August 29, 2025 • 50 mins
It's Fox Sports Radio's official fantasy football podcast! Dan Beyer and Mike Harmon are back to help you through another action-packed season of fantasy football! They open the show reacting to the blockbuster trade sending Micah Parsons to the Packers... What does it mean from a fantasy perspective? They then run through Mike's top wide receiver and tight end rankings before taking a look at some later-round value picks at both positions.
Hosts: Mike Harmon, Dan Beyer
Producers: Ian Roddy
#fsrweekends #jss
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Ladies, you want experience during your football season, Well, buckle up,
sweet cheeks. We've got all the experience in the world.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
This is I want your Flex with Dan Byer and
Mike Harmon.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
Mike and Dan break down everything you need to set
your lineups, from position rankings to starts and sits. The
guys help you make those hard decisions. And now let's
get your flex ond. Here's Dan Bayer and Mike Harmon.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Week one of the NFL season is fast approaching, but
we know that there are a lot of drafts still
to take place. We've covered the quarterbacks and running backs.
Now we're going to do the wide receivers. He is
Mike Harmon, I'm Dan Byer. Our executive producer is Ian Roddy.
But before we talk about the pass catchers in the
top ten ends, we have to talk about the biggest
news in the NFL. It's been a story all off season,
(00:55):
Mike and finally has reached the pinnacle of the New
cycle where Micah Parsons is dealt by the Dallas Cowboys
to the Green Bay Packers for two first round picks,
a defensive tackle Kenny Clark. The Stalemate, the Showdown, the duel,
however you wanted to say it is finally over. Micah
(01:16):
Parsons dealt by the Cowboys to the Green Bay Packers.
Speaker 4 (01:19):
Absolutely stunned on several levels. One that the Packers are
going to pay out that kind of money. Two, there's
no trade happening, there's nothing happening. And then oh, here's
the deal consummated, here's the money, just like that. So
never believe any of what you hear in this process.
But the curiosity of timing Jerry, going back on what
(01:42):
has been a long run business in terms of getting
it done in the eleventh hour, just two first round picks,
figured there would be a third, So maybe a little
bit of a distressed property kind of situation there. You
do get a three time pro bowler and Kenny Clark,
which is great anchor up that defensive line. And as
I've argued all along, Dan, the Cowboys are gonna lose
(02:06):
games with or without Micah Parsons. So if nothing else,
you got a couple of draft picks that, if you
spin it right, then you're you're rebuilding a team and
you're not paying a guy what is it, one hundred
and eighty eight million dollars You can go and do
some other things.
Speaker 3 (02:22):
It's the four year deal that he wanted. I think
that you're the perfect guy to also look at this
deal from this perspective. The deal that we compare this
to is the Khalil Mack trade from the Raiders to
the Bears. For those that don't remember the deal, it
was on September one to twenty eighteen that the Bears
(02:45):
got Khalil Mack, a second round pick in twenty twenty
and a conditional pick a fifth round pick in twenty twenty. Well,
the Raiders received two first in twenty twenty, a third
round pick in twenty twenty, and nineteen sixth round pick,
So you got the picks in twenty nineteen and in
(03:05):
twenty twenty. It does feel that the Bears gave up
a lot more than what Green Bay had to give up.
Mac then signed a six year deal where the one hundred
and forty one million dollars with the with the Bears
after that trade, but that's, you know, the the what
they got in return. Kenny Clark's a great player. But
(03:26):
I think it I lent to lean more on your
side of things, Mike, is why not just then just
get all draft picks. Don't try to sell it, Jerry
that you're trying to get Kenny Clark and trying to
stop there on and this is going to be a
good piece when you have Micah Parsons. There's very similar
dealings with the Mavericks, Lakers Luca trade as well with
this deal, but I just wish they would have just
(03:47):
gone all in with Picks. I don't think that they
needed an accomplished player as part of this deal. So
that's why I lean on your side of this. If
you're gonna lose, you might as well lose bad and
make those picks worth it. I don't for as good
as Kenny Clark is, I don't know if his better
days are ahead of him. I don't think that they are, right,
so then what's the point of bringing him in. I
just I didn't understand the deal for Dallas on that aspect.
Speaker 4 (04:10):
Yeah, I mean, you're looking at a guy who's got
still has a couple of years left on his deal.
Some decent money is at that tipping point of thirty
which we always always wonder, you know, how much longer
you're gonna be playing at an elite level. But in
the end, wins and losses. Yeah, you'll stop the run
slightly more effectively. But guess what, you don't have the
guy getting after the pass rush or after the passer
(04:33):
at this point, right, he gave up your attacker and
that's fine. Right Again, football philosophies of how you practice through.
I gotta wonder if Matt Eberfluz feels a little salty
now thinking he was going to be able to run
a defense that would have Michael Parsons out there. I mean,
if anything, for the Packers side of it, I mean,
(04:55):
you get a guy Khalil Mack had twelve and a
half sacks in that twenty eighteen, so he came in
and played and played well. You always are concerned if
a guy hasn't practiced to that point. But yeah, for
Jerry Jones, it's just that curiosity. I mean, you're a
middling team one way or another, and it's suddenly about
a couple of bucks, because that's the thing I think,
(05:17):
to pull it out back to the non football business
out of it. It almost seems like out of spite, right,
Mike did the I'm done scorched earth everything social media,
laying down on the table after eating some bad nachos.
All right, I'm casting as versions on the najas now,
but just all of that, and Jerry's like, no, it's negotiating.
(05:38):
We'll figure this out and in the end, if you're
to believe where the numbers were, And again Jerry didn't
give any specificity and when what he said, but kind
of talked that the numbers were pretty similar. So it
more seems like a all right, we took his personally
with Mugiletta and with Micah Parsons to walk away for
(05:59):
what might constitute just a slight bump, but more the
I win the principle of the matter.
Speaker 3 (06:07):
And he's I want to say this, I actually agree
with the Cowboys trading Michaeh Parsons to what you said,
and I think that we just don't think that Dallas
is going to be that competitive. Also, Mike, if you
can get future assets when maybe Philadelphia takes a step
back for once, as they're a defending Super Bowl champ style,
(06:27):
we expect them to be good. We expect Washington to
be good. Washington's probably gonna be good for the next
couple of years, but right now, a team that's climbing up.
If you're Dallas stagger it in a way, we're like, Okay,
maybe in a couple of years, when those top teams
in the NFL, those two maybe take a step back,
maybe it's easier for us in the NFC East. So
I am all for Dallas trying to look at the
(06:48):
future with all of this. I just don't understand Jerry
Jones essentially talking out of both sides of his mouth,
saying how great Micah Parsons was, how they thought they
had a deal in the spring with him, and then
now as they talk about the deal, they talk about
Kenny Clark, what they could do with the draft picks,
how they could move. It feels like he's having it
(07:08):
both ways and you can't either you thought he was
worth paying the money in April, or now you're looking
at it from the point that you just didn't want
to pay him that much. To me, it seems like
he's talking out of both sides of his mouth, where
if he were to just say, guess what, we couldn't
agree to terms on the money, so we just pivoted
in a direction that we thought was best for the
(07:29):
football team. I think that would have been a sufficient
explanation instead of trying to spin this tail on why
this tal e why they think that this is going
to work for the Cowboys.
Speaker 4 (07:39):
Wag the tail, spin the tail. You're absolutely right, it
all goes to it. And again from a football perspective,
I don't have a problem with it at all. Yes, again,
it's all going to be on Dak's arm how far
you're going, because they weren't a very good defensive team
when Mike had.
Speaker 2 (07:56):
Played right in Week one?
Speaker 4 (07:58):
Yeah, you beat the Browns yay, then you got drum
by the Saints, remember that, ah, and then you lose
to Baltimore, You beat the Giants, you get drubbed by Philadelphia,
you get drubbed by Houston, and we go all the
way on down the line. You're giving up a ton
of points. And I know there's some metrics to say,
look how much better they were, and look how great
(08:20):
they were with Mikeeh bottom line, as you're giving up
a load of points every damn week, so's thinking, yet
he's some difference maker. And you know we always talk
to you know, guys from Vegas. Whatever's what's he worth?
Half a win? Like it's as great a player as
he is and as much merch as he sells, and
I don't mean to, you know, denigrade him. He's a
(08:41):
he's a great player, doesn't doesn't win or lose your games.
So to not pay the one eighty eight one twenty
one thirty guaranteed differing numbers coming out like Jerry's just
owning up, It's like we finally made the business decision.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
We were done with this.
Speaker 3 (09:00):
I also find this interesting and this shows you the
value of the Dallas Cowboys. Now, as we're recording this podcast,
I'm back in the Midwest, back home in Wisconsin, and
this is a big deal around here for Green Bay
Packer purposes. Mike, there is zero chatter on x outside
(09:21):
of these borders of this state talking about how this
affects the Packers and puts them in a possible spot
to make it the Super Bowl sixty. It is all
about the Cowboys. It is all about Jerry Jones. And
that's the amazing thing, because I do think that this
move is magnificent for Green Bay in a division that
(09:42):
we feel is going to be very strong. Now they've
gotten another opportunity to be even better. You feel you
team up Micaeh Parsons with Rashan Gary and now Green
Bay is a legit if they weren't already a legit
Super Bowl contender to come out of the NFC, and
no one's talking about it. That's another crazy part of
it for me, is it's a really big deal here,
(10:03):
but I don't know in the other forty nine states
if that's the case, because all we're doing is talking
about the Cowboys and Jerry Jones.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (10:09):
I mean, it's not very sexy to talk about how
Mark Murphy's no longer the guy, so now it's ed policy. Yeah,
because under Mark Murphy, would this deal have gotten done.
I don't know that it would have, right, And I
think that was one of the big the last forty
eight to seventy two hours heading in and we saw
some smattering of Packers talk coming into the weekend ahead
(10:33):
of the current week that we're in, and it started
to build momentum. But it's just like, this doesn't seem
like a Packers thing because other than Reggie White all
those years ago, not big players in free agency and
not making big splashes with big dollar contract guys. So
for this to suddenly pop up on the radar and
we all know how much the Packers got from the
(10:54):
national deal four hundred and thirty two million dollars. Thank
you for that information based on the wave constructed. But
it's just a little different way of doing business and
pushing in on what your current roster has and giving
that vote of confidence. You know, I think it's absolutely fascinating.
Speaker 3 (11:13):
I'm going to wrap it up this way because we
do have wide receivers and tight ends to talk about.
When Reggie White was agreeing to a deal as a
free agent to sign with the Green Bay Packers. I
remember where I was, Okay, and I was here in
my hometown and just outside of it on Highway G
(11:36):
on my way to my aunt's house, driving past the
road where my other aunt lives Okay today, when the
Micah Parsons news broke, I was at my aunt's house
when this and I immediately had deja vu to thirty
plus years ago, like I am practically in the same
(11:57):
exact spot as you had this roundbreaking deal that really
changed the vision of the Green Bay Packers franchise when
Reggie White decides to sign with them in free agency,
because there wasn't free agency before that. Now you have
this move and I'm like, oh my goodness, like there
is something in the universe with this. But the Packers
get their big star. I think they're legit in the
(12:19):
NFC North. And now it's up to Jerry and Steven
to spin those two first round picks into something.
Speaker 4 (12:24):
Well, those are two guys you really trust to get
that done, now, aren't you?
Speaker 5 (12:28):
Two things that I want to ask you guys first
before we wrap up the segment, specifically Green Bay. Do
you have an issue with it being Green Bay because
if you remember, that's the team that destroyed them in
the playoffs the last time they were actually, you know,
a good team a couple of years ago. You just
gave them the guy who was your best player at
that time and it's you know, in the.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
NFC's That's what I was just gonna say. I'm surprised
that he went to an NFC team. Yeah, I mean,
there's only there are only so many teams that were
in the Micah Parsons sweepstakes, right, and so to have
it be in the NFC, And Jerry even said in
his press conference, the deal came. You know, these things
(13:08):
happened fast, They come down pretty quickly. It happened on
Thursday afternoon, that is the portion, So answer your question.
Surprised that it is in the NFC.
