Transpower says contractor Omexom is working through its own recommendations after the June pylon topple that caused a power outage in Northland.
An Electricity Authority report found bad practice that caused the Transpower tower to topple had probably happened before.
Unsupervised, inexperienced maintenance crews from contractor Omexom unfastened three legs at once.
Transpower Executive General Manager Mark Ryall told Mike Hosking you do need to be able to train people on the job, otherwise they'll never become competent.
But he says a trainee needs to be under direct supervision, and in this case they weren't adequately supervised.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
We got the report into the pylon debarcle lays the
blame at the feet of Transpower, which, as I said
before the new strikes me as slightly odd. The argument
is too much reliance on contractors and the fact too
many bolts have been removed more than once, and the
fact of Transpower employee had of course raised the issues
back in two thousand and one, but seemingly was ignored anyway.
Trustpowers Executive General Manager of Grid Delivery Mark Ryle is
with us.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Marke.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Good morning to you, morning Mike. The twenty twenty one warning.
First of all, why do you know wasn't that acted on?
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Yeah, look, I'll put some facts out there around that.
For some of the rhetoric from the press conference isn't
quite accurate. So we've a hundred engineers for contexts, and
you know, we run a continuous improvement culture. So then
making a recommendation around an improvement of something that's quite common.
In this case, the recommendation was round a coating's practices
course a how you apply the coating product to a
(00:48):
foundation was made through the grid Skills Manager at the time. Now,
the decision was obviously made not to take that forward.
That person's left the business, so I can't ask them,
But that decision makes sensevents the responsibility of our contractual
framework if the staff being competent in training sits with
the service providers. In this case mex On, we have
(01:09):
grid Skills, which provides transmission specific competency training, how people
access equipment, how they can be safe around high voltage,
all those sort of specific things, out to paint a
tower out of paint to foundation, how to drive an
e WP, even basic supervits for training that sits with
the service providers as expected, because that's their competency. We're
not skilled in flying coteins. So this course it wasn't
(01:32):
a warning around taking too many nuts off. It wasn't
a warning around unsafe practices. If that had been raised,
that would have gone down a different shot in the company,
and I either one hundred percent confidence that would have
been escalated to me or through my business very quickly.
From an operational and safety perspective, you know, all the
information we've looked at does not confirm this practice is common.
In fact, the exact opposite hasn't been common. Apart from
(01:53):
this one small group over four jobs in Northland between
late May and early June, and obviously we saw the
unfortunate circumstances of that coming together. Correct.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
Have you talked in the ensuing period since the day
it happened with a MIXIM and got to your satisfaction
and explanation as to why they hired people they didn't train.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
Yes, yes, of course we have. We released our investigation
report six weeks ago and all this information was contained
within it. We've worked with a mix ON, They've done
an independent investigation. They've got a long list of recommendations
that they are working actively on. We're as well focused
on our recommendations. The reality is you do need to
be able to train people on the job, otherwise no
(02:35):
one can ever become competent. But as someone that is
a trainee, they need to be under direct supervision. In
this case, the trainee wasn't adequately supervised. The work order
approved the job. The information transparer had was that a
competent supervisor and two people with foundation competency we're going
to do the task. What turned up on the job
was a competent supervisor and two trainees. This was an
(02:56):
adequate and this is one of the key findings. The
root cause of the event, were not following procedures and practices.
If that follows their procedures, how I would have never
before come to both the reports.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
And I'm just wonder if we're convoluting too much here
because it's not actually that complex. You had people who
didn't do their job properly. I and from the text
everyone disagrees with me, but I argue it's it's I mean,
ultimately it is your fault because you hire these people
and your your ultimately responsible buck stops at the top.
Speaker 2 (03:24):
I get that, and we're not abiding it. We're not
avoiding that.
Speaker 1 (03:26):
At some point, when you hire people to do something,
you've got to have a level of trust that they're
going to do it, don't you. Therefore it's on them, Yes,
you do.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
We have a robust quality assurance program and we do
hundreds and hundreds of independent audits of work throughout every year.
We have thousands of interactions where our job manager are
out there inspecting site. Unfortunately, in a small package of work,
nobody visited that site. The service providers have their own
assurance programs. It should have picked it up. So look,
we have taken that on board and we are reviewing
all our assurance programs, seeing do we need to do more.
