees and the performance that your
fund has. Perfect Now, just really quickly on fees, I
do want to know. I understand why superannuation companies charge fees. Yeah,
but I'm struggling.
Speaker 4 (21:10):
To find where fees come from. If you're managing your
superfund yourself.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
It's a good question to be honest, and that comes
from all of the external support that you need. Okay,
So where does the SMSF come from? In the first place,
it needs to be established by an accountant, So setting
up the structure, registering it with the ATO and ASSIC
is going to cost you money. So getting that fund,
it's kind of like setting up a trust. As we
(21:36):
said before, I think I referred to an SMSF being
like a small business. It's like a small business cost.
So you need to register your small business. You need
to register your SMSF. You're going to need to have
an accountant. Legally, if you're a small business back you
could go, but I'm going to do the accounting myself.
That makes sense, But in an SMSF you actually can't.
You need an external auditor to perform an audit each
(21:58):
and every single year, and that audit beck can be
anywhere from three to eight thousand dollars. Oh, I see,
So that's what I'm talking about. When it comes to fees.
It's not oh, you're going to save so much because
you don't have the underlying management fee, Like there might
be underlying management fees that then sit inside your super
as well, because what would happen is, let's just get
the laundry list going. You've got to register it to
(22:20):
begin with. So charge there, You've got to pay for
your annual audit every year. Great, are you an investing wizard? Like,
let's be honest, let's pretend you're following assex rules. You
had a minimum of five hundred thousand dollars in your
super before you decided to go and get an SMSF fantastic.
You've got five hundred grand to invest. How are you
investing it? Are you going to go see a financial advisor?
(22:42):
Maybe you do right. Financial advice fees in Australia sit
between three and ten thousand dollars each and every single year,
So you've got to pay for that. You've got to
pay ongoing management fees for that financial advisor you for
you're using them if you're smarter than the average financial
advisor and you're like, well vo and a manage it myself.
If you buy ETFs, you're going to have the underlying
(23:03):
fees for owning that ETF. If you're buying direct shares,
you're going to have underlying fees for brokerage and ongoing
platform support.
Speaker 4 (23:12):
Truly only up it does.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
And that's where I go, like, this isn't as easy
as you think it is. And all of these fees
might slip through the cracks, And when I say that,
you might not remember they're there, because like brokerage might
happen and you go, will I paid fifty bucks in
brokerage to make that transaction, you've already forgotten about it,
you haven't accounted for it. Like these things over time
add up. So we want to make sure that we're
making the right decision. And when we say I want
(23:36):
you to review your fees for your currency branuation, I
want you to look at retail and industry funds, check
the fees, check the investment returns, and have a look
at what am I getting the level of control that
I want to make sure that you're in the right
account because their fees are going to be a lot cleaner.
And I'm not saying they're better or worse, but just
a lot cleaner to review, yeah, because they're going to
(23:57):
go down the bottom of your sheet. Basically, you're paying
this amount in fees, this amount of insurance, and this
amount in management because more often than not, if that
superannuation fund invests in a Vanguard ETF for example, they
are going to pass that management fee onto you. So
if Vanguard charges zero point eight percent, you are going
(24:18):
to pay that point eight percent, But then you're also
going to pay your super fund fees for them to
manage that for you. So I don't think it's a
way of money you're paying someone to make sure that
you're getting good returns money. In the next thing I
want you to do, Beck, how many super funds do
you have?
Speaker 4 (24:33):
You might be shocked by this, but I used to
have like four, Now I have one.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
So you've console a day they're ready. That is the
next hot tip. According to the ATO, about a quarter
of super fund holders actually have multiple accounts, So that
means basically twenty five percent of people listening right now
have multiple super funds and they are paying multiple sets
of fees. So we just talked about fees and how
they can add up. Imagine if you had to pay
(24:56):
double Beck while you're there. Also, can you please check
if you have any claimed super so sometimes and this
is more historical because now we are better at data matching,
but there's about eighteen billion dollars right now sitting Beck,
Oh my god, in an account that the ATO manages,
and it's lost in unclaimed superannuation that people haven't gone
(25:17):
and picked up. How do you find that online? So
you need to do some data matching three DATO website
super easy though, because the government actually doesn't want this.
They can't spend it right, they want to give it
back to you. That's very nice, like, yes, but it's
also a legality, right, Like it's lost. It's kind of
gone into lost and Found box and you can't just
go and raid the lost and Found box and take
whatever you want. That's theft. So they actually want to
(25:39):
give it back to you, so they're making it as
easy as possible. But I would have a look at it.
I would also urge your parents to look at it,
because it's more likely that they are going to have
lost super than you do because data matching. You know,
you and I are a bit younger back then, they
might have had different names, they might have gotten married,
they might have not provided enough information on a super
fund form for it to become lost. So just maybe
(26:03):
helping made out.
Speaker 4 (26:04):
Yeah, oh my god, I'm going to Google after this, all.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
Right, please do, And then we're going to assess our
investment options. Right. So we spoke before about what different
super funds can do, and it's a lot more powerful
than it used to be. But most super funds of
our different investment strategies that you can pick from, and
often I would say they're labeled like high growth, balanced,
or conservative, and most of you if you log into
(26:28):
your super fund and you've done nothing until this point.
No shame, look at you doing it now. Absolutely, But
I can almost guarantee that when you go in, you'll
see that you're in a balanced fund. Nice, okay, right
in the middle. What does that mean though? It means
that you probably got your super fund forms when you've
got your first job or a job that you had
to sign super funds for, and you're like, I don't
(26:50):
know what to pick, because if I said, Becky, your conservative,
you'd be like, no, high growth, Oh that sounds scary.
Then they're a little box and it says balanced beside it.
What one are you most comfortable ticking? If you don't
have the financial literacy you deserve to make the best
decisions for you.
Speaker 4 (27:05):
All balanced, for sure, one.
Speaker 2 (27:06):
Hundred percent, And we all did it. All of my
super funds were balanced at one point. I have since
changed it. Don't worry. I'm a very high growth investor.
But most of you are imbalanced because it was the
safest option at the time. But I can almost guarantee
that if we went and did a risk profile, which
we have done an entire episode on for the community,
(27:27):
So go and we'll put the information in the show notes,
but there is an entire episode on how to work
out what your risk profile is. I can almost guarantee
because of age and a few other factors, and the
fact that people are in the shees on the money community.
They're not balanced investors. They're probably growth or high growth.
They want more out of their money than just sitting
a lot of it in cash. Yeah, okay, so do
(27:48):
you know how much that costs you?
Speaker 3 (27:49):
Though?
Speaker 2 (27:50):
To check?
Speaker 4 (27:51):
How much?
Speaker 2 (27:51):
Nothing? It's free?
Speaker 5 (27:52):
Oh my god.
