April 1, 2025 • 29 mins
Are you still trying to get your head around what this budget means for you? Well Victoria went straight to Parliament House to sit down with Finance Minister & Minister for Women Katy Gallagher and ask the questions we actually care about... no fluff, no jargon, just real answers about what this budget means for you. They cover everything from HECS indexation changes and rent relief to energy bill support, women’s health funding, and that massive $27 billion deficit. And yes she straight-up asked if it’s all just pre-election hype.
They unpack:
💰What the Finance Minister actually does
💰Can we get cost-of-living relief without wrecking inflation?
💰That $27B deficit (and why it’s not just bad news)
💰Big wins for women’s health: endo, menopause, bulk billing
💰Rent support, housing plans, and the long game
💰Why your groceries cost so much and what’s being done
Hit play if you’re over the headlines and want to know what this budget actually means for your money.
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Acknowledgement of Country By Natarsha Bamblett aka Queen Acknowledgements.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello, my name's Santasha Nabananga Bamblet. I'm a proud or
the Order Kerni Whaltbury and a waddery woman. And before
we get started on She's on the Money podcast, I
would like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the land
of which this podcast is recorded on a wondery country,
acknowledging the elders, the ancestors and the next generation coming
(00:22):
through as this podcast is about connecting, empowering, knowledge sharing
and the storytelling of you to make a difference for
today and lasting impact for tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Let's get into it.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
She's on the Money, She's on the Money.
Speaker 4 (00:57):
Hello, and welcome to She's on the Money, the podcast
that translates government budgets into information that you are actually
going to be able to understand. If you felt like
you need a politics degree just to understand if the
budget this year is good or bad, or you're sitting
there like, wait, what is a structural deficit? And why
(01:17):
should I even care? Or maybe you're just wondering cool,
but does any of this actually help me or benefit me?
My friend, you are in exactly the right place. I'm
Victoria Devine, the one that's here to ask the real questions,
cut through the spin and make this budget makes sense
for real life. And today, which is actually the day
after the big budget announcement, I'm doing a very special
(01:40):
recording from Parliament House in Canberra. But I'm not doing
it alone, which would be a little bit sad. I
am joined by someone who helped shape this year's federal
budget from the inside. Senator Katie Gallagher is the Minister
for Finance and the Minister for Women, and she's here
to chat with us about what made it into the budget,
(02:02):
what didn't make it and what it actually means to you. Katie,
welcome to She's on the money. Thank you so much
for having me on. It's very exciting. It is, honestly
for me career highlight. Guys, I'm in parliament. Baby Victoria
would be shaking.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
In her boots right now.
Speaker 4 (02:19):
First of all, I'm just going to start this off
assuming that a lot of my community haven't dipped their
toes in the political waters yet. And I have seen
questions in my community of Victoria. What's the difference between
the Minister of Finance and the treasurer, How does that
relationship work and what are the different roles.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
Okay, so that's a great question. Really Jim and I.
Speaker 5 (02:42):
So, Jim Chalmers is the Treasurer, I'm the finance minister.
We work very closely together on all matters relating to
the budget, but really on all matters relating to economic
policy as well. But if I could sort of simplify
it down, I think really Jim is the lead economic minister.
He's in charge of economic policy across the country, revenue,
(03:04):
all those big kind of nationally important things. And I'm
responsible for the money, like where's the money coming from?
Where are the savings? More of like the accounting book
keeper part of the business. So are you in a
nitty gritty I am like, I'm gettings.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
Yeah, you're in the one. I want that role. I
don't want to be treasurer. I want to be nosy.
I know, well the.
Speaker 5 (03:27):
Treasure has a lot of responsibilities. He's busy, but he
can be nosy and give him the highlight I can
and love. They have my fingers really in every single
thing that happens across government. So I know what's happening
in other minister's portfolios. I know what policy is being
developed up. Yeah, it's a very interesting role, but I'm
(03:48):
kind of yeah, it really suits my personality, which is
naturally nosy.
Speaker 4 (03:52):
O me too, like I don't want to be part
of the drama or the gossip, but I actually would
really like to know what's going on, just committing me
in the loop, Like if you give me a budget
or a spreadsheet, I will do a little bit of
a nosey into what that means and how that works.
You are also, in addition to being the Minister for Finance,
you are the Minister for Women, which I think is
(04:15):
so special and so cool. But let's wrap it back
to the budget. Was this a good budget for women?
Speaker 1 (04:21):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (04:21):
I think so.
Speaker 5 (04:22):
You know, we've worked hard on it. There's some really
good and important big announcements for women, but it shouldn't
be seen in isolation of the other three budgets we've
done where we've tried to shift the dial for women
as well. I think, you know, like for the last decade,
really I feel like women's policy had really been a
bit more of an afterthought. It wasn't kind of central
at the table, kind of a front of mind. And
(04:45):
you know, putting me as Finance Minister and Minister for
Women means the Minister for Women is at every kind
of decision of the budget and that helps, plus helps
having a PM who wanted me in that role because
he wanted women's policy right at the front and center
of And it helps enormously to have a Treasurer who
doesn't need convincing that women's economic equality, you know, getting
(05:06):
a fair deal for women is actually a national economic priority,
like it's good for the economy, and so I don't
have to convince anyone on that, and that's made a
big difference.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
To what we can pull off.
Speaker 4 (05:17):
And I feel like that is obvious, Like I feel
like you have had so much pull and have I guess,
garnered so much respect for that because it's obvious there's
a team. It's obvious that people are backing you to
go through this and you're not having to fight to
go No, do you know that this is also important?
And I, as a female or seeing that this year's
(05:38):
budget has had to walk, I would say a fine
line between helping people and then making sure we're not
fueling inflation. How in your role, how do you actually
make that balance work? How are you looking at inflation
but then also going oh, honestly, we're in the middle
of a cost of living crisis, and we want to
help people, but sometimes too much help actually sends it
(06:01):
the wrong way. Yeah, and I think part of the
challenge for people has been, like in the GFC and
in COVID, when there was sort of an economic crisis
or you know, something that we needed to a shock,
an economic shock, the response was to hand out money,
so we got money to keep the stimulate the economy.
The issue with the inflation shock is that.
Speaker 2 (06:22):
It's the opposite response.
Speaker 5 (06:23):
You've got to work out how to calm down demand
in the economy, and I think that's been part of
our challenge is you know, people saying, well, I'm under
a lot of pressure. What are you doing for me now?
And why aren't I getting the support that perhaps I
got in the GFC, etc. You're right, it's a real
balance and we've had to find ways to help people.
(06:44):
But doesn't add to the inflation challenge. So it's not
simply like sending a check out in the mail or
something like that, which happened in the GFC.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
It's more about Okay.
