Steve Cullen: Criminal defence lawyer on the chances of a prison sentence reaching an all-time high

More than seven thousand people have been sent to prison following a conviction. 

Ministry of Justice data shows the proportion of convicted charges leading to prison sentences has reached an all-time high at 27%. 

People convicted of robbery, sexual offences, and homicides have the highest imprisonment rates. 

Criminal defence lawyer Steve Cullen told Mike Hosking it's worrying to see such a large number of people involved in illegal activity. 

He says it could be due to a wave of young people coming through, social media, or gang and drug influences. 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
It's a new insight into our crime story. Later at

(00:02):
data shows jail sentences at record highs. We've got seventy
four hundred and fifteen people sentenced to prison in the
year to June, which is up fourteen percent. Robbery led
the way imprisonment rate there of sixty one percent. Meanwhile,
cannabis and meth position charges their back at twenty nineteen levels.
Steve Cullen, criminal lawyer, back with us. Steve, morning to you,
good body. So we're either committing a great deal more

(00:22):
crime or the guidance from the government to put them
in jail as working. Is it the latter, Well, we.

Speaker 2 (00:28):
Could speak a lad it's ladder that could be contributing
to it. But I'll tell you one thing that struck me, Mike.
I've been talking to one of your reporters, Jordan Done.
There's been a more than doubling of people violating their
em bail, and of course the judge's view will be
if you violate your bail, violate electronically monitored bail, then
you're not going to be set up for an electronically
monitored sentence. So people have been writing their own prescription

(00:51):
to go to prison. That could be contributing to it
as well.

Speaker 1 (00:54):
Indeed, what about the gang population? Is it full of gangs?
We had some gang stats the other day, I mean
huge numbers of people gang. So we're just essentially we're
locking up more people more often, aren't we?

Speaker 2 (01:04):
As we are? And it seems to people we're locking
up are the ones that need to be locked up?

Speaker 1 (01:09):
The discounting part, are you seeing any change in that?
In other words, with the law suggesting you can't discount
as much, would that lead to more people going behind bars?

Speaker 2 (01:19):
Well, it has had an effect, undoubtedly, because we've got
mandatory reductions and the discounts available, judges aren't able to
perhaps be as benevolent the people as they want to be,
So yes, that is having an impact as well.

Speaker 1 (01:36):
Overall, fifteen percent get a prison sentence, which strikes me.
We have a tremendous number of people who commit crime.
It's eighty five percent of people don't go to jail,
so hell of a lot of crime. Is there something
wrong with us?

Speaker 2 (01:48):
Well, it can be due to a wave of young
people coming through. It can also be due to social media.
It could be due to gang influences and drug influencers.
We'd need some sort of information about what's causing it.
But it's really worrying when you see such a large
proportion of people involved in a legal activity.

Speaker 1 (02:07):
Yeah, we're going to need to build more prisons, aren't we.
If we keep putting fourteen percent more in jail each year,
we're going to be full before we know it.

Speaker 2 (02:14):
That's right. I see one of the countries I'm sure
is now building a prison that's a floating island so
that people can't jump over the side and from back
to shore. Goodness knows. I hope we don't get to that.

Speaker 1 (02:24):
No, but we've got the politics versus the rehab story,
haven't we. The politics of this probably plays well to
Middle New Zealand, doesn't it. I mean, there is a
sense that people want people put in jail for crime
that we don't want to deal with.

Speaker 2 (02:36):
With our aging population, everybody gets fearful. They want everybody
locked up to keep them away so they all feel safe.

Speaker 1 (02:41):
Yeah, all right, so appreciate it. Steve Callen, criminal lawyer,
with us this morning.

Speaker 2 (02:45):
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