Mark Mitchell and Ginny Andersen joined Mike Hosking to dig into the biggest political stories of the week so far.
On the agenda:
Police Commissioner Andrew Coster will be gone by April - not seeking a second term in the role.
And what’s happening with the layers of health management?
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Politics Wednesday. Mark Mitchell and Ginny Anderson are both well,
that's good morning lady Mike. Now Mark Mark Mark, Yeah,
the pain level that you're feeling at the moment, is
it still there? Because the reported was first of all
was Andrew Saville. This is Ginny if you don't know this,
this is the rugby of the weekend. So we're at
a charity rugby event in Russell. Andrew Savill, the sports
(00:23):
reporters there. Mark's there. The claim from Andrew Saville was
you made one tackle, put your back out and walked off.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
True, there's half a truth in that. Look, No, it
wasn't me. He got me mixed up with Jonesy. Jonesy
went out after the first ruck. But my first teainger
was with Tane Randall. You always come away feeling that,
But no, I stayed on. I played about probably twenty
twenty five minutes. It was a great game. Huge shout
out to Ricky Jane from the Juke of my Broman.
(00:51):
They were the driving force behind this. It was a
fantastic weekend for Northland and you know we just want
to do it again.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
Did you pull up all right?
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Yeah? I did? I mean I was told that if
I played, I wasn't allowed to complain about injuries, right,
So but yes, no I did. The ribs are a
little bit, particularly betther than that.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
I'm fine, Well are you fit?
Speaker 3 (01:09):
Are you?
Speaker 1 (01:10):
I looked at those people, Let's be honest back, and
I'm not being sexist about that. There's some pretty fat out.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
Of fit looking at you.
Speaker 1 (01:15):
I mean, honestly, there were some people there that shouldn't
be doing physical exercise and at a certain age.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Isn't it like you can include me in that break?
Don't worry about that. I know that I've a fitness
but look, it was it was actually a really good game.
We had quite a few weeks all picks in there,
and the crowd seemed to really enjoy it, and of
course the hometown heroes had a good one, so that
was great.
Speaker 1 (01:38):
Okay, cool, Now serious matters cost her. He's on his
way out. Did you get rid of them at last?
Speaker 2 (01:42):
Or not? No? No, I just think that he's He
and I had a conversation that will remain confidential and
out of respect for him, but he's clearly come out
and indicated that he won't be sending seeking an extension
on his term, which finishes in April next year.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Fair enough, Ginny or not?
Speaker 3 (02:01):
Sorry I couldn't catch your back.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
Fair enough or not that cost is going well.
Speaker 3 (02:05):
I don't think they made a good match. They have
different different perspectives on how to resolve Lauren or in
New Zealand. I think they work together as best they could,
but fundamentally they come from quite different points of view
and so I think it was always going to be
a tough match.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
Would you still defend him as a police commissioner? I
mean it wasn't your appointment. It was a dourn slash nash.
You came in afterwards, But did you see at the
time as a solid appointment or not.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
Yeah, he's a smart guy and he had the best
interests of New Zealand at heart, and things like Refrain
that he wanted to see in place would have set
the police up for another ten years. For shame that
he wasn't able to achieve that right.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
Talk to me, try and keep this as a political
as possible. And this is health and this is the
layers in management and all the problems in health at
the moment. But what Luxon said on Monday about not
having an understanding or getting an understanding of numbers, expenditure,
line of sight on an astonishing amount of money. Can
you understand that or explain how the public service gets
(03:04):
that jerry manned backward and hopeless?
Speaker 3 (03:11):
First look, I think they've had to come cling that.
That's what they've said is not true. There's not fourteen
layers they're including.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
Uh, forget to fourteen, twelve, eleven or whatever. It is
the fact that it's a mess. It's an indisputable mess.
How does it become a mess like that?
Speaker 3 (03:30):
Well, you had multiple different dhvs across New Zealand that
really were a mess. You had different standards of healthcare
and different parts of New Zealand because you had a
regionally based system, and to bring it under one and
try and have consistency so no matter where someone gets
cancer they get the same level of treatment. That has
to be brought together. And that's what the reforms that
(03:53):
that we did that were Underwagh and in place. And
it's a real shame that some of that work is
being unpicked and the problem is they haven't funded it.
If you want to talk about what's what's a mess?
A meiss is putting a hiring freeze on doctors and
they're not being enough doctors in New Zealand.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
That's thirty billion dollars. How much more do you want?