Speaker 5 (06:53):
Well, let's take some pressure off your energy bill so
you're not out with more money in your pocket. But
it's reducing your costs in another away. And so you know,
we've made a lot of progress on inflation. It's come
back towards ben In this budget it shows that it's
coming back in sustainably into the normal range six months earlier,
which is really good news. But we also recognize people
(07:15):
still under pressure, and that's why we have to try
and find ways to help. Yeah, and I think a
lot of people don't understand that balance. They go, well,
why aren't they throwing more at this? You really have
to step back and look at the bigger picture or
the bigger umbrella to be able to understand. Okay, well,
if we actually just lined your pockets like we did
in the GFC, we're actually stimulating the economy, and a
(07:36):
growing economy means inflation is going to increase the cost
of eggs. And like, it all comes back to that
and goes all right, well we could help you here,
and I love that you're like, Okay, well, let's look
at the energy bill side of things.
Speaker 4 (07:49):
Let's actually take the pressure off while not hopefully stimulating
the economy in that way.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (07:55):
I feel like there's been a lot of commentary, as
there always is when a budget happens, right.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
I think the budget is exciting, but the.
Speaker 4 (08:01):
Day after the budget is more exciting because all of
the commentary comes out, all of the articles are online.
Every man in his dog has an opinion. Yes they do,
and I love it. Again, I'm nosy, so I'm reading
and devouring absolutely every part of it. In your view,
what was this year's most misunderstood part of the budget?
Speaker 5 (08:21):
Well, to be honest, I have not even had time
to read much about what people are saying about the budget.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
I had a whole flight here. I come up later.
Speaker 5 (08:30):
Yeah, because, like you say, actually budget days more controlled
for us, Like because we've got the lock up, We've
got the set press conference, then the budget speech in
the evening, and then we do a few late press conferences.
But not a lot of people have read the detail.
But come Wednesday, yeah, everything's unleashed people, you know, stakeholders
are having their two cents worth, Economists are out with
(08:53):
all the big answers usually and a lot of free advice.
What's been the most misunderstood? Well, I think think for us,
you know, we feel very strongly Jim and I that
we've put together a budget that's right for the times.
Like right for the economy, and our thinking has been
about that, not about politics. And I think there's been
(09:13):
from what I've seen, a lot of commentary saying, oh,
this is just a political budget, you know, to get
to the other side.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
Of an election, because we're on the eve of an election.
Speaker 5 (09:22):
And I know from the sort of tens of loads
of hours that we've sat in the ERC room that's
not the case. Like we look at all what's happening
in the economy, where are the areas of pressure, how
can the government help, And we've made decisions we think
in the national interests. But I think there's a lot
of cynicism about politicians and politics and motivation. But yeah,
(09:45):
I really think that if this wasn't an election year,
we would still be handing down this budget.
Speaker 4 (09:50):
That's good to hear because I feel like so much
of the narrative is, oh, it's a political budget. They're
going to announce it in the next six weeks, so
they're trying to appease everybody, and you just go that
actually wouldn't help their narrative. Let's say it comes back
in and labor stays in. It actually doesn't help to
just be political and say all these things that kept
you in because you're going to be held to those
(10:11):
standards as.
Speaker 5 (10:12):
Well, right, yeah, exactly, exactly. I mean this is a
priority for the next twelve months, not for the next
six weeks. And I think governments have a responsibility to
make decisions. Every decision we make is in the nation's interests,
regardless of whether you've voted for.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
Us or not.
Speaker 5 (10:28):
I mean, you know, we're responsible, and we've tried to
do our best. I think, as you say, kind of
navigating that inflationary environment with really sensible and good and
responsible assistance to help people, like medicare like hex step relief,
cheaper medicines, like putting it all of that out in
a way that doesn't put cash in people's pockets and
(10:50):
fuels the inflation challenge, because in the long run, that
makes everybody poorer. And that was the real challenge I
think we've dealt with the last three years.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
Absolutely.
Speaker 4 (10:59):
The privilege of interviewing lots of people in business, and
I was having a beautiful conversation with someone this morning
about how sometimes when you get to a certain level
in business or in politics, people stop seeing you as
human and think that maybe you are this all magical
beast that somehow knows absolutely everything. I would see that
(11:21):
as a pretty big responsibility, right, Like I would feel
like the weight of the world was on my shoulders.
Speaker 2 (11:26):
Yes, like that is a lot.
Speaker 4 (11:27):
How do you from a more personal perspective, how do
you deal with that? Because I'm in awe. I'm like,
this woman is the coolest, Like she is the Minister
for Finance, not only that, the Minister for women. I
think that there has been so much done, but then
people are vocal. That would be really hard. I get
one Instagram message if someone saying that my hair doesn't
look good, and I'm like, oh, maybe I'll cry under
(11:49):
the table. How are you dealing with not just commentary,
but knowing that that is a big responsibility. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (11:57):
I think that's been a really big adjustment for me
into this role. Really felt it, and I think it's
probably I sort of take the mystery away from it.
It's like every job. I think when you come into
a new job, you feel the weight of the responsibility.
You don't want to mess up. There's things that you
didn't know about the job that all of a sudden
are part of the job, and over time you adjust
(12:19):
to that and you get better at it, and so
I feel like, you know, when people go, you know,
tell me what your job's like, I feel like saying
to them what it's probably very like yours. You know,
every prosice, there's planning, there's teams to work with, deadlines
to meet.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
I'd have time for lunch, exactly.
Speaker 5 (12:36):
And I think mine's a little bit different and it's
more public and more contested at times, but other than that,
it is like every other job. And I am like
every other woman going to work. I've got kids at home,
I've got a dog that needs walking, I need groceries
that need buying. You know, I have the same anxieties
as everyone else. You have to push away imposter syndrome
(12:56):
and think, oh my god, am I really up to this?
Speaker 4 (12:59):
You're telling me at this level you still have imposter syndrome.
I think everybody else is in a lot of trouble.
Speaker 5 (13:04):
And I'm much better at it than when I was
younger in my career, where I really kind of was
looking around going does everyone know that I'm here and
responsible for things? Whereas I'm much better now. You learn
that as you get older, But I still feel like,
you know, I guess For me, it's part of taking
the job seriously, not thinking that I've got all the answers,
being open to advice, being careful and thoughtful about how
(13:28):
you make decisions. But it's not a job for everyone.
I don't think and on the social media stuff, I
just don't look at it because or when I do,
I delve in and then I'm like wow, I'll straight
back out again, like okay, because one I feel like
engaging with people and going that is totally not true
and there's no point.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
There is no points, So.
Speaker 4 (13:49):
You can't change the opinion of somebody who's already decided
what theirs is and is quite adamant with that, and
that's okay with that is a hard pill to swallow.
Let's get back to the questions, because I could talk
about stuff like that for ages. This budget has a
twenty seven point six million dollar deficit, and there's lots
of commentary.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
I'm telling it.