Speaker 2 (27:53):
So you can go and do this and put future
you in the best possible financial position. And you could
spend some money on a coffee and be like, but
that coffee and did a lot for future me. Yes,
that's so true, exactly right. Okay.
Speaker 4 (28:06):
My next question B is how do you know how
much you'll need in your super and how do you
get there?
Speaker 1 (28:11):
Like?
Speaker 2 (28:11):
How much cash do you need? How by the time
you retire?
Speaker 4 (28:13):
Ideally it's a.
Speaker 2 (28:14):
Good question, right. So the AFSA suggests that people will
need about five hundred and ninety five thousand dollars in
super savings at the age of sixty seven. Okay, but
couples need six hundred and ninety thousand dollars combined. It's
nice to have some clean numbers, right, it is nice.
It's nice to not have somebody turn around and be like,
(28:35):
oh well, it's up to you and your values and
your morals. Like at a minimum, the AFSA has recommended
that single people need about six hundred grand in their account. Sure,
So working then backwards, we need to work out our
lifestyle goals. What that looks like. Maybe you want to
travel around Australia and have some tinnies and you know,
maybe get an old caravan and have a sick life.
(28:56):
Or maybe you're like, we'll be Actually, I've been working
in the background and I want yacht. Those two things
cost very different amounts of money, and that is okay.
But that's where we then have to overlay our values
and what we are trying to achieve. So I know
that personally that's not going to be enough for me.
So I need to do a little bit of working backwards.
And if we work backwards cleanly, I work on about
(29:19):
five percent, and I work on five percent because it's
really conservative and I love to underpromise over deliver a
beck of course, if I say, on average, you withdraw
five percent from your retirement fund, each and every single year.
And you want an income of sixty grand in retirement,
that would mean that you need an investment portfolio of
(29:42):
one point two million dollars.
Speaker 4 (29:43):
WHOA, So you.
Speaker 2 (29:46):
Need to take everything that the AFSA says with a
grain of salt because that's on average across Australia. And
obviously there's people with really high incomes and then there's
people on lower incomes and that's all fine. But I
would work out, you know, out a five percent or downrate,
like how much do you want If it's sixty grand,
you need one point two million dollars and do some
maths yourself. You can just google it if you want
(30:07):
to as well, and work backwards. If you want eighty grand,
it's more like, have a look at that. So what
do you need in super is very different, but how
you get there is to me the most important part, right,
So the first thing you want to do is set
some goals. So working backwards, like you're already contributing to SUPER.
And I'm going to use you as an example because
(30:27):
you are a PAYG employee. So every month you get
your payslip and on that pay slip, it says Beck.
Here's how much cash we put in your bank account,
and Beck, here's how much cash were put in your superannuation?
Sure is that amount that is being contributed enough for you?
Like you did some working backwards? How much did you
need to contribute each and every single month. I've spoken
(30:49):
about it on the podcast before. My favorite website is
the money Smart website, and on that website is a
compound interest calculator where you can put in the percentage amount,
you can put in how much your plan on contributing,
and you can play with the timeline and from that
you can go, well, if I contributed five hundred dollars
a month, this is how much i'd have at retirement.
(31:09):
If I contributed ten dollars a month, this is how
much extra I would have. You can play with that.
Does that mean that you need to contribute more to
super right now? Not necessarily, But it means that you
know that the contributions that are currently being made are
either going to help you get to retirement or you
might need to do some more work. And that's really helpful,
might be disengaging. You might be like, oh my gosh,
(31:31):
but isn't it good to know now? And we can
make a plan instead of getting to sixty seven and
going hey, Bex, so you know how you thought that
you'd just re hire? Yeah? No, Umm, I want to.
Speaker 4 (31:40):
Ask really quickly. This is mainly for my mummy, who
is one of those people that unfortunately didn't know about
X mom ibex mom. Now, I don't imagine she'll have
much or if anything. Yep, and pensions still exists, right.
Speaker 2 (31:51):
Really good question if you're retiring with not enough superinnuation. Sure,
the government in Australia is brilliant. There is a pension.
You can apply for it. There's obviously whole heap of
poops that you need to get through. You can't obviously
have a massive investment portfolio, but they're no super They're
going to look at your assets and they're going to
work out whether you qualify for it. But it's definitely
something to look into. And I think that that is
(32:13):
privilege of living in Australia, right, Like, I am really
glad that we support our economy and I'm really glad
that we support people who are aging. The other thing
I want to say is superanuation only became mandatory in
nineteen ninety two. Yes, so when I was born in
nineteen ninety one, my mom didn't have compulsory subranuation, So
(32:34):
my mom in her thirties only started earning SUPER. You
and I and a lot of our community have had
the pleasure of you know, if I was born in
ninety one and superannuation was mandatory by nineteen ninety two,
by the time I was fourteen years old, in nine months,
I was making supranuation. Yes, so I have a one
up on my mom. Yes, so I got super from
fourteen years and nine months. My mom did not, So
(32:57):
I think that there's also this really big gap in this.
This is why the biggest demographic of people becoming homeless
is women in their sixties and seventies. And it makes
sense because they didn't have a lot of contributions going
into superannuation. A lot of them are, you know, deciding
to leave their partners. That's the number one driver behind homelessness.
(33:20):
It's not they're bad with money, it's not that they
didn't have good careers or good jobs. It's not because
they've done the wrong thing. It's actually because they are
behind and that breaks my heart. But that's where I
kind of want to talk about this as well and
be like, Okay, cool, like you mentioned your mum, but
also like, let's give that community a lot of grace
as well, because they didn't have the things that we
(33:41):
had now. Yes, of course, and I know that if
I looked at your super, Beck, you would have contributions
from your entire working life, like you may or may
not have dipped into it during COVID and that's so fine,
but you would have been making consistent contributions. And I
can almost guarantee that you're in a better place right
now than your mum at her age, and that's point privilege,
and I wanted to call that out, so I do apologize.
(34:03):
But then back on track, we were talking about working
out how much money you need. If you want, you
can make additional contributions and if it's right for you,
have a chat to your payroll department about maybe signing
up some salary sacrificing which means it comes out before tax,
which is quite sexy. And this allows you to send
extra money to your superannuation directly from your pay reducing
(34:26):
your taxable income, which we like to Then also, do
you know how Beck to make a contribution to your super,
Like if you say, had an extra fifty bucks and
you're like, I want to put into my super V.
Do you know how to do that?
Speaker 4 (34:38):
It's pretty easy if you log in. They kind of
make it very very clear. But I like it that
if you don't even know where you're super EA is,
you don't know where to start. I guess like googling
is the best option. But if you have a better.
