The Reality of Rebuilding Your Life (And Sharing It Online) with Bella Messina 🌹

In this raw and deeply honest conversation, Georgie is joined by content creator and all-around powerhouse Bella Messina to unpack the reality of what it really looks like to rebuild your life from the ground up — and share it online.

Bella opens up about navigating postpartum depression, her divorce, and finding her true self on the other side — all while facing intense public scrutiny and judgment from strangers on the internet.

Together, they dive into:
✨ The power (and pain) of sharing your darkest moments online
✨ Why we need professional support — and why it should be more accessible
✨ The stigma around women’s mental health and internalised misogyny in online spaces
✨ Why you don’t need to hit rock bottom to start healing (but if you do, you can rise)
✨ Owning your story and staying true to your “why” even when the world tells you not to
✨ Letting go of the need to be “liked” and focusing on impact instead

If you've ever felt alone in your struggle, afraid to take up space, or scared to own your truth, this conversation will remind you: you are not alone — you’re stronger than you think and you WILL rise, even if you can't see it right now. 

________________________________

Follow Bella Messina: 

Instagram: @bellsmessina

Tikok: @bellsmessina

Listen to Georgie's episode on Bella's podcast here

 

Find out more about the Rise app here. 

Find the manifestation Lab HERE 

You can join TAA here. 

Join the Rise & Conquer Facebook group here.   

Follow the Rise & Conquer Instagram here.  

Discover Rise & Conquer courses here. 

Shop Rise & Conquer products here. 

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
I would like to acknowledge the traditional owners of the
land on which this episode is being recorded, the Combomb
Merry people. They've been having conversations and telling stories on
this land for thousands of years, and we show our
gratitude and respect for their contribution to our environment and culture.

(00:21):
This is Rise and Conquer, the podcast where we strive
to become the highest version of ourselves through curious conversations,
healthy mindsets, laughter, connection, and a deep desire to evolve.
I'm your host, Georgie Stevenson. Join me as we explore parenthood, business, manifestation,

(00:46):
and so much more. It's positive, it's practical, and it's
about putting you in the driver's seat of your own life.
Are you ready, Bella? Welcome to the Right and Conquered Podcasts. Hello,
thank you for having me, Thank you so much for coming.
We have hero here.

Speaker 2 (01:06):
I know bellas do puppy so you can hear us.

Speaker 1 (01:10):
See.

Speaker 2 (01:11):
I was just saying, like, he's so chill, and we've
been in here for like fifteen minutes, like chatting off Mike,
and he didn't say a word, and then the second
we turned the MIC's on, he's like like wanting to
run around. Poor little Bobby.

Speaker 1 (01:23):
Honestly, I feel like real dog people here. So it's
so fine.

Speaker 2 (01:26):
I know, I just got him yesterday and I was like,
I can't really leave him at home by himself yet,
so I was like, he's just gonna come and be
our third little guest. So if you hear like whimpering
or his color rattling, I'm sorry, but he's really cute.

Speaker 1 (01:41):
We're here for it. Yeah. He's a cocker Spaniel and
he just looks super dopey and chill you like long ears.

Speaker 2 (01:50):
Oh my god, poor little thing. They get all like
caught in his water bowl and stuff. But I'm so
excited to like have a dog back in my life
because my other dog who I had for like ten years,
passed away last year. And I am such a dog
person that I was like, I'm it's.

Speaker 1 (02:04):
So comfortable, isn't it. It's so comforting it is. And
Rosie and Bennie loving him.

Speaker 2 (02:09):
They haven't met him yet. It's a surprise. They meet
him this afternoon. Oh my goodness, I know. So I
hope they're going to be excited. I think they will be,
come on, I think they will be because Rosie has
been asking for a dog Rosie is my oldest daughter.
I have two daughters, and she's watched four in November.
Our daughters are actually born one day apart. So we
did our first pregnancies together. Yes, we do you and

(02:30):
now you've got another little bubby in your belly, I know.

Speaker 1 (02:33):
And then so Bennie. How old's Bennie?

Speaker 2 (02:35):
She's two in June?

Speaker 1 (02:37):
Two in June.

Speaker 2 (02:38):
I was taken back to that, and I remember when
I told you I was pregnant again. You were like,
are you insane? My face would have been like, oh,
you would think about, oh my goodness, are you okay?
I was like, yeah, it's fine. Nice, young naive me
who had like a unicorn first baby, who was so easy,
was like, I can do two under two absolutely no issues.

(03:00):
And I love it because you've got a big slice
of humble pie. On that one off.

Speaker 1 (03:03):
Air you were telling me like how well Rosie slept.
And she's such a beautiful soul.

Speaker 2 (03:09):
Very she's extroverted, but very like sweet, very sweet. My
youngest is like very headstrong. Yes, well, it's like.

Speaker 1 (03:17):
Don't you see those tiktoks where it's like my firstborn
my second born. So I don't think you're alone like
it seems like everyone is high.

Speaker 2 (03:23):
She like tricked me though the first six months, and
I was like, Oh, she's this sweet little angel baby,
and then now she's like getting her own like toddler personality.
I'm like, nah, she's insane.

Speaker 1 (03:35):
They do that sometimes because when they are a newborn,
they just like sleep and feed and you're like, oh,
there's nothing to them. So that was honestly a bit
of an intro already with the girls. But do you
just want to tell the irn C community who you are,
what you do, what you're about.

Speaker 2 (03:52):
Sure, So the elevator pitch, my Elevader pitch has drastically
changed in the last six months. It used to be
very different. Yes, but I am a single mom to
two beautiful girls, like I just said before, Rosie and Benny,
and I am a full time content creator. I also
have a podcast. Mine is more about like, well, at

(04:12):
the moment, it's been about finding myself after being a
stay at home mum and divorcing my ex husband. But
it's more about like womanhood, I guess, and like motherhood
and that's what I do with most of my time.
Other than I still do have my girls two days
a week. At home with me as well. But yeah,
I've gone through a big transition period, so I think

(04:33):
right now my biggest question is finding the answer for
my elevator pitch. Like I'm still in that stage of
like who am I? Like what am I doing at
the moment, which has been a fun journey to sort
of do with my followers and listeners.

Speaker 1 (04:47):
I love that so much, And that's actually why I
wanted to have you on the podcast, because this season
is all about getting what you want, and I think
it's so important to showcase that that doesn't always look
like you know the end result, and like I think
a lot of the time when you're listening to podcasts,
it's the person who has like done it all and

(05:09):
been there and it's twenty years down the line of success.
And so I really wanted to get you on because
you are in such a transitional season, like you said,
divorcing becoming a single mom or within you know, the
last six months, or while doing it on social media,
which will get into that, and I think you are

(05:29):
such the representation of the becoming in real time, which
a lot of people don't talk about. And I think
once you get to the I know who I am.

Speaker 2 (05:41):
I know the elevator.

Speaker 1 (05:42):
Pitch, you can sometimes forget the process, the process and
the transition. So I'm so excited to have you on
and to talk about that. And so many people would
be in the exact same position going through a transition,
going through a life challenge, and so obviously we're going
to talk about that all, but let's just talk about

(06:04):
you said like you are in the transition of getting
your spark back and what that has looked like over
the last couple of months.