Speaker 4 (14:10):
We can talk about it later, but there's lots of
commentary in the media about this and the government's forecasting
more for years to come. For our community, who is
sitting there trying to budget for their own lives, that
honestly sounds quite scary like billions. What do you mean
even a million is out of reach? Can you explain
why a deficit in government spending might actually be okay? Yeah, so,
(14:35):
I mean this is part of my job to try
and explain this. And there's a lot of you know,
obviously this is a contested political environment, so there's a
lot of oh my god, there's deficits and the rest
of it. It's important to use the budget to support
the economy at different times, and so particularly coming through COVID,
the former government really lean in and borrowed a lot
(14:57):
of money to try and get people through through job
Keeper and other big payments like that. And what that
did to the budget was it forced the budget into
a pretty significant deficit. And it's important that you do
that because we actually avoided a recession. People maintain their jobs,
people were supported with social security payments. The media doesn't
like that part though, No, they don't know, they don't
(15:18):
like mind.
Speaker 2 (15:18):
It's not as exciting to talk about, that's right. But
if you didn't do it.
Speaker 4 (15:22):
Yeah, we would be in trouble because that government made
us go into a recession. Yes, so you're not going
to win here. I'm so sorry to.
Speaker 5 (15:29):
It, you know, well, I feel like part of my
job is to tell a broader story, to say the
budget needs to lean in when government investment is needed,
and then as you get through an economic shock, the
private sector returns, usually because they withdraw during economic shocks.
They return and they take over their rightful place in
the economy. And the government can withdraw and not entirely
(15:52):
because we pay, you know, all those payments to families
and childcare subsidies and all our investments in other areas
as well, but it means you don't have to lean
in as heavily and you can take a step back,
and then you can repair the budget, which is what
we've been doing over this term where we've got more
revenue coming in than expected, we pay down debt, we
(16:12):
lower the deficits, and that's what we've been doing. But
you can't just flick the switch off, because if you
tried to get into surplus immediately, and we have delivered
two surpluses because we got more revenue and employment remained
really strong, so we were able to deliver those, but
going forward it would mean some pretty significant cuts that
(16:33):
people would really feel right now. And so it's sort
of my calm, methodical approach. We repair the budget over
time and you bring the budget back into balance, and
that's completely appropriate and really part of pretty standard economic theory. Yeah,
I was explaining it in more I guess relatable terms
to someone.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
Is that not the other day?
Speaker 4 (16:53):
No, it totally was relatable, But I was trying to like, go,
we've got good debt and we've got bad debt, and
sometimes we have to take on some bad debt to
actually project ourselves forward, Like sometimes we have to take
a step back and get a mortgage because we don't
have the amount to purchase in full.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
Nobody does.
Speaker 4 (17:11):
But sometimes we need funding and the deficit is kind
of like, all right, well we can't afford house, but
we really need this and we're going through this process.
And I think that just understanding that a deficit doesn't
mean that you're going to be in deficit forever. No,
there's strategy, there's planning. I think it makes me feel
a lot lighter about it. I go, oh, okay, so
we're not absolutely burying the economy. It's actually strategic and
(17:34):
there was a reason for this.
Speaker 5 (17:36):
That's right, And you can't just spend irresponsibly and go
who cares.
Speaker 2 (17:40):
You know who cares about the bottom line? We do,
We totally do.
Speaker 5 (17:43):
But you've got to be kind of practical about the
expectations of what you're going to fund and how you
fund it. And the other thing I'd say is you've
got to look at the Commonwealth has a lot of
assets as well, like we've got a very good balance
sheet from which to borrow against and debt for us
is come a pretty low interest rates and things like that,
and we can deliver other outcomes by borrowing to invest
(18:06):
in things. And that's your good dip bad tinker on
the same page about that, I do like the concept
of investing. I've heard that Katie.
Speaker 4 (18:14):
We're going to go to a really quick break, but
guys stick around because when we come back, we're going
to get into the stuff that hits a.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
Little bit closer to home.
Speaker 4 (18:22):
Tax cuts, we're going to touch on grocery bills, energy rebates,
and whether this budget actually is going to give you
any breathing room. Don't go anywhere, Welcome back. We're here
at Parliament House with Senator Katie Gallagher, the Minister for
Finance and the Minister for Women, and we're going to
dive into a few things parts of the budget that
(18:43):
the community really want to understand. But Katie, in the
middle of the break, you were like, I want to
talk a little bit more about women's health.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
I'm really passionate about it. Let's do that.
Speaker 4 (18:52):
I mean you were touching on it before. I feel
like we moved off it. Talk to me a little
bit more about women's health and why it is so important. Yeah, well,
this is a really big part of this budget. So
each budget we've been trying to work through priorities for women,
so women's wages, women in work, early education, and care,
age care, all those kind of areas, and we keep
(19:14):
doing that. But Jed Karney, who's the one of the
Assistant Ministers for Health, has done this huge piece of
work looking at how the health system works for women
or doesn't work for women, and she found through her
work some really you know, amazing things like the no
oral contraceptive pill had been listed on the PBS for
the last three decades, none of the new menopause treatments
(19:38):
had been listed on PBS, and women were paying out
a pocket because you know, many of those treatments are
better for you, have less side effects. It makes sense yeah,
and so like this is part of having women involved
in politics. When you have enough women involved in politics,
things like contraception, menopause, endometriosis, pelvic pain, IVF all those
(20:01):
things start being considered as priorities. And this budget deals
with all of those in a pretty comprehensive way. Lists
all the new some of the new medications like Slender
for the oral contraceptive pill, and a lot of new
menopause treatment for women of my age going through that,
and also training up and helping healthcare professionals actually treat women,
(20:23):
you know, making sure the NBS allows doctors to insert
IUDs without women paying those huge out.
Speaker 2 (20:31):
Of pocket costs. It's wild.
Speaker 5 (20:33):
All of that it's in this budget, and it's a
big investment, almost eight hundred million dollars it costs. But
the health system, because you know there hasn't been a
lot of women in politics, has gone under recognized for
too long, and you know, this budget fixes that and
so hopefully women will be saving hundreds of dollars.
Speaker 4 (20:51):
Now, I have a question that's sidelining that it's on
the same track. And you've probably heard this from a
plethora of women before, but so many women go to
the doctor and then have their pain or their symptoms dismissed.
They go and obviously it is so fantastic to have
more funding, but you know, is funding enough to get
(21:13):
doctors and healthcare providers to start taking women's issues seriously? Yeah,
that's I mean, that's a different size, right, Yeah, And
it's so many of us that have gone shocks have
been patted on the head and told well, yeah, no
neurofen and lie down, you'll be fine.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
So this, yes, it does. It has a component here.