Speaker 2 (34:48):
No, you are absolutely correct. So the best place to
start would be the ATO website because you can log
in and it will show you where everything is and
you can go from there. If you've forgotten your member number,
you can contact the super fund that the ATO says
you've got money with and go through that process. But
once you're able to log in and whatnot, transferring post
taxing gum so whatever is in your bank account, if
(35:10):
you go, I'd love that to be a super contribution.
It's a b pay like it is so simple. You
could even save them as a payee so that if
you were like, oh, V, I don't really know if
I'm financially able to contribute more to my super, well,
why don't you just set yourself up for success? Why
don't you just add them as a payee on your
bank account so that if ever you do decide to
(35:31):
do that, you can then transfer the cash really quickly.
Keep track of it though, because you'll claim it at
tax time and you get the tax back on it.
Speaker 4 (35:38):
True, that's a bit of a money with so you
can claim it it's before tax. You can't claim it.
Speaker 2 (35:42):
Well, you can't claim it because you wouldn't have paid tax, right,
And that makes so much sense. We can't claim tax
we didn't earn or didn't pay. It's a shame. I mean,
people have tried, but it's not going to work. The
last thing I want to say here back because I
feel like I have yapped and the second you let
me talk about a topic that I'm passionate about, she
goes on and on. I would consider getting financial advice
if you're really worried about this, so to make sure
(36:05):
that your super aligns with your long term goals. If
you haven't done all of the stuff that I've recommended,
like you haven't sat down and been like, oh, well,
how much should I contribute? Like this heaps of free
content on superannuation on our podcast. There's heaps of free
resources floating around the internet. The money Smart website is
my favorite. But if you're super stressed about it, Like,
get some financial advice and ensure that your super aligns
with your long term goals. And one thing I will
(36:27):
say is you can more often than not pay for
your financial advice out of your superannuation. There you go.
And I'm not saying that you should just pay for
everything out of your super, but if it's advice that's
putting you in the best possible position in my head,
you're investing a portion of that into the advice, so
you super count go further.
Speaker 4 (36:45):
That's actually a really good idea. I've got a few
things to share, some got hit your tricks, Okay, but
I feel like that's probably enough from us, right, Yeah.
I feel like it's a really good place to leave it.
Do you feel satisfied?
Speaker 2 (36:55):
Not yet. I really want to yap on and on
about super but I feel like we should leave it
there and leave some content for another day. Okay, Yeah, perfect,
let's do that. Let's go have a little coffee. Absolutely, Beck.
And the last thing I want to leave you with
is it is not complicated, I promise. Like when you
log in. Beck said it before, like, oh, my super
fund's really easy to understand. You just log in They've
(37:16):
got everything that you need. Like, it's not hard. It's
often the mental challenge of just taking a leap and
actually just getting it done. But I promise future you
is going to thank you and then stick to the basics.
So just check your balance, review your fees, maybe consolidate
your accounts, and choose an investment strategy that aligns with
your value. So keep it simple, stupid like that kiss methodology.
(37:39):
I promise will pay dividends. And also while I'm here,
I'm just going to say, don't forget to hit subscribe
so that you never miss an episode. And it also
really helps our show. And it also, I don't know,
Loki should help with you staying on top of your
money and making confident financial decisions. So like what a
better call out.
Speaker 4 (37:58):
Absolutely, that's a great notification. That's why follow me you'd
be rich. Yes, yes, that's a great motto. I love
her to follow you.
Speaker 2 (38:04):
All right, thank you, thank you, all right, have a
good day. We'll catch you on Friday.
Speaker 4 (38:08):
Bye, guys.
Speaker 5 (38:14):
The advice shared on She's on the Money is general
in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's
on the Money exists purely for educational purposes and should
not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision.
If you do choose to buy a financial product, read
the PDS TMD and obtain appropriate financial.
Speaker 2 (38:33):
Advice tailored towards your needs.
Speaker 5 (38:35):
Victoria Divine and She's on the Money are authorized representatives
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Hello, my name's Santasha Nabananga Bamblet. I'm a proud yor
the Order Kerni Whoalbury and a waddery woman. And before
we get started on She's on the Money podcast, I
would like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the land
of which this podcast is recorded on a wondery country,
acknowledging the elders, the ancestors and the next generation coming
(00:22):
through as this podcast is about connecting, empowering, knowledge sharing
and the storytelling of you to make a difference for
today and lasting impact for tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Let's get into it.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
She's on the Money, She's on the Money.
Speaker 4 (00:57):
Hello and welcome to She's on the Money. The podcast
is about the bank balance of future you as much
as today you do. You ever see the letters SMSF
and wonder what does that stand for? But you kind
of hear people talking about it and setting up their
own self managed super fun and have you ever thought like, am.
Speaker 2 (01:14):
I supposed to be doing that?
Speaker 1 (01:15):
Well?
Speaker 4 (01:15):
Honestly kind of same. I am excited and joining me
today our expert in all things finance and the woman
asking themselves turned to when they needed the lowdown on
millennials and their superannuation. Victoria Devine.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
That's such a flex, isn't it. I know that's actually
it was like probably my biggest career flex that is
really really cood. Oh well, as wanted my advice.
Speaker 4 (01:36):
So it's like Jesus coming to you and be like, hey,
what should I write in the Bible?
Speaker 2 (01:41):
No it's not, but I'm not gonna correct you. I
love that for us. I get asked about SMSF or
self managed super all the time. You know, when you
get super motivated and you're gonna do a really big
DIY project, but then halfway through, you're like me deep
in paint. You're standing there and you're like, why did
I decide to do this? I don't know what I'm doing.
I've messed so much up. I need to hire a pro,
(02:04):
and it might now cost me a bit more because
I've made all these mistakes that need unwinding. Well that's
kind of what an SMSF can feel like. Yeah, sure
you get to do it all yourself, beck absolutely, but
sometimes it's a lot more work than it's worth. So
today I decided it was time we're going to break
down why managing your own super fund It sounds great
(02:27):
in theory, but it can often turn more into a
DIY nightmare than a dream. And I think that that
is very poignant at the moment, because I've seen a
lot of people in our community asking should I have
an SMSF my friends set up one, or my parents
set up one, or most alarming to me, someone approached
me and said I could use the entire and mounting
(02:50):
my superannuation and buy a property with it. There are
red flags flying, Beck, they are flying, They're flying high.
Speaker 4 (02:57):
Yes, I used to think the same thing as well.
I wanted to start my own I'm like, if I
have full access to my super and no one's gonna
ask me questions, it's not the case.
Speaker 2 (03:04):
I realized it's.
Speaker 4 (03:05):
Very, very illegal.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
It's very scary. I mean, it's not illegal to have
access and invest on your own terms, absolutely.
Speaker 4 (03:10):
Not right, but to use it for your groceriason.
Speaker 2 (03:13):
Oh, no, we're not doing that, babe, Yes, absolutely not.