Speaker 2 (06:12):
I think like a really interesting point to kind of
touch on is when you're talking about like getting what
you want. A really interesting experience that I've gone through
is like I got everything that I thought I wanted,
and then I got there and then was like, oh, actually,
maybe this isn't what I wanted. And that has been
like a really interesting journey now to be like, Okay,

(06:32):
what do I actually want? Because I thought I knew
and I got there, and then it didn't work out
for me. It wasn't meant for me, it wasn't actually
what I needed in life, and now I'm like, Okay,
well let's try again, which I think a lot of
people don't want to admit to like you might say
for years and years and years like oh, this is
where I want to go, and then like not many
people when they get there and they don't like it,

(06:53):
have the backbone to be like, actually, like this isn't
for me, Like this isn't what I want. And people
get really triggered as well when you say like, oh, yeah,
I reached the goals and I did what I wanted
to do, but I didn't like it or I wasn't fulfilled,
or it didn't make me happy. So that's been so interesting.
And I think like linking to what you were saying
about the spark, that is what kind of made me realize,

(07:13):
like maybe this isn't for me because I had no spark,
Like I was doing things that I had said my
entire life, like I want to be a stay at
home mom, I want to be married, I want to
have kids young, I want to be financially set up,
like we owned multiple businesses together, my ex husband and I.
I want to do all these things like I had
social media, I had you know, on paper, like the

(07:37):
dream life, and then you know, stuff doesn't always work
out the way that you think, and that went away
and then it was like, now without all those things
that I thought I wanted, I feel more fulfilled and
more vibrant and like I have so much more passion
for life than when I was in this like dream

(07:57):
life that I told myself was going to be the
most fulfilling thing ever. And that has been such an
interesting process to go through. And when people always ask like,
how have you found that spark, the biggest thing I
always say is surrendering. I feel like for so long,
like sometimes the problem is when you're a super ambitious

(08:18):
person or you like plan everything, you very type A
is like you want to control like every single little
bit of your life, and then that can be really
taxing and really draining. And I found that I have
had the ability to connect with myself and learn so
much more about myself and become so much happier by

(08:38):
letting go and just surrendering and being like, Okay, like
you can't control every single asset and aspect of your life.
Just go with it and surrender a little bit and
kind of see where life takes you. And that has
led me to be the happiest that I could be.
Because if you had told me like a year ago,
like hey, you're going to be divorced, You're not going

(08:59):
to be living with your partner anymore. You're not gonna
be a stay at home mum, You're only gonna have
your kids fifty percent of the time. You're gonna be
working full time in social media. I would have been like, no,
I'm fucking not. That sounds horrendous, Like that is not
what I want. That would never make me happy. I
would be so miserable, blah blah blah. And then I
kind of went through a journey where it's like, well,
I had no choice, and now I'm on the other side,
I'm like, oh, I actually really love my life now,

(09:20):
Like it would never have been something I would have
actively chosen for myself, but I'm so glad that it
did happen to me.

Speaker 1 (09:26):
Well, let's even go there, because I think I resonate
a lot even with how I did a six year
law degree and I got at the end and I
was like, holy shit, I don't want to do this.
And I had that impending feeling of like, what are
people gonna think. They're gonna think I'm an idiot for
doing six years of law, putting all this time and
energy and effort into this specific dream, this vision, and

(09:49):
then I'm gonna quote unquote throw it away. But I
was miserable. Yeah, And I was like I saw, you know,
other people who had reached the career success that you know,
I'm aiming to do in thirty years, and I was like,
oh my god, I don't want that. Now that I'm
in it, and now that I've seen it, I don't
want it. And it's such an interesting thing to almost

(10:12):
because I'd love to ask you your whole dream of
like stay at home mom with this partner, that sort
of ambitious stream that you were talking about, like when
did that happen? When did that start?

Speaker 2 (10:24):
Kind Of always my mom was like full time working
bread winner in my family, and while that gave me
so many opportunities growing up, I always had wished like
she could have been around a bit more. And so
then I just got in my head like instead of
finding like a happy medium, I'm the type of person
that's like nothing, yeah, all nothing. So instead of being

(10:46):
like I could be a part time working mom and
like kind of best of both words, I was like,
I'm going to be a stay at home mom and
dedicated and I loved being a stay at home mom,
Like I actually really enjoyed it, and I thought I
was really good at it, and I found it really fulfilling.
But I think a really beautiful thing that I've learned
in the last six months is like things are not
so all or nothing or not so black and white,

(11:07):
and also like there's not just one version of your
life that that's the only life that could make you happy.
And I think I really held on to the idea
of like, well, no, I have to do this version.
And then I've sort of learned like you can take
so many different paths and still end up like a
really happy, fulfilled version of yourself. And like almost in
a really weird way to say this, because I've had

(11:30):
so many like crazy things happened to me, but like
I've just gotten in a mindset now of like it's
not that deep, Like it's just not that deep, Like
it's just not that like all or nothing like and
that sounds insane and people might be like, I don't
understand what you mean by that, but it's like I
think when you go through like extreme adversity, and if
like a listener has like followed me, they would really

(11:51):
know like the whole law of the last six months,
you really start to realize like you can get through anything,
and you can do anything, and like nothing so big
that you can't bounce back from it, you can't like
recover from it. I don't know, it's really hard to describe,
but it's like I've gotten to a point where I'm like, oh, well,
it'll work out, Like it has worked out. I've made
it through all of this so far, and I've ended

(12:12):
up in a really happy place. So like, whatever, it's
not that deep, there's something else out there. If that's
not gonna like fill me up, or if that's not
meant for me, there's obviously something else. And like I think,
in a weird way, like God, universe, whatever you believe
in sort of like forced me to be like okay,
like you are not listening to us, like we are
sending it all these signs like this is not the
path for you. This is not the path for you.

(12:33):
We're gonna have to freaking skull drag you now onto
a different path until you get the thing of like
you can't control everything. You can't you know, push your
version of what you want everything to be. You'll end
up where you meant to be no matter what, and
it you know, I feel like I always think of
the thing of the universe might like at first give
be like a little push and be like, hey, like
I don't think this is for you, maybe you should change.

(12:54):
And then you can be a really stubborn person and
be like no, like this is for me. I'm gonna
keep like going on this path. And then it can
give you like a little bit of a harder push
and it's like this isn't meant for you, Like you
need to change your course. You need to like course correct,
and then it gets to a point where it's like, okay,
we're just going to force you now because like this
is not meant for you. You can go through like
an absolute soul altering experience to learn this lesson because

(13:17):
you're clearly not listening to our like little nudges of
being like you shouldn't be doing this, you shouldn't be
doing this, And like, in hindsight, there is so much
now where I'm like, maybe that was a sign, like
that wasn't what I was meant to be, like choosing
for myself or doing or whatever. But then another part
of me is like I feel like everything's meant to
sort of happen for a reason.

Speaker 1 (13:34):
Yeah, I was about to ask you, did you get
those nudges? Did you get those small signs or was
it a truck came and hear you.

Speaker 2 (13:41):
At the time, I was like, it's a truck come
and hit me and I've had no signs. And I
feel like that's very normal when you go through like
a big event. It's very normal to be like, oh,
I didn't know anything, and like this is so.

Speaker 1 (13:52):
And it was happened to me.

Speaker 2 (13:53):
It was a very like drastic change, and it was
very unexpected for me and everyone around me online, in
my personal life, like everyone was kind of shocked when
I was like, oh, I've left my husband and like
my life has done like a full one pint eighty.
Everyone was like, oh my god, what is going on?
But now looking back, I'm like there are so many
things where I'm like, wow, I really had my blinkers

(14:15):
on and was just no, I'm doing this. This is
the life I want, this is what I'm doing, And
like that sort of thing where you're saying before, well,
I've sacrificed so much and like I've done this, Like
if I give up now, or if I turn back now,
that was all for nothing. And like, I feel like
that is a very common thing that you can sort
of get stuck in, and not just in relationships like
in Korea, in friendships, in so many different things. You

(14:37):
can be like I did so much to get here.
If I just like turn around now and be like, oh,
I don't want to do this anymore, it's like, well,
was that all wasted time? But I think I've really
learned now to like appreciate the journey rather than just
like the result at the end, and also really learning
that there's no point having all the things you want

(14:59):
if you unhappy, Like we were saying this before, like
I was saying, off Mike, I would rather be struggling
and happy than have everything I want and be depressed.
And like that's a really interesting thing to learn because
I think in today's day and age, we're like told
all these external things are really going to make you
happy and make your life feel amazing and whatever, but

(15:21):
if you don't feel it inside, it like really doesn't.

Speaker 1 (15:24):
Really a society really, we're honestly brainwashed. Society tells us
when we're younger, through like you know, the media, through
our parents through what we're taught in school. It's like
there's this checklist and these are you know, either material
things or like status things or relationship things.

Speaker 2 (15:43):
Check this off, and.

