September 5, 2024 • 45 mins
In this episode, Caroline is joined by the widely published photographer and storyteller Marley Morgan. A proud Wiradjuri woman born on Gumbaynggirr Land, Marley’s incredible portrayal of Aboriginal culture, stories, and women has taken her across so-called Australia. Her work has been featured in publications like Vogue and Marie Claire, where she shares awe-inspiring stories and imagery of Aboriginal women, deeply connected to Country and Culture
Caroline and Marley yarn about Marley’s career and her drive to capture authentic, intimate, and unforgettable moments for Aboriginal women, as well as her work supporting Blak owned businesses. They chat about the current state of Aboriginal representation in the media, and how to be authentic storytellers in a modern world. They also dive into topics like giving back to the community, managing the stresses of a work-life balance, and being supported by your mob. Lastly, Marley shares how she overcame her own self-doubts and anxietyabout her art, and was able to stay true to herself and her vision through the pressures of the photography industry.
To learn more about Marley Morgan and her work, follow her on Instagram @marleymorganphotography and visit her website here. If you enjoyed this episode, please leave a review and don’t forget to follow the show!
Follow Caroline on Instagram @blak_wattle_coaching and learn more about working with Caroline here!
We would like to acknowledge Aboriginal people as Australia’s First Peoples’ who have never ceded their sovereignty. We acknowledge the Wurundjeri/Woiwurrung people of the Kulin Nation where the podcast was taped. We pay our deepest respects to Traditional Owners across Australia and Elders past, present and emerging.
This podcast was brought to you by On Track Studio.
For advertising opportunities please email hello@ontrackstudio.com.au
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Black cast, Unite our voices.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
This podcast is brought to you by on Track Studio.
Welcome to Yarning Up, a podcast that showcases stories of
First Nations excellence to help us learn and unlearn Australia's
history to work Tillward's a better future. I'm your host,
(00:32):
proud Barbara woman and founder of Blackwattle Coaching and Consulting,
Caroline cal This podcast was taped on the sacred, stolen
and unseeded Aboriginal lands of the Runjeri people of the
Coln Nation. I pay my deepest respects to them, my elders,
(00:55):
your elders, and all owners of country, of this beautiful
place that.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
We call home.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Well, I'm super excited about today's guest. I've been dying
to get this lovely titter on our podcast for quite
some time because I'm such a fan of Marley Morgan's work,
and so yeah, I'm really excited to have you on
the show today. Marley, Welcome to Yarning Up.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Thank you so much for having me. I'm such a
fan of yourself also, and I've felt really honored when
you asked me to join, So thank you so much
for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Oh, thank you. Marley has been doing some amazing work,
you know, a visual storyteller, a photographer, a mom of
three little jar gems, community warrior and woman, someone who's
fiercely strong in advocating for mobs as well. So it's
the honor and privilege is so reciprocal. But as we
(01:58):
do on this show.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
I'd like to start by formally.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
Handing over to you to introduce yourself and your mob,
and yeah, just tell us a little bit about yourself.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
Sis.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
So my name is Maley Morgan. I'm a photographer and
as you mentioned, a mum of three boys. He's the
same as Maley Morgan Photography. I've also in I guess
the Works is starting a mentoring program for young Indigenous
women called Shadow Sisters that live in regional, rural or remote.
I am Gimlauri and Rodri and I grew up in
(02:32):
a small opal mining town called Lightning Ridge on Ullerroy Country.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
Wow, oh my goodness, three boys, businesses and mentoring programs.
It's so amazing how our mob can just you know,
continually dig deep into giving back to families and communities
and never never ceases to amaze or inspire me what
our people can do, especially our sisters, So yeah, mad respect.
Speaker 3 (02:59):
Thank you. Like I think we as black fellows, it's
just in our nature to give back, we share errors.
We're not greedy people, so I think, like when we
are running businesses and being parents, it just comes natural
to want to when we have the right means to
start giving back to community because it's just who we
are as people and how it would be changed.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
So true, isn't it like that responsibility? You know, when
we get an opportunity to not only be able to
help our families, but really help the next gen and
our younger ones coming up. Well, you know, you have
shot some incredible, incredible photos. You know, the thing that
has really drawn me to your work is, I think
(03:40):
the way that you I'm getting goosebumps, ah ancestors, just
the way that you are able to portray the beauty
of black women, the women the matriarchy, the way that
we see them in their in our softness, in our realness,
in our beauty.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
They're so earthy and ow.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
I mean, you've shot for places like Vogue a couple
of times I see you know Mari Claire to name
a few, But I'm just wondering, you know what inspired
you to pick up the camera and start capturing these
beautiful moments.
Speaker 3 (04:19):
I just look back when I was younger, like there
was no true representation of the women that I was
seeing in my community. Like you've just got to look
at with mainstream Australian media that how black women are portrayed,
were portrayed as being violent or drunk like, and growing up,
I've never seen that. I was always surrounded by beautiful,
staunch black women who really just held our communities together
(04:43):
and they're the women that inspire me and they still do.
They were not like what the media had portrayed them
at all, like I and I feel immensely grateful to
be raised by such incredible Black women like my Auntie's
cousins and the black women in my community. And I
really wanted to do photography portray how I see Black
(05:05):
women as we are. You know, we're connected, we're strong,
but we also carry such strength but also softness. And
for me, it's just how I really see, you know,
mob and through my own lens, and I really like
through my photography, I also wanted to really change that
(05:30):
stereotype of Aboriginal women. We are just incredibly beautiful and
even like if you look back at the stereotypes that
they say were ugly or that old gam and say,
and you know, like, oh, you're too pretty to be Aboriginal,
Like I really wanted to change that because I think
every black woman is absolutely magnificent like chef's kiss.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
Yeah, gosh.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
And you really are helping to change the narrative of
how people perceive us because you're so right, like we
firstly have not been really represented on a main global stage.
And whatever I think of like our black women and
my aunties, my cousins, my friends, my sisters, there is
(06:17):
this beauty and realness that comes with with you know,
being a black woman, being a sovereign, sacred woman, like
our women have been here for longer than modern governments,
longer than you know, we can you know, even conceptualize.
So you really are helping to change the way that Australia,
(06:37):
so called Australia, views us by showing us in all
of our facets and that yeah, we are strong, but
we are soft and beautiful and loving and generous. So yeah,
it's really really special what you're doing, Sis.
Speaker 3 (06:51):
Because like at the end of the day, I you know,
I look back when I was younger, and I see
those stereotypes and even like there was a moment when
I was pregnant with my my second born and i
was in the doctor's waiting room and I've just seen
all these posters of like, you know, pregnant women like
quit smoking, this and that, and I was like, well,
(07:13):
is this really how they view us? Like none of
these posters or pictures I had seen really was showing
anything that reflected how I'd grown up or like the
incredible black women that I knew. So that also was
like another kind of turning point because I do I
(07:33):
love to photograph black motherhood and that was another inspiration.
Really like that pushed me that little bit step further
to really want to change the narrative.
Speaker 1 (07:42):
I must say.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
You know, I've spoken quite openly on the show about
our journey, my partner and i's journey to IBF and
trying to have a family, and your photos, I might
get emotional, Oh my god, ancestors get me because this
is the thing about a picture or a photo of
someone that.
Speaker 1 (08:00):
Is so special.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
It's because you're almost this mirror back to them that
they might not see this beauty within themselves and your
maternity shots are just incredible, Like.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
You're so stunning.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
And you know, we use this terminology about decolonizing things,
but when you think about, you know, what we see
online or on Instagram about like baby showers and maternity shoots,
they're all very white centric, you know, they're not really
how we do it. And you take us back to
our roots and you put us in these the photos.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
You put these women in in this like dreamy.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
Raw, earthy, sacred state, and I imagine that it's so
much more than taking a photo. It's so much more
than capturing a moment.
Speaker 3 (08:50):
Yeah, I'm just in awe of our women, like to
be able to you know, grow another life form and
also like carrying on this beautiful, sacred bloodline that we
as black fellows have and passing on that knowledge that
these women have been told. Like it it's so special.
(09:10):
We had like the world's oldest continuous culture and seeing
you know, more little black babies being born and carrying
on that bloodline, it's it's so special. Like I can't
even put into words how special it is. And I
really love it. Most of the time, you know, it's
when I get to meet these incredible men and women
(09:31):
and families and models. It can become quite intimate because
we get to you know, it's very one on one.
We get to learn more about each other and really
connect and you know, learn about each other's mobs to
like who they are, who their people is, who their
family is. It's it's really special.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
What a gift because it's such a vulnerable, intimate thing
to sometimes even open up on film or on camera.
I know we've done branding shoots before, and you know,
we've used mob and there's something so vulnerable about being exposed.
And so having a sister on the other side of
the lens who understands you and your sacredness and your
(10:14):
beauty and is helping to guide.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
That is just so so special.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
Yeah, I mean, what's your journey being like in becoming
a photographer? Like when did you start this craft? And
did you ever imagine it would take you to places
like Vogue and Marie Claire and you know, all of
those fashion shows, and Yeah, what's the journey been like
for you in becoming a photographer?