Speaker 5 (21:32):
One of the elements which Jed started and we're building
on it is these indo and pelvic pain clinics which
are actually staffed by specialist gps who are aware. You know,
I visited one, I think in Melbourne and it was
amazing just talking to the doctors, talking the women who
use the service, the kind of care that they are getting,
(21:55):
the recognition that their pain is not in their head,
and also that they're something that you can do about it.
Even changing your diet can help people who.
Speaker 4 (22:04):
Don't know if you haven't got access to those doctors exactly. So,
you know, simple changes that can be made for more
complex people. You know, you might be a referral to
a specialist whatever. So we're opening some more of those
and I just think they'll become a feature of the
health landscape.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
As it should.
Speaker 4 (22:22):
And like you're the Minister for Women, I don't have
to convince you, but I'm just in the background cheering
you on, being like, yes, Queen, that is exactly what
we want to see. I'm going to pivot because I
know that they don't have a heap of time left
with you. In the Treasurer's speech, he mentioned that we
are going to be putting some more accountability onto supermarkets
when it comes to the cost of living and the
(22:42):
cost of groceries, which I know is going to appeal
to my community because I think that's where most of
us are starting to tap our cards and feel the pain.
Speaker 2 (22:50):
Right, So that sounds.
Speaker 4 (22:52):
Great, but how does that actually translate to dollars at
the checkout? When are people going to start to feel
the impacts of this budget and the conversations that are
being had at the checkout?
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (23:05):
No, I completely understand that. I do the shopping in
my household too, and sometimes you just go what when
you look at a price of something in the supermarket. So,
particularly over the last couple of years I reckon. So
a couple of things there. The HBLEC has done a
piece of work. It's found that we've got a highly
concentrated grocery market, so we have the two big players.
(23:25):
We'd like more competition, so there's some effort going in there.
We've got Aldi and they made a difference when it
came in, but we need to make the system more
competitive so that there's other players that feel like that
they can compete. So part of it's making sure that
system's right. We've also got this and I know it
sounds probably doesn't sound real for people when they're going
around with their trolleys and looking at the prices, but
(23:47):
there's a mandatory code of conduct being put in place,
a mandatory food and grocery code which actually sets out
some pretty clear rules about how supermarkets are to behave.
We're also attaching multimillion dollar penalties to that. Now there's
been a voluntary code, but many people who work in
this space or say voluntary codes never do anything. So
(24:11):
we've made it mandatory law and we've significantly increased the penalty,
so it actually if they breach that code not going
to be a work. Yeah, it's not going to commercially
work that, and it kind of assists with, you know,
some of the complaints we've had from farmers who feel
like that they can't raise a complaint if they're being
treated badly by one of the supermarkets. They can now
(24:32):
make an anonymous complaint to the A Triple C and
have that investigated so they don't have to fear retaliation.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
Yeah, we've all it's really important.
Speaker 5 (24:39):
Yeah, massively important, because yeah, it's all about power, and
when you've got a concentrated market, we know where the
power sits. The other thing I'd say, and it's good
if people take a look at it. We've funded Choice
to basically do a series of you know, shopping basket
assessments and publish that. So where is the cheapest basket
(25:00):
of goods and who's offering it? And they publish that
now and it's free for everybody. And I think, you know, again,
it might not change things overnight, but I think that
transparency and accountability and consumers have a lot of power
here too to kind of take the time if they can,
to work out where they shop and what they shop for.
(25:20):
And you know, there'll be more to say on this.
I think because it's not a finished piece of work totally.
Speaker 4 (25:25):
My last question, because I am very aware that we
are time limited. Labour's said that this budget is about
responsible spending, and I feel like we're all being very responsible,
like we are pinching our pennies, which makes total sense
in an inflation environment.
Speaker 2 (25:41):
But for someone in my community who might be.
Speaker 4 (25:43):
Skipping meals or spending sixty percent of their income on
their rent, I feel like sometimes that doesn't feel like
it's enough. How do you define responsibility in that context
and how do you balance what the economy needs versus
what the people needs? And I guess that it's very
nicely back around to what we were saying before, where
you know, sometimes we can't just put money in your
(26:04):
pocket because it would grow the economy and that is
literally the exact opposite of what we want to.
Speaker 2 (26:09):
Occur right now. Yeah, no, exactly.
Speaker 5 (26:12):
So I think budgets are often seen in isolation, so
they think, oh, that it's only the new things that
are funded in this budget, where they actually, you know,
have money running through the year on year from what
we did last year to you know, what will happen
next year. So firstly, I'd say we've tried to look
at all of the ways that we can help people,
(26:32):
particularly on low and fixed incomes. You know, for example,
with renters who have been feeling the pinch. You know,
part of the issue is the supply of housing, so
we need to build more houses now that you know,
for a person right now, they'll say, oh, well, that's
not going to help me right now. So then it's
things like rent assistance and increasing rent assistance, which we've
(26:52):
done in two budgets, So we're trying to come at
it each way, but without adding to inflation, and that
has been tricky. The government is a big player in
the economy. If the government pours a whole lot of
money into an economy at a time when inflation is high,
that hurts everyone, but it most hurts though. I was
on low and fixed incomes who don't have a lot
(27:12):
of discretionary use of their money. They spend almost all
of their money just to keep up with living costs. Basically,
a budget is really about striking that balance and also
accepting that this is a point in time. In a
normal year, we finish the budget and we pretty much
go into what's called the mid year Economic and Fiscal
(27:34):
update or commonly known as my EFO. If you hear
that word like, we usually start my EFO maybe three
weeks after we finished the budget, so it's a continuous process.
It never finishes and so there's always room for new ideas.
Speaker 4 (27:47):
I love that, Katie. Thank you so much for your time.
This has been an absolute privilege and getting to sit
down with you, especially after budget night.
Speaker 2 (27:56):
I am very.
Speaker 4 (27:57):
Grateful because I am absolutely certain that your inbox is
on fire. I haven't even looked at it may don't
very right, but thank you for having me on. It's
so great to be able to try and explain what
we're doing, what we're up to.
Speaker 2 (28:09):
You are so welcome anytime let me know.
Speaker 4 (28:12):
And that's a wrap on our special budget episode recorded
right here in Parliament House. A massive thank you to
Senator Katie Gallagher for sitting down with us, especially after
budget night when I am absolutely certain that her inbox
is on fire. So if you're walking away from this
episode feeling a little bit clearer, a little bit more empowered,
(28:33):
or even just like someone finally explained what a structural
death as it actually is.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
My friend, that's a money win.
Speaker 4 (28:39):
If this helped do not Gate keep share it, save it,
and hit subscribe so you're always across the stuff that
actually affects your wallet. Did I shared on She's on
the Money is generally nature and does not consider your
individual circumstances. All the Money exists purely for educational purposes
(29:02):
and should not be relied upon to make an investment
or financial decision. If you do choose to buy a
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Speaker 6 (29:09):
The PDS TMD and obtain appropriate financial.