Speaker 1 (15:44):
Then you're successful. You have made it, like this is
what you need to do in life. And I feel
like that's the journey of like going through those things.
Like I can resonate in regards to I remember it
was probably before IVY or maybe like when I became
an I think it. No, it was just when I

(16:05):
became a new mum. And so for example, like you know,
I became a self made millionaire by age twenty six,
I did this by age twenty seven. I had my daughter.
I wanted to be a new mom, I wanted to
work both. And I remember getting to that point and
having this like break down and being like, bit, I've
ticked all the boxes and I feel fucking miserable inside.

(16:29):
And then I went on this whole healing journey, which
is a whole other story. And it's crazy because I
have all the same things, but the healing journey was
all about accepting myself, working through childhood trauma, working through
healing so you know, certain parts of myself and now

(16:49):
I am so much more content and happier, and my
external hasn't changed. If anything, It's like I have put
on the breaks of career driven. I have put on
the breaks of certain things because I'm like that shit
doesn't actually matter, and often it takes to getting to
that pinnacle that like ticking all the things. And then

(17:10):
the way I would describe it is I felt quite empty,
Like I felt quite but I'm doing all the things,
but I don't have the feeling that everyone's talking about.
And then I went on a whole healing journey and
then like now I have the feeling, and I just
see things in such a different way where even choices
I make, you know, with my finances, with certain things,

(17:32):
like we just move house from this beautiful like ocean
view house and we've moved like to acreage, and so
many people like, oh, but I'm confused, that was your
dream house blah blah blah, And I'm like, yeah, but
now I've have a different perception and it's all about
how I feel. So if it doesn't make sense to you,
that's okay, because you have your own perceptions, you have

(17:54):
your own.

Speaker 2 (17:54):
Thing, and I don't have to explain myself Also, one
thing I've really learned is like truly coming to accept
in the least malicious way, no one cares about what
you're doing in your life. I know that sounds wild,
but I feel like when you're stuck in a period
and you think like, oh, I can't do this because
you know this person's gonna judge me, this person's gonna

(18:15):
judge me, whatever. And then as someone who's gone through
stuff that, I was like, oh, I'm gonna get eaten alive, Like,
especially on social media where there's like hundreds of thousands
of people or whatever, you really realize like people don't
care that much like they do. And maybe at first
you've got to have like a couple of awkward conversations
with people or go through like a little bit of adversity,

(18:35):
but people adapt to your new reality very quickly because
at the end of the day, they have their own
life that they're worrying about and stressing about, and they
don't have the time to think about you as much
as you are thinking about you. And I wish, honestly,
I had realized that like five six years ago, because
I spent so long in my life being like I
can't do this because of this person's judgment or whatever.

(18:57):
And then after going through what I would have described
a year go as my literal worst nightmare, and then
like surviving the other side and then being like, you
know what, that was really hard, but it wasn't what
I thought it was gonna be. And then I'm like, shit,
how much stuff have I said? No, I'm not going
to do that. I'm not going to change because I
was so concerned about someone being like that's you know,

(19:17):
you can't do that or whatever. At the end of
the day, people, most people, I would say ninety five
percent of people are like, oh, well, if it makes
you happy, like cool, Like you know, even people knew
me personally at first we're a bit like oh, and
then now they're like yeah, cool, like whatever, like if
that makes you happy.

Speaker 1 (19:32):
Yes, well, you know, even let's take that one step further.
So the people who do care, and let's we will
chat about like your social media and the feedback that
you got because honestly, wild girl.

Speaker 2 (19:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (19:43):
But even so, the people that care from like a
mindset like shadow work also lens. Yeah, the only reason
why they would care is you were reflecting something to
them that they don't like. Within themselves. Yes, and once
you realize that, and once you realize okay, so there
are people who care, but it's about them, not you,

(20:06):
Like it's not about you exactly, it's actually not about you.

Speaker 2 (20:10):
Really learning that like even that negative thought, that's their
own story and like having to come to the realization
of like, that's cool. They can think that about me,
but they don't have to wake up as me every
day and they don't have to live as me every day.
So like let them think that, Like let them think
that that's cool for them, okay, And what does that
mean for me? Like I think really not giving power

(20:31):
to thoughts and being like it's literally just a thought
of someone else. It's not even my own thought about myself.
So why am I giving it so much power over me?
Because at the end of the day, it doesn't really
affect me or even like you.

Speaker 1 (20:44):
Said, it's like that five percent who are judgmental who care,
and it's like, well, we're not giving our attention to
the you know, ninety five percent. Why are we giving
so much attention to the five percent?

Speaker 2 (20:56):
I always say this to people when I have this conversation,
and I think it's because negative thoughts are the loudest, right,
So something that's five percent, because negativity is such a
emotive thing and it is such a strong emotion. It
sounds thirty thousand times louder than positivity. Right, So even

(21:18):
though you have ninety five percent of people who are
positive cheering you on whatever, the five percent feels like
one hundred percent. So then you put so much time
and effort into it. And I actually listened to an
interview with Tom Holland which was a really weird place
to get like inspirations vitament Biamendu, and he said that
like the way that he deals with any type of

(21:38):
critique is just realizing that what anyone else thinks about
you that does not know you is not true. And
he was like, positive, it's not true. I don't give
it any value because they don't know me and they
aren't me, so they can sit there and be like
you're the best ever, and like I think you're so amazing.
He was like, I give that the same value as
someone who says something negative. And when I realized that,

(22:01):
it changed my perception on how people perceive me, and
I have now really leant into that of like the
value of a positive word is the same value as
a negative word. It's what I put the value on it,
not what the other person is thinking. And that has
been really interesting. And I think a really really big

(22:21):
thing to learn is also that pleasing everyone else doesn't
mean that you're going to be pleased, yes, which was
a really hard thing to learn. So I got diagnosed
with ADHD at the end of last year and then
I'm currently going through my ASD diagnosis. I've had like
a clinical psychologist diagnose me, and then I'm going through
the process of life. Sorry, what is ASD stortism? Oh? Yes, yes,

(22:45):
with your autism spectrum disorder. Yeah. And the biggest thing
learning was that people pleasing is like a really big
thing of people who have neurodivergence because it's a really
big masking thing. You try and please people to fit in.
It becomes like a survival instinct because you're like, I'm
a bit different, I don't really fit in with everyone else.
So if I do everything that everyone wants and make

(23:07):
them really happy, they're going to like me. So it
becomes a very big thing that you do. And I
never understood why I found people pleasing so important and
like it literally dedicated my entire life to just not
looking introspectively at anything that would make me happy and
putting one hundred percent of my time and energy into
what is going to make the people around me happy.

(23:28):
And maybe if that happens, I will be accepted and
then I will be.

Speaker 1 (23:32):
Happy and fit in.

Speaker 2 (23:34):
Yeah, And then so much sin that has been like
unlearning that or realizing like even if I do every
little thing to make everyone happy, if I'm not happy,
it doesn't matter. And once I realized that, it really changed,
like everything, and like I honestly think a lot of
that came from like once I hit rock bottom and
I was like, Okay, all the horrible things, like the

(23:55):
worst things I thought that could have happened to me
have happened to me. Like I got postpartum depression. My dog,
who was like my best friend from ten years like
died really suddenly and tragically. My marriage broke down. I
had four hundred dollars to my name, and I moved
out of my home. I was a single mom to
two kids, which was my biggest worst nightmare because I
grew up with divorced parents and I hated it. I

(24:16):
was like, had no job, prospects other than my social media.
Like I'd been a stay at home mum for four years,
so I had no current references, no current work experience.
I didn't have anyone that I could be like, hey,
can I have a job with you? So I was like, crap,
I've got to start like generating actual, serious, full time
money out of this social media or I'm quite frankly
stuffed because I don't have any income. Like I had

(24:37):
all these things where I was like, well, like I'm here,
I'm at the bottom. I was like, I've disappointed everyone.
In my head, I hadn't disappointed anyone, but in my
people pleasing brain, I was like, I've let everyone down.
Why not try doing it my way? Then? Because I
did everything for everyone and it didn't turn out the
way that I wanted. So let's try this again, but

(24:57):
do what you want to do. And it is such
a like liberating experience to kind of go through and like,
while I wouldn't wish what I went through on the
worst on my worst enemy, it was also like wow,
I needed all of that to kind of like fall
away for me to realize, hey, like you can do

(25:18):
whatever you want. Because at the end of the day,
like you pleased all those people and you're the one
that suffered for it. Yeah, why not? You know, if
stuff can change in an instant, why not do what
you want to do, wouldn't you say?