Speaker 4 (13:18):
I think the Packers part is interesting, just giving the
documentary and everything that he talked about how soul crushing
that loss was and the Jordan Love perfect passer rating and.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
All of that stuff.
Speaker 4 (13:30):
But yeah, it's I'm curious what the other offers were then,
because as you said, Dan, I mean, there's not only
not gonna be a lot of people that are coming
into the marketplace for a two hundred million dollars. Yeah,
Minebacker edge Rusher wherever we're highbreding because that was the
other part was you know, trying to figure out what
his classification is in terms of his position.
Speaker 2 (13:52):
But yeah, to decide to just.
Speaker 4 (13:55):
Pull here, I mean that speaks volumes of where you're
at as an organization, like you're reeling.
Speaker 5 (14:02):
And then the other the other thing I want to
ask you, guys, is fantasy wise for Dallas. Now, Mike,
you were saying, it doesn't really necessarily translate to wins
specifically for you know, Green Bay, or you know, necessarily
translating to more losses for Dallas because their defense would
have been bad anyway. But fantasy wise, how does this
help guys? Like George Pickens and Ceedee Lamb.
Speaker 4 (14:22):
Well, we've we alluded to it. We'll do it a
little more in the wide receivers and tight ends. But
all right, I mean you've been fully on board Dan
from day one with you know, Dak Prescott's winging around.
Speaker 3 (14:34):
I love it.
Speaker 4 (14:34):
You don't have it. You don't have a big running
back corps. Right, there's not a single guy there that
scares you. Your defense was already suspect. I mean, like
you were gonna give up twenty five or twenty six
a game. Now you're at twenty nine. Again, let's go
winging around a lot.
Speaker 3 (14:52):
But hey, they could stop the run. They could stop
the run. I I ian's answer your question. On my part,
I don't think that it affects it because I felt
that they already were going to be this team anyway
that has to score thirty five points a game to win.
So to Mike's point, maybe then how they just need
to score thirty eight to make sure that they win.
Speaker 5 (15:12):
Maybe I just I feel like he when you're talking
about one of the best defensive players in the entire league.
I just feel like it affects it a little more
like maybe maybe not in the grand scheme of the season,
like you were saying, wins losses wise, but just game
script and how you approach, you know, how the offense approaches,
how they attack you. It's just going to change, you know,
the amount you're throwing, the amount you're running going forward.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
So yeah, I think they could have been trailing a lot.
I think that's no surprise.
Speaker 4 (15:39):
Yeah, yeah, I think that's the thing, right, I think
they're now the NFC Bengals went without the star defensive player, right,
the Bengals still have Trey Hendrickson. What did that do
for him last year? Not a damn thing. What did
it do with Micah Parsons was other than we got
to watch him have you know, a dozen sacks and
run them up a little bit. They weren't good.
Speaker 5 (16:01):
I actually like that, Mike, because they've got a you know,
solid not Joe Burrow, not Joe Burrow, but they've got
dak In, a solid quarterback, and two good receivers.
Speaker 4 (16:09):
Really bad defense, right, I mean, we love Chase Brown
far more than anything, doubtless is running out at the
running back position. But you know, when we talk about receivers,
add Jake Ferguson into the mix. He got paid this
offseason Listoyo will be utilized. Yeah, I mean, I think
they're they're kind of the mirror. They're gonna have to
win shootout after shootout if they're going to try to
(16:29):
have any kind of advancement into January.
Speaker 3 (16:32):
I think they're gonna get crushed on Thursday night in
their opener and.
Speaker 2 (16:35):
Then this season's gonna minus seven.
Speaker 3 (16:38):
Yeah, I think that they're going to get Let's see,
there's a lot of there's a lot of emotion that
comes into those games. Certain teams work well with it,
certain teams don't. We've seen the Patriots when they were
in their dynasty. They you know, I remember lost an
opener to the Chiefs. It's not the it's not the
fail safe that you always think it is. But I
think that you're going to see a great effort from
(17:01):
Philadelphia and then Dallas can recover heading into week two.
Is it's just been a crazy offseason.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
So great.
Speaker 4 (17:07):
It's a week away and chaos ensues, and Smith and
I will be on air to watch it all destruct.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
It'll be good.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
He's Mike Carmon, that's Ian Roddy, our executive producer. I'm
Dan Byer. This is I want your flex. Let's talk
some fantasy. Now. We're going to get into the wide
receivers and tight ends and the guys that you got
to draft, yes in the next coming week as the
NFL season is approaching. That's next here, and I want
your flex. Let's talk about the guys who are going
to be catching passes. Maybe after this Micah Parsons deal,
(17:36):
Mike Ian is right that maybe Ceedee Lamb is now
wr one for everyone, considering the Cowboys are gonna have
to score thirty eight. I don't know. We we'll find
out the next ten minutes or so on if this
does change someone like Ceedee Lamb. But I think it
would be very, very hard pressed to knock Jamar Chase
from that number one spot when we're talking about the
top wide receivers in fantasy football.
Speaker 4 (17:58):
Yeah, I mean, as you talked about in mirrors between
conferences here, and I'll take Joe Burrow over Dak Prescott.
HM right in terms of being able to feed Jamar
Chase with that regularity as we watched so brilliantly last year,
and nothing's changed. I mean, it's gonna be the same
formula as much as they did all their massages, massaging
(18:22):
of contracts to get everybody squared away. The receiving core,
Hendrickson or whatever defense is still gonna be bad. You're
still gonna need to ramp up the offense. So yeah,
still chase ahead of Lamb. And then it starts to
get a little more into the fun and excitement about
debates because you got a bunch of guys where either
the offense is changed and coordinators change, young receivers like oh,
(18:44):
i'd like to see him do that again, and quarterbacks
that I don't know how much we trust him.
Speaker 3 (18:50):
Yes, And that leads me to a topic that I
don't think has been talked enough this offseason. And I
feel it's because at least during the training camps, Mike,
it's been because of Michael Parsons, it's been because of
Terry McLaurin, it's been because of Trey Andrickson. We're dealing
with all of that drama. But I do wonder about
JJ McCarthy in Minnesota and how that directly affects someone
(19:13):
like Justin Jefferson because I hate to say that maybe
we're underappreciating Sam Donald because I don't want to sound
like a Seahawks Homer now that he's on my team.
But I do think that there's a lot to ask
to fill the shoes that Donald did have in the
first ninety percent of the season, where we were calling
him an MVP candidate, And now you have JJ McCarthy
(19:35):
in there, which directly relates and correlates to performances by
Justin Jefferson.
Speaker 4 (19:40):
Yeah, I think Sam Donald. I think God short shrift
in that end of season run as well. I think
because of the collective media love of Kevin O'Connell as
a as a super genius, it became a well, he
couldn't have possibly game plan wrong, He couldn't have possibly
done anything in his sequencing that was wrong. It's clearly
(20:02):
all Sam Donald. He threw up on himself at a
big moment, which I completely disagree with the way we've
fallen over some of these guys GMS and coaches and whatever.
And this is the collective national media sometimes like no, no, no,
you can't put the spot like back on him, like
just because he's nice and he answers all media requests
and calls you sir and gives you a cup of
(20:22):
coffee when you walk in the door. And they like
you can ask him questions. I think Sam Donald got
screwed at the end of game.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
Was he great?
Speaker 4 (20:30):
No, But I don't think they did anything in terms
of scripting to put him in a chance to succeed.
So yeah, now JJ McCarthy's got to do it. We
haven't gotten to see much of him. He's down one
of his top options at least for the first couple
of weeks with Addison's suspension, So there's certainly questions. And
the Bears defense, for as much as we've blown a
(20:51):
lot of hot air towards the offense on the course
of the season, moves needles. We put the Bears on
the metal stand of thank yous for these summer months.
Smith and I at our show in the evening, thank
you for the content. I almost started singing like it
was an ABA song, thank you for the music. But
but the Bears defense should be pretty good by by
(21:13):
all accounts. So you know, he's got a tough test
right off the jump. And for Justin Jefferson, is McCarthy
the guy that's gonna force the ball? What did we
see in Michigan that ever said all right, he's gonna
he's gonna force it.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
No, he played within a system.
Speaker 4 (21:27):
So now it's gonna be a curiosity of all, right,
are you gonna be willing to force the ball into
double coverage where the safety is shading over, especially those
first couple of weeks where you don't have that secondary help.
Speaker 3 (21:41):
It's it's gonna really take guts to take someone not
named Ceedee Lamb or Jamar Chase above Justin Jefferson. But
if you did have those cohonists, like you like to say,
if you do have the balls to do it, is
there a name out there that you would take Mike
over Justin Jefferson, or names for people, or maybe looking
to go in a different direction at the wide receiver position.
Speaker 4 (22:03):
If you push me that way, I would look at
two young guys who succeeded greatly in spite of their
quarterback and team success because there was none the Giants
and the Jaguars. So I'm looking at Neighbors and Thomas
Junior as two elite guys that go up into that
next space. With the amount of production we got in
(22:27):
twenty twenty four with subpar quarterbacking, now you have in
theory and he whispered it when he said, Duval Cohen
there to go and fix Trevor Lawrence. Whatever you think
of Travis Hunter as a number two and the rest
of the depth chart there. I mean, Brian Thomas delivered
a year ago. There's no reason to believe suddenly he
takes a step back. Malik Neighbors as well. One of
(22:50):
those guys is going to be better than what they
were thrown out there last year at quarterback, right, even
if it ends up being Jamis trying to eat W's,
He'll wing the ball around and guys make plays. Jackson
Dart eventually gets his run in the interim, we get
the moon ball with Russ Wilson a bit so, Malik
Dabors and Brian Thomas would be those guys, and then
(23:10):
the third would be Nico Collins. In Houston, that offensive
line isn't much better. They've got a good defense, maybe
a great defense, but I think he had a bounce
back for CJ.
Speaker 2 (23:20):
Stroud, And again, who else are they throwing the ball to?
Speaker 3 (23:23):
Right? Yes, I feel that That's why I'd like Thomas
in Jacksonville. I know there's so much hype about Travis
Hunter and does seem like he's going to maybe have
more of a role on offense than he does on
defense to start out his career. But I was shocked
on this podcast to see the numbers last year that
Brian Thomas was putting up for Jacksonville. And I would
(23:46):
think in year two, I don't think there's going to
be a sophomore slump. And as crazy as it sounds,
I like Jacksonville's quarterback room better than say the Giants
quarterback room with neighbors. So neighbors may be more the
big name talent that we have. But if I'm taking
a receiver, if I'm taking an LSU receiver, yeah, as
(24:07):
crazy as it is, it's Brian Thomas.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
Yeah, it gets into that curiosity.
Speaker 4 (24:11):
And certainly, you know we've got the body of work
going back to Jefferson to the starting point of it all.
Like it it's awful hard to walk off there because
you're also not going to be razzed by your league.
Speaker 2 (24:23):
Mites, because that's the other part.
Speaker 4 (24:25):
You got to consider the psychological damage that your league
mates can do, particularly if there's an active message board
or texting service going on there. Dan, because if it
goes south for him, hey, the quarterback stunt the other
guys like he plays in Jacksonville.
Speaker 3 (24:40):
Yes, on, I know it's a great place to hide
until they become the world's team. There you go, that's
what I think that Travis Hunter is going to to
help bring the Jacksonville Jaguars. All right, let's move outside
of the top five, if you will. Let's get into
these next group of guys. I'm talking about the Drake London's,
(25:01):
the Lad mcconkey's, as crazy as it sounds, the Tyreek
Kills of the world. We did a top sixty draft
at the end of last season and I took one
for the team. I said, guys, I'm just gonna take
Tyree Kill because he continues to fall. We can't have
him fall out of the top sixty of our draft.
So I took him. But when we start to look
(25:21):
at this next level, like who are the guys that
you're like, Okay, I'm taking it better or I'm taking
him over Tyreek Kill. Who is in this next group
that you think could really stand out this season?
Speaker 2 (25:31):
Well, you imagined Drake London.