Speaker 3 (10:39):
Honestly, I didn't. I'd never thought I'd see the day
that I'd be published in these mainstream magazines because it
wasn't too long ago that people who looked like me
or more were really featured in these magazines alone being
able to photograph them. So for me it's quite special.
But also it makes me question like maybe this should
(11:02):
have been happening a lot long time ago, because like
I know, there's some incredible women out there who are black,
who are amazing photographers who deserve to be seen, you know, globally,
like one Grooper, Bobby Lockier. I mean all with how
talented our women are, and I really hope with me
being featured in these magazines that it does open up
(11:25):
more doors for other black titters and brothers to be
featureds in their incredible work. So I do feel really privilege,
but also in the sense I'm like, well, you know,
they should have been happening a very long time ago.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
You're so right, It does feel like, you know, mainstream
is very much catching up. But it does beg the
question of you know, what shifted you know, for us
to actually be I guess respected for our craft, not
for our aboriginality that we bring so much, like we
contribute so much, just for our skills, not because we're average,
(12:05):
not when we have skills.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
Yeah, exactly right, Like, I know my storytelling skills come
because I am Aboriginal, Like it's something that I carry
in my bloods, and you know, we are the world's
oldest storytellers. But like at times, yeah, I do question
what I am booked and I being booked because of
my aboriginality? Is it a tick in the box or
(12:30):
because you know of my my work and my style.
Also yeah, yeah, but also I know that with stereotypes
and how slowly this is moving that you know, if
I what's the word, Like, if I wasn't aboriginal, I
(12:51):
do believe, you know, without racism, I'd probably get more opportunities,
like from a realistic stand of you, because there is
still in media this very racist stereotype that we aren't
capable or we need to be supported or you know,
we're just not well suited when that isn't the case
(13:12):
at all talented and we are more than capable. I
hope that made sense.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
Oh, it makes it makes so much sense. And I
think you're right, Like you know, Whine, Australia has such
a long way to go for us to not just
be seen as that diversity teak, but actually respected for
the for the skills, the unique skills that we bring,
and you know you are you know you are so
(13:39):
talented in your craft that anyone would be lucky that
feature you, and it would be lovely to reimagine a
world or we're moving slowly, slowly towards a world where
I imagine on set and I don't I believe this
might have happened with the Vogue shoot, but that we
had black photographers, black models, black makeup artists, black, all
(14:00):
black everything, and that we weren't just sort of slotted
in to this white paradigm, but it was all black everything.
And you know, there's a long way for these industries
to go. But I guess I'm pretty.
Speaker 1 (14:12):
Grateful that there are people like you who are.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
Leading the charge. But I also know that what you're
saying would be really tricky to hold on to this
hope and optimism but also be like, well, come on,
your followers, like get with it now. We've really got
to stop and really address racism in these industries as well.
Speaker 3 (14:28):
Absolutely, like it's twenty twenty four, there's no excuse to
not be hiring mob. It's well and really great to
have these one off features, but we need consistent work
for black followers.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
Yes, yes, preach say that, Yeah, say it louder from
the back, because you're so right. This is it's hard
enough to break into these industries. We need long, long
term work, not this seasonal when it suits them on
their terms, work.
Speaker 3 (14:56):
Expically right, like it always seems lately, Like I do
believe there has been some incredible progress. Don't get me wrong.
I'm really proud to see you know, MOB really leading
these campaigns and on the cover of magazines and in
runway and all these incredible industries. But I do believe
it needs to be consistent, just one offset needs to
(15:18):
be an ongoing thing where MOB are really valued for
their time and effort and their work rather than just
for a ticket like a tick in the box.
Speaker 2 (15:30):
It's a really good takeaway message I think for anyone
listening about you know, really go working in really long
term mutual beneficial partnerships with MOB and you know, really
valuing our contributions and you know, doing more to make
sure that there are all black everything, because you know,
when we are around ourself, when we're around our mob
(15:52):
and we can be ourselves, you know, you'll only get
better products and things.
Speaker 1 (15:56):
I think it's really important we raise that. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (15:59):
Yeah, I truly think like when MOB are well supported,
we're together and you know, we know there's going to
be long term outcomes, that's when we really shine.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
So true.
Speaker 3 (16:10):
And I think like too, when we have, like when
we're together and MOB booked for these jobs, it creates
a whole different level of cultural safety too. Well, just
feel a lot more safer and you know, at ease
knowing that there's other black fellows working on these jobs.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
Oh well, thank you for raising that. I think it's
a really important conversation to be having, you know, with
that in mindsets, you know, it's probably very difficult for
you to sort of say, but you know, has there
sort of been any any particular projects or photo shoots
or things that you've been involved with where things have
(16:50):
worked well and you have felt that you've had full
creative license and have been able to produce a product
where it has been done well.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
Yeah. So we did a campaign for my friends Hues
are just sign a Laladia Houston Brigs and we did
that last year and we had a black makeup artist,
two black models, and the styling assistant was black and
designer was black. So it was a full black team
and just being able to really like collaborate with each other,
(17:21):
like listening to everyone's you know, creative input. I think
we were all really able to shine but also feel
comfortable and have a lot of fun. So for me,
that really like is a you know moment that really
stood out to me because everyone's creative views and input
(17:41):
was really valued.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
I love that.
Speaker 2 (17:45):
I could imagine you, like master minds are coming together
and sharing your passions and collaborating and working together. That
sounds beautiful.
Speaker 3 (17:55):
It was a shoot that was made by Mob for mobs,
so I think that itself was extremely special.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
Amazing. Oh that's incredible. I mean what's going on for
you as the photographer behind the lens, like as you're
taking the photos, Like if we were on a shoot
with you, Yeah, what's going through? What are you feeling?
What are you experiencing when you're actually behind the camera.
Speaker 3 (18:23):
So it really depends on the job because I've done
such a range of different jobs, like I recently photographed
the Sorry Day event in Sydney and that was a
really emotional day. When it's you know, events like that
or subjects that are really you know, like heavy for us, MOB,
(18:43):
it can be really hard. But then jobs where it's
been you know, like where it's just been all mob
and that itself has just brought me like so much
joy seeing our people really shine and stuff. So like
it really depends on the job. It's been a mixed
bag of emotions because I'm one of those kind of
people feel everything's being jobs are I've cried, I laughed,
(19:08):
like I very much put myself into the job and
really just feel every moment of the photo shoots.
Speaker 2 (19:16):
Yeah, gosh, hearing you say that, you know, it's it's
obvious it's a really heart led job and that ability
to like to empathize and put yourself in your in
the person you're shootings shoes and feeling that it's so
much more than just a photo, isn't it. It's capturing
these moments.
Speaker 3 (19:37):
Like I've even done jobs where I would never be
able to share just because of cultural protocols for communities
and like even with my own people, and it's just,
you know, you can't describe the feeling of being invited
to something that's ceremonial or cultural, like that feeling is indescribable.
But there are moments that like I will forever cherish
(20:01):
and I would not be allowed say in that space
if I wasn't a black woman or in this kind
of role.
Speaker 2 (20:17):
Will be back you mob right after this short break? Wow,
so I could I could only imagine what it would
(20:40):
be like to capture. I guess there's one thing being
in vogues and fashion shoes, but then there's one thing
in a ceremony with you, with your own people and
that sacred responsibility.
Speaker 3 (20:51):
Wow, incredible, And it was great that you said like
sacred responsibility because it very much did feel like that.
And like as much as like I've got these photos now,
I could never share because they're so special and even
speak about I will always hold these memories really dear.
And as a mum, I've been really fortunate that my
(21:14):
children have been allowed to come along to these events
also or like ceremonies, so that itself like my kids
now will experience.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
Wow, it's so it's just so beautiful.
Speaker 2 (21:25):
I think sometimes like you know, you've sort of quote
unquote made it when you're actually serving the people in
your family in communities that mean the most to you, right,
Like that's so much.
Speaker 3 (21:36):
Absolutely, Although I do feel honored to be featured in
some mainstream magazines. I saw it got very clear, like
what to me is made at moment, is really being
acknowledged and honored by my own community and people. Why
not If I'm doing them proud, then I'm happy.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
That's it. That's it.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
And we've got to pour into our families and communities
as much as we pour into you know, miggeloo or
to other communities, you know, when we're living off our country.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
Too, So that is so so special.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
Well, I mean with that in mind sets, you know,
one of the questions we like to ask our guests
because you know, a lot of our yarns is around
I guess mental health and burnout as well, is you know,
thinking about you know, because this is such a heart
led role that you play in providing these beautiful shots.
You know, do you have like a person or a
(22:31):
practice that you turn to to sort of come back
to yourself after these emotional times? Do you have a
thing that you do that works for you, that brings
you a little bit of joy so you can get
on with the next shot.
Speaker 3 (22:45):
So May that just went was a very very horrible
month work wise, with just experiencing some really like traumatic events.
So for me, I've I just I'm turning off, logging off,
I'm spending less time on my phone. I just need
to be present with myself.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (23:06):
If that means doing nothing, then that's fine. If that
means I'm just laying on the lounge watching my favorite shows,
eating my favorite food, then that's fine. I just need
to be alone with my thoughts so I can I
can process. And I know for some people it's very different.