Speaker 1 (25:30):
When you start living life on your own terms, it's.

Speaker 2 (25:34):
Liberating, so liberating and like so freeing when you also
this is gonna sound really woo woo. Okay, so before babe,
I know, yeah, this is what I like. Georgie and
I doing podcast swaps, so like she's gonna come into
my podcast next, and this is like something that I
wanted to touch on in my podcast. But like before

(25:54):
this whole experience of my life, I was not really
that woo. I was religious. I've always grown up. Really,
I still believe in like Jesus. I still go to
church or whatever, but I'd never done any type of
like alternative spirituality. I got really bad postpartum depression with
my youngest after I had her, and I saw this
advertisement of this like Mother's Retreat, which was with another

(26:17):
influencer in Sydney and her like spiritual life coach, right,
and it was like at this beautiful lake and it
was like come be with other women for three days
and like we're going to do like all this like
emotional soul work. And honestly, I was so depressed and
so desperate, like I had like psychiatrists being like, we're
going to have to admit you into like a maternal
mental health ward, like you're very, very depressed, like you've

(26:38):
got severe postpartum depression. And I was like I don't
want to like do that. I can't take my daughters.
I could only take my youngest with me, so my
toddler would have had not had me for like six weeks.
And I was like I was a stay at home mum,
Like being a mum was my whole identity. So for
me to be admitted into a ward was like that
was the ultimate failure for me. So I was just
like I can't, I'm not doing that, which in hindsight,

(26:58):
I'm like, maybe I should have just on it, but
I had all these stories in my head telling me
like you can't do that, you can't admit that you
need that help. Whatever. I saw this ad for this
retreat and I was like, well, what have I got
to lose, because like at this point, like I'll try
anything because I'm like I'm going to a psychiatrists. I'm
going to a psychologist, I'm going doing all these like things.

(27:19):
I'm medicated, I'm this that the other. Let's try this.
I haven't tried this yet, Like let's give it a go.
So I booked the retreat on the spot and it
was happening like three or four weeks later, and I
was like, yep, no worries. Anyway, I went to this retreat,
got there and I was like, ooh, this is very wooo.
Like I was kind of sitting in the first like
like imagining a woman's circle, being like, oh, okay, we're

(27:39):
doing this, like this is really weird, like you know,
like Kelly, who's now like my life coach. But she
was like, you know, testing everyone's areas and like all
this stuff, and I was like, whoa, what is going on? Anyway,
it was like the most incredible retreat, like totally transformed me.
The most beautiful group of women that was like eighteen
of us was the most beautiful group of women. I
had like the best time. And then I was like

(28:02):
talking to Kelly and then she was like, you know,
like if you ever want to like keep doing work
like this, like I do have like some spots available,
and she told me like the price to work with her,
and my eyeballs nearly fell out my head and I
was like, excuse me, Like that is so expensive. And
then I was like I don't know what I want
to do because I have this feeling like I want
to go do this, but then I'm also like that's

(28:23):
a lot of money and I could be getting scammed
right now, like this chick could like take this like
lump sum of money for me and I like do nothing.
And again I was just in such I didn't have
the money like that like money, because I was like
I don't. I don't feel like I could take this
from a joint account like from my marriage. So I
was like, this is going to be like my savings
that I'm going to like put into this. I'm a

(28:43):
said her mum. I wasn't making that much money. So
it was like any money that I did have in
my own account was like very very precious to me. Yes, yes,
because that was my money to spend on whatever I wanted,
no questions asked. And I was like, if I like
pay this sum, like that's it, Like that's all my
savings gone, Like what if this just blows up in
my face and I, you know, pee away all that
money that I had spent so long saving art. But

(29:05):
I was like, I'm so desperate, like let's give it
a go. And after doing that work, which is really
just mindset work and a lot of like emotional processing work,
it made me realize how so much power comes from
within and not from the external circumstances around you, which
is so cool to learn but also deeply frustrating because

(29:26):
you're like I had the power the whole time, and
I was like victiming it and blaming it on everything
around me, when it was like, this is coming down
to the way I think, like even simple things I
learned of the idea of like just ask, Like what
do you mean just ask? Like, oh, just ask for
like ask that person if you want something, just ask
for it. I'm like, no, you can't do that or

(29:47):
ask the universe. Yeah, like just ask And I was
like that's like bullshit or whatever. And then now I've
like gone like I wouldn't say I'm full woo wo,
but I'm like, have put like learnt so much of
the power of like how the way you think about
your life and the way you think about yourself can
change so much around you, which is a really cool

(30:07):
like journey to sort of go on.

Speaker 1 (30:09):
And don't you think it's interesting that we often have
to get to rock bottom to then be like, ah,
I was, I was the power all that I was,
you know, like I was the key all the time,
and I had to like go through all this shit.
But also, like, something I think about is if we
were born and like you know, he entered school and

(30:30):
for example, you knew, oh, I was power, I've got everything,
you wouldn't go through anything. You wouldn't have any challenges,
you wouldn't become the person you are. Like, if you
think about it, in the last six months, the amount
of transformation in your emotional intelligence, in your ego, in

(30:52):
the challenges no sorry, the lessons.

Speaker 2 (30:55):
You will teach your daughters like the It's like, honestly, you've.

Speaker 1 (30:59):
Gone through ten years of self development in six months,
and it sucks that you had to go through a challenge.
But also, like you said, it's kind of it had
to happen that way for whatever reason, your soul has
picked up. That's what I believe. I've got your souls.

Speaker 2 (31:13):
I'm not religious, I think as well as just a
stubborn bitch and was like, I'm not learning this lesson.
I refuse to go through this hardship. I'm gonna push push,
push push, And I think like, if it's destined for you,
it's destined for you. And it was like that was
the only way that I could get where I needed
to be, and it Yeah, I just was like, honestly,
I do say that to people when they're like, oh,

(31:34):
you know, you seem like you've moved so quickly and
blah blah blah. I'm like, I think because I've had
such intense I've done such intense work on myself, Like
I've done more work in the last twelve months on myself.
So six months before I separated and then the six
months after that, I think then people have done will
do in ten years.

Speaker 1 (31:52):
I'm also going to put it out there, I because
I didn't know you had done that work, which is
first of all incredible, and I'm gonna put it out there.
But do you think it's a coincidence no, that you
started doing spiritual soul work six months and then your
marriage brokeer? No way, Like I always say this to Kelly,

(32:14):
who I did the work with no Joe, I've just
got full body shivering.

Speaker 2 (32:18):
Three weeks before my marriage ended, I had just finished
a finance course with her, right, so I never managed
any of the finances in my marriage. I'd just done
a finance course with her whatever, and then three weeks later,
I like left, my husband, had to become financially independent,

(32:38):
had to do all this stuff. And like her and
I were talking and she's like, there's no way it's
a coincidence. You just did like deep finance mindset work
and got given all the skills you needed to then
go and do this massive finance change in your life.
And to put it in perspective, I did not know
my marriage was ending. There were no signs. I wasn't
expecting it. I wasn't like her out of the blue. Yeah,

(33:00):
came really out of the blue. So like I think
of that all the time, Like I'm like, there's no
way that was a coincidence. Like, and I did like
deep like chakra work and we like unclogged all this stuff,
And I was just like, this is wild. But I
know because listen, like this girl's crazy. But I cannot
stress that you're on the right podect. Before this period,

(33:20):
I did not believe in any of that, like honestly,
even with you. Sometimes I would see your post about manifestation,
I roll my eyes and be like yeah, yeah, whatever.
And then I started doing it and seeing like the
results of like a mindset switch and like letting go
of like external power and being like I actually have
the power to do everything I want in my life.

(33:41):
I was like, oh my god, I Georgian an apology,
like she's actually onto something, this chick.

Speaker 1 (33:46):
Honestly, I take no offense because I know that's how
a lot of people feel. And it's because and I'm
like careful when I say this. But what I call
it is, before you started doing that in a work,
I call it you were in the matrix, like you
were so in the three D the matrix where again

(34:08):
it's like the society of like A plus B equalcy.
You know this, this is the.