Speaker 3 (04:15):
We have had record numbers of immigration and most people
have come into New Zealand and New Zealand's history over
the last year, and we are trying to provide services
to more people with the same amount of funding when
they're coming in. And this is what's putting massive pressure
on our health system. It was just coming to terms
(04:36):
worth getting through a global pandemic and then we've got
slammed with additional people who require services and so how
you do that is a difficult solution. But cutting the
budget is not the answer.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
Mark your side of the health story.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
So I just think that Labor created a bohemoth. I
think labor's good at creating bureaucracy. There's massive layers of
management and their nationals comes in and has to recalibrate
and get services and the best backing up to the
front lines. Lab they don't know how to deliver the
services to people. When you look at the caucus, they
don't have anyone you've actually had to do that real off,
(05:09):
so you know this is and now we're having to
unrevel it all and it's difficult, and right, we're just
getting on with it.
Speaker 1 (05:15):
Jinny, Listen to this. This is lux and working you
through the fourteen layers. Listen that a patient it interacts
with a team member. A team member reports the team supervisor,
who reports the team leader.
Speaker 4 (05:25):
The team leader reports to the assistant manager. The assistant
manager reports to the manager, who reports the service manager,
who then reports to the general manager. The general manager
might be asking who do they report to? Will they
report to the group director of operations, and of course
they report to the regional director, the national director, eventually
the chief of staff, then the chief executive, and of
course they report to the chair on the board.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
Can you defend that?
Speaker 3 (05:46):
I can certain that they should have funded it in
March when the knew it ran out of money, and
that would be a better thing than giving technicap to
the tobacco lobby.
Speaker 1 (05:53):
So you so you're still arguing that more money is required,
even when you've got that line that lineup.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
I think you need to look at how the health
system works. And if you're going to do it in
one minute and question time, then it's a joke. So
there's complexities. But the point is that there's no doctors
in the Hut Valley because of the cuts, and we
have people queuing up for a Tali health session who
need medical attention.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
You can last.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
Isn't the answer to that, though, Ginny. Fewer managers and
more actual doctors and Nurse's.
Speaker 3 (06:24):
Right, Let's let's see how they do with that, because
with less money and trying to cut services, it's the
front line because you need people in place to be
able to put that support and if you want doctors operating,
and you're going to cut all that away and cutting
up to two thousand jobs already in health, Let's see
how they go, because I have that the frontline is
(06:48):
not going to be done. But he used to run
an airline. I'm sure you're doing a great job of
reforming at health.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
That's right, that's right. He has running the line and
he understandings.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
Into the ground three times for a wail out.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
And he understands the responsibility customers that actually had to deliver,
and he just laid out and articulated very well. Layers
and layers and layers of managers. We'd rather have doctors
and nurses on the front.
Speaker 3 (07:10):
Lne look to get them back go and get the
doctors there because.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
They're allways well well and you want to vest more
money into more managers, which is exactly Labour's approach was
exactly why we find ourselves in the current position that
we do as a country.
Speaker 1 (07:22):
Quick comment mark on emergency response. I'm reading a report
yesterday and I can't, for the life of me remember
what it was called. But back when late twenty fourteen
they were going to have some sort of group Victoria
and Australia's got it, they never got around to it.
Local agencies didn't want to share information. The upshot is
that they are claiming in Hawks Bay that I Gabriel
happened again, there would be no difference in response because
(07:44):
basically emergency response can't get their act together. Is that true?
Speaker 2 (07:49):
No, I don't agree with it. Since I've been in
Ministers in the last seven months, I've had four local
states of emergency. We've had we've had floods, we've had fires,
we've had earthquakes, we've had space whether, we've had CrowdStrike
and no one's waiting. I received a report from Siderior
Matter Prie in terms of the work that we need
to do to make our system more resilient, but no
one's waiting for that. And I've been on the ground
(08:10):
at every single one of those and the response has
been outstanding. So no, we've got amazing people that do
this work. We need to get the legislation done and
that will codefine support the entire ecosystem in terms of
how we respond. But there's been really good progress made
over the last seven months, certainly, you know. That's what
I'm sing seen right from the mayors and the chief
(08:32):
executives right through the whole emergency management sort of sector.
Everyone is working really well together, all right.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
I'm encouraging to hear make appreciate time, Jinny Anders, appreciate
yours as well. Politics Wednesday.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
For more from the Mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to
news talks there'd be from six am weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio.