I think like connecting with your family and friends is
also amazing and being supported. But for me personally, I'm
(23:29):
one of those people that I just really need to
be present with myself and really just process what's happened,
and really think through what's the next steps and off
just taking time out for me to fill my cup
and just enjoy the things that I love. And for me,
that's watching proovies and just vegging out and munching out
(23:52):
on food.
Speaker 1 (23:53):
Oh my god, dear, you're a sister of my own heart.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
There's nothing more that I love than rotting away at
home laying us on my cout.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
So I don't recommend that for anyone else, but I
know for me that works. I'll be once I've had
some times to myself to just rest and be present.
I'll I'm back to good old me.
Speaker 1 (24:14):
Yeah, it's so.
Speaker 2 (24:15):
I mean, this is the beautiful thing of what I
love asking about this question is because you know, there's
no one size fits all.
Speaker 1 (24:21):
We all have a.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
Many things in our tool kid, and sometimes you might
need to be around people, sometimes you might need to
switch off. But I think what's important is just giving
ourselves the permission to understand what works for us, and
that we're all so different.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
And yeah, I feel you.
Speaker 3 (24:38):
I agree, like, do what works for you. I know
that personally this works for me, but for you it
might be going out on country, it might be being
with friends, or it might be going to the gym.
Like it's you know, whatever you feel is going to
bring you back to yourself. I would recommend.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
Yeah, absolutely, I must admit this year myself too, and
particularly after you know last year and how hard it's
been and just life in general, with what we're going through,
with what's happening in here in Australia. You know, I
too have really had to do the same, go very
inwards and just sit and process and be and put
(25:17):
my phone on, do not disturb, and yeah, go inwards,
just so I can get enough clarity with what I'm
feeling so I can process it so then I can
maybe pake a step in whatever direction it might be.
But just give him, my posit, myself permission to pause
and go in and not feel even remotely guilty about it.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
And I either, you know, I think.
Speaker 3 (25:38):
There's such beauty and just slowing down the time to
be with yourself and you know, just letting yourself feel
feel like, you know, stop, what's the word, like trying
to for me, run away from the problems and really
just take time to process what's happening. Why am I
feeling this way? What do I need to do next?
So I'm feeling good about myself in the situation because
(26:01):
I don't think you know, we as people, it's normal
to be running on low. We really need to focus
on filling our own cups and making sure we're looked after.
Speaker 2 (26:12):
And it takes tremendous courage to stop and turn inwards
when things are going a bit difficult in our lives,
like to truly stop. We've got so many distractions that
we can just avoid or oppress or or not deal
with it. But you're having that healthy distraction of like Okay,
this weekend, I'm just going to give myself permission to
just turn off and watch them. You know, whatever works
(26:33):
for you, and yeah, I think it's I think it's important.
Speaker 3 (26:36):
Yeah, whatever brings you joy, just stop and you know,
just we're allowed to, you know, enjoy our little guilty pleasures,
whether that be you know, having a snack, going out
for a coffee, or you know, just having a good nap. Like,
it's whatever works for you, We're allowed to. And I've
been myself that too, Like I'm allowed to slow down.
(26:57):
I'm allowed to you know, have a little break from
work and have some kid free time and just really
be with myself.
Speaker 1 (27:05):
Yeah, well that's it.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
You've got three little jardins too, so you know your
time would be so so precious. Thank you for sharing
that with me, sis, I really appreciate that. I think
it's such an important yu Yan for us to have.
Speaker 3 (27:18):
No Absolutely, like myself, I struggle with mental health issues,
and I think it's important to really have these discussions
and normalize in our communities that it's okay to not
be okay. Yeah, because as we've just had a mob,
you know, we wear so many different hats as it
is and I know sometimes it can be hard to
(27:39):
just really slow down and look after ourselves, but I think,
you know, it is important that we do prioritize our
health and mental health.
Speaker 1 (27:47):
Absolutely, you're so right.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
And I guess just knowing that we're not alone, and
that we've got people around us and people that love
us and value us when we are not right, and
that we don't have to sit in it alone. But
you know, there's beauty in as you say, just hitting
pause and a reset for you. But yeah, if you're
noticing that you're not doing right, then yeah, you're right,
(28:09):
it's okay to not be.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
Okay, we're all you know.
Speaker 2 (28:13):
I think the with what's happening is like with we're
chartering new territory about how to look after ourselves and
each other now too, And so yeah, I think it's
a thanks for that reminder for all of us.
Speaker 1 (28:25):
Really, it's really importantly.
Speaker 3 (28:28):
Like I cannot preach it enough and there is so
much support out there, and you know, there's always more
that are willing to listen to and that's something like
I've had to remind myself like Okay, like I don't
need to be going through this alone. Like there's people
out there that care about me and want to support
me and see me do well. So for anyone that's listening, like,
I think it's important that we remind ourselves like there's
(28:51):
so much you know, love out there and support from
other mob and you're not alone.
Speaker 2 (28:56):
And that they're in know to add I guess to that,
which I think it's really important to underscore that you
know you're not alone and that there is such there's
such strength and vulnerability, you know.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
I know that in the last few months, I've.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
Really had to ask people for help. I've had to say, hey,
I'm not coping, can you take something off my plate?
Or you know, this is what support looks like for me.
Are you in a position to be able to help?
And it it can be really tricky, but when you
come out the other side and you realize that sometimes
you're going to be the supporter. Sometimes you're going to
(29:32):
be the person who's giving support. And that's what the
beauty of being a part of big community is is
that we're all going to be have times where we're
up and down, but.
Speaker 1 (29:40):
We're all here to lift each other up.
Speaker 3 (29:42):
So absolutely I agree, Like I can't even add anything
else onto that because you're so correct.
Speaker 2 (29:48):
Oh, this is why I love these yarns because we
got too when we talk about photo and then next minute,
you know, we're talking about you know, real stuff. And
this is why I love I love this podcast so
much because they're such beautiful, candid yarns.
Speaker 1 (30:02):
Ah, I feel.
Speaker 2 (30:03):
Like an to just take a big breath with that one. Well,
I mean with that, I mean there's no real neat segue.
But you mentioned something before that I'd love to be
a dorion and circle back around, which is around shadow Sisters.
You mentioned a program that you're doing to support mom
(30:23):
in this space. Can you tell us a little bit
more about this idea and what you hope to achieve
in in supporting mobs.
Speaker 3 (30:31):
So as we were talking about earlier with that whole
you know, if you're in a position to give back
like a lot of our people do. I feel like
with my career now and my knowledge, you know, it's
my responsibility that I would start looking at ways to
give back and how I can really help foster that
next generation of black women that want to get into photography.
(30:55):
Because when I was growing up in Lightning Ridge and
also in Dubble was back and forth. I look at
the really limited opportunities for mob that wanted to get
into the art space or anything really that wasn't sports.
Growing up, footy was, you know, what everyone wanted to
get into. Whereas you know, the mob that don't really
(31:17):
want to do sports or want to really pursue a
career or hobby in arts, there was very limited opportunities there.
So I'm hoping when I do start this program, I
can support women to begin a career in photography or
just even a hobby, just like a little outlet to
get creative and you know, something nice for them. And yeah,
(31:41):
I'm still very much in the early stages of really
mapping out what these workshops are going to look like
and what I really need to make sure they are successful.
Speaker 2 (31:53):
So amazing to create opportunities for, like you say, sisters
in areas where there's just sometimes no opportunities, and yeah,
just to be able to provide some of that some
of your skills back, you know. I think we've been
having these yarns internally at Black Wattle about creating some
mob meats where we can come and just share our skills, like, oh,
(32:15):
you do this, I do that. Let's just share it
in like a circular way. It's just exchanging our passion
so you can learn a little bit there. And so yeah,
that's incredible that that's what you're thinking about and thinking about.
Birthing into the world. Is the next step of your
I guess your your personal passion outside of just yeah, photography.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
You know, for all of.
Speaker 2 (32:37):
Us amateur iPhone people who taken photos or selfies or whatever,
is there any like any little tips that you could
give anyone who listening about what is the secret to
a good shot? I'm asking for a friend, nah, given.
Speaker 3 (32:57):
A secret truly, Like I look at some pictures like
people take on their iPhone, they're so creative. I think
it's just about getting creative with your photos and like
the capabilities of our phones, like the cameras on their
own credible. I think it's just really like, you know,
thinking outside the box and new stuff that's creative. But
(33:18):
also you know that's very true to yourself.
Speaker 2 (33:21):
Ah, darl, that's such good advice.
Speaker 3 (33:24):
Even if you just take like a simple you know,
black and white, that's your kind of style of being minimalistic.
Like it's really like self preference and just playing around.
Like I think with you know, with phones these days,
there's so much you can do with them. It's just
you really got to think outside of the box and
you know, let yourself be creative.
Speaker 2 (33:43):
That's such good advice because I think we're living in
a world where everything is very copy paste, where people
are like, you know, just taking someone's idea rebadging it
for themselves on TikTok or online. But yeah, giving yourself
permission to like find the thing that works for you
and just yeah, embrace your authenticity with it and try
(34:04):
to do it in your most creative way.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
What great advice?