Speaker 4 (25:33):
He's a guy that we're anticipating, and we push all
in on Atlanta because even if Pennix fails at this point,
there's the break glass in case of emergency or he
gets hurt that Kirk Cousins at least as we sit
down to record, this is still there, whereas we don't
have that kind of level of confidence in virtually any
(25:53):
other room in terms of the backup. Right, the precipitous
drop off for most is there and a very real thing. McConkie,
like the others we mentioned when we talk about Thomas
and uh and going back to elite neighbors, they performed
without a lot of support in the receiving course, so
it's hard to believe that they don't shift.
Speaker 2 (26:16):
Now.
Speaker 4 (26:16):
It's curious, you know, I look at maconkie and I
think I'm on Ross Saint Brown a little bit the
same way is that their teams, you know in Detroit,
the team I alluded to at the beginning of things
with all right, you got a new OC, what's it
going to look like? He's still gonna catch a lot
of balls to move first move the chains? Now is
he gonna pop for big plays? Sure, there's gonna be
(26:38):
some broken tackles and scheme it up to where to
where he finds some daylight. But he's still going to
pile up receptions. So the half PPR PPR leagues. I
think Almon Ross Saint Brown still gets it done. But
in terms of pushing all in, I think you play
defense and run the football a bit more right. You
lose some of the gadgetary that Ben Johnson took with
(26:59):
him in Chicago, So I think the ceiling's lowered. Not
to mention Jamison Williams, who's you know in that mid
to late you know WR two, perhaps higher if you
want to push in on him that if you're going
to take the shots, he's going to be the beneficiary,
whereas a'man Ross, Saint Brown and Sam Laporta do a
lot of the dirty work over the middle, but don't
(27:20):
necessarily put up the huge fantasy stats this time around.
Speaker 3 (27:23):
Yeah, I thought it was not that this was a
blockbuster trade mic, But when the Lions dealt Tim Patrick
to the Jaguars last week, the only reason why it
just kind of popped up on my radar was not
because Islac Tesla or however we want to pronounce.
Speaker 2 (27:41):
We're gonna call him Tesla.
Speaker 3 (27:42):
He's electric.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
Once played by David Bowie in a movie, by the way.
Speaker 3 (27:48):
But I felt it was more of what you're saying
like we do have one of, if not the best
offensive lines in the NFL, even with losing our all
world center and right Greg Now it's a retirement in
the off season, I feel like he can be replaced,
and I feel that you're spot on with that running
game in terms of what the Detroit is doing there.
(28:10):
I find it interesting when you know with that Sam
Laporter discussion that we'll get to later of where the
tight ends get. But I agree with you, I don't
think it's going to be as much wheeling and free
wheelings as they were previously in Detroit with Ben Johnson
calling those shots.
Speaker 4 (28:25):
Well in the defense, if they're healthy, you don't have
to play the pinball game as they did at times. Right,
you can go more conservatively. Let's just run some clock,
grind it out, and go that way. So I think
that plays in.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
I'm going to give you the toughest, the toughest player
to draft as a wide receiver, Okay, I think it's
T Higgins, And the reason being is I feel that
you feel that there's this pot of gold at the
end of the rainbow because of what you get from
Cincinnati and there's as someone who has been a T
Higgins owner for the past couple of years, and Mike,
(29:00):
I don't know if he's been on your teams or
Ian I'm not sure if he's been on your teams.
It is so frustrating.
Speaker 5 (29:06):
It really is exactly where you're going, Yes.
Speaker 3 (29:09):
It is. It is so frustrating because the numbers are
there and the points are there, and you think, gosh,
why couldn't this just be more even, and so you
have such a tough time in judging because he is,
you know, legit a starting wide receiver in fantasy football.
There is no doubt about that. You think that there's
everything with it. But when you think of what could be,
(29:29):
I mean, this could be a top five, top ten guy.
T Higgins is my most frustrating guy to deal with
when we're talking about drafting and fantasy football.
Speaker 4 (29:37):
And I think it goes to, you know, one of
the background parts of it, like we put up rankings
and there's always just that giant astros that hangs out there.
Speaker 2 (29:44):
It's like, this is not a best ball competition.
Speaker 4 (29:47):
Sure, so while a guy may rank twelfth because like, alrighty,
we projects this many points week to week, you're gonna
live and die a little bit with that, because he's
not going to have the you know, the three touchdown
like you might have one of those, might might find
a second And if Jamar Chase goes down, then then
then maybe you get a little more love and the targets.
(30:08):
I mean, I'd be more likely just you know, there's
enough wide receiver depth there that I'll let him go
and then I'll eventually take yoshavsh and put him on
my bench. Sure, right, WR five, and if it breaks right,
he's still getting a decent target share per week.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
And now he's my WR three with a bullet.
Speaker 3 (30:29):
It's it's such a it's you feel like, oh, he's
gonna maybe he'll dig into Jamar Chase's numbers. No, it's
not gonna happen.
Speaker 2 (30:39):
Help him a player though, Yeah, right, I mean you
look at it.
Speaker 4 (30:44):
Last year, right, seventy three targets, which is just one
off a career high both twenty one and twenty two.
Speaker 2 (30:51):
Seventy four catches target.
Speaker 4 (30:53):
Count outside of twenty twenty three, or he played twelve games,
which he did again in twenty twenty four, but target
count has been the same four of his five NFL seasons,
which is just insane. Yeah, and then nine hundred and
eleven yards. He did have a career at best ten touchdowns.
But again, you know, if you're going to have to
(31:13):
be touchdown dependent, it's a very dangerous way to live.
Speaker 3 (31:17):
To look at our wide receivers. We're going to touch
out a few more guys coming up after the break,
and then we'll get into the tight end conversation as well.
He's Ian Roddy, our executive producer. The voice he hears
Mike Harmon hit him up on ext swollen dome. I'm
Dan Byer. This is I Want Your Flex more receiver
and tight end talk next, wrapping up this episode of
(31:38):
I Want Your Flex. Talking about some wide receivers. There's
one name that I've stayed away from in my drafts.
And remember a couple of years ago, Mike I was
high on Brandon Cooks and and it just did not
work out for me. This is when Cooks was with
the Texans. I was doubling up on him. In leagues.
I've played a couple of different leagues, one standard once
(31:59):
half point PPR. We talk a lot about in our rankings.
We're looking at this from a half point PPR situation.
There's one player I've completely stayed away from that. I've
had multiple times to draft and he's not Tyreek Hill
at someone else. And then there's another player that I've taken,
just one player I've taken in both drafts. The player
I've stayed away from Puka and Nakula. I've stayed away
from Pooka and Akua. Our executive producer, Ian Roddy wants
(32:21):
to know more about why we're staying away from poqua Akua.
The guy doubled up Jerry Judy Cleveland Browns now value wise,
I wasn't reaching on Judy, but the value I felt
with Judy was great. I was not comfortable taking Puoka
as high as he was in the rankings in my
two drafts.
Speaker 4 (32:38):
Yeah, Judy being drafted as a mid to low end
three or later, depending on how much you really want
to delve into the Cleveland Browns situation. Certainly, we've had
a lot of fun with the quarterback spot. But a
guy who had one hundred and forty five targets twelve
hundred yards a year ago. You know the old rule
of thumb that someone's gonna catch the ball, all right,
(33:02):
there's a lot of targets, so there's a lot of
carries that are out there, no question about it. So
for talking value AD and perception versus reality, Yeah, I
mean that's great value where he is down there, because
even if Dylan Gabriel and eventually shod Or Sanders, Uh,
Deshaun Watson maybe uh, and Bailey Zappi and whoever else
(33:23):
may come creeping out of the stands.
Speaker 2 (33:25):
Uh, they're gonna throw the ball up for grabs.
Speaker 4 (33:27):
And so long as he's healthy, which was one of
the things that affected his run in Denver, as long
as he's healthy, he'll be out there to go and
run and run under it.
Speaker 2 (33:35):
But pukin Dakua.
Speaker 4 (33:36):
Guy, it's just so difficult based on this style I
think they want to play. But also is Matthew Stafford
going to be upright? Like what's is over under on games?
I have no idea. You know, I'm a Jimmy Garoppolo
truther to a point, but you're not gonna be winging
it around now. Nakula may in a half point or
full PPR mode, you'll pick up those eight catch games
(34:01):
for forty yards. Like, there's gonna be a couple of those,
I guarantee. But in terms of a week to week
pop as the sixth or seventh wide receiver off the board.
That is just too difficult, And especially if I got
to worry every time Matthew Stafford is getting scraped up
off of the ground that that may be the last
one for the year. Now, we could say that about
a lot of quarterbacks, but for a guy who basically
(34:22):
didn't practice the whole off season and now we're gonna
roll him out there, I have full respect for the
guy because he'll stand in and take the hit and
make the throw, get the timing right, whatever. But eventually,
you know, father time comes from us. It adds up it.
Speaker 3 (34:37):
Because of how we feel about Puka, I think everything.
The same thing could be said for DeVante Adams as well,
just on a lesser point because it's so dependent of Stafford.
And now does Stafford have any chemistry with Devanta Adams.
I mean, Stafford hadn't been there for a decent amount
of training camp, like I DeVante Adams. I fell into
(34:57):
drafting DeVonta Adams because there was just no one left
that I felt that couldn't match what he could possibly do.
But yet I don't even necessarily know what to expect
from DeVonta Adams. So I have the same questions just
on a different level about DeVonta Adams that I do
with Pukah.
Speaker 4 (35:12):
Yeah, but where you're drafted Adams, right, you get into
the mix the aforementioned you know Baltimore. Here is Tyreek
Hill that you brought up, right, because he's kind of
that line of demarcation of those next guys. You know,
do you trust what's going on with the Jets? I mean,
Ian Garrett Wilson's an all world talent? How often is
(35:32):
he seeing the ball on a week to week basis?
Speaker 5 (35:34):
He's their wide receiver one, two, and three right now,
There's there's no one else.
Speaker 4 (35:38):
Right, So like, but do I trust that that that's
gonna yield a weekly benefit to me?
Speaker 3 (35:44):
No?
Speaker 4 (35:45):
I'd rather go and invest in brayln Allen later and
stay in the run game there for the Jets. The
other wide receivers, Mike Evans, he adopted some of that
TB twelve training this offseason, so he's gonna live and
play forever. Terry McLaurin deal, okay, And then this is
where we start getting into that weird space. Marvin Harrison Junior,
(36:06):
DJ Moore, Ted McMillan in Carolina, how much do you
believe in Canalis and Bryce Young this next year? And
then go back to Denver where they got a lot
of miles to feed between the running backs and the
wide receivers. Courtland Sutton, what's the ceiling on him on
a week to week basis or does he know play
decoy at times? So trying to create some separation there
(36:28):
in your fantasy rankings with these guys and DeVante Adams
is a very difficult proposition.
Speaker 3 (36:33):
Yeah, it absolutely is. As we go further down the
list of just guys that stand out, I mentioned a
guy like Jerry Judy, There's other names that are in
that group. Romadonza in Chicago, second guy to DJ Moore,
a lot of w R two's on their own teams
in that same area. Who's the name that stands out
(36:56):
to you, Mike?
Speaker 4 (36:57):
We talked about it a little bit Abuca in Tampa.
I'm a Baker believer that they're going to put up
numbers and that's just going to keep going, and he's
going to have a huge role. He's one of those
guys that if you really wanted to get cheeky with
your offensive Rookie of the Year kind of projections. He
may be able to put up numbers enough in that
(37:17):
offense to make a run for it. So he was
he would be a guy I'd be looking at another
because look now it's going to sound like I'm trying
to be a Buckeye fan.
Speaker 2 (37:29):
But Chris a Lave there in New Orleans.
Speaker 3 (37:31):
That's okay, right, because that's all they got, Yes.
Speaker 2 (37:34):
All right.
Speaker 4 (37:34):
I mean, whether it's Chuck and or Rattler keeps the
job for an extended period, what else do they have.
It's Alvin Kamara and it's Chris a Lave. Between them,
they should be touching the ball forty times a game.
Speaker 3 (37:47):
Mm hmm, yeah, I agree, there's i they're gonna be
down twenty eight to three, so let's just it's going
to be fourth quarter Saints fun with christ a Lave.
I've always loved Rashid Shahid.