Speaker 4 (29:12):
Advice tailored towards your needs.
Speaker 6 (29:14):
Victoria Divine and Sheese on the Money are authorized representatives
of Money Sherpa pty Ltd a BN three two one
six four nine two seven seven zero eight AFSL four
five one two eight nine
Hello, my name's Santasha Nabananga Bamblet. I'm a proud or
the Order Kerni Whaltbury and a waddery woman. And before
we get started on She's on the Money podcast, I
would like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the land
of which this podcast is recorded on a wondery country,
acknowledging the elders, the ancestors and the next generation coming
(00:22):
through as this podcast is about connecting, empowering, knowledge sharing
and the storytelling of you to make a difference for
today and lasting impact for tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Let's get into it.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
She's on the Money, She's on the Money.
Speaker 4 (00:57):
Hello, and welcome to She's on the Money, the podcast
that translates government budgets into information that you are actually
going to be able to understand. If you felt like
you need a politics degree just to understand if the
budget this year is good or bad, or you're sitting
there like, wait, what is a structural deficit? And why
(01:17):
should I even care? Or maybe you're just wondering cool,
but does any of this actually help me or benefit me?
My friend, you are in exactly the right place. I'm
Victoria Devine, the one that's here to ask the real questions,
cut through the spin and make this budget makes sense
for real life. And today, which is actually the day
after the big budget announcement, I'm doing a very special
(01:40):
recording from Parliament House in Canberra. But I'm not doing
it alone, which would be a little bit sad. I
am joined by someone who helped shape this year's federal
budget from the inside. Senator Katie Gallagher is the Minister
for Finance and the Minister for Women, and she's here
to chat with us about what made it into the budget,
(02:02):
what didn't make it and what it actually means to you. Katie,
welcome to She's on the money. Thank you so much
for having me on. It's very exciting. It is, honestly
for me career highlight. Guys, I'm in parliament. Baby Victoria
would be shaking.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
In her boots right now.
Speaker 4 (02:19):
First of all, I'm just going to start this off
assuming that a lot of my community haven't dipped their
toes in the political waters yet. And I have seen
questions in my community of Victoria. What's the difference between
the Minister of Finance and the treasurer, How does that
relationship work and what are the different roles.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
Okay, so that's a great question. Really Jim and I.
Speaker 5 (02:42):
So, Jim Chalmers is the Treasurer, I'm the finance minister.
We work very closely together on all matters relating to
the budget, but really on all matters relating to economic
policy as well. But if I could sort of simplify
it down, I think really Jim is the lead economic minister.
He's in charge of economic policy across the country, revenue,
(03:04):
all those big kind of nationally important things. And I'm
responsible for the money, like where's the money coming from?
Where are the savings? More of like the accounting book
keeper part of the business. So are you in a
nitty gritty I am like, I'm gettings.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
Yeah, you're in the one. I want that role. I
don't want to be treasurer. I want to be nosy.
I know, well the.
Speaker 5 (03:27):
Treasure has a lot of responsibilities. He's busy, but he
can be nosy and give him the highlight I can
and love. They have my fingers really in every single
thing that happens across government. So I know what's happening
in other minister's portfolios. I know what policy is being
developed up. Yeah, it's a very interesting role, but I'm
(03:48):
kind of yeah, it really suits my personality, which is
naturally nosy.
Speaker 4 (03:52):
O me too, like I don't want to be part
of the drama or the gossip, but I actually would
really like to know what's going on, just committing me
in the loop, Like if you give me a budget
or a spreadsheet, I will do a little bit of
a nosey into what that means and how that works.
You are also, in addition to being the Minister for Finance,
you are the Minister for Women, which I think is
(04:15):
so special and so cool. But let's wrap it back
to the budget. Was this a good budget for women?
Speaker 1 (04:21):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (04:21):
I think so.
Speaker 5 (04:22):
You know, we've worked hard on it. There's some really
good and important big announcements for women, but it shouldn't
be seen in isolation of the other three budgets we've
done where we've tried to shift the dial for women
as well. I think, you know, like for the last decade,
really I feel like women's policy had really been a
bit more of an afterthought. It wasn't kind of central
at the table, kind of a front of mind. And
(04:45):
you know, putting me as Finance Minister and Minister for
Women means the Minister for Women is at every kind
of decision of the budget and that helps, plus helps
having a PM who wanted me in that role because
he wanted women's policy right at the front and center
of And it helps enormously to have a Treasurer who
doesn't need convincing that women's economic equality, you know, getting
(05:06):
a fair deal for women is actually a national economic priority,
like it's good for the economy, and so I don't
have to convince anyone on that, and that's made a
big difference.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
To what we can pull off.
Speaker 4 (05:17):
And I feel like that is obvious, Like I feel
like you have had so much pull and have I guess,
garnered so much respect for that because it's obvious there's
a team. It's obvious that people are backing you to
go through this and you're not having to fight to
go No, do you know that this is also important?
And I, as a female or seeing that this year's
(05:38):
budget has had to walk, I would say a fine
line between helping people and then making sure we're not
fueling inflation. How in your role, how do you actually
make that balance work? How are you looking at inflation
but then also going oh, honestly, we're in the middle
of a cost of living crisis, and we want to
help people, but sometimes too much help actually sends it
(06:01):
the wrong way. Yeah, and I think part of the
challenge for people has been, like in the GFC and
in COVID, when there was sort of an economic crisis
or you know, something that we needed to a shock,
an economic shock, the response was to hand out money,
so we got money to keep the stimulate the economy.
The issue with the inflation shock is that.
Speaker 2 (06:22):
It's the opposite response.
Speaker 5 (06:23):
You've got to work out how to calm down demand
in the economy, and I think that's been part of
our challenge is you know, people saying, well, I'm under
a lot of pressure. What are you doing for me now?
And why aren't I getting the support that perhaps I
got in the GFC, etc. You're right, it's a real
balance and we've had to find ways to help people.
(06:44):
But doesn't add to the inflation challenge. So it's not
simply like sending a check out in the mail or
something like that, which happened in the GFC.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
It's more about Okay.
Speaker 5 (06:53):
Well, let's take some pressure off your energy bill so
you're not out with more money in your pocket. But
it's reducing your costs in another away. And so you know,
we've made a lot of progress on inflation. It's come
back towards ben In this budget it shows that it's
coming back in sustainably into the normal range six months earlier,
which is really good news. But we also recognize people
(07:15):
still under pressure, and that's why we have to try
and find ways to help. Yeah, and I think a
lot of people don't understand that balance. They go, well,
why aren't they throwing more at this? You really have
to step back and look at the bigger picture or
the bigger umbrella to be able to understand. Okay, well,
if we actually just lined your pockets like we did
in the GFC, we're actually stimulating the economy, and a
(07:36):
growing economy means inflation is going to increase the cost
of eggs. And like, it all comes back to that
and goes all right, well we could help you here,
and I love that you're like, Okay, well, let's look
at the energy bill side of things.