Speaker 2 (34:13):
Your shadow self, that's like thing there being like yeah.

Speaker 1 (34:17):
And like you got the herm oil underneath. And then
so as soon as you step into this work, it
all has to come to the surface. It all has
to play out. It cannot like you cannot get out
of the matrix and understand the world and understand truly
what's happening in a spiritual sense, and then life be

(34:39):
the same, like it wouldn't. It just doesn't happen. And
it's funny because I remember when I before I did
spiritual healing work that i'm telling you about before the
guy I did it with, he said, I'm gonna be
very frank with you, and after you do this work,
there is a lot of divorces, There is a lot
of career change. There is a lot of change that

(35:01):
will happen in your reality, and I need to know
if you will be able to deal with that, because
once we start, we can't go back, and you have
to finish this, you know, container with me, because otherwise
it's really bad and you'll be stuck in like the
middle and I'm the void in the void. And so
he said, you like, there's a lot of relationship breakdowns.

(35:24):
There's a lot of blah blah blah in his clients
that he has, like you know, been through, and he's like,
I need you to realize that this is an actual thing.

Speaker 2 (35:33):
And it's funny because at the time I.

Speaker 1 (35:34):
Was like, yeah, yeah, And then I went through it
and me and Tim actually went through a lot of
marital sort of you know, things we had to deal
with that were super uncomfortable and very uncertain. There was
actually points in my marriag where I was like, I
don't know if we'll be together. Yeah, And so now
we have come out the other end, and you know,

(35:56):
we obviously are having a second baby, and I have
decided that, you know, future together. But I just love
that you brought that up because I think once you
start opening up to truly again not just being in
a life that society has set for you, and you
start looking inwards and you start getting curious, your reality

(36:20):
has to reflect that.

Speaker 2 (36:21):
Well, it kind of goes off what I was saying
before of like when I had paid all that money
and I'd been like, Okay, I'm gonna do this work
now really came down to surrendering and just being like, well,
if you're gonna like I got to a point where
I was like, I've paid this lump sum. If I'm
gonna pay this lump sum and it's everything that is
my own that I've saved or whatever, I might as
well give it everything i've got, like and say that

(36:43):
I did my all to like embrace it. And also
I just had to tell myself, it's gonna be uncomfortable,
you're gonna be scared, you're not gonna like doing it.
Probably like the first few sessions, I was like, this
is fucking weird like stuff that I'm doing here, and
you know, she's getting me to be like like breathe
out like negative emotions, like really weird, kooky stuff. And
I was like, just surrender, Just do it, Just give

(37:04):
it everything you can. Stop trying to fight it. If
you feel, like I told myself in every session, don't
overthink the answers to questions she's asking. As soon as
it pops in your head, just let it out and
don't think, oh, that was a silly answer or whatever.
I was like, just truly surrender, and it was the
biggest learning to then be like, Okay, you can do
that in that sense, you can do that in every sense.

(37:26):
Just surrender and speak what speak your mind, or like,
let that thing happen to you. If it's gonna happen,
there's nothing you can do to change it. Just let
it happen and go with it. Because you are wasting
so much time and so much energy resisting, resisting, resisting
because you're afraid or you're embarrassed or you know, you're
trying to prevent something from happening. And it was just

(37:47):
like such a learning of like just do it, just
let it happen and go with the flow, because you
are giving it more power by giving it all that
energy and doing all that stress and putting all that
emotion like I don't want this, I don't want this,
I don't want this. Then sometimes just surrendering and letting
it happen. And that doesn't mean I'm sitting here being
like oh, you know, because sometimes when you go through

(38:09):
a really shit thing and someone's like, oh that was
you know, that was God's plan for you, or like
that was meant to happen. Yeah, sometimes you can sit
there and be like, no, actually, fuck you. That was
really hard and I didn't deserve that and that was
shitty and that made me feel crap, and you know
I could have gone without that, and you know what,
maybe I didn't want to learn that lesson, Like I
think that's really valid, and I still have moments like

(38:30):
when people try and be like, oh, you know, like
that was so meant for you, I'm like yes, but
also no, like no one's meant to go through like
extreme suffering like that, or like you know, like as
well as people who lose like a loved one or
something like that, Like don't ever sit there and tell
them like, this is what's meant for you. But also
it's like, Okay, it's happening to you. Whether it was
meant to happen to you or not, it is, so

(38:53):
surrender to it and see what you can learn from it,
because the other option is you stay angry, you stay jaded,
you stay bitter, and the result is still the same.
That thing still happens to you either way. And once
I kind of switched to that mindset, I learned so
much and grew so much.

Speaker 1 (39:10):
Wow, Like I didn't even know that you went through that.
That is so incredible. I'm so proud of you. I
love this so much, and I want to kind of
bring it back to you on the rebuilding journey because,
like you said, I think you've hit the nail on

(39:30):
the head where that really is everyone's I think that's
like most women's worst fear, you know, divorce, single mom.
Can you talk to us about the rebuilding Obviously you've
spoken on like the deeper healing work, the surrendering. What
sort of other is the more like tangible things that

(39:51):
you can kind of give advice to someone who is
maybe going through something similar or just like a really
really hard challenge right now that has helped you. Because
I'm even looking in and obviously this is only my projection,
I'm not living the experience, but I feel like you
have processed this quite fast, and like I even see

(40:12):
you like you're thriving, like you look amazing, Like I
can see in your appearance like that you're doing really well.
And even the words you're saying, like I'm like, holy shit,
she's really fucking processing is fast in a six month period.
And then but again, I truly believe someone will only
process fast when they're leaning completely in. So such a

(40:33):
testament to you. Yeah, but like the tangible things that
have helped you rebuild get your spark back, What would
you say to someone going through it?

Speaker 2 (40:43):
I would say, first up, stop get rid of any
five year plan, ten year plan, out of the in
that been that right now, especially like obviously not forever,
but while you're going through like a huge period of
change and turmoil, get rid of that out of your brain,
because it's not gonna be helpful it's gonna put so

(41:04):
much external pressure on yourself. It's gonna really fuck with
your internal dialogue because you're thinking, I have to be
here in you know, five years, but all this stuff
is happening. I got rid of everything and I literally
broke it down to today, what do I have to
do today? Like, genuinely, I would not even be like
people because at first, when my husband and I separated,
We're like, we're taking six months, and then people would

(41:25):
be like, well, what's gonna happen at the end of
the six months, And I'm like, I don't know. I'm
not there yet. I'm doing today, and when I get
to the end of the six months, I can make
that decision. But I'm like, there's no point because six
months ago, I didn't even know this was a reality
that could have happened to me. So why am I
going to waste so much time and energy going there
not saying that like I don't have goals or dreams
for my life, but right now I'm doing it. Okay,

(41:49):
there's no pressure. Yes, I'm like, let's just get through
this period and then we can go back to that,
which is honestly the most Like even some days there
would be days where I would be like, let's do
hour by hour, like because I'm a very anxious person
that I can try and pre plan and like future project,
and yeah, I had to learn like you need to

(42:10):
stop that right now because you don't have the energy
for that right now. Let that go. Don't stop trying
to do that and stop trying to control that. Just
break it down to really edible, bite sized sort of pieces.
The next thing that I really had to learn was like,
stop trying to push the negative emotions down, which is
something I'm really, really, really good at. Like I said,

(42:32):
I'm no I'm getting diagnosed with autism. And the thing
that flagged with my clinical psychologists for her to even
test me for it was like, you're really bad at
processing any emotion that's not just like happiness or She's like,
you have an emotional spectrum of happy, sad, angry, and
like nothing in between. She's like, you really suck at
dealing with like gray emotions like melancholy or like nostalgia,

(42:56):
or like emotions that it's like it's not really one thing,
or that it's like kind of a blend of multi emotions.

Speaker 1 (43:03):
Like you almost can't hold duality.