Speaker 3 (34:07):
No, Like I love. I love seeing authenticity and creativity,
like even if it's not necessarily like in a photography
standupoint view, like you know, correct what you know, the
olden ways of doing it. I love seeing just creativity,
like people who are thinking outside the box and doing
(34:29):
what you know others aren't. So I think there's no
really wrong way of taking a photo because if you
like it, then neces.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
Really I love that. What good advice be bold, be creative,
have fun with it, and give something else a go
that works for you.
Speaker 1 (34:47):
I love that.
Speaker 3 (34:49):
I think my own photography I look now and you know,
at the start, I was really creating what I thought
other people wanted to see. But now I'm just creating
like what I want to see. What's you know I like?
And I think when you start creating for yourself, that's
when you know the magic will really outshine and people
will really start to notice your work.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
So true because you're working from that place of like love,
when you're actually doing something that brings joy or spark
some joy for you, it's so true.
Speaker 1 (35:19):
Like I think a lot of us.
Speaker 2 (35:20):
When we're moving into our careers just sort of try
to template the White way or think that the white
is right or that success so that's what it looks like.
And yeah, I think doing the things that you like
for you your way, knowing that you're creating a new
path and doing things is yeah, really good advice.
Speaker 1 (35:41):
I love that.
Speaker 3 (35:42):
And I think, like you just to add onto what
you said too about like you know, like with success
and the White way, I think in this generation we
really need to stop thinking that money or the White
way is the right way. Like you can be very
successful without actually being rich. You know, you're rich in
(36:05):
spirit and in community and love, Like that is the
true definition of success and happiness, happy with what you're
making and creating and doing as a career.
Speaker 2 (36:17):
Preach I love that being wealthy in your spirit. Put
that on a T shirt, put that on a mug,
because you're so right, like, we really don't need we
don't need wealth and fame and fortune and being, you know,
to be feeling fulfilled. And in fact, probably for a
lot of our mob who are sort of you know,
(36:37):
I can't speak for everyone, but you know, I've certainly
in my early twenties sort of fell into this trap
of I guess thinking that I had to be something
I wasn't to be successful because you know, the colony
didn't make space for black women, you know, and you
just burn out. You're miserable, you're trying to be something
that you're not. But yeah, having enough, you know, And
(36:59):
I think it's having enough and then having enough time
to give back to the thing you love and enjoy
and your family and your community too. And you know,
if you're running around running yourself into the ground for
you know, white dollars, it's a very it's for me
and my experience, it it's it's maybe a short feeling,
(37:22):
but it's a fleeting moment it's not long term love
of self, you know. It's it's a fleeting feeling of something,
but it will not bring you long lasting joy in
my experience.
Speaker 3 (37:34):
So you're so correct, and I think if you find
something that really brings you joy and you're passionate about it,
then the rest will come. Really like the money, if
that's you know, your long term self goal, but everything
else will come. If you're passionate about something, then you know,
people will catch on and see that this is something
(37:55):
that you really love and that you're good at, and
the rest will come later.
Speaker 1 (37:59):
It's so true.
Speaker 2 (38:01):
Ah, It's like you know that the notion of worthiness
and that feeling and belief in self, it doesn't come
from out there the things we have, all the stuff
we've done. It comes from who we are and what
person we are.
Speaker 3 (38:18):
You know.
Speaker 1 (38:18):
I remember when I when I was in my early twenties.
Speaker 2 (38:21):
I always used to have this narrative like, oh, when
I get this job, I'm going to be happy, or
when I do this, I'm going to be and then
you get to the thing and you never feel fulfilled
because you're just chasing this false sense of what you know.
So it's really just about yeah, turning inwards and going
in and focusing on the spirit, like you say, to
(38:45):
be wealthy in spirit, family and community. It's just so
simple but so so beautiful. So thank you for sharing that.
Speaker 3 (38:52):
Exactly right, Like it is very simple but also very fulfilling.
Speaker 2 (38:57):
Yeah, and it's an unlearning you know, we're all being programmed.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
We're all unlearning.
Speaker 2 (39:02):
And you know, with time and wisdom and lots of
step backs and lots of mistakes and lots of maybe
low periods or feeling you know, really down, you know,
sometimes these things become clearer and we're all on a
journey with this, you know. Yeah, that's beautiful advice. You
read my mind this because that was one of my
questions was around you know, you know, what advice would
(39:23):
you give to mob? But I think that that captures
the essence entirely. Just don't be afraid to do the thing,
be bold, be yourself, and you know, find ways to
love yourself just as much along the way.
Speaker 3 (39:37):
Absolutely, Like I like me personally, I you know, was
when I was starting out really afraid to be myself
and be what others I thought others wanted me to be.
And I found like as I got older and more
mature when I started really just being my authentic self,
you know, and giving you know, unless not just be
(39:58):
vulgar but fox like.
Speaker 1 (40:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (40:01):
I that's when I really started to become more successful
because I was being my authentic self whether people liked
it or not. And surprisingly, like I've just being myself,
I've made some really great friends. And that's when my
business was really able to start growing because I was creating,
you know, work that was authentic to me, and I
(40:22):
was really putting myself out there being vulnerable also, and
it was making me happy. And that's when you know,
I started feeling my own cup and creating what you know,
made me happy. That's when the rest all came later.
Speaker 2 (40:38):
Working from that place of love and authenticity and acceptance
and you because this is a thing, you know, you're
not like it's not your business anyway. And for the
black business owners who are listening, you know, it's not
that like we are our business. We we it's not like, oh,
my business is here and I'm here, Like how we
show up for ourselves is how we show up in
(41:00):
our business. And so you know, it's such a it's
actually business is a very spiritual feeling. I think because
we're pouring into something and abs not separate.
Speaker 3 (41:11):
So and I find that with black businesses too, Like
it's just compared to non indigenous businesses like mob you
can really feel when you're purchasing from them or you know,
looking at their work, it does come from a place
of authenticity and who they are. And yeah, I just
thought i'd add that on with that because it's like
you're so spot on.
Speaker 1 (41:32):
It's I love it. I love it. Oh my god.
Speaker 2 (41:35):
This has given me so much to think about. And
I think for any of the you know, the young
sisters who particularly are listening, you know, that's a I
think it's a really beautiful conversation to be having about
leaning into all parts of ourselves and you will attract
the people that want to stick around and sadly some
people you might have to surrender and let go to
as well. It's when you start leaning into yourself. You know,
(41:58):
people know feel that and you attrack that, oh this
is let them leave.
Speaker 3 (42:05):
Yes, they if they don't want to see you shine,
then you know they're definitely not worth it. They're not
worth bringing into the next chapter of your life.
Speaker 1 (42:14):
Amen. I mean.
Speaker 2 (42:17):
I've been Yeah, I feel that on so many levels.
It's such a grief and loss at first to let
people go, but over time you're like, bye, see you
love to see you leave.
Speaker 3 (42:31):
The place of self love to I find when you
start really you know, within and loving yourself, then you're
more than happy to let go of that loose toxic
people and really allow the people who want to see
you shine come in.
Speaker 1 (42:46):
That's so true.
Speaker 2 (42:48):
Oh, my Cis you are so wise And this is
the thing.
Speaker 3 (42:51):
You know.
Speaker 2 (42:51):
We started off talking about photos, but then when we
really started to unpack, it's like it is such a
heart led process, so of course we're going to be
talking about vulnerable things like what a no brain? Oh well,
my sister, where can people connect with you? And have
you got anything that you want to share in the
pipeline or yeah, anything else that you want to share
(43:13):
about you in your work and a big shout out
to where we can all follow along with your beautiful
magic and gifts for the world.
Speaker 3 (43:22):
Well, you can find my work on Instagram. That's where
I spend most of my time. It's Marley Morgan Photography
and I'm also on Facebook and my website is www
dot Marleymorgan dot com dot AU. But also like to
those listening, I encourage them to really connect with other
black photographers also because like I'm very inspired by the
(43:44):
other mob who are doing it. I'm a part of
a little community called Black Lens. It's just where we
really support each other, we share resources, and you know,
really want to see each other do well. And I
think it's really worth checking out. And if you ever
need a photographer, I encourage them to reach out to
Black Lens or to source out who is in your community,
(44:08):
because honestly, like there is some mob that's really being
you know, not being booked, and their talents so really
being overlooked, and I couldn't encourage that anymore.
Speaker 2 (44:20):
Such a great piece of advice. We'll be popping all
of Marley's and Black Lenses details in our show notes,
but it really is such a beautiful reminder that this
is what you get when you hire your black followers,
not just someone who's going to rock up and take
some photos, but people who are really digging deep into themselves,
providing pouring into their communities and are really showing up
(44:42):
in unique, vulnerable and fearless ways.
Speaker 1 (44:45):
So please, new followers, get out there and.
Speaker 2 (44:48):
Book your black artists, because you aren't going to get
this love and care from anyone. So yeah, thank you,
thank you so much for coming on the show today,
my system, and also just giving me a place in space.
Speaker 1 (45:01):
To air out some of how I've been feeling.