Speaker 4 (03:16):
I thought it sounded really good, but then yes, I
realized I'm not allowed to do that. But I've always
wanted to know about it because it kind of sounds fancy,
and like, who doesn't want more control? Should we start
with what a self managed super fund actually is.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
I think it sounds really glamorous. Like when I used
to be a financial advisor, I'd have people come in
and they would say, I really want to have a
self managed super fund, and I feel like people thought
that was a flex. So I used to have people
come in and they would be like, well, I want
to have complete control. And I'd be thinking in the
back of my mind, like you do have complete control,
and they'd be like, I need this, this, this, and this.
(03:48):
And I used to have this friend they had a
self managed super fund, and they would always tell me
how silly I was for having managed funds, and I'd
be like, oh, okay, like you're talking to a legitimate
financial advice. So do you think I haven't thought about
this as an option and of all people to do
it as cheap as possible, it's me Because I owned
the practice. I could have had my own team set
(04:09):
that up for me for not that much, and I
still didn't do it. So I feel like that tells
you a fair bit about like how much work, how
much it goes into it, work goes into it. But
let's go back to basics. I suppose so a self
managed superfund. It allows people to manage their own superinvestments,
which is a lot deeper than having like a management
(04:31):
company or a superannuation company doing that for you. You
do have a lot more control today, So we'll get
into that a little bit later, but essentially members are
then responsible for managing their own funds, their own investment strategy,
their own compliance with regulations. That's on your shoulders and
any admin associated with it. And SMSF it's very different
(04:52):
from having a retail or a industry fund which are
managed by proper professional trustee s, which I like that.
So approximately four percent of Australians have smsfs, so they're
not that common, and they account actually for twenty eight
percent of Australia's total super assets.
Speaker 4 (05:12):
Wait a minute, that's like out of one hundred percent
of the funds that are available that are super.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
It actually makes a lot of sense. So smsfs are
often associated with high net wealth individuals because of their
complexity and the costs that's involved managing them. It's not
something that is completely preposterous, right, Like, I'm not here
saying smsfs are a terrible idea. When I was a
financial advisor, I did have clients that had very practical smsfs,
(05:43):
like they would have oodles and I'm talking like tens
of millions of dollars back of family money that was
being managed through an SMSF, like they would have massive
property portfolios. I had one client who had a vintage
car collection inside his SMSF. That was wild actually because
complete side note, when you sell cars, if you sell
(06:07):
them for a profit, you don't have to pay capital
gains tax. So there's like a little loophole that basically
only applies to the wealthy because you can't just go
buy a nice little credola and hope that this happens.
Speaker 4 (06:20):
Say, for example, like sold my really really ugly old
no window Toyota Echo downstairs for fifty bucks.
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Toyota Echo is an elite car.
Speaker 4 (06:29):
It actually is an incredible car, and it's fuel.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
Efficient, and because it's a Toyota, she's good.
Speaker 4 (06:33):
For she's good for it. But if I sold it
for fifty bucks, I would have to pay.
Speaker 2 (06:38):
No, don't know whereas if you bought a house, for example,
and you paid fifty bucks for it and sold it
for one hundred, you would be up for capital gains tax.
And that's a whole other conversation. But on cars, you
don't pay that. So if you like super rich because
obviously the Corolla, the Echo, it's not going to do
it for us. But I have had clients who have
(06:59):
purchased luxury and vintage cars. They might like buy an
old Porsche nine to eleven and redo it and sell
it for a profit. That profit is their profit to keep.
They don't pay CGT on it, right, So like little tipbit,
but this client used to have vintage cars in his
SMSF and you know this is not earn investing one
oh one with Viba, Like it's interesting. The amount vintage
(07:22):
car's return in comparison to the Australian share market is astronomical.
You have to be good at it. But he used
to flip cars, and I remember thinking, oh my god,
Like I thought this was going to be an absolute
shit show because like I looked over archingly, he's an
SMSF looking, what's it made up? Off cars? Far out? Okay,
(07:44):
Like I'm going to work with his part, like what's
going on? And obviously did all my research and I
remember looking at it going what the hell? This guy's
a genius? Like he talked me through it, and he
was really good at it, like he ultimately because it
was so wealthy, he actually funded the setup of a
whole work shop that he hired staff for that did
it for everybody else, like it was a legit business.
(08:05):
But he did that so that it really brought down
the cost of him fixing up his cars. He had
somewhere to keep them, like anyway, whole different thing, but
just really quickly, Yes, if you have cars in an SMSF,
does that mean you just like the estimated value of
that is what's in your SMSF or yeah, I don't
forget to access an investment, it either has to provide
(08:26):
you with an income. A car is not going to
do that. He just had an asset, so in order
for it to provide him in income, he had to
sell the asset. So you'd have an average value of
what those cars were worth. But ultimately, a car or
a house is actually only worth what the market will
pay on the day that you sell it. So if
you go, oh, well it's worth three hundred grand, I'm
feeling safe, Well, it's only worth three hundred thousand dollars
(08:48):
if the market is willing to pay for that, Like
you'd have to find a buyer. Right, So there's a
lot more strategy And that's a side note. But back
to this, I feel like smsfs can be very costly.
They can be very fun. Like, don't get me wrong,
I don't want this entire episode to be the's warning us.
They can be fun, but in certain circumstances.
Speaker 4 (09:09):
Right, So it sounds like it is a lot of work,
but there are some benefits this, So what's the actual
catch with smsfs then why would everyone just jump on board?
If it's all about like kind of like being controlled.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
You put your echo in your SMSF.
Speaker 4 (09:23):
I would put my echo in my smsfal Mouthful.
Speaker 3 (09:26):
Isn't it.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
Yeah, it's like she sells seashells by the sea shop.
Speaker 4 (09:30):
That can also go on your SMSF.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
Ye can't haven't seen it, but happy to be corrected.
Managing an SMSF is a lot of work. It's basically
like running a tiny small business. So you're responsible for
meeting all the legal obligations. You're then responsible for making
sure that it is compliant with tax laws. You're responsible
for making sure that your fund gets audited every single year.
(09:54):
So like you need to pay someone an accountant to
audit your fund, and so many more. I won't say
hidden costs because they're not hidden, you just probably don't
know about them when you learn what an SMSF is.