Speaker 2 (43:05):
Yes, Like I would just be like, oh, that thing
that happened to me that was sad, and then she's like, well,
but it could have like elements of happiness or elements
of anger, or elements of grief, and I just could
not process the emotions. Like I was very black and white,
which meant when I feel negative emotions, I will instead
choose to feel nothing because I don't really deal well

(43:25):
with dealing with negative emotions, like very non confrontational, very
rarely get angry. Like those things were very scary to me,
and a big thing that I had to learn was like,
the only thing that that will result in is burnout
because to suppress emotions takes like three times the amount
of energy then to just feel the emotion and to
just allow yourself to be like, what I'm feeling is

(43:46):
valid and I can feel it.

Speaker 1 (43:47):
And it always comes up.

Speaker 2 (43:48):
Oh it does, even if it comes up in a
way that you didn't realize that it's coming up. It
always comes up. And also the thing is it always
comes up and it's not going to just go away
because you're not putting time and energy into it. And
also in the age of like social media, you really
are told like, if you're negative about things, if you're

(44:09):
this like positive mindset, stuff is great. But sometimes people
can take it too far and like you always have
to be positive, positive, yeah, but like they don't realize
that sometimes part of a positive mindset is processing the
negative emotions to leave room for the positivity. I think
a lot of people have all the room taken up
by like anger, sadness, grief, whatever, and then they just

(44:30):
try and like squash the positivity on top without realizing
to have room for that, you have to deal with
everything else that's in there. So I went through this
period where I was like I'm gonna be sad, I'm
going to cry in my bed all day, and like
I started asking myself like really scary questions that I'd
always avoided, Like my therapist. I was like, you know,
I'm just so exhausted and I just feel like giving up.

(44:51):
And then my therapists would be like, okay, well why
don't you give up? I'd be like sorry, She's like, well,
what would that look like? What would that look like
if you just turned around today and you're like I'm
going to give up? Why don't you feel that feeling
and think about it? And actually process what that would
look like for you and how that would make you feel,
rather than just like saying it as a concept, think

(45:12):
about it genuinely go to that place, because I think
a lot of us will be like, oh, I don't
even want to like touch that emotion.

Speaker 1 (45:17):
I can't I can't go that.

Speaker 2 (45:18):
I don't want to go there. I don't want to
think about that. Or she'd be like, you know, why
don't you just take a day and cry all day
in bed and see what happens at the end of
the day. And like that was a really that sounds
so simple, That was so that's so deep. It was
so transformational to me to just be like, Okay, what
if I just allow myself to be negative? What if

(45:38):
I just allow myself to cry? What if I allow
myself to be angry? What if I allow myself to
just do these emotions and get them out and then
give myself a period of like, Okay, for a day,
I'm going to be sad and I'm not going to
work and I'm not going to do anything. I'm just
gonna lay in my bed and cry and read a
book and do nothing and just do it for a
day and see what the result is, and then you

(45:58):
go to bed, comes up the next morning and you're like, oh, okay,
well the ladder, what am I going to do today? Now?
Like that was done. I did that. The world didn't end.
I survived, I processed the emotions. It didn't kill me.
All right, let's move on to the next thing now.
And like once I kind of realized that, I then
started to have like healthy processing of emotion. And I

(46:19):
think it is so scary to actually do the things
of like I'm gonna give up, I'm gonna cry, i'm
gonna fall apart, I'm gonna have a breakdown, and then
when you do it and you come out the other end,
you're like, okay, cool. So that was that just the
same as like when you have a super happy day,
the happy day ends and you wake up the next
morning when you start again, it's the exact same thing.

(46:39):
And that was a really cool thing to do. So
they're the two main things. And then the third thing,
if it is you know, a financial option, get professional help.

Speaker 1 (46:48):
Amen.

Speaker 2 (46:49):
Amen is a big thing I say to people because
it's like you can mindset, diet, exercise, do all the
fun stuff things as much as you want acupuncture, sauna,
all those like alternative things. Sometimes at the end of
the day, you need a professional to come in and
help you. And if you do have the funds to
do it, there's nothing wrong in saying, no, I need help,

(47:09):
no I need medication, I need a professional to talk
me through this. I need to do the work. And
that's okay. And I always say that to people as well,
like you can do every single alternative therapy in the world,
but at the end of the day, scientifically, sometimes when
you're really distressed, you're really depressed whatever, your brain goes

(47:29):
into fight or flight and when you're in that stage,
it's actually physically impossible for your brain to take on
new information. So you can be trying all these other things.
Your brain has got a massive brick wall around it,
being like I can't learn anything new right now. I
can't take on any new information. So you're doing this stuff,
You're pummeling yourself with self care and all these things,

(47:51):
and at the end of the day, it's like you
need to go and get professional help or someone to
help you to get you to a space that then
you can do all these alternate things. And I think
that's really important whenever I'm sharing the journey that I've
gone through. For me to not just sit here and
be like, oh yeah, I had someone like do reiki
on me and I was cured. It's like no, no, no,
I'm also medicated. I got an eurodivergent diagnosis. I see

(48:15):
a psychiatrist, I see a psychologist, and I do alternative healing.
It's sort of like a quadruple pronged effect. And I
think that's important to say to people as well, is
like we are not meant to know everything, and that's
why people are professionals in their job to help you.

Speaker 1 (48:34):
I love that you point that out, and I think
it's well. When you were talking, something that came to
mind was a lot of people ask like, oh, you
were successful so fast in business.

Speaker 2 (48:45):
What did you do?

Speaker 1 (48:46):
And it's funny because this six months before I even
started Naked Harvest. I hired a business like mindset coach
who had created a seven figure business and we just
did mindset work and it cost me sixty thousand dollars,
which sorry forty thousand US, which like I didn't have.

(49:09):
And I'm like, well, I wanted a successful, you know, business,
so I just went straight to the professional who could
give me the identity work, the mindset work, everything, because
that's what I wanted. And so people will pay for
that with like, you know, business or whatnot. But what

(49:29):
they also don't know is then that was the only
business coach I've ever had, and anyone after that has
been pure mindset mental health. And that's how I've been
able to like move through life. And I'm like, I
never think I have it figured out. I never think
even though I teach other people self development and mindset,

(49:50):
I'm still now continuously going to professionals because you should
always be evolving and progressing. And a lot of the
time we will go to p professionals when we are
like a broken rock bottom or like we really really
want something. But what you need to understand is it
should be a continuous thing to be like a well

(50:11):
rounded human and to continuously like progress and evolve. And
of course it's not going to always be like to
the amount because I can understand, like it would be
taking a lot for you to see all these people
and a lot of money and whatnot, and it's not
always at that standard.

Speaker 2 (50:27):
Yeah, But I just truly believe we.

Speaker 1 (50:29):
Should always be looking for help. We should always be
relying on other people and seeking out that professional help
because we don't know it all well.

Speaker 2 (50:38):
It also like going through that experience and paying the
money for it has made me so passionate about being
like why is this not more accessible to people? Like
why can we have access to so many other things?
But like psychology is not on Medicare, psychology is not
claimable on private health either. Like there's literally nothing.

Speaker 1 (50:57):
Either as a mindset coach.

Speaker 2 (50:59):
Yeah, like you get, yeah, you get, you get ten
sessions on a mental health plan, but it's not even free,
like it's you still got to pay gap and like
ten sessions is not even one session a month. Yeah,
Like if you've got actual complex mental health issues like
I had postpartum depression, that's not just like oh I
feel sad, Like that's a really complex mental health issue,
you still can't even do yeah a session a month,

(51:20):
and it's like when you have When I had postpartum depression,
I was going once a week. So it's been something
that's really like made me quite passionate around the idea
of like why is that so expensive and why aren't
we prioritizing it more and making it more accessible to
a larger audience of people because it is so transformative
and it is so helpful, and I think doing stuff

(51:42):
like I always explained to people, like what's the difference
between your life coach and your psychologist? And I'm like,
it's different in the way of like with my psychologists
we talk about the way I feel, and with my
life coach and the work she sort of does around
like emotional healing. It's how those emotions show up physically,
either in my life or in my body, and that's
where they kind of like work together to access it.

(52:03):
On all sides.

Speaker 1 (52:04):
It's almost like the first thing is actual awareness and
then it's like the actual processing.