Speaker 2 (45:03):
It's such a reciprocal, beautiful thing, Miss job about having yarn,
So you've given me a lot to think about too, Sis,
So thanks.
Speaker 3 (45:12):
I think that's the beauty of when MOB connect, isn't
it Like we're really able to just yearn and just
like release so let go.
Speaker 2 (45:22):
Absolutely, Yeah, it's so true. You've definitely given me some
things I need to go away and think about. So
thank you all, love my sis, thank you so much
for listening you Mob. If you're vibing this season of
Yarning up, then please head over to Apple, Spotify, or
wherever you get your podcasts from to show us some love,
(45:43):
rate and review. Alternatively, you can get in contact and
give us some feedback by visiting www. Dot carolinecow dot
com dot au
Black cast, Unite our voices.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
This podcast is brought to you by on Track Studio.
Welcome to Yarning Up, a podcast that showcases stories of
First Nations excellence to help us learn and unlearn Australia's
history to work Tillward's a better future. I'm your host,
(00:32):
proud Barbara woman and founder of Blackwattle Coaching and Consulting,
Caroline cal This podcast was taped on the sacred, stolen
and unseeded Aboriginal lands of the Runjeri people of the
Coln Nation. I pay my deepest respects to them, my elders,
(00:55):
your elders, and all owners of country, of this beautiful
place that.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
We call home.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Well, I'm super excited about today's guest. I've been dying
to get this lovely titter on our podcast for quite
some time because I'm such a fan of Marley Morgan's work,
and so yeah, I'm really excited to have you on
the show today. Marley, Welcome to Yarning Up.
Speaker 3 (01:25):
Thank you so much for having me. I'm such a
fan of yourself also, and I've felt really honored when
you asked me to join, So thank you so much
for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Oh, thank you. Marley has been doing some amazing work,
you know, a visual storyteller, a photographer, a mom of
three little jar gems, community warrior and woman, someone who's
fiercely strong in advocating for mobs as well. So it's
the honor and privilege is so reciprocal. But as we
(01:58):
do on this show.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
I'd like to start by formally.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
Handing over to you to introduce yourself and your mob,
and yeah, just tell us a little bit about yourself.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
Sis.
Speaker 3 (02:09):
So my name is Maley Morgan. I'm a photographer and
as you mentioned, a mum of three boys. He's the
same as Maley Morgan Photography. I've also in I guess
the Works is starting a mentoring program for young Indigenous
women called Shadow Sisters that live in regional, rural or remote.
I am Gimlauri and Rodri and I grew up in
(02:32):
a small opal mining town called Lightning Ridge on Ullerroy Country.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
Wow, oh my goodness, three boys, businesses and mentoring programs.
It's so amazing how our mob can just you know,
continually dig deep into giving back to families and communities
and never never ceases to amaze or inspire me what
our people can do, especially our sisters, So yeah, mad respect.
Speaker 3 (02:59):
Thank you. Like I think we as black fellows, it's
just in our nature to give back, we share errors.
We're not greedy people, so I think, like when we
are running businesses and being parents, it just comes natural
to want to when we have the right means to
start giving back to community because it's just who we
are as people and how it would be changed.
Speaker 2 (03:19):
So true, isn't it like that responsibility? You know, when
we get an opportunity to not only be able to
help our families, but really help the next gen and
our younger ones coming up. Well, you know, you have
shot some incredible, incredible photos. You know, the thing that
has really drawn me to your work is, I think
(03:40):
the way that you I'm getting goosebumps, ah ancestors, just
the way that you are able to portray the beauty
of black women, the women the matriarchy, the way that
we see them in their in our softness, in our realness,
in our beauty.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
They're so earthy and ow.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
I mean, you've shot for places like Vogue a couple
of times I see you know Mari Claire to name
a few, But I'm just wondering, you know what inspired
you to pick up the camera and start capturing these
beautiful moments.
Speaker 3 (04:19):
I just look back when I was younger, like there
was no true representation of the women that I was
seeing in my community. Like you've just got to look
at with mainstream Australian media that how black women are portrayed,
were portrayed as being violent or drunk like, and growing up,
I've never seen that. I was always surrounded by beautiful,
staunch black women who really just held our communities together
(04:43):
and they're the women that inspire me and they still do.
They were not like what the media had portrayed them
at all, like I and I feel immensely grateful to
be raised by such incredible Black women like my Auntie's
cousins and the black women in my community. And I
really wanted to do photography portray how I see Black
(05:05):
women as we are. You know, we're connected, we're strong,
but we also carry such strength but also softness. And
for me, it's just how I really see, you know,
mob and through my own lens, and I really like
through my photography, I also wanted to really change that
(05:30):
stereotype of Aboriginal women. We are just incredibly beautiful and
even like if you look back at the stereotypes that
they say were ugly or that old gam and say,
and you know, like, oh, you're too pretty to be Aboriginal,
Like I really wanted to change that because I think
every black woman is absolutely magnificent like chef's kiss.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
Yeah, gosh.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
And you really are helping to change the narrative of
how people perceive us because you're so right, like we
firstly have not been really represented on a main global stage.
And whatever I think of like our black women and
my aunties, my cousins, my friends, my sisters, there is
(06:17):
this beauty and realness that comes with with you know,
being a black woman, being a sovereign, sacred woman, like
our women have been here for longer than modern governments,
longer than you know, we can you know, even conceptualize.
So you really are helping to change the way that Australia,
(06:37):
so called Australia, views us by showing us in all
of our facets and that yeah, we are strong, but
we are soft and beautiful and loving and generous. So yeah,
it's really really special what you're doing, Sis.
Speaker 3 (06:51):
Because like at the end of the day, I you know,
I look back when I was younger, and I see
those stereotypes and even like there was a moment when
I was pregnant with my my second born and i
was in the doctor's waiting room and I've just seen
all these posters of like, you know, pregnant women like
quit smoking, this and that, and I was like, well,
(07:13):
is this really how they view us? Like none of
these posters or pictures I had seen really was showing
anything that reflected how I'd grown up or like the
incredible black women that I knew. So that also was
like another kind of turning point because I do I
(07:33):
love to photograph black motherhood and that was another inspiration.
Really like that pushed me that little bit step further
to really want to change the narrative.
Speaker 1 (07:42):
I must say.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
You know, I've spoken quite openly on the show about
our journey, my partner and i's journey to IBF and
trying to have a family, and your photos, I might
get emotional, Oh my god, ancestors get me because this
is the thing about a picture or a photo of
someone that.
Speaker 1 (08:00):
Is so special.
Speaker 2 (08:01):
It's because you're almost this mirror back to them that
they might not see this beauty within themselves and your
maternity shots are just incredible, Like.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
You're so stunning.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
And you know, we use this terminology about decolonizing things,
but when you think about, you know, what we see
online or on Instagram about like baby showers and maternity shoots,
they're all very white centric, you know, they're not really
how we do it. And you take us back to
our roots and you put us in these the photos.
Speaker 1 (08:37):
You put these women in in this like dreamy.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
Raw, earthy, sacred state, and I imagine that it's so
much more than taking a photo. It's so much more
than capturing a moment.
Speaker 3 (08:50):
Yeah, I'm just in awe of our women, like to
be able to you know, grow another life form and
also like carrying on this beautiful, sacred bloodline that we
as black fellows have and passing on that knowledge that
these women have been told. Like it it's so special.
(09:10):
We had like the world's oldest continuous culture and seeing
you know, more little black babies being born and carrying
on that bloodline, it's it's so special. Like I can't
even put into words how special it is. And I
really love it. Most of the time, you know, it's
when I get to meet these incredible men and women
(09:31):
and families and models. It can become quite intimate because
we get to you know, it's very one on one.
We get to learn more about each other and really
connect and you know, learn about each other's mobs to
like who they are, who their people is, who their
family is. It's it's really special.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
What a gift because it's such a vulnerable, intimate thing
to sometimes even open up on film or on camera.
I know we've done branding shoots before, and you know,
we've used mob and there's something so vulnerable about being exposed.
And so having a sister on the other side of
the lens who understands you and your sacredness and your
(10:14):
beauty and is helping to guide.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
That is just so so special.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
Yeah, I mean, what's your journey being like in becoming
a photographer? Like when did you start this craft? And
did you ever imagine it would take you to places
like Vogue and Marie Claire and you know, all of
those fashion shows, and Yeah, what's the journey been like
for you in becoming a photographer?
Speaker 3 (10:39):
Honestly, I didn't. I'd never thought I'd see the day
that I'd be published in these mainstream magazines because it
wasn't too long ago that people who looked like me
or more were really featured in these magazines alone being
able to photograph them. So for me it's quite special.
But also it makes me question like maybe this should
(11:02):
have been happening a lot long time ago, because like
I know, there's some incredible women out there who are black,
who are amazing photographers who deserve to be seen, you know, globally,
like one Grooper, Bobby Lockier. I mean all with how
talented our women are, and I really hope with me
being featured in these magazines that it does open up
(11:25):
more doors for other black titters and brothers to be
featureds in their incredible work. So I do feel really privilege,
but also in the sense I'm like, well, you know,
they should have been happening a very long time ago.