(03:58):
We're looking at how we can get better. Obviously you
need to stop on one of these investigations at the people.
You look right through your organization and right through spros
organization and identify those things we can improve and we're
focused on doing that.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
Okay, have a mixed some sacked in your body.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
They haven't sacked these people at the moment. They are
supporting them through the process. They're not through the process
on our assets. Well, I guess I mean the crew
lessns never go out to do something like this, right,
They don't need to have an outcome like this. The
training is need training before they can do work.
Speaker 1 (04:31):
Your fantastic this must have occurred to you. I have
no training in doing this, but I can tell you
something for nothing, I wouldn't undo all the bolts for
what I would argue are pretty bloody obvious reasons.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
Yes, Look, I've arrived on the site from the next
and it's one look at that tower and arrangement and
absolutely should never and that is one of the things
we need to work through. How could a fully confident
supervisor line mechanic been trained on loading rigging all those
kind of things leading a crew that this could happen,
and that's you know, one of the fundamentals.
Speaker 1 (05:04):
He wasn't paying attention. He was in the cab having
a sandwich.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
I bet wasn't he Well, he was water blasting at
the time, so he had a mask on water basking,
and the trainee continued to take nuts off unsupervised and
went too far, as on the findings from the investigation.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
So the sky's on the water blaster standing the watching
a guy ond nuts and at no points does he
go that's quite a lot of nuts. I wonder if
that's too many.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
Well, he's blasting the tower, he's got a mask gone,
So the explanations he's not actually supervising this. The number
of the time he's focused on the water blasting. So
the trainee's gone and removed nuts without supervision, which is
you know, the fundamental failing here that led to the tower.
Speaker 1 (05:47):
Well where are we at with compensation for the Northland region?
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Yeah, look, as you know Electricita, Well, first of all,
impossible to guarantee supply one hundred percent of the time.
We really loved and we tried very hard across his
the three to do that. There's okay, ially agree and
we understand that. But I guess there's the value you
have heard some of the numbers are coming out from
the investigation potential loss. You know, the value that electricity
(06:14):
adds is hugely higher than what we actually charged for
the service. So what that conversation it will be. There's
no mechanism within the existing framework to provide that. THEA
report looked into conversations, makes no recommendations to change anything.
You know, in essence, if we paid conversation, the cost
(06:35):
will have to be picked up by other consumers. And
you've got evidence of the governance or reduced dividence government. Yes,
of course we have insurance and do that well. We
are working actively and some of my colleagues are hidden
meetings in the northern today. We've been working with the
community up there. We're looking to put some investment in
(06:57):
the community. You know, sorry about this event.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
Now you're dodging me. So if you've got insurance and
you cocked it up, you've got to put it right,
because it's the putting right that counts.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
Yep. You look, we just obviously insurance. All businesses do
that as mechanism we have under existing frameworks. As you know,
we are looking to put some community funding into the
community and we don't have an ability within our framework
to pay compensation. It's practical.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
I guess what about I don't understand why you Why
don't you make a claim with the insurance company. They
already told you they're not going to pay.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
No, I'm not aware of that fact.
Speaker 1 (07:46):
So you haven't even inquired.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
No, I'm not letting the insurance part of the business.
But no, I don't believe that's the case.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
So wouldn't wouldn't that be the next route you'd want
to follow if you wanted to do the right thing.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
Yes, well, well, are obviously working through those outcomes. We're
looking to work with the community on putting some investment
into Northland around that.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
Okay, what's the time frame?
Speaker 2 (08:09):
Is the effect the effect of the mona into the
effect of the guess to make that. But then our
tepee mechanism, but the Electrocity Authority put together and we're
working through way we capture our costs. We don't have
a mechanism to do this, so you know that change
could come from the Ultroscy Authority or from government.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
All right, what any timeframe.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
What's around?
Speaker 1 (08:28):
Sorry, what the timeframe? So it doesn't drag on for
months on and and you keep coming up out programs
like this going oh yeah, we're still talking about it.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
Yeah, well, the meetings to the North End, I think
over the next couple of days and then we should
have an announcement around that.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
Eminently fantastic next week. All right, we'll stay in touch.