Speaker 4 (07:49):
Let's actually take the pressure off while not hopefully stimulating
the economy in that way.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (07:55):
I feel like there's been a lot of commentary, as
there always is when a budget happens, right.
Speaker 2 (07:59):
I think the budget is exciting, but the.
Speaker 4 (08:01):
Day after the budget is more exciting because all of
the commentary comes out, all of the articles are online.
Every man in his dog has an opinion. Yes they do,
and I love it. Again, I'm nosy, so I'm reading
and devouring absolutely every part of it. In your view,
what was this year's most misunderstood part of the budget?
Speaker 5 (08:21):
Well, to be honest, I have not even had time
to read much about what people are saying about the budget.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
I had a whole flight here. I come up later.
Speaker 5 (08:30):
Yeah, because, like you say, actually budget days more controlled
for us, Like because we've got the lock up, We've
got the set press conference, then the budget speech in
the evening, and then we do a few late press conferences.
But not a lot of people have read the detail.
But come Wednesday, yeah, everything's unleashed people, you know, stakeholders
are having their two cents worth, Economists are out with
(08:53):
all the big answers usually and a lot of free advice.
What's been the most misunderstood? Well, I think think for us,
you know, we feel very strongly Jim and I that
we've put together a budget that's right for the times.
Like right for the economy, and our thinking has been
about that, not about politics. And I think there's been
(09:13):
from what I've seen, a lot of commentary saying, oh,
this is just a political budget, you know, to get
to the other side.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
Of an election, because we're on the eve of an election.
Speaker 5 (09:22):
And I know from the sort of tens of loads
of hours that we've sat in the ERC room that's
not the case. Like we look at all what's happening
in the economy, where are the areas of pressure, how
can the government help, And we've made decisions we think
in the national interests. But I think there's a lot
of cynicism about politicians and politics and motivation. But yeah,
(09:45):
I really think that if this wasn't an election year,
we would still be handing down this budget.
Speaker 4 (09:50):
That's good to hear because I feel like so much
of the narrative is, oh, it's a political budget. They're
going to announce it in the next six weeks, so
they're trying to appease everybody, and you just go that
actually wouldn't help their narrative. Let's say it comes back
in and labor stays in. It actually doesn't help to
just be political and say all these things that kept
you in because you're going to be held to those
(10:11):
standards as.
Speaker 5 (10:12):
Well, right, yeah, exactly, exactly. I mean this is a
priority for the next twelve months, not for the next
six weeks. And I think governments have a responsibility to
make decisions. Every decision we make is in the nation's interests,
regardless of whether you've voted for.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
Us or not.
Speaker 5 (10:28):
I mean, you know, we're responsible, and we've tried to
do our best. I think, as you say, kind of
navigating that inflationary environment with really sensible and good and
responsible assistance to help people, like medicare like hex step relief,
cheaper medicines, like putting it all of that out in
a way that doesn't put cash in people's pockets and
(10:50):
fuels the inflation challenge, because in the long run, that
makes everybody poorer. And that was the real challenge I
think we've dealt with the last three years.
Speaker 2 (10:58):
Absolutely.
Speaker 4 (10:59):
The privilege of interviewing lots of people in business, and
I was having a beautiful conversation with someone this morning
about how sometimes when you get to a certain level
in business or in politics, people stop seeing you as
human and think that maybe you are this all magical
beast that somehow knows absolutely everything. I would see that
(11:21):
as a pretty big responsibility, right, Like I would feel
like the weight of the world was on my shoulders.
Speaker 2 (11:26):
Yes, like that is a lot.
Speaker 4 (11:27):
How do you from a more personal perspective, how do
you deal with that? Because I'm in awe. I'm like,
this woman is the coolest, Like she is the Minister
for Finance, not only that, the Minister for women. I
think that there has been so much done, but then
people are vocal. That would be really hard. I get
one Instagram message if someone saying that my hair doesn't
look good, and I'm like, oh, maybe I'll cry under
(11:49):
the table. How are you dealing with not just commentary,
but knowing that that is a big responsibility. Yeah.
Speaker 5 (11:57):
I think that's been a really big adjustment for me
into this role. Really felt it, and I think it's
probably I sort of take the mystery away from it.
It's like every job. I think when you come into
a new job, you feel the weight of the responsibility.
You don't want to mess up. There's things that you
didn't know about the job that all of a sudden
are part of the job, and over time you adjust
(12:19):
to that and you get better at it, and so
I feel like, you know, when people go, you know,
tell me what your job's like, I feel like saying
to them what it's probably very like yours. You know,
every prosice, there's planning, there's teams to work with, deadlines
to meet.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
I'd have time for lunch, exactly.
Speaker 5 (12:36):
And I think mine's a little bit different and it's
more public and more contested at times, but other than that,
it is like every other job. And I am like
every other woman going to work. I've got kids at home,
I've got a dog that needs walking, I need groceries
that need buying. You know, I have the same anxieties
as everyone else. You have to push away imposter syndrome
(12:56):
and think, oh my god, am I really up to this?
Speaker 4 (12:59):
You're telling me at this level you still have imposter syndrome.
I think everybody else is in a lot of trouble.
Speaker 5 (13:04):
And I'm much better at it than when I was
younger in my career, where I really kind of was
looking around going does everyone know that I'm here and
responsible for things? Whereas I'm much better now. You learn
that as you get older, But I still feel like,
you know, I guess For me, it's part of taking
the job seriously, not thinking that I've got all the answers,
being open to advice, being careful and thoughtful about how
(13:28):
you make decisions. But it's not a job for everyone.
I don't think and on the social media stuff, I
just don't look at it because or when I do,
I delve in and then I'm like wow, I'll straight
back out again, like okay, because one I feel like
engaging with people and going that is totally not true
and there's no point.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
There is no points, So.
Speaker 4 (13:49):
You can't change the opinion of somebody who's already decided
what theirs is and is quite adamant with that, and
that's okay with that is a hard pill to swallow.
Let's get back to the questions, because I could talk
about stuff like that for ages. This budget has a
twenty seven point six million dollar deficit, and there's lots
of commentary.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
I'm telling it.