Speaker 2 (11:42):
You're so right, It does feel like, you know, mainstream
is very much catching up. But it does beg the
question of you know, what shifted you know, for us
to actually be I guess respected for our craft, not
for our aboriginality that we bring so much, like we
contribute so much, just for our skills, not because we're average,
(12:05):
not when we have skills.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
Yeah, exactly right, Like, I know my storytelling skills come
because I am Aboriginal, Like it's something that I carry
in my bloods, and you know, we are the world's
oldest storytellers. But like at times, yeah, I do question
what I am booked and I being booked because of
my aboriginality? Is it a tick in the box or
(12:30):
because you know of my my work and my style.
Also yeah, yeah, but also I know that with stereotypes
and how slowly this is moving that you know, if
I what's the word, Like, if I wasn't aboriginal, I
(12:51):
do believe, you know, without racism, I'd probably get more opportunities,
like from a realistic stand of you, because there is
still in media this very racist stereotype that we aren't
capable or we need to be supported or you know,
we're just not well suited when that isn't the case
(13:12):
at all talented and we are more than capable. I
hope that made sense.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
Oh, it makes it makes so much sense. And I
think you're right, Like you know, Whine, Australia has such
a long way to go for us to not just
be seen as that diversity teak, but actually respected for
the for the skills, the unique skills that we bring,
and you know you are you know you are so
(13:39):
talented in your craft that anyone would be lucky that
feature you, and it would be lovely to reimagine a
world or we're moving slowly, slowly towards a world where
I imagine on set and I don't I believe this
might have happened with the Vogue shoot, but that we
had black photographers, black models, black makeup artists, black, all
(14:00):
black everything, and that we weren't just sort of slotted
in to this white paradigm, but it was all black everything.
And you know, there's a long way for these industries
to go. But I guess I'm pretty.
Speaker 1 (14:12):
Grateful that there are people like you who are.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
Leading the charge. But I also know that what you're
saying would be really tricky to hold on to this
hope and optimism but also be like, well, come on,
your followers, like get with it now. We've really got
to stop and really address racism in these industries as well.
Speaker 3 (14:28):
Absolutely, like it's twenty twenty four, there's no excuse to
not be hiring mob. It's well and really great to
have these one off features, but we need consistent work
for black followers.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
Yes, yes, preach say that, Yeah, say it louder from
the back, because you're so right. This is it's hard
enough to break into these industries. We need long, long
term work, not this seasonal when it suits them on
their terms, work.
Speaker 3 (14:56):
Expically right, like it always seems lately, Like I do
believe there has been some incredible progress. Don't get me wrong.
I'm really proud to see you know, MOB really leading
these campaigns and on the cover of magazines and in
runway and all these incredible industries. But I do believe
it needs to be consistent, just one offset needs to
(15:18):
be an ongoing thing where MOB are really valued for
their time and effort and their work rather than just
for a ticket like a tick in the box.
Speaker 2 (15:30):
It's a really good takeaway message I think for anyone
listening about you know, really go working in really long
term mutual beneficial partnerships with MOB and you know, really
valuing our contributions and you know, doing more to make
sure that there are all black everything, because you know,
when we are around ourself, when we're around our mob
(15:52):
and we can be ourselves, you know, you'll only get
better products and things.
Speaker 1 (15:56):
I think it's really important we raise that. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (15:59):
Yeah, I truly think like when MOB are well supported,
we're together and you know, we know there's going to
be long term outcomes, that's when we really shine.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
So true.
Speaker 3 (16:10):
And I think like too, when we have, like when
we're together and MOB booked for these jobs, it creates
a whole different level of cultural safety too. Well, just
feel a lot more safer and you know, at ease
knowing that there's other black fellows working on these jobs.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
Oh well, thank you for raising that. I think it's
a really important conversation to be having, you know, with
that in mindsets, you know, it's probably very difficult for
you to sort of say, but you know, has there
sort of been any any particular projects or photo shoots
or things that you've been involved with where things have
(16:50):
worked well and you have felt that you've had full
creative license and have been able to produce a product
where it has been done well.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
Yeah. So we did a campaign for my friends Hues
are just sign a Laladia Houston Brigs and we did
that last year and we had a black makeup artist,
two black models, and the styling assistant was black and
designer was black. So it was a full black team
and just being able to really like collaborate with each other,
(17:21):
like listening to everyone's you know, creative input. I think
we were all really able to shine but also feel
comfortable and have a lot of fun. So for me,
that really like is a you know moment that really
stood out to me because everyone's creative views and input
(17:41):
was really valued.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
I love that.
Speaker 2 (17:45):
I could imagine you, like master minds are coming together
and sharing your passions and collaborating and working together. That
sounds beautiful.
Speaker 3 (17:55):
It was a shoot that was made by Mob for mobs,
so I think that itself was extremely special.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
Amazing. Oh that's incredible. I mean what's going on for
you as the photographer behind the lens, like as you're
taking the photos, Like if we were on a shoot
with you, Yeah, what's going through? What are you feeling?
What are you experiencing when you're actually behind the camera.
Speaker 3 (18:23):
So it really depends on the job because I've done
such a range of different jobs, like I recently photographed
the Sorry Day event in Sydney and that was a
really emotional day. When it's you know, events like that
or subjects that are really you know, like heavy for us, MOB,
(18:43):
it can be really hard. But then jobs where it's
been you know, like where it's just been all mob
and that itself has just brought me like so much
joy seeing our people really shine and stuff. So like
it really depends on the job. It's been a mixed
bag of emotions because I'm one of those kind of
people feel everything's being jobs are I've cried, I laughed,
(19:08):
like I very much put myself into the job and
really just feel every moment of the photo shoots.
Speaker 2 (19:16):
Yeah, gosh, hearing you say that, you know, it's it's
obvious it's a really heart led job and that ability
to like to empathize and put yourself in your in
the person you're shootings shoes and feeling that it's so
much more than just a photo, isn't it. It's capturing
these moments.
Speaker 3 (19:37):
Like I've even done jobs where I would never be
able to share just because of cultural protocols for communities
and like even with my own people, and it's just,
you know, you can't describe the feeling of being invited
to something that's ceremonial or cultural, like that feeling is indescribable.
But there are moments that like I will forever cherish
(20:01):
and I would not be allowed say in that space
if I wasn't a black woman or in this kind
of role.
Speaker 2 (20:17):
Will be back you mob right after this short break? Wow,
so I could I could only imagine what it would
(20:40):
be like to capture. I guess there's one thing being
in vogues and fashion shoes, but then there's one thing
in a ceremony with you, with your own people and
that sacred responsibility.
Speaker 3 (20:51):
Wow, incredible, And it was great that you said like
sacred responsibility because it very much did feel like that.
And like as much as like I've got these photos now,
I could never share because they're so special and even
speak about I will always hold these memories really dear.
And as a mum, I've been really fortunate that my
(21:14):
children have been allowed to come along to these events
also or like ceremonies, so that itself like my kids
now will experience.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
Wow, it's so it's just so beautiful.
Speaker 2 (21:25):
I think sometimes like you know, you've sort of quote
unquote made it when you're actually serving the people in
your family in communities that mean the most to you, right,
Like that's so much.
Speaker 3 (21:36):
Absolutely, Although I do feel honored to be featured in
some mainstream magazines. I saw it got very clear, like
what to me is made at moment, is really being
acknowledged and honored by my own community and people. Why
not If I'm doing them proud, then I'm happy.
Speaker 1 (21:56):
That's it. That's it.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
And we've got to pour into our families and communities
as much as we pour into you know, miggeloo or
to other communities, you know, when we're living off our country.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
Too, So that is so so special.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
Well, I mean with that in mind sets, you know,
one of the questions we like to ask our guests
because you know, a lot of our yarns is around
I guess mental health and burnout as well, is you know,
thinking about you know, because this is such a heart
led role that you play in providing these beautiful shots.
You know, do you have like a person or a
(22:31):
practice that you turn to to sort of come back
to yourself after these emotional times? Do you have a
thing that you do that works for you, that brings
you a little bit of joy so you can get
on with the next shot.
Speaker 3 (22:45):
So May that just went was a very very horrible
month work wise, with just experiencing some really like traumatic events.
So for me, I've I just I'm turning off, logging off,
I'm spending less time on my phone. I just need
to be present with myself.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (23:06):
If that means doing nothing, then that's fine. If that
means I'm just laying on the lounge watching my favorite shows,
eating my favorite food, then that's fine. I just need
to be alone with my thoughts so I can I
can process. And I know for some people it's very different.
I think like connecting with your family and friends is
also amazing and being supported. But for me personally, I'm
(23:29):
one of those people that I just really need to
be present with myself and really just process what's happened,
and really think through what's the next steps and off
just taking time out for me to fill my cup
and just enjoy the things that I love. And for me,
that's watching proovies and just vegging out and munching out
(23:52):
on food.
Speaker 1 (23:53):
Oh my god, dear, you're a sister of my own heart.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
There's nothing more that I love than rotting away at
home laying us on my cout.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
So I don't recommend that for anyone else, but I
know for me that works. I'll be once I've had
some times to myself to just rest and be present.
I'll I'm back to good old me.