Politics Wednesday. Mark Mitchell and Ginny Anderson are both well,
that's good morning lady Mike. Now Mark Mark Mark, Yeah,
the pain level that you're feeling at the moment, is
it still there? Because the reported was first of all
was Andrew Saville. This is Ginny if you don't know this,
this is the rugby of the weekend. So we're at
a charity rugby event in Russell. Andrew Savill, the sports
(00:23):
reporters there. Mark's there. The claim from Andrew Saville was
you made one tackle, put your back out and walked off.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
True, there's half a truth in that. Look, No, it
wasn't me. He got me mixed up with Jonesy. Jonesy
went out after the first ruck. But my first teainger
was with Tane Randall. You always come away feeling that,
But no, I stayed on. I played about probably twenty
twenty five minutes. It was a great game. Huge shout
out to Ricky Jane from the Juke of my Broman.
(00:51):
They were the driving force behind this. It was a
fantastic weekend for Northland and you know we just want
to do it again.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
Did you pull up all right?
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Yeah? I did? I mean I was told that if
I played, I wasn't allowed to complain about injuries, right,
So but yes, no I did. The ribs are a
little bit, particularly betther than that.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
I'm fine, Well are you fit?
Speaker 3 (01:09):
Are you?
Speaker 1 (01:10):
I looked at those people, Let's be honest back, and
I'm not being sexist about that. There's some pretty fat out.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
Of fit looking at you.
Speaker 1 (01:15):
I mean, honestly, there were some people there that shouldn't
be doing physical exercise and at a certain age.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Isn't it like you can include me in that break?
Don't worry about that. I know that I've a fitness
but look, it was it was actually a really good game.
We had quite a few weeks all picks in there,
and the crowd seemed to really enjoy it, and of
course the hometown heroes had a good one, so that
was great.
Speaker 1 (01:38):
Okay, cool, Now serious matters cost her. He's on his
way out. Did you get rid of them at last?
Speaker 2 (01:42):
Or not? No? No, I just think that he's He
and I had a conversation that will remain confidential and
out of respect for him, but he's clearly come out
and indicated that he won't be sending seeking an extension
on his term, which finishes in April next year.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Fair enough, Ginny or not?
Speaker 3 (02:01):
Sorry I couldn't catch your back.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
Fair enough or not that cost is going well.
Speaker 3 (02:05):
I don't think they made a good match. They have
different different perspectives on how to resolve Lauren or in
New Zealand. I think they work together as best they could,
but fundamentally they come from quite different points of view
and so I think it was always going to be
a tough match.
Speaker 1 (02:21):
Would you still defend him as a police commissioner? I
mean it wasn't your appointment. It was a dourn slash nash.
You came in afterwards, But did you see at the
time as a solid appointment or not.
Speaker 3 (02:30):
Yeah, he's a smart guy and he had the best
interests of New Zealand at heart, and things like Refrain
that he wanted to see in place would have set
the police up for another ten years. For shame that
he wasn't able to achieve that right.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
Talk to me, try and keep this as a political
as possible. And this is health and this is the
layers in management and all the problems in health at
the moment. But what Luxon said on Monday about not
having an understanding or getting an understanding of numbers, expenditure,
line of sight on an astonishing amount of money. Can
you understand that or explain how the public service gets
(03:04):
that jerry manned backward and hopeless?
Speaker 3 (03:11):
First look, I think they've had to come cling that.
That's what they've said is not true. There's not fourteen
layers they're including.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
Uh, forget to fourteen, twelve, eleven or whatever. It is
the fact that it's a mess. It's an indisputable mess.
How does it become a mess like that?
Speaker 3 (03:30):
Well, you had multiple different dhvs across New Zealand that
really were a mess. You had different standards of healthcare
and different parts of New Zealand because you had a
regionally based system, and to bring it under one and
try and have consistency so no matter where someone gets
cancer they get the same level of treatment. That has
to be brought together. And that's what the reforms that
(03:53):
that we did that were Underwagh and in place. And
it's a real shame that some of that work is
being unpicked and the problem is they haven't funded it.
If you want to talk about what's what's a mess?
A meiss is putting a hiring freeze on doctors and
they're not being enough doctors in New Zealand.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
That's thirty billion dollars. How much more do you want?