Speaker 4 (14:10):
We can talk about it later, but there's lots of
commentary in the media about this and the government's forecasting
more for years to come. For our community, who is
sitting there trying to budget for their own lives, that
honestly sounds quite scary like billions. What do you mean
even a million is out of reach? Can you explain
why a deficit in government spending might actually be okay? Yeah, so,
(14:35):
I mean this is part of my job to try
and explain this. And there's a lot of you know,
obviously this is a contested political environment, so there's a
lot of oh my god, there's deficits and the rest
of it. It's important to use the budget to support
the economy at different times, and so particularly coming through COVID,
the former government really lean in and borrowed a lot
(14:57):
of money to try and get people through through job
Keeper and other big payments like that. And what that
did to the budget was it forced the budget into
a pretty significant deficit. And it's important that you do
that because we actually avoided a recession. People maintain their jobs,
people were supported with social security payments. The media doesn't
like that part though, No, they don't know, they don't
(15:18):
like mind.
Speaker 2 (15:18):
It's not as exciting to talk about, that's right. But
if you didn't do it.
Speaker 4 (15:22):
Yeah, we would be in trouble because that government made
us go into a recession. Yes, so you're not going
to win here. I'm so sorry to.
Speaker 5 (15:29):
It, you know, well, I feel like part of my
job is to tell a broader story, to say the
budget needs to lean in when government investment is needed,
and then as you get through an economic shock, the
private sector returns, usually because they withdraw during economic shocks.
They return and they take over their rightful place in
the economy. And the government can withdraw and not entirely
(15:52):
because we pay, you know, all those payments to families
and childcare subsidies and all our investments in other areas
as well, but it means you don't have to lean
in as heavily and you can take a step back,
and then you can repair the budget, which is what
we've been doing over this term where we've got more
revenue coming in than expected, we pay down debt, we
(16:12):
lower the deficits, and that's what we've been doing. But
you can't just flick the switch off, because if you
tried to get into surplus immediately, and we have delivered
two surpluses because we got more revenue and employment remained
really strong, so we were able to deliver those, but
going forward it would mean some pretty significant cuts that
(16:33):
people would really feel right now. And so it's sort
of my calm, methodical approach. We repair the budget over
time and you bring the budget back into balance, and
that's completely appropriate and really part of pretty standard economic theory. Yeah,
I was explaining it in more I guess relatable terms
to someone.
Speaker 2 (16:53):
Is that not the other day?
Speaker 4 (16:53):
No, it totally was relatable, But I was trying to like, go,
we've got good debt and we've got bad debt, and
sometimes we have to take on some bad debt to
actually project ourselves forward, Like sometimes we have to take
a step back and get a mortgage because we don't
have the amount to purchase in full.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
Nobody does.
Speaker 4 (17:11):
But sometimes we need funding and the deficit is kind
of like, all right, well we can't afford house, but
we really need this and we're going through this process.
And I think that just understanding that a deficit doesn't
mean that you're going to be in deficit forever. No,
there's strategy, there's planning. I think it makes me feel
a lot lighter about it. I go, oh, okay, so
we're not absolutely burying the economy. It's actually strategic and
(17:34):
there was a reason for this.
Speaker 5 (17:36):
That's right, And you can't just spend irresponsibly and go
who cares.
Speaker 2 (17:40):
You know who cares about the bottom line? We do,
We totally do.
Speaker 5 (17:43):
But you've got to be kind of practical about the
expectations of what you're going to fund and how you
fund it. And the other thing I'd say is you've
got to look at the Commonwealth has a lot of
assets as well, like we've got a very good balance
sheet from which to borrow against and debt for us
is come a pretty low interest rates and things like that,
and we can deliver other outcomes by borrowing to invest
(18:06):
in things. And that's your good dip bad tinker on
the same page about that, I do like the concept
of investing. I've heard that Katie.
Speaker 4 (18:14):
We're going to go to a really quick break, but
guys stick around because when we come back, we're going
to get into the stuff that hits a.
Speaker 2 (18:20):
Little bit closer to home.
Speaker 4 (18:22):
Tax cuts, we're going to touch on grocery bills, energy rebates,
and whether this budget actually is going to give you
any breathing room. Don't go anywhere, Welcome back. We're here
at Parliament House with Senator Katie Gallagher, the Minister for
Finance and the Minister for Women, and we're going to
dive into a few things parts of the budget that
(18:43):
the community really want to understand. But Katie, in the
middle of the break, you were like, I want to
talk a little bit more about women's health.
Speaker 2 (18:49):
I'm really passionate about it. Let's do that.
Speaker 4 (18:52):
I mean you were touching on it before. I feel
like we moved off it. Talk to me a little
bit more about women's health and why it is so important. Yeah, well,
this is a really big part of this budget. So
each budget we've been trying to work through priorities for women,
so women's wages, women in work, early education, and care,
age care, all those kind of areas, and we keep
(19:14):
doing that. But Jed Karney, who's the one of the
Assistant Ministers for Health, has done this huge piece of
work looking at how the health system works for women
or doesn't work for women, and she found through her
work some really you know, amazing things like the no
oral contraceptive pill had been listed on the PBS for
the last three decades, none of the new menopause treatments
(19:38):
had been listed on PBS, and women were paying out
a pocket because you know, many of those treatments are
better for you, have less side effects. It makes sense yeah,
and so like this is part of having women involved
in politics. When you have enough women involved in politics,
things like contraception, menopause, endometriosis, pelvic pain, IVF all those
(20:01):
things start being considered as priorities. And this budget deals
with all of those in a pretty comprehensive way. Lists
all the new some of the new medications like Slender
for the oral contraceptive pill, and a lot of new
menopause treatment for women of my age going through that,
and also training up and helping healthcare professionals actually treat women,
(20:23):
you know, making sure the NBS allows doctors to insert
IUDs without women paying those huge out.
Speaker 2 (20:31):
Of pocket costs. It's wild.
Speaker 5 (20:33):
All of that it's in this budget, and it's a
big investment, almost eight hundred million dollars it costs. But
the health system, because you know there hasn't been a
lot of women in politics, has gone under recognized for
too long, and you know, this budget fixes that and
so hopefully women will be saving hundreds of dollars.
Speaker 4 (20:51):
Now, I have a question that's sidelining that it's on
the same track. And you've probably heard this from a
plethora of women before, but so many women go to
the doctor and then have their pain or their symptoms dismissed.
They go and obviously it is so fantastic to have
more funding, but you know, is funding enough to get
(21:13):
doctors and healthcare providers to start taking women's issues seriously? Yeah,
that's I mean, that's a different size, right, Yeah, And
it's so many of us that have gone shocks have
been patted on the head and told well, yeah, no
neurofen and lie down, you'll be fine.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
So this, yes, it does. It has a component here.
Speaker 5 (21:32):
One of the elements which Jed started and we're building
on it is these indo and pelvic pain clinics which
are actually staffed by specialist gps who are aware. You know,
I visited one, I think in Melbourne and it was
amazing just talking to the doctors, talking the women who
use the service, the kind of care that they are getting,
(21:55):
the recognition that their pain is not in their head,
and also that they're something that you can do about it.
Even changing your diet can help people who.