Speaker 1 (24:14):
Yeah, it's so.
Speaker 2 (24:15):
I mean, this is the beautiful thing of what I
love asking about this question is because you know, there's
no one size fits all.
Speaker 1 (24:21):
We all have a.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
Many things in our tool kid, and sometimes you might
need to be around people, sometimes you might need to
switch off. But I think what's important is just giving
ourselves the permission to understand what works for us, and
that we're all so different.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
And yeah, I feel you.
Speaker 3 (24:38):
I agree, like, do what works for you. I know
that personally this works for me, but for you it
might be going out on country, it might be being
with friends, or it might be going to the gym.
Like it's you know, whatever you feel is going to
bring you back to yourself. I would recommend.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
Yeah, absolutely, I must admit this year myself too, and
particularly after you know last year and how hard it's
been and just life in general, with what we're going through,
with what's happening in here in Australia. You know, I
too have really had to do the same, go very
inwards and just sit and process and be and put
(25:17):
my phone on, do not disturb, and yeah, go inwards,
just so I can get enough clarity with what I'm
feeling so I can process it so then I can
maybe pake a step in whatever direction it might be.
But just give him, my posit, myself permission to pause
and go in and not feel even remotely guilty about it.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
And I either, you know, I think.
Speaker 3 (25:38):
There's such beauty and just slowing down the time to
be with yourself and you know, just letting yourself feel
feel like, you know, stop, what's the word, like trying
to for me, run away from the problems and really
just take time to process what's happening. Why am I
feeling this way? What do I need to do next?
So I'm feeling good about myself in the situation because
(26:01):
I don't think you know, we as people, it's normal
to be running on low. We really need to focus
on filling our own cups and making sure we're looked after.
Speaker 2 (26:12):
And it takes tremendous courage to stop and turn inwards
when things are going a bit difficult in our lives,
like to truly stop. We've got so many distractions that
we can just avoid or oppress or or not deal
with it. But you're having that healthy distraction of like Okay,
this weekend, I'm just going to give myself permission to
just turn off and watch them. You know, whatever works
(26:33):
for you, and yeah, I think it's I think it's important.
Speaker 3 (26:36):
Yeah, whatever brings you joy, just stop and you know,
just we're allowed to, you know, enjoy our little guilty pleasures,
whether that be you know, having a snack, going out
for a coffee, or you know, just having a good nap. Like,
it's whatever works for you, We're allowed to. And I've
been myself that too, Like I'm allowed to slow down.
(26:57):
I'm allowed to you know, have a little break from
work and have some kid free time and just really
be with myself.
Speaker 1 (27:05):
Yeah, well that's it.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
You've got three little jardins too, so you know your
time would be so so precious. Thank you for sharing
that with me, sis, I really appreciate that. I think
it's such an important yu Yan for us to have.
Speaker 3 (27:18):
No Absolutely, like myself, I struggle with mental health issues,
and I think it's important to really have these discussions
and normalize in our communities that it's okay to not
be okay. Yeah, because as we've just had a mob,
you know, we wear so many different hats as it
is and I know sometimes it can be hard to
(27:39):
just really slow down and look after ourselves, but I think,
you know, it is important that we do prioritize our
health and mental health.
Speaker 1 (27:47):
Absolutely, you're so right.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
And I guess just knowing that we're not alone, and
that we've got people around us and people that love
us and value us when we are not right, and
that we don't have to sit in it alone. But
you know, there's beauty in as you say, just hitting
pause and a reset for you. But yeah, if you're
noticing that you're not doing right, then yeah, you're right,
(28:09):
it's okay to not be.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
Okay, we're all you know.
Speaker 2 (28:13):
I think the with what's happening is like with we're
chartering new territory about how to look after ourselves and
each other now too, And so yeah, I think it's
a thanks for that reminder for all of us.
Speaker 1 (28:25):
Really, it's really importantly.
Speaker 3 (28:28):
Like I cannot preach it enough and there is so
much support out there, and you know, there's always more
that are willing to listen to and that's something like
I've had to remind myself like Okay, like I don't
need to be going through this alone. Like there's people
out there that care about me and want to support
me and see me do well. So for anyone that's listening, like,
I think it's important that we remind ourselves like there's
(28:51):
so much you know, love out there and support from
other mob and you're not alone.
Speaker 2 (28:56):
And that they're in know to add I guess to that,
which I think it's really important to underscore that you
know you're not alone and that there is such there's
such strength and vulnerability, you know.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
I know that in the last few months, I've.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
Really had to ask people for help. I've had to say, hey,
I'm not coping, can you take something off my plate?
Or you know, this is what support looks like for me.
Are you in a position to be able to help?
And it it can be really tricky, but when you
come out the other side and you realize that sometimes
you're going to be the supporter. Sometimes you're going to
(29:32):
be the person who's giving support. And that's what the
beauty of being a part of big community is is
that we're all going to be have times where we're
up and down, but.
Speaker 1 (29:40):
We're all here to lift each other up.
Speaker 3 (29:42):
So absolutely I agree, Like I can't even add anything
else onto that because you're so correct.
Speaker 2 (29:48):
Oh, this is why I love these yarns because we
got too when we talk about photo and then next minute,
you know, we're talking about you know, real stuff. And
this is why I love I love this podcast so
much because they're such beautiful, candid yarns.
Speaker 1 (30:02):
Ah, I feel.
Speaker 2 (30:03):
Like an to just take a big breath with that one. Well,
I mean with that, I mean there's no real neat segue.
But you mentioned something before that I'd love to be
a dorion and circle back around, which is around shadow Sisters.
You mentioned a program that you're doing to support mom
(30:23):
in this space. Can you tell us a little bit
more about this idea and what you hope to achieve
in in supporting mobs.
Speaker 3 (30:31):
So as we were talking about earlier with that whole
you know, if you're in a position to give back
like a lot of our people do. I feel like
with my career now and my knowledge, you know, it's
my responsibility that I would start looking at ways to
give back and how I can really help foster that
next generation of black women that want to get into photography.
(30:55):
Because when I was growing up in Lightning Ridge and
also in Dubble was back and forth. I look at
the really limited opportunities for mob that wanted to get
into the art space or anything really that wasn't sports.
Growing up, footy was, you know, what everyone wanted to
get into. Whereas you know, the mob that don't really
(31:17):
want to do sports or want to really pursue a
career or hobby in arts, there was very limited opportunities there.
So I'm hoping when I do start this program, I
can support women to begin a career in photography or
just even a hobby, just like a little outlet to
get creative and you know, something nice for them. And yeah,
(31:41):
I'm still very much in the early stages of really
mapping out what these workshops are going to look like
and what I really need to make sure they are successful.
Speaker 2 (31:53):
So amazing to create opportunities for, like you say, sisters
in areas where there's just sometimes no opportunities, and yeah,
just to be able to provide some of that some
of your skills back, you know. I think we've been
having these yarns internally at Black Wattle about creating some
mob meats where we can come and just share our skills, like, oh,
(32:15):
you do this, I do that. Let's just share it
in like a circular way. It's just exchanging our passion
so you can learn a little bit there. And so yeah,
that's incredible that that's what you're thinking about and thinking about.
Birthing into the world. Is the next step of your
I guess your your personal passion outside of just yeah, photography.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
You know, for all of.
Speaker 2 (32:37):
Us amateur iPhone people who taken photos or selfies or whatever,
is there any like any little tips that you could
give anyone who listening about what is the secret to
a good shot? I'm asking for a friend, nah, given.
Speaker 3 (32:57):
A secret truly, Like I look at some pictures like
people take on their iPhone, they're so creative. I think
it's just about getting creative with your photos and like
the capabilities of our phones, like the cameras on their
own credible. I think it's just really like, you know,
thinking outside the box and new stuff that's creative. But
(33:18):
also you know that's very true to yourself.
Speaker 2 (33:21):
Ah, darl, that's such good advice.
Speaker 3 (33:24):
Even if you just take like a simple you know,
black and white, that's your kind of style of being minimalistic.
Like it's really like self preference and just playing around.
Like I think with you know, with phones these days,
there's so much you can do with them. It's just
you really got to think outside of the box and
you know, let yourself be creative.
Speaker 2 (33:43):
That's such good advice because I think we're living in
a world where everything is very copy paste, where people
are like, you know, just taking someone's idea rebadging it
for themselves on TikTok or online. But yeah, giving yourself
permission to like find the thing that works for you
and just yeah, embrace your authenticity with it and try
(34:04):
to do it in your most creative way.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
What great advice?
Speaker 3 (34:07):
No, Like I love. I love seeing authenticity and creativity,
like even if it's not necessarily like in a photography
standupoint view, like you know, correct what you know, the
olden ways of doing it. I love seeing just creativity,
like people who are thinking outside the box and doing
(34:29):
what you know others aren't. So I think there's no
really wrong way of taking a photo because if you
like it, then neces.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
Really I love that. What good advice be bold, be creative,
have fun with it, and give something else a go
that works for you.
Speaker 1 (34:47):
I love that.
Speaker 3 (34:49):
I think my own photography I look now and you know,
at the start, I was really creating what I thought
other people wanted to see. But now I'm just creating
like what I want to see. What's you know I like?