And this isn't obviously my opinion, but our friends at
ASIK recommend that you have at least half a million
dollars in super before even considering setting up an SMSF
(10:14):
to justify the costs. Right, So if you don't have
more than that and you're considering it, I would wonder
why to be rude for a hot second. Is it
your ego? Do you want to be in control and
you're not willing to do the research into all of
the industry and super funds that you could work with
that are actually aligned to your values and allow you
to have a bit of a play around with the
(10:36):
amounts of different things. Or do you have somebody in
the back of your mind who's like, oh, we're a
company that sets up an SMSF, accesses your superannuation, helps
you invest it in property and wham maam, thank you, ma'am,
you're going to get an off the plan apartment. And
I think that we need to talk about these things
a little bit more because it could be all sunshine
(10:58):
and roses like I could sell it to you now,
and dodgy financial advisors, which, thankfully after the Royal Commission
can't exist anymore. Dodgy financial advisors used to set them
up and then work with a property developer that they'd
clipped the ticket on. Like if I said to you, Beck, oh, well,
actually that financial advisor who said set up an SMSF
(11:19):
actually is making five percent of your property purchase. Oh right, Okay,
that used to happen. Yeah, So there's a lot of
hesitancy in the market when it comes to talking about smsfs.
But there's also a lot of people just like me
who are or were financial advisors who've just wound up
more of them than we've ever set up, because we
(11:40):
just get new clients who maybe weren't happy with their advisor,
or they'd gotten a few years into their SMSF and
it was not working for them. And I would then
look at it and be like, who let you do
this in the first place? Oh, here's the advice I got,
And you'd read the advice and you'd just be like,
I knew in the back of my mind that there
was probably a referral going on, and someone was clipping
the ticket because otherwise it made no sense to give
(12:02):
that advice.
Speaker 4 (12:03):
Sneaky, sneaky snake.
Speaker 3 (12:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
So there's also the cost factor. Yeah, so back to
what Acik was saying, smsfs can be really expensive to
set up and they're maintain and the ATO says that
the average annual cost of running an SMSF is between
three and ten thousand dollars, depending on the complexity of it.
Speaker 4 (12:20):
Okay, so that's not small change, that's for sure. Because
here I am thinking, if you're doing it yourself, no fees,
no anything.
Speaker 2 (12:28):
No, so there's still fees, right, there's not no fees,
And they think that that's where we need to talk
about it, because even though beck Acik has said, oh well,
you'd have to have a minimum of five hundred thousand
dollars to consider setting one up, that's where people, I
think start thinking deeply about it. Right. So, like, on average,
(12:48):
the cost of managing funds in Australia is give or
take one percent. So like, if you've got a balance
of five hundred thousand dollars in your superannuation, which must
be nice, you you're probably paying at least five thousand
dollars in fees already, right, and when your superstatement comes in,
you're going to look at that and be like, five
(13:10):
grand in fees for what And the answer is administration management,
ongoing portfolio management. Probably some insurance is built into that.
So it's very easy to just see the bottom line
and go, well, I'm spending five grand on this, why
wouldn't I go spend three to ten thousand dollars on
just having my own I could sell it to you
if I wanted to, but I'm not going to.
Speaker 4 (13:31):
So it's not really something that the average person maybe
like I was gonna say you or I, but actually
just I who just wants to kind of invest smarter, Like,
it's probably not something that they should do. I know
you can't really give personal as advice, but.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
No, of course not. But you're exactly right, Like, if
you don't have a huge balance, or you're not investing
in really complex assets like property, there are much more
simple ways for you to manage your superannuation very cost
effectively and also structure effectively. Most now traditional super funds
(14:03):
actually allow you to pick your investment strategy, which we
know because I talk about that all the time, and
then they tailor it to your risk level, so you
still have a lot more control than you think you
do without all the admin stress. Like Beck, it is
twenty twenty four right now, and even if you're listening
to this in twenty twenty five, you have so much
power in superannuation. And I'll use Australian Super as an example,
(14:27):
not as a recommendation, but as an example. Because they're
a top performing fund. I feel like everyone's heard of them.
They are very trusted in our industry, and I think
that because of that, you automatically assume that they must
be a little bit fuddy duddy. But the reality is
inside Australian Super, yes, you can pick your investment strategy
and you can pick it and tailor it to your
(14:49):
risk profile, which if you haven't is a reminder to
please log in and make sure you know what those
things are. But they also allow you to take some
of the money inside your superannuation and pick an ETF
that you like, so you can actually have so much
control and allow that portfolio to reflect your values. And
if you don't know that, you don't know, and you
might think that the only way to have ultimate control
(15:11):
is to take it all out and have it in
your own fund. But the reality is you can control
so much. And if Australian super is not for you,
maybe you want an all women super fund or you
want to invest in something completely different, like there's a
super fund for everyone nowadays. Yeah, definitely find a company
that aligns with your values if that's what you're looking
(15:32):
for before you jump into Well, I have to have
ultimate control and it must be all on my shoulders, right, Yeah,
that's so true.
Speaker 4 (15:38):
Actually I did jump into mind and I kind of
like move my investments around or like mine, this feels
like I'm fully you go in and check it and
it's like I feel in control of this. So it
does sound like a much simpler option for most of us.
And I love that you can still like kind of
take charge that needing to be a super fun manager yourself.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
And I mean, would you call a super fun manager
to fix your taps if they were broken? Beck, No,
I'd call a plumber. Like I want somebody who is
an expert running the show. And given it's so affordable
to do, so, why aren't you just getting the expert involved?
Speaker 1 (16:13):
Right?
Speaker 2 (16:13):
They know what they're doing, they know what they're doing,
and like it's the plumber that has a leaky tap.
So like I knew that if I ever set up
an SMSF myself, I'd probably let it go by the wayside,
not do the right thing by it, not check everything
because I'm so busy getting in everybody else's business. Don't
they say the plumber always has a leaky tap, Like
I don't know?
Speaker 4 (16:30):
So true.
Speaker 2 (16:32):
We are all about actionable tips here at Cheese on
the Money, and we're going to take a really quick
break and when we come back, we're going to give
you the lowdown on how you can manage your super
within your super fund. So don't go anywhere.
Speaker 4 (16:47):
Welcome back everyone. So V what are the steps our
listeners can take to stay in control of their super
without getting sucked into the SMSF hype.
Speaker 2 (16:55):
So first things, Verse Beck, I don't think that you'll
be surprised. I want to talk about why it's important
firstly be in control of your super but secondly the
importance of being in control of your super, especially as
a woman. Here's the thing. On average, Australian women retire
with twenty eight percent less superanuation than their male counterparts,
(17:16):
and while that is not fair and a lot of
people could have some arguments about you know, oh my gosh,
like the gap doesn't exist. I will cut you, like,
I'm so done with that conversation because the gap exists
and I can prove it, and it's usually ignorance and
people being literally rude, Like if somebody puts their hand
(17:37):
up back and says I'm experiencing disadvantage, do you go no,
you not sit down? Yeah, like what why aren't we
getting behind it? Like I would much prefer to be like, oh, okay,
maybe this conversation isn't for me. I'm gonna dip out,
but let everybody else have a platform to share their thoughts, feelings, beliefs.
Speaker 4 (17:55):
And values absolutely because no one's experience is exact same
as yours. And if it was, and everyone will be
like you.