Speaker 2 (08:43):
Mark.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
Appreciate that Mark Ryle, who's the Transpwer executive general manager
and loving every minute of his job.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
For more from the Mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to
news talks there'd be from six am weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio
We got the report into the pylon debarcle lays the
blame at the feet of Transpower, which, as I said
before the new strikes me as slightly odd. The argument
is too much reliance on contractors and the fact too
many bolts have been removed more than once, and the
fact of Transpower employee had of course raised the issues
back in two thousand and one, but seemingly was ignored anyway.
Trustpowers Executive General Manager of Grid Delivery Mark Ryle is
with us.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Marke.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Good morning to you, morning Mike. The twenty twenty one warning.
First of all, why do you know wasn't that acted on?
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Yeah, look, I'll put some facts out there around that.
For some of the rhetoric from the press conference isn't
quite accurate. So we've a hundred engineers for contexts, and
you know, we run a continuous improvement culture. So then
making a recommendation around an improvement of something that's quite common.
In this case, the recommendation was round a coating's practices
course a how you apply the coating product to a
(00:48):
foundation was made through the grid Skills Manager at the time. Now,
the decision was obviously made not to take that forward.
That person's left the business, so I can't ask them,
But that decision makes sensevents the responsibility of our contractual
framework if the staff being competent in training sits with
the service providers. In this case mex On, we have
(01:09):
grid Skills, which provides transmission specific competency training, how people
access equipment, how they can be safe around high voltage,
all those sort of specific things, out to paint a
tower out of paint to foundation, how to drive an
e WP, even basic supervits for training that sits with
the service providers as expected, because that's their competency. We're
not skilled in flying coteins. So this course it wasn't
(01:32):
a warning around taking too many nuts off. It wasn't
a warning around unsafe practices. If that had been raised,
that would have gone down a different shot in the company,
and I either one hundred percent confidence that would have
been escalated to me or through my business very quickly.
From an operational and safety perspective, you know, all the
information we've looked at does not confirm this practice is common.
In fact, the exact opposite hasn't been common. Apart from
(01:53):
this one small group over four jobs in Northland between
late May and early June, and obviously we saw the
unfortunate circumstances of that coming together. Correct.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
Have you talked in the ensuing period since the day
it happened with a MIXIM and got to your satisfaction
and explanation as to why they hired people they didn't train.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
Yes, yes, of course we have. We released our investigation
report six weeks ago and all this information was contained
within it. We've worked with a mix ON, They've done
an independent investigation. They've got a long list of recommendations
that they are working actively on. We're as well focused
on our recommendations. The reality is you do need to
be able to train people on the job, otherwise no
(02:35):
one can ever become competent. But as someone that is
a trainee, they need to be under direct supervision. In
this case, the trainee wasn't adequately supervised. The work order
approved the job. The information transparer had was that a
competent supervisor and two people with foundation competency we're going
to do the task. What turned up on the job
was a competent supervisor and two trainees. This was an
(02:56):
adequate and this is one of the key findings. The
root cause of the event, were not following procedures and practices.
If that follows their procedures, how I would have never
before come to both the reports.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
And I'm just wonder if we're convoluting too much here
because it's not actually that complex. You had people who
didn't do their job properly. I and from the text
everyone disagrees with me, but I argue it's it's I mean,
ultimately it is your fault because you hire these people
and your your ultimately responsible buck stops at the top.
Speaker 2 (03:24):
I get that, and we're not abiding it. We're not
avoiding that.
Speaker 1 (03:26):
At some point, when you hire people to do something,
you've got to have a level of trust that they're
going to do it, don't you. Therefore it's on them, Yes,
you do.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
We have a robust quality assurance program and we do
hundreds and hundreds of independent audits of work throughout every year.
We have thousands of interactions where our job manager are
out there inspecting site. Unfortunately, in a small package of work,
nobody visited that site. The service providers have their own
assurance programs. It should have picked it up. So look,
we have taken that on board and we are reviewing
all our assurance programs, seeing do we need to do more.
(03:58):
We're looking at how we can get better. Obviously you
need to stop on one of these investigations at the people.
You look right through your organization and right through spros
organization and identify those things we can improve and we're
focused on doing that.