And I think when you start creating for yourself, that's
when you know the magic will really outshine and people
will really start to notice your work.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
So true because you're working from that place of like love,
when you're actually doing something that brings joy or spark
some joy for you, it's so true.
Speaker 1 (35:19):
Like I think a lot of us.
Speaker 2 (35:20):
When we're moving into our careers just sort of try
to template the White way or think that the white
is right or that success so that's what it looks like.
And yeah, I think doing the things that you like
for you your way, knowing that you're creating a new
path and doing things is yeah, really good advice.
Speaker 1 (35:41):
I love that.
Speaker 3 (35:42):
And I think, like you just to add onto what
you said too about like you know, like with success
and the White way, I think in this generation we
really need to stop thinking that money or the White
way is the right way. Like you can be very
successful without actually being rich. You know, you're rich in
(36:05):
spirit and in community and love, Like that is the
true definition of success and happiness, happy with what you're
making and creating and doing as a career.
Speaker 2 (36:17):
Preach I love that being wealthy in your spirit. Put
that on a T shirt, put that on a mug,
because you're so right, like, we really don't need we
don't need wealth and fame and fortune and being, you know,
to be feeling fulfilled. And in fact, probably for a
lot of our mob who are sort of you know,
(36:37):
I can't speak for everyone, but you know, I've certainly
in my early twenties sort of fell into this trap
of I guess thinking that I had to be something
I wasn't to be successful because you know, the colony
didn't make space for black women, you know, and you
just burn out. You're miserable, you're trying to be something
that you're not. But yeah, having enough, you know, And
(36:59):
I think it's having enough and then having enough time
to give back to the thing you love and enjoy
and your family and your community too. And you know,
if you're running around running yourself into the ground for
you know, white dollars, it's a very it's for me
and my experience, it it's it's maybe a short feeling,
(37:22):
but it's a fleeting moment it's not long term love
of self, you know. It's it's a fleeting feeling of something,
but it will not bring you long lasting joy in
my experience.
Speaker 3 (37:34):
So you're so correct, and I think if you find
something that really brings you joy and you're passionate about it,
then the rest will come. Really like the money, if
that's you know, your long term self goal, but everything
else will come. If you're passionate about something, then you know,
people will catch on and see that this is something
(37:55):
that you really love and that you're good at, and
the rest will come later.
Speaker 1 (37:59):
It's so true.
Speaker 2 (38:01):
Ah, It's like you know that the notion of worthiness
and that feeling and belief in self, it doesn't come
from out there the things we have, all the stuff
we've done. It comes from who we are and what
person we are.
Speaker 3 (38:18):
You know.
Speaker 1 (38:18):
I remember when I when I was in my early twenties.
Speaker 2 (38:21):
I always used to have this narrative like, oh, when
I get this job, I'm going to be happy, or
when I do this, I'm going to be and then
you get to the thing and you never feel fulfilled
because you're just chasing this false sense of what you know.
So it's really just about yeah, turning inwards and going
in and focusing on the spirit, like you say, to
(38:45):
be wealthy in spirit, family and community. It's just so
simple but so so beautiful. So thank you for sharing that.
Speaker 3 (38:52):
Exactly right, Like it is very simple but also very fulfilling.
Speaker 2 (38:57):
Yeah, and it's an unlearning you know, we're all being programmed.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
We're all unlearning.
Speaker 2 (39:02):
And you know, with time and wisdom and lots of
step backs and lots of mistakes and lots of maybe
low periods or feeling you know, really down, you know,
sometimes these things become clearer and we're all on a
journey with this, you know. Yeah, that's beautiful advice. You
read my mind this because that was one of my
questions was around you know, you know, what advice would
(39:23):
you give to mob? But I think that that captures
the essence entirely. Just don't be afraid to do the thing,
be bold, be yourself, and you know, find ways to
love yourself just as much along the way.
Speaker 3 (39:37):
Absolutely, Like I like me personally, I you know, was
when I was starting out really afraid to be myself
and be what others I thought others wanted me to be.
And I found like as I got older and more
mature when I started really just being my authentic self,
you know, and giving you know, unless not just be
(39:58):
vulgar but fox like.
Speaker 1 (40:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (40:01):
I that's when I really started to become more successful
because I was being my authentic self whether people liked
it or not. And surprisingly, like I've just being myself,
I've made some really great friends. And that's when my
business was really able to start growing because I was creating,
you know, work that was authentic to me, and I
(40:22):
was really putting myself out there being vulnerable also, and
it was making me happy. And that's when you know,
I started feeling my own cup and creating what you know,
made me happy. That's when the rest all came later.
Speaker 2 (40:38):
Working from that place of love and authenticity and acceptance
and you because this is a thing, you know, you're
not like it's not your business anyway. And for the
black business owners who are listening, you know, it's not
that like we are our business. We we it's not like, oh,
my business is here and I'm here, Like how we
show up for ourselves is how we show up in
(41:00):
our business. And so you know, it's such a it's
actually business is a very spiritual feeling. I think because
we're pouring into something and abs not separate.
Speaker 3 (41:11):
So and I find that with black businesses too, Like
it's just compared to non indigenous businesses like mob you
can really feel when you're purchasing from them or you know,
looking at their work, it does come from a place
of authenticity and who they are. And yeah, I just
thought i'd add that on with that because it's like
you're so spot on.
Speaker 1 (41:32):
It's I love it. I love it. Oh my god.
Speaker 2 (41:35):
This has given me so much to think about. And
I think for any of the you know, the young
sisters who particularly are listening, you know, that's a I
think it's a really beautiful conversation to be having about
leaning into all parts of ourselves and you will attract
the people that want to stick around and sadly some
people you might have to surrender and let go to
as well. It's when you start leaning into yourself. You know,
(41:58):
people know feel that and you attrack that, oh this
is let them leave.
Speaker 3 (42:05):
Yes, they if they don't want to see you shine,
then you know they're definitely not worth it. They're not
worth bringing into the next chapter of your life.
Speaker 1 (42:14):
Amen. I mean.
Speaker 2 (42:17):
I've been Yeah, I feel that on so many levels.
It's such a grief and loss at first to let
people go, but over time you're like, bye, see you
love to see you leave.
Speaker 3 (42:31):
The place of self love to I find when you
start really you know, within and loving yourself, then you're
more than happy to let go of that loose toxic
people and really allow the people who want to see
you shine come in.
Speaker 1 (42:46):
That's so true.
Speaker 2 (42:48):
Oh, my Cis you are so wise And this is
the thing.
Speaker 3 (42:51):
You know.
Speaker 2 (42:51):
We started off talking about photos, but then when we
really started to unpack, it's like it is such a
heart led process, so of course we're going to be
talking about vulnerable things like what a no brain? Oh well,
my sister, where can people connect with you? And have
you got anything that you want to share in the
pipeline or yeah, anything else that you want to share
(43:13):
about you in your work and a big shout out
to where we can all follow along with your beautiful
magic and gifts for the world.
Speaker 3 (43:22):
Well, you can find my work on Instagram. That's where
I spend most of my time. It's Marley Morgan Photography
and I'm also on Facebook and my website is www
dot Marleymorgan dot com dot AU. But also like to
those listening, I encourage them to really connect with other
black photographers also because like I'm very inspired by the
(43:44):
other mob who are doing it. I'm a part of
a little community called Black Lens. It's just where we
really support each other, we share resources, and you know,
really want to see each other do well. And I
think it's really worth checking out. And if you ever
need a photographer, I encourage them to reach out to
Black Lens or to source out who is in your community,
(44:08):
because honestly, like there is some mob that's really being
you know, not being booked, and their talents so really
being overlooked, and I couldn't encourage that anymore.
Speaker 2 (44:20):
Such a great piece of advice. We'll be popping all
of Marley's and Black Lenses details in our show notes,
but it really is such a beautiful reminder that this
is what you get when you hire your black followers,
not just someone who's going to rock up and take
some photos, but people who are really digging deep into themselves,
providing pouring into their communities and are really showing up
(44:42):
in unique, vulnerable and fearless ways.
Speaker 1 (44:45):
So please, new followers, get out there and.
Speaker 2 (44:48):
Book your black artists, because you aren't going to get
this love and care from anyone. So yeah, thank you,
thank you so much for coming on the show today,
my system, and also just giving me a place in space.
Speaker 1 (45:01):
To air out some of how I've been feeling.
Speaker 2 (45:03):
It's such a reciprocal, beautiful thing, Miss job about having yarn,
So you've given me a lot to think about too, Sis,
So thanks.
Speaker 3 (45:12):
I think that's the beauty of when MOB connect, isn't
it Like we're really able to just yearn and just
like release so let go.
Speaker 2 (45:22):
Absolutely, Yeah, it's so true. You've definitely given me some
things I need to go away and think about. So
thank you all, love my sis, thank you so much
for listening you Mob. If you're vibing this season of
Yarning up, then please head over to Apple, Spotify, or
wherever you get your podcasts from to show us some love,
(45:43):
rate and review. Alternatively, you can get in contact and
give us some feedback by visiting www. Dot carolinecow dot
com dot au
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