Speaker 2 (52:10):
Yes is that yes? Yeah, yeah, And I found that
like really really helpful. But yeah, there is a massive
financial barrier to those things and it is such a
privilege to be able to do it. But I also,
since leaving my husband, had to prioritize financially. Okay, I'm
going to cut other things because this is so important
to me that I've got to find the money somewhere.

Speaker 1 (52:32):
Well, that's what I want to bring up because one
hundred percent, it should be more accessible, it should be
more available, But I do want to counter that with
I don't think people prioritize that they will. For example,
I speaking to a girlfriend who wants to, you know,
get a coach and whatnot. She's like, well, I just
don't have the money. And I'm like, babe, I know

(52:54):
for a fact the amount of money you spend on
facials and beauty appointments, and obviously that's not the same
like a single mum, but I'm like you just for me,
for example, having that beach business coach, It's like I
didn't have the money, it was the only thing I
could do, but it was such a priority. And I
think a lot of the time, like for example, my

(53:14):
mom and dad, mental health wasn't spoken about. Yeah, Like
it was like you're happy, you're sad, and also if
you're sad, don't talk to me about it. And I
think in society there has not been a lot of
importance on our mental health.

Speaker 2 (53:28):
So when people like, oh, what I have I have
to pay for this? Yeah, I was like, yes, you'd
do when it's really.

Speaker 1 (53:35):
Important and it should be not only more accessible and cheaper,
but it also should be a priority.

Speaker 2 (53:42):
I think a lot of that can also come down
to though, like the way that we had taught about
mental health in society and also the fear and stigma
that comes around dealing with mental health. Like some people
will like, there genuinely are people out there who can't
even afford to put groceries on the table, right, So
of course they're like the people they physically.

Speaker 1 (54:00):
Cannot got to eat.

Speaker 2 (54:01):
Yes, if I cannot find the money anywhere, like I'm stuffed.
But then there's also people who, you know, they've been
told their whole lives, like, you know, it's weird. People
go to therapy and it's scary and it's uncomfortable.

Speaker 1 (54:13):
When I told my parents like five years ago that
I was going because I did therapy for probably three
years straight, they literally were like, but you're so fine,
Like we raised you so well, why do you need
to go to therapy like you had the best childhood.

Speaker 2 (54:28):
Well, when you have those stigmas associated with it, and
then you're telling someone who is really you know, living
paycheck to paycheck and is struggling to them, be like, no,
actually cut something out of your life that you really
enjoy and brings you a slither of joy and put
it towards this thing that you've been told your whole
life only freaks do and it's really scary and it's

(54:50):
comfortable and you're not gonna like it and whatever. Like,
of course people are gonna be like, I get very
few luxuries as it is, and now I've got to
pay all my money that I get to put towards
anything for me that I like towards doing therapy. Well,
of course people are gonna be like, I'm not fucking
doing that, like, and that makes so much sense to
me when you like frame it that way, which is

(55:11):
why I also like do so much of my time
online explaining to women like, it is so okay to
be struggling. Doesn't make your freak, it doesn't make you weird.
Go and get therapy, like, you will be so grateful
for it. And the sooner you start, the sooner you
get to the end. And that's a big thing where
I'm like, I know it's scary, and I know you
feel like you don't have money, and I know you

(55:32):
feel like you're going to have to sacrifice the very
few luxuries you have in like a cost of living
crisis where things are already tight, But trust me, it.

Speaker 1 (55:40):
Would be the best.

Speaker 2 (55:40):
It's worth it, trust me, Like if you can, if
you are not at the point where you're like, we
can't even pay groceries. Like, if you have a spare
fifty dollars a week, spend six months saving up that
fifty dollars to do therapy. I promise you you will
not regret it and it will not be like wasted
money at all. But it's so hard, and you can

(56:01):
understand why people feel absolutely apprehensive about starting it totally.

Speaker 1 (56:07):
And that's like, I also think people need to get
And it's like even what you're saying, how like you'd
see some of my content and like, you know, roll
your eyes. I think people need to get to a
certain spot in their life for something to be relevant
and for something to be a priority. And like we said,
like it does suck that it has to be rock bottom,

(56:29):
and for you it had to be literally your whole
world crashing down. But now that you've done it, you're like,
oh my god, I you know, this is amazing. I
want to scream it to the world. And so it
does really suck that sometimes it has to be rock bottom,
or sometimes someone just has to be really ready. And
what I say with like therapy or mindset work or

(56:50):
anything like that you can never push someone to go
and do it because let's say you know your brother's
an addict and he's gone going through whatnot, and you're like,
I'll pay your therapy, I'll do.

Speaker 2 (57:02):
It, unless you have to want to help yourself.

Speaker 1 (57:05):
Unless he wants to help himself and he's ready for
the awareness and he's ready for it, it's not even
going to work. And so it is very sad that
like some people will never really get to that place
or have that realization because they do truly believe it's
like for this work to work, you need to be

(57:27):
ready for it.

Speaker 2 (57:27):
You have to I like have said to a lot
of people around like self work, you have to literally
chuck your ego in the min and like let go
of everything everything you knew, so humble and just be like, Okay,
I'm coming to you like a chakra work. Yeah, like
you're coming to like I am a worm, Like I
am not going like build me back up. And but

(57:49):
that's really hard to do, Like that's really hard to
be like let that go, let that ego go, like
even the ego of being like getting to the point
of like being like I'm not okay, I'm actually really
fun struggling. That takes so much to like stand there
to people and actually wholeheartedly admit, hey, I'm really not
doing okay. Is such a scary and hard thing to do, like,

(58:11):
and that's the thing where it's like the person has
to be ready to do it themselves and you have
to take those scary steps otherwise you're just not gonna
get to a point where you're gonna it's gonna like
actually set in because you need to strip away yeah,
everything else. Otherwise it's just like you are literally peeing
money up the wall and just being like it's not
gonna work. Like you have to get to a point,

(58:31):
like I was saying before when I did the course,
I was just like, well, I've paid all this money,
like I got to go into this full chest one
hundred percent. Otherwise I am just gonna be wasting yes lumps.
And that is really really hard and takes a lot
of yeah, humbleness to be like okay, like I'm just
gonna swallow everything in my head that's saying this is

(58:52):
silly and this is stupid and this will never work
and just being like just give it a go and see.
And that takes because it's a risk because known you're
not guaranteed a result at the end, So that's the
scary bit.

Speaker 1 (59:04):
It is scary, and also because a lot of it
relies on how much you show up, and a lot
of people don't have that confidence in themselves. All right,
my love, I'm going to ask you one last question.
And this has been an amazing conversation, by the way, Yeah,
it's really stimulated me.

Speaker 2 (59:20):
I've really enjoyed it. For sure, I could talk forever,
but we're still going to your.

Speaker 1 (59:26):
Something I just want to quickly touch on is the
comments that you get on TikTok. Like I follow you
on TikTok, love your content, and I remember once it
was because you had like replied to a comment, so
I like press the comments and I was literally baffled.

(59:47):
What some people comment to you and what some people
think they have the right to have an opinion about
your life or how you're processing or how you're doing
something is so wild. And then I like one on
a bit of thing of like checking out your other comments,
and I just want to say, you should be so
proud of how you show up on social media, the

(01:00:10):
criticism and judgment you hold and deal with because like,
and it kind of seems like other moms if I'm
getting it right.

Speaker 2 (01:00:18):
Well, my audience is ninety six percent female, so it
makes sense. Yes, And so it's like, I just want
to say, such a testament to the work you've done
and who you are, because honestly, I was like looking
there and I was like, if people this fucking judgmental
to me, I don't know how I would feel. So,
first of all, I know probably not on that level,

(01:00:38):
but anyone going through a big life change, the judgments
and criticisms is so much and I'd love for you
to kind of just finish on the advice for someone
going through it, just because you've like yeah, on social media,
I was like, that's a.

Speaker 1 (01:00:52):
Bit much like, yes, I hope you're blocking people.

Speaker 2 (01:00:55):
Well, this is the thing that I so many creators
are like, you're fucking insane because I very rarely block
and delete. I leave a lot your face is like,
excuse me, I leave a lot of the negative discourse up. Obviously,
if it goes to a place of it being like
absolutely appropriate, futrid and bile, yes, those people get blocked
and deleted, or if it's just like them constantly constantly, constantly,

(01:01:18):
I might like, okay, okay.