Speaker 2 (18:00):
Do you know what kills me the most? Beck complete
side note again and like this is me just calling
people in my DMS out. I cannot stand when a
woman of all people messages mean says well, I don't
think this gender gap is real. I've literally not experienced it.
That's not the same for everyone survivors bias.
Speaker 4 (18:19):
And yeah, and also like it might not be true.
They might not know that they could be being paid
more even though they're being paid.
Speaker 2 (18:25):
But like, even if they're like, oh, it's completely transparent,
Like I am on the same salary as all of
my male counterparts, and I have been since the day
I graduated complete TRANSPARENCYV. Your argument is flawed. Why do
you think that your experience means that everybody's experience is
reflective of that? It actually drives me insane to think
(18:46):
that you are so naive that you think because your
experience was yours must be the same for everybody else. Totally,
It's how dull would the world be if that were true?
Speaker 4 (18:55):
If that were true, and also, where did this conversation
come from?
Speaker 1 (18:59):
Then?
Speaker 4 (18:59):
If it doesn't exists, there are a.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
Lot better things to advocate for, yes than closing a gap.
Speaker 4 (19:04):
Yes, Like I.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Am saying here, I just want the same thing and
the same opportunities that are extended to my male colleagues.
I'm not saying I want more or better, like Beck.
If this didn't exist, there is a whole heap of
stuff I could be like, oh my gosh, women, we
need like three days off a week, Like I could
find some stuff to come up with and a pretty
convincing argument. But like closing a gap and asking for
(19:28):
equality bare minimum, the gap isn't because we're bad at
managing money. It's mostly due to things like career breaks
and having kids or unsurprisingly being paid less in the
first place. Beck. And basically we see it here at
Choose on the Money as the hidden tax that we
pay just for being women. What a privileged But we
(19:48):
don't have to let it stay that way, right, So
I've got a few steps of how we can take
back our power when it comes to our superannuation. And
the first is I want you to check your superbalance.
Do you know what is in your superannuation today? I think,
don't have to tell me the amount, sure, but do
you know I think so that is good And most
people in our community would be like, oh yes, maybe no, Like,
(20:13):
if you're erring on the side of caution, babe, it's
time to log into your superfund and just check. Just
check it. It will take five minutes and you will
be a lot more financially literate. There is research out
there that says when we know our numbers, we are
I think it's like eighty two percent more likely to
achieve financial security than when we don't know our numbers.
(20:34):
That's very true, and that is just you knowing, not
actually about doing anything or saving anything. We haven't even
got to the part where I make you take actual action.
Most of us don't check regularly, and I want this
to become part of your financial hygiene checklist. I want
you to do it at least every quarter. Knowing your
balance and how it's performing is going to put you
in the best possible position. Do you need to be
(20:56):
considering a different fund? The next is I want you
to review your funds, fees and the performance that your
fund has. Perfect Now, just really quickly on fees, I
do want to know. I understand why superannuation companies charge fees. Yeah,
but I'm struggling.
Speaker 4 (21:10):
To find where fees come from. If you're managing your
superfund yourself.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
It's a good question to be honest, and that comes
from all of the external support that you need. Okay,
So where does the SMSF come from? In the first place,
it needs to be established by an accountant, So setting
up the structure, registering it with the ATO and ASSIC
is going to cost you money. So getting that fund,
it's kind of like setting up a trust. As we
(21:36):
said before, I think I referred to an SMSF being
like a small business. It's like a small business cost.
So you need to register your small business. You need
to register your SMSF. You're going to need to have
an accountant. Legally, if you're a small business back you
could go, but I'm going to do the accounting myself.
That makes sense, But in an SMSF you actually can't.
You need an external auditor to perform an audit each
(21:58):
and every single year, and that audit beck can be
anywhere from three to eight thousand dollars. Oh, I see,
So that's what I'm talking about. When it comes to fees.
It's not oh, you're going to save so much because
you don't have the underlying management fee, Like there might
be underlying management fees that then sit inside your super
as well, because what would happen is, let's just get
the laundry list going. You've got to register it to
(22:20):
begin with. So charge there, You've got to pay for
your annual audit every year. Great, are you an investing wizard? Like,
let's be honest, let's pretend you're following assex rules. You
had a minimum of five hundred thousand dollars in your
super before you decided to go and get an SMSF fantastic.
You've got five hundred grand to invest. How are you
investing it? Are you going to go see a financial advisor?
(22:42):
Maybe you do right. Financial advice fees in Australia sit
between three and ten thousand dollars each and every single year,
So you've got to pay for that. You've got to
pay ongoing management fees for that financial advisor you for
you're using them if you're smarter than the average financial
advisor and you're like, well vo and a manage it myself.
If you buy ETFs, you're going to have the underlying
(23:03):
fees for owning that ETF. If you're buying direct shares,
you're going to have underlying fees for brokerage and ongoing
platform support.
Speaker 4 (23:12):
Truly only up it does.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
And that's where I go, like, this isn't as easy
as you think it is. And all of these fees
might slip through the cracks, And when I say that,
you might not remember they're there, because like brokerage might
happen and you go, will I paid fifty bucks in
brokerage to make that transaction, you've already forgotten about it,
you haven't accounted for it. Like these things over time
add up. So we want to make sure that we're
making the right decision. And when we say I want
(23:36):
you to review your fees for your currency branuation, I
want you to look at retail and industry funds, check
the fees, check the investment returns, and have a look
at what am I getting the level of control that
I want to make sure that you're in the right
account because their fees are going to be a lot cleaner.
And I'm not saying they're better or worse, but just
a lot cleaner to review, yeah, because they're going to
(23:57):
go down the bottom of your sheet. Basically, you're paying
this amount in fees, this amount of insurance, and this
amount in management because more often than not, if that
superannuation fund invests in a Vanguard ETF for example, they
are going to pass that management fee onto you. So
if Vanguard charges zero point eight percent, you are going
(24:18):
to pay that point eight percent, But then you're also
going to pay your super fund fees for them to
manage that for you. So I don't think it's a
way of money you're paying someone to make sure that
you're getting good returns money. In the next thing I
want you to do, Beck, how many super funds do
you have?
Speaker 4 (24:33):
You might be shocked by this, but I used to
have like four, Now I have one.
Speaker 2 (24:35):
So you've console a day they're ready. That is the
next hot tip. According to the ATO, about a quarter
of super fund holders actually have multiple accounts, So that
means basically twenty five percent of people listening right now
have multiple super funds and they are paying multiple sets
of fees. So we just talked about fees and how
they can add up. Imagine if you had to pay
(24:56):
double Beck while you're there. Also, can you please check
if you have any claimed super so sometimes and this
is more historical because now we are better at data matching,
but there's about eighteen billion dollars right now sitting Beck,
Oh my god, in an account that the ATO manages,
and it's lost in unclaimed superannuation that people haven't gone
(25:17):
and picked up. How do you find that online? So
you need to do some data matching three DATO website
super easy though, because the government actually doesn't want this.