Speaker 2 (38:00):
Yeah, it was fun.
Speaker 3 (38:01):
So you may you may have to wait until you
know later on in the in the day to enjoy
your your guys, meaning that if it's a let's say
one o'clock Eastern time kick when the Saints are down
by twenty points in the fourth quarter, but I think
that there could be legitimate points in those in those spots.
Speaker 4 (38:18):
Yeah, and for my you know, shameless homerism, h picking
a guy if look Cal Williams getting his four thousand
and thirty touchdowns or whatever nonsense seventy percent completion that
that they're trying to throw out there. Luther Burden's a
guy that has won a lot of people over with
the way he's gone about his work ethic. Because one
(38:39):
thing we know with Ben Johnson and with Antoine Randall
l is if you're a physical wide receiver, you're getting
on the field. And this is a guy that runs
through people on blocks and will get you know, be
part of plays where it's not designed for his number
that's going to get win him over. And from all
reports in camp and even Greg Olsen to throw it
(39:00):
up into the telecast when they did that Sunday night,
did the Fox game, right, was you know talking about
it is like, well, we were told he's he's the
guy that they've got their eye on. So he got
to let the cat out of the back. I don't
know if he was supposed to say, but he did.
H So that's something to watch as we go forward.
But yeah, those second and third receivers in a lot
(39:21):
of rooms. Man, the variability in drafts that I've seen
is absolutely staggering.
Speaker 5 (39:27):
Mike, of those of those three Chicago receivers, Dj Moore,
Luther burd and Roman Duonsay, and you know throwing Colston
Lovelin too, how do you stack those guys up?
Speaker 2 (39:36):
Are you avoiding any I don't think there's one to avoid.
Speaker 4 (39:40):
I think Dj Moore I might have to draft a
little earlier than I want to. Like I think with
Roman Duneesay, there was enough, There was enough noise around
his rookie season that people are going to be scared
away that you might get a potential value. He had
some good weeks right that, Like there were there were
moments and Dj Moore stepping out of bounds and walking
off the field. That is is never gonna to be
(40:00):
forgotten in Chicago. But like I think, from the pecking order,
as you lay it out, it sits there. And then
you got Cole Comet, who's still enough of a factor.
I mean, we think Loveland takes the lion's share of
those kinds of situational targets. But it is curious do
I avoid them?
Speaker 2 (40:20):
No? But I think more at that ADP.
Speaker 4 (40:24):
He's in that range with McLaurin and all those guys,
I'd rather have them.
Speaker 3 (40:29):
That's a look at the wide receivers, because we have
to get to the tight ends. It feels like it's
Brock Bauers, Trey McBride, and I hate to say everybody else,
but that's kind of where we're at. Do you see
Bauers on his own tier and then and then McBride next,
and everybody else? How do you break down this tight
end position?
Speaker 4 (40:47):
Yeah, I think there's some curiosity. You know, McBride last year,
fantastic week to week, but absolutely invisible in the painted grass,
right and that, And that's the question. Some theories about, hey,
Kyler Murray can't make that throw because he can't see it,
which maybe, I mean, go to the old Doug Flutie
(41:09):
jump ass if you need to down low. But all
of that to say, yeah, I mean I think there's
that separation. I mean, Bowers and you get a guy
like Geno Smith, you know, a you know, we we
joke about the Geno ratio. So Gino Smith had to
leave so Suarez could live on the baseball side in Seattle.
But Gino Smith is a good quarterback, Brock, They've got
(41:33):
some depth. I don't know what happens with Jacoby Myers,
whether you know they chip him off a couple extra
dollars to make him happy. But it kind of goes
to even in a subpar year, look how great powers.
Speaker 5 (41:45):
Was Bowers was that good with Aidan O'Connell throwing him
the ball. So now you have Geno Smith, who we
know is at least competent.
Speaker 4 (41:52):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, there's the Aidan O'Connell slander. Guy can't
even wave one finger back at you right now.
Speaker 3 (42:00):
I'll tell you what. I'm right there with Ian on that.
There are so many Raider fans that thought he was
the answer. Oh my goodness.
Speaker 2 (42:07):
I just wanted to see the little Purdue guy do good.
Speaker 4 (42:10):
But conference man, No, But like it was the is
he going to be serviceable?
Speaker 2 (42:16):
Right? Not great? Yeah, And Bauers showed.
Speaker 4 (42:20):
To that point like it didn't matter. He was going
to find the ball.
Speaker 3 (42:24):
I love the spots of the tight ends because I
so am curious on where Travis Kelce goes. I am
so curious on where guys like Mark Andrews go because
these are the names that just a couple of years ago.
I mean, we knew that Travis Kelce was the top
tight end kind of like Brock Bowers is now for
so long, and then all of a sudden, Andrews emerged
(42:45):
down to the scene, and now those guys kind of
fall back in the pack. Travis Kelce, obviously newly engaged,
been the story of the last week, but it's also
been the story of the off season, of the poor
performance in the super Bowl. What's he going to do
for the upcoming season. I've been surprised in the drafts
that I've been in, Mike that and Ian, I don't
know if it's the case that you've seen as well.
(43:07):
Travis Kelsey hasn't been overdrafted in our leagues, and I
think everybody's kind of onto it, which makes me think
that wherever you get him, there's actually value to drafting him.
Speaker 5 (43:17):
Yeah, I think there's something to that. I've seen him
fall as well in pretty much every draft I've been in,
and I'm kind of just operating under the rule of
just I'm not touching him because last year. I feel
like going into last year into the season, you kind
of go in under the assumption that they kind of
keep him on ice until the playoffs. And he's only
(43:37):
a year older now. I don't see why that changes,
especially now he's got other distractions in his life as
we know.
Speaker 4 (43:43):
So i'd be curious, you know, if we can get
a true assessment of this offseason versus last, because I
mean they kind of went into hiding for the most part.
A couple of dinners, but not a lot of activity.
So was he back in the gym because last year
he was overseas right and center time and time again
as part of the ariostool right and and you'd see
(44:05):
him and he still had a great year for anybody
who's not named Travis kelcey. Except when it mattered right
the end. There's a spotlight of what four or five
plays from the Super Bowl that you can clearly just say, okay,
what are we doing here?
Speaker 3 (44:19):
Well?
Speaker 5 (44:19):
And the price to get him was like first round, second, No,
that's right, right, yeah, the fantasy price off it was huge.
But then you saw him, beer brought worths, all of
that stuff, and you know the only time he did
anything athletic was when he showed up in a tuxedo
to be part of.
Speaker 2 (44:36):
The dance act.
Speaker 4 (44:37):
And then we got into the year, and again great
numbers overall for most other tight ends that aren't of
his history. So I want to, I want to, I'm curious, right,
what was the off season regimen getting back to work?
Do you now have value as you know tight end
seven or eight or wherever he is down that list
(44:58):
for you, But certainly nobody's reaching right, there's Bowers, then
there's a round. Maybe the back end of the next
round is where you see McBride come off. And then
to your point, Dan, it becomes the all right, who
do you love most out of that next tier of guys?
Are you trusting that George Kittle's gonna stay upright for
a full seventeen?
Speaker 2 (45:18):
Again?
Speaker 5 (45:21):
I mean he's he's got the volume, but but that's
all that could also be seen as a negative for
Kittle because he's getting that much work.
Speaker 4 (45:28):
Well and at the run blocking that he does. Yeah, right,
he's still one of the few throwbacks in that regard.
So questions there, Hockinson. It goes back to the McCarthy
question we were asking a little bit earlier, and with
all those wide receiver weapons and and Aaron Jones, what's
the workload there? Laporta last year was the guy everybody
(45:50):
you know clamored for. Uh, if you didn't go down
the veteran route. And then there's there's just a bunch
of guys maybe a little bit of excitement for Tyler
Warren as as you know, a guy who just becomes
target one for Daniel Jones. Uh so I've seen.
Speaker 3 (46:06):
Him raft Harry, Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4 (46:08):
No, but you know what I mean, it's just that,
you know, look, we always talked about the running back
and the tight end being the great safety valve and
elixir for young quarterbacks.
Speaker 2 (46:17):
Also could be for guys.
Speaker 4 (46:18):
On their bad quarterbacks and last leg Yes.
Speaker 3 (46:23):
I look at a name like Dalton Kincaid is someone
who I was so high on for value wise for
for tight end, and I'd rather now take a flyer
on Tyler Warren.
Speaker 4 (46:36):
You know stouts back right where Kyle Pitts is being drafted, right,
he's being drafted as a mid tight end too. Well,
we know when things break right physically, how many guys
stand up to what he can do.
Speaker 5 (46:51):
At his best And like you said, he trusted, Like
you said earlier, it's just Drake London. There's no one
else so he has.
Speaker 4 (46:58):
Yeah, I mean we like our mclouds and other guys,
but in terms of four you know, guys at the forefront.
Speaker 3 (47:04):
Yeah, I would say this, and I would just I
go on a different direction with the Falcons, and you
guys know this because they feel that Pennix could have
a great year. I feel that the conversation about Kyle
Pitts is the fit into what they do because they
are a different team than when Kyle Pitts was drafted.
So even though Moody's hurt and I do like Ray
Ray McLeod, I think that he's.
Speaker 4 (47:26):
We've talked about him at Guy probably more than any
any other podcast or read.
Speaker 3 (47:30):
Yeah, I just think it's warranted with Pitts because I
just don't think that he does fit. I don't think
he fits in what they want to do. And that's
why I I mean, where he's falling, There's there's no
problem in taking him. Like you, there's just there's no
reason to reach on any of anything with Kyle Pitts.
But I just I will be surprised if people are
(47:52):
pleasantly surprised by taking him. I think that you at
least have to figure out another maybe a backup option
at tight end because I think there's a reason that
he's at the spot that he's at.
Speaker 4 (48:02):
Yeah, and you have a couple other guys when you know,
for curiosity's sake, whatever Mason Taylor becomes for the Jets,
you know, again being drafted as a back end too.
But again a guy in justin fields who I'm not
expecting him to wing it around, right, you're going to
run the football. He's going to run the football, and
(48:22):
it's going to be the short and intermediate game. So
death by a thousand cuts. See what I did. I
got Taylor Swift back into the show. But anyway, the
tight end position just gets really crowded, and we've seen
the push league wise the settings to where we're now
doing more of the wr tight end combo platter instead
(48:44):
of having an isolated tight end position for the very
fact that you only have a couple of guys that
people are clamoring for. And then there's all right, I'll
fill in that later. It's almost to where we're at
tight ends, kickers and defenses going in the fine three rounds.
Speaker 3 (49:01):
Well, Hey, full backs are coming back in the NFL,
so let's figure out different ways. Let's start drafting full backs.
That's hot and yes, let's uh maybe like that'll be
our plan for twenty twenty six in because we do
have big things coming up. There is something big coming up.
Mike Harmon is going to be appearing on Good Date Chicago.
That's on Friday, August twenty ninth. So if you get
(49:22):
an opportunity talking some fantasy football should be fun talking
to everybody in your home.
Speaker 4 (49:27):
City, getting back into hometown. I don't know if I'm
gonna wear the cutler Suresey or not or what that background?
Speaker 2 (49:34):
Do you?
Speaker 3 (49:35):
You gotta wear what your mom saved for good Mike,
this is a TV appearance actually done. So yes, that
got the.
Speaker 4 (49:41):
Shirt and tie combination that's been sitting in the back
of the closet for a while just for this moment.
Speaker 3 (49:47):
Oh man, we can't wait to We'll review that appearance
the next time that we get together and we'll be
talking about Week one. We'll be talking about Eagles, Cowboys
and so much more because the games are almost here. Guys.
This was fun breaking down the positions and we could
start talking about football games soon. How about that.
Speaker 2 (50:03):
Let's get it on.
Speaker 3 (50:04):
Let's do it all right for Ian Roddy and Mike
Carmen I'm Dan Bayer. That's been your wide receiver tennant
to wrap up right here on I want your flex
Ladies, you want experience during your football season, Well, buckle up,
sweet cheeks. We've got all the experience in the world.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
This is I want your Flex with Dan Byer and
Mike Harmon.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
Mike and Dan break down everything you need to set
your lineups, from position rankings to starts and sits. The
guys help you make those hard decisions. And now let's
get your flex ond. Here's Dan Bayer and Mike Harmon.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
Week one of the NFL season is fast approaching, but
we know that there are a lot of drafts still
to take place. We've covered the quarterbacks and running backs.