Speaker 1 (01:01:19):
D obsess me, but my page.

Speaker 2 (01:01:21):
I've never been never been afraid of negative discourse or
hidden it because I think there is so much learning
in dealing with negative judgments or even letting people see
negativity against you. I think it shows people like I
think it's very common for creators, and it's I would say,
by and large, the done thing to delete and block

(01:01:43):
negative opinions. But then it makes people sometimes think when
they view something that you know, everyone else in life
is making these big changes and doing these big things
and they're not getting any negative pushback, and then they're
trying to do the same thing and they're like, why
is everyone in my life being such a ce next
Tuesday about doing X, Y and Z. So I do
leave it up sometimes to show people the reality, the

(01:02:04):
reality of sometimes doing hard things or changing things is like, yes,
you have to deal with negative backlash and push through.
I also think there's a lot of learning that can
come from me in negativity. Also, I feel like it's
really great to like touch on I think being women,
I definitely have learned in the last six months that
internalized misogyny is alive and well in Australian women, absolutely

(01:02:29):
so so so fascinating to watch the me and my
X husband go through the exact same situation and the vast,
vast differences in his comment section versus my comment section,
and the only difference is he has a penis and
I do not, which is really really frustrating to endure
and see. I think people get very triggered watching someone

(01:02:55):
do hard things and survive because it goes against them,
standing up the narrative they've told themselves of I have
to accept this because if I don't accept the shitty behavior, yes,
if I don't, and that's in everything, that's not just
in a relationship, like I have to accept this lot
in life because there's no other option. And people who
feel really trapped in that when they see someone not

(01:03:17):
accepting that, going against it, doing the hard work and
coming out the other end, that triggers the fuck out
of them because they're like, hang on a minute, no,
because then I can't just tell myself I have to
accept what is happening to me in life. I can't
just be the victim, because you're showing me in real
time that I can choose another option, and there's always
another choice, and I hate that because that doesn't make

(01:03:38):
me feel good about myself and the choices that I'm
making in my own life. Which actually that response makes
me the saddest because I'm like, I share those things
to show you there is another option. So it makes
me really sad when it makes people feel like, oh, like,
I don't like that because it makes me feel bad
about the choice I am choosing. That's never the intention.
It's to show like, hey, like you can be vulnerable,

(01:04:01):
you can be honest to people around you. You can
say I'm not doing well. I failed at this, this sucked.
This was a really hard period, and that's okay. You
can share all of that stuff and keep on keeping on.
I think it's also really cool to show, you know.
A big thing on social media is the struggle Olympics, right,
especially TikTok. It has a real thing of you will
share something hard, and it's the worst platform for someone

(01:04:23):
being like, yeah, but there's also this person doing this
and it's like I've got it harder. Yes, And that
can get really exhausting to deal with as well. And
I think it's a reason why I've never stopped showing
my heart is to really just push, like you don't
have to be like in a homeless shelter with one
cent to your name to be going through a hard time.

(01:04:44):
Anyone can go through hard times at any time. And
also everyone does go through hard times, you know, Like
I think we get put in this mindset of like
no one else is going through hard times, it's just me.
Or A really big thing I found in social media
is people will about the hard times in retrospect and
they'll make like one fifteen second video about it, and

(01:05:05):
every day Joe is looking at that video being like,
oh I went through a time like that. Oh you
sorted that in a fifteen second video. Why am I
still in the Why have I been going through this
for a year? Then, and you did all of that
behind the scenes. I never even saw any of it,
and then you've made this like summary video and now
everything's like fine and andy. So sometimes I'm like, despite
the negativity, I think it's really healthy to show people

(01:05:27):
like hard times can last and hard times can go
on for a while, and it's not something that you
can just wake up and fix. And so sometimes I
feel bad and I'm like, oh God, I don't want
to come online and be like, hey, everything's still a
mess over here. But then other times I'm like this
is so normal, like it's actually just realize yes, like
this is just the reality of it, and like this

(01:05:47):
is normal emotions that people go through. And I think
sometimes by showing up or even letting people see the
stigma that goes against expressing negative parts of your life
almost destigmatizes it. And I really hope that like one person,
Like I always say this, if one person goes through
a hard time and thinks, oh, well, you know, like
I saw that girl on social media do the same thing,

(01:06:09):
and I saw she got through it and I can
get through it, then I'm happy. I just need one
person for it to resonate to, and I'm like that's
enough for me. Like I don't need everyone to love
me all the time. No, I would rather make an
impact on one person and be vulnerable and actually authentic
to me then be like wishy washy and have everyone
love me. And I think that has really been what

(01:06:31):
I've told myself my entire journey online of like just
be you and accept not everyone's gonna like you, and
it's going to trigger people watching you be you, because
not many people do that and that's okay. It doesn't
matter because if you make a difference to a small
group of people, that's enough for you. And I think
that really comes down to on social media, people like
how do you do it? Like, I think it really

(01:06:53):
comes down to your why and understanding, like.

Speaker 1 (01:06:55):
And that's your why. So that makes complete sense, hmm.

Speaker 2 (01:06:58):
But it is rough in saying this. There is days fucked.

Speaker 1 (01:07:02):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:07:02):
There is days where I will call my best comments
so I was like, are these people okay, what's happening?
I will call my best friend in tears and be
like I can't do this, or like call my therapist
in tears and be like, you know, like it is hard,
Like it's not like I'm like happy, positive about it
all the time. But I just try and remember, why
are you doing it? And I always say to people

(01:07:24):
because of the amount of hate I yet I definitely
am not in social media for the money, because no
amount of money could justify that. I'm in it for
the thing of like I love talking to women and
I love helping women, and that's why I show up
every day Because you could pay me a million dollars
and I wouldn't freaking sit and cop some of the
stuff that I cop every day. Yeah, it's not about that,

(01:07:45):
and that's not what fills me up and lights me up.
So that's how I try and deal with it.

Speaker 1 (01:07:49):
I love that you're so self aware and it's so beautiful. No,
it is because I think even you clarifying and being like, well,
this is my why, and a not a lot of
people even have a why. They don't have a purpose,
they don't have that. So for me to hear that,
that's incredible that you've been able to process that and
move through that too.

Speaker 2 (01:08:09):
I feel like identifying your why is so important to
do it, and like money can be your why. That's
so fine off literally, especially as a woman. I want
to make that really clear. You are allowed to have
money be your why. Men have done it for generations
and generations and no one said fuck all about it.
So if you want your why to be I want
to be rich and have money, it slay queen. But
I think like you need to identify what is it

(01:08:33):
and then make decisions from there. Yeah, and then so
once you are so zoned in on that, the rest
is kind of white noise.

Speaker 1 (01:08:40):
Yeah, you just and that's well, that's the main thing.
Is like, well, the money can be the why, so
then don't fucking worry about the comments because it's literally
your money.

Speaker 2 (01:08:47):
Literally, that's what I mean. And it's just identifying what
is the purpose and why you're doing it, and the
second you have that, it's a lot easier.

Speaker 1 (01:08:56):
I love that so much. Bella, thank you so much
for coming on the show. So thank you being me amazing.
We are now going to do a podcast on Bella's podcast,
so go and check that out all linked in the
show notes if it's live. But where can everyone find you?
You know, get on board with everything?

Speaker 2 (01:09:13):
Yeah, so across pretty much every platform. It's Bell's Messina,
so b E double ls and Messina like the ice cream. Yeah,
I would love to have people over. I love yapping
and sharing and I love new perspectives and like, I
really pride myself on being super interactive. So if anyone's
listening to this and anything resonates with you, please dm me.

(01:09:35):
I would love to chat. Yeah, I would love to
yap to you about We could chat for hours.

Speaker 1 (01:09:40):
O good. Yeah, thank you so much, my love, no worries.
Thank you so much for listening to this episode of
the Rise and Conquer podcast. If you enjoyed it and
want more, connect with us via Instagram or continue the
conversation on our beautiful Facebook community page. All the details,
earn the show notes, and I'd love to hear more

(01:10:00):
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