Speaker 3 (04:15):
We have had record numbers of immigration and most people
have come into New Zealand and New Zealand's history over
the last year, and we are trying to provide services
to more people with the same amount of funding when
they're coming in. And this is what's putting massive pressure
on our health system. It was just coming to terms
(04:36):
worth getting through a global pandemic and then we've got
slammed with additional people who require services and so how
you do that is a difficult solution. But cutting the
budget is not the answer.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
Mark your side of the health story.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
So I just think that Labor created a bohemoth. I
think labor's good at creating bureaucracy. There's massive layers of
management and their nationals comes in and has to recalibrate
and get services and the best backing up to the
front lines. Lab they don't know how to deliver the
services to people. When you look at the caucus, they
don't have anyone you've actually had to do that real off,
(05:09):
so you know this is and now we're having to
unrevel it all and it's difficult, and right, we're just
getting on with it.
Speaker 1 (05:15):
Jinny, Listen to this. This is lux and working you
through the fourteen layers. Listen that a patient it interacts
with a team member. A team member reports the team supervisor,
who reports the team leader.
Speaker 4 (05:25):
The team leader reports to the assistant manager. The assistant
manager reports to the manager, who reports the service manager,
who then reports to the general manager. The general manager
might be asking who do they report to? Will they
report to the group director of operations, and of course
they report to the regional director, the national director, eventually
the chief of staff, then the chief executive, and of
course they report to the chair on the board.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
Can you defend that?
Speaker 3 (05:46):
I can certain that they should have funded it in
March when the knew it ran out of money, and
that would be a better thing than giving technicap to
the tobacco lobby.
Speaker 1 (05:53):
So you so you're still arguing that more money is required,
even when you've got that line that lineup.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
I think you need to look at how the health
system works. And if you're going to do it in
one minute and question time, then it's a joke. So
there's complexities. But the point is that there's no doctors
in the Hut Valley because of the cuts, and we
have people queuing up for a Tali health session who
need medical attention.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
You can last.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
Isn't the answer to that, though, Ginny. Fewer managers and
more actual doctors and Nurse's.
Speaker 3 (06:24):
Right, Let's let's see how they do with that, because
with less money and trying to cut services, it's the
front line because you need people in place to be
able to put that support and if you want doctors operating,
and you're going to cut all that away and cutting
up to two thousand jobs already in health, Let's see
how they go, because I have that the frontline is
(06:48):
not going to be done. But he used to run
an airline. I'm sure you're doing a great job of
reforming at health.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
That's right, that's right. He has running the line and
he understandings.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
Into the ground three times for a wail out.
Speaker 2 (07:00):
And he understands the responsibility customers that actually had to deliver,
and he just laid out and articulated very well. Layers
and layers and layers of managers. We'd rather have doctors
and nurses on the front.
Speaker 3 (07:10):
Lne look to get them back go and get the
doctors there because.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
They're allways well well and you want to vest more
money into more managers, which is exactly Labour's approach was
exactly why we find ourselves in the current position that
we do as a country.
Speaker 1 (07:22):
Quick comment mark on emergency response. I'm reading a report
yesterday and I can't, for the life of me remember
what it was called. But back when late twenty fourteen
they were going to have some sort of group Victoria
and Australia's got it, they never got around to it.
Local agencies didn't want to share information. The upshot is
that they are claiming in Hawks Bay that I Gabriel
happened again, there would be no difference in response because
(07:44):
basically emergency response can't get their act together. Is that true?
Speaker 2 (07:49):
No, I don't agree with it. Since I've been in
Ministers in the last seven months, I've had four local
states of emergency. We've had we've had floods, we've had fires,
we've had earthquakes, we've had space whether, we've had CrowdStrike
and no one's waiting. I received a report from Siderior
Matter Prie in terms of the work that we need
to do to make our system more resilient, but no
one's waiting for that. And I've been on the ground
(08:10):
at every single one of those and the response has
been outstanding. So no, we've got amazing people that do
this work. We need to get the legislation done and
that will codefine support the entire ecosystem in terms of
how we respond. But there's been really good progress made
over the last seven months, certainly, you know. That's what
I'm sing seen right from the mayors and the chief
(08:32):
executives right through the whole emergency management sort of sector.
Everyone is working really well together, all right.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
I'm encouraging to hear make appreciate time, Jinny Anders, appreciate
yours as well. Politics Wednesday.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
For more from the Mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to
news talks there'd be from six am weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio.
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