Outrage as murderer granted leave for IVF treatment in prison

The family of murdered mum Alicia Schiller is outraged after her killer is granted leave for IVF treatment. Schiller, serving 16 years for a 2014 stabbing, could have a child raised in prison until age five. Victoria's Opposition seeks to overturn the decision.

For more, the Criminal Justice Spokesperson for the Australian Lawyers Alliance, Greg Barns SC, joins.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
Family of a murdered mum of three is outraged after
learning her killer has been granted special leave from prison
to undergo IVF treatment. Alicia Schiller is currently serving a
sixteen year sentence for stabbing her housemate to death in
a drug fueled rage back in twenty fourteen. It's understood
the child would be raised in the prison until the

(00:21):
age of five years old. Victoria's opposition, however, once the
decision overturned. For more, we're joined by Greg Barnes, sc
criminal Justice spokesperson for the Australian Lawyers Alliance Live in Hobart.
Thanks for joining us, Greg, So you're in support of
this decision. Explain that to.

Speaker 2 (00:38):
Us, Well, when you go to prison, what happens is
that it's the deprivation of liberty that is the punishment.
You are entitled to ex your self care in the
same way as any other person. There are plenty of
cases where women into the prison system they're pregnant. In fact,
it's about ten percent globally are in that space and

(01:03):
they grow up with their children the first five years
in prison. There's no difference in a prison of wanting
to access IVF and in fact, Ireland last year implemented
a scheme to do just that.

Speaker 1 (01:15):
But this is a choice. It's not a medical condition
that needs to be treated. She wasn't pregnant going in.
This is a choice. Shouldn't that choice be taken away?
Or should they be allowed to have families?

Speaker 2 (01:30):
It should be allowed to have families. Everybody has the
right to family. And these, of course made are assessed
on a case by case basis. This idea that you know,
we're going to have all of these women prisoners running
out to get IVF is a nonsense. All it's going
to happen in this particular case is there's been an
assessment made and she is able to do it. But

(01:52):
when people go to prison, it's the deprivation of liberty
that's the punishment, not saying to them you're going to
be further punished when you're.

Speaker 1 (01:59):
In pri What about the child though, Like an innocent
child is being brought up for the first five years
of its life in a prison environment. Is that okay?

Speaker 2 (02:11):
That happens every day of the week. It happens all
around our nation where because we insist on jailing so
many people, we have people who are with children in prison.
Because all the research tells us that it's important for
mothers to be with their child in that first five years.
If you don't do that, the old practice used to

(02:33):
be mat that. You know, women prisoners would give birth,
the baby would just be torn away from them immediately,
you know, a form of stolen generation. And the first
five years in caring humane environments within the custodi or
sector are good for the mother and good for the child.

Speaker 1 (02:53):
And what about the victims here, because ultimately she's in
prison for sixteen years for murder another woman and the
victim's son, who was in the house when that murder happened, said,
you left three kids motherless. I was an orphan, so
all my milestones as a kid, nobody was there to
celebrate them. I strongly stand against this. Should the victims

(03:17):
be heard in decisions like this.

Speaker 2 (03:21):
Well, you know that's a complex argument. One can absolutely
understand the response of the victims. But in this sense,
once a person goes into prison, and unless they're being
released full time, in which that is a matter in
which victims have a say, this is a matter that
has to be dealt with in the context of the prisoner,

(03:43):
their own family. And of course you take into account
the views of victims, but no one has a right
of veto in terms of you know who says what
here other than the correction system. And so it's not
as simple as saying, well, because the victims and the
victims families say no, then it should be no. It

(04:05):
needs to require you know that complex balancing act.

Speaker 1 (04:09):
I mean, regardless of the victims family is absolutely outraged
over this happening. Greg, Thank you so much for your time,
appreciating