Now we're going to do the wide receivers. He is
Mike Harmon, I'm Dan Byer. Our executive producer is Ian Roddy.
But before we talk about the pass catchers in the
top ten ends, we have to talk about the biggest
news in the NFL. It's been a story all off season,
(00:55):
Mike and finally has reached the pinnacle of the New
cycle where Micah Parsons is dealt by the Dallas Cowboys
to the Green Bay Packers for two first round picks,
a defensive tackle Kenny Clark. The Stalemate, the Showdown, the duel,
however you wanted to say it is finally over. Micah
(01:16):
Parsons dealt by the Cowboys to the Green Bay Packers.
Speaker 4 (01:19):
Absolutely stunned on several levels. One that the Packers are
going to pay out that kind of money. Two, there's
no trade happening, there's nothing happening. And then oh, here's
the deal consummated, here's the money, just like that. So
never believe any of what you hear in this process.
But the curiosity of timing Jerry, going back on what
(01:42):
has been a long run business in terms of getting
it done in the eleventh hour, just two first round picks,
figured there would be a third, So maybe a little
bit of a distressed property kind of situation there. You
do get a three time pro bowler and Kenny Clark,
which is great anchor up that defensive line. And as
I've argued all along, Dan, the Cowboys are gonna lose
(02:06):
games with or without Micah Parsons. So if nothing else,
you got a couple of draft picks that, if you
spin it right, then you're you're rebuilding a team and
you're not paying a guy what is it, one hundred
and eighty eight million dollars You can go and do
some other things.
Speaker 3 (02:22):
It's the four year deal that he wanted. I think
that you're the perfect guy to also look at this
deal from this perspective. The deal that we compare this
to is the Khalil Mack trade from the Raiders to
the Bears. For those that don't remember the deal, it
was on September one to twenty eighteen that the Bears
(02:45):
got Khalil Mack, a second round pick in twenty twenty
and a conditional pick a fifth round pick in twenty twenty. Well,
the Raiders received two first in twenty twenty, a third
round pick in twenty twenty, and nineteen sixth round pick,
So you got the picks in twenty nineteen and in
(03:05):
twenty twenty. It does feel that the Bears gave up
a lot more than what Green Bay had to give up.
Mac then signed a six year deal where the one hundred
and forty one million dollars with the with the Bears
after that trade, but that's, you know, the the what
they got in return. Kenny Clark's a great player. But
(03:26):
I think it I lent to lean more on your
side of things, Mike, is why not just then just
get all draft picks. Don't try to sell it, Jerry
that you're trying to get Kenny Clark and trying to
stop there on and this is going to be a
good piece when you have Micah Parsons. There's very similar
dealings with the Mavericks, Lakers Luca trade as well with
this deal, but I just wish they would have just
(03:47):
gone all in with Picks. I don't think that they
needed an accomplished player as part of this deal. So
that's why I lean on your side of this. If
you're gonna lose, you might as well lose bad and
make those picks worth it. I don't for as good
as Kenny Clark is, I don't know if his better
days are ahead of him. I don't think that they are, right,
so then what's the point of bringing him in. I
just I didn't understand the deal for Dallas on that aspect.
Speaker 4 (04:10):
Yeah, I mean, you're looking at a guy who's got
still has a couple of years left on his deal.
Some decent money is at that tipping point of thirty
which we always always wonder, you know, how much longer
you're gonna be playing at an elite level. But in
the end, wins and losses. Yeah, you'll stop the run
slightly more effectively. But guess what, you don't have the
guy getting after the pass rush or after the passer
(04:33):
at this point, right, he gave up your attacker and
that's fine. Right Again, football philosophies of how you practice through.
I gotta wonder if Matt Eberfluz feels a little salty
now thinking he was going to be able to run
a defense that would have Michael Parsons out there. I mean,
if anything, for the Packers side of it, I mean,
(04:55):
you get a guy Khalil Mack had twelve and a
half sacks in that twenty eighteen, so he came in
and played and played well. You always are concerned if
a guy hasn't practiced to that point. But yeah, for
Jerry Jones, it's just that curiosity. I mean, you're a
middling team one way or another, and it's suddenly about
a couple of bucks, because that's the thing I think,
(05:17):
to pull it out back to the non football business
out of it. It almost seems like out of spite, right,
Mike did the I'm done scorched earth everything social media,
laying down on the table after eating some bad nachos.
All right, I'm casting as versions on the najas now,
but just all of that, and Jerry's like, no, it's negotiating.
(05:38):
We'll figure this out and in the end, if you're
to believe where the numbers were, And again Jerry didn't
give any specificity and when what he said, but kind
of talked that the numbers were pretty similar. So it
more seems like a all right, we took his personally
with Mugiletta and with Micah Parsons to walk away for
(05:59):
what might constitute just a slight bump, but more the
I win the principle of the matter.
Speaker 3 (06:07):
And he's I want to say this, I actually agree
with the Cowboys trading Michaeh Parsons to what you said,
and I think that we just don't think that Dallas
is going to be that competitive. Also, Mike, if you
can get future assets when maybe Philadelphia takes a step
back for once, as they're a defending Super Bowl champ style,
(06:27):
we expect them to be good. We expect Washington to
be good. Washington's probably gonna be good for the next
couple of years, but right now, a team that's climbing up.
If you're Dallas stagger it in a way, we're like, Okay,
maybe in a couple of years, when those top teams
in the NFL, those two maybe take a step back,
maybe it's easier for us in the NFC East. So
I am all for Dallas trying to look at the
(06:48):
future with all of this. I just don't understand Jerry
Jones essentially talking out of both sides of his mouth,
saying how great Micah Parsons was, how they thought they
had a deal in the spring with him, and then
now as they talk about the deal, they talk about
Kenny Clark, what they could do with the draft picks,
how they could move. It feels like he's having it
(07:08):
both ways and you can't either you thought he was
worth paying the money in April, or now you're looking
at it from the point that you just didn't want
to pay him that much. To me, it seems like
he's talking out of both sides of his mouth, where
if he were to just say, guess what, we couldn't
agree to terms on the money, so we just pivoted
in a direction that we thought was best for the
(07:29):
football team. I think that would have been a sufficient
explanation instead of trying to spin this tail on why
this tal e why they think that this is going
to work for the Cowboys.
Speaker 4 (07:39):
Wag the tail, spin the tail. You're absolutely right, it
all goes to it. And again from a football perspective,
I don't have a problem with it at all. Yes, again,
it's all going to be on Dak's arm how far
you're going, because they weren't a very good defensive team
when Mike had.
Speaker 2 (07:56):
Played right in Week one?
Speaker 4 (07:58):
Yeah, you beat the Browns yay, then you got drum
by the Saints, remember that, ah, and then you lose
to Baltimore, You beat the Giants, you get drubbed by Philadelphia,
you get drubbed by Houston, and we go all the
way on down the line. You're giving up a ton
of points. And I know there's some metrics to say,
look how much better they were, and look how great
(08:20):
they were with Mikeeh bottom line, as you're giving up
a load of points every damn week, so's thinking, yet
he's some difference maker. And you know we always talk
to you know, guys from Vegas. Whatever's what's he worth?
Half a win? Like it's as great a player as
he is and as much merch as he sells, and
I don't mean to, you know, denigrade him. He's a
(08:41):
he's a great player, doesn't doesn't win or lose your games.
So to not pay the one eighty eight one twenty
one thirty guaranteed differing numbers coming out like Jerry's just
owning up, It's like we finally made the business decision.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
We were done with this.
Speaker 3 (09:00):
I also find this interesting and this shows you the
value of the Dallas Cowboys. Now, as we're recording this podcast,
I'm back in the Midwest, back home in Wisconsin, and
this is a big deal around here for Green Bay
Packer purposes. Mike, there is zero chatter on x outside
(09:21):
of these borders of this state talking about how this
affects the Packers and puts them in a possible spot
to make it the Super Bowl sixty. It is all
about the Cowboys. It is all about Jerry Jones. And
that's the amazing thing, because I do think that this
move is magnificent for Green Bay in a division that
(09:42):
we feel is going to be very strong. Now they've
gotten another opportunity to be even better. You feel you
team up Micaeh Parsons with Rashan Gary and now Green
Bay is a legit if they weren't already a legit
Super Bowl contender to come out of the NFC, and
no one's talking about it. That's another crazy part of
it for me, is it's a really big deal here,
(10:03):
but I don't know in the other forty nine states
if that's the case, because all we're doing is talking
about the Cowboys and Jerry Jones.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (10:09):
I mean, it's not very sexy to talk about how
Mark Murphy's no longer the guy, so now it's ed policy. Yeah,
because under Mark Murphy, would this deal have gotten done.
I don't know that it would have, right, And I
think that was one of the big the last forty
eight to seventy two hours heading in and we saw
some smattering of Packers talk coming into the weekend ahead
(10:33):
of the current week that we're in, and it started
to build momentum. But it's just like, this doesn't seem
like a Packers thing because other than Reggie White all
those years ago, not big players in free agency and
not making big splashes with big dollar contract guys. So
for this to suddenly pop up on the radar and
we all know how much the Packers got from the
(10:54):
national deal four hundred and thirty two million dollars. Thank
you for that information based on the wave constructed. But
it's just a little different way of doing business and
pushing in on what your current roster has and giving
that vote of confidence. You know, I think it's absolutely fascinating.
Speaker 3 (11:13):
I'm going to wrap it up this way because we
do have wide receivers and tight ends to talk about.
When Reggie White was agreeing to a deal as a
free agent to sign with the Green Bay Packers. I
remember where I was, Okay, and I was here in
my hometown and just outside of it on Highway G
(11:36):
on my way to my aunt's house, driving past the
road where my other aunt lives Okay today, when the
Micah Parsons news broke, I was at my aunt's house
when this and I immediately had deja vu to thirty
plus years ago, like I am practically in the same
(11:57):
exact spot as you had this roundbreaking deal that really
changed the vision of the Green Bay Packers franchise when
Reggie White decides to sign with them in free agency,
because there wasn't free agency before that. Now you have
this move and I'm like, oh my goodness, like there
is something in the universe with this. But the Packers
get their big star. I think they're legit in the
(12:19):
NFC North. And now it's up to Jerry and Steven
to spin those two first round picks into something.
Speaker 4 (12:24):
Well, those are two guys you really trust to get
that done, now, aren't you?
Speaker 5 (12:28):
Two things that I want to ask you guys first
before we wrap up the segment, specifically Green Bay. Do
you have an issue with it being Green Bay because
if you remember, that's the team that destroyed them in
the playoffs the last time they were actually, you know,
a good team a couple of years ago. You just
gave them the guy who was your best player at
that time and it's you know, in the.
Speaker 3 (12:47):
NFC's That's what I was just gonna say. I'm surprised
that he went to an NFC team. Yeah, I mean,
there's only there are only so many teams that were
in the Micah Parsons sweepstakes, right, and so to have
it be in the NFC, And Jerry even said in
his press conference, the deal came. You know, these things
(13:08):
happened fast, They come down pretty quickly. It happened on
Thursday afternoon, that is the portion, So answer your question.
Surprised that it is in the NFC.
Speaker 4 (13:18):
I think the Packers part is interesting, just giving the
documentary and everything that he talked about how soul crushing
that loss was and the Jordan Love perfect passer rating and.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
All of that stuff.
Speaker 4 (13:30):
But yeah, it's I'm curious what the other offers were then,
because as you said, Dan, I mean, there's not only
not gonna be a lot of people that are coming
into the marketplace for a two hundred million dollars. Yeah,
Minebacker edge Rusher wherever we're highbreding because that was the
other part was you know, trying to figure out what
his classification is in terms of his position.
Speaker 2 (13:52):
But yeah, to decide to just.
Speaker 4 (13:55):
Pull here, I mean that speaks volumes of where you're
at as an organization, like you're reeling.