Speaker 4 (22:04):
Don't know if you haven't got access to those doctors exactly. So,
you know, simple changes that can be made for more
complex people. You know, you might be a referral to
a specialist whatever. So we're opening some more of those
and I just think they'll become a feature of the
health landscape.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
As it should.
Speaker 4 (22:22):
And like you're the Minister for Women, I don't have
to convince you, but I'm just in the background cheering
you on, being like, yes, Queen, that is exactly what
we want to see. I'm going to pivot because I
know that they don't have a heap of time left
with you. In the Treasurer's speech, he mentioned that we
are going to be putting some more accountability onto supermarkets
when it comes to the cost of living and the
(22:42):
cost of groceries, which I know is going to appeal
to my community because I think that's where most of
us are starting to tap our cards and feel the pain.
Speaker 2 (22:50):
Right, So that sounds.
Speaker 4 (22:52):
Great, but how does that actually translate to dollars at
the checkout? When are people going to start to feel
the impacts of this budget and the conversations that are
being had at the checkout?
Speaker 2 (23:04):
Yeah?
Speaker 5 (23:05):
No, I completely understand that. I do the shopping in
my household too, and sometimes you just go what when
you look at a price of something in the supermarket. So,
particularly over the last couple of years I reckon. So
a couple of things there. The HBLEC has done a
piece of work. It's found that we've got a highly
concentrated grocery market, so we have the two big players.
(23:25):
We'd like more competition, so there's some effort going in there.
We've got Aldi and they made a difference when it
came in, but we need to make the system more
competitive so that there's other players that feel like that
they can compete. So part of it's making sure that
system's right. We've also got this and I know it
sounds probably doesn't sound real for people when they're going
around with their trolleys and looking at the prices, but
(23:47):
there's a mandatory code of conduct being put in place,
a mandatory food and grocery code which actually sets out
some pretty clear rules about how supermarkets are to behave.
We're also attaching multimillion dollar penalties to that. Now there's
been a voluntary code, but many people who work in
this space or say voluntary codes never do anything. So
(24:11):
we've made it mandatory law and we've significantly increased the penalty,
so it actually if they breach that code not going
to be a work. Yeah, it's not going to commercially
work that, and it kind of assists with, you know,
some of the complaints we've had from farmers who feel
like that they can't raise a complaint if they're being
treated badly by one of the supermarkets. They can now
(24:32):
make an anonymous complaint to the A Triple C and
have that investigated so they don't have to fear retaliation.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
Yeah, we've all it's really important.
Speaker 5 (24:39):
Yeah, massively important, because yeah, it's all about power, and
when you've got a concentrated market, we know where the
power sits. The other thing I'd say, and it's good
if people take a look at it. We've funded Choice
to basically do a series of you know, shopping basket
assessments and publish that. So where is the cheapest basket
(25:00):
of goods and who's offering it? And they publish that
now and it's free for everybody. And I think, you know, again,
it might not change things overnight, but I think that
transparency and accountability and consumers have a lot of power
here too to kind of take the time if they can,
to work out where they shop and what they shop for.
(25:20):
And you know, there'll be more to say on this.
I think because it's not a finished piece of work totally.
Speaker 4 (25:25):
My last question, because I am very aware that we
are time limited. Labour's said that this budget is about
responsible spending, and I feel like we're all being very responsible,
like we are pinching our pennies, which makes total sense
in an inflation environment.
Speaker 2 (25:41):
But for someone in my community who might be.
Speaker 4 (25:43):
Skipping meals or spending sixty percent of their income on
their rent, I feel like sometimes that doesn't feel like
it's enough. How do you define responsibility in that context
and how do you balance what the economy needs versus
what the people needs? And I guess that it's very
nicely back around to what we were saying before, where
you know, sometimes we can't just put money in your
(26:04):
pocket because it would grow the economy and that is
literally the exact opposite of what we want to.
Speaker 2 (26:09):
Occur right now. Yeah, no, exactly.
Speaker 5 (26:12):
So I think budgets are often seen in isolation, so
they think, oh, that it's only the new things that
are funded in this budget, where they actually, you know,
have money running through the year on year from what
we did last year to you know, what will happen
next year. So firstly, I'd say we've tried to look
at all of the ways that we can help people,
(26:32):
particularly on low and fixed incomes. You know, for example,
with renters who have been feeling the pinch. You know,
part of the issue is the supply of housing, so
we need to build more houses now that you know,
for a person right now, they'll say, oh, well, that's
not going to help me right now. So then it's
things like rent assistance and increasing rent assistance, which we've
(26:52):
done in two budgets, So we're trying to come at
it each way, but without adding to inflation, and that
has been tricky. The government is a big player in
the economy. If the government pours a whole lot of
money into an economy at a time when inflation is high,
that hurts everyone, but it most hurts though. I was
on low and fixed incomes who don't have a lot
(27:12):
of discretionary use of their money. They spend almost all
of their money just to keep up with living costs. Basically,
a budget is really about striking that balance and also
accepting that this is a point in time. In a
normal year, we finish the budget and we pretty much
go into what's called the mid year Economic and Fiscal
(27:34):
update or commonly known as my EFO. If you hear
that word like, we usually start my EFO maybe three
weeks after we finished the budget, so it's a continuous process.
It never finishes and so there's always room for new ideas.
Speaker 4 (27:47):
I love that, Katie. Thank you so much for your time.
This has been an absolute privilege and getting to sit
down with you, especially after budget night.
Speaker 2 (27:56):
I am very.
Speaker 4 (27:57):
Grateful because I am absolutely certain that your inbox is
on fire. I haven't even looked at it may don't
very right, but thank you for having me on. It's
so great to be able to try and explain what
we're doing, what we're up to.
Speaker 2 (28:09):
You are so welcome anytime let me know.
Speaker 4 (28:12):
And that's a wrap on our special budget episode recorded
right here in Parliament House. A massive thank you to
Senator Katie Gallagher for sitting down with us, especially after
budget night when I am absolutely certain that her inbox
is on fire. So if you're walking away from this
episode feeling a little bit clearer, a little bit more empowered,
(28:33):
or even just like someone finally explained what a structural
death as it actually is.
Speaker 2 (28:37):
My friend, that's a money win.
Speaker 4 (28:39):
If this helped do not Gate keep share it, save it,
and hit subscribe so you're always across the stuff that
actually affects your wallet. Did I shared on She's on
the Money is generally nature and does not consider your
individual circumstances. All the Money exists purely for educational purposes
(29:02):
and should not be relied upon to make an investment
or financial decision. If you do choose to buy a
financial product, read.
Speaker 6 (29:09):
The PDS TMD and obtain appropriate financial.
Speaker 4 (29:12):
Advice tailored towards your needs.
Speaker 6 (29:14):
Victoria Divine and Sheese on the Money are authorized representatives
of Money Sherpa pty Ltd a BN three two one
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