They can't spend it right, they want to give it
back to you. That's very nice, like, yes, but it's
also a legality, right, Like it's lost. It's kind of
gone into lost and Found box and you can't just
go and raid the lost and Found box and take
whatever you want. That's theft. So they actually want to
(25:39):
give it back to you, so they're making it as
easy as possible. But I would have a look at it.
I would also urge your parents to look at it,
because it's more likely that they are going to have
lost super than you do because data matching. You know,
you and I are a bit younger back then, they
might have had different names, they might have gotten married,
they might have not provided enough information on a super
fund form for it to become lost. So just maybe
(26:03):
helping made out.
Speaker 4 (26:04):
Yeah, oh my god, I'm going to Google after this, all.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
Right, please do, And then we're going to assess our
investment options. Right. So we spoke before about what different
super funds can do, and it's a lot more powerful
than it used to be. But most super funds of
our different investment strategies that you can pick from, and
often I would say they're labeled like high growth, balanced,
or conservative, and most of you if you log into
(26:28):
your super fund and you've done nothing until this point.
No shame, look at you doing it now. Absolutely, But
I can almost guarantee that when you go in, you'll
see that you're in a balanced fund. Nice, okay, right
in the middle. What does that mean though? It means
that you probably got your super fund forms when you've
got your first job or a job that you had
to sign super funds for, and you're like, I don't
(26:50):
know what to pick, because if I said, Becky, your conservative,
you'd be like, no, high growth, Oh that sounds scary.
Then they're a little box and it says balanced beside it.
What one are you most comfortable ticking? If you don't
have the financial literacy you deserve to make the best
decisions for you.
Speaker 4 (27:05):
All balanced, for sure, one.
Speaker 2 (27:06):
Hundred percent, And we all did it. All of my
super funds were balanced at one point. I have since
changed it. Don't worry. I'm a very high growth investor.
But most of you are imbalanced because it was the
safest option at the time. But I can almost guarantee
that if we went and did a risk profile, which
we have done an entire episode on for the community,
(27:27):
So go and we'll put the information in the show notes,
but there is an entire episode on how to work
out what your risk profile is. I can almost guarantee
because of age and a few other factors, and the
fact that people are in the shees on the money community.
They're not balanced investors. They're probably growth or high growth.
They want more out of their money than just sitting
a lot of it in cash. Yeah, okay, so do
(27:48):
you know how much that costs you?
Speaker 3 (27:49):
Though?
Speaker 2 (27:50):
To check?
Speaker 4 (27:51):
How much?
Speaker 2 (27:51):
Nothing? It's free?
Speaker 5 (27:52):
Oh my god.
Speaker 2 (27:53):
So you can go and do this and put future
you in the best possible financial position. And you could
spend some money on a coffee and be like, but
that coffee and did a lot for future me. Yes,
that's so true, exactly right. Okay.
Speaker 4 (28:06):
My next question B is how do you know how
much you'll need in your super and how do you
get there?
Speaker 1 (28:11):
Like?
Speaker 2 (28:11):
How much cash do you need? How by the time
you retire?
Speaker 4 (28:13):
Ideally it's a.
Speaker 2 (28:14):
Good question, right. So the AFSA suggests that people will
need about five hundred and ninety five thousand dollars in
super savings at the age of sixty seven. Okay, but
couples need six hundred and ninety thousand dollars combined. It's
nice to have some clean numbers, right, it is nice.
It's nice to not have somebody turn around and be like,
(28:35):
oh well, it's up to you and your values and
your morals. Like at a minimum, the AFSA has recommended
that single people need about six hundred grand in their account. Sure,
So working then backwards, we need to work out our
lifestyle goals. What that looks like. Maybe you want to
travel around Australia and have some tinnies and you know,
maybe get an old caravan and have a sick life.
(28:56):
Or maybe you're like, we'll be Actually, I've been working
in the background and I want yacht. Those two things
cost very different amounts of money, and that is okay.
But that's where we then have to overlay our values
and what we are trying to achieve. So I know
that personally that's not going to be enough for me.
So I need to do a little bit of working backwards.
And if we work backwards cleanly, I work on about
(29:19):
five percent, and I work on five percent because it's
really conservative and I love to underpromise over deliver a
beck of course, if I say, on average, you withdraw
five percent from your retirement fund, each and every single year.
And you want an income of sixty grand in retirement,
that would mean that you need an investment portfolio of
(29:42):
one point two million dollars.
Speaker 4 (29:43):
WHOA, So you.
Speaker 2 (29:46):
Need to take everything that the AFSA says with a
grain of salt because that's on average across Australia. And
obviously there's people with really high incomes and then there's
people on lower incomes and that's all fine. But I
would work out, you know, out a five percent or downrate,
like how much do you want If it's sixty grand,
you need one point two million dollars and do some
maths yourself. You can just google it if you want
(30:07):
to as well, and work backwards. If you want eighty grand,
it's more like, have a look at that. So what
do you need in super is very different, but how
you get there is to me the most important part, right,
So the first thing you want to do is set
some goals. So working backwards, like you're already contributing to SUPER.
And I'm going to use you as an example because
(30:27):
you are a PAYG employee. So every month you get
your payslip and on that pay slip, it says Beck.
Here's how much cash we put in your bank account,
and Beck, here's how much cash were put in your superannuation?
Sure is that amount that is being contributed enough for you?
Like you did some working backwards? How much did you
need to contribute each and every single month. I've spoken
(30:49):
about it on the podcast before. My favorite website is
the money Smart website, and on that website is a
compound interest calculator where you can put in the percentage amount,
you can put in how much your plan on contributing,
and you can play with the timeline and from that
you can go, well, if I contributed five hundred dollars
a month, this is how much i'd have at retirement.
(31:09):
If I contributed ten dollars a month, this is how
much extra I would have. You can play with that.
Does that mean that you need to contribute more to
super right now? Not necessarily, But it means that you
know that the contributions that are currently being made are
either going to help you get to retirement or you
might need to do some more work. And that's really helpful,
might be disengaging. You might be like, oh my gosh,
(31:31):
but isn't it good to know now? And we can
make a plan instead of getting to sixty seven and
going hey, Bex, so you know how you thought that
you'd just re hire? Yeah? No, Umm, I want to.
Speaker 4 (31:40):
Ask really quickly. This is mainly for my mummy, who
is one of those people that unfortunately didn't know about
X mom ibex mom. Now, I don't imagine she'll have
much or if anything. Yep, and pensions still exists, right.