Speaker 5 (14:02):
And then the other the other thing I want to
ask you, guys, is fantasy wise for Dallas. Now, Mike,
you were saying, it doesn't really necessarily translate to wins
specifically for you know, Green Bay, or you know, necessarily
translating to more losses for Dallas because their defense would
have been bad anyway. But fantasy wise, how does this
help guys? Like George Pickens and Ceedee Lamb.
Speaker 4 (14:22):
Well, we've we alluded to it. We'll do it a
little more in the wide receivers and tight ends. But
all right, I mean you've been fully on board Dan
from day one with you know, Dak Prescott's winging around.
Speaker 3 (14:34):
I love it.
Speaker 4 (14:34):
You don't have it. You don't have a big running
back corps. Right, there's not a single guy there that
scares you. Your defense was already suspect. I mean, like
you were gonna give up twenty five or twenty six
a game. Now you're at twenty nine. Again, let's go
winging around a lot.
Speaker 3 (14:52):
But hey, they could stop the run. They could stop
the run. I I ian's answer your question. On my part,
I don't think that it affects it because I felt
that they already were going to be this team anyway
that has to score thirty five points a game to win.
So to Mike's point, maybe then how they just need
to score thirty eight to make sure that they win.
Speaker 5 (15:12):
Maybe I just I feel like he when you're talking
about one of the best defensive players in the entire league.
I just feel like it affects it a little more
like maybe maybe not in the grand scheme of the season,
like you were saying, wins losses wise, but just game
script and how you approach, you know, how the offense approaches,
how they attack you. It's just going to change, you know,
the amount you're throwing, the amount you're running going forward.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
So yeah, I think they could have been trailing a lot.
I think that's no surprise.
Speaker 4 (15:39):
Yeah, yeah, I think that's the thing, right, I think
they're now the NFC Bengals went without the star defensive player, right,
the Bengals still have Trey Hendrickson. What did that do
for him last year? Not a damn thing. What did
it do with Micah Parsons was other than we got
to watch him have you know, a dozen sacks and
run them up a little bit. They weren't good.
Speaker 5 (16:01):
I actually like that, Mike, because they've got a you know,
solid not Joe Burrow, not Joe Burrow, but they've got
dak In, a solid quarterback, and two good receivers.
Speaker 4 (16:09):
Really bad defense, right, I mean, we love Chase Brown
far more than anything, doubtless is running out at the
running back position. But you know, when we talk about receivers,
add Jake Ferguson into the mix. He got paid this
offseason Listoyo will be utilized. Yeah, I mean, I think
they're they're kind of the mirror. They're gonna have to
win shootout after shootout if they're going to try to
(16:29):
have any kind of advancement into January.
Speaker 3 (16:32):
I think they're gonna get crushed on Thursday night in
their opener and.
Speaker 2 (16:35):
Then this season's gonna minus seven.
Speaker 3 (16:38):
Yeah, I think that they're going to get Let's see,
there's a lot of there's a lot of emotion that
comes into those games. Certain teams work well with it,
certain teams don't. We've seen the Patriots when they were
in their dynasty. They you know, I remember lost an
opener to the Chiefs. It's not the it's not the
fail safe that you always think it is. But I
think that you're going to see a great effort from
(17:01):
Philadelphia and then Dallas can recover heading into week two.
Is it's just been a crazy offseason.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
So great.
Speaker 4 (17:07):
It's a week away and chaos ensues, and Smith and
I will be on air to watch it all destruct.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
It'll be good.
Speaker 3 (17:15):
He's Mike Carmon, that's Ian Roddy, our executive producer. I'm
Dan Byer. This is I want your flex. Let's talk
some fantasy. Now. We're going to get into the wide
receivers and tight ends and the guys that you got
to draft, yes in the next coming week as the
NFL season is approaching. That's next here, and I want
your flex. Let's talk about the guys who are going
to be catching passes. Maybe after this Micah Parsons deal,
(17:36):
Mike Ian is right that maybe Ceedee Lamb is now
wr one for everyone, considering the Cowboys are gonna have
to score thirty eight. I don't know. We we'll find
out the next ten minutes or so on if this
does change someone like Ceedee Lamb. But I think it
would be very, very hard pressed to knock Jamar Chase
from that number one spot when we're talking about the
top wide receivers in fantasy football.
Speaker 4 (17:58):
Yeah, I mean, as you talked about in mirrors between
conferences here, and I'll take Joe Burrow over Dak Prescott.
HM right in terms of being able to feed Jamar
Chase with that regularity as we watched so brilliantly last year,
and nothing's changed. I mean, it's gonna be the same
formula as much as they did all their massages, massaging
(18:22):
of contracts to get everybody squared away. The receiving core,
Hendrickson or whatever defense is still gonna be bad. You're
still gonna need to ramp up the offense. So yeah,
still chase ahead of Lamb. And then it starts to
get a little more into the fun and excitement about
debates because you got a bunch of guys where either
the offense is changed and coordinators change, young receivers like oh,
(18:44):
i'd like to see him do that again, and quarterbacks
that I don't know how much we trust him.
Speaker 3 (18:50):
Yes, And that leads me to a topic that I
don't think has been talked enough this offseason. And I
feel it's because at least during the training camps, Mike,
it's been because of Michael Parsons, it's been because of
Terry McLaurin, it's been because of Trey Andrickson. We're dealing
with all of that drama. But I do wonder about
JJ McCarthy in Minnesota and how that directly affects someone
(19:13):
like Justin Jefferson because I hate to say that maybe
we're underappreciating Sam Donald because I don't want to sound
like a Seahawks Homer now that he's on my team.
But I do think that there's a lot to ask
to fill the shoes that Donald did have in the
first ninety percent of the season, where we were calling
him an MVP candidate, And now you have JJ McCarthy
(19:35):
in there, which directly relates and correlates to performances by
Justin Jefferson.
Speaker 4 (19:40):
Yeah, I think Sam Donald. I think God short shrift
in that end of season run as well. I think
because of the collective media love of Kevin O'Connell as
a as a super genius, it became a well, he
couldn't have possibly game plan wrong, He couldn't have possibly
done anything in his sequencing that was wrong. It's clearly
(20:02):
all Sam Donald. He threw up on himself at a
big moment, which I completely disagree with the way we've
fallen over some of these guys GMS and coaches and whatever.
And this is the collective national media sometimes like no, no, no,
you can't put the spot like back on him, like
just because he's nice and he answers all media requests
and calls you sir and gives you a cup of
(20:22):
coffee when you walk in the door. And they like
you can ask him questions. I think Sam Donald got
screwed at the end of game.
Speaker 2 (20:28):
Was he great?
Speaker 4 (20:30):
No, But I don't think they did anything in terms
of scripting to put him in a chance to succeed.
So yeah, now JJ McCarthy's got to do it. We
haven't gotten to see much of him. He's down one
of his top options at least for the first couple
of weeks with Addison's suspension, So there's certainly questions. And
the Bears defense, for as much as we've blown a
(20:51):
lot of hot air towards the offense on the course
of the season, moves needles. We put the Bears on
the metal stand of thank yous for these summer months.
Smith and I at our show in the evening, thank
you for the content. I almost started singing like it
was an ABA song, thank you for the music. But
but the Bears defense should be pretty good by by
(21:13):
all accounts. So you know, he's got a tough test
right off the jump. And for Justin Jefferson, is McCarthy
the guy that's gonna force the ball? What did we
see in Michigan that ever said all right, he's gonna
he's gonna force it.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
No, he played within a system.
Speaker 4 (21:27):
So now it's gonna be a curiosity of all, right,
are you gonna be willing to force the ball into
double coverage where the safety is shading over, especially those
first couple of weeks where you don't have that secondary help.
Speaker 3 (21:41):
It's it's gonna really take guts to take someone not
named Ceedee Lamb or Jamar Chase above Justin Jefferson. But
if you did have those cohonists, like you like to say,
if you do have the balls to do it, is
there a name out there that you would take Mike
over Justin Jefferson, or names for people, or maybe looking
to go in a different direction at the wide receiver position.
Speaker 4 (22:03):
If you push me that way, I would look at
two young guys who succeeded greatly in spite of their
quarterback and team success because there was none the Giants
and the Jaguars. So I'm looking at Neighbors and Thomas
Junior as two elite guys that go up into that
next space. With the amount of production we got in
(22:27):
twenty twenty four with subpar quarterbacking, now you have in
theory and he whispered it when he said, Duval Cohen
there to go and fix Trevor Lawrence. Whatever you think
of Travis Hunter as a number two and the rest
of the depth chart there. I mean, Brian Thomas delivered
a year ago. There's no reason to believe suddenly he
takes a step back. Malik Neighbors as well. One of
(22:50):
those guys is going to be better than what they
were thrown out there last year at quarterback, right, even
if it ends up being Jamis trying to eat W's,
He'll wing the ball around and guys make plays. Jackson
Dart eventually gets his run in the interim, we get
the moon ball with Russ Wilson a bit so, Malik
Dabors and Brian Thomas would be those guys, and then
(23:10):
the third would be Nico Collins. In Houston, that offensive
line isn't much better. They've got a good defense, maybe
a great defense, but I think he had a bounce
back for CJ.
Speaker 2 (23:20):
Stroud, And again, who else are they throwing the ball to?
Speaker 3 (23:23):
Right? Yes, I feel that That's why I'd like Thomas
in Jacksonville. I know there's so much hype about Travis
Hunter and does seem like he's going to maybe have
more of a role on offense than he does on
defense to start out his career. But I was shocked
on this podcast to see the numbers last year that
Brian Thomas was putting up for Jacksonville. And I would
(23:46):
think in year two, I don't think there's going to
be a sophomore slump. And as crazy as it sounds,
I like Jacksonville's quarterback room better than say the Giants
quarterback room with neighbors. So neighbors may be more the
big name talent that we have. But if I'm taking
a receiver, if I'm taking an LSU receiver, yeah, as
(24:07):
crazy as it is, it's Brian Thomas.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
Yeah, it gets into that curiosity.
Speaker 4 (24:11):
And certainly, you know we've got the body of work
going back to Jefferson to the starting point of it all.
Like it it's awful hard to walk off there because
you're also not going to be razzed by your league.
Speaker 2 (24:23):
Mites, because that's the other part.
Speaker 4 (24:25):
You got to consider the psychological damage that your league
mates can do, particularly if there's an active message board
or texting service going on there. Dan, because if it
goes south for him, hey, the quarterback stunt the other
guys like he plays in Jacksonville.
Speaker 3 (24:40):
Yes, on, I know it's a great place to hide
until they become the world's team. There you go, that's
what I think that Travis Hunter is going to to
help bring the Jacksonville Jaguars. All right, let's move outside
of the top five, if you will. Let's get into
these next group of guys. I'm talking about the Drake London's,
(25:01):
the Lad mcconkey's, as crazy as it sounds, the Tyreek
Kills of the world. We did a top sixty draft
at the end of last season and I took one
for the team. I said, guys, I'm just gonna take
Tyree Kill because he continues to fall. We can't have
him fall out of the top sixty of our draft.
So I took him. But when we start to look
(25:21):
at this next level, like who are the guys that
you're like, Okay, I'm taking it better or I'm taking
him over Tyreek Kill. Who is in this next group
that you think could really stand out this season?
Speaker 2 (25:31):
Well, you imagined Drake London.
Speaker 4 (25:33):
He's a guy that we're anticipating, and we push all
in on Atlanta because even if Pennix fails at this point,
there's the break glass in case of emergency or he
gets hurt that Kirk Cousins at least as we sit
down to record, this is still there, whereas we don't
have that kind of level of confidence in virtually any
(25:53):
other room in terms of the backup. Right, the precipitous
drop off for most is there and a very real thing. McConkie,
like the others we mentioned when we talk about Thomas
and uh and going back to elite neighbors, they performed
without a lot of support in the receiving course, so
it's hard to believe that they don't shift.
Speaker 2 (26:16):
Now.
Speaker 4 (26:16):
It's curious, you know, I look at maconkie and I
think I'm on Ross Saint Brown a little bit the
same way is that their teams, you know in Detroit,
the team I alluded to at the beginning of things
with all right, you got a new OC, what's it
going to look like? He's still gonna catch a lot
of balls to move first move the chains? Now is
he gonna pop for big plays? Sure, there's gonna be
(26:38):
some broken tackles and scheme it up to where to
where he finds some daylight. But he's still going to
pile up receptions. So the half PPR PPR leagues. I
think Almon Ross Saint Brown still gets it done. But
in terms of pushing all in, I think you play
defense and run the football a bit more right. You
lose some of the gadgetary that Ben Johnson took with
(26:59):
him in Chicago, So I think the ceiling's lowered. Not
to mention Jamison Williams, who's you know in that mid
to late you know WR two, perhaps higher if you
want to push in on him that if you're going
to take the shots, he's going to be the beneficiary,
whereas a'man Ross, Saint Brown and Sam Laporta do a
lot of the dirty work over the middle, but don't
(27:20):
necessarily put up the huge fantasy stats this time around.
Speaker 3 (27:23):
Yeah, I thought it was not that this was a
blockbuster trade mic, But when the Lions dealt Tim Patrick
to the Jaguars last week, the only reason why it
just kind of popped up on my radar was not
because Islac Tesla or however we want to pronounce.
Speaker 2 (27:41):
We're gonna call him Tesla.
Speaker 3 (27:42):
He's electric.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
Once played by David Bowie in a movie, by the way.
Speaker 3 (27:48):
But I felt it was more of what you're saying
like we do have one of, if not the best
offensive lines in the NFL, even with losing our all
world center and right Greg Now it's a retirement in
the off season, I feel like he can be replaced,
and I feel that you're spot on with that running
game in terms of what the Detroit is doing there.
(28:10):
I find it interesting when you know with that Sam
Laporter discussion that we'll get to later of where the
tight ends get. But I agree with you, I don't
think it's going to be as much wheeling and free
wheelings as they were previously in Detroit with Ben Johnson
calling those shots.
Speaker 4 (28:25):
Well in the defense, if they're healthy, you don't have
to play the pinball game as they did at times. Right,
you can go more conservatively. Let's just run some clock,
grind it out, and go that way. So I think
that plays in.
Speaker 3 (28:38):
I'm going to give you the toughest, the toughest player
to draft as a wide receiver, Okay, I think it's
T Higgins, And the reason being is I feel that
you feel that there's this pot of gold at the
end of the rainbow because of what you get from
Cincinnati and there's as someone who has been a T
Higgins owner for the past couple of years, and Mike,
(29:00):
I don't know if he's been on your teams or
Ian I'm not sure if he's been on your teams.
It is so frustrating.
Speaker 5 (29:06):
It really is exactly where you're going, Yes.
Speaker 3 (29:09):
It is. It is so frustrating because the numbers are
there and the points are there, and you think, gosh,
why couldn't this just be more even, and so you
have such a tough time in judging because he is,
you know, legit a starting wide receiver in fantasy football.
There is no doubt about that. You think that there's
everything with it. But when you think of what could be,
(29:29):
I mean, this could be a top five, top ten guy.
T Higgins is my most frustrating guy to deal with
when we're talking about drafting and fantasy football.
Speaker 4 (29:37):
And I think it goes to, you know, one of
the background parts of it, like we put up rankings
and there's always just that giant astros that hangs out there.
Speaker 2 (29:44):
It's like, this is not a best ball competition.
Speaker 4 (29:47):
Sure, so while a guy may rank twelfth because like, alrighty,
we projects this many points week to week, you're gonna
live and die a little bit with that, because he's
not going to have the you know, the three touchdown
like you might have one of those, might might find
a second And if Jamar Chase goes down, then then
then maybe you get a little more love and the targets.
(30:08):
I mean, I'd be more likely just you know, there's
enough wide receiver depth there that I'll let him go
and then I'll eventually take yoshavsh and put him on
my bench. Sure, right, WR five, and if it breaks right,
he's still getting a decent target share per week.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
And now he's my WR three with a bullet.
Speaker 3 (30:29):
It's it's such a it's you feel like, oh, he's
gonna maybe he'll dig into Jamar Chase's numbers. No, it's
not gonna happen.
Speaker 2 (30:39):
Help him a player though, Yeah, right, I mean you
look at it.
Speaker 4 (30:44):
Last year, right, seventy three targets, which is just one
off a career high both twenty one and twenty two.
Speaker 2 (30:51):
Seventy four catches target.
Speaker 4 (30:53):
Count outside of twenty twenty three, or he played twelve games,
which he did again in twenty twenty four, but target
count has been the same four of his five NFL seasons,
which is just insane. Yeah, and then nine hundred and
eleven yards. He did have a career at best ten touchdowns.
But again, you know, if you're going to have to
(31:13):
be touchdown dependent, it's a very dangerous way to live.
Speaker 3 (31:17):
To look at our wide receivers. We're going to touch
out a few more guys coming up after the break,
and then we'll get into the tight end conversation as well.
He's Ian Roddy, our executive producer. The voice he hears
Mike Harmon hit him up on ext swollen dome. I'm
Dan Byer. This is I Want Your Flex more receiver
and tight end talk next, wrapping up this episode of
(31:38):
I Want Your Flex. Talking about some wide receivers. There's
one name that I've stayed away from in my drafts.
And remember a couple of years ago, Mike I was
high on Brandon Cooks and and it just did not
work out for me. This is when Cooks was with
the Texans. I was doubling up on him. In leagues.
I've played a couple of different leagues, one standard once
(31:59):
half point PPR. We talk a lot about in our rankings.
We're looking at this from a half point PPR situation.
There's one player I've completely stayed away from that. I've
had multiple times to draft and he's not Tyreek Hill
at someone else. And then there's another player that I've taken,
just one player I've taken in both drafts. The player
I've stayed away from Puka and Nakula. I've stayed away
from Pooka and Akua. Our executive producer, Ian Roddy wants
(32:21):
to know more about why we're staying away from poqua Akua.
The guy doubled up Jerry Judy Cleveland Browns now value wise,
I wasn't reaching on Judy, but the value I felt
with Judy was great. I was not comfortable taking Puoka
as high as he was in the rankings in my
two drafts.
Speaker 4 (32:38):
Yeah, Judy being drafted as a mid to low end
three or later, depending on how much you really want
to delve into the Cleveland Browns situation. Certainly, we've had
a lot of fun with the quarterback spot. But a
guy who had one hundred and forty five targets twelve
hundred yards a year ago. You know the old rule
of thumb that someone's gonna catch the ball, all right,
(33:02):
there's a lot of targets, so there's a lot of
carries that are out there, no question about it. So
for talking value AD and perception versus reality, Yeah, I
mean that's great value where he is down there, because
even if Dylan Gabriel and eventually shod Or Sanders, Uh,
Deshaun Watson maybe uh, and Bailey Zappi and whoever else
(33:23):
may come creeping out of the stands.
Speaker 2 (33:25):
Uh, they're gonna throw the ball up for grabs.
Speaker 4 (33:27):
And so long as he's healthy, which was one of
the things that affected his run in Denver, as long
as he's healthy, he'll be out there to go and
run and run under it.
Speaker 2 (33:35):
But pukin Dakua.
Speaker 4 (33:36):
Guy, it's just so difficult based on this style I
think they want to play. But also is Matthew Stafford
going to be upright? Like what's is over under on games?
I have no idea. You know, I'm a Jimmy Garoppolo
truther to a point, but you're not gonna be winging
it around now. Nakula may in a half point or
full PPR mode, you'll pick up those eight catch games
(34:01):
for forty yards. Like, there's gonna be a couple of those,
I guarantee. But in terms of a week to week
pop as the sixth or seventh wide receiver off the board.
That is just too difficult, And especially if I got
to worry every time Matthew Stafford is getting scraped up
off of the ground that that may be the last
one for the year. Now, we could say that about
a lot of quarterbacks, but for a guy who basically
(34:22):
didn't practice the whole off season and now we're gonna
roll him out there, I have full respect for the
guy because he'll stand in and take the hit and
make the throw, get the timing right, whatever. But eventually,
you know, father time comes from us. It adds up it.
Speaker 3 (34:37):
Because of how we feel about Puka, I think everything.
The same thing could be said for DeVante Adams as well,
just on a lesser point because it's so dependent of Stafford.
And now does Stafford have any chemistry with Devanta Adams.
I mean, Stafford hadn't been there for a decent amount
of training camp, like I DeVante Adams. I fell into
(34:57):
drafting DeVonta Adams because there was just no one left
that I felt that couldn't match what he could possibly do.
But yet I don't even necessarily know what to expect
from DeVonta Adams. So I have the same questions just
on a different level about DeVonta Adams that I do
with Pukah.
Speaker 4 (35:12):
Yeah, but where you're drafted Adams, right, you get into
the mix the aforementioned you know Baltimore. Here is Tyreek
Hill that you brought up, right, because he's kind of
that line of demarcation of those next guys. You know,
do you trust what's going on with the Jets? I mean,
Ian Garrett Wilson's an all world talent? How often is
(35:32):
he seeing the ball on a week to week basis?
Speaker 5 (35:34):
He's their wide receiver one, two, and three right now,
There's there's no one else.
Speaker 4 (35:38):
Right, So like, but do I trust that that that's
gonna yield a weekly benefit to me?
Speaker 3 (35:44):
No?
Speaker 4 (35:45):
I'd rather go and invest in brayln Allen later and
stay in the run game there for the Jets. The
other wide receivers, Mike Evans, he adopted some of that
TB twelve training this offseason, so he's gonna live and
play forever. Terry McLaurin deal, okay, And then this is
where we start getting into that weird space. Marvin Harrison Junior,
(36:06):
DJ Moore, Ted McMillan in Carolina, how much do you
believe in Canalis and Bryce Young this next year? And
then go back to Denver where they got a lot
of miles to feed between the running backs and the
wide receivers. Courtland Sutton, what's the ceiling on him on
a week to week basis or does he know play
decoy at times? So trying to create some separation there
(36:28):
in your fantasy rankings with these guys and DeVante Adams
is a very difficult proposition.
Speaker 3 (36:33):
Yeah, it absolutely is. As we go further down the
list of just guys that stand out, I mentioned a
guy like Jerry Judy, There's other names that are in
that group. Romadonza in Chicago, second guy to DJ Moore,
a lot of w R two's on their own teams
in that same area. Who's the name that stands out
(36:56):
to you, Mike?
Speaker 4 (36:57):
We talked about it a little bit Abuca in Tampa.
I'm a Baker believer that they're going to put up
numbers and that's just going to keep going, and he's
going to have a huge role. He's one of those
guys that if you really wanted to get cheeky with
your offensive Rookie of the Year kind of projections. He
may be able to put up numbers enough in that
(37:17):
offense to make a run for it. So he was
he would be a guy I'd be looking at another
because look now it's going to sound like I'm trying
to be a Buckeye fan.
Speaker 2 (37:29):
But Chris a Lave there in New Orleans.
Speaker 3 (37:31):
That's okay, right, because that's all they got, Yes.
Speaker 2 (37:34):
All right.
Speaker 4 (37:34):
I mean, whether it's Chuck and or Rattler keeps the
job for an extended period, what else do they have.
It's Alvin Kamara and it's Chris a Lave. Between them,
they should be touching the ball forty times a game.
Speaker 3 (37:47):
Mm hmm, yeah, I agree, there's i they're gonna be
down twenty eight to three, so let's just it's going
to be fourth quarter Saints fun with christ a Lave.
I've always loved Rashid Shahid.
Speaker 2 (38:00):
Yeah, it was fun.
Speaker 3 (38:01):
So you may you may have to wait until you
know later on in the in the day to enjoy
your your guys, meaning that if it's a let's say
one o'clock Eastern time kick when the Saints are down
by twenty points in the fourth quarter, but I think
that there could be legitimate points in those in those spots.
Speaker 4 (38:18):
Yeah, and for my you know, shameless homerism, h picking
a guy if look Cal Williams getting his four thousand
and thirty touchdowns or whatever nonsense seventy percent completion that
that they're trying to throw out there. Luther Burden's a
guy that has won a lot of people over with
the way he's gone about his work ethic. Because one
(38:39):
thing we know with Ben Johnson and with Antoine Randall
l is if you're a physical wide receiver, you're getting
on the field. And this is a guy that runs
through people on blocks and will get you know, be
part of plays where it's not designed for his number
that's going to get win him over. And from all
reports in camp and even Greg Olsen to throw it
(39:00):
up into the telecast when they did that Sunday night,
did the Fox game, right, was you know talking about
it is like, well, we were told he's he's the
guy that they've got their eye on. So he got
to let the cat out of the back. I don't
know if he was supposed to say, but he did.
H So that's something to watch as we go forward.
But yeah, those second and third receivers in a lot
(39:21):
of rooms. Man, the variability in drafts that I've seen
is absolutely staggering.
Speaker 5 (39:27):
Mike, of those of those three Chicago receivers, Dj Moore,
Luther burd and Roman Duonsay, and you know throwing Colston
Lovelin too, how do you stack those guys up?
Speaker 2 (39:36):
Are you avoiding any I don't think there's one to avoid.
Speaker 4 (39:40):
I think Dj Moore I might have to draft a
little earlier than I want to. Like I think with
Roman Duneesay, there was enough, There was enough noise around
his rookie season that people are going to be scared
away that you might get a potential value. He had
some good weeks right that, Like there were there were
moments and Dj Moore stepping out of bounds and walking
off the field. That is is never gonna to be
(40:00):
forgotten in Chicago. But like I think, from the pecking order,
as you lay it out, it sits there. And then
you got Cole Comet, who's still enough of a factor.
I mean, we think Loveland takes the lion's share of
those kinds of situational targets. But it is curious do
I avoid them?
Speaker 2 (40:20):
No? But I think more at that ADP.
Speaker 4 (40:24):
He's in that range with McLaurin and all those guys,
I'd rather have them.
Speaker 3 (40:29):
That's a look at the wide receivers, because we have
to get to the tight ends. It feels like it's
Brock Bauers, Trey McBride, and I hate to say everybody else,
but that's kind of where we're at. Do you see
Bauers on his own tier and then and then McBride next,
and everybody else? How do you break down this tight
end position?
Speaker 4 (40:47):
Yeah, I think there's some curiosity. You know, McBride last year,
fantastic week to week, but absolutely invisible in the painted grass,
right and that, And that's the question. Some theories about, hey,
Kyler Murray can't make that throw because he can't see it,
which maybe, I mean, go to the old Doug Flutie
(41:09):
jump ass if you need to down low. But all
of that to say, yeah, I mean I think there's
that separation. I mean, Bowers and you get a guy
like Geno Smith, you know, a you know, we we
joke about the Geno ratio. So Gino Smith had to
leave so Suarez could live on the baseball side in Seattle.
But Gino Smith is a good quarterback, Brock, They've got
(41:33):
some depth. I don't know what happens with Jacoby Myers,
whether you know they chip him off a couple extra
dollars to make him happy. But it kind of goes
to even in a subpar year, look how great powers.
Speaker 5 (41:45):
Was Bowers was that good with Aidan O'Connell throwing him
the ball. So now you have Geno Smith, who we
know is at least competent.
Speaker 4 (41:52):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, there's the Aidan O'Connell slander. Guy can't
even wave one finger back at you right now.
Speaker 3 (42:00):
I'll tell you what. I'm right there with Ian on that.
There are so many Raider fans that thought he was
the answer. Oh my goodness.
Speaker 2 (42:07):
I just wanted to see the little Purdue guy do good.
Speaker 4 (42:10):
But conference man, No, But like it was the is
he going to be serviceable?
Speaker 2 (42:16):
Right? Not great? Yeah, And Bauers showed.
Speaker 4 (42:20):
To that point like it didn't matter. He was going
to find the ball.
Speaker 3 (42:24):
I love the spots of the tight ends because I
so am curious on where Travis Kelce goes. I am
so curious on where guys like Mark Andrews go because
these are the names that just a couple of years ago.
I mean, we knew that Travis Kelce was the top
tight end kind of like Brock Bowers is now for
so long, and then all of a sudden, Andrews emerged
(42:45):
down to the scene, and now those guys kind of
fall back in the pack. Travis Kelce, obviously newly engaged,
been the story of the last week, but it's also
been the story of the off season, of the poor
performance in the super Bowl. What's he going to do
for the upcoming season. I've been surprised in the drafts
that I've been in, Mike that and Ian, I don't
know if it's the case that you've seen as well.
(43:07):
Travis Kelsey hasn't been overdrafted in our leagues, and I
think everybody's kind of onto it, which makes me think
that wherever you get him, there's actually value to drafting him.
Speaker 5 (43:17):
Yeah, I think there's something to that. I've seen him
fall as well in pretty much every draft I've been in,
and I'm kind of just operating under the rule of
just I'm not touching him because last year. I feel
like going into last year into the season, you kind
of go in under the assumption that they kind of
keep him on ice until the playoffs. And he's only
(43:37):
a year older now. I don't see why that changes,
especially now he's got other distractions in his life as
we know.
Speaker 4 (43:43):
So i'd be curious, you know, if we can get
a true assessment of this offseason versus last, because I
mean they kind of went into hiding for the most part.
A couple of dinners, but not a lot of activity.
So was he back in the gym because last year
he was overseas right and center time and time again
as part of the ariostool right and and you'd see
(44:05):
him and he still had a great year for anybody
who's not named Travis kelcey. Except when it mattered right
the end. There's a spotlight of what four or five
plays from the Super Bowl that you can clearly just say, okay,
what are we doing here?
Speaker 3 (44:19):
Well?
Speaker 5 (44:19):
And the price to get him was like first round, second, No,
that's right, right, yeah, the fantasy price off it was huge.
But then you saw him, beer brought worths, all of
that stuff, and you know the only time he did
anything athletic was when he showed up in a tuxedo
to be part of.
Speaker 2 (44:36):
The dance act.
Speaker 4 (44:37):
And then we got into the year, and again great
numbers overall for most other tight ends that aren't of
his history. So I want to, I want to, I'm curious, right,
what was the off season regimen getting back to work?
Do you now have value as you know tight end
seven or eight or wherever he is down that list
(44:58):
for you, But certainly nobody's reaching right, there's Bowers, then
there's a round. Maybe the back end of the next
round is where you see McBride come off. And then
to your point, Dan, it becomes the all right, who
do you love most out of that next tier of guys?
Are you trusting that George Kittle's gonna stay upright for
a full seventeen?
Speaker 2 (45:18):
Again?
Speaker 5 (45:21):
I mean he's he's got the volume, but but that's
all that could also be seen as a negative for
Kittle because he's getting that much work.
Speaker 4 (45:28):
Well and at the run blocking that he does. Yeah, right,
he's still one of the few throwbacks in that regard.
So questions there, Hockinson. It goes back to the McCarthy
question we were asking a little bit earlier, and with
all those wide receiver weapons and and Aaron Jones, what's
the workload there? Laporta last year was the guy everybody
(45:50):
you know clamored for. Uh, if you didn't go down
the veteran route. And then there's there's just a bunch
of guys maybe a little bit of excitement for Tyler
Warren as as you know, a guy who just becomes
target one for Daniel Jones. Uh so I've seen.
Speaker 3 (46:06):
Him raft Harry, Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4 (46:08):
No, but you know what I mean, it's just that,
you know, look, we always talked about the running back
and the tight end being the great safety valve and
elixir for young quarterbacks.
Speaker 2 (46:17):
Also could be for guys.
Speaker 4 (46:18):
On their bad quarterbacks and last leg Yes.
Speaker 3 (46:23):
I look at a name like Dalton Kincaid is someone
who I was so high on for value wise for
for tight end, and I'd rather now take a flyer
on Tyler Warren.
Speaker 4 (46:36):
You know stouts back right where Kyle Pitts is being drafted, right,
he's being drafted as a mid tight end too. Well,
we know when things break right physically, how many guys
stand up to what he can do.
Speaker 5 (46:51):
At his best And like you said, he trusted, Like
you said earlier, it's just Drake London. There's no one
else so he has.
Speaker 4 (46:58):
Yeah, I mean we like our mclouds and other guys,
but in terms of four you know, guys at the forefront.
Speaker 3 (47:04):
Yeah, I would say this, and I would just I
go on a different direction with the Falcons, and you
guys know this because they feel that Pennix could have
a great year. I feel that the conversation about Kyle
Pitts is the fit into what they do because they
are a different team than when Kyle Pitts was drafted.
So even though Moody's hurt and I do like Ray
Ray McLeod, I think that he's.
Speaker 4 (47:26):
We've talked about him at Guy probably more than any
any other podcast or read.
Speaker 3 (47:30):
Yeah, I just think it's warranted with Pitts because I
just don't think that he does fit. I don't think
he fits in what they want to do. And that's
why I I mean, where he's falling, There's there's no
problem in taking him. Like you, there's just there's no
reason to reach on any of anything with Kyle Pitts.
But I just I will be surprised if people are
(47:52):
pleasantly surprised by taking him. I think that you at
least have to figure out another maybe a backup option
at tight end because I think there's a reason that
he's at the spot that he's at.
Speaker 4 (48:02):
Yeah, and you have a couple other guys when you know,
for curiosity's sake, whatever Mason Taylor becomes for the Jets,
you know, again being drafted as a back end too.
But again a guy in justin fields who I'm not
expecting him to wing it around, right, you're going to
run the football. He's going to run the football, and
(48:22):
it's going to be the short and intermediate game. So
death by a thousand cuts. See what I did. I
got Taylor Swift back into the show. But anyway, the
tight end position just gets really crowded, and we've seen
the push league wise the settings to where we're now
doing more of the wr tight end combo platter instead
(48:44):
of having an isolated tight end position for the very
fact that you only have a couple of guys that
people are clamoring for. And then there's all right, I'll
fill in that later. It's almost to where we're at
tight ends, kickers and defenses going in the fine three rounds.
Speaker 3 (49:01):
Well, Hey, full backs are coming back in the NFL,
so let's figure out different ways. Let's start drafting full backs.
That's hot and yes, let's uh maybe like that'll be
our plan for twenty twenty six in because we do
have big things coming up. There is something big coming up.
Mike Harmon is going to be appearing on Good Date Chicago.
That's on Friday, August twenty ninth. So if you get
(49:22):
an opportunity talking some fantasy football should be fun talking
to everybody in your home.
Speaker 4 (49:27):
City, getting back into hometown. I don't know if I'm
gonna wear the cutler Suresey or not or what that background?
Speaker 2 (49:34):
Do you?
Speaker 3 (49:35):
You gotta wear what your mom saved for good Mike,
this is a TV appearance actually done. So yes, that
got the.
Speaker 4 (49:41):
Shirt and tie combination that's been sitting in the back
of the closet for a while just for this moment.
Speaker 3 (49:47):
Oh man, we can't wait to We'll review that appearance
the next time that we get together and we'll be
talking about Week one. We'll be talking about Eagles, Cowboys
and so much more because the games are almost here. Guys.
This was fun breaking down the positions and we could
start talking about football games soon. How about that.
Speaker 2 (50:03):
Let's get it on.
Speaker 3 (50:04):
Let's do it all right for Ian Roddy and Mike
Carmen I'm Dan Bayer. That's been your wide receiver tennant
to wrap up right here on I want your flex
Hosts And Creators
Jason Smith
Mike Harmon
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
New Heights with Jason & Travis Kelce
Football’s funniest family duo — Jason Kelce of the Philadelphia Eagles and Travis Kelce of the Kansas City Chiefs — team up to provide next-level access to life in the league as it unfolds. The two brothers and Super Bowl champions drop weekly insights about the weekly slate of games and share their INSIDE perspectives on trending NFL news and sports headlines. They also endlessly rag on each other as brothers do, chat the latest in pop culture and welcome some very popular and well-known friends to chat with them. Check out new episodes every Wednesday. Follow New Heights on the Wondery App, YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to new episodes early and ad-free, and get exclusive content on Wondery+. Join Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts or Spotify. And join our new membership for a unique fan experience by going to the New Heights YouTube channel now!
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.