Speaker 1 (04:09):
Okay, have a mixed some sacked in your body.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
They haven't sacked these people at the moment. They are
supporting them through the process. They're not through the process
on our assets. Well, I guess I mean the crew
lessns never go out to do something like this, right,
They don't need to have an outcome like this. The
training is need training before they can do work.
Speaker 1 (04:31):
Your fantastic this must have occurred to you. I have
no training in doing this, but I can tell you
something for nothing, I wouldn't undo all the bolts for
what I would argue are pretty bloody obvious reasons.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
Yes, Look, I've arrived on the site from the next
and it's one look at that tower and arrangement and
absolutely should never and that is one of the things
we need to work through. How could a fully confident
supervisor line mechanic been trained on loading rigging all those
kind of things leading a crew that this could happen,
and that's you know, one of the fundamentals.
Speaker 1 (05:04):
He wasn't paying attention. He was in the cab having
a sandwich.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
I bet wasn't he Well, he was water blasting at
the time, so he had a mask on water basking,
and the trainee continued to take nuts off unsupervised and
went too far, as on the findings from the investigation.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
So the sky's on the water blaster standing the watching
a guy ond nuts and at no points does he
go that's quite a lot of nuts. I wonder if
that's too many.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
Well, he's blasting the tower, he's got a mask gone,
So the explanations he's not actually supervising this. The number
of the time he's focused on the water blasting. So
the trainee's gone and removed nuts without supervision, which is
you know, the fundamental failing here that led to the tower.
Speaker 1 (05:47):
Well where are we at with compensation for the Northland region?
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Yeah, look, as you know Electricita, Well, first of all,
impossible to guarantee supply one hundred percent of the time.
We really loved and we tried very hard across his
the three to do that. There's okay, ially agree and
we understand that. But I guess there's the value you
have heard some of the numbers are coming out from
the investigation potential loss. You know, the value that electricity
(06:14):
adds is hugely higher than what we actually charged for
the service. So what that conversation it will be. There's
no mechanism within the existing framework to provide that. THEA
report looked into conversations, makes no recommendations to change anything.
You know, in essence, if we paid conversation, the cost
(06:35):
will have to be picked up by other consumers. And
you've got evidence of the governance or reduced dividence government. Yes,
of course we have insurance and do that well. We
are working actively and some of my colleagues are hidden
meetings in the northern today. We've been working with the
community up there. We're looking to put some investment in
(06:57):
the community. You know, sorry about this event.
Speaker 1 (07:05):
Now you're dodging me. So if you've got insurance and
you cocked it up, you've got to put it right,
because it's the putting right that counts.
Speaker 2 (07:14):
Yep. You look, we just obviously insurance. All businesses do
that as mechanism we have under existing frameworks. As you know,
we are looking to put some community funding into the
community and we don't have an ability within our framework
to pay compensation. It's practical.
Speaker 1 (07:34):
I guess what about I don't understand why you Why
don't you make a claim with the insurance company. They
already told you they're not going to pay.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
No, I'm not aware of that fact.
Speaker 1 (07:46):
So you haven't even inquired.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
No, I'm not letting the insurance part of the business.
But no, I don't believe that's the case.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
So wouldn't wouldn't that be the next route you'd want
to follow if you wanted to do the right thing.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
Yes, well, well, are obviously working through those outcomes. We're
looking to work with the community on putting some investment
into Northland around that.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
Okay, what's the time frame?
Speaker 2 (08:09):
Is the effect the effect of the mona into the
effect of the guess to make that. But then our
tepee mechanism, but the Electrocity Authority put together and we're
working through way we capture our costs. We don't have
a mechanism to do this, so you know that change
could come from the Ultroscy Authority or from government.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
All right, what any timeframe.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
What's around?
Speaker 1 (08:28):
Sorry, what the timeframe? So it doesn't drag on for
months on and and you keep coming up out programs
like this going oh yeah, we're still talking about it.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
Yeah, well, the meetings to the North End, I think
over the next couple of days and then we should
have an announcement around that.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
Eminently fantastic next week. All right, we'll stay in touch.
Speaker 2 (08:43):
Mark.
Speaker 1 (08:43):
Appreciate that Mark Ryle, who's the Transpwer executive general manager
and loving every minute of his job.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
For more from the Mic Asking Breakfast, listen live to
news talks there'd be from six am weekdays, or follow
the podcast on iHeartRadio
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