Speaker 2 (31:51):
Really good question if you're retiring with not enough superinnuation. Sure,
the government in Australia is brilliant. There is a pension.
You can apply for it. There's obviously whole heap of
poops that you need to get through. You can't obviously
have a massive investment portfolio, but they're no super They're
going to look at your assets and they're going to
work out whether you qualify for it. But it's definitely
something to look into. And I think that that is
(32:13):
privilege of living in Australia, right, Like, I am really
glad that we support our economy and I'm really glad
that we support people who are aging. The other thing
I want to say is superanuation only became mandatory in
nineteen ninety two. Yes, so when I was born in
nineteen ninety one, my mom didn't have compulsory subranuation, So
(32:34):
my mom in her thirties only started earning SUPER. You
and I and a lot of our community have had
the pleasure of you know, if I was born in
ninety one and superannuation was mandatory by nineteen ninety two,
by the time I was fourteen years old, in nine months,
I was making supranuation. Yes, so I have a one
up on my mom. Yes, so I got super from
fourteen years and nine months. My mom did not, So
(32:57):
I think that there's also this really big gap in this.
This is why the biggest demographic of people becoming homeless
is women in their sixties and seventies. And it makes
sense because they didn't have a lot of contributions going
into superannuation. A lot of them are, you know, deciding
to leave their partners. That's the number one driver behind homelessness.
(33:20):
It's not they're bad with money, it's not that they
didn't have good careers or good jobs. It's not because
they've done the wrong thing. It's actually because they are
behind and that breaks my heart. But that's where I
kind of want to talk about this as well and
be like, Okay, cool, like you mentioned your mum, but
also like, let's give that community a lot of grace
as well, because they didn't have the things that we
(33:41):
had now. Yes, of course, and I know that if
I looked at your super, Beck, you would have contributions
from your entire working life, like you may or may
not have dipped into it during COVID and that's so fine,
but you would have been making consistent contributions. And I
can almost guarantee that you're in a better place right
now than your mum at her age, and that's point privilege,
and I wanted to call that out, so I do apologize.
(34:03):
But then back on track, we were talking about working
out how much money you need. If you want, you
can make additional contributions and if it's right for you,
have a chat to your payroll department about maybe signing
up some salary sacrificing which means it comes out before tax,
which is quite sexy. And this allows you to send
extra money to your superannuation directly from your pay reducing
(34:26):
your taxable income, which we like to Then also, do
you know how Beck to make a contribution to your super,
Like if you say, had an extra fifty bucks and
you're like, I want to put into my super V.
Do you know how to do that?
Speaker 4 (34:38):
It's pretty easy if you log in. They kind of
make it very very clear. But I like it that
if you don't even know where you're super EA is,
you don't know where to start. I guess like googling
is the best option. But if you have a better.
Speaker 2 (34:48):
No, you are absolutely correct. So the best place to
start would be the ATO website because you can log
in and it will show you where everything is and
you can go from there. If you've forgotten your member number,
you can contact the super fund that the ATO says
you've got money with and go through that process. But
once you're able to log in and whatnot, transferring post
taxing gum so whatever is in your bank account, if
(35:10):
you go, I'd love that to be a super contribution.
It's a b pay like it is so simple. You
could even save them as a payee so that if
you were like, oh, V, I don't really know if
I'm financially able to contribute more to my super, well,
why don't you just set yourself up for success? Why
don't you just add them as a payee on your
bank account so that if ever you do decide to
(35:31):
do that, you can then transfer the cash really quickly.
Keep track of it though, because you'll claim it at
tax time and you get the tax back on it.
Speaker 4 (35:38):
True, that's a bit of a money with so you
can claim it it's before tax. You can't claim it.
Speaker 2 (35:42):
Well, you can't claim it because you wouldn't have paid tax, right,
And that makes so much sense. We can't claim tax
we didn't earn or didn't pay. It's a shame. I mean,
people have tried, but it's not going to work. The
last thing I want to say here back because I
feel like I have yapped and the second you let
me talk about a topic that I'm passionate about, she
goes on and on. I would consider getting financial advice
if you're really worried about this, so to make sure
(36:05):
that your super aligns with your long term goals. If
you haven't done all of the stuff that I've recommended,
like you haven't sat down and been like, oh, well,
how much should I contribute? Like this heaps of free
content on superannuation on our podcast. There's heaps of free
resources floating around the internet. The money Smart website is
my favorite. But if you're super stressed about it, Like,
get some financial advice and ensure that your super aligns
with your long term goals. And one thing I will
(36:27):
say is you can more often than not pay for
your financial advice out of your superannuation. There you go.
And I'm not saying that you should just pay for
everything out of your super, but if it's advice that's
putting you in the best possible position in my head,
you're investing a portion of that into the advice, so
you super count go further.
Speaker 4 (36:45):
That's actually a really good idea. I've got a few
things to share, some got hit your tricks, Okay, but
I feel like that's probably enough from us, right, Yeah.
I feel like it's a really good place to leave it.
Do you feel satisfied?
Speaker 2 (36:55):
Not yet. I really want to yap on and on
about super but I feel like we should leave it
there and leave some content for another day. Okay, Yeah, perfect,
let's do that. Let's go have a little coffee. Absolutely, Beck.
And the last thing I want to leave you with
is it is not complicated, I promise. Like when you
log in. Beck said it before, like, oh, my super
fund's really easy to understand. You just log in They've
(37:16):
got everything that you need. Like, it's not hard. It's
often the mental challenge of just taking a leap and
actually just getting it done. But I promise future you
is going to thank you and then stick to the basics.
So just check your balance, review your fees, maybe consolidate
your accounts, and choose an investment strategy that aligns with
your value. So keep it simple, stupid like that kiss methodology.
(37:39):
I promise will pay dividends. And also while I'm here,
I'm just going to say, don't forget to hit subscribe
so that you never miss an episode. And it also
really helps our show. And it also, I don't know,
Loki should help with you staying on top of your
money and making confident financial decisions. So like what a
better call out.
Speaker 4 (37:58):
Absolutely, that's a great notification. That's why follow me you'd
be rich. Yes, yes, that's a great motto. I love
her to follow you.
Speaker 2 (38:04):
All right, thank you, thank you, all right, have a
good day. We'll catch you on Friday.
Speaker 4 (38:08):
Bye, guys.
Speaker 5 (38:14):
The advice shared on She's on the Money is general
in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's
on the Money exists purely for educational purposes and should
not be relied upon to make an investment or financial decision.
If you do choose to buy a financial product, read
the PDS TMD and obtain appropriate financial.
Speaker 2 (38:33):
Advice tailored towards your needs.
Speaker 5 (38:35):
Victoria Divine and She's on the Money are authorized representatives
of money sheirper pty Ltd ABN three two one IS
six four nine two seven seven zero eight AFSL four
five one two